475 ft lb torque stick tool review
Вставка
- Опубліковано 11 лис 2024
- It sort of works but not reliable enough for me to ever trust. Now this may be an issue with working in conjunction with the Milwaukee M18. But everyone i know is switching to electric impacts.
Link amzn.to/3ikKv2m
During my time as a GM mechanic at a dealer, I remember when the torque sticks came out. They over-torqued wheels as well. The trusty torque wrench can't be beaten. They thought in the day that using these would help curb over-tightening of wheels and resulting in warped brake rotors.
@Dave Pawson Agreed to use a wrench however double check all clicker wrenches with a old school bent wire torque wrench. Yeah they might be a few pounds off, but never 20 pounds !
Torque measurements when you loosen something will always be inaccurate on the high side. Starting friction is always greater than running friction.
Break away toque is different from moving torque.
Yes, the second bolt was more like it for a test, first to 475 lb ft with a torque wrench and then with the tool it showed it gets a little more because the nut moved... Not very much I would like to say.
If the impact did torque it to 475 you will not be able to verify it with breakaway using a torque wrench. Not much of a issue on rims but mains, rods and heads would be a big issue.
@@ko9446 who uses a torque stick to do those though?
@@pjbth Probably anyone who works in a busy shop and gets paid book rate....
Pat Booth I don’t use them. Been on the game enough decades to under torque with impact then torque wrench is used. I also send my torque wrench’s in every 6 months for calibration
I’m a long time jet engine mechanic. Everything gets torqued with lubricant. If you lube the lugs you would see a very slight movement while bumping up the torque
rusty bolts don't help to achieve accurate torque readings. I'm about 100 percent sure this bus hasn't had a torque wrench on any part of it in years and nothing fell off.
Rusty studs & dry nuts with no lube can = SNAP OFF studs !
@@hydroy1 Lubed nuts farks with torque readings too I believe.
@@Guillotines_For_Globalists I have never had a problem using Anti seize after cleaning studs with brake clean and a brush & air on my studs at all, and I have cars that are 40/50/60 years old and owned since new, and most still have original studs. ( but I do replace nut's when needed) I still just use a truck 4 way to tighten by hand then check readings with toque wrench. Never more than 5 pounds off.
@@hydroy1 Back in the day we never used torque wrenches either, 1/2" impact surely over torquing everything, never had a failure but that doesn't mean it was done right!!
@@Guillotines_For_Globalists Well, in 50+ years I only lost one wheel & tire and that was because the center of the cast wheel broke, must be doing something right . Just sayin. lol .
At Boeing we had when needed CW and CCW torque wrenches which would be great for checking your torque. There are electronic digital torque setups too but super expensive. On the nose gear 1 1/8" X 12" bolts we used the electronic one preset at 1600ft lbs. We had to only go 200 ft lbs for the family LH bolts then move the duel torque head sockets to the RH side to go 200 there. So it went 200, 400, 600, 800, 1000, 1200, 1400, 1600. Took 2 of us moving the thing back and forth which took forever to torque. If we didn't do it like that one side would bind up.
Im not familiar with the setup but why not just put one wrench on each side and just move the people back and forth to tighten them up? Need more wrenches but could save time. Just move the wrenches from plane to plane.
The motors ran the nuts from the bottom at the same time. We had a reaction socket arm holding the top of the two bolts while torquing.
This was on just one a/p at a time. The head assembly with the motors and huge deep sockets were attached to what we called a pogo. An pneumatic 4ft cylinder that would easily raise and lower the torquing head assembly. The pain was moving the whole thing from one side of the gear to the other. We had a 2nd unit but only one pogo. 747 was tight on money back then and now shutting down in 2 years so nobody wanted to spend the money
left vs right hand lugnut thread . . . I learned that lesson the expensive way 40+years ago, to this day I still check 3-4 times before even starting to undo a lugnut . . .
Finally, a torque stick for my Sherman tank.
Working in a shop, I found for me that torque sticks work better with pneumatic impact wrench. I use the cordless impact for removal and the use the pneumatic impact wrench with the torque stick for installation followed by torque wrench for verification.
Was always told by a very wise old man to clean lug threads with a thread die then wire brush threads clean then hit with compressed air and lube the studs properly ( I use anti seize ) before installing lug nuts back on the studs every time the nuts were removed. It will give better reading of toque plus add life to threads on lug studs.
Anti-sieze is a lubricant. If you put any lubricant on a bolt thread you have to reduce your torque setting 30%.
