Thanks so much for watching today my bros! Yes I know the Power Sword placement is a hot take, but it comes down ultimately to my play style and what I enjoy! And right now... I'M ALL ABOUT FISTING! Tier List ► imgur.com/a/zHsKtF4 Purchase the Game w/ Discount Here ► www.fanatical.com/en/game/warhammer-40000-space-marine-2-ultra-edition?ref=italianspartacus Find my Beginner Tips Here ► ua-cam.com/video/VCAYM4hkJvU/v-deo.html Warhammer 40k Lore ► ua-cam.com/video/TADLN7ceUbg/v-deo.html Follow me on Twitch! ► www.twitch.tv/italianspartacus Become Part of the Community ► discord.gg/tCnpBPJqRu
power sword feels very slow compared to the fencing relic chainsword, but at the same time it makes the silly steel pipe falliing sound on executions which makes it 500% worth it imo
Gotta disagree with the grenade launcher bolt rifle. With emperor's vengeance you can get back all your grenades every 30 seconds. Maxed out with perks you get 11 grenades
Yeah, I've never run out of grenades in a pinch. I guess it could be a problem if you are using it exclusively for grenades, but that's not the intent of the weapon. The ability to thin out any horde on demand, or melt Terminis enemies with auspex and grenades, make it S-tier for me.
That, it has a perk that you can get the ammo back when at low health, and the ammo boxes. You rarely have no grenades and if you do everything is just deleted
Agreed, i have like 2 purple data left, but have over 20 gold because i only play on hardest difficulty so eventually i will need to play easier difficulty just to level some guns up
I'm glad we can't. Twinking a weapon to relic doesn't teach you anything about how the weapon plays and what it's strengths and weaknesses are and would lead to people saying it sucks or is OP with next to no experience with the weapon
@@Acebaur1 he means when you need to use green data to level it up not skip, when all u play is ruthless u eventually run out of green and purple datas and need to play on lower difficulties just to level a gun up once
@@scottbroxirfcyou don’t need to play lower difficulty. Hover over the levelling part and it will ask if you want to spend the relic data in place of a lower data to level said weapon
I feel like the Stalker bolt rifle is being undersold here. The relic damage version will make warriors executable in 5 headshots, which isnt hard to do. The ammo on this thing is great too, because it can refund shots after a reload equal to 50% of the enemies you hit with it which, combined with the extra penetration perk, lets me regain large chunks of the ammo i just used. It also destroys zoanthropes and neurothropes very quickly.
If we ignore the Bolt Rifle (due to it being obviously imbalanced right now), then the Stalker is equal best weapon for Tac alongside the Plasma - it all comes down to how consistently you can headshot. You need to be hitting >70% headshots for it to out damage the Plasma, which does make me prefer the Plas, but for a really accurate player the Stalker is going to end up doing more damage. Being the highest potential damage for Tac (outside of the imbalance BR), I feel like that should land it in A tier.
As a Heavy Bolt Rifle user, it is low B at the very highest. It takes way too many headshots to incap a Warrior/Rubric even fully leveled and with all of the damage increase perks. It is pretty good at crowd control though. I have went through 3/4 of a 52 round magazine sometimes on one Majoris on Ruthless. It needs a small damage buff IMO. It just doesn’t hit hard enough. This is coming from someone that uses it extensively. If push comes to shove I’m picking the GL Bolt Rifle any day. Even without the GL it would be better.
Yeah, not only did I level it to max exp in relic (so I've also experienced the relic version), but I keep the datamined info spreadsheets open all the time so I can double check this stuff. It's servicable at relic in ruthless - but every weapon is at least servicable. It legit has equivalent dps to the Bolt PISTOL. That is not what you want in a primary.
You don't need to stance dance for Power Sword, all you need is power whirl. It deals more damage than chain sword ground stomp and can be activated off any light attack. Staggers/breaks guard on both hits, clears space around you, deals good damage, and knocks back for gunstrikes. Also, you can do a 2 light attack > ground stomp (or 1 light > shoulder bash) on chain sword by speccing into full throttle, and holding the first attack for a split second. You immediately start the combo with the second light attack. You don't get the second ground stomp, but I find the increased activation speed to be massively more useful.
I know but that's what I'm saying. I use exclusively power stance. And it feels like the devs wants stance dancing so it feels like I'm only ever using half of the weapon. It's not bad at all, I just don't like using it
@@italianspartacus I use power stance on all minoris and the amount of gun strikes it provides is amazing. I got top gun damage by a massive percent on my bulwark in a run lately only using my plasma pistol for gun strikes and scout interruptions. I used to struggle with stance switching smoothly too but using the Dash+Heavy made it switch a lot easier and I usually dash in to engage Majoris+ enemies so the flow was natural once I figured it out
@@Buffalo9975 i only use power stance, and use pwoer rake for majoris enemies with the + 50% dmg it works fine for me , and occasionly swap to speed if theres a lot of rubrics.
@avlaenamnell6994 This is the way. A light, heavy, heavy combo with the power rake damage perk is incredible for single target. The fact that you can use it from power stance means you never have to change. And if for some reason you do, just neutral dodge into a charged attack to switch stances as you power stance light will clear space. I do agree that it has the highest learning curve for melee in the game, which is the only thing holding it back. Thunder Hammer also has a large learning curve as you need to use the correct combos with the right perks to optimize your damage output (double slam, or stage 1 charged attack with the 3rd spin perk).
GL Bolt Rifle on my Tactical trivializes the entire game. The only time I ever run out of grenades is when I decide to check how quickly I can solo a boss.
Been running the heavy plasma incenerator and plasma pistol. Feels so sweet. Did want to point out though that while the heavy bolt pistol is pretty cool all by itself, pairing it with all the gunstrike stuff and pistol damage makes it a MONSTER of a weapon.
Bolt rifle with grenade launcher is S+++ tier btw, also you can fill grenades every 30 seconds, basically enabling you to only shoot grenades full time. No ammo boxes or anything needed. It's c razy how you're putting meltas above grenade launcher.. With a heavy in a team you can have up to 15 grenades lol. So 1 grenate per 2 seconds. It's highest dps in the game with basically free ammo, and it's WILDLY IMBALANCED. They could remove the whole bolter thing from this werapon and it would still be SSSSSS++++++ tier lol.
sorry you gotta give the stalker another go man, it is ridiculously good when you finally get it to relic. even on ruthless you can put tyranid warriors in an execution state in just a couple of shots, ammo issues are 100% rectified when you get Reload Restoration, especially with the penetrating rounds perk. tyranid warrior far away? pop a couple of shots into its head and kill it. swarm approaching you? decimate it by simply shooting into it. just parried a tyranid warrior? if auspexed, enjoy deleting it near instantly with like 2 headshots. it sounds good, it feels good, it is my favourite bolt gun in the game by far.
Some of the other bolters should get Kraken/Dragonfire/Hellfire so you can further specialize. I haven't used them enough to say which should have which, just hit 25 on Tac yesterday.
I’ll have to disagree with quite a few placements here. Speaking strictly on relic level. The foremost is the Bolt Rifle, or indeed the Grenade Launcher. It is arguably *the strongest* weapon in the game. The new patch didn’t just nerf its ammo acquisition, it buffed the grenades’ ROF. Until Emperor’s Vengeance no longer works with it, it’s going to be an apex weapon. It at least deserved an S no matter what your reservations are. The Heavy Bolter in the same tier as the Heavy Bolt Rifle is… a humorous choice. Heavy Bolter is perhaps on the weaker side of the Heavy weapons but it is still leagues stronger than the HBR and enough to secure a spot in the S tier. The HBR’s damage output is simply mathematically subpar with bad per shot damage and bad headshot multipliers. Even though it does get very good accuracy and tight spread especially when you zoom in the ADS, accuracy cannot salvage its bad numbers. On that note though, the Stalker is actually deserving of that tier A spot. It has the same laser accuracy and magnet headshot feel, except it does actual damage because it has a way higher base damage and additional headshot multiplier. Its ammo capacity is surprisingly enduring with the ammo refund perk. I strongly recommend giving this weapon a fair shot especially on the sniper with the recoil reduction perk. It was a pleasant surprise to me how great and consistent it was. Regarding melee weapons, I don’t think many assault mains would stand for Power Fist coming before the Hammer, not Bulwark mains for it being higher than Power Sword. I understand it’s a preference; Power Fist is honestly my least favourite melee weapon because it has neither the dueling power of Knife or Power Sword nor the charged damage of the Hammer, nor the overall versatility of the Chain Sword.
Appreciate these takes my bro! It's just the limitation of a tier list like this. I should have done S+ to help break the tension between A and S. I was filming this on stream and I was saying a lot of what you said.. It feels bad to have some guns in A that are better than others but not better than meltas or plasma. It was a big struggle
I'd place it in F tier because it trivializes the game and thus makes it a boring snoozefest of evaporating enemies with zero effort required. At least meltas need to think about ammo and such. Heavy bolt rifle is an amazing weapon. If you can aim at head level it will clear hordes as fast or faster than the heavy bolter. It has good enough damage to be worth shooting majors with and with a parry scan/auspex scan it will take them to poundtown. As for the why it's because it can 1hk termagants to the head, has 4 pierce and 2 pierce perks to be used. It feels so good to shoot down hordes with, can't stress this enough. God I love the headshot sound.
Yeah - the Bolt Rifle is the only overpowered weapon in the game right now, due to a combination of how much damage the grenades do to terminus enemies, in conjunction with the fact you get a free refill every ~30 secs. I'm confident they'll rebalance it next patch. I suspect, at the very least, the nades will do less damage to terminus enemies, and you won't get an entire refill for killing a majoris (likely ~3 grenades, give or take).
