I live in the UK and can confirm it was a day of wild weather particulaly in the north of the United Kingdom with heavy turbulent winds. Many scheduled flights were cancelled as were ferry crossings and some train journeys. Very rough conditions - very difficult flying conditions. Season's greetings Magnar.
It was actually pretty vicious over here - gusting 50 knots in parts of County Down and forecast 40+ in Belfast. I live approx twenty miles south of Belfast.
Thank you Magnar for your insightful, instructive, and non-speculative explanations. They are much appreciated. All the best to you and yours for the festive season. Vince C
After what you said last week about the relatively low wing loading of the ATR and the fact that it was a repositioning flight, I knew getting it on the ground in those winds would have been a massive task.
Empty ATR's are a pain to land. It didn't help that the company I worked for at the time made us use the landing speeds for a 17 tonne aircraft, when tne actual weight was closer to 14.5 tonnes. That made the aircraft want to land flat, or slightly nose down
Merry Christmas to you too. Love your channel and thanks for your hard work making these videos. My dad used to fly commercial operations in the Short 360 to Belfast City and said it could sometimes be gusty and challenging there.
I was at the airport when it happened………quite a shock to be fair and glad no one was hurt! The winds were very unpredictable during that period with very sudden and very severe gusts occasionally, from quite variable directions, so it seems likely that your summary of “sometimes shut happens” is the core reason
Have you seen the video? They bounce hard on the main gear and porpoise onto the nose gear. I think the aircraft may be a write-off as there is a lot of rippling to the fuselage possibly from the first touchdown. We shall see. Hope the crew are ok as I know most of them.
Turning into an annual event, this combination of airport & firm :) it was, and still is, extremely gusty facing the atlantic on the islands right now. I suspect that approach wasn't a lot of fun. I don't know the rate of descent, but the fact that the aircraft isn't a banana is quite reassuring!
Once on approach of EGAC runway 22 with the LET410 a sort of rotor made the airplane oscillate left and right. It took me a few seconds to realise, that I should correct accelerations, not displacements, like the yaw damper does. Has anybody else experienced the same ?
Aer lingus use their ATRs on their belfast to leeds/bradford services. When the wind is bad leeds/bradford is certainly a tricky airport to fly into mainly bcos it gets alot of crosswind, the runway faces NW but most the time the wind blows from the SW, the touchdown zone is also set at the highest part of the runway so floating can occur too
The ATPL Human Performance book mentioned the difference between an error and violation. The former is inadvertent, the latter is willful. The pilot was within the legal limit. We don't know if the gust caused an inadvertent pitch angle causing a nose wheel landing. About errors, someone once said " the mistakes I make out of ignorance are nothing compared to the mistakes I make thinking I know it all " Wish You a Merry Christmas and A Very Happy New Year
I'm a former private pilot and can no longer fly on my own due to old age. I therefore know how difficult it can be to land an aircraft in windy conditions. One of the reasons is that the modern wings are so efficient that the little Cessnas that I flew would drift on and on when landing in a head wind so we had to 'persuade' them to land by lightly forcing them onto the runway. The aircraft involved in this accident had flown into Belfast with no passengers so its landing weight was greatly reduced. A plane with passengers can settle on the runway due its extra weight whereas a plane without this load can drift on and on and needs to be forced down onto the runway hence the problem with this flight. I do hope this incident is not held against the captain as I'm sure he was struggling to get his plane on the ground.
In addition, the ATR recommends to use 100% NP for land in this condition. Just follow the AFM recommendations and it’s gonna be good! Merry Christmas captain!
Adding a handful of knots to the approach speed to allow for significant gusts pitches the nose wheel slightly lower so there will be a reduced tendency to arrive on the main gear first with a slightly firm landing to handle the difficult wind.
