Great review Wytse! I really like this plug in as well, I know the designer, Yotam, spent a long time with Chris getting this right. Often with 'signature' plug ins I feel they are a little cynical, however, this one feels like there is a huge amount of actual care and attention went into this! The results are immediately great, that says a lot, we move fast and I want something sounding great without hours of tweaking. Glad to see your channel doing so well!
Warren, thank you as well for your video on this plugin, I just tried it out and compared the different reverbs to otherts, like Valhalla Room, bx_room and some other more pricy plugins. I was kind of dissapointed cause I found out that I liked the Epic ones a lot more. I really like this plug in and it’s worth much much more than 29!!
Epic is really impressive at first but if you have been already mixing with 1-2-3-4 delays going into A-B-C-D reverbs then you bump into some problems with Epic. For example in my effect template In Reaper Id send my snare drum into rev B and D, main vocals in rev A and and B, delay 2 and 3, back vocals in delay 1 and 2 and hook vocals in delay 2-3-4. If this plugin has 2 ins / 2 outs then I cannot really have the same workflow as CLA has in his latest depth videos. If EPIC had 8ins/8outs which can be routed in Reaper then It would really be what I see in CLA-Waves videos. Now, If I want the same mixing experience, I have to open 8 different tracks in Reaper, open 8 EPICs but use ONE device in each of the tracks (track 1=delay 1, track 2=delay 2... track 5 rev A, ....track 8 rev4) and route everything together and then I can send anything anywhere... If thats the case it would be better to have 8 stand-alone plugins of EPIC, 4 delays and 4 reverbs, to make this happen. Of. course in order to work fast I should be able to tweak my 8 effects in BUCKETS like in the CLA MixHub. Meaning, I open ONE Epic plugin but can control all 8 from it. Does this make any sense to anybody? I was happy to get EchoSphere on Black Friday and thought that today we'd get 3 more Epic plugins like Berzerk distortion came out last year and then we got 3-4 more distorters, variations of the same plugin. Of course I purchased Epic without demoing it (even though I was sure of what I mentioned above), just for the Ursa-type delay 4 preset and the defaults on all 8 units. It is sad though that all the excitement I got. from EchoSphere got lost in the buzz that Epic created today. I really liked EchoSphere and was expecting 3 more delay-reverb plugins to cover the 8 devices. When CLA MixHub came out I wasnt into it, but I have adopted the bucket workflow to tweak my effect returns EQ from one instanse of MixHub, and was expecting the bucket thing to be a "thing"... Anyway sorry for ranting. Take care!!!
Just for the sake of it I went to make an effects template in Reaper, just like I mentioned above: 8 effect tracks with one device activated on each track. Just found out that I cannot use any of the reverbs as stand alone reverbs. The sound has to go through a delay unit before it hits the reverb... Whats the point of that? CLA in his depth videos says that if you put reverb on your vocals its better to put reverb on the vocals' delays too. Having said that you should be able to send your vocals to Reverb A as they are, then the same vocals in any of the delays that also go to Reverb A, so both main vocals and the delays have the same space. .... If youre a pro level mixer this plugin is not for you. Youre better off with your own templates which can be much more flexible than this.
you can run old plugins no problem. i do it everyday... however, as far as "CLA knowledge".... don't fall for the hype. its just reverb and delay. ive been doing it in protools for years. send whatever to to my reverb/delay aux and then sen the aux to the other aux. this plugin makes it more convenient, but its nothing revolutionary.
Keith Pringle you can run anything from v9.92 with v10, v11 and v12. Just install your v9 - v11 plugs with a legacy installer, then install your v12 stuff. Just doing have the same plugin installed in 2 different versions. I do this with Mac OS X Catalina and it works fine
You can move all ten faders together with a mouse, just select them by drawing a box around them with the mouse. Same for the Hi-pass and Lo-pass filters and other buttons. Not quite 10 fingers....
Enjoyed the review Wytse. This plug is EPIC! and if you're producing in the box it saves so much time. Great for retro and synthwave artists since CLA uses a lot of his favorite gear from the 80's in this plug. You can teach yourself a lot about how to create more depth, width and space in your mixes by looking at the presets and then apply it to your other reverbs/delays too. It needs fair amount of CPU but you can easily freeze it, disable the plug and move on. Or make it an Aux Fx Send for instruments.
This is probably one of their best plug-ins to be fully honest. Makes it easy to give tracks their own space and saves you from making multiple busses.
