We raise dorpher/Katahdin cross. Havent wormed in 3 years on our 30A 🤞 with lambs today there is 85 head running. That are moved every 2 or 3 days. It will take us over a month to go around the farm. Fresh grass is our best remedy. Happy farming. Thanks for the video
I’ve had hair sheep for about the last 4 years and really like the ewes we’ve kept to build our flock. I used a 50:50 Dorper: Blackbelly ram on pure Dorper ewes (triplet ram from Blackbelly ewe). Offspring are very fertile, rebreed quickly, milk well, shed clean, and last a little longer in the flock than pure Dorpers. They do not seem to get “overfat” as easily as pure Dorpers. Overfat ewes seem to have lower lambing rates as well as birthing problems.
Just found your channel and I have been binge watching for the last week. Such great information!!!! My grandparents had 800 acres in southern Illinois and although I was always on the farm earning some kind of money I chose to be a commercial airline pilot instead. I have been blessed with a very good career as a major airline captain but I am wanting to come back to my roots and have my children get to know some of the things I took for granted. You have inspired me to buy some land and give it a try. Thank you so much.
As Greg Judy says: it’s not the profit per animal that matters but the profit per acre.” I have found that is true and you can make more on Saint Croix because they’re more profitable if you consider profit per acre. Currently Saint Croix are more marketable and in super high demand. There is no parasite issues, they are great mamas, lamb in the pasture without help, have higher birth rate and lower death rate and don’t require any grain. I have had Dorpers, they are much more prone to parasites, higher maintenance, higher death rate, and not in as high of demand when sold at 2-3 months old lambs directly off the farm. St Croix ewes are currently sold out until 2024. If you don’t believe me go try to find some.
Raised St. Croix sheep for 20 years. I did raise a few Dorpers but parasites were a problem with this breed as the Shepherdess addressed. I also agree if your intention is to maximize lamb weight and profit the Dorper is an excellent breed and superior to St. Croix for that purpose. However, if you are looking for the breed that requires the minimal care with lower feed and manpower requirements I would strongly recommend St. Croix.
I really appreciate the thought that you have put into every aspect of building your herd; it’s a big advantage to the rest of us. Thank you for your time!
I just found your channel and will begin binge watching tonight. Katahdin is the direction I'm heading at the moment. We live in Mississippi. Great video.
I feel that tiredness you’re talking about. To cut back on our workload we got rid of all our goats and are strictly concentrating on our Katahdin flock. But after watching your videos and a bit more research the Dorper sheep is a possibility in our near future. We just can’t get over how muscular they are from the get go!
Northern Illinois gets about 28" of precipitation so growing pasture is prolific. We went to pasture some time in May as soon as we had 6" of grass. We would supplement with grass hay for a couple of weeks when the pasture was a little washy. We had 5 ac paddocks with Alfalfa, Trefoil, Orchard Grass and Italian Rye. One paddock was always used to spread manure and plant oats and turnips that year The following year we would plant that paddock back to pasture and spread manure on another paddock. We ran Ramboullet/Dorset cross ewes and put Hamp or Suffolk bucks on them. We had about 2000-3000 lams in our feedlot and niche marketed 125-200 lambs per week through our slaughter house. I never processed a Dorper but the other breeds of hair sheep hang up a carcass that looks like a goat or a deer. Darker meat and too lean. I typically boned them out and added the meat to trimmings to make the ground lamb more attractive. We ran 5 strands of hot wire around the exterior of our pastures and 3 strands between the paddocks. Ewes that did not twin or would not respect the cross fences were sold. Coyotes were abundant but that fence kept them out for years.
I always agree with most of your points, but its important to point out that 37% less weight doesn't equal 37% less income, because you could essentially increase your stocking rate by 37% as the St. Croix would eat less. Like you said it's goal dependent, there's always pros and cons to each or there would be only one breed.
Agreed. And my guess is that the goal is to maximize Dorper market fever. Dorper is overpriced right now. The cost for deworming, can be covered by the robust growth rate, and market demand. However, it may be just sensational bubble which would eventually burst IMHO. Similar to how the marbled oversized beef used to be hot when grain feed was affordable. When market cooled off, and inflation kicked in, the rancher went broke trying to stick with old trend and its expensive problem. To be profitable the right way, it would require a complete change over of cow herd genetic. Can't just simply throw grain fed genetic oversized cows on pasture and expect them to adapt. Dorper's robust growth rate, thus their impressive weaned weight may mean that they're not adaptable to humid weather to become parasite resistant. So they're not really a breed for regenerative farmer. Regenerative farming is about soil life, and many of the dewormers that end up in the soil would prevent the healing process to truly complete.
@@lukeryuzaki2328 I have had moderate luck cross breeding dorper with parasite resistant breeds like St Croix in a humid climate. But, it's certainly not easy.
@@Velacreations Good to hear. The thing remain that we, the people that cross breed to have parasite reistance, is still far away from creating a new breed from these program so we can have sheep offsprings that breed true to have good characteristic of Dorper and parasite resistant. And if we're to sell to other shepherds, most of them want at least the pure bred Dorpers because for the hot market. We're not exactly getting the Dorper premium price.
As someone who raises katahdin sheep, I'd love to hear your perspective on why not them. I personally have found that while I'm not getting 20k a head raising, rotational grazed, grass-fed, no wormer lamb has allowed me to push a premium price. But similar to what you said, we started with the katahdin because of being worried about worms with dorper.
I don’t want to do anything at all with deworming which is why I was interested in St. Croix. How do you manage, or do you even, deworming for Katahdins?
@@cameronmurray4479 We only worm new stock to the farm while they're in quarantine. After that we rotate every week (because we work full time jobs and use premier1 nets with a mixed herd of Katahdin sheep and Kiko goats)
@@cameronmurray4479 I do no flock wide de worming. If I notice an animal is slow on a drive or slow to move to the next paddock I will worm it and mark it for harvest, but it's fairly uncommon. The only two I've had to dose this year had dorper linage which is typical for us. I never intentionally let anything die. A certain well no proponent of parasite resistant hair sheep lets anything die that wants too, but to me that approach seems unethical.
The Royal White breed is highly desirable and was originated from Dorper and StCroix stock. It combines the best parasite resistance and the carcass size.