Well to define a 'handful of knots'... In my days (flying Swearingen Metroliners and SAAB 340, shows my age, huh ;-) we applied well defined rules re additions to airspeed and flap configurations. Most of the time we added half the gusts sped to our landing Vref. plus a somewhat reduced flap setting (say Flaps 20 instead of Flaps 30) to prevent floating. I don't know the respective values for the ATR's - they do seem to have quite another wing loading as, say, the SAAB's... Merry Christmas and a prosperous new year to all of you! Greetings from Switzerland, Charles
I agree with all said especially that lessons should be learned and a just culture applied to the situation. However I would enquire as to the culture the company has towards manual flying vs autopilot use. I have encountered company cultures that very much encouraged the maximum use of automation ( autopilot) and by inference discouraged manual flying. I had encountered increasing automation dependency eroding manual flying skills and would think that this incident should be a catalyst for the investigators to look at the manual vs automation culture of the company. I did fly for a Norwegian company that very much encouraged pilots to fly manually when appropriate and practice their manual flying skills, as the company expanded this did show a cultural difference between the Scandinavian and British / Irish pilot communities who could be very reluctant make a manually flown visual approach even on a perfect flying day.
I fly into Belfast a lot on these planes and they always give me the willies! I always try to get a seat aft of the wings. Apart from the inconvenience of having to have a special smaller bag to fit the smaller than usual cabin baggage allowance, these aircraft do not feel safe and do seem to have rather a poor accident record. There is the issue of the high tailplane being shadowed by the wings in stall and pre-stall conditions. There are those heavy propellers centimetres from the fuselage and in line with cabin windows. Finally the long, low-slung fuselage makes nose wheel impact and tail drag incidents more likely.
There is poor quality video circulating, that nose down still is after the aircraft bounced on initial touchdown. One would assume that a go-around probably should’ve been initiated but that is just speculation. Have a great Christmas all
There's only 2 free things in life, oxygen and a go around. You could argue a go around costs fuel and time (money) and soon the government might tax oxygen.
Airbus and Boeing airliners have wings optimized for high cruise speed. To enable them to take off and land with a reasonable speed, they are equipped with large trailing edge flaps and leading edge slats/flaps. The latter allows for flight with higher angle of attack, hence less speed. ATR and other turboprop aircraft do not have leading edge slats. The normal attitude during approach is zero degrees, and we touch down with 3-5 degrees nose up.
Ever since the first accidents with the ATR, and subsequent pilot notes improvements, the plane has always alarmed me! I have to use it sadly now the Dash-8's are disappearing and it seriously is still a pig in every sense - the pictures at Belfast suggest very little up elevator, but who can tell?
Hi Capt. I watched you videos. Mostly they are ATR planes. Could you explain or detail what happenned to Jeju B737, 2 days ago? I would like to hear your opinions? Thany you capt.
Hi, no I cannot tell what happened. It will be wrong to speculate. There are many questions that only the investigation can answer. The preliminary report should be ready in a month.
Other poor quality sources show that the aircraft did land slightly nose down and the nosewheel impacted the runway with moderate force followed by the mainwheels. This resulted in the aircraft bouncing upwards. At this stage the nose gear appeared to be intact. The aircraft then pitched steeply nose down and impacted the runway with strong force, with the main wheels off the ground, breaking the nose gear. The initial problem is likely to be weather related. With strong and gusty crosswinds it is possible to stall the tailplane, as the downwind half of the tailplane can encounter turbulent airflow. The tailplane usually generates lift in the downward direction, counteracting the pitch moment cause by the CoG being forward of the center of lift (from the main wing). If this occurs the pilot has no control authority to prevent the pitch moment. The nose wheel striking the ground will then cause the aircraft to pitch up, potentially causing the main wing to stall, as this occurs the center of pressure moves aft, rapidly, resulting in a steep pitch down motion. Looking at the video in trying to recovery from the bounce the pilot may have induced a pitch oscillation (PIO). The runway at Edinburgh Airport is aligned 06/24, at the time of the incident the 24 runway was in operation. The winds were similar (and even stronger) than that at Belfast. Probably closer to the published limits for this type of aircraft. The winds were supposed to get stronger later in the day, so there may have been pressure to preposition the aircraft in advance of the bad weather. The AAIB report will make interesting reading.