We (artist/producers) have midi fader banks that are programmable, so it is not a problem. With that said, we all have delay and reverb plugs. We all have virtual mixers where we can set up sends and route those sends to other sends. So, this is all rather easy to do on your own, with your own flavors and special sauces. What can be taken from this is the idea and the specific implementation, ie, the nature of each delay, what function they each serve, then each reverb, and the effect that they each have. I'm sure some thought was given to that by CLA and the Waves "team". Something to be learned from his specific implementation. And I'm sure many of us already have something similar to this already set up. I mean, who doesn't have a fast delay and a long delay send, and who doesn't have a small reverb and a big reverb send? And who doesn't send some of each delay into each reverb? I hand build this type of effect send structure, invariably, on each of my tracks. I really should be smart about it and save fx chains, or channel presets... but I just don't do it. But if it takes me a minute to instantiate and route everything I'm slacking, so I just do it by hand each time. It's not the "Lord's" implementation, but it's mine. Maybe I should give this a look and model each type of delay and reverb? But am I trying to make 80's hair rock. No, I can assure you I am not.
Your conclusion is the same as I am thinking, but then I'm thinking it's a great little throw it in the early stages of creation to get working on an idea... stuff like that really works for me... then when something sounds really interesting then it's worth putting the time into fine tuning it with dedicated plugins... if it needs it
After you did this blind testing, you should watch the videos from CLA - there are bunch of other interesting comments from him about this approach. He says that one of the secrets from his tight mixes are the send effects and he never uses more than 4 reverbs or delays in a mix to keep the space consistent.
Ever since the first Waves video wity CLA showing how he did this on his console I emulated it in Studio one with busses. The routing is honestly super easy works the same as this with faders and everything. By doing what CLA does and limiting myself to just these 8 types of time effects across the whole mix I feel like I went from good to great. The space and depth is so much richer and better sounding. Good review. As far as if it's worth it? For me, that is a no.
Can you make it so two different busses use different combos of the same delay/reverb without them affecting each other? I can’t mentally figure out how to do that without replicating 8 delay/reverb chains for each bus.
I'm using one of these- Sparrow 8x100mm MIDI controller. 8 faders but no buttons for routing. A very helpful addition to the CLA-Epic but buttons would make it perfect.
Great video as usual 🙌 I figured out how to set the faders up on my Faderport 8 using Macros in Studio one, game changer. Thanks again for the insight. 🙏
It would be really epic if it have multichannel in/out routing, especially useful for reaper users. I mean a separate stereo inputs and outputs for each module. That way you can have only one plugin for whole mix, and really mix like CLA
Regarding the hardware controller - touchscreen should be an option. I guess waves have this direction in mind (LV1), as well as Slate with their raven.
This mimics what you would do on an SSL with the "channel output to small faders" that would route the signal up to the busses where you would just push the "buss" buttons to route to your effects. We would patch buss outputs into effects for extra sends off each channel. It was a basic workflow on SSL and Neve VR consoles. You could switch your effects exactly like you are pressing the ABCD buttons. Not snake oil its how we worked. You are right faders would be great. The "throw" is the delay throw that we would automate on a channel fader to "throw" the signal up to the buss or the actual sends on the channel to automate echos in a mix or "throw into a reverb". Like catching the ends of a phrase with a 1/4 note delay to give it some "tail" on the end. So to reiterate yeah faders would be nice but i would think you can control these on any set of faders via MIDI.
Why do u need a controller or whatever like everyone is saying when the faders are on the plugin? Just looking to become more knowledgeable on the subject, sorry
I see a lot of people like this, and I'm not saying it's bad... But considering most people have, not only several stock reverb/delay plugins, but also several 3th party (in my case Valhalla and Slate reverbs and delays, and all those Logic stock) I just don't see why you wouldn't just set this up your self, save it as a preset/patch, save your money, and not clog up your DAW with yet another plugin. It seems it was made more for musicians and maybe beginners who just want to set it up quickly and move on.
Yes, thats why I think Presonus or Allen Heath QU will be my choice. I did not buy Softube Console 1 because they do not support at least Plugin Alliance bundle yet. I was thinking to buy it for about 3 years. But I would like QU-32 a lot more.
If you have Valhalla plugins, you have the Epic version of Epic. If you want to interact with hardware, just buy a touchscreen. It's cheaper and you can interface with all your plugins for one price.
I've been mixing exactly like this with multiple delays and reverbs for awhile now and didn't know CLA does this too! Works great with guitar solo's as well.
Just remember you’re going to be obligated to regularly pay the renewal fee. Even if you don’t want to, they tend to force you into paying it through less than moral means. But I mean, I guess a single plug-in would cost that much to renew regularly.
