I suspect that I'll need two circuits for the situation I'm considering. One circuit in pex for glycol/antifreeze from the solar collector to the battery. The other weeping tile for the air from the space through the battery. I'm still looking for some way to numerically model my system so that I can get an idea of the heat capacity and transfer rates for given flows. I like having a back of the envelope calculation up front just to help set expectations.
PEX-AL-PEX is what I used for the shop floor (1/2") & also to move heated fluid (1") from outdoor wood furnace to shop & house. I will be using 1/2" in the future for solar heat collectors.
I just used pex for the in floor heating in my home that I am currently building. It was so cheap! It only cost $150 for all the piping for my 800 sqft first floor. The 4" pad is insulated with 3" of styrofoam and my heat source is from the wood stove. Copper piping from the wood stove to the tank then copper to the heat exchanger and then Pex filled with glycol from there. That aluminized pex sounds intriguing though, I will look into that for next time
Another way of transferring heat is to use a heat exchanger between the high temperature storage/generator and the pipes to transfer it into the home. So as an example, from the storage/generator to the heat exchanger, you use metal piping. The heat exchanger is well insulated and is filled with a liquid capable of handling temps up to 200 C, but the max temperature control setting for the heat exchanger is set to 150C. The piping inside the heat exchanger is all metal, but the piping exiting to the house/greenhouse is such that can handle up to 150 C (it should never actually reach this temperature with the house/greenhouse fluid circuit circulating.
I live in Florida. I haven't seen much about cooling. I have even considered a cooper line under the ground, and circulate the air from inside the house with a small air pump.
For metallic air piping consider aluminum downspouts. They do not have great crush resistance, but that isn't always important. The solar collector itself could be made of aluminum downspouts and the heat exchanger in a raised bed. Its also a candidate for carrying steam.
I stripped the paint off and painted it with hi-heat BBQ paint. I built a collector box insulated with fiberglass and lined inside with aluminum flashing also painted with BBQ paint. As I was installing the double pane glass I touched the pipe by accident and burnt the back of my hand. This was only after 2 hours in indirect sun. As I was renting a second floor apartment at the time, I limited to installation options. So I installed it to the fencing of south-facing balcony on inside part of fence. ( Safety reasons and not to trigger building code police.). I did lose some heating from the rails shadowing, but it kept landlord happy. Well that 4 ft X 10 ft unit would blast heat into our apartment to maintain 25*C for 4-6 hours a day in - 30 to - 35*C days. Considering it had no heat sink to bank and save us about 25 % of heating during the coldest days of winter, we were happy. So I say Aluminum downspouts are a fantastic option. As they do come in square shape, by placing on a diamond angle in heat sink as you fill with sand will up its crush-resistance to sand above it.
3 роки тому+2
@@redstone1999 Again, excellent advice. Your comments sparked my imagination. I was thinking of using them with a sand battery because pex tubing or plastic pipes would just melt. I feel like a mad scientist!
@ Thank you, sir. Yes, we are scientist. Not a mad scientists, but curious scientists. I love to experiment. Most end up as brain-farts, but some do actually work out as planned or better. The more you do and learn, the more you find solutions easier. I have spent 58 years of my 62 years playing " What can I do/make with this ... ? ". I drove my parents crazy. Dad finally decided I needed my own lab away from house incase I blew myself up or release bio-hazardous material from my bedroom or basement hobby room.
Great vid - thanks I have a 10x10 insulated block building i am going to use for my sand battery- heating the sand with both solar and a wood heater { as a backup im in northern Mn} built into the battery, im thinking i will need to use copper coils in the sand because of the heat that may be present from the wood stove, any thoughts on this?
I know it’s a lot of work, but have you considered putting links to the materials and products you refer to? Many other Utubers do that and it’s extremely helpful. Just a thought..
Ive been playing with a design for a number of years. Finally moving to land big enough to install a system. Going to see if I can apply the experience towards my physics degree. You mentioned wanting 100k btu per hour of output in your last video....just curious why youre wanting so much output. Our 60k btu furnace currently heats our 1400 sq ft home during winter and uses around 200k btu per day max. 100k btu an hour is SO much output.
I did not hear any mention of the thermal conductivity of any of the different types of piping. That is the ability of the material to transfer heat through the material. Copper has a much larger heat transfer ability then ABS. The reason one wants a high heat conductivity is not for the transport of the heat to or from the heat exchanger (in that case a high insulation value is desired) but rather to transfer the heat between the heat exchanger fluid and the material that is to be heated/cooled.