I totally understand your reasoning for running Dorpers. We're planning to add some rams later on. We have a small flock of Katahdins we're keeping pure and increasing. These guys fly through our zero degree winters. Find what works for you and run with it!
we are runing a small flock of dorpahdins. i find the more dorper they look the heavier they become. even the ones that look more katahdin are a bit on the lean side. i bought most of my flock off a neighboring farmer who shares the sentiments about wormload. the more dorper they are, the more parasite load. thats why i havent quite gone pure dorper yet. unless i register, it makes little sense to my bottom line. its all about finding a heavy boy and a few heavy girls and going from there.
Awesome lesson. Yes you are so right what works on somebody else’s place might not work on yours. So take the time and be patient and the land will teach us what it can support.
This breakdown was awesome. Thank you. I kinda knew I was gonna go Dorper but was extremely concerned with parasites . You took a lot of the fear out of running sheep. Thank you for this…. Can’t wait for the beef video. Blessings and love ❤️
You're doing a great job Grace. I used to run 300 ewes on management intensive and accelerated lambing on 40 acres in Northern Illinois. Made a great living doing exactly the same things are doing today. Keep up the good work. Oh, and check out the book," A shepherd's view of the 23rd Psalm" I think you will teally enjoy it.
Wow! 300 on 40 acres! What kind of supplement did you provide to support that number? Wondering mostly about hay overwinter and/or any grazing season supplement.
I know I'm late to the party but to the Shepherdess, I so appreciate your videos and reading materials and all the time you have spent making them available, and freely at that. You are a true humanitarian as well as a friend to the animals. I have literally been viewing and reading this whole labor day weekend and learned so much. I live in MN and have 6 acres available for animal husbandry and I'm looking for small farm independence. I've decided to go with Katahdin and St. Croix, possibly cross breeding in the future. I'm older, ready to retire and still healthy. I have established outbuildings and fencing. I know it will be a lot of work but I'd like it to be as minimal as possible and with these two breeds, I feel I can manage mostly on my own. I have raised chickens for years and will continue to do so but I wanted something more diverse, so after much research I chose sheep. Since I'm only looking at this endeavor mostly as food stability I'm sure this is a win win. Again, thank you so much!
We raise Barbados, khathadin, st croix crosses and I just love them. In Hawaii we don't get a break from the parasites so parasite management is a huge deal here. I really enjoy watching your videos. For some reason Dorpers are not as popular here in regards to live sales.
A couple of points. First, Greg Judy is popular within the niche of Homesteading and family self sufficiency. Which is his targeted audience. Not commercial meat production. He sells live animals not trying to compete with the meat industry on a niche level. His focus is only livestock not end product hanging weight. Within the entirety of ruminant community that is a small niche. You have crossover viewers because you also appeal to us too. Particularly your lifestyle, political points, economy etc. which I have also shared your videos on other forums and to people Greg Judy also appeals to. Second point, Most of us watching in this group are interested in feeding our families in self sufficient way, not maximizing hanging weight with outside inputs. We have different goals is all. The point for us isn't having the input of de worming for saving every individual sheep and having a flock dependent. It is for a stronger flock in the long run just like you pointed out yours is better each year. We want that for a stronger herd for health resilience when dewormers no longer work or are unavailable. Viewers like me aren't interested in maximizing sales is all but we like watching your journey and you make a lot of great points. Or model is just different. Now for my last point, I brought in St. Croix Sheep a long time ago. They came from out of my area and I lost a bunch out of the gate. Those that survived thrived and their offspring still do with zero chemical and grain inputs on a lot less than 100's of acres. That is the only issue I take here. You don't need hundreds of acres to make this work without chemical inputs . That is the way you projected it. Enjoy the crossover viewership. You appeal to the homesteading community and those looking to create a market for themselves.
Thank you Shepherdess for sharing and your sheep book for beginners. I've decided to go with Australian White sheep for size, weight gain and meat quality as well as some other health related reasons. I have nearly 1,000 acre ranch in Ecuador that will be shared with Nubian milk goats.
I love the resistance in my White Dorpers. I raised Nigerian dwarf goats for years and culled the wormy duds. By the end of 15 years had a very resistant herd. I will do the same with my sheep…. I plan on getting more this fall.
Another great video Grace and it adds meat to the email that you sent out. Its much better for me to see and hear your topics rather than read then, its probably and age thing. But the two of them together (video and email) reinforces the point that your trying to get across. If people have not signed up to Grace's news letter then I would consider doing so as you get so much information. Thanks for posting
Thank you, I look forward to every informative video you make. Before you started did you take a Greg Judy class? I live somewhat near you outside of dfw, and currently looking for land.
Hi, I’m not convinced that your statement of 37% less weight of animal means 37% less lbs sold. You can run more animals per acre generally speaking and can actually generate more lbs per acre. I am a cattle guy and we are working on lowering our mature size for more efficient grass converting cattle. PS : keep up the great work, I enjoy your videos!
Greg Judy has lambing rates of at least 2 or above it is hard to get that with dorpher. The size difference doesn’t particularly matter smaller sheep mean higher stocking rate so would probably equate to the same amount of meat per acre. Imaging if Greg had to deworm all his sheep at times he has 300 head so based on your math that’s 300 hours of labor per year.
This is why I went with katahdin-dorper crosses. Also bc that’s what is more readily available in my area of Kentucky. You get the stockier genes of the dorper with the hardiness and higher parasite resistance of the katahdin.
I'm much further north - Nova Scotia, Canada to be exact and I've discovered a similar thing after 3 years breeding hair sheep. I started with Horned Wiltshire sheep due to their parasite resistance and hardiness but I've found they are much to slow growing and smaller than I need. I direct market beef and lamb and the carcass yield just isn't where it needs to be on the wiltshires, much like the St. Croix. I purchased 4 white dorper ewes last year and 2 of them have really filled out, 2 need to be culled. I'm hoping to make a video on it soon, going over similar points as you did today. I'm transitioning towards dorpers from here on out.
We have been rotational grazing cattle for 30 years with no treatment of any kind or grain. Recently got Dorper sheep to ad to the system, 21 sheep on 80 acers for now.