@@KnzoVortex I have tend to find that only people on mac have to regularly update it, some of my waves plugins are still on v9 and are working fine here, but I understand what you are saying, their email tactics are annoying as all hell
@@studio.kaedinger From what I've heard waves eventually starts to use a lot of sneaky tactics to force you to upgrade. I've only heard the horror stories so I don't know exactly what they do, but it seems like they cause your plugins licenses to stop working sometimes, or maybe they stop you from being able to use the installer, but whatever it is, I heard plenty of people who were screwed over in some unforeseen way by waves and their upgrade scheme. If you are to take anything away from this, there's at least a chance of it happening to you.
@@KnzoVortex Never happened to me in the last 6 years, so no hearsay on my side. True you don't get updates for older plugin versions, but all of my old versions still work fine. It's exactly what they say on their website, too. The current installer even guides you to the legacy software installers.
Waves is stuck in the past, and not even in a good way. Check out FabFilter Pro-R, Arturia Rev Intensity, and D16 Group Spacereck and Toraverb 2 to see what the future is like.
It would be dope if you could use the Faders or knobs on your midi controller to control this plugin! Ive been really wanting some hands on ability for my plugins!
After watching Warrens review I bought the plugin, and it’s great. I do understand your thoughts about having a controller with faders to manage it. TC Electronics have both delays and reverbs with hardware controllers and I also have those plugins. It works well and gives you the “right” feeling when working with them. If waves comes up with a hardware controller to epic, I will definitly buy it. I do like your review!
if he's using exactly this... at least it seems like tape, dly, slap 166.... seems like "his" standard fx chain he claims to use often; and it works good for a starting point for rock vocals
I use my fingers not the mouse on the analog type plug ins. I have touch screens, plus I can lay my tablet down and can be my mixer, I use studio one 4 and use it remotely on my tablet. Works great. I love waves and I love the analog stuff, as long as it has screws.
Great video man, love what I've seen from this plugin so far, definitely going to buy it PS. Future video idea: I would love to see how and why you added ethernet to your Neumann console!
Confirmed: with Duet iOS and Windows app you can move all the faders using multitouch. It should work also with Microsoft Remote desktop and any multitouch screen interface.
At today's live presentation by waves and CLA it became clear that a lot of users would prefer the possibility to route different inputs to different delays and reverbs within the plugin. Without this feature you are more flexible in your daw by using plugins you already have.
The controller is a great idea, specially if you want to make automation for each individual effect or all at once. Really like that idea 💡over all I do love EPIC.
That's how CLA uses the Time Based FX on his mixes. That's what he calls "Landscape". He uses 8 faders from his SSL Console. There is a 4 video series "How to create Depth" hosted by CLA where he desmonstrates the analog mode how he does it...
According to CLA this is exactly how he mixes, except he uses all of his vintage hardware and his SSL to do this. Waves has a 4 part series showing this called "Mixing With Depth".
Working with the new FREE version as EchoSphere, which I got via the Black Friday freebie, I'm playing around and planning on posting a video on this topic. Will hopefully be posting something soon.
I'm lucky enough to have multiple ways to control stuff, Studio Live 16 series 3 and an iPad. I think you're right, having access quickly to all 8 faders at once is the key. The beauty of course is with experience automation takes care of that. What did we do before we could automate everything... ahh that's right, we used faders.
Thanks for the review! I'm happy to see I'm not the only one who thinks that a hardware control surface with faders would take this plugin over the top. In the meantime, I think I'll try mapping some faders in Reaper via MIDI to my keyboard controller! Thanks again! - chaz
Not really sure what the problem is with their upgrade scheme. I have plugins from versions 9 to 12 happily running alongside on the same machine. No one's forcing you to buy upgrades.
You can get iPad and use it as a remote multitouch screen for Windows 10. Then move this plugin window on 2nd screen and you can control the routing using touch control. Yes, it is not as tactile as 100mm faders,so the best scenario could be Presonus or Softube faders and use ipad, or even iphone, screen for other buttons. What 100mm faders console for PC DAW you recommend?
Wait. Im a little confused. Why would you want a physical fader? What would be the difference between that and the faders on the plugin. And what makes this different than simply putting a delay after a reverb on a channel? Isn't that all this is. And why does each side have 4 faders. 4 verbs before 4 delay? I'm totally lost
i have build a similar approach in reaper inspired by CLAs video and EPIC but with Echoboy and Valhalla Vintage Verb, man i'm never going back, my mixing is so much faster and better now!! how much CPU is EPIC using more or less? very good sounds in there, wouldn't use it on lots of tracks though, i'd rather put it on a send track using the same approach as CLA actually does on his console, i can highly recommend the waves walkthrough of his setup, and then build your own.
Bought this for 29 Euro today. It's my first wave plugin and I don't think I will jump on the waves train but for that amount It is worth to have it if only for the inspirational aspect. Good video like always. Thanks a lot.