I need to heat my honey room to 100F. The dimensions of my room is 8’WX 12’L X 12’H = 1152cf. I will place a solar collector on the south side of the room and wish to draw air through the system to store heat inside my honey warming room. It must the dissipate that heat throughout the day/night maintaining a fairly constant ambient room temperature of 100F to heat the bulk honey for bottling or frames of honey for extraction to about 90F. Can you recommend a collection system, piping, and storage system (I was considering river stones in a 30 gal to 55 gal steel drum. What are your thoughts?
Added thought: I have a south facing window in that room that I’ve blanked off. I’ll modify that for my solar panel and then use insulated ducting to draw hot air into a solar battery filled with river rock. Yes? No?
If your thematic battery is sand... why not green sand (used to make moulds for casting metal)?... form the pipe structure in the sand itself. I know it sounds crazy - but checkout a few green sand casting videos. Maybe add a little cement, lay the sand in layers and cast the pipe work structure into the sand itself. - with no additional material. As a final thought why not spray the hot water on the top of a sand battery and let it trickle down under gravity (no pipes needed) and pump cold air in at the bottom to rise through and get heated (again no pipes needed).
Another option that may have been covered is the stuff they use for maple sap collection. They use poly for mainlines but the laterals are more flexible and smaller although just like the poly piping, I would think that they are only suited to low temperature heat sources.
Do you have a suggestion for the size and type of circulator pump that can be used with Pex and polypropylene glycol for the application with a car radiator and a 20" box fan in a greenhouse?
Do you use an air or liquid heat delivery system in your thermal battery and why?
I suspect that I'll need two circuits for the situation I'm considering. One circuit in pex for glycol/antifreeze from the solar collector to the battery. The other weeping tile for the air from the space through the battery. I'm still looking for some way to numerically model my system so that I can get an idea of the heat capacity and transfer rates for given flows. I like having a back of the envelope calculation up front just to help set expectations.
@@chrisfedde4032 my best advise is testing!!!!! Thank you for the great response!
@@SimpleTek a
@@lafnjohn3292 sweet
Excellent video, very useful, very well presented...THANK YOU.
PEX-AL-PEX is what I used for the shop floor (1/2") & also to move heated fluid (1") from outdoor wood furnace to shop & house.
I will be using 1/2" in the future for solar heat collectors.
I love aluminum wrapped pex!
I just used pex for the in floor heating in my home that I am currently building. It was so cheap! It only cost $150 for all the piping for my 800 sqft first floor. The 4" pad is insulated with 3" of styrofoam and my heat source is from the wood stove. Copper piping from the wood stove to the tank then copper to the heat exchanger and then Pex filled with glycol from there. That aluminized pex sounds intriguing though, I will look into that for next time
That sounds like an awesome system!
Is that a purpose made outdoor wood burner or a DIY'd conversation of an indoor wood stove?
Another way of transferring heat is to use a heat exchanger between the high temperature storage/generator and the pipes to transfer it into the home. So as an example, from the storage/generator to the heat exchanger, you use metal piping. The heat exchanger is well insulated and is filled with a liquid capable of handling temps up to 200 C, but the max temperature control setting for the heat exchanger is set to 150C. The piping inside the heat exchanger is all metal, but the piping exiting to the house/greenhouse is such that can handle up to 150 C (it should never actually reach this temperature with the house/greenhouse fluid circuit circulating.
what type to you suggest?
Thanks for the straight forward info....subscribed....
Thank you for the kind words
Super video. Greetings from Poland :)
Thank you for the kind words! Cheers from Canada!
Merci from Montreal, Canada.
Cheers from Oak Point, Manitoba!
😀 I like your videos. They get you thinking 👍
Thank you!!! That’s the purpose!
@@SimpleTek 🙂
I live in Florida. I haven't seen much about cooling. I have even considered a cooper line under the ground, and circulate the air from inside the house with a small air pump.
cooling is important!
Yaaaay leaaaarning!!!
Yay!
Thanks for the info!
Thank you for the kind words!
Abs piping with mineral oil for the liquid! Safe higher thermal mass then water and non toxic if leakage happens!
interesting!
For metallic air piping consider aluminum downspouts.
They do not have great crush resistance, but that isn't always important.
The solar collector itself could be made of aluminum downspouts and the heat exchanger in a raised bed.
Its also a candidate for carrying steam.
great ideas!
I stripped the paint off and painted it with hi-heat BBQ paint. I built a collector box insulated with fiberglass and lined inside with aluminum flashing also painted with BBQ paint. As I was installing the double pane glass I touched the pipe by accident and burnt the back of my hand. This was only after 2 hours in indirect sun.