Thank you very much for this Update!👍 It seems to be unclear so far if really strong winds as suspected caused this accident. And a "maybe" is not enough to base any lessons on it. We probably have simply to wait for the Preliminary Report. - I wish you Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year 2025, too!🎅🌲✈🍀-
how easy is it, would you say, to keep to a personal limit which significantly differs from the absolute no-go standards... would you say the companies generally are fairly good at that or is there normally quite a bit of push back from management... I understand a lot of work has been done to improve the situation, but do you think it has filtered down to smaller airplanes and airlines (rather than the Jumbos which get more media light)
It’s probably worse with small aircraft and airlines for several reasons: 1. The smaller the airline, likely the smaller profits mean financial pressure to always complete the trip. 2. Small aircraft are more affected by weather, as they react worse to icing and turbulence, and don’t have niceties like auto land and head up displays etc. 3. Because the pay is less, the crews are more likely to be in the earlier stages of their careers, so not only less experienced, but sometimes inclined more to bow to commercial pressure than more senior pilots. 4. Smaller aircraft often operate into smaller airports which can sometimes be sandwiched into difficult terrain and which may have limited or one way approach options, sloping or narrow runways, poor lighting etc.
@@captratty2167 To look onto this particular flight in regard of your four points: 1.) Emerald Airlines UK is of course a small regional airline, the UK subsidiary of another small airline, Emerald Airlines in Ireland, who operates regional flights for Aer Lingus. Their whole fleet contains only seven ATR 72. 2.) The Aircraft was obviously very light - a positioning flight with no passengers and their luggage on board, also only on a short haule flight, so probably not much fuel on board needed, too. That could have contributed to the accident. 3.) We don´t know anything about the Pilots so far. 4.) The George Best Belfast City Airport is the smaller of the two Airports of Belfast in Northern Ireland. In opposite to the larger Belfast International Airport he´s located in the City area of Belfast. No difficult terrain, but only a short runway of 1829 metres length. Of course long enough for a nearly empty ATR 72, but nevertheless always a challenge.
@ I wasn’t suggesting any of my points were the cause of this particular incident, merely replying to an earlier comment. Having flown many hours in several large turboprops and about equal hours in medium jets, often in very challenging conditions, I consider the turboprops more demanding of pilot skills, yet, because of economics, turboprop pilots usually earn less money. Life wasn’t meant to be fair!
@@captratty2167 I guess this was more aimed at discussing the whole nature of being a pilot and safety improvements or the lack thereof... the fact that having personal minimums and actually being able to uphold them are two very different things... especially if flying a smaller plane with less oversight.
No matter how we prepare, there are moments when chaos rules. A butterfly landed hard on a pile of cow dung in China, causing a rogue zephyr to force the nose of that plane down in Belfast.
30,000+ hours and 6000 plus hours in the ATR series. Flys like a big 172. But since we are not teaching flying anymore I predict airline crashes and mishaps will continue for the next 10 years. Karaoke is more important than stick skills. Robots and quotas are what airline want. They will get what they want but not like what they get
Emerald Airlines UK (ICAO: EAG) is an airline from United Kingdom founded in 2021 operating ATR 72-600. The accident aircraft is registered G-CMMK. The mother company is Irish.
Nah, both of that crash was pure pilots incompetence. One feathered both engines instead of lowering the flaps and didn't even bother to check eventhough they must had hear aural warning that accompany that feather selection while the other one just stupidly remained in icing condition without taking any action to prevent the worst to happen.
@@chris22capt You could dismiss just about any aviation accident as “stupidity”. But if you want to make aviation safer you need to dig a little deeper than that.
That's a lot of wind with such a high wingloading and profile the ATR got when near to stall speed. Yet another reason i'm never ever gonna fly in an ATR.
I do not fly on ATR airplanes , they are unbalanced, underpowered,wing design builds heavy ice , they have a poor de- icing system , and have a high accident history.
I live in the UK and can confirm it was a day of wild weather particulaly in the north of the United Kingdom with heavy turbulent winds. Many scheduled flights were cancelled as were ferry crossings and some train journeys. Very rough conditions - very difficult flying conditions. Season's greetings Magnar.
It was actually pretty vicious over here - gusting 50 knots in parts of County Down and forecast 40+ in Belfast. I live approx twenty miles south of Belfast.