The big question is, how do these reverbs sound? Are they competitive against say UAD chambers, UAD Lexicon 480, UAD EMT plate, etc? Or is this on same par as their H-Reverb, Rverb, etc? ALl this routing and faders means nothing if it's not a top end reverb. I'll pass for now, it'll be on sale again at some point. I like the thought process in the plugin, but how does it sound? Good for beginners/novice, or will this be on a CLA mix? I doubt it.
Nice review. I totally agree with you on the hardware point, especially as I used to use a 224 and 480L. One thing I would add is that it's more user friendly with a Kensington Expert Trackball. Then it feels like fingers on faders.
This seems like a plugin that works if you automate everything, send you vocals to it and automate each of the different delays, maybe set up the throw to go to a long reverb, the crowd to the space etc. The way you'd do this in your daw is with four verbs and four delay sends. I usually do two of each or maybe three for vox, not sure how I feel on the sound of the actual verb but Im picky.
i got the echosphere for free and in my opinion it s like a broken glass sharp reverb. Not suitable for most of my projects. The reverb should fade away and not work like a brick. I don t like unsuitable rooms thats why i don t like it. But maybe with automation you could be right because it emphasizes harmonics.
Great review Wytse! I really like this plug in as well, I know the designer, Yotam, spent a long time with Chris getting this right. Often with 'signature' plug ins I feel they are a little cynical, however, this one feels like there is a huge amount of actual care and attention went into this! The results are immediately great, that says a lot, we move fast and I want something sounding great without hours of tweaking. Glad to see your channel doing so well!
Really enjoyed your review as well Warren
Would you say they managed to make it sound like hits? :P
Warren, thank you as well for your video on this plugin, I just tried it out and compared the different reverbs to otherts, like Valhalla Room, bx_room and some other more pricy plugins. I was kind of dissapointed cause I found out that I liked the Epic ones a lot more. I really like this plug in and it’s worth much much more than 29!!
And have a marvelous time making music Warren! xD
@@michaellarsen180 haha thanks ever so much! Have a marvellous time!
Thanks!
The crowd setting is awesome on this vocal
According to the waves series with CLA “Mixing With Depth”, this is exactly how CLA’s signal flow works for his effects, complete with faders
Epic is really impressive at first but if you have been already mixing with 1-2-3-4 delays going into A-B-C-D reverbs then you bump into some problems with Epic. For example in my effect template In Reaper Id send my snare drum into rev B and D, main vocals in rev A and and B, delay 2 and 3, back vocals in delay 1 and 2 and hook vocals in delay 2-3-4. If this plugin has 2 ins / 2 outs then I cannot really have the same workflow as CLA has in his latest depth videos. If EPIC had 8ins/8outs which can be routed in Reaper then It would really be what I see in CLA-Waves videos. Now, If I want the same mixing experience, I have to open 8 different tracks in Reaper, open 8 EPICs but use ONE device in each of the tracks (track 1=delay 1, track 2=delay 2... track 5 rev A, ....track 8 rev4) and route everything together and then I can send anything anywhere... If thats the case it would be better to have 8 stand-alone plugins of EPIC, 4 delays and 4 reverbs, to make this happen. Of. course in order to work fast I should be able to tweak my 8 effects in BUCKETS like in the CLA MixHub. Meaning, I open ONE Epic plugin but can control all 8 from it. Does this make any sense to anybody? I was happy to get EchoSphere on Black Friday and thought that today we'd get 3 more Epic plugins like Berzerk distortion came out last year and then we got 3-4 more distorters, variations of the same plugin. Of course I purchased Epic without demoing it (even though I was sure of what I mentioned above), just for the Ursa-type delay 4 preset and the defaults on all 8 units. It is sad though that all the excitement I got. from EchoSphere got lost in the buzz that Epic created today. I really liked EchoSphere and was expecting 3 more delay-reverb plugins to cover the 8 devices. When CLA MixHub came out I wasnt into it, but I have adopted the bucket workflow to tweak my effect returns EQ from one instanse of MixHub, and was expecting the bucket thing to be a "thing"... Anyway sorry for ranting. Take care!!!
Just for the sake of it I went to make an effects template in Reaper, just like I mentioned above: 8 effect tracks with one device activated on each track. Just found out that I cannot use any of the reverbs as stand alone reverbs. The sound has to go through a delay unit before it hits the reverb... Whats the point of that? CLA in his depth videos says that if you put reverb on your vocals its better to put reverb on the vocals' delays too. Having said that you should be able to send your vocals to Reverb A as they are, then the same vocals in any of the delays that also go to Reverb A, so both main vocals and the delays have the same space. .... If youre a pro level mixer this plugin is not for you. Youre better off with your own templates which can be much more flexible than this.