Awesome video as always. I'm always impressed with your progress. When you class out your ram lambs and ewe lambs always look for the longest frame length lambs, it will increase the meat percentages on the carcass weight by 3-5% and keep the 5 longest ones for the stud sales 🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦🐑🐏🐏🐑🐏 Stay blessed.
I'm located in California and I raise Dorpers. I have a breeding stock flock and a commercial stock. I ran this 2 flocks of about 60 on 40 acres but the Fullblood Dorpers is what is bringing the most. I have been carefully selecting Rams and ewes that will produce South African Standards lambs for our breeding stock. Our goals is to have type 5 ewes and Rams to confidently offer them to dorper sheep Breeders at a higher yield price. But we also have the commercial culled sheep for our clients that need them for consumption. We have been having success at it so far. One thing I know is that I am convinced I will need a handling chute to make my operation easier.
It sounds like Saint Croix ewes would be a good means for a beginning grazer to begin with and service them with a Dorper ram. Nice to learn your sheep dying on you has gone down over the last three seasons. Is this all increased resistance or improving management too?
Thank you. I raised geese some 20 yrs ago. Now that I am retired - and working to raise on site food - I follow your channel. Best regards! By the way- From St. Croix - so I might follow the easier sheep to start this!
Great info from all. Thank you for the video. I am in beginning stages of looking into getting sheep for my smaller acreage. I am familiar with cows & have never had sheep. I know the market for beef and the large consumption of beef in the American diet. When you refer to the profit from hair/meat sheep where do you market them. Is this profitability from the consumption of the meat?
Love your channel! My first subscription on UA-cam :) I have a question please. For sheep, which veterinary steps/tests are required to be able to sell the processed meat? I am not so familiar with the meat grading steps. Since it’s meat, I assume it can’t just be sold on the market after coming back from the processor? I am located in Tennessee. Is there a video on this already? Thank you!!!!
Yep, the whole heritage breed/naturally parasite resistant deal is a rough landscape. We grew a healthy base with our Shetland flock and threw in a Cheviot ram last year because the carcass is so small and the growth takes… forever. And we are going to continue “upsizing” and puzzling out how to get the sheep we want (250lb, wool, good hooves, no medication, thrifty, twins). A legitimate farm is a business. And you have to figure out what you are willing to sacrifice and pursue to make your business work.
@@OkTxSheepLady There are enough uses for my wool (occasional fleece sales, mulch, dog beds...) that I don't want a shedding/rooing fleece. I hire a fella from a couple states away to shear my sheep. The time he takes and the cost are worth it. Plus, a big part of it is simple aesthetics; I prefer to own wool sheep. I like their looks and am willing to make the business sacrifices for legitimate wool at the moment. In the future? Who knows. I like the slow growth model I've got right now and don't plan on leaving wool crosses anytime soon.
Great video. I've enjoyed watching your process and that business model that you have created. It cool and amazing. Nice highlight reel on selected sheep breed to raise. And good looking steaks!
We started with Jacob sheep and learned all the "benefits" of them were all hype and finding a shearer near us was a nightmare. We have been switching over to Katahdin, Dorper and crosses of those 2 on our farmstead.
We have blackbelly X dorpher crossbred sheep. Their main purpose is to keep our junkyard from becoming overgrown. We never use wormer. Just add diatomiactes earth to the mineral and salt mix and rotate pastures.
Do you think is a good idea to rotate white dorper and black head dorper as long as I stick with dorpers ( not cross them with an other breed) thank you!🙏🙏
Bonjour, je trouve intéressant votre comparaison entre les races mais vous avez oublier un facteur important : la prolificté des brebis . Si la prolificté du ste Foix est plus grande que le dorper , le nombre de kg produit par agnealage peut changer le résultat
Wow those lambs are some real chunks! Nice going, can see your breeding is really paying off👍 Didn't realize there was such a poundage difference at that age between the two breeds. Another great video, have really enjoyed your shared wisdom. Also your video about building infrastructure finally made up my mind about going with a cyclops charger, so glad I got it. Can't wait to see how it performs. Take care, and God bless😁
Do you believe that parasite resistance would change it your ewes were in a different location? e.g. If I purchased a sad and raised in the same conditions in E. Tennessee, would it develop other parasites in the new location?
I really like to listen to peoples videos on sheep. But is there such a thing as eating grass efficiency with sheep? Or... I worded that wrong, I mean whatever trait determines them being able to not need extras, extra feed, and so on beyond what's on the land? I had heard 1 of Greg Judy's videos where he raves about how St Croix being able to get enough nourishment from just normal grass without grain or hay. But I haven't done sheep yet. So I can't tell if that means ALL sheep breeds have similar efficiency to get enough strength from just foraging without extra grain or hay (except in winter), or if some breeds are worse at it than others? And curious what you think on this? Is there such a thing as a type of sheep breed that is 'the least maintenance'? And sorry to reference some other persons channel, but I had to explain why I asked a certain thing.
You only have a Small acre farm tho and are new to Sheep farming tho . But also have a lot to learn tho really. You are text book farmer. The way you learn about Sheep is working with them hands on really. Not just from a book or from Temple grandin really tho Kiwi Shayne
Walking and waiting are both needed. Keep your goal focus. Herders and golfers are alike. Each do it their way that works for them. If not, get help. You are a great helper/shepherdess!
Dorper are hardy and copes well in dry areas. Here in Namibia, sheep is farmed in areas that typically gets from 4 to 8 inches of rain per year. Dorper are really popular.They produce well off natural grazing. Actually, all beef and mutton is produced as pure organic, natural field raised animals. Many feeds and hormones (and all GMO products) are actually against the law here. Sometimes, the "developing world" is ahead of the game🤔
In one of your previous videos about 11 months ago, Joel said he gets letters almost every day from farmers wanting someone to take over or etc. how does one find a farmer to get in contact with in north Florida as my family is wanting to homestead after military life comes to an end and are willing to work to inherit the farm or buy from a local farm.
High rainfall area at 47 inches plus? How do I describe where I live that hosts the highest recorded average annual precipitation in North America at 260 inches per average year?
What do you think about the Royal white breed? Was told it was a cross of the st. Croix and dorper breed to take the best genetics from both. Just curious on your thoughts? We have raised dorper and katahdin crosses but we have considered switching to the Royal white breed.