@@italianspartacusgrenade launcher is by far the strongest weapon in entire game - not heavy plasma nor melta doesn’t have this combination of aoe, dmg, stagger, range and infinite ammo
Funny, the power fist took 1/3 of the hive tyrants health with just one charged up strike. No other melee weapons did that. And this is coming from a guy who loves the power sword
Interesting, I find the speed stance much better on the power sword than the AOE stance. With how parrying works with minoris now, I just want to focus majoris enemies and use the minoris as armour fodder.
I would say it’s A tier - very strong weapon, but not stupidly overpowered like S tier weapons. Not to mention grenade launcher which can let you solo any mission with your eyes closed
@@leonidemelin1131 fair but you can only get grenades from the ammo boxes and from the load out drop and the only reason I say S tier mainly for doing great at picking off majoris calling in reinforcements and bosses
The Grenade launcher bolter should be in a tier of its own. That thing is still super OP, I regularly have double or triple the damage of my teammates in ruthless. Until they nerf the ammo refill perk on tactical there’s no gun that’s even close in my opinion
Been watching since the early BG3 videos and your upfronting the information, as I'm sure you've heard from other viewers, is a huge level of respect to your fans and has led to me watch the full videos out of respect for your time in making them. Like you said at the end, I'll still be using whatever I find fun even if makes the game harder, but the information and your explanations/arguments were solid as always. All that to say, loved the video and I hope to continue to watch you pump out content and grow. Much love from the US o/
I've stopped using the Chain sword on my Assault and Bulwark, it's straight up easy mode when you use the chainsword, the combos are so good. Thunderhammer and Power Sword are my go too, fencing for both. The power sword you need to learn to not touch the directional buttons or it'll mess your combo up. Thunderhammer you need to get used to its speed and doing ground slams/aftershocks, they do so much damage. The cool thing is when it comes to melee weapons, it's all based on Your own playstyle, not what others say. Play how you want, most of all the weapons are viable for Ruthless, just make sure to grind out your Relic weapons for full power.
Small correction, the Las Fusil does not give you a charge back per kill, it's more then 1 enemy kill from 1 shot. So you need to fire into an on coming horde to get 2 or more kills per shot, to keep getting your ammo back.
I completely agree on the fist. I think it's in a pretty good spot now, but i think it needs a buff on that heavy ground pound attack. It still has no range
If you’re using instigator on vanguard, chainsword becomes much more important for dealing with minoris waves. Combat knife feels awesome with melta. The animation lock on some attacks is bad though. I just try to avoid doing the big spinning attack because that’s the worst culprit. The shorter heavy attacks aren’t so bad. The chainsword combos are just way easier to pull off.
You didn't power whirl enough. It clears weaker stuff, staggers stronger stuff, displaces you as well. In the time you execute a power whirl, you're still probably charging your 2nd power fist attack for much less overall effect.
I do - I exclusively use power whirl, but I prefer the fist's speed and mobility. You don't charge up every single attack on it, and when you do charge, it's a quick charge n release - you don't hold it :)
@@italianspartacus yup i am referring to a perfectly-charged power fist attack (very quick); even then, it is slower and inferior to a simple power whirl. i think most players never even once considered that "stance dancing" was the way the devs intended the power sword to be used. light stance for single targets, heavy stance for multiple targets. this is the first i'm hearing of "stance dancing". and the gap closer for the power sword is not that much different from the power fist, especially in light stance. the power fist desperately needs buffs. increased aoe range and faster charging might help. anyway, all in all cool video. :) your space marine content 2 is great in general
I’ve spent hours leveling the bolt rifle, the perk ensures you always have full grenades. Not getting them from ammo caches doesn’t even matter. I’m never out of them and I’m constantly using them.
Bolt rifle can go both in A and in S, the reason is the one you supplied. Skill, a skilled player will prefer it's versatility to the Melta range, accuracy and ability to deal with crowds. It is my favorite weapon on the Tactical. The heavy Bolter on the hand is my favorite weapon on the Heavy, I have both it and the multy melta at relic. The multy melta is awesome, but I prefer the versatility of the heavy Bolter and will always choose it over the melta, all I need to do now is start working on heavy plasma incinerator
I felt the opposite about the Heavy Bolter and Power Fist. The HB has felt good the entire time and I'm still just at artificer level, while the Power Fist felt sluggish until I got it to Relic for the faster Fencing version.
@14:55 You don't need to be in Melee to proc the ammo return, you just have to kill a Majors. A Gunstrike, standard ranged kill with the bolt rifle (none-GL) will proc the perk. You can also cheese it if you know a Grenade will kill a majoris by swapping to standard firing with the grenade mid air.
I just found your channel and I appreciate the honest takes. It's why I now play powerfist when I originally wrote it off. The game is really close to being great, but it needs work. Last night my buddy and I played probably 8 OPs between us, and there were several times you just get screwed. We'd run into scenarios where you seemingly just get chain staggered, or you go to shoot someone calling for help and there's a gun strike on the screen so the game does that instead, or some of the executions taking so long we no longer want to do them for fear of a Majoris on ruthless calling for help. And the dodge mechanic is jank as eff. Otherwise, solid game so far.
I think power sword should be A-Tier, considering both the skill floor and skill ceiling it has. If you are exclusively using one stance (power or speed, as you have said you do and I am sure others do as well, I did in the past), the power sword will feel like a middling B-tier if not even a C-tier. Doing that would be like using a Heavy Bolter without using heavy stance, or plasma weapons without charged shots, which is going to make it feel like it is missing a lot. Once you have learned how the power sword can be used most effectively and actually play it that way, it is easily S-tier. The thing with the power sword is that it requires significantly more patience (stance switching), timing (power whirl/power rake), and skill (knowing how to get the most out of it) than basically any other melee weapon in the game. If you try to constantly hold WASD, button mash, and be hyper-aggressive in combat it feels like slightly underwhelming weapons. If you learn to be patient, methodical, stance-switch effectively, parry/block/shieldbash effectively, and just generally fully utilize the weapon, you feel like a God-Emperor amongst men and it's incredibly satisfying. And every time you stance-switch you feel like Henry Cavill reloading his arms. All of that being said, I would still say A-tier because of just how much learning you have to do. I learned all of this myself the hard way, but it feels well worth it. I would love to see a champion class with a relic blade or two with similar learning curves in the future.
Thank you, finally.... thank you so much! Finally I've seen a tier-list I fully and objectively agree with after 300h in game :D Maybe some bolters can be here and there, idc, as long as I finally see a brother who is on one page with me in terms of ranking power fist vs power sword. Same thing, I love power swords, I thought that power fist probably would be the weapon I'll hate to play the most while grinding the game, but after I tried using it during first days after launch (even though I have all weapons maxed rn), I won't go back to any sword... and I definitely changed my mind towards power fist look and feel in general. Thank you and... thank you :D
Some feedback to the tier list I think you could have gone deeper into specifics with each weapon, as opposed to general knowledge. For instance when you talked about the Melta and how it could create bad habits, you might talk a little about what those bad habits are. A sign of a good tier list is a list that providers the viewer with a more in-depth knowledge of the items being ranked, as opposed to simply their hierarchical order. I'd also recommend being more specific with the kind of criteria that you use for judging the weapons.
Absolutely agree across the board. This was sort of off the cusp during a stream. I usually structure these by having a section that establishes assumptions or reaffirms that most weapons come down to skill. And more imperial evidence/side by sides would have probably been more helpful
The combat knife is super powerful because you can easily duel any majoris and extremis, and the shoulder charge is an easy move to spam to get gunstrikes on minoris, keeping your armor up.
Hey. I love power fist and I like it more than power sword because it looks cooler. But the things you say why you like power fist and why you dislike power sword is because you're using power stance while you prefer the light stance playstyle without realizing it. The jump attack from light stance is the same animation type from cannon punch and gives the same mobility and the animations are a lot faster and actually easier to dodge and parry than the power fist. You will loose cleave, but you will have more focused damage downing majoris faster with a better armor upkeep. It's the trade. Try your power fist play style with power sword light stance and I think you'll give a lot more credibility to the power sword. Try this and I think you will enjoy it: Use jump attack > light > light (all lights that has the thrust animation) and then 2 rakes. Only change to power stance when majoris are down and there's only minoris left in the pack you're engaging, because of the better cleave. Or don't. I don't. I'm lazy and I don't like changing stances and a pack of minoris is just meh, whatever.. PS: With cannon punch you will get a lot of free gun strikes to farm armor while with the sword light stance is not that easy, but I think changing perk for the improved shield bash (Focused Strength) makes it a lot easier and faster. You might want try the light stance with this perk. This will also make it better to stand your ground tanking packs protecting your ranged fellow without loosing aggro and allowing them to dispatch more heavy damage without losing time dodging, while jumping around makes you loose a lot of aggro.
I disagree with ya on the melee weps. I’d definitely put hammer in S tier and sword in A. Good video though, I feel like a lot of this game is subjective af when it comes to what you like to use which is a very good thing. My fav class is Assault for example but I know it’s the worst overall mechanically but man that hammer and heavy bolt pistol feel soo good lmao
Its sabers fault, tbh theirs no reason for it to be designed so horribly, I still cant grasp the reasoning behind making assault jump pack take 25 seconds to recharge, the weapon perks too are just bad in general, they clearly lacked quality control on this its just sad.
I love the power sword it’s not really about stance dancing for me. If I see a large horde I’ll swap to power stance and clear out the minoris enemies with some power whirls in there and get some hits on the majoris enemies. Once the minoris threat is either neutralized or cut down substantially, I’ll swap to the speed stance and engage the Majoris enemies.