CLA just made a set of videos explaining his "depth" workflow and this is how he does it in hardware. If it came with an SSL, it would be perfect.
EPIC is not as flexible...
USE IT WITH MIXHUB!!!
@@dimoscondos I'm interested to see how this works yet, and also Schep's Omni channel!!!.
@@tonycarpenter-Makzimia check the videos from waves and Andrew himself. also CLA released a new video with Waves fir Epic
Honestly looks like a lot of CLA knowledge condensed into an easy to control package. This is stuff he found that works.
Needs V.12 to operate which costs to upgrade :(
@@saturdaynightfeverDJshows I'll have another look then, cheers
@@keithpringle1103 you can have multiple versions coexist, I have V9, 10, 11 & 12 all working together.
you can run old plugins no problem. i do it everyday... however, as far as "CLA knowledge".... don't fall for the hype. its just reverb and delay. ive been doing it in protools for years. send whatever to to my reverb/delay aux and then sen the aux to the other aux. this plugin makes it more convenient, but its nothing revolutionary.
Keith Pringle you can run anything from v9.92 with v10, v11 and v12. Just install your v9 - v11 plugs with a legacy installer, then install your v12 stuff. Just doing have the same plugin installed in 2 different versions. I do this with Mac OS X Catalina and it works fine
I love this plugin. Simple to use because you don’t have to look for among big list of delay and reverb.
Sandstorm gets better every time i listen to it. :D
Chris knew that reverb was coming back into style so he put it up where it could be obvious, not just subtle. He stays on top of the trends for sure.
You can move all ten faders together with a mouse, just select them by drawing a box around them with the mouse. Same for the Hi-pass and Lo-pass filters and other buttons. Not quite 10 fingers....
I dig this a lot. I also like how in your review you went through it naturally like someone actually would. Great content!
Behringer B-control fader BCF2000 is perfect for this plugin
Enjoyed the review Wytse. This plug is EPIC! and if you're producing in the box it saves so much time. Great for retro and synthwave artists since CLA uses a lot of his favorite gear from the 80's in this plug. You can teach yourself a lot about how to create more depth, width and space in your mixes by looking at the presets and then apply it to your other reverbs/delays too. It needs fair amount of CPU but you can easily freeze it, disable the plug and move on. Or make it an Aux Fx Send for instruments.
worth it? thinking of trying one
@@onzkicg It is good. if you can stand the Waves update plan. I find myself distancing myself from Waves these days.
This is probably one of their best plug-ins to be fully honest. Makes it easy to give tracks their own space and saves you from making multiple busses.
Can u use it with any DAW?
@@inlovingmemoryofdouglasmul5216 yup!! I bought it today, it works perfectly in Logic Pro. Amazing plug-in!
I've seen this "snake oil" thumbnail a bunch of times already and now I'm interested to know what it is. Gonna look it up
We (artist/producers) have midi fader banks that are programmable, so it is not a problem.
With that said, we all have delay and reverb plugs.
We all have virtual mixers where we can set up sends and route those sends to other sends.
So, this is all rather easy to do on your own, with your own flavors and special sauces.
What can be taken from this is the idea and the specific implementation, ie, the nature of each delay, what function they each serve, then each reverb, and the effect that they each have. I'm sure some thought was given to that by CLA and the Waves "team". Something to be learned from his specific implementation.
And I'm sure many of us already have something similar to this already set up. I mean, who doesn't have a fast delay and a long delay send, and who doesn't have a small reverb and a big reverb send? And who doesn't send some of each delay into each reverb?
I hand build this type of effect send structure, invariably, on each of my tracks. I really should be smart about it and save fx chains, or channel presets... but I just don't do it. But if it takes me a minute to instantiate and route everything I'm slacking, so I just do it by hand each time.
It's not the "Lord's" implementation, but it's mine. Maybe I should give this a look and model each type of delay and reverb? But am I trying to make 80's hair rock. No, I can assure you I am not.
I just bought it and am so excited to try it out
It's the first CLA one for me that made me go "yep, that would be really useful" might get that one when it comes the time
I think the fader control is just what you do with your DAW controller purchases, with all plugins really
Your conclusion is the same as I am thinking, but then I'm thinking it's a great little throw it in the early stages of creation to get working on an idea... stuff like that really works for me... then when something sounds really interesting then it's worth putting the time into fine tuning it with dedicated plugins... if it needs it
After you did this blind testing, you should watch the videos from CLA - there are bunch of other interesting comments from him about this approach. He says that one of the secrets from his tight mixes are the send effects and he never uses more than 4 reverbs or delays in a mix to keep the space consistent.