Hey, i am new to your videos. I have small flock of Katahdin cross. I never heard of dorper sheep before but am very interested in adding to my current flock with potential of switching my herd out. But I’ve run into a small snag, being that there is only one person selling them in a 4 hours area. I’m Northen Jersey. And when I called to inquire price and info, I was dumbfounded in the price. 2k per Ram, 10k for a starter herd of 5 ewes and a Ram. So my question is, what is a typical price you see? Is that a rip off price or is that what they go for? Thanks
That is definitely a rip-off. You can pickup suitable commercial stock at the local sale barns in Oklahoma for under $2 per pound live weight most of the year. The "value-added" market on registered stock only applies to breeding more registered stock. If you put that registered ram over commercial ewes it won't matter what his paperwork says the offspring will only bring commercial prices.
I assume that you would put the Black Belly Barbados sheep in the same category as the Croix. Too small for commercial meat production, but good parasite resistance (and they are hair sheep). Great video as always.
Thank you, Douglas! I haven’t researched the black belly as much as these three breeds, but have heard from other commenters that they cross well with dorper. 👍🏻
I'll say too that there are a lot of RW sheep that are not true to the breed standard. The first couple RW sheep I got looked more like st Croix, but they should look more like a dorper.
But the point is don’t worm (no chemicals) No maintenance whatsoever No grain feed All natural I have 180 acres I rotate Dexter/ and south polls And Saint Croix Then chickens behind .
Thanks for the vid. Wow I'm so confused about stocking rate. First I read 1000 lbs/acre. Then I watched a vid by Linessa Farm saying he's got 50 head on 4 acres. Now you tell me 2-3/acre. Surely there must be a better rule of thumb. I've only got 1/2 acre and was planning to raise 4 sheep on it. Maybe it means I'll have to feed some hay year round and move them more frequently.
I typically don’t provide any feed besides the grass on the ground, which is why my stocking rate is low. You can fit a lot more sheep on an acre, but the more you add the higher your chance of buying feed :).
Royal Whites are a great breed to look at for a good combination of parasite resistance and carcass size. But, your flock will always be only as good as what you cull for. If you crutch along ewes that do need dewormed and keep them in the flock, all of the flock will soon need to be dewormed.
@@scottpoet I ran into this trying to breed Muscovy ducks to true black, which made them safer from owl predation. However, pure black feathers made for smaller ducks.
Do you think raising dorpers in central Texas (less rainfall) would help with that parasite resistance? I keep hearing that wet climates are the thing that contributes to that, but I don't know why (total newb)!
Absolutely! We’ve only had 26” of rai this year (thanks to drought) and parasites have not been much of an issue. It’s when you tip over 30-35” that you’ll experience most of the struggles.
I want to get myself some sheep but my yard is so poor at draining I still have a pond in my yard from the last big rain one week ago . So question can I still get sheep or livestock
South African Mutton Merino is what you need to research. Meat + Excellent Wool. Low maintenance. Also the Meatmaster is good if you are not into wool but you might be too cold for them.
I was wondering… why you selected your particular breed… and now I know …good choice… I also follow Greg Judy… do you have an agreement with your meat processor?
🐑🥩CLICK HERE for my $100K FARM BUSINESS PLAN: bit.ly/farmprofit
We raise dorpher/Katahdin cross. Havent wormed in 3 years on our 30A 🤞 with lambs today there is 85 head running. That are moved every 2 or 3 days. It will take us over a month to go around the farm. Fresh grass is our best remedy. Happy farming. Thanks for the video
What's weights are they hitting at 6 to 8 months?
Are you selling animals? Where are you located?
So 30 days breaks the parasite cycle on your farm?
Are you doing AMP grazing?
I’ve had hair sheep for about the last 4 years and really like the ewes we’ve kept to build our flock. I used a 50:50 Dorper: Blackbelly ram on pure Dorper ewes (triplet ram from Blackbelly ewe). Offspring are very fertile, rebreed quickly, milk well, shed clean, and last a little longer in the flock than pure Dorpers. They do not seem to get “overfat” as easily as pure Dorpers. Overfat ewes seem to have lower lambing rates as well as birthing problems.
My first 🐑 year D K mix girls and a black belly ram expecting first babbys withen 3 months
Just found your channel and I have been binge watching for the last week. Such great information!!!! My grandparents had 800 acres in southern Illinois and although I was always on the farm earning some kind of money I chose to be a commercial airline pilot instead. I have been blessed with a very good career as a major airline captain but I am wanting to come back to my roots and have my children get to know some of the things I took for granted. You have inspired me to buy some land and give it a try. Thank you so much.
As Greg Judy says: it’s not the profit per animal that matters but the profit per acre.” I have found that is true and you can make more on Saint Croix because they’re more profitable if you consider profit per acre. Currently Saint Croix are more marketable and in super high demand. There is no parasite issues, they are great mamas, lamb in the pasture without help, have higher birth rate and lower death rate and don’t require any grain. I have had Dorpers, they are much more prone to parasites, higher maintenance, higher death rate, and not in as high of demand when sold at 2-3 months old lambs directly off the farm. St Croix ewes are currently sold out until 2024. If you don’t believe me go try to find some.
Great testimonial! Thank you for sharing.
the Shepherdess don’t take me wrong, I loved my Dorpers and yours look awesome. We love you channel.
This is the right answer. Its profit per acre, not animal. Same for beef or any animal.
Great point. Not sure how you can run 2 or 3 sheep per acre and be profitable at today's land prices.
Raised St. Croix sheep for 20 years. I did raise a few Dorpers but parasites were a problem with this breed as the Shepherdess addressed. I also agree if your intention is to maximize lamb weight and profit the Dorper is an excellent breed and superior to St. Croix for that purpose. However, if you are looking for the breed that requires the minimal care with lower feed and manpower requirements I would strongly recommend St. Croix.
Very well said!
Thank you for the ebook!! Greetings from South Africa. Nice to see Dorper doing so well. 😊
I really appreciate the thought that you have put into every aspect of building your herd; it’s a big advantage to the rest of us. Thank you for your time!
I just found your channel and will begin binge watching tonight. Katahdin is the direction I'm heading at the moment. We live in Mississippi. Great video.