@@Bread996 Been lubing lug threads for many decades , never ever had to replace a lug stud with lube on them plus threads look perfect forever. I clean the stud & nuts in solvent & chase threads with a die and re lube them every time I pull a wheel plus it grantees correct torque of nut's every time. Never had one work loose with fresh lube on the studs or because of lube but see many studs lock up & snap off because of lack of fresh or no lubrication on threads!. They even sell a special water proof grease for salt water boat trailer studs !
@@Bread996 I tighten by hand with truck 4 way and check with toque wrench. never off more than 5 pounds.
Might not be a good review for the torque stick but great demonstration of the milwaukee impact gun 👍🏻 very impressed with even the small 3/8 impact gun and electric ratchet for cars and bikes. Absolute time saver
I’m not a mechanic but I remember reverse threads on push bike pedals as “Back off, front on” as the directions to turn on that side of the bike.
Torque sticks are engineered to work with pnematic impacts not electric. But you are using a one key milwaukee impact. Download the app and program the settings on the impact. So that it stops close to desired Torque on what ever setting you want.
That is a great idea, hope @busgreasemonkey sees this....
Bingo!!!
Use the torque wrench the impact torque will vary depending on the charge and condition of the batteries.
It's a pretty easy answer actually. Your continuously hammering once the lug nut has bottomed out on the stud. Your own high torque readings confirm this. As Soon as it stops, you stop!!
I'm pretty sure on the Milwaukee impacts the 4 settings only affect the torque in the forward direction. Reverse is always wide open.
Torque sticks are not very accurate, but it really doesn't matter all that much. I mean 99% of all tire shops I've ever been in take a 1" drive impact and lean on the nuts until they can't turn any more. I've very rarely ever seen a stud break or strip from over torque. The biggest issue IMO is rust and crud under the rim or under the brake drum. You tighten over the crud, then it rattles out on the road and now the lugs are loose.
In my driving time I saw lots of broken studs with the nut still on them. Overtightened by tyre fitters.
That just makes me want a Milwaukee all the more.
I've never trusted those torque sticks, and after watching your video I still don't. For my vehicles I will continue using an old fashioned torque wrench....
NickBeek I use several on my cars. The 80, 100, and 150 ft-lbs are pretty accurate.
clean the rust off first, and braking something loos to get it moving is way different then when it is moving.
I Use those with air impact at 100 psi air consumption.triger full pres Only to loosen nut. One direction only. Great video.
Sorry only to torque nut.
When you torque down head bolts for example you have to use ARP “”Ultra Torque” fastener assembly lubricant on both sides of the washer. You are not getting an accurate measurement without the bolts and wheel suds being lubed. You would need to lubricate the threads and face of the bolt.
ARP gives you a different spec when using it
Budd wheel lug nuts are supposed to be installed dry.
LMAO. Keep hyping that product without reading the directions, mate.
Wheel lugs are meant to be torqued dry. If you lube them they will be over torqued.
I have a torque stick extension. A dealership I use to work at required them. It's supposed to be 90 ft. Lbs and my Dewalt impact would usually end up around 175 ft. Lbs. If I used it.
We have a big torque wrench at work just for tire changing. 600 + lbs.
Lot of 10x20 tubes on Dayton rims.
It's fun having a flat in the middle of nowhere USA call a tire shop ask them if they have a 10x20 tube, just to have them ask."Whats that"
Something to make note of, is when is the last time you had your Torque Wrench Calibrated? I personally like the torsion torque wrenches. They don't go out of accuracy as easy. But they are very expensive.
Hindsight being 20-20, a less labor intensive way might be to: 1) loosen 4 nuts. 2) tighten them with the torque wrench to 425,450,475 and 500. 3) with the impact wrench set at "1" using the "torque stick" see which ones (if any) tighten further. 4) Repeat with impact wrench set at "2" then "3" etc.. Perhaps put some paper masking tape on the end of the socket, then make a line on it with a 'Sharipe" and mark a corrosponding "witness" line on the wheel. If you really want to ger anal, repeat the test with the battery in the impact wrench 2/3 drained.
Considering the breakaway torque in that you could loosen it with slightly more torque than the bar was rated for means that it is probably within its calibration. actually it's likely your torque wrench is going to be further off than one of those torsion bars. Pay particular attention to the stated range of the torsion bar.
Ive never trusted them sticks.i just use my torque wrench and go by feel.
i torque mine to about three grunts
I'am at a complete loss with that tools purpose, I feel keeping it simple is the only way to get the job done. Put a torque wrench to it and call it quits. 👍
i've been using torque sticks since the early 90's, and have never had any problems. you do have to use a properly-matched pneumatic impact gun, electric guns hit more rapidly and won't work. also, due to the way a torque stick is induction hardened they can only be used in a clockwise direction so you can't use them on backwards lug nuts and bolts.