As I was renting a second floor apartment at the time, I limited to installation options. So I installed it to the fencing of south-facing balcony on inside part of fence. ( Safety reasons and not to trigger building code police.). I did lose some heating from the rails shadowing, but it kept landlord happy. Well that 4 ft X 10 ft unit would blast heat into our apartment to maintain 25*C for 4-6 hours a day in - 30 to - 35*C days. Considering it had no heat sink to bank and save us about 25 % of heating during the coldest days of winter, we were happy.
So I say Aluminum downspouts are a fantastic option. As they do come in square shape, by placing on a diamond angle in heat sink as you fill with sand will up its crush-resistance to sand above it.
@@redstone1999 Again, excellent advice. Your comments sparked my imagination. I was thinking of using them with a sand battery because pex tubing or plastic pipes would just melt. I feel like a mad scientist!
@ Thank you, sir. Yes, we are scientist. Not a mad scientists, but curious scientists. I love to experiment. Most end up as brain-farts, but some do actually work out as planned or better.
The more you do and learn, the more you find solutions easier. I have spent 58 years of my 62 years playing " What can I do/make with this ... ? ". I drove my parents crazy. Dad finally decided I needed my own lab away from house incase I blew myself up or release bio-hazardous material from my bedroom or basement hobby room.
@@redstone1999 That's awesome
Great vid - thanks I have a 10x10 insulated block building i am going to use for my sand battery- heating the sand with both solar and a wood heater { as a backup im in northern Mn} built into the battery, im thinking i will need to use copper coils in the sand because of the heat that may be present from the wood stove, any thoughts on this?
Sounds interesting, keep me updated on your progress
I know it’s a lot of work, but have you considered putting links to the materials and products you refer to? Many other Utubers do that and it’s extremely helpful. Just a thought..
I've dabbled with it and I like money but I'm on the line with it
Ive been playing with a design for a number of years. Finally moving to land big enough to install a system. Going to see if I can apply the experience towards my physics degree.
You mentioned wanting 100k btu per hour of output in your last video....just curious why youre wanting so much output. Our 60k btu furnace currently heats our 1400 sq ft home during winter and uses around 200k btu per day max. 100k btu an hour is SO much output.
greenhouses use a LOT more energy than houses for heating
I did not hear any mention of the thermal conductivity of any of the different types of piping. That is the ability of the material to transfer heat through the material. Copper has a much larger heat transfer ability then ABS. The reason one wants a high heat conductivity is not for the transport of the heat to or from the heat exchanger (in that case a high insulation value is desired) but rather to transfer the heat between the heat exchanger fluid and the material that is to be heated/cooled.
good point
I need to heat my honey room to 100F. The dimensions of my room is 8’WX 12’L X 12’H = 1152cf. I will place a solar collector on the south side of the room and wish to draw air through the system to store heat inside my honey warming room. It must the dissipate that heat throughout the day/night maintaining a fairly constant ambient room temperature of 100F to heat the bulk honey for bottling or frames of honey for extraction to about 90F.
Can you recommend a collection system, piping, and storage system (I was considering river stones in a 30 gal to 55 gal steel drum. What are your thoughts?
I just use home depo or Amazon/eBay for that kind of stuff…
Added thought: I have a south facing window in that room that I’ve blanked off. I’ll modify that for my solar panel and then use insulated ducting to draw hot air into a solar battery filled with river rock. Yes? No?
good info
Thank you
If your thematic battery is sand... why not green sand (used to make moulds for casting metal)?... form the pipe structure in the sand itself.
I know it sounds crazy - but checkout a few green sand casting videos.
Maybe add a little cement, lay the sand in layers and cast the pipe work structure into the sand itself. - with no additional material.
As a final thought why not spray the hot water on the top of a sand battery and let it trickle down under gravity (no pipes needed) and pump cold air in at the bottom to rise through and get heated (again no pipes needed).
not crazy at all!
Another option that may have been covered is the stuff they use for maple sap collection. They use poly for mainlines but the laterals are more flexible and smaller although just like the poly piping, I would think that they are only suited to low temperature heat sources.
Great tip!
Hdpe potable water pipes are rated less but will only start melting at 125deg c it seems to be good price/value.
nice
What do you think about Ferrell concrete
I don’t know what that is?
Do you have a suggestion for the size and type of circulator pump that can be used with Pex and polypropylene glycol for the application with a car radiator and a 20" box fan in a greenhouse?
ask your plumbing supply store - they have tables there so you get the right pump for length and volume of tubing
Anybody had success with harnessing the heat from a thermal battery using ground source heat pump to heat a home?
Tons of homes use that
My husband can't stand your background music.
Time for a new husband!!!
Lol