I feel that tiredness you’re talking about. To cut back on our workload we got rid of all our goats and are strictly concentrating on our Katahdin flock. But after watching your videos and a bit more research the Dorper sheep is a possibility in our near future. We just can’t get over how muscular they are from the get go!
Northern Illinois gets about 28" of precipitation so growing pasture is prolific. We went to pasture some time in May as soon as we had 6" of grass. We would supplement with grass hay for a couple of weeks when the pasture was a little washy. We had 5 ac paddocks with Alfalfa, Trefoil, Orchard Grass and Italian Rye. One paddock was always used to spread manure and plant oats and turnips that year
The following year we would plant that paddock back to pasture and spread manure on another paddock.
We ran Ramboullet/Dorset cross ewes and put Hamp or Suffolk bucks on them.
We had about 2000-3000 lams in our feedlot and niche marketed 125-200 lambs per week through our slaughter house.
I never processed a Dorper but the other breeds of hair sheep hang up a carcass that looks like a goat or a deer. Darker meat and too lean. I typically boned them out and added the meat to trimmings to make the ground lamb more attractive. We ran 5 strands of hot wire around the exterior of our pastures and 3 strands between the paddocks. Ewes that did not twin or would not respect the cross fences were sold. Coyotes were abundant but that fence kept them out for years.
I always agree with most of your points, but its important to point out that 37% less weight doesn't equal 37% less income, because you could essentially increase your stocking rate by 37% as the St. Croix would eat less. Like you said it's goal dependent, there's always pros and cons to each or there would be only one breed.
or you could carry 40% more ewes on the same land
Agree with you...she makes some illogical leaps here for sure.
Agreed.
And my guess is that the goal is to maximize Dorper market fever. Dorper is overpriced right now. The cost for deworming, can be covered by the robust growth rate, and market demand. However, it may be just sensational bubble which would eventually burst IMHO. Similar to how the marbled oversized beef used to be hot when grain feed was affordable. When market cooled off, and inflation kicked in, the rancher went broke trying to stick with old trend and its expensive problem.
To be profitable the right way, it would require a complete change over of cow herd genetic. Can't just simply throw grain fed genetic oversized cows on pasture and expect them to adapt.
Dorper's robust growth rate, thus their impressive weaned weight may mean that they're not adaptable to humid weather to become parasite resistant. So they're not really a breed for regenerative farmer. Regenerative farming is about soil life, and many of the dewormers that end up in the soil would prevent the healing process to truly complete.
@@lukeryuzaki2328 I have had moderate luck cross breeding dorper with parasite resistant breeds like St Croix in a humid climate. But, it's certainly not easy.
@@Velacreations Good to hear.
The thing remain that we, the people that cross breed to have parasite reistance, is still far away from creating a new breed from these program so we can have sheep offsprings that breed true to have good characteristic of Dorper and parasite resistant.
And if we're to sell to other shepherds, most of them want at least the pure bred Dorpers because for the hot market. We're not exactly getting the Dorper premium price.
As someone who raises katahdin sheep, I'd love to hear your perspective on why not them. I personally have found that while I'm not getting 20k a head raising, rotational grazed, grass-fed, no wormer lamb has allowed me to push a premium price. But similar to what you said, we started with the katahdin because of being worried about worms with dorper.
I’ve found dorpers to have poor parasite resistance and bad feet. Almost all my dorper crosses have fallen out of my flock. Love my katahdins.
I don’t want to do anything at all with deworming which is why I was interested in St. Croix. How do you manage, or do you even, deworming for Katahdins?
@@cameronmurray4479 We only worm new stock to the farm while they're in quarantine. After that we rotate every week (because we work full time jobs and use premier1 nets with a mixed herd of Katahdin sheep and Kiko goats)
@@cameronmurray4479 I do no flock wide de worming. If I notice an animal is slow on a drive or slow to move to the next paddock I will worm it and mark it for harvest, but it's fairly uncommon. The only two I've had to dose this year had dorper linage which is typical for us. I never intentionally let anything die. A certain well no proponent of parasite resistant hair sheep lets anything die that wants too, but to me that approach seems unethical.
I raise them also but honestly I think Dorpers are better suited for the warmer climes like hers. Every farm and situation is different.
The Royal White breed is highly desirable and was originated from Dorper and StCroix stock. It combines the best parasite resistance and the carcass size.
I raised Royal White's and they were the smallest breed of sheep I had ever raised.
I totally understand your reasoning for running Dorpers. We're planning to add some rams later on. We have a small flock of Katahdins we're keeping pure and increasing. These guys fly through our zero degree winters. Find what works for you and run with it!
Amen!
we are runing a small flock of dorpahdins. i find the more dorper they look the heavier they become. even the ones that look more katahdin are a bit on the lean side. i bought most of my flock off a neighboring farmer who shares the sentiments about wormload. the more dorper they are, the more parasite load. thats why i havent quite gone pure dorper yet. unless i register, it makes little sense to my bottom line. its all about finding a heavy boy and a few heavy girls and going from there.
Very well said! I have heard really good things about the Dorper/Kathadin cross.
Awesome lesson. Yes you are so right what works on somebody else’s place might not work on yours. So take the time and be patient and the land will teach us what it can support.
Yes! It’s all about defining your goals, then finding a breed or crossbreed that fits. 👍🏻
Yes! It’s all about defining your goals, then finding a breed or crossbreed that fits. 👍🏻
That helps a lot to hear the breeds compared real thoroughly. Is like to hear the same comparison made with Khatadin
This breakdown was awesome. Thank you. I kinda knew I was gonna go Dorper but was extremely concerned with parasites . You took a lot of the fear out of running sheep. Thank you for this…. Can’t wait for the beef video. Blessings and love ❤️
You're doing a great job Grace. I used to run 300 ewes on management intensive and accelerated lambing on 40 acres in Northern Illinois. Made a great living doing exactly the same things are doing today. Keep up the good work. Oh, and check out the book," A shepherd's view of the 23rd Psalm"
I think you will teally enjoy it.
Wow! 300 on 40 acres! What kind of supplement did you provide to support that number? Wondering mostly about hay overwinter and/or any grazing season supplement.
We have Katahdin and love the resistance we're getting. We're looking to add Dorper, Royal White or Easycare to add a little more growth and muscle.
