twitchcon was a bit of a mess
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- Опубліковано 13 жов 2022
- TwitchCon San Diego 2022 had it all. Too small panel rooms, lacking security, bodily harm, and so much more. To be fair, I did have a good time at TwitchCon but that doesn't mean all the cons of the convention do not matter.
*this was filmed prior to me seeing the video of the convention center security guard talking about how awful attendees had been during the convention. Obviously, harassing employees and security guards for not letting you do what you want and being verbally abusive towards them is never okay.
related links-
Twitter thread- astraharaa/status...
Injury video- JakeSucky/status/...
Adriana's twitter- / 1579098947779407877
/ pinkerchu
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EMT here. We are told to treat every fall from over 3 feet or landing on your butt, back, or head as a spine injury. Every single fall off of those pedestals where someone doesn't land on their feet would qualify.
It felt so absurd sometimes to slap that collar on during training scenarios that didn’t feel like they warranted it, but it really is better safe than sorry.
I fell once during a cheer camp (breaking my femur in a pretty gory fashion) and I remember the EMT's putting a collar on me and thinking, "this is unnecessary..." but looking back, I had so much adrenaline that I my compound fracture didn't exactly HURT, so I could see why y'all have to be over cautions for any fall.
Thank you for doing what you do! ❤
I only took a college-level first aid class and the rule of thumb was "if, in doubt, it is a spine injury." Better safe than permanent injury, and those who took a fall were not in immediate life-threatening danger either. Just my non-medical opinion.
ER scribe, and you’re so right, bc so many of those falls have genuine injuries. it’s crazy
It’s shocking they didn’t even attempt to add a gym mat underneath the cubes. Still wouldn’t have been enough. But leaving the hard concrete under the cubes….this is horribly negligent.
I’ve heard they actually did but THEY CHOSE THE WRONG ONES WITH THE WOODEN INSERTS. I’m not sure if this is confirmed but I’ve seen someone talking about different yoga mats in the comment section of a video about the incident and they mentioned these mats with wooden insets in them. Then another commenter replied that they’ve seen the corners of such mats with visible wood sticking out underneath the pit. Again I’m not sure if any of this is true but definitely a point worth taking into consideration 👀
@@mrkryakushka4241 Ok that i not an excue, like double check safety?!
But at leat that has a reason. a bad reason to not affty check after , but a reason.
Ok in that case it maybe lies with the people setting it up, but they still have a liability to checkand ensur that, and th medics and reaction, is on twitch. That not checking when she fell. Even to save their ass legally.
Those super thick gym mats would have been the best for this and it still would have been cheap for them..
I feel like if I ever saw Swell at an event, I would treat it like a Mothman sighting. Like "Aw shit, Amanda's here, this event is gonna get messy."
Lol great comment, would read again
Amanda is the closest to an IRL Absol I’ve ever heard of lmao
Pff you’re totally right
The mothswell prophecies
she's got a chaos sensor and follows it lmao
Don't forget the tweets Adriana later put out that the medical staff hired for the booth CONTINUED TO TRY TO MOVE HER AFTER HER INJURY. It was only when an off-duty EMT noticed and came over to tell them to stop that they stopped moving her. That could have severely aggravated her injuries.
I thought it was common sense that someone with sudden and extreme backpain shouldnt be moved around. Holy fucking shit, i hope she sues them 😬😱
@@kristelbrok998 You know, my father had a saying that has stuck with me. "Common sense isn't as common as you think it is"
It's like the signs on the back of trucks stating they aren't responsible for damage to your vehicle. It's BS. They can be made to pay because that sign is not legally binding. She might have signed something but a lawyer will say it's void because she used the pit under the understanding that it was safe and it was inspected and verified safe.
I remember seeing in the video when they tried to move her and I screamed at my screen. I'm not even an EMT and I know not to touch someone in that situation
The video I saw not only did they try to move her the other woman Her opponent I guess, said "She's okay". Pretty sure that's not for her to decide.
The foam pit and the disabled person with the service dog getting harassed was just awful.
Honestly! One of my biggest anxieties when attending events with my SD is being harassed or being given a hard time
I have fallen an landed on my feet and felt it all the way up my back. Falls are no joke.
@@Oonagh72 same. I have had and seen people with pain and injuries to tail bone. The pain and problems genuinely is for a life time
@@iusedtowrite6667 I broke my tailbone over 30 years ago. It still hurts.
@@danaslitlist1 depending on what u use your service dog for, invest in a “don’t pet im working” thing on the harness
These conventions need to stop having pits in them. First the Dashcon ball pit and now we have the Twitchcon foam pit. 😳
Seriously. All I can think of is “NO PITS!” in the Edna Mode “no capes” tone
"how many times do we have to teach you this lesson OLD MAN?!"
Idk man, tumblr ball pit was pretty epic
The ball pit was great until someone pissed in it 😭
😂😂 I immediately thought of the dashcon ball pit.
Hearing about that woman's broken back made me so sad...this is a major injury she's going to have to deal with in some way forever
Fr literally hearing that made my jaw drop and made me feel sick to my stomach that is so awful and everything about the situation is incredibly messed up
she should sue
@@XxboogesxX She literally won't be able to do her job anymore tho. Or even live a pain free normal life. The amount of jokes I've seen at this injured girl's expense disgusts me.
Yep. That is most likely a life changing injury.
Minor soapbox here, but it drives me nuts how people skip over all the things that can happen between did not survive and made a full recovery. The rod in her spine is a great example. My deaf right ear is a decent one. Sure, we'll both keep living, but the effects on our lives are permanent and non trivial.