I like it.. the first thing i did was set it up with a controller. Works slick... Another great video!
I feel called out by this particular cover of sandstorm :(
Ever since the first Waves video wity CLA showing how he did this on his console I emulated it in Studio one with busses. The routing is honestly super easy works the same as this with faders and everything. By doing what CLA does and limiting myself to just these 8 types of time effects across the whole mix I feel like I went from good to great. The space and depth is so much richer and better sounding. Good review. As far as if it's worth it? For me, that is a no.
Can you make it so two different busses use different combos of the same delay/reverb without them affecting each other? I can’t mentally figure out how to do that without replicating 8 delay/reverb chains for each bus.
There are some Darude presets in the Artist Preset list!
Woe 🎚️ it doesn't even sound like Darude anymore!!! Nice plugging!
Been playing around it already with some of my tracks and am satisfied so far 👍
Ooh... just had a thought, I could map the faders on my keylab 2 to this? 🤔
Its great with my dell xps touch screen laptop
I'm using one of these- Sparrow 8x100mm MIDI controller. 8 faders but no buttons for routing. A very helpful addition to the CLA-Epic but buttons would make it perfect.
Great video as usual 🙌 I figured out how to set the faders up on my Faderport 8 using Macros in Studio one, game changer. Thanks again for the insight. 🙏
It would be really epic if it have multichannel in/out routing, especially useful for reaper users. I mean a separate stereo inputs and outputs for each module. That way you can have only one plugin for whole mix, and really mix like CLA
This is my favorite version of Sandstorm
Actually this is the only version, the original
Regarding the hardware controller - touchscreen should be an option. I guess waves have this direction in mind (LV1), as well as Slate with their raven.
Yea, they should sell a hardware USB fader specifically for this plugin. That would be fire but then you'd want to use it for other plugins too.
Its basically his workflow in a plugin. Like you said you can do this in your DAW the long way around.
Isn’t Valhalla Delay did the same sending delay to a reverb?
This mimics what you would do on an SSL with the "channel output to small faders" that would route the signal up to the busses where you would just push the "buss" buttons to route to your effects. We would patch buss outputs into effects for extra sends off each channel. It was a basic workflow on SSL and Neve VR consoles. You could switch your effects exactly like you are pressing the ABCD buttons. Not snake oil its how we worked. You are right faders would be great. The "throw" is the delay throw that we would automate on a channel fader to "throw" the signal up to the buss or the actual sends on the channel to automate echos in a mix or "throw into a reverb". Like catching the ends of a phrase with a 1/4 note delay to give it some "tail" on the end. So to reiterate yeah faders would be nice but i would think you can control these on any set of faders via MIDI.
Yup. I can definitely get on board with this plugin. I think buying some dedicated midi faders for this is the way to go.
It sounds good, just get a control surface with faders , end of review
Why do u need a controller or whatever like everyone is saying when the faders are on the plugin? Just looking to become more knowledgeable on the subject, sorry
@@inlovingmemoryofdouglasmul5216 because you can find a better sweet spot moving faders together , oppose to one fader at a time
Evolution requires time to learn your gear. I bought it. Won't be able to use it till next year. It is what you make of it
@@ermano thank you
@@triple_x_r_tard why one day are they that expensive??
I see a lot of people like this, and I'm not saying it's bad... But considering most people have, not only several stock reverb/delay plugins, but also several 3th party (in my case Valhalla and Slate reverbs and delays, and all those Logic stock) I just don't see why you wouldn't just set this up your self, save it as a preset/patch, save your money, and not clog up your DAW with yet another plugin. It seems it was made more for musicians and maybe beginners who just want to set it up quickly and move on.
i'd love to see this get Softube Console1 Fader compatibility, it's be really good and the controller already has the exactly correct amount of faders
Yes, thats why I think Presonus or Allen Heath QU will be my choice. I did not buy Softube Console 1 because they do not support at least Plugin Alliance bundle yet. I was thinking to buy it for about 3 years. But I would like QU-32 a lot more.
If you have Valhalla plugins, you have the Epic version of Epic. If you want to interact with hardware, just buy a touchscreen. It's cheaper and you can interface with all your plugins for one price.
I've been mixing exactly like this with multiple delays and reverbs for awhile now and didn't know CLA does this too! Works great with guitar solo's as well.
Is this compatible with any DAW like audacity??
Might be a waves plugin I actually get
Just remember you’re going to be obligated to regularly pay the renewal fee. Even if you don’t want to, they tend to force you into paying it through less than moral means. But I mean, I guess a single plug-in would cost that much to renew regularly.