I know I'm late to the party but to the Shepherdess, I so appreciate your videos and reading materials and all the time you have spent making them available, and freely at that. You are a true humanitarian as well as a friend to the animals. I have literally been viewing and reading this whole labor day weekend and learned so much. I live in MN and have 6 acres available for animal husbandry and I'm looking for small farm independence. I've decided to go with Katahdin and St. Croix, possibly cross breeding in the future. I'm older, ready to retire and still healthy. I have established outbuildings and fencing. I know it will be a lot of work but I'd like it to be as minimal as possible and with these two breeds, I feel I can manage mostly on my own. I have raised chickens for years and will continue to do so but I wanted something more diverse, so after much research I chose sheep. Since I'm only looking at this endeavor mostly as food stability I'm sure this is a win win. Again, thank you so much!
We raise Barbados, khathadin, st croix crosses and I just love them. In Hawaii we don't get a break from the parasites so parasite management is a huge deal here. I really enjoy watching your videos. For some reason Dorpers are not as popular here in regards to live sales.
I have an interest in raising Barbados, how is their meat in comparison to other meat breeds?
A couple of points. First, Greg Judy is popular within the niche of Homesteading and family self sufficiency. Which is his targeted audience. Not commercial meat production. He sells live animals not trying to compete with the meat industry on a niche level. His focus is only livestock not end product hanging weight. Within the entirety of ruminant community that is a small niche. You have crossover viewers because you also appeal to us too. Particularly your lifestyle, political points, economy etc. which I have also shared your videos on other forums and to people Greg Judy also appeals to. Second point, Most of us watching in this group are interested in feeding our families in self sufficient way, not maximizing hanging weight with outside inputs. We have different goals is all. The point for us isn't having the input of de worming for saving every individual sheep and having a flock dependent. It is for a stronger flock in the long run just like you pointed out yours is better each year. We want that for a stronger herd for health resilience when dewormers no longer work or are unavailable. Viewers like me aren't interested in maximizing sales is all but we like watching your journey and you make a lot of great points. Or model is just different. Now for my last point, I brought in St. Croix Sheep a long time ago. They came from out of my area and I lost a bunch out of the gate. Those that survived thrived and their offspring still do with zero chemical and grain inputs on a lot less than 100's of acres. That is the only issue I take here. You don't need hundreds of acres to make this work without chemical inputs . That is the way you projected it. Enjoy the crossover viewership. You appeal to the homesteading community and those looking to create a market for themselves.
I really appreciate this comment, thank you!
Thank you Shepherdess for sharing and your sheep book for beginners. I've decided to go with Australian White sheep for size, weight gain and meat quality as well as some other health related reasons. I have nearly 1,000 acre ranch in Ecuador that will be shared with Nubian milk goats.
I love the resistance in my White Dorpers. I raised Nigerian dwarf goats for years and culled the wormy duds. By the end of 15 years had a very resistant herd. I will do the same with my sheep…. I plan on getting more this fall.
I love seeing your enthusiasm. It is so fun to watch your videos.
I got a dorper ram I’m currently raising for meat this Christmas. He’s gotten so big I’m excited. One more month to go
Another great video Grace and it adds meat to the email that you sent out. Its much better for me to see and hear your topics rather than read then, its probably and age thing. But the two of them together (video and email) reinforces the point that your trying to get across. If people have not signed up to Grace's news letter then I would consider doing so as you get so much information. Thanks for posting
Thank you so much for the hearty endorsement! It helps a lot!
Thank you, I look forward to every informative video you make. Before you started did you take a Greg Judy class? I live somewhat near you outside of dfw, and currently looking for land.
No, I haven’t taken any Greg Judy classes. Thank you very much for commenting!
Hi, I’m not convinced that your statement of 37% less weight of animal means 37% less lbs sold. You can run more animals per acre generally speaking and can actually generate more lbs per acre. I am a cattle guy and we are working on lowering our mature size for more efficient grass converting cattle. PS : keep up the great work, I enjoy your videos!
Greg Judy has lambing rates of at least 2 or above it is hard to get that with dorpher. The size difference doesn’t particularly matter smaller sheep mean higher stocking rate so would probably equate to the same amount of meat per acre. Imaging if Greg had to deworm all his sheep at times he has 300 head so based on your math that’s 300 hours of labor per year.
Greg has decades of experience. I'm a fan.
I like the flex with the gas prices. Great video in general, but I love when you slide things like that into it.
This is why I went with katahdin-dorper crosses. Also bc that’s what is more readily available in my area of Kentucky. You get the stockier genes of the dorper with the hardiness and higher parasite resistance of the katahdin.
Kypreparedness
How do you do it? Ram katadhin dorper ewes? Or the other way around? Thanks muchly
@@choncoconcos5912 mine came already mixed
@@Kypreparedness LUCKY YOUUUU. THEY LOOK GREAT.
I'm much further north - Nova Scotia, Canada to be exact and I've discovered a similar thing after 3 years breeding hair sheep. I started with Horned Wiltshire sheep due to their parasite resistance and hardiness but I've found they are much to slow growing and smaller than I need. I direct market beef and lamb and the carcass yield just isn't where it needs to be on the wiltshires, much like the St. Croix. I purchased 4 white dorper ewes last year and 2 of them have really filled out, 2 need to be culled. I'm hoping to make a video on it soon, going over similar points as you did today. I'm transitioning towards dorpers from here on out.
Have you looked at Katahdin?
We have been rotational grazing cattle for 30 years with no treatment of any kind or grain. Recently got Dorper sheep to ad to the system, 21 sheep on 80 acers for now.
Awesome video as always. I'm always impressed with your progress. When you class out your ram lambs and ewe lambs always look for the longest frame length lambs, it will increase the meat percentages on the carcass weight by 3-5% and keep the 5 longest ones for the stud sales
🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦🐑🐏🐏🐑🐏
Stay blessed.
Thank you for the good information!
Am in love with this eloquence
I'm located in California and I raise Dorpers. I have a breeding stock flock and a commercial stock. I ran this 2 flocks of about 60 on 40 acres but the Fullblood Dorpers is what is bringing the most. I have been carefully selecting Rams and ewes that will produce South African Standards lambs for our breeding stock. Our goals is to have type 5 ewes and Rams to confidently offer them to dorper sheep Breeders at a higher yield price. But we also have the commercial culled sheep for our clients that need them for consumption. We have been having success at it so far. One thing I know is that I am convinced I will need a handling chute to make my operation easier.