Literally! I sat wrong for a couple hours and now have a permanently bruised tailbone called coccydynia. I can only imagine how much her life is going to change because of her broken back. I feel so bad for her
I'm glad you brought up accessibility issues. And yes, as a disabled person, MOST accessibility issues are caused by employees who were not communicated information on how to use their own resources. About 7,000 wheelchairs are damaged per year on airplanes in the USA alone. It is currently IMPOSSIBLE on EVERY SINGLE COMMERCIAL PLANE to bring your wheelchair on board. You MUST get out of it and get carried or use a very dangerous aisle chair to get pushed onto the plane. There are no accessible bathrooms on literally any plane, and airlines are trying to cram in more seats to airplanes to make more money and push people out of their assistive devices. Once you get out of your chair, it is like entrusting a corporation to not break your legs that cost as much as a car. Motorized wheelchairs and manual wheelchairs are not fully covered by insurance, so every time it's broken, that's thousands of dollars out the door and several months to YEARS waiting on a long list for a repair. Gate crew employees are not trained on how to pick up a wheelchair and treat them like any other luggage (basically picking them up by a fragile part and throwing it onto a plane). People don't realize how absolutely horrifying traveling is as a disabled person. Imagine if every time you traveled you risked breaking your legs. Just "getting a new chair" is not feasible. This is why so many disabled people just don't travel. It's not an option. It's not just about tight spaces.
Extremely insightful, thank you
This is one of the reasons i wish i was an engineer to fix this!! Something I will say is hopefully trains are a bit better, and trains are so important because you dont have to put the chair under and can remain in it the whole time. Im not sure if all trains, such as amtrack, have wide enough doors though im curious if they have special doors for that
@@Pandemonioxo Trains are worse. And I could actually start sobbing hysterically. They have worse doors and walkways and there are NO handicapped areas for me to sit. If I were to get on am Amtrak train and buy an overnight area to sleep in? I HAVE TO CLIMB STAIRS. Me, the wheelchair user, who has a standing time of ten minutes.
I had a better time with airlines who have high records of breaking chairs when people realized I need to sit down immediately and could not be bumped or hurt. That was screwed up. That was entirely screwed up. And we're gonna be honest here... people don't have common sense. They don't And the worst, the absolute worst, still had the basic instincts to go "this person has limited standing time, has indicated she will be in pain, and needs help."
Amtrak will never be accessible and is worse than the airlines. We need a full revamp of the railroads in the US. We need air travel to get a wake up call. And yet every time the government proposes some sort of measure to fix our transportation problems? Some Republican (YES WE WILL SAY WHO IS THE PROBLEM) starts crying that their friends are going to lose money. They already make an obscene amount of money because nobody has any choices but to be forced into literal pain, even people who don't have disabilities. Enough is enough.
@@Pandemonioxo its not because nobody thought of ways to fix this. It is like this because their is no profit in making thing accessible. These companies just don't give a shit.
I am in a wheelchair full time. In my experience they did once allow me to bring my chair on to the plane, although every other time they did not. To add to that the airline will only pay about $100 for a new chair. The people I knew that had broken chairs from plains had to bring a lawsuit to get airlines to pay for a new chair.
Waivers also don't protect you from gross negligence and it'll be easy to show this was negligence.
Yep easy example with football players. They waived their right to sue from getting hit hard not from the Stadium Collapsing and hurting them. Here the Stadium collapsed.
Exactly. Let's say instead of lacking adequate padding there were a bunch of broken bottles under the foam left from the workers drinking there the night before when they were setting it up. So she jumps into the pile of broken glass and severely cuts herself and glass needs to be surgically removed from her body and some of it will not be able to be removed. She wouldn't be able to sue because she signed a waiver? LOL! Yeah right.
regardless of how I feel about what happened, I wouldn't be surprised if she ends up not having as much of a case as people are thinking. the foam pit structure itself was certainly negligence, but I think lawyers could point to her walking onto the platform (thus knowing how deep it really was) and then purposefully doing a sort of splits canon ball directly onto the ground, & claim that it's on her for her own injuries.
I don't know much about law, but there are certain trials where the parties are assigned a percentage of responsibility and then pay accordingly. twitch is certainly at fault for a lot of it (especially considering we saw other people not diving ass-first into the concrete and still getting injured), but there's no way she would be found 0% at fault
Hey there! As someone with the oddly specific experience of setting up foam pits and acrobatics setups for college events, this foam pit was a disaster waiting to happen. For any activity or even where you anticipate a fall greater than 2 ft, there HAS to be a minimum of 4ft of foam held underneath by a net, or crash mats surrounding the fall zone. This is because anything less will allow contact with the floor, because there isn’t enough compression to slow down and cushion your fall. Plus, there should have been two trained emts on site incase anything happened. While the fall for sure did damage, moving someone with a spine injury as a joke is insane levels of negligence, and it’s a miracle she’s able to walk after that. The fact that no one though to consult with a local gym about the setup is insane to me.
I saw someone comment with an update on Adriana, apparently she can't or sit up at the moment, because the damage is severe 😬
unless they were coordinating with a tumbling gym for a portable version of an actual foam pit, this shouldn't have been a booth of theirs at all. it honestly seems deceptive. when people see the foam cubes, they expect everything underneath to be set up appropriately. i really hope they don't try bringing this to other cons
@@ane3sha agreed 100%
Thank you for this information i feel so sorry for adrianna getting injured from their negligence why was no one testing the pit if it was safe??