Most people rate the heavy bolt rifle very low, which made me sad when I first got the game, because the idea of the weapon is very appealing. Seeing you give it a high rating is interesting to me, and I'll give it a whirl. I just got the game like three days ago, and the tactical is my first class that I'm really trying to level. your guides and videos have been very helpful as I have made my way through the game. Thank you
It took me awhile with the power fist, but I wanted it for my space wolf bulwark build. I hated it at first, but after getting comfortable with it, I absolutely love it! The ground pound/shake absolutely needs some work tho, but otherwise I love it
And this is why balance is so important in games. It's really just the chainsword and melta. Then there's everything else. Sure, it doesn't mean that weapons are not viable. But these two thing clearly are a step ahead of everything else. Also why the heavy bolt pistol and other heavy weapons are so limited to one class, is a clear miss by the devs. Which once again, brings everyone back to the melta and chainsword.
The Noobtube Bolt Rifle is godtier and there is no other weapon that comes even close to it. Every 30 sec who get all your nades back and since the "nerf" patch they buffed it in the same patch, they removed the shot delay after each shot. Before you could shoot one every 1+ sec. now you can spam them. 2 nades every thing is in execution range... nades don't damage you either, oh I'm surrounded no problem aim at the ground and boom boom boom everything is dead. It's like this build but faster, more dmg and no need to charge anything.
Power sword is actually pretty easy. Use the relic fencing sword. You can switch stances mid combo but that doesn’t even matter. The very basics is have it on speed for majoris enemies and cleave for minoris enemies or a mixture of both, throw a couple attacks out, hold off on an attack for a second and do power whirl, clears every enemy around you. Parry for insane aoe dmg. It’s literally the best melee in the game hands down.
To your point on the power sword, it’s my favourite weapon in the game but I still agree that it needs a more fluid method of changing stance. I like using the dodge attack method for stance changes - it makes it feel like a dance - but when it locks onto the wrong enemy and I end up using a speed stance attack on a termagant instead of a Tyranid warrior because in the time it took for me to dodge attack is irritating.
On table top the power fist is so iconic. I've always loved them, However I am a IG player and it's rare I equip any sergeant with one Except when I field Yarrick.
Fast firing bolt weapons are crowd clear. You take the bolt pierced multiple enemies talents and perks pop auspex and you can clear all gaunts and trash instantly
Didn't try the bolt rifle grenade launcher pre-patch but loving it post patch. Its a good 'oh shit' weapon to almost instantly get you team out of a terrible situation, and also fun from a gameplay/roleplaying perspective too. And its good against both nids and chaos
unironically, The auto bolt rifle is pretty bad in PvP too. However, all the carbines are great in PvP. The power fist is utterly busted due to netcode not allowing you to dodge.
This is NOT tabletop when it comes to melee. The powerfist was anti champoin or light vehicle. Powerhammer was anti tank or deamon prince level. Power sword was anti trooper.
I always play in melee in any game, so as a dedicated melee player my tier list of those would be: S: Power sword (for me it's the most universal and convenient weapon to use in the whole game and with it on bulwark I deal more damage then with hammer on assault and I can't even remember when I died last time on bulwark with any weapon) A: Hammer (it's a great and fun wespon with huge damage and AOE, but holy Emperor, upgrading it was atrotious, using a fencing variant before relic is shooting yourself in a leg because those variants have insanely bad stats...ZERO speed on purple one, bro!!!) B: Power fist (overall this is a really good weapon, it deals big damage, it annihilates elites, combos are fluid, it can do adclear and single target damage alike...so why B? It's outclassed on both bulwark and assault. On bulwark power sword can do much more damage and be more flexible and on assault hammer does literally the same things but better and stronger); Chain sword (it's convenient and reliable weapon, but it lacks in damage department significantly...it takes 7-10 seconds in general to kill one elite while all previous weapons do it twice quicker. Those stomps just throw everyone back and all of them just get up and continue to fight, it's just not cool) C: Combat knife (it's a defensive weapon. In actual combat it's close to useless, I deals so little damage that even if you take a +100% damage from invis on sniper and perform charged attack, you still will do laughable amount of damage. As a defencive tool to just parry and counter with crit shots it's very good, but I would never recommend to actually fight with it) And final remark: every weapon is equally good at parry, all balance and fencing variants have the same amount of parry frames.
Bolt sniper is D tier! I suffered and cried, and Cried and Suffered.. I tried my hardest to love the gun because I'm a underdog enthusiasts but got dam 😂
Great video. Love assault so much it’s the only class I’ve reach max rank with playing 100+ hours lol the buffs helped a lot but the armor you get back from blocking seems a bit overkill now.
Huh. Interesting. A chunk of this I can see, but some I disagree with You seem to really dislike the DMR style guns, the Stalker and the Carbine in the marksman pattern. I can't speak for the latter as I haven't fully levelled it yet but the Stalker does a lot of work for me. If you discount the grenade launcher bolt rifle - which we'll get to in a minute - it's 2nd or 3rd best pick for Tactical along with the Plasma Incinerator and the Melta. Between Reloaded Restoration and the Tacticals ammo back perk you have a excellent tool for removing precision targets at range with a very generous ammo pool. And while it's got worse interactions with the Sniper's perks that the Bolt Sniper I still think it's overall utility means it's the better weapon for them if for some reason you're not going Fusil. Maybe it's a m+k vs controller thing? Because you've also put the Heavy Bolt Rifle in A tier which really surprised me. I've consistently found it pretty weak sauce and not really worth the investment. It's not Occulus or Auto Bolt Rifle levels of bad, but it's really underwhelming. And the Bolt Rifle with Grenade Launcher needs to be S tier. It just does. Even with the nerf you can still get 10+ grenades every 30 seconds. It arguably needs an S+ all for itself right now. I'd also swap Power Fist and Power Sword around personally, but everyone's going to have different tastes and I want to give the Fist another try as I may have judged it too quickly. Still, from my experience it feels also as slow and clunky as the Thunder Hammer with none of the crowd control or the umph. I wouldnt certainty mind if Powersword got a pass on its damage in speed stance, but it's crowd control utility is outstanding.
It's pretty easy to stance dance with the Power Sword by dodging and quickly holding down the melee to execute a heavy. Now you do the dash attack and switch stances at the same time, and since it's a dash attack it can stagger minoris and majoris enemies. So now you can easily get the fantasy of stance switching. Very fun to do deal with big enemies by thrusting into Speed Stance and then spinning into Power Stance to deal with hordes. As someone who prefers the Power Fist animations, it simply does not keep up. The fantasy of using megaton punch power waves doesn't hold up. I use it on Bulwark because it actually has perks like the parry AoE damage to make up for its shortcomings. The supposedly radial Power Smash does NO area damage at all, and I simply cannot feel the AoE from its thrusts and backfists. At least when the game tells me that the Power Stance and Power Whirl are for AoE... Yeah, I get it, it does the job!
Heavy Bolt Rifle is S tier. It's the closest you get to the heavy bolter while also being able to use the chain sword. Combined with the tactical ability the damage you can get out of it is very high. Much Higher than the heavy bolter per bullet.
Stalker is amazing A tier my opinion. Does so much damage to bosses, works perfect for Tac shoot till they come to use the unload with chainsword. Happe s 90 percent of time anyways. Plus being able to get the ranged majoris pinged down is super handy.
My take on bulwark melee is that the parry perks outclass the melee damage. I rather parry and gun strike and negate damage outright rather than committing to the weapons combos that leave you open. I can stand in the middle of a crowd and parry 1 minor and the damage wave will kill 4-5 and chip majors but power fist has to charge to do the same and sword will lock you in its animation to only hit 1 target or spread them with heavy swing. Not to mention chain sword is more efficient at single target, and you still have the parry wave perks for crowd control.
Block is good on the power Hammer if you know your dodge timings, especially if you have unlimited jet pack perfect dodges that give you a 25% attack boost
Agree with this ranking. I feel the same thing about power sword/power fist. Sadly hammer lack of damage. I would put Hammer in B and Knife on A espacially for sniper and high single target potential
If I had to change anything, the grenade launcher would be in SSS tier. The powerfist in the C tier. Good job putting the chainsword where it is. It really is the best melee weapon in the game. The sword and the hammer are cool, but they are lacking in damage for what they are and how slow they are.
Most approachable doesn't mean best. That would be like saying an automatic transmission is the best because everyone can easily use it. And yet, how many professional drivers use an automatic transmission?
The way I look at it, the HBR is what the ABR should be, the ABR is what the standard and Occulus Carbines should be, and the Carbines are basically Autoguns. I also love the new Heavy Plasma, but it needs a rework to the charge SFX after taking the charge speed upgrade, and either rework the projectile drop or the sights. Power Fist feels much better, but either they need to increase the heavy attack radius, or rework its perks into either single target or crowd play styles. Personally, I don’t like the TH’s Aftershock perk. I’d just have it increase the AoE, or even one that makes your light attacks deal increased stagger. All together, I would like to see more perk reworks before Saber decides to adjust pure weapon stats. Maybe the Bolt weapons would be deserving of raw stat changes, but I’d rather see a lot of perks reworked or replaced.
Your issues with the Stalker are my issues with the Bolt Sniper so i use Stalker instead bc of it lol. Granted i am only on Artificer level with my weapons so far
Why do you say "...kill a majoris in melee every 30 seconds..."? Has it not always been that you just need to get a kill on a majoris-level enemy in any way and not specifically melee? Also, I would love to see an updated tier-list of the weapons, great video!
Haven’t worked on the power sword yet, but I think going by your setup that it has to be good at all rarities, the power fist should be b tier . I leveled it up on assault, and I hated it up until relic tier when it sped up: it always just felt too slow. I would say thunder hammer is s tier
I think if they properly balance the pistols and melee weapons, every class should have access to every pistol and melee weapon except for probably the thunderhammer and maybe the power fist
I do slightly disagree on the bolt sniper rifle. I think the benefit of point and click instead of having to line up a charge shot is a pretty big deal, and *might* push it to A tier IMO.