Yes! The handling system is really a must for a growing flock.
Thank you for sharing! I am learning a lot before deciding if sheep are a right fit for our new homestead.
It sounds like Saint Croix ewes would be a good means for a beginning grazer to begin with and service them with a Dorper ram. Nice to learn your sheep dying on you has gone down over the last three seasons. Is this all increased resistance or improving management too?
What about the Royal Whites? They are an improved cross of Dorpers and St. Croix.
Thank you. I raised geese some 20 yrs ago. Now that I am retired - and working to raise on site food - I follow your channel. Best regards!
By the way- From St. Croix - so I might follow the easier sheep to start this!
Great info from all. Thank you for the video. I am in beginning stages of looking into getting sheep for my smaller acreage. I am familiar with cows & have never had sheep. I know the market for beef and the large consumption of beef in the American diet. When you refer to the profit from hair/meat sheep where do you market them. Is this profitability from the consumption of the meat?
Love your channel! My first subscription on UA-cam :)
I have a question please. For sheep, which veterinary steps/tests are required to be able to sell the processed meat? I am not so familiar with the meat grading steps. Since it’s meat, I assume it can’t just be sold on the market after coming back from the processor? I am located in Tennessee.
Is there a video on this already?
Thank you!!!!
To my knowledge you do not have to have any vet testing of the meat for resale. Inspection takes place at the processor. 👍🏻
Yep, the whole heritage breed/naturally parasite resistant deal is a rough landscape. We grew a healthy base with our Shetland flock and threw in a Cheviot ram last year because the carcass is so small and the growth takes… forever. And we are going to continue “upsizing” and puzzling out how to get the sheep we want (250lb, wool, good hooves, no medication, thrifty, twins).
A legitimate farm is a business. And you have to figure out what you are willing to sacrifice and pursue to make your business work.
YES. Well said!
If you used a Doppler do you think it would help maintain a self shedding fleece?
@@OkTxSheepLady There are enough uses for my wool (occasional fleece sales, mulch, dog beds...) that I don't want a shedding/rooing fleece. I hire a fella from a couple states away to shear my sheep. The time he takes and the cost are worth it.
Plus, a big part of it is simple aesthetics; I prefer to own wool sheep. I like their looks and am willing to make the business sacrifices for legitimate wool at the moment.
In the future? Who knows. I like the slow growth model I've got right now and don't plan on leaving wool crosses anytime soon.
@Wandering Panda I understand wanting wool. I have Gulf Coast sheep myself and love their wool.
Yes, the IRS doesn't like you calling your hobby farm a business! You have to try to make revenue.
Great video. I've enjoyed watching your process and that business model that you have created. It cool and amazing. Nice highlight reel on selected sheep breed to raise. And good looking steaks!
In a previous video I watched you mentioned your favorite book on butchering farm animals. I would appreciate the name and author of that book
how do you not have more subs? You are so eloquent and informative! God bless Texas!!
What kind of mineral system do you have
Great stream. Did you ever consider Wilshire sheep - and reasons please
We started with Jacob sheep and learned all the "benefits" of them were all hype and finding a shearer near us was a nightmare. We have been switching over to Katahdin, Dorper and crosses of those 2 on our farmstead.
What about baby doll lambs?
Do you think the dorpers are better than the white dorpers?
Gradually improving the parasite resistance of dorper sheep over time very smart. Anyone who raises lamb should want your animals 🐑👍
Thank you, Ian!
I’m curious if anyone has any advice or experience with adding biochar to a sheep’s diet?
Thank you for your information to help me to get started in my adventure
We have blackbelly X dorpher crossbred sheep. Their main purpose is to keep our junkyard from becoming overgrown. We never use wormer. Just add diatomiactes earth to the mineral and salt mix and rotate pastures.
Can you not run more animals per acre with st croix and have a higher fecundity rate as well?
What about royal white
Or the Australian one for got name
Good grief, Grace! I was dead-set on St. Croix for my small 3 acres of pasture here in Missouri, and now you’ve got me second guessing it for Dorpers.
Do you think is a good idea to rotate white dorper and black head dorper as long as I stick with dorpers ( not cross them with an other breed) thank you!🙏🙏
Bonjour, je trouve intéressant votre comparaison entre les races mais vous avez oublier un facteur important : la prolificté des brebis . Si la prolificté du ste Foix est plus grande que le dorper , le nombre de kg produit par agnealage peut changer le résultat
Wow those lambs are some real chunks! Nice going, can see your breeding is really paying off👍 Didn't realize there was such a poundage difference at that age between the two breeds. Another great video, have really enjoyed your shared wisdom. Also your video about building infrastructure finally made up my mind about going with a cyclops charger, so glad I got it. Can't wait to see how it performs. Take care, and God bless😁
Great content, thanks for all of this helpful advice…. Would you recommend Dorper sheep for someone living in Chicago?
Hi Juan,
If you go to Dorper.org you will find a breeder list in your area. I’d get in touch with one of those for climate info!
Do you believe that parasite resistance would change it your ewes were in a different location? e.g. If I purchased a sad and raised in the same conditions in E. Tennessee, would it develop other parasites in the new location?
Another very informative video.
I really like to listen to peoples videos on sheep. But is there such a thing as eating grass efficiency with sheep? Or... I worded that wrong, I mean whatever trait determines them being able to not need extras, extra feed, and so on beyond what's on the land? I had heard 1 of Greg Judy's videos where he raves about how St Croix being able to get enough nourishment from just normal grass without grain or hay.
But I haven't done sheep yet. So I can't tell if that means ALL sheep breeds have similar efficiency to get enough strength from just foraging without extra grain or hay (except in winter), or if some breeds are worse at it than others? And curious what you think on this? Is there such a thing as a type of sheep breed that is 'the least maintenance'?
And sorry to reference some other persons channel, but I had to explain why I asked a certain thing.