Someone breaking their back is absolutely and unbelievably awful, but my mind also went immediately to "What if someone had went down head first??", like it is a small chance but someone totally could have died from a severe head injury from a fall directly to concrete if they had fallen in a similar way to how she had slammed. Safety seemed like a complete oversight at those booths.
To be fair it really isn’t that small of a chance with how it was set up
I think that the woman who broke her back could also sue due to her bladder also having permanent nerve damage which was most likely due to the security forcing her to get up and walk despite her obvious injury
😲 no! I know no amount of money will truly make her whole but that definitely puts them at a huge liability
OMG, that's horrific
She also has a physical job, she isnt a game streamer who can mostly sit down. So she wont be able to work for a while
they did What
Beyond awful!
The girl who broke her back tweeted that she doesnt know if the nerve damage will ever heal enough for her to not need a catheter. Her life is changed forever now.
I'm glad you spoke up about the accessibility issues. It's disabled people's right by law to not have to provide proof to use accessible spaces, but it's a huge problem that event organizers, staff, and people trying to just get "special treatment" are ruining the ability for the people who NEED these options to participate. And thank you for your care in not implying that the issue was people who didn't "look disabled". You'd think that in this day and age people would understand that invisible disabilities exist, but in these conversations, often disabled people who look "normal" get harmed by being lumped in with the actual abled people who are abusing the system.
👆👆👆
Exactly. I have invisible disabilities and the number of people who expect me to prove that I "deserve" help is ridiculous
As someone who is disabled, usually my companion travels with me. So even if someone in the accessibility line looks healthy, they may be, but their friend or partner isn't able-bodied and they are enjoying the event together.
I mean, how awful would accessibility be if they only let the disabled person through and they then had to wait at the front of the line for the rest of their party to join them. Most events/theme parks.etc don't do that.
Yes! I have extremely severe RA and needed a disability placard for 6 months due to damage in my knees. People would legit harass me about it because I “look young and healthy” like mama I WISH I WAS
Yes! I have an invisible disability and people give me dirty looks all the time when I use my placard to park in a handicapped spot. I have severe cold urticaria, which means I am allergic to exposure to cold temperatures. So here I am in the winter, parking handicapped, running into the building, and people yell at me and tell me I should be ashamed of myself for taking up a parking spot from someone who ‘actually’ needs it. I went into anaphylactic shock in 60 degree weather…so yeah, I really do need it. I appreciate your comment and support towards the concept of invisible disabilities!
I'm willing to bet at least one person DID say something about the foam pit but was ignored 😬
Yeah I would never try something like that, especially if they make me sign a waver, then you know it’s not safe!
Non-practicing attorney here. Fun fact: you can’t waive negligence. So even if you sign a waiver, you can still sue and potentially recover damages if you can prove that the entity responsible for your injury acted negligently. I can’t comment on whether Twitch or Lenovo definitely acted with negligence because I can’t provide legal advice as a non-practicing attorney, but hypothetically if there were an even that had multiple prior injuries or even just set up the attraction in a way that was negligent (ie. not conforming to established standards and practices regarding safety), that could potentially be evidence of negligence depending on the exact circumstances in the hypothetical situation described. For example, you sign a waiver to go bungee jumping. The company running the bungee jumping uses a bungee not rated for weight and forces that will be applied to it or not in compliance with established bungee standards for safe jumping. You get injured. You might be able to recover damages despite signing a waiver if you can prove using that particular bungee was negligent. Whether the company knew it was negligent or not plays a roll, but with regular negligence I don’t think knowledge matters that much. It just makes it worse if they knew it wasn’t rated for that use and did it anyway. But don’t quote me on the knowledge of negligence bit. It’s been a long time since Torts and I play with puppies for a living now. Just sharing some general knowledge from my law school days. 😊
I want to play with puppies all day!
Ooh cool, I was right! I was thinking that signing a waiver for a potentially dangerous activity covers the activity itself, not whether the people who organized the activity were negligent. The people who got hurt in the foam pit signed the waiver knew the risk involved in the activity of having a gladiator fight in a foam pit. If they had known that the foam pit was actually just a thin layer of foam cubes on top of bare concrete they probably wouldn't have signed the waiver or participated in the activity. Anyways thanks for giving such a good explanation! Hopefully the people who were hurt are able to take legal action against the organizers of that booth. I am curious if the set up they used wasn't meant for this activity and they went ahead and used it anyways. It sounds like it was too big of a mistake to be made by a company that has experience with setting up these foam pit fights or anything similar!
@@alexkasper5029 Exactly! They accepted the risk of the general nature of the activity as if it were set up properly, not the risk of it being set up in an inherently dangerous or negligent manner. That’s my understanding, at least. Whether that liability applies only to the people/company who set up the pits or the sponsor Lenovo or Twitchcon as the organizer or the convention center as the host is another legal question that is beyond my general knowledge of Tort law and would have to be decided by the courts based on precedent. Great comment!
@@alyssabrown-carleton6173 I became a dog trainer and work mostly with puppy classes and socialization. It’s super fun and rewarding but plenty of hard work in its own way!
@@annarrogance Thanks!! :D
As someone with an "invisible" disability, I really appreciate you speaking up about the way accessibility is addressed in these situations. I wasn't at Twitchcon, but even at the bank I have had issues with either lack of accessibility or people making comments because I don't "look" disabled. Usually I can shake off the comments but I shouldn't have to, and ngl if I'm tired or feeling particularly bad there have been times when it has really hurt.
Another thing is Adriana was pregnant when she broke her back (she was unaware at the time) and because she needed surgery she couldn't keep the baby. It's so much worse than her just breaking her back.