Alright, so my credentials: 325 hours played (almost entirely in operations), was soloing ruthless pre-patch, currently often do stimless ruthless runs, and have levelled every weap to max exp (so not just to relic, but also to 100%/100% exp. My thoughts: Edit: this comes up in my explanations - in my own S through D tier ranking system, I typically only rank imbalanced/overpowered weapons at S tier. *Auto Bolt Rifle: agreed. Pretty accurate, especially from hipfire, but that doesn't make up for the wet-pool-noodle damage. *Meltas: B tier IMO. They're anti-minoris weapons, but now that minoris give armour on parry they're a much, much lower threat priority than majoris. Heavy is better served with Plasma for that purpose; Tac is better served with GL (or Plasma/Stalker once the GL gets nerfed), Vanguard is better served with Instigator. Sure, you can use them to deal with minoris swarms if you have little-to-no-skill, but they're serving as a crutch in that case; a stand in for good melee play. Though I will say I think it's a fine choice for Vanguard; I prefer Instigator but Melta does suit their short range playstyle. *Occulus: agreed. Good fire rate and accuracy don't make up for the low damage. *Plasma Incinerator: agreed. Outside of the one overpowered weapon in the game right now (Bolt Rifle), it's equal best for Tac alongside the Stalker. Which one is better depends on headshot rate. I prefer the Plasma as the bigger, more daunting majoris groups can be difficult to ensure >60% headshots on, especially when you're dodging between shots, and the Plasma does also have a small AoE if you need to turn it on minoris. *Stalker Bolt Rifle: A tier for Tac, C tier for Sniper. Sniper wants Las Fusil for the biggest stealth-breaking damage possible, but on Tac Stalker is the highest damage (from a non-OP weapon) if you can get a high enough headshot rate. I'd say that warrants an A tier as a good player is going to realise the potential of the weapon. If we consider the average player it might be a B tier on Tac. *Bolt Pistol: I'd put it in C tier, purely because I don't think any of the sidearms should be S tier, but there's a clear hierarchy between the three, with Bolt Pistol being the worst of the three. It's not bad, and I'd definitely use it over some of the worse primaries when levelling - though at relic every primary was better than it IMO. It's also a reason to differentiate the tier lists into their own weapon slots. C tier pistol =/= C tier primary =/= C tier melee. *Heavy Bolt Pistol: agreed, but in my secondary only ranking as mentioned with the Bolt Pistol. So it should be a tier above the Bolt Pistol. *Plasma Pistol: agreed. I leant on it heavily when levelling some weaps on Bulwark and Heavy. Charged shot damage is comparable to some relic level primaries. *Carbine: D tier, for the same reason as the Auto Bolt and Occulus. Devs put too much stock into non-damage factors (in this case fire rate), which doesn't make up for damage that's just too low. *BOLT RIFLE: ABSOLUTE S TIER. It's the only S tier weapon right now, because it's the only overpowered weapon right now. Grenades do too much damage in general, but especially to terminus level enemies (particularly when it's on the class with Auspex). So they will almost surely nerf the damage they do to terminus at least, soon. Even then, getting a full ~11+ (depending on weapon perks) grenades back every ~30 seconds is also ridiculous. I've had mild disagreements with some of the tier choices but Bolt Rifle is absolutely, ABSOLUTELY S tier. You also don't have to kill the majoris in melee. It's a very low skill weapon right now. I will die on this hill. *Bolt Sniper: agreed. *Heavy Bolt Rifle: D tier. Like the Occulus, like the Auto Bolt Rifle, like the Carbine, it has comparable dps to the BOLT PISTOL. That is not what you want from a primary, even if it's accurate against minoris or w/e factor the devs decided was worth all that damage loss. *Heavy Bolter: I'd put it B tier personally, but I think A is a fine assessment. *Heavy Plasma: I'd say A tier, but I tend to reserve S tier in this sort of thing for "is so powerful it likely needs to be rebalanced" - which is why I only have the Bolt Rifle there. Heavy Plasma is easily the best Heavy weapon IMO, because of how easily it deals with the actual threat in ops, majoris+ enemies. *Instigator: agreed. Vanguard is kind of lacking in "really good" majoris killing primaries, but Instigator is the best of that bunch. *Fusil: A tier for me, for the same reason as I mentioned before (that I only put imbalanced stuff in S tier for my ratings). Definite best weapon on Sniper and fantastic weapon overall. *Combat Knife: agreed. I did like it most out of all melee at first due to the attack speed, but as you get more and more comfortable with melee and stuff like parry cancelling and stagger combos, the Combat Knife just had no combo that I was happy with when using it. *Power Sword: agree, and this one makes me sad as I want to like it more, and did initially use it at first. While it has a better combo than the Combat Knife, it's ultimately just too clunky - I prefer the Chainsword double stomp for dealing with minoris, over Power Sword's Power Mode, and my Chainsword preferred single target combo (light attack => kick, repeat) flows better too. *Power Fist: I'd put it at B tier too. A lot of these melee ones are going to come down to preference and what you're comfortable with; melee is the most balanced aspect of the game in that all weapons are viable. That said, I found that the Power Fist combos were just too slow for the extra damage they dealt, and in terms of minoris clear it just doesn't stand up to the Chainsword or Thunder Hammer. *Thunder Hammer: agreed. I used to dislike it due to how slow all its attacks were, but once I became savvy to parry cancelling it's probably my favourite melee weapon of all. *Chainsword: I'd put it at A tier - again, because in my ratings I only put overpowered/imbalanced stuff at S tier. It's fantastic, to the point where I swapped to it on Vanguard, and was even using it on Assault until I became adept at parry cancelling. Great single target combos, great minoris clear - exactly what you want on a weapon.
100% you nailed it. Two 25 classes so far are Assault (favorite) and Tactical, so I don’t have the full picture yet, but this has been my experience as well. Getting better at melee made me prefer the stalker to the melta on Tac, especially once I got the ammo perks and realized how the grenade Bolter is too OP to be fun. Haven’t spent enough time on the Bulwark to max out the sword, but hated the fist from the little time I used it on Assault.
@@philc2257dumb quick question, how are you guys checking Time Played on game? I play on console so idk if it’s just a pc/stream thing - also thank you for all the in depth info on the weapons with personal experience. I appreciate it all greatly.
Ill never understand why people hate on the Heavy Bolt Rifle. Its one of the better weapons on the Tactical. High Reserve capacity, High Magazine capacity, Just High everything. Ophelian Liberation-Beta is the best version of it. with perks you get like 5 or 6 penetration, you pretty much have a Heavy Bolter for the Tactical, It makes Minoris swarms a non issue. Even when paired against a Melta user you will clear waves faster because you obviously have superior range. Its a very easy A tier of a weapon even when compared to Meltas which a very niche.
I did lvl heavy melta first and it actually helped me to get the hang of the game more since when I started to lvl the other two ”harder” weapons as a heavy I managed it all fine.
I love Melt + Combat Knife on my Vanguard. Hook in ->Melta away the minoris -> Duel majoris with knife. Pure bliss. But that's because I just like to melee stuff, Melta is just there to clear the way. Also, as a fellow tabletop enjoyer I agree: fuck a big fist.
Thanks so much for watching today my bros! Yes I know the Power Sword placement is a hot take, but it comes down ultimately to my play style and what I enjoy! And right now... I'M ALL ABOUT FISTING!
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power sword feels very slow compared to the fencing relic chainsword, but at the same time it makes the silly steel pipe falliing sound on executions which makes it 500% worth it imo
Heavy bolt pistol really should be available to more classes
definitely at least for sniper. and Heavy. because.. He's HEAVY, it's the HEAVY bolt pistol.
Can’t wait to see which classes get the neo volkite pistol but I would love to use HBP on a vanguard or sniper
Heavy bolt pistol has 1.5x dps of a heavy bolt rifle, it’s too powerful
I was so confused when Vanguard didn't get it since Reivers are literally the first unit ever released that had the weapon
@@Eskeletor_210 prob every class that has only the normal bolt pistol
Power Sword B-Ti................. Yes?! Inquisition? Yes...I want to report a Heretic.
LOL
According to Codex Astartes, You are supposed to report to your Chaplain and not the inquisition you heretic fool
Gotta disagree with the grenade launcher bolt rifle. With emperor's vengeance you can get back all your grenades every 30 seconds. Maxed out with perks you get 11 grenades
Yeah, I've never run out of grenades in a pinch. I guess it could be a problem if you are using it exclusively for grenades, but that's not the intent of the weapon. The ability to thin out any horde on demand, or melt Terminis enemies with auspex and grenades, make it S-tier for me.
That, it has a perk that you can get the ammo back when at low health, and the ammo boxes. You rarely have no grenades and if you do everything is just deleted
It is by far the best weapon in the game. It's beyond S tier.
Grenade bolt rifle is busted. Plain and simple. Doing 27-35k damage is trivial.
S+ tier
yeah its the best weapon ingame im only using grenades and never get empty on grenades its just overpowered in my opinion XD like a melta on steroids
I wish we could spend extra weapon data to bypass leveling up weapons. Like spend 10 or 20 green data to skip the first tier of the weapon
Agreed, i have like 2 purple data left, but have over 20 gold because i only play on hardest difficulty so eventually i will need to play easier difficulty just to level some guns up
I'm glad we can't. Twinking a weapon to relic doesn't teach you anything about how the weapon plays and what it's strengths and weaknesses are and would lead to people saying it sucks or is OP with next to no experience with the weapon
@@Acebaur1 he means when you need to use green data to level it up not skip, when all u play is ruthless u eventually run out of green and purple datas and need to play on lower difficulties just to level a gun up once
@@scottbroxirfc you don't need to do that. Just use a higher level one to master it instead
@@scottbroxirfcyou don’t need to play lower difficulty. Hover over the levelling part and it will ask if you want to spend the relic data in place of a lower data to level said weapon
I feel like the Stalker bolt rifle is being undersold here. The relic damage version will make warriors executable in 5 headshots, which isnt hard to do. The ammo on this thing is great too, because it can refund shots after a reload equal to 50% of the enemies you hit with it which, combined with the extra penetration perk, lets me regain large chunks of the ammo i just used. It also destroys zoanthropes and neurothropes very quickly.