@@KnzoVortex I have tend to find that only people on mac have to regularly update it, some of my waves plugins are still on v9 and are working fine here, but I understand what you are saying, their email tactics are annoying as all hell
@@KnzoVortex I never paid for upgrades, not sure why you might have to. I have versions 9 to 12 running on the same machine without problems.
@@studio.kaedinger From what I've heard waves eventually starts to use a lot of sneaky tactics to force you to upgrade. I've only heard the horror stories so I don't know exactly what they do, but it seems like they cause your plugins licenses to stop working sometimes, or maybe they stop you from being able to use the installer, but whatever it is, I heard plenty of people who were screwed over in some unforeseen way by waves and their upgrade scheme. If you are to take anything away from this, there's at least a chance of it happening to you.
@@KnzoVortex Never happened to me in the last 6 years, so no hearsay on my side. True you don't get updates for older plugin versions, but all of my old versions still work fine. It's exactly what they say on their website, too. The current installer even guides you to the legacy software installers.
Waves is stuck in the past, and not even in a good way. Check out FabFilter Pro-R, Arturia Rev Intensity, and D16 Group Spacereck and Toraverb 2 to see what the future is like.
D16 Spacerek is 🔥EPIC🔥
Sometimes in a mix for certain genres the sound of the past is useful though.
I don't even see how Waves would want to catch up again.
@@timoheinrich8763 Exactly.
Great video. I may not buy the actual plug-in just now but I love the concept of it for creating new sounds for my music. Thanks for the video.
It would be dope if you could use the Faders or knobs on your midi controller to control this plugin! Ive been really wanting some hands on ability for my plugins!
Dear anyone watching...it sound great right out of the box.
After watching Warrens review I bought the plugin, and it’s great. I do understand your thoughts about having a controller with faders to manage it. TC Electronics have both delays and reverbs with hardware controllers and I also have those plugins. It works well and gives you the “right” feeling when working with them. If waves comes up with a hardware controller to epic, I will definitly buy it. I do like your review!
if he's using exactly this... at least it seems like tape, dly, slap 166.... seems like "his" standard fx chain he claims to use often; and it works good for a starting point for rock vocals
Wietse, I think Chris recently made a video together with waves on his workflow for delay's, reverb's and how he uses it on his SSL
TRUE... it’s called “mixing with depth”
I use my fingers not the mouse on the analog type plug ins. I have touch screens, plus I can lay my tablet down and can be my mixer, I use studio one 4 and use it remotely on my tablet. Works great. I love waves and I love the analog stuff, as long as it has screws.
Would you set this up as a FX track and send the track into it? or as part of the main vocal chain
Same question
Lol I think the snake is out of oil by now 🤣🤣
Great video man, love what I've seen from this plugin so far, definitely going to buy it
PS. Future video idea:
I would love to see how and why you added ethernet to your Neumann console!
Confirmed: with Duet iOS and Windows app you can move all the faders using multitouch. It should work also with Microsoft Remote desktop and any multitouch screen interface.
At today's live presentation by waves and CLA it became clear that a lot of users would prefer the possibility to route different inputs to different delays and reverbs within the plugin. Without this feature you are more flexible in your daw by using plugins you already have.
The controller is a great idea, specially if you want to make automation for each individual effect or all at once. Really like that idea 💡over all I do love EPIC.
That's how CLA uses the Time Based FX on his mixes. That's what he calls "Landscape". He uses 8 faders from his SSL Console. There is a 4 video series "How to create Depth" hosted by CLA where he desmonstrates the analog mode how he does it...
According to CLA this is exactly how he mixes, except he uses all of his vintage hardware and his SSL to do this. Waves has a 4 part series showing this called "Mixing With Depth".
You can assign them to a midi fader controler? I think you can
This is one plugin I can DEFINITELY see myself using.
Is it heavy on CPU ? Am using CLA signature series and my mac hiccups many times
Working with the new FREE version as EchoSphere, which I got via the Black Friday freebie, I'm playing around and planning on posting a video on this topic. Will hopefully be posting something soon.
I have a Novation Launch Control XL. I think this could be a good controller for controlling this plugin.
Absolutely
I like your Blue , White and Red look ;-)
matching the plugin's interface ;). smart!
I'm lucky enough to have multiple ways to control stuff, Studio Live 16 series 3 and an iPad. I think you're right, having access quickly to all 8 faders at once is the key. The beauty of course is with experience automation takes care of that. What did we do before we could automate everything... ahh that's right, we used faders.
can't wait when Waves develop a hardware controller like the Console1 from Softube!
0:48 subtitles 😂😂😂😂
Made it work with my ssl uf8 via CSI in Reaper! 8 hardware faders as you wished for 😉
13 year old me digs those lyrics
They are distractingly terrible
It sounds amazing.