Thank you Magnar for your insightful, instructive, and non-speculative explanations. They are much appreciated.
All the best to you and yours for the festive season.
Vince C
After what you said last week about the relatively low wing loading of the ATR and the fact that it was a repositioning flight, I knew getting it on the ground in those winds would have been a massive task.
Thank you Captain for the last 2024 video. :-) Looking forward to many more in 2025. Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!
Bula Captain - hope you get to spend some time with your family over the holiday period.
Thank you for your professional explanations on ATR matters.
Thank you and merry Christmas!
Thank you Captain for your explanations.
Thanks, capt. Magnar, for all your shared insights! God jul & godt nytt år fra Særp…!
Takk likeså! Jeg vokste opp i Degenes!
Empty ATR's are a pain to land. It didn't help that the company I worked for at the time made us use the landing speeds for a 17 tonne aircraft, when tne actual weight was closer to 14.5 tonnes.
That made the aircraft want to land flat, or slightly nose down
Merry Christmas Magnar and thanks for your ever appreciated insights.
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year captain!!! Happy landings!
Well said, it is through this considered approach that we call all learn and make aviation safer
I live 1.5NM from EGAC, the weather was quite awful that day.
Thank you Captain Magnar for your excellent videos all year. Best wishes from G-MGNI!
Good message. Merry Christmas to you and your family too.
Merry Xmas Capitan 🎄...we love you!!
I live 4 mile from Belfast city Airport.
Weather was atrocious all day. Really gusty winds.
Merry Christmas from Ireland magnar
Thank you Magnar.. all the best in 2025.
Merry Christmas to you too. Love your channel and thanks for your hard work making these videos. My dad used to fly commercial operations in the Short 360 to Belfast City and said it could sometimes be gusty and challenging there.
Thanks!
I was at the airport when it happened………quite a shock to be fair and glad no one was hurt! The winds were very unpredictable during that period with very sudden and very severe gusts occasionally, from quite variable directions, so it seems likely that your summary of “sometimes shut happens” is the core reason
Thank you Sir! I am not a pilot but I enjoy your analysis and I take a lot from this sector into my own work in the education sector
Thank you Captain... your channel is excellent... very informative
Thanx for all your excellent reports Captain.
Merry Christmas for Australia, where we are having a heatwave ATM 🇦🇺
Grazie.
Grazie mille
Merry Christmas Capt. Nordahl!
Have you seen the video? They bounce hard on the main gear and porpoise onto the nose gear. I think the aircraft may be a write-off as there is a lot of rippling to the fuselage possibly from the first touchdown. We shall see. Hope the crew are ok as I know most of them.
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you, Captain!
Turning into an annual event, this combination of airport & firm :) it was, and still is, extremely gusty facing the atlantic on the islands right now. I suspect that approach wasn't a lot of fun.
I don't know the rate of descent, but the fact that the aircraft isn't a banana is quite reassuring!
Hello Captain Nordal your videos rock and I can tell you are an expert at flying so happy new year
Thank you Captain! Happy Christmas!
Happy xmas to you too Captain Magnar!
Merry christmas and happy holidays to you and yours Capt! :) Hope it's a good one for you all.
Merry Christmas Magnar!!
Once on approach of EGAC runway 22 with the LET410 a sort of rotor made the airplane oscillate left and right. It took me a few seconds to realise, that I should correct accelerations, not displacements, like the yaw damper does.
Has anybody else experienced the same ?
Aer lingus use their ATRs on their belfast to leeds/bradford services. When the wind is bad leeds/bradford is certainly a tricky airport to fly into mainly bcos it gets alot of crosswind, the runway faces NW but most the time the wind blows from the SW, the touchdown zone is also set at the highest part of the runway so floating can occur too
The ATPL Human Performance book mentioned the difference between an error and violation. The former is inadvertent, the latter is willful. The pilot was within the legal limit. We don't know if the gust caused an inadvertent pitch angle causing a nose wheel landing.
About errors, someone once said " the mistakes I make out of ignorance are nothing compared to the mistakes I make thinking I know it all "
Wish You a Merry Christmas and A Very Happy New Year
I saw a posting about this incident in our local spotting group, and I was hoping you'd add some insights. Thank you, and happy holidays!