Yes, it may not be a standout, but it's surprisingly good on a sniper as a more balanced weapon than actual sniper rifles. Very underrated.
I find with the ammo and recoil reduction perks, the stalker bolt gun is a great head shot weapon. Zero recoil makes follow up shots a breeze.
The stalker already has 4 penetration so I feel banking on the extra damage in the same column of perks is more beneficial.
If we ignore the Bolt Rifle (due to it being obviously imbalanced right now), then the Stalker is equal best weapon for Tac alongside the Plasma - it all comes down to how consistently you can headshot. You need to be hitting >70% headshots for it to out damage the Plasma, which does make me prefer the Plas, but for a really accurate player the Stalker is going to end up doing more damage.
Being the highest potential damage for Tac (outside of the imbalance BR), I feel like that should land it in A tier.
bolt rifle with grenade launcher is the best weapon in game period, the nerf didn't change it enough to make it a tier A
That gun literally deletes the Hive Tyrant’s single health bar if Auspex Scan is specced for debuff multiplication & duration
As a Heavy Bolt Rifle user, it is low B at the very highest. It takes way too many headshots to incap a Warrior/Rubric even fully leveled and with all of the damage increase perks. It is pretty good at crowd control though. I have went through 3/4 of a 52 round magazine sometimes on one Majoris on Ruthless. It needs a small damage buff IMO. It just doesn’t hit hard enough. This is coming from someone that uses it extensively. If push comes to shove I’m picking the GL Bolt Rifle any day. Even without the GL it would be better.
Yeah, not only did I level it to max exp in relic (so I've also experienced the relic version), but I keep the datamined info spreadsheets open all the time so I can double check this stuff. It's servicable at relic in ruthless - but every weapon is at least servicable. It legit has equivalent dps to the Bolt PISTOL. That is not what you want in a primary.
I have found it very effective against Majoris when timing out 5-8 round burts
Power Fist>Power Sword? *Raises eyebrow*
A hot take for sure. I find the sword superior.
Gotta listen to my rationale first :)
I only raised my eyebrow 😂@@italianspartacus
Fist is easier, Doomfist vibes in pvp.
Power fist is.... Pretty bad
I left my wife for the heavy bolter because it never leaves me hanging when the neurothrope starts bullying me.
You don't need to stance dance for Power Sword, all you need is power whirl. It deals more damage than chain sword ground stomp and can be activated off any light attack. Staggers/breaks guard on both hits, clears space around you, deals good damage, and knocks back for gunstrikes.
Also, you can do a 2 light attack > ground stomp (or 1 light > shoulder bash) on chain sword by speccing into full throttle, and holding the first attack for a split second. You immediately start the combo with the second light attack. You don't get the second ground stomp, but I find the increased activation speed to be massively more useful.
I know but that's what I'm saying. I use exclusively power stance. And it feels like the devs wants stance dancing so it feels like I'm only ever using half of the weapon. It's not bad at all, I just don't like using it
@@italianspartacus I think exclusively using power stance has definitely discolored your perception of the weapon.
@@italianspartacus I use power stance on all minoris and the amount of gun strikes it provides is amazing. I got top gun damage by a massive percent on my bulwark in a run lately only using my plasma pistol for gun strikes and scout interruptions. I used to struggle with stance switching smoothly too but using the Dash+Heavy made it switch a lot easier and I usually dash in to engage Majoris+ enemies so the flow was natural once I figured it out
@@Buffalo9975 i only use power stance, and use pwoer rake for majoris enemies with the + 50% dmg it works fine for me , and occasionly swap to speed if theres a lot of rubrics.
@avlaenamnell6994 This is the way.
A light, heavy, heavy combo with the power rake damage perk is incredible for single target. The fact that you can use it from power stance means you never have to change. And if for some reason you do, just neutral dodge into a charged attack to switch stances as you power stance light will clear space.
I do agree that it has the highest learning curve for melee in the game, which is the only thing holding it back. Thunder Hammer also has a large learning curve as you need to use the correct combos with the right perks to optimize your damage output (double slam, or stage 1 charged attack with the 3rd spin perk).
GL Bolt Rifle on my Tactical trivializes the entire game. The only time I ever run out of grenades is when I decide to check how quickly I can solo a boss.
Been running the heavy plasma incenerator and plasma pistol. Feels so sweet. Did want to point out though that while the heavy bolt pistol is pretty cool all by itself, pairing it with all the gunstrike stuff and pistol damage makes it a MONSTER of a weapon.
Bolt rifle with grenade launcher is S+++ tier btw, also you can fill grenades every 30 seconds, basically enabling you to only shoot grenades full time. No ammo boxes or anything needed. It's c razy how you're putting meltas above grenade launcher.. With a heavy in a team you can have up to 15 grenades lol. So 1 grenate per 2 seconds. It's highest dps in the game with basically free ammo, and it's WILDLY IMBALANCED. They could remove the whole bolter thing from this werapon and it would still be SSSSSS++++++ tier lol.
sorry you gotta give the stalker another go man, it is ridiculously good when you finally get it to relic. even on ruthless you can put tyranid warriors in an execution state in just a couple of shots, ammo issues are 100% rectified when you get Reload Restoration, especially with the penetrating rounds perk.
tyranid warrior far away? pop a couple of shots into its head and kill it. swarm approaching you? decimate it by simply shooting into it. just parried a tyranid warrior? if auspexed, enjoy deleting it near instantly with like 2 headshots.
it sounds good, it feels good, it is my favourite bolt gun in the game by far.
Feels great on a sniper from the beginning on. Truly underrated.
I like this guy.
It’s super good for pvp, 8 shots and you die 😊
@hawk9mm I believe he misspoke. i find the damage output amazing even on lower tiers. Only issue is ammo which is easily rectified.
Some of the other bolters should get Kraken/Dragonfire/Hellfire so you can further specialize. I haven't used them enough to say which should have which, just hit 25 on Tac yesterday.
Powersord at b? Anger. Those infinite gun strikes should keep you alive forever tho
I love your format and I will watch your entire video both for its quality and out of respect.
I’ll have to disagree with quite a few placements here. Speaking strictly on relic level.
The foremost is the Bolt Rifle, or indeed the Grenade Launcher. It is arguably *the strongest* weapon in the game. The new patch didn’t just nerf its ammo acquisition, it buffed the grenades’ ROF. Until Emperor’s Vengeance no longer works with it, it’s going to be an apex weapon. It at least deserved an S no matter what your reservations are.
The Heavy Bolter in the same tier as the Heavy Bolt Rifle is… a humorous choice. Heavy Bolter is perhaps on the weaker side of the Heavy weapons but it is still leagues stronger than the HBR and enough to secure a spot in the S tier. The HBR’s damage output is simply mathematically subpar with bad per shot damage and bad headshot multipliers. Even though it does get very good accuracy and tight spread especially when you zoom in the ADS, accuracy cannot salvage its bad numbers. On that note though, the Stalker is actually deserving of that tier A spot. It has the same laser accuracy and magnet headshot feel, except it does actual damage because it has a way higher base damage and additional headshot multiplier. Its ammo capacity is surprisingly enduring with the ammo refund perk. I strongly recommend giving this weapon a fair shot especially on the sniper with the recoil reduction perk. It was a pleasant surprise to me how great and consistent it was.
Regarding melee weapons, I don’t think many assault mains would stand for Power Fist coming before the Hammer, not Bulwark mains for it being higher than Power Sword. I understand it’s a preference; Power Fist is honestly my least favourite melee weapon because it has neither the dueling power of Knife or Power Sword nor the charged damage of the Hammer, nor the overall versatility of the Chain Sword.
Appreciate these takes my bro! It's just the limitation of a tier list like this. I should have done S+ to help break the tension between A and S. I was filming this on stream and I was saying a lot of what you said.. It feels bad to have some guns in A that are better than others but not better than meltas or plasma. It was a big struggle
I'd place it in F tier because it trivializes the game and thus makes it a boring snoozefest of evaporating enemies with zero effort required. At least meltas need to think about ammo and such.
Heavy bolt rifle is an amazing weapon. If you can aim at head level it will clear hordes as fast or faster than the heavy bolter. It has good enough damage to be worth shooting majors with and with a parry scan/auspex scan it will take them to poundtown. As for the why it's because it can 1hk termagants to the head, has 4 pierce and 2 pierce perks to be used. It feels so good to shoot down hordes with, can't stress this enough. God I love the headshot sound.
Yeah - the Bolt Rifle is the only overpowered weapon in the game right now, due to a combination of how much damage the grenades do to terminus enemies, in conjunction with the fact you get a free refill every ~30 secs.
I'm confident they'll rebalance it next patch. I suspect, at the very least, the nades will do less damage to terminus enemies, and you won't get an entire refill for killing a majoris (likely ~3 grenades, give or take).
@@italianspartacusgrenade launcher is by far the strongest weapon in entire game - not heavy plasma nor melta doesn’t have this combination of aoe, dmg, stagger, range and infinite ammo
Funny, the power fist took 1/3 of the hive tyrants health with just one charged up strike. No other melee weapons did that.
And this is coming from a guy who loves the power sword
Interesting, I find the speed stance much better on the power sword than the AOE stance. With how parrying works with minoris now, I just want to focus majoris enemies and use the minoris as armour fodder.
yup, majoris are the only real enemies and chaff clear is extremely overrated in this game
@@atlasstoned Agreed, I actively want MORE melee chaff around me for free armour tbh
I’m glad you’re still championing the power fist. I quite like it, but most UA-camrs make me feel bad about it…
Since they did those rebalances, power fist is pretty good
Most youtubers don't know how to use it so they call it bad
Don’t let others opinions make you feel bad. It’s your game, play how you want.