I've seen photos of both a broken leg and a dislocated knee. Multiple people also mentioned back pain which could indicate more bad injuries. I'm also suprised you didn't mention the latest news from Adriana, it's a *severe* injury, much more than just a rod in her spine. Nerve damage to her bladder, unable to walk or sit up at the moment, crushed spine, it's really really bad.
Probably a development from after filming.
@@LunaWitcherArt The latest development was from the 12th, so maybe but it's not uncommon for her to make last min edits on breaking news on the topics she's covering
@@skylarkblue1 yeah, this is one of her faster videos to come out. She usually films 5-7 days before posting the finished video. And her videos are more about her experience and opinions than an actual report. Philip DeFranco talked about the health update, though.
@@LunaWitcherArt heh, where you think I heard about the update from :P
That poor girl! I hope she's able to get 100% of the emergency and residual care covered, cause her life is changed forever. The least they can do is pay out.
thank god nobody tried to dive or even front flip into that pit, could've easily been a horror show. Adriana is 0% to blame for this and it breaks my heart thinking about the long painful road she has ahead of her right now, wishing her a speedy recovery and ALL the money. also that sweatshirt is rad as hell
It's technically illegal to prove a disability. That's why they can't ask.
Require proof of a disability*
But yeah that's why it's up to a person's friends and family to let them know they're a shitty person.
But alot of people don't have either or have those that enable them.
such a horrible thought to BREAK your BACK TWICE in a foam pit thinking you'll be safe enough. horrible how they dealt with that. my thoughts are with the injured girl!! hope she gets well soon and hope she sues
She shouldn't even have to sue. They should just pay her
@@em84c suing can ensure that the company will actually implement changes into the future. Companies also tend to low ball people if they just pay them. The McDonalds Coffee Case is a good example of this as a serious injury was also caused by gross negligence.
@@em84c like the other person said, suing can lead to changes in policy. itd be great if they paid her off the bat but if they then turned around and used the exact same foam pit and broke someone elses back it wouldnt be great
@@em84c insurance will probably require a legal proceeding to take place unfortunately.
Everyone who has ever done gymnastics is horrified by the video. The foam pits we tumble into are incredibly deep, and there are usually tramps and/or mats under the foam! I was shocked when I saw the pics from TwitchCon - they were _lucky_ there weren't more people injured.
I am disabled and use a wheelchair. Ableds trying to steal our seating and abuse our accommodations is nothing new, unfortunately. I go to a lot of concerts and the amount of people who will hop the barrier to sit in the ADA section is staggering. It always happens at least once per concert. There's not much that can be done about it though, as asking for proof of disability is both ableist and illegal.
Crowded convention spaces are also par for the course. You just have to hope people are nice and move out of the way. Or start ramming ankles lol
I’m not from the US so I’m not familiar with your laws but understand that there’s different rules regarding this in different countries. And I guess I understand that it would be a hassle to get that kind of proof for a lot of things. But as an example, here in Sweden you will need a “disability permit” to use disability parking. You apply for it from your municipality and in the application your doctor need to fill out certain things. If you don’t have this permit then it is illegal to use those parking spots and you will get fined. What I don’t really understand is how something like that would be viewed as ableist? In a perfect world it wouldn’t be needed. But I’m 100% sure people that don’t need them would take advantage of those spots, if you wouldn’t need the permit as proof.
@@irrelevant8660 it’s abelist because it’s not so easy for disabled people to get “proof”. There are many hidden disabilities and conditions and people who are still seeking a diagnosis who end up being left out and unable to access these adjustments. Also the actual proof is usually varied by event or place. Some might have very harsh rules like being on a specific benefit which cuts out even more eligible disabled people
That foam pit should never have been put up, I'll bet no safety inspection or risk assessment was done. Hope Adriana and all the others have a good recovery
It's so interesting you bring up accessibility. I just went to NYCC and while I am not disabled, I did bring my 9month old son one day and getting his stroller around was SO DIFFICULT. The javits center is many floors and we were often waiting for elevators with people in wheelchairs that were full of either staff or people who could take an escalator. And while I rant, MOST bathrooms DID NOT HAVE CHANGING TABLES. We took him on KIDS DAY. wtf
Edit: this is just to say if was the first time I ever realized how inaccessible NYCC was. Also I understand invisible disability, but blocking out or pushing ahead of wheelchair users or mobility aid users and making them wait ages for the elevator is really not right.
Making the world accessible helps everyone
Yeah I’m disabled and I decided not to go to comic con the last couple years because I was in a wheelchair. Still didn’t go this year, because I know that center doesn’t have enough places for me to take a break and sit, and I know placing my cane with each step was gonna be a problem!
Please don’t use “people who could [walk]” in these examples. Just because you don’t see someone’s disability doesn’t mean they don’t need the accommodation. Thanks!
i was at nycc on Sunday and the amount of staff who took one look at the mobility aid I use and the M on my badge and ignored them was insane. I counted 4 people that entire day who saw the cane and the ADA badge and actually honored it.
KCON is more disability friendly - when the kpop cons are doing better than NYCC something’s wrong.
@@heath6802 I totally get that- I went pregnant last year and my very kind husband lugged around a collapsible chair so I could take breaks
The booth operators figured by calling it a "gladiator fight" they were making it clear that one participant would be maimed or killed
dashcon ball pit walked so twitchcon ball pit could run
The idea of those foam pits makes me feel physically sick. I organise events and how this got through is beyond me.
Also, Adriana didn't even impact in the worst way possible. When you set up an area where people are being pushed, you have to prepare for someone falling on their head/neck. Doing the splits is a fairly safe move that people can learn how to do directly onto a hard floor.