Somebody doesn't like to read manuals. Great way to stay in the dark !
Thanks for the review! I'm happy to see I'm not the only one who thinks that a hardware control surface with faders would take this plugin over the top. In the meantime, I think I'll try mapping some faders in Reaper via MIDI to my keyboard controller! Thanks again! - chaz
€24! That's a bargain. I'm not a waves fan...but bought. 🧡
J’hésite...
On the one hand this seems like a really fast way of routing delays into reverb.
That said, screw waves and their "upgrade" scheme.
Agreed will never buy another waves product because of that scheme !!
Not really sure what the problem is with their upgrade scheme. I have plugins from versions 9 to 12 happily running alongside on the same machine. No one's forcing you to buy upgrades.
@@studio.kaedinger nah man. She's obligated to buy it now.
@@URRBANELEKTRO Then why are you watching video reviews of waves products?
@@oyahthefirst Unfortunate. At least I didn't have to pay for any upgrades for the last 6 years now, and all my plugins are still working fine.
I only buy handsoldered plugins. PCB plugins just don't sound as warm.
CLA doesn’t like the word “warm”😝
You can get iPad and use it as a remote multitouch screen for Windows 10. Then move this plugin window on 2nd screen and you can control the routing using touch control. Yes, it is not as tactile as 100mm faders,so the best scenario could be Presonus or Softube faders and use ipad, or even iphone, screen for other buttons. What 100mm faders console for PC DAW you recommend?
Wait. Im a little confused. Why would you want a physical fader? What would be the difference between that and the faders on the plugin. And what makes this different than simply putting a delay after a reverb on a channel? Isn't that all this is. And why does each side have 4 faders. 4 verbs before 4 delay? I'm totally lost
i have build a similar approach in reaper inspired by CLAs video and EPIC but with Echoboy and Valhalla Vintage Verb, man i'm never going back, my mixing is so much faster and better now!! how much CPU is EPIC using more or less? very good sounds in there, wouldn't use it on lots of tracks though, i'd rather put it on a send track using the same approach as CLA actually does on his console, i can highly recommend the waves walkthrough of his setup, and then build your own.
Pls. make a video of Waves Schoeps Omni Channel plugin! I'm very curious is it a snake oil or not....
Bought this for 29 Euro today. It's my first wave plugin and I don't think I will jump on the waves train but for that amount It is worth to have it if only for the inspirational aspect. Good video like always. Thanks a lot.
The lyrics 😂👌
I used it in a mix today. Super cool plug.
Can u import this plugin to audacity?
Korg nano control will give you 8 faders for this. I'm still researching this myself to see if it will match what I want to do.
Shouldn't you be able to map the faders to your MIDI controller?
The big question is, how do these reverbs sound? Are they competitive against say UAD chambers, UAD Lexicon 480, UAD EMT plate, etc? Or is this on same par as their H-Reverb, Rverb, etc? ALl this routing and faders means nothing if it's not a top end reverb. I'll pass for now, it'll be on sale again at some point. I like the thought process in the plugin, but how does it sound? Good for beginners/novice, or will this be on a CLA mix? I doubt it.
Cool review. I'm considering getting it and yes it would work a treat with my Faderport FP8.
the korg nano control midi controller would do want you want with the faders
Nice review. I totally agree with you on the hardware point, especially as I used to use a 224 and 480L. One thing I would add is that it's more user friendly with a Kensington Expert Trackball. Then it feels like fingers on faders.
now imacs are syncing with ipads better, you can use your ipad for full-finger faders.
With a midi controller and map the faders, simple same think for most of the plug-ins
Can the faders be automated on Logic or any other DAW? If so then you should be able to route it to any fader interface. No?
Any info on if this thing is capable of multitouch? That would be awesome.
I’ve never been a fan of his plug ins. I’ve bought a bunch and been disappointed but this one looks very cool actually
put mix to 100% and use faders only
This seems like a plugin that works if you automate everything, send you vocals to it and automate each of the different delays, maybe set up the throw to go to a long reverb, the crowd to the space etc. The way you'd do this in your daw is with four verbs and four delay sends. I usually do two of each or maybe three for vox, not sure how I feel on the sound of the actual verb but Im picky.
i got the echosphere for free and in my opinion it s like a broken glass sharp reverb. Not suitable for most of my projects. The reverb should fade away and not work like a brick. I don t like unsuitable rooms thats why i don t like it. But maybe with automation you could be right because it emphasizes harmonics.
metallic sound*
Like the video! And also the idea of this being combined in a hardware controller.
It provides fun to test more and easy to use. Like it.
Love this plug in. CLA is my favorite from waves.