Stalker bolt rifle does insane damage and is great for sniping the majoris S tier or top A
I would say it’s A tier - very strong weapon, but not stupidly overpowered like S tier weapons.
Not to mention grenade launcher which can let you solo any mission with your eyes closed
@@leonidemelin1131 fair but you can only get grenades from the ammo boxes and from the load out drop and the only reason I say S tier mainly for doing great at picking off majoris calling in reinforcements and bosses
I feel like this list puts grenade launcher lower than S+ just to avoid a nerf.
The Grenade launcher bolter should be in a tier of its own. That thing is still super OP, I regularly have double or triple the damage of my teammates in ruthless.
Until they nerf the ammo refill perk on tactical there’s no gun that’s even close in my opinion
Been watching since the early BG3 videos and your upfronting the information, as I'm sure you've heard from other viewers, is a huge level of respect to your fans and has led to me watch the full videos out of respect for your time in making them. Like you said at the end, I'll still be using whatever I find fun even if makes the game harder, but the information and your explanations/arguments were solid as always. All that to say, loved the video and I hope to continue to watch you pump out content and grow. Much love from the US o/
I've stopped using the Chain sword on my Assault and Bulwark, it's straight up easy mode when you use the chainsword, the combos are so good.
Thunderhammer and Power Sword are my go too, fencing for both. The power sword you need to learn to not touch the directional buttons or it'll mess your combo up. Thunderhammer you need to get used to its speed and doing ground slams/aftershocks, they do so much damage.
The cool thing is when it comes to melee weapons, it's all based on Your own playstyle, not what others say. Play how you want, most of all the weapons are viable for Ruthless, just make sure to grind out your Relic weapons for full power.
Totally agree man! It... Rips and tears.. Some. Would say!
What about your vanguard?
Small correction, the Las Fusil does not give you a charge back per kill, it's more then 1 enemy kill from 1 shot. So you need to fire into an on coming horde to get 2 or more kills per shot, to keep getting your ammo back.
29:25
I did not expect the bill burr-esque fucking joke there. I broke a ring laughing at this.
Hahahaha thank you brother
I completely agree on the fist. I think it's in a pretty good spot now, but i think it needs a buff on that heavy ground pound attack. It still has no range
If you’re using instigator on vanguard, chainsword becomes much more important for dealing with minoris waves. Combat knife feels awesome with melta. The animation lock on some attacks is bad though. I just try to avoid doing the big spinning attack because that’s the worst culprit. The shorter heavy attacks aren’t so bad. The chainsword combos are just way easier to pull off.
S and A tier weapons are the weapons that can keep you alive with little to no weapon perks.
You didn't power whirl enough. It clears weaker stuff, staggers stronger stuff, displaces you as well. In the time you execute a power whirl, you're still probably charging your 2nd power fist attack for much less overall effect.
I do - I exclusively use power whirl, but I prefer the fist's speed and mobility. You don't charge up every single attack on it, and when you do charge, it's a quick charge n release - you don't hold it :)
@@italianspartacus yup i am referring to a perfectly-charged power fist attack (very quick); even then, it is slower and inferior to a simple power whirl.
i think most players never even once considered that "stance dancing" was the way the devs intended the power sword to be used. light stance for single targets, heavy stance for multiple targets. this is the first i'm hearing of "stance dancing".
and the gap closer for the power sword is not that much different from the power fist, especially in light stance.
the power fist desperately needs buffs. increased aoe range and faster charging might help.
anyway, all in all cool video. :) your space marine content 2 is great in general
Totally agree with you man hahaha! Thank you for watching brother :)
@@italianspartacus looking forward to the next one!
I’ve spent hours leveling the bolt rifle, the perk ensures you always have full grenades. Not getting them from ammo caches doesn’t even matter. I’m never out of them and I’m constantly using them.
Bolt rifle can go both in A and in S, the reason is the one you supplied. Skill, a skilled player will prefer it's versatility to the Melta range, accuracy and ability to deal with crowds.
It is my favorite weapon on the Tactical.
The heavy Bolter on the hand is my favorite weapon on the Heavy, I have both it and the multy melta at relic. The multy melta is awesome, but I prefer the versatility of the heavy Bolter and will always choose it over the melta, all I need to do now is start working on heavy plasma incinerator
I felt the opposite about the Heavy Bolter and Power Fist. The HB has felt good the entire time and I'm still just at artificer level, while the Power Fist felt sluggish until I got it to Relic for the faster Fencing version.
@14:55 You don't need to be in Melee to proc the ammo return, you just have to kill a Majors. A Gunstrike, standard ranged kill with the bolt rifle (none-GL) will proc the perk. You can also cheese it if you know a Grenade will kill a majoris by swapping to standard firing with the grenade mid air.
I just found your channel and I appreciate the honest takes. It's why I now play powerfist when I originally wrote it off. The game is really close to being great, but it needs work. Last night my buddy and I played probably 8 OPs between us, and there were several times you just get screwed. We'd run into scenarios where you seemingly just get chain staggered, or you go to shoot someone calling for help and there's a gun strike on the screen so the game does that instead, or some of the executions taking so long we no longer want to do them for fear of a Majoris on ruthless calling for help. And the dodge mechanic is jank as eff. Otherwise, solid game so far.
The heavy bolt pistol is smooth. I love the way it feels
If you could bind switch stance to a key, the power sword would instantly be S tier
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I think power sword should be A-Tier, considering both the skill floor and skill ceiling it has. If you are exclusively using one stance (power or speed, as you have said you do and I am sure others do as well, I did in the past), the power sword will feel like a middling B-tier if not even a C-tier. Doing that would be like using a Heavy Bolter without using heavy stance, or plasma weapons without charged shots, which is going to make it feel like it is missing a lot.
Once you have learned how the power sword can be used most effectively and actually play it that way, it is easily S-tier. The thing with the power sword is that it requires significantly more patience (stance switching), timing (power whirl/power rake), and skill (knowing how to get the most out of it) than basically any other melee weapon in the game. If you try to constantly hold WASD, button mash, and be hyper-aggressive in combat it feels like slightly underwhelming weapons. If you learn to be patient, methodical, stance-switch effectively, parry/block/shieldbash effectively, and just generally fully utilize the weapon, you feel like a God-Emperor amongst men and it's incredibly satisfying. And every time you stance-switch you feel like Henry Cavill reloading his arms.
All of that being said, I would still say A-tier because of just how much learning you have to do. I learned all of this myself the hard way, but it feels well worth it. I would love to see a champion class with a relic blade or two with similar learning curves in the future.
I’m watching the whole thing BECAUSE you put the twitch list up front! ✊
Thank you, finally.... thank you so much! Finally I've seen a tier-list I fully and objectively agree with after 300h in game :D
Maybe some bolters can be here and there, idc, as long as I finally see a brother who is on one page with me in terms of ranking power fist vs power sword. Same thing, I love power swords, I thought that power fist probably would be the weapon I'll hate to play the most while grinding the game, but after I tried using it during first days after launch (even though I have all weapons maxed rn), I won't go back to any sword... and I definitely changed my mind towards power fist look and feel in general.
Thank you and... thank you :D
The combat knife crazy - has most interesting perks and great parry window
Bolt rifle with nade launcher needs its own S+ tier
Some feedback to the tier list
I think you could have gone deeper into specifics with each weapon, as opposed to general knowledge. For instance when you talked about the Melta and how it could create bad habits, you might talk a little about what those bad habits are.
A sign of a good tier list is a list that providers the viewer with a more in-depth knowledge of the items being ranked, as opposed to simply their hierarchical order. I'd also recommend being more specific with the kind of criteria that you use for judging the weapons.
Absolutely agree across the board. This was sort of off the cusp during a stream. I usually structure these by having a section that establishes assumptions or reaffirms that most weapons come down to skill. And more imperial evidence/side by sides would have probably been more helpful
The combat knife is super powerful because you can easily duel any majoris and extremis, and the shoulder charge is an easy move to spam to get gunstrikes on minoris, keeping your armor up.
Which combo do you prefer for single target?
Hey. I love power fist and I like it more than power sword because it looks cooler. But the things you say why you like power fist and why you dislike power sword is because you're using power stance while you prefer the light stance playstyle without realizing it.
The jump attack from light stance is the same animation type from cannon punch and gives the same mobility and the animations are a lot faster and actually easier to dodge and parry than the power fist. You will loose cleave, but you will have more focused damage downing majoris faster with a better armor upkeep. It's the trade.
Try your power fist play style with power sword light stance and I think you'll give a lot more credibility to the power sword.
Try this and I think you will enjoy it:
Use jump attack > light > light (all lights that has the thrust animation) and then 2 rakes. Only change to power stance when majoris are down and there's only minoris left in the pack you're engaging, because of the better cleave. Or don't. I don't. I'm lazy and I don't like changing stances and a pack of minoris is just meh, whatever..
PS: With cannon punch you will get a lot of free gun strikes to farm armor while with the sword light stance is not that easy, but I think changing perk for the improved shield bash (Focused Strength) makes it a lot easier and faster. You might want try the light stance with this perk. This will also make it better to stand your ground tanking packs protecting your ranged fellow without loosing aggro and allowing them to dispatch more heavy damage without losing time dodging, while jumping around makes you loose a lot of aggro.
I disagree with ya on the melee weps. I’d definitely put hammer in S tier and sword in A. Good video though, I feel like a lot of this game is subjective af when it comes to what you like to use which is a very good thing.
My fav class is Assault for example but I know it’s the worst overall mechanically but man that hammer and heavy bolt pistol feel soo good lmao
Yeah the hammer is a king now.