I wonder if this foam pit was more designed like a ball pit, just to roll around. I am curious where they bought the foam pit and how it’s advertised.
thank you for talking about the misgendering btw, obviously it's nowhere near as bad as the foam pit and the accessibility issues but i think it's another sign of how the event only pretended to care about the attendees' wellbeing
I watched attorney Tom's video covering the foam pit at Lenovo's Booth, they would actually be liable under negligent design saying that their booth was designed to be unsafe and so a waiver will not protect the company.
As one of the approximately five people who had a good time at DashCon, you having a good time at TwitchCon is so relatable to me 😂
i cannot comprehend why they didn’t just put thick gymnastic mats under the foam pit, as well as making the pit deeper. They really looked at two feet of foam blocks and thought “yeah that’s good!”
Thank you for bringing up that Covid is still a real concern for people. A close family friend just passed from it and my uncle got discharged from the hospital today and is still having issues. Just because it’s not a concern to you and your family doesn’t mean it’s over for everyone. A lot of people act like it’s a thing of the past.
I've lost two friends in the last 2 years from covid, and my mom is immunocompromised. It sucks how many people just pretend it isn't happening
The virus still exists obviously and is a concern for some people, but the pandemic is a thing of the past.
The medication that I take apparently lowers my immune system and I don't want to take any chances so I wear a mask everywhere, but it sucks that people don't want to wear a mask anymore and pretend like covid is just gone. It sucks
Exactly!
@@TheIrishYoshi no, you’re just wrong. Why say lies? To make yourself feel better?
In addition to the rooms for certain panels being tiny compared to the fan bases, the security at the panels handled it terribly. I didn’t go (thank god) but I was seeing warnings from people who were there that it was turning into a _crowd crush_ , and security was encouraging people to stand and crowd against the walls, which is a TERRIBLE thing to do in that situation
SD resident here. Yea twitch con is garbage SDCC knows how to do the panels twitch con is just a place for the partners to get perks and feel like gods not worth it for non partners
The security is outsourced and twitch con is still tryna find what works so even if the same guards work every year twitch con hasn’t found their pattern like SDCC has
@Viewer it's not their responsibility to save themselves. it's the responsibility of the con.
per the ADA it is illegal for a venue/company to ask you to prove you have a disability
But they can ask what form of accessibility you would need, early entry, wheelchair access, ESA/SA access or use so they can accommodate. They can also “filter out” people that wouldn’t need any form of accessibility and rather just want early entry or mailed badges and no other form of access needed.
Is it great and perfect for every differently abeles person? No, but you can’t rely on people to be honest and not game systems.
No, you can’t ask why but you can ask what they need.
But the badge is to show you need *some* accessibility, and you ask for it beforehand. They didn't check badges at the event, you could just waltz into accessibility lines.
I *am* (visibly) disabled and I don’t think one should have to prove a disability to be accommodated. But yeah, they should check the stickers if that’s the system in place.
Unfortunately being shoved and walked over with a mobility aid is nothing new. It’s very common.
I wasn’t at twitch con but I just had a bad experience at Cincinnati comic con with accessibility
I’m still watching. They misgendered people?! Ew
I feel that as a cane user
TwitchCon gives me anxiety. I've seen way too much vile behavior in chats for me to feel safe in a crowd of Twitch Users. I know there are still a lot of good people but, I'm not willing to take the risk. I'm trans and after all of the abuse we've been dealt on Twitch, I think it would be dumb for me to be in the same room as those people.
The half these people not being disabled thing gripes my cookies. I have an invisible disability that I mostly don't need accommodation for, but it's infuriating when I do and people don't believe me.
I understand this 100% I’m an ambulatory wheelchair user and even my own family sometimes act like I’m exaggerating and depending on the person in my family sometimes straight up start treating me worse when I’m in my wheelchair or rant about how I shouldn’t be using it because it’s just making me lazy etc it’s exhausting and the main reason I moved so far away from them
back injuries are so detrimental too. its something you never really recover from, if not physically, but mentally. they are extremely traumatic on the body and mind so honestly that makes me even more angry and upset.
I truly hope that Adriana and everyone else who was injured get justice and win their lawsuits. Beyond awful.
Another thing I heard is that the bathrooms didn’t have any trash cans of any sort. Meaning if you had to change a tampon or pad there was no place in the restrooms where you throw menstrual products or any other trash away.
🚮
I went to San Diego Comic Con in the same building. All the same mask/vaccination/test requirements and STILL got covid. I think it's a good idea to still have the precautions in place
holt shit this is the first video where I've actually been able to see how shallow that foam pit actually was. insanity
The virgin dashcon ball pit vs the Chad Twitchcon foam pit
Seriously, stop having pits at events! What’s next? A comic con trampoline?
at least dashcon didn't break someone's spine
I mean... A good foam pit does have a trampoline under it.
at the very least, dashcon didn't advertise that you're allowed to jump in the ball pit since they had a bouncy castle for that.
ballpit had zero injuries, possible human piss, and a fake rumor of a child being birthed in it. all good fun.
foampit 2 injuries, a possible lawsuit waiting. terrible mess.
therefore, the chad dashcon ballpit vs the virgin twitchcon foam pit*
I don't know why I ever doubt your ability to be at the perfect place for internet drama
I was waiting for this!!! Can always count on you for an interesting retrospective of an event I only have passing knowledge of or none at all
I follow a lot of streamers so I knew a little bit this time around but your perspective is always really entertaining and informative even if it's something I've never thought about in my life, my brain eats that shit up
Hey I have professional experience with foam pits and foam pit safety in the state of California. I can tell you from everything I’ve seen of the foam pit situation, they literally did everything wrong and it was an absolute safety hazard to anyone who got in the pit in any manner
Also you are correct, the waver does not cover this because from everything that I’ve seen from clips seems to fall under gross negligence
About COVID, I worked NYCC this year and part of my job was to enforce masks and it was a nightmare to get some people to wear their masks. Either people would try to argue that mask weren’t required, when in fact they were, or they would take a mask, put it on while in front of you and take them off. I will say though it wasn’t everyone, and I even had some people come and thank me for my efforts but still .The way Friday and Saturday were completely packed with people, I don’t understand why you wouldn’t have one on..