I live in the UK, very close to George best city airport.
Yes it was a very windy day. I'm surprised flights weren't cancelled.
Merry Christmas Magnar
Informative as usual.
I'm a former private pilot and can no longer fly on my own due to old age. I therefore know how difficult it can be to land an aircraft in windy conditions. One of the reasons is that the modern wings are so efficient that the little Cessnas that I flew would drift on and on when landing in a head wind so we had to 'persuade' them to land by lightly forcing them onto the runway. The aircraft involved in this accident had flown into Belfast with no passengers so its landing weight was greatly reduced. A plane with passengers can settle on the runway due its extra weight whereas a plane without this load can drift on and on and needs to be forced down onto the runway hence the problem with this flight. I do hope this incident is not held against the captain as I'm sure he was struggling to get his plane on the ground.
In addition, the ATR recommends to use 100% NP for land in this condition. Just follow the AFM recommendations and it’s gonna be good! Merry Christmas captain!
Looking forward to following you on this channel which I have only recently discovered. All the best.
Welcome aboard!
God Jul Magnar!
God jul Svein!
God Jul Capt Magnar 🎉😊
Adding a handful of knots to the approach speed to allow for significant gusts pitches the nose wheel slightly lower so there will be a reduced tendency to arrive on the main gear first with a slightly firm landing to handle the difficult wind.
Well to define a 'handful of knots'... In my days (flying Swearingen Metroliners and SAAB 340, shows my age, huh ;-) we applied well defined rules re additions to airspeed and flap configurations.
Most of the time we added half the gusts sped to our landing Vref. plus a somewhat reduced flap setting (say Flaps 20 instead of Flaps 30) to prevent floating. I don't know the respective values for the ATR's - they do seem to have quite another wing loading as, say, the SAAB's...
Merry Christmas and a prosperous new year to all of you! Greetings from Switzerland, Charles
That was crazy 😮 feliz Navidad saludos ❤
Nice explanation captain
Merry Christmas 🎄
Same to you!
In such wild and unpredictable conditions, "going around" is the wise option, but anyone can be caught out at the last minute!
Merry Christmas🎄🎁
Merry Christmas, Magnar, and a very happy 2025.
Thanks for your wonderful channel.
That METAR was as ugly as my passport photo.
I agree with all said especially that lessons should be learned and a just culture applied to the situation. However I would enquire as to the culture the company has towards manual flying vs autopilot use. I have encountered company cultures that very much encouraged the maximum use of automation ( autopilot) and by inference discouraged manual flying. I had encountered increasing automation dependency eroding manual flying skills and would think that this incident should be a catalyst for the investigators to look at the manual vs automation culture of the company. I did fly for a Norwegian company that very much encouraged pilots to fly manually when appropriate and practice their manual flying skills, as the company expanded this did show a cultural difference between the Scandinavian and British / Irish pilot communities who could be very reluctant make a manually flown visual approach even on a perfect flying day.
Merry Christmas to everyone
I fly into Belfast a lot on these planes and they always give me the willies! I always try to get a seat aft of the wings. Apart from the inconvenience of having to have a special smaller bag to fit the smaller than usual cabin baggage allowance, these aircraft do not feel safe and do seem to have rather a poor accident record. There is the issue of the high tailplane being shadowed by the wings in stall and pre-stall conditions. There are those heavy propellers centimetres from the fuselage and in line with cabin windows. Finally the long, low-slung fuselage makes nose wheel impact and tail drag incidents more likely.
Thank you, have a good Christmas and best wishes for 2025 😇
Same to you!
There is poor quality video circulating, that nose down still is after the aircraft bounced on initial touchdown. One would assume that a go-around probably should’ve been initiated but that is just speculation. Have a great Christmas all
There's only 2 free things in life, oxygen and a go around. You could argue a go around costs fuel and time (money) and soon the government might tax oxygen.
This is about 40mins from me Magnar! Great content!
Great points made Captain! Love the channel! Even though I fly a little single piston Cirrus. 😅
40 minutes by train? By bicycle? By car? Walking? . . .