Its sabers fault, tbh theirs no reason for it to be designed so horribly, I still cant grasp the reasoning behind making assault jump pack take 25 seconds to recharge, the weapon perks too are just bad in general, they clearly lacked quality control on this its just sad.
I love the power sword it’s not really about stance dancing for me. If I see a large horde I’ll swap to power stance and clear out the minoris enemies with some power whirls in there and get some hits on the majoris enemies. Once the minoris threat is either neutralized or cut down substantially, I’ll swap to the speed stance and engage the Majoris enemies.
Most people rate the heavy bolt rifle very low, which made me sad when I first got the game, because the idea of the weapon is very appealing. Seeing you give it a high rating is interesting to me, and I'll give it a whirl. I just got the game like three days ago, and the tactical is my first class that I'm really trying to level. your guides and videos have been very helpful as I have made my way through the game. Thank you
Give it a go! It's very satisfying. There are definitely better weapons, but I think solely on its own merit of shoot fucking bolts, it crushes hahaha
I'm pretty sure they fixed the bug on the powrer sword, so that the direction no longer interferes with the combo
It took me awhile with the power fist, but I wanted it for my space wolf bulwark build. I hated it at first, but after getting comfortable with it, I absolutely love it! The ground pound/shake absolutely needs some work tho, but otherwise I love it
And this is why balance is so important in games. It's really just the chainsword and melta. Then there's everything else. Sure, it doesn't mean that weapons are not viable. But these two thing clearly are a step ahead of everything else. Also why the heavy bolt pistol and other heavy weapons are so limited to one class, is a clear miss by the devs. Which once again, brings everyone back to the melta and chainsword.
The Noobtube Bolt Rifle is godtier and there is no other weapon that comes even close to it. Every 30 sec who get all your nades back and since the "nerf" patch they buffed it in the same patch, they removed the shot delay after each shot. Before you could shoot one every 1+ sec. now you can spam them. 2 nades every thing is in execution range... nades don't damage you either, oh I'm surrounded no problem aim at the ground and boom boom boom everything is dead. It's like this build but faster, more dmg and no need to charge anything.
Bolt rifle with GL is easily S tier. Literally OP
Pro tip for the power sword. Stop stance dancing and just swing.
Power sword is actually pretty easy. Use the relic fencing sword. You can switch stances mid combo but that doesn’t even matter. The very basics is have it on speed for majoris enemies and cleave for minoris enemies or a mixture of both, throw a couple attacks out, hold off on an attack for a second and do power whirl, clears every enemy around you. Parry for insane aoe dmg. It’s literally the best melee in the game hands down.
For PVE obviously*
To your point on the power sword, it’s my favourite weapon in the game but I still agree that it needs a more fluid method of changing stance. I like using the dodge attack method for stance changes - it makes it feel like a dance - but when it locks onto the wrong enemy and I end up using a speed stance attack on a termagant instead of a Tyranid warrior because in the time it took for me to dodge attack is irritating.
On table top the power fist is so iconic. I've always loved them,
However I am a IG player and it's rare I equip any sergeant with one
Except when I field Yarrick.
I always found the giant Hand of a Coomer weapons cool, even back in the 4th edition tabletop.
Fast firing bolt weapons are crowd clear. You take the bolt pierced multiple enemies talents and perks pop auspex and you can clear all gaunts and trash instantly
Didn't try the bolt rifle grenade launcher pre-patch but loving it post patch. Its a good 'oh shit' weapon to almost instantly get you team out of a terrible situation, and also fun from a gameplay/roleplaying perspective too. And its good against both nids and chaos
unironically, The auto bolt rifle is pretty bad in PvP too.
However, all the carbines are great in PvP. The power fist is utterly busted due to netcode not allowing you to dodge.
Am I wrong about las fusil class perk being kill 2 with 1 shot to refund ammo?
I agree with the instigator bolt rifle. It is indeed very good and most vanguards are sleeping on this gun or ignoring it over the melta.
The combat knife is insane you can stand still and spam the parry button and just be fine its kinda op
This is NOT tabletop when it comes to melee. The powerfist was anti champoin or light vehicle. Powerhammer was anti tank or deamon prince level. Power sword was anti trooper.
I always play in melee in any game, so as a dedicated melee player my tier list of those would be:
S: Power sword (for me it's the most universal and convenient weapon to use in the whole game and with it on bulwark I deal more damage then with hammer on assault and I can't even remember when I died last time on bulwark with any weapon)
A: Hammer (it's a great and fun wespon with huge damage and AOE, but holy Emperor, upgrading it was atrotious, using a fencing variant before relic is shooting yourself in a leg because those variants have insanely bad stats...ZERO speed on purple one, bro!!!)
B: Power fist (overall this is a really good weapon, it deals big damage, it annihilates elites, combos are fluid, it can do adclear and single target damage alike...so why B? It's outclassed on both bulwark and assault. On bulwark power sword can do much more damage and be more flexible and on assault hammer does literally the same things but better and stronger); Chain sword (it's convenient and reliable weapon, but it lacks in damage department significantly...it takes 7-10 seconds in general to kill one elite while all previous weapons do it twice quicker. Those stomps just throw everyone back and all of them just get up and continue to fight, it's just not cool)
C: Combat knife (it's a defensive weapon. In actual combat it's close to useless, I deals so little damage that even if you take a +100% damage from invis on sniper and perform charged attack, you still will do laughable amount of damage. As a defencive tool to just parry and counter with crit shots it's very good, but I would never recommend to actually fight with it)
And final remark: every weapon is equally good at parry, all balance and fencing variants have the same amount of parry frames.
Bolt sniper is D tier! I suffered and cried, and Cried and Suffered.. I tried my hardest to love the gun because I'm a underdog enthusiasts but got dam 😂
Great video. Love assault so much it’s the only class I’ve reach max rank with playing 100+ hours lol the buffs helped a lot but the armor you get back from blocking seems a bit overkill now.
Power sword is at least A tier if not S. It’s extremely versatile and with max perk tree shit goes even crazier
Commentating for algo bump, list first is so nice
Huh. Interesting. A chunk of this I can see, but some I disagree with
You seem to really dislike the DMR style guns, the Stalker and the Carbine in the marksman pattern. I can't speak for the latter as I haven't fully levelled it yet but the Stalker does a lot of work for me. If you discount the grenade launcher bolt rifle - which we'll get to in a minute - it's 2nd or 3rd best pick for Tactical along with the Plasma Incinerator and the Melta. Between Reloaded Restoration and the Tacticals ammo back perk you have a excellent tool for removing precision targets at range with a very generous ammo pool. And while it's got worse interactions with the Sniper's perks that the Bolt Sniper I still think it's overall utility means it's the better weapon for them if for some reason you're not going Fusil.
Maybe it's a m+k vs controller thing? Because you've also put the Heavy Bolt Rifle in A tier which really surprised me. I've consistently found it pretty weak sauce and not really worth the investment. It's not Occulus or Auto Bolt Rifle levels of bad, but it's really underwhelming.
And the Bolt Rifle with Grenade Launcher needs to be S tier. It just does. Even with the nerf you can still get 10+ grenades every 30 seconds. It arguably needs an S+ all for itself right now.
I'd also swap Power Fist and Power Sword around personally, but everyone's going to have different tastes and I want to give the Fist another try as I may have judged it too quickly. Still, from my experience it feels also as slow and clunky as the Thunder Hammer with none of the crowd control or the umph. I wouldnt certainty mind if Powersword got a pass on its damage in speed stance, but it's crowd control utility is outstanding.
It's pretty easy to stance dance with the Power Sword by dodging and quickly holding down the melee to execute a heavy. Now you do the dash attack and switch stances at the same time, and since it's a dash attack it can stagger minoris and majoris enemies. So now you can easily get the fantasy of stance switching. Very fun to do deal with big enemies by thrusting into Speed Stance and then spinning into Power Stance to deal with hordes.
As someone who prefers the Power Fist animations, it simply does not keep up. The fantasy of using megaton punch power waves doesn't hold up. I use it on Bulwark because it actually has perks like the parry AoE damage to make up for its shortcomings. The supposedly radial Power Smash does NO area damage at all, and I simply cannot feel the AoE from its thrusts and backfists. At least when the game tells me that the Power Stance and Power Whirl are for AoE... Yeah, I get it, it does the job!
Heavy Bolt Rifle is S tier. It's the closest you get to the heavy bolter while also being able to use the chain sword. Combined with the tactical ability the damage you can get out of it is very high. Much Higher than the heavy bolter per bullet.
Stalker is amazing A tier my opinion. Does so much damage to bosses, works perfect for Tac shoot till they come to use the unload with chainsword. Happe s 90 percent of time anyways. Plus being able to get the ranged majoris pinged down is super handy.
My take on bulwark melee is that the parry perks outclass the melee damage. I rather parry and gun strike and negate damage outright rather than committing to the weapons combos that leave you open. I can stand in the middle of a crowd and parry 1 minor and the damage wave will kill 4-5 and chip majors but power fist has to charge to do the same and sword will lock you in its animation to only hit 1 target or spread them with heavy swing. Not to mention chain sword is more efficient at single target, and you still have the parry wave perks for crowd control.
Block is good on the power Hammer if you know your dodge timings, especially if you have unlimited jet pack perfect dodges that give you a 25% attack boost
Agree with this ranking. I feel the same thing about power sword/power fist. Sadly hammer lack of damage. I would put Hammer in B and Knife on A espacially for sniper and high single target potential
Power fist is easier to use but in my opinion if you actually utilize the different stances and combos on the sword its really versatile
If I had to change anything, the grenade launcher would be in SSS tier. The powerfist in the C tier. Good job putting the chainsword where it is. It really is the best melee weapon in the game. The sword and the hammer are cool, but they are lacking in damage for what they are and how slow they are.
Most approachable doesn't mean best. That would be like saying an automatic transmission is the best because everyone can easily use it. And yet, how many professional drivers use an automatic transmission?