Ironically, I've had COVID between 1-3 times since the pandemic began and now I can't wear masks for long periods of time walking because I can't breath in enough oxygen to walk and I get headaches almost immediately.
So I basically just... Stay at home lol
Sounds like a nightmare job, man.
@@LunaWitcherArt masks don't change oxygen intake.
I’m real sorry you had to put up with that, I had a feeling that would happen this year so I stayed away for now
I live in Alberta, Canada which is truly doing its best to pretend the pandemic never happened.
I was in the ER over the summer with what turned out to be pneumonia, and got stuck in the waiting room with a group of spoiled college kids in town for Stampede. Pretty much the only places you are required to wear masks here now are medical facilities, but when confronted by the peace officers about why they weren't wearing them, they put on that faux outrage and told the officers they had mental health issues, and they were just there supporting their friend who also had mental health issues, and the officers were putting them into a mental health crisis by asking them about masks. After the officers left, they started giggling to each other about pulling one over the "dumb cops".
Man, I was sitting there with serious difficulty breathing due to pneumonia, there were BABIES there with respiratory issues, and these clowns thought they were so cute and clever putting us all in danger. Especially as they'd obviously been to more than a few random parties recently as well as a super packed huge public event (Stampede). If anything they should have been EXTRA cautious due to that. Using mental health too as an excuse to be a dumpster fire of a human is just infuriating, particularly as I'm pretty certain they were only there because their friend got drunk and hurt himself. They were partying the whole time they were there.
I hate how much it still bothers me, but it's such a good example of the attitudes I've seen around doing the bare minimum to keep others safe and healthy.
I have friends who are immuno-compromised and it's really upsetting hearing how they're still essentially stuck in their houses and living in constant anxiety because everyone has decided it's "normal" time now. I'm so sorry this is still happening, and that people are being this way 😔
Hey Amanda! I love your in-depth dissection of these events. Just thought I'd highlight it's okay to say 'disabled' and we don't need to run-around the word by using terms like 'differently abled'. Just call it for what it is - this world has been designed for able-bodied folks to access all areas and there is a litany of infrastructure (amongst other things) that is not accessible to disabled folks. I think that by not just saying 'disabled' and rather, finding ways to say it without _really_ saying it functions as a means to erase or cover up that fact even if that's not your intent. Again, love your videos and you always bring up great points and I think covering how the accessibility accommodations for this event were exploited + how staff were actively joking about disabilities + attendees with service animals were being harrassed is really important so keep up the good work!
For the accessibility thing it seems to be a grey area. It’s wrong to ask for proof of disability but then it works on the honor code system and as we know a lot of people lack honor.
Also a lot of ambulatory wheelchair users get discriminated against when you start dictating who can or can't use a wheelchair.
Maybe we should just have the default be accessible buildings, which would solve all these problems, but it would prevent able bodied people from feeling superior so that won’t hapoen
@@thesuavechemist Universal design is so important. :/ Helps everyone and yet because it benefits the disenfranchised the most it doesn't get enough resources from the elite who hold them.
@@inkynewt that’s most concise and accurate way I’ve heard the unspoken societal resistance to greater accessibility described… sadly.
Oh god, I didn't really have a good understanding of how shallow that foam pit really was until your clip. I can't believe they got away with that.
The foam ball pit was the worst 😅 Glad your back is intact
I heard someone gave birth in it
Was this uploaded before? I swear I remember this and this exact comment
@@ariaxrose1 only for Patreon preview. I was first comment
As someone who is disabled, and has had the VidCon19 TWICE this year, can confirm, it sucks. We’re still in a pandemic, and unfortunately, until something happens, it’s not going away anytime soon. Love that they did turn around and mandated some safety things (after backlash, but still. They could have just ignored it like the other things going on this year)
It’s wild to me that most people have just… stopped wearing masks. Unendingly frustrating.
@@Feverm00n Same, I could scream in frustration everytime I enter the grocery store. Now it's almost like we're the weird ones for wearing masks to begin with. God, I hate this so much.
@@Feverm00n the pandemic is over. What part of the pandemic is over did you not get the memo.
It’s a miracle more people weren’t seriously hurt in that foam pit. I truly wish Adriana luck with her recovery, and any legal action in the future. 🙏🏽
The pit hungers for blood.
vengeance for the dashcon pit
I just feel so bad for Adriana.
I'm a partnered Twitch streamer and this was my first Twitchcon. I brought along one of my moderators so I wouldn't be alone for the convention and made sure to always have a buddy to avoid a lot of safety issues, but the foam pit was a scary thing. I mostly went to meet my community and didn't do a lot of the Twitch-hosted events but it was a really great time for me. It was lovely meeting you too - my first time meeting anybody from the internet IRL and you as well as everybody else were super kind.