@@TRPGpilot car
I’m very close, hear all the traffic departing/landing on 22/04 respectively.
@@dominicMcAfee Got ya. Wish there was video of this incident. must have been a heck of a force on that nosewheel to cause it fail.
Even on a good day, those ATRs do seem to approach the runway at a fuselage low angle of attach, compared with a Boeing or Airbus.
Airbus and Boeing airliners have wings optimized for high cruise speed. To enable them to take off and land with a reasonable speed, they are equipped with large trailing edge flaps and leading edge slats/flaps. The latter allows for flight with higher angle of attack, hence less speed.
ATR and other turboprop aircraft do not have leading edge slats. The normal attitude during approach is zero degrees, and we touch down with 3-5 degrees nose up.
Ever since the first accidents with the ATR, and subsequent pilot notes improvements, the plane has always alarmed me!
I have to use it sadly now the Dash-8's are disappearing and it seriously is still a pig in every sense - the pictures at Belfast suggest very little up elevator, but who can tell?
Buon natale and buon anno! ❤️🎄❤️
Was missed approach an option?
Hi Capt. I watched you videos. Mostly they are ATR planes. Could you explain or detail what happenned to Jeju B737, 2 days ago? I would like to hear your opinions? Thany you capt.
Hi, no I cannot tell what happened. It will be wrong to speculate. There are many questions that only the investigation can answer. The preliminary report should be ready in a month.
@@FlywithMagnar Okay. Thanks Capt.
@@FlywithMagnarwaiting for your analysis
Other poor quality sources show that the aircraft did land slightly nose down and the nosewheel impacted the runway with moderate force followed by the mainwheels. This resulted in the aircraft bouncing upwards. At this stage the nose gear appeared to be intact. The aircraft then pitched steeply nose down and impacted the runway with strong force, with the main wheels off the ground, breaking the nose gear.
The initial problem is likely to be weather related. With strong and gusty crosswinds it is possible to stall the tailplane, as the downwind half of the tailplane can encounter turbulent airflow. The tailplane usually generates lift in the downward direction, counteracting the pitch moment cause by the CoG being forward of the center of lift (from the main wing). If this occurs the pilot has no control authority to prevent the pitch moment. The nose wheel striking the ground will then cause the aircraft to pitch up, potentially causing the main wing to stall, as this occurs the center of pressure moves aft, rapidly, resulting in a steep pitch down motion. Looking at the video in trying to recovery from the bounce the pilot may have induced a pitch oscillation (PIO).
The runway at Edinburgh Airport is aligned 06/24, at the time of the incident the 24 runway was in operation. The winds were similar (and even stronger) than that at Belfast. Probably closer to the published limits for this type of aircraft.
The winds were supposed to get stronger later in the day, so there may have been pressure to preposition the aircraft in advance of the bad weather.
The AAIB report will make interesting reading.
Michail the ATR seems to be a cross that you are fated to bear!
Thank you very much for this Update!👍 It seems to be unclear so far if really strong winds as suspected caused this accident. And a "maybe" is not enough to base any lessons on it. We probably have simply to wait for the Preliminary Report.
- I wish you Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year 2025, too!🎅🌲✈🍀-
how easy is it, would you say, to keep to a personal limit which significantly differs from the absolute no-go standards... would you say the companies generally are fairly good at that or is there normally quite a bit of push back from management...
I understand a lot of work has been done to improve the situation, but do you think it has filtered down to smaller airplanes and airlines (rather than the Jumbos which get more media light)
It’s probably worse with small aircraft and airlines for several reasons:
1. The smaller the airline, likely the smaller profits mean financial pressure to always complete the trip.
2. Small aircraft are more affected by weather, as they react worse to icing and turbulence, and don’t have niceties like auto land and head up displays etc.
3. Because the pay is less, the crews are more likely to be in the earlier stages of their careers, so not only less experienced, but sometimes inclined more to bow to commercial pressure than more senior pilots.
4. Smaller aircraft often operate into smaller airports which can sometimes be sandwiched into difficult terrain and which may have limited or one way approach options, sloping or narrow runways, poor lighting etc.