You only have a Small acre farm tho and are new to Sheep farming tho . But also have a lot to learn tho really. You are text book farmer. The way you learn about Sheep is working with them hands on really. Not just from a book or from Temple grandin really tho Kiwi Shayne
A very interesting video there that I'll will share with my neighbour as she is sheep crazy with her flock, greetings from Scotland. 🙂🏴🐑👍
Walking and waiting are both needed. Keep your goal focus. Herders and golfers are alike. Each do it their way that works for them. If not, get help. You are a great helper/shepherdess!
You always come with some of the best encouragement. Thank you!!
Dorper are hardy and copes well in dry areas.
Here in Namibia, sheep is farmed in areas that typically gets from 4 to 8 inches of rain per year. Dorper are really popular.They produce well off natural grazing.
Actually, all beef and mutton is produced as pure organic, natural field raised animals. Many feeds and hormones (and all GMO products) are actually against the law here.
Sometimes, the "developing world" is ahead of the game🤔
In one of your previous videos about 11 months ago, Joel said he gets letters almost every day from farmers wanting someone to take over or etc. how does one find a farmer to get in contact with in north Florida as my family is wanting to homestead after military life comes to an end and are willing to work to inherit the farm or buy from a local farm.
May your flock be blessed like Jacob's. May God's favour be upon you and the work of your hands.
Thank you, Adam!!
High rainfall area at 47 inches plus? How do I describe where I live that hosts the highest recorded average annual precipitation in North America at 260 inches per average year?
I’d say pull out the snorkel!
@@theShepherdess Don’t worry it’s not That bad. Mountains rivers and lakes here keep it under control, 95% of the time.
What do you think about the Royal white breed? Was told it was a cross of the st. Croix and dorper breed to take the best genetics from both. Just curious on your thoughts? We have raised dorper and katahdin crosses but we have considered switching to the Royal white breed.
Hey, i am new to your videos.
I have small flock of Katahdin cross.
I never heard of dorper sheep before but am very interested in adding to my current flock with potential of switching my herd out. But I’ve run into a small snag, being that there is only one person selling them in a 4 hours area. I’m Northen Jersey.
And when I called to inquire price and info, I was dumbfounded in the price. 2k per Ram,
10k for a starter herd of 5 ewes and a Ram.
So my question is,
what is a typical price you see? Is that a rip off price or is that what they go for?
Thanks
That is definitely a rip-off. You can pickup suitable commercial stock at the local sale barns in Oklahoma for under $2 per pound live weight most of the year. The "value-added" market on registered stock only applies to breeding more registered stock. If you put that registered ram over commercial ewes it won't matter what his paperwork says the offspring will only bring commercial prices.
I have listened to this one for a while and I just heard your rainfall inches if I get land I will think seriously of the dopper sheep
I assume that you would put the Black Belly Barbados sheep in the same category as the Croix. Too small for commercial meat production, but good parasite resistance (and they are hair sheep). Great video as always.
Thank you, Douglas! I haven’t researched the black belly as much as these three breeds, but have heard from other commenters that they cross well with dorper. 👍🏻
We raise Royal White (dorp croix). I got a new white dorper ram that I'll be crossing to my RW.
I'll say too that there are a lot of RW sheep that are not true to the breed standard. The first couple RW sheep I got looked more like st Croix, but they should look more like a dorper.
What about Royal white?
What about the Royal White
But the point is don’t worm (no chemicals)
No maintenance whatsoever
No grain feed
All natural
I have 180 acres
I rotate Dexter/ and south polls
And Saint Croix
Then chickens behind .
What do you use to deform? I believe I saw Joel Salatin use a type of soap??? Curious.
I use prohibit and Cydectin. The soap doesn’t work for me.
Thanks for the vid. Wow I'm so confused about stocking rate. First I read 1000 lbs/acre. Then I watched a vid by Linessa Farm saying he's got 50 head on 4 acres. Now you tell me 2-3/acre. Surely there must be a better rule of thumb. I've only got 1/2 acre and was planning to raise 4 sheep on it. Maybe it means I'll have to feed some hay year round and move them more frequently.
I typically don’t provide any feed besides the grass on the ground, which is why my stocking rate is low. You can fit a lot more sheep on an acre, but the more you add the higher your chance of buying feed :).
@@theShepherdess Thank you. Love your content.
Are you going to be selling any more sheep this year? Can I get on a wait-list for your sheep next year?
How about Royal White?
What do you think of the Royal White & Australian White ?
I don’t have any experience with them, but thank you for asking!
Have you looked at Royal Whites?
Royal Whites are a great breed to look at for a good combination of parasite resistance and carcass size. But, your flock will always be only as good as what you cull for. If you crutch along ewes that do need dewormed and keep them in the flock, all of the flock will soon need to be dewormed.
I think they are in the same predicament as Katahdins. Trying to breed for two things at once that are genetically adversarial. It's very hard.
@@scottpoet I ran into this trying to breed Muscovy ducks to true black, which made them safer from owl predation. However, pure black feathers made for smaller ducks.
I think J and Scott answered this well! I am at a place where I’d rather cull than cross.
Do you think raising dorpers in central Texas (less rainfall) would help with that parasite resistance? I keep hearing that wet climates are the thing that contributes to that, but I don't know why (total newb)!
Absolutely! We’ve only had 26” of rai this year (thanks to drought) and parasites have not been much of an issue. It’s when you tip over 30-35” that you’ll experience most of the struggles.
@@theShepherdess Why is that exactly??
What's your thoughts on Katahdin?
Are you familiar with Texmaster sheep? We have a breeding farm in my area.
I want to get myself some sheep but my yard is so poor at draining I still have a pond in my yard from the last big rain one week ago .
So question can I still get sheep or livestock
I would try and establish a good relationship with a local rancher if I were you. He could look at your place and give your some guidance. 👍🏻
Why not Katahdin?
Always thank you for sharing!
What do you feed them?
South African Mutton Merino is what you need to research. Meat + Excellent Wool. Low maintenance. Also the Meatmaster is good if you are not into wool but you might be too cold for them.
I was wondering… why you selected your particular breed… and now I know …good choice… I also follow Greg Judy… do you have an agreement with your meat processor?
Ummm, theBarbados Blackbelly is ancestral to American Blackbellyand Katahdin. what about them? Simply because they dont " litter"?
How do you feel about the American blackbelly
They are on the small end as well. 👍🏻