I just want to say that it meant so much to hear you say "covid is still a danger and people should care." when I feel like I'm being gaslit by everyone I know and everyone I don't know when I wear masks everywhere and no one else does. T_T Just that bit of recognition from another human made me feel like I'm not alone in this.
Me and my family continue to wear our masks. My mom is a LVN so she’s making sure everyone is still taking covid seriously because she takes care of immunocomprimised patients.
SAME!! you are not alone ❤❤
@@Sonicsis thank you and your fam for continuing to wear masks ❤
Same. I completely understand. I still wear a mask everywhere I go (which is almost nowhere, just doctors/vets and the occasional grocery store) in Texas, but I usually am the only one I ever see wearing a mask. Makes me scared to leave my house because when I did catch Covid from my mother in law last year, I got really sick. Covid is not a joke. 😢
Exactly. Hell, I still wear masks in areas such as public transportation and airports, and I still wear masks anytime that I am sick.
I was in the PJ Sugar Panel room when Dream was outside and literally were told is was unsafe to leave the room because of the massive crowd outside. After waiting for quite some time we ended up going through the center of convention center’s storage area as a big group to safely exit.
Needless to say it was poor planning. We also encountered loads of uninformed staff on Thursday, trying to get into the partner shop was a shit show of bad signage and uninformed staff.
Additionally I had a shared channel badge with my co-host and the staff didn’t know that it was an option just like the accessibility stickers. I had to explain it frequently.
I was at NYCC last weekend where they had the "mask requirement" that lasted 2/3rds of Thursday then staff and vendors stopped wearing them. Friday they tried to enforce again but by two hours in all the signs said "masks encouraged" instead of "masks required". All of Saturday and Sunday, next to nobody wore them at all.
Good!
@@redneckreviews3016 I didn't have a problem with rule, I respected it and followed until a ton of staff and vendors stopped. That was a sign of inconsistent policy and would have put one back on if asked but they pretty much gave up on enforcing by day and a half in.
The science shows masks and vaccinations don’t prevent transmission. Why are you anti-science?
@@redneckreviews3016 do you… understand what channel you’re watching?
@@froggy5748 yes. And its nice too see people not following that garbage
I was talking about the pronoun thing with a friend… like it was either an outdated request from someone who didn’t know, or staff just didn’t really care. And for LGBTQ creators that have a large LGBTQ fanbase like Aimsey, it’s just not a good look to dismiss that kind of stuff.
As a disabled person who uses mobility aides sometimes but not others, I’m not shocked with any of the ableism or ineptitude. It’s a systemic issue that goes so far beyond twitch. And it’s super normal unfortunately for folks with invisible disabilities to be treated really poorly and like they’re faking it.
I wouldn't even call that a pit, that's a thin layer of foam on the rock hard ground.
I work in a personal injury law office and yes you're correct, a waiver doesn't prevent you from suing someone. You have a reasonable expectation of safety that was violated. Especially in cases where your medical bills are exorbitant. (Disclaimer: I'm not an attorney at my firm, I don't practice law, I'm just part of several legal teams)
Re: accessibility - that’s how they are for SDCC also at the San Diego convention center, actually really great with the accommodations and having seats available and tagged in the rooms, but workers generally knew what was going on and were helpful (other than security who would yell at you for walking too slow or trying to take a break). I think it’s a hippa thing and also a lack of workers who could be knowledgeable to interpret/verify accessibility needs. I have had two hip surgeries so I usually need a cane for walking/standing intensive days like at SDCC and can’t sit on the ground. Most people I met didn’t question if I just bought a cane to get a sticker, and I didn’t see anyone talking about faking to work the system OTHER THAN in the line for Hall H.
As soon as i heard what a disaster this was, i said to myself "ouuu wonder if swell will cover/went to this?🤔"
I’m someone with multiple invisible disabilities and I get nervous using accessibility options because I don’t want people thinking I’m faking. The fact that some people have the audacity to use accessibility options when they don’t need them infuriates me to no end. People are so fucking selfish.
what is it with conventions and ball/foam pits
Been wondering if she is suing since in theory her profession is physical and appearance based so a life altering injury would impede her career aside from the physical injuries.
It will be an interesting lawsuit if that's the case, I have a feeling Twitch might bring up how her Doctor told her before, in regards to her pornography, that she needed to quit it / stop for awhile because her body was breaking and she declined, so Twitch might pull that 'she was already injured' or something, either way the shitty con management and the on site med team needs to be dealt with
I would guess she’s suing to get her medical bills paid. Regular health insurance won’t pay at all if there’s any type of liability involved. They always default to worker’s comp or the property insurance of the place where the injury took place. (Edited to add: I used to do medical billing.)
Twitchcon had the potential, but it backfired. If only it had been planned out more properly, then things wouldn’t have escalated for the worse.
I wrote a whole article on this too! One of my editor's pointed out that California law has made it possible for waivers to be void as well.
As far as accessibility: I'm disabled, I go to conventions. The best ADA options I have experienced are run by ReedPop (Pax West, ECCC) where they often give an extra badge for attendees with rules, bylines, etc. It requires you visiting a special ADA booth at registration/will call, but this does deter people from abusing the system and doesn't require anything special for those who identify as disabled aside from going to pick up the badge.
As stories were rolling out about this, I texted my friend saying that I hoped you would be covering it, so excited to give this a watch to learn more and see your perspective!