@@captratty2167 To look onto this particular flight in regard of your four points:
1.) Emerald Airlines UK is of course a small regional airline, the UK subsidiary of another small airline, Emerald Airlines in Ireland, who operates regional flights for Aer Lingus. Their whole fleet contains only seven ATR 72.
2.) The Aircraft was obviously very light - a positioning flight with no passengers and their luggage on board, also only on a short haule flight, so probably not much fuel on board needed, too. That could have contributed to the accident.
3.) We don´t know anything about the Pilots so far.
4.) The George Best Belfast City Airport is the smaller of the two Airports of Belfast in Northern Ireland. In opposite to the larger Belfast International Airport he´s located in the City area of Belfast. No difficult terrain, but only a short runway of 1829 metres length. Of course long enough for a nearly empty ATR 72, but nevertheless always a challenge.
@ I wasn’t suggesting any of my points were the cause of this particular incident, merely replying to an earlier comment. Having flown many hours in several large turboprops and about equal hours in medium jets, often in very challenging conditions, I consider the turboprops more demanding of pilot skills, yet, because of economics, turboprop pilots usually earn less money. Life wasn’t meant to be fair!
@@captratty2167 I guess this was more aimed at discussing the whole nature of being a pilot and safety improvements or the lack thereof...
the fact that having personal minimums and actually being able to uphold them are two very different things... especially if flying a smaller plane with less oversight.
@@captratty2167 I found it nevertheless interesting to brake the known facts about this incident down to your points. Merry Christmas!🙋♀
I've landed an Embraer 190 there. It's a little short. Weather can be sporty there.😆
God jul fra Portugal. Jan.
God jul
In the airline biz, we call them wheelbarrow landings
Happy New year 2025!
No matter how we prepare, there are moments when chaos rules. A butterfly landed hard on a pile of cow dung in China, causing a rogue zephyr to force the nose of that plane down in Belfast.
God Jul Magnar!
God jul!
I live in Belfast 2 miles from airport plane landed front wheel broke of on landing
God jul!
It’s being referred to as an ‘incident’, but judging from the serious wrinkling of the skin around the nose surely it was an accident.
30,000+ hours and 6000 plus hours in the ATR series. Flys like a big 172. But since we are not teaching flying anymore I predict airline crashes and mishaps will continue for the next 10 years. Karaoke is more important than stick skills. Robots and quotas are what airline want. They will get what they want but not like what they get
Why is no one talking about the many many nose gear failures on these airframes. Google bombardier dash 8 nose gear failures. Too many to list.
It was an ATR not a Bombardier😊😊
Emerald Airlines/Aer Lingus is not from the U.K. it is Irish.
Emerald Airlines UK (ICAO: EAG) is an airline from United Kingdom founded in 2021 operating ATR 72-600. The accident aircraft is registered G-CMMK. The mother company is Irish.
@ I should have formed that comment as a question not at a comment. Thanks for the follow up.
Atr one of the worst things i have ever flown in
Really dislike those ATR 72s, especially after that Nepal crash and the one still being investigated where it just span itself into the ground.
Nah, both of that crash was pure pilots incompetence. One feathered both engines instead of lowering the flaps and didn't even bother to check eventhough they must had hear aural warning that accompany that feather selection while the other one just stupidly remained in icing condition without taking any action to prevent the worst to happen.
@@chris22capt
You could dismiss just about any aviation accident as “stupidity”. But if you want to make aviation safer you need to dig a little deeper than that.
@@meofnz2320 for those 2 case, i disagree with that, especially with the crash at Nepal because that was pure a rookie mistake.
I have over 20000hrs on single seat DFS and I know not to slam nosewheels in first.
If in doubt, DON'T. Pilot negligence.
That's a lot of wind with such a high wingloading and profile the ATR got when near to stall speed. Yet another reason i'm never ever gonna fly in an ATR.
I do not fly on ATR airplanes , they are unbalanced, underpowered,wing design builds heavy ice , they have a poor de- icing system , and have a high accident history.
Cunning.
Emerald are not a good airline. Loganair weren’t flying their Atrs in that storm.