The way I look at it, the HBR is what the ABR should be, the ABR is what the standard and Occulus Carbines should be, and the Carbines are basically Autoguns.
I also love the new Heavy Plasma, but it needs a rework to the charge SFX after taking the charge speed upgrade, and either rework the projectile drop or the sights.
Power Fist feels much better, but either they need to increase the heavy attack radius, or rework its perks into either single target or crowd play styles.
Personally, I don’t like the TH’s Aftershock perk. I’d just have it increase the AoE, or even one that makes your light attacks deal increased stagger.
All together, I would like to see more perk reworks before Saber decides to adjust pure weapon stats. Maybe the Bolt weapons would be deserving of raw stat changes, but I’d rather see a lot of perks reworked or replaced.
Hey I agree with your power fist hot take but where did you put my beloved knife???
As long as I have access to the Hammer, I ain't usin' anything else.
You can also swap power sword stance with the parry
Power sword is the melta gun of melee, but requires a pinch of skill.
Sword is the best weapon controlling big waves of “small” enemies.
Your issues with the Stalker are my issues with the Bolt Sniper so i use Stalker instead bc of it lol. Granted i am only on Artificer level with my weapons so far
Why do you say "...kill a majoris in melee every 30 seconds..."? Has it not always been that you just need to get a kill on a majoris-level enemy in any way and not specifically melee? Also, I would love to see an updated tier-list of the weapons, great video!
Haven’t worked on the power sword yet, but I think going by your setup that it has to be good at all rarities, the power fist should be b tier . I leveled it up on assault, and I hated it up until relic tier when it sped up: it always just felt too slow. I would say thunder hammer is s tier
The whole point of a game like Warhammer is doing what seems most cool to you and your power fantasy. Rock on with the PF if you want, I say!
I think if they properly balance the pistols and melee weapons, every class should have access to every pistol and melee weapon except for probably the thunderhammer and maybe the power fist
I do slightly disagree on the bolt sniper rifle. I think the benefit of point and click instead of having to line up a charge shot is a pretty big deal, and *might* push it to A tier IMO.
Alright, so my credentials: 325 hours played (almost entirely in operations), was soloing ruthless pre-patch, currently often do stimless ruthless runs, and have levelled every weap to max exp (so not just to relic, but also to 100%/100% exp. My thoughts:
Edit: this comes up in my explanations - in my own S through D tier ranking system, I typically only rank imbalanced/overpowered weapons at S tier.
*Auto Bolt Rifle: agreed. Pretty accurate, especially from hipfire, but that doesn't make up for the wet-pool-noodle damage.
*Meltas: B tier IMO. They're anti-minoris weapons, but now that minoris give armour on parry they're a much, much lower threat priority than majoris. Heavy is better served with Plasma for that purpose; Tac is better served with GL (or Plasma/Stalker once the GL gets nerfed), Vanguard is better served with Instigator. Sure, you can use them to deal with minoris swarms if you have little-to-no-skill, but they're serving as a crutch in that case; a stand in for good melee play. Though I will say I think it's a fine choice for Vanguard; I prefer Instigator but Melta does suit their short range playstyle.
*Occulus: agreed. Good fire rate and accuracy don't make up for the low damage.
*Plasma Incinerator: agreed. Outside of the one overpowered weapon in the game right now (Bolt Rifle), it's equal best for Tac alongside the Stalker. Which one is better depends on headshot rate. I prefer the Plasma as the bigger, more daunting majoris groups can be difficult to ensure >60% headshots on, especially when you're dodging between shots, and the Plasma does also have a small AoE if you need to turn it on minoris.
*Stalker Bolt Rifle: A tier for Tac, C tier for Sniper. Sniper wants Las Fusil for the biggest stealth-breaking damage possible, but on Tac Stalker is the highest damage (from a non-OP weapon) if you can get a high enough headshot rate. I'd say that warrants an A tier as a good player is going to realise the potential of the weapon. If we consider the average player it might be a B tier on Tac.
*Bolt Pistol: I'd put it in C tier, purely because I don't think any of the sidearms should be S tier, but there's a clear hierarchy between the three, with Bolt Pistol being the worst of the three. It's not bad, and I'd definitely use it over some of the worse primaries when levelling - though at relic every primary was better than it IMO. It's also a reason to differentiate the tier lists into their own weapon slots. C tier pistol =/= C tier primary =/= C tier melee.
*Heavy Bolt Pistol: agreed, but in my secondary only ranking as mentioned with the Bolt Pistol. So it should be a tier above the Bolt Pistol.
*Plasma Pistol: agreed. I leant on it heavily when levelling some weaps on Bulwark and Heavy. Charged shot damage is comparable to some relic level primaries.
*Carbine: D tier, for the same reason as the Auto Bolt and Occulus. Devs put too much stock into non-damage factors (in this case fire rate), which doesn't make up for damage that's just too low.
*BOLT RIFLE: ABSOLUTE S TIER. It's the only S tier weapon right now, because it's the only overpowered weapon right now. Grenades do too much damage in general, but especially to terminus level enemies (particularly when it's on the class with Auspex). So they will almost surely nerf the damage they do to terminus at least, soon. Even then, getting a full ~11+ (depending on weapon perks) grenades back every ~30 seconds is also ridiculous. I've had mild disagreements with some of the tier choices but Bolt Rifle is absolutely, ABSOLUTELY S tier. You also don't have to kill the majoris in melee. It's a very low skill weapon right now. I will die on this hill.
*Bolt Sniper: agreed.
*Heavy Bolt Rifle: D tier. Like the Occulus, like the Auto Bolt Rifle, like the Carbine, it has comparable dps to the BOLT PISTOL. That is not what you want from a primary, even if it's accurate against minoris or w/e factor the devs decided was worth all that damage loss.
*Heavy Bolter: I'd put it B tier personally, but I think A is a fine assessment.
*Heavy Plasma: I'd say A tier, but I tend to reserve S tier in this sort of thing for "is so powerful it likely needs to be rebalanced" - which is why I only have the Bolt Rifle there. Heavy Plasma is easily the best Heavy weapon IMO, because of how easily it deals with the actual threat in ops, majoris+ enemies.
*Instigator: agreed. Vanguard is kind of lacking in "really good" majoris killing primaries, but Instigator is the best of that bunch.
*Fusil: A tier for me, for the same reason as I mentioned before (that I only put imbalanced stuff in S tier for my ratings). Definite best weapon on Sniper and fantastic weapon overall.
*Combat Knife: agreed. I did like it most out of all melee at first due to the attack speed, but as you get more and more comfortable with melee and stuff like parry cancelling and stagger combos, the Combat Knife just had no combo that I was happy with when using it.
*Power Sword: agree, and this one makes me sad as I want to like it more, and did initially use it at first. While it has a better combo than the Combat Knife, it's ultimately just too clunky - I prefer the Chainsword double stomp for dealing with minoris, over Power Sword's Power Mode, and my Chainsword preferred single target combo (light attack => kick, repeat) flows better too.
*Power Fist: I'd put it at B tier too. A lot of these melee ones are going to come down to preference and what you're comfortable with; melee is the most balanced aspect of the game in that all weapons are viable. That said, I found that the Power Fist combos were just too slow for the extra damage they dealt, and in terms of minoris clear it just doesn't stand up to the Chainsword or Thunder Hammer.
*Thunder Hammer: agreed. I used to dislike it due to how slow all its attacks were, but once I became savvy to parry cancelling it's probably my favourite melee weapon of all.
*Chainsword: I'd put it at A tier - again, because in my ratings I only put overpowered/imbalanced stuff at S tier. It's fantastic, to the point where I swapped to it on Vanguard, and was even using it on Assault until I became adept at parry cancelling. Great single target combos, great minoris clear - exactly what you want on a weapon.
100% you nailed it. Two 25 classes so far are Assault (favorite) and Tactical, so I don’t have the full picture yet, but this has been my experience as well. Getting better at melee made me prefer the stalker to the melta on Tac, especially once I got the ammo perks and realized how the grenade Bolter is too OP to be fun. Haven’t spent enough time on the Bulwark to max out the sword, but hated the fist from the little time I used it on Assault.
@@philc2257dumb quick question, how are you guys checking Time Played on game? I play on console so idk if it’s just a pc/stream thing - also thank you for all the in depth info on the weapons with personal experience. I appreciate it all greatly.
@@hewhocantBEstopped Probably on PC using Steam which tracks the time you have spent playing each game in your library.
Ill never understand why people hate on the Heavy Bolt Rifle. Its one of the better weapons on the Tactical. High Reserve capacity, High Magazine capacity, Just High everything. Ophelian Liberation-Beta is the best version of it. with perks you get like 5 or 6 penetration, you pretty much have a Heavy Bolter for the Tactical, It makes Minoris swarms a non issue. Even when paired against a Melta user you will clear waves faster because you obviously have superior range. Its a very easy A tier of a weapon even when compared to Meltas which a very niche.
@@hewhocantBEstopped For PC easily checked on Steam. I wouldnt know on console.
Me who exclusively leveled vanguard with the melta and nothing else because of your vanguard vid 😅
It’s just so FUN 3:50
I did lvl heavy melta first and it actually helped me to get the hang of the game more since when I started to lvl the other two ”harder” weapons as a heavy I managed it all fine.
I wonder why Saber moved the handle on every weapon forward so much. It looks so different compared to the figurines.
Heavy Bolt should be A tier. I wish more classes used it because it is so good.
I love Melt + Combat Knife on my Vanguard. Hook in ->Melta away the minoris -> Duel majoris with knife. Pure bliss. But that's because I just like to melee stuff, Melta is just there to clear the way.
Also, as a fellow tabletop enjoyer I agree: fuck a big fist.
Well, I found out you could make the bolt carbine a DMR today.