As a 28 year old who “looks healthy” but is disabled, I do have to agree that the double edge sword sucks. You shouldn’t have to prove your disabled, because you don’t know why that person who “looks” healthy and young and fine is in the scooter/wheelchair, but then stands up. But, the amount of people who will say they’re disabled to get better accommodations sucks. I will say, it’s nice that as someone who isn’t disabled, you were visibly able to see the disabled/accommodating areas, and that they had a section set up for those who need a sign language interpreter. Having it visible to EVERYONE, and not just hiding it makes it normalize it, and, makes it easier for those of us who need those, and we don’t have to go on a scavenger hunt to find them
I went to TC and had a good time overall but at the same time recognize not everyone else did. I was definitely hearing the same accesibility issues as well. Lol I went to a panel that was talking about how ally's need to listen more and not just be performative. and one of the guys at the end literally stood up like "what do you guys want from me though?" lmao literally after an hour panel of them saying just that. i couldnt stop laughing because it felt so on the nose of "we need allies to listen" to "idk what you guys said but can you just tell me what to do"
didn’t amouranth’s stalker get let in and let get pretty close to her? i thought i saw a video of her talking about how she had to have 24/7 personal security for it beyond the regular security and how much of a pain in the ass it was to get him kicked out
Me: *is a quiet introvert
Also me: 0:57
Omg Edward 🤭😍
A time stamp joke within the first 5 mins of the video being up lol
literally
no bc theres a difference between involved in the chaos and observing the chaos from the sidelines and going "damn, shits wild" and i am fully aware that i love the second
🐍🐍🐍🤢🤢🤢
i saw you there a few times but didnt get the chance to say hi, im disabled and i had my walker with me and i also had the accessible badge so i could get places and i still got so many dirty looks for using the elevators and i ended up dislocating my hip and knee because of how pushy people were in the convention center
I’m really sorry that happened to you 😞
Dashcon ball pit: a baby conceived
Twitchcon foam pit: a baby miscarried
Yes, pandemic is still a thing. My sister in law just lost her father yesterday to Covid. IT IS STILL A THING. Thank you for the acknowledgement.
When are these events going to learn that no waiver will ever cover gross or intentional negligence?
As I see it (not a lawyer), she’d have a case for gross negligence because no sensible would put that little foam directly above concrete and intentional negligence because other people got hurt before, so they knew about it, and did nothing to fix it or stop it.
Right. Like at a trampoline park you sign a waiver saying if you get hurt you will not sue. Yet if the park just put tarps on concrete and you thought it was a trampoline and broke you back that’s gross negligence on the park. Just like at fairs where when you buy the tickets you sign a waiver but if the ride kills you because they did not take care of it then your family can sue. ( not a lawyer but my mom is 🤣 close enough ).
i feel like the amount of streamers with stalkers is reason enough *alone* to go insane with security and to give personal security to much higher popularity streamers like
I'm an attorney in NY/NJ and while waivers can be a powerful tool to protect from liability, they generally do not protect from gross negligence.
Ouch. I hope she heals well. I fractured my tailbone a year ago and it's still a pain. I've heard from others those injuries never really go away.
Some parts were definitely iffy but overall I had a great time at twitch con! Was great meeting you as well!
I can’t believe how long it took them to stop using the pit. That poor woman. I can only hope she makes a full recovery!
Sadly her injuries are pretty extensive I’m not sure how she’s doing now as I’m writing this but the update as of this video was that she has nerve damage in her bladder and had a crushed spine and couldn’t walk or stand or anything
I sprained/injured my tailbone quite badly during childbirth ~5 months ago and that shit HURTS. I can only imagine what that poor woman felt when she landed in that foam pit. 😖
well, hopefully, twitch does the absolute minimum I would expect of a sociopath in the future and closes down booths after the first person who goes to it needs hospitalization. They should watch tv and realize injured people sue all the time.
15:00 I will say to this point, they legally cannot ask people to prove their disability in order to gain accessibility. It goes against ADA compliance and can get them into a ton of trouble if they run around asking people to prove their disabilities. That being said, you are right that it's a double-edged sword because there ARE people who take advantage of these loopholes and use them unnecessarily.
In a REAL foam pit you’re like drowning in foam it’s hard to get out it’s so deep
as someone who does gymnastics and lands tricks into these foampits THOSE PITS ARE DEEP i am 1,60m and i even have a hard time getting out sometimes also because the mat underneat is supersoft so its hard to walk in.
Eesh, I coached gymnastics for 13 years and I've NEVER seen a foam pit less than 7' deep 😳 and even then, the bottom is soft mats...so scary
Thanks for reviewing twitchcon so we don't have to! 🙆♀️
The foam pit is a perfect representation of Twitch. Looks perfectly fine but it's all just surface level.
Thank you for not showing the clip of when she got hurt, I saw it once and then whenever I've seen a video talking about it they keep showing it and I also physically cannot watch it, it makes me so uncomfortable to watch someone go so blindly and happily, with complete faith that it was safe, into a serious injury like that. In general if you know someone has been seriously injured, showing the footage is just an odd choice imo, the footage always makes me physically and mentally uncomfortable. So thank you for not showing it.
if you decide to stream, i could see you playing the more calm games like stardew or animal crossing. the kind of streaming you play when you do homework
I was waiting for your take on this. Thank you for mentioning the ableism and getting why bringing your own wheelchair is not a thing done lightly. I am horrified by that foam pit. When I saw the clip on the PDS I knew she was hurt badly. The good news is liability waivers don't waive neglect when it comes to liability
QTCinderella talked on her stream, that even in the normal Partner Lounge she got swarmed for photos, had to go to the more exclusive(controversial, but needed) Partner Lounge to get away.
Waivers can't cover negligence.
Full Stop.
The improvement of your thumbnails it’s so good! I’m so proud of how much you’re growing as a content creator! ♥️