Well you've adequately demonstrated that my brother's opinion of torque sticks is correct - they are only of use as drifts or ballast.
I remember when those "torque sticks" started showing up in the tool catalogs back in the late 80s, I think they were targeted to the automotive shops. We never used them in the heavy equipment work, I think so many of us "old timers" just didn't trust them. The guys I knew in the dealer shops said they never really worked, actually ended up stripped a lot of wheel studs on customer's cars.
With all that rust, I'm not sure I would trust the veracity of the numbers.
Working at a place that we need to torque wheels on every PMI and when removing wheels i can see why the torque stick would be handy. I also have used a torque stick in past with a 1" gun but we would regulate the air down but it was cumbersome. If anything the Norbar torque wrench i found to be the best i would actually use my foot to press on it to avoid fatigue.
For better accuracy with your torque wrench try to keep both hands at the end of the wrench avoid pushing in the middle of the wrench very interesting video thanks
Try a lower torque stick. 300, 350, 375, 400, 425. I have no idea what's available. Then finish with the torque wrench. My wife's crown Victoria had two sets of wheel rotors warped because the Ford dealer insisted on using torque sticks. From then on we took her car to an independent mechanic who also owned a crown Vic himself and he always used an actual torque wrench and we never had any more issues.
Hey Scott That looks like a 3/4 extension only solid all the way through. It doesn't look like a torque limiting tool. The torque you a getting is what the impact tool is delivering.
this is what tire stores did before torque sticks. they would over tighten with impact wrench then after its to late check it with torque wrench. I would watch this and make them loosen all of them and bring them up to torque with the wrench. the torque sticks work very well.
I would let the tyre fitter go at it with his gun then hand him the factory tools and tell him to loosen them. Never let them do the final tighten.Or check when you get home to verify.
This is what I like about your videos. You are totally honest. And that means everything to me. If that was someone pushing a sponsored tool, it would have miraculously worked flawlessly. Thank you
Like others mentioned breakaway torque on rusty stuff will be higher.
But with that said I always depend on a good torque wrench.
Funny every time i increase the torque wrench it turns before clicking when i dial up the wrench.
Set the torque wrench 10 pounds higher than stick, use the wrench on stick to see which one clicks first wrench or stick.
hello scott and kelly first of all i do apolize for being late watching your videos and commenting on them it's been a very odd and hectic time for me during these hard times so i've gotten behide abit and i really enjoyed watching you scott using your new 475 ft lb torque stick on your son tylers bus Larry" i noticed that it wasn't doing what you thought it would do on a certain setting of torque not sure if i got that right but great video so thankyou very much and until next video that i already have i say so long for now from Randy.from ontario.canada p.s take care and stay safe out there .
I hate milwaukee tools for screwing me on my v18 batteries. But I`m quite amazed that your impact has so much power.
Throw the stick in the trash. 40 years of steam and gas turbine work we could never get the sticks to work.
The reason why they didn’t work is that someone used the stick to remove a nut. They are not designed to remove nuts. Remember they provide torque one way. If you use it to remove nuts then the metal molecules get all out of phase in the stick marking them become useless.
When is the las time your torque wrench was calibrated? Keep them comming.
I had to do the same for some suspension parts. Come to find out, torque wrench was way off. 4’ 3/4” torque wrench
@@codycall6513 Kind of old school but I ALWAYS check settings with any clicker wrench with my old school bent wire wrench ! Sure , it might be 10 pounds off ( max ) , but no way is it ever MORE then 10 pounds off ! I never did fully trust any clicker wrench 100%
I've seen those torque sticks used in tyre shops. I don't understand just what they are supposed to do or how they limit torque when using an impact with 150 pounds of air on them. Do they break off or something?
Remember how an impact works, it hammers the socket/fastener around, its not a continuous rotational torque. Each hammer impact can only rotate the faster a tiny fraction.
How the torque sticks are supposed to work is the shafts are specially designed so that above a certain torque, the shaft just flexes/twists rather than rotating the socket, I between impacts the shaft flexes back.
Personally I've always suspected they are junk, and impact wrench can never torque anything accurately, too many variables at play and no constants.
torque sticks are a wonderful invention.
Keep in mind static friction is significant. If you stop with the torque wrench at 475, how high do you have to go to make it move again? But yeah, obviously over-torqueing them.
Buy the torque stick set. Test them against your torque wrench with the impact gun you will be using. Write the tested, verified measurement on each stick with sharpie.
With a battery operated impact it will never be perfect. But we’re talking wheel nuts here so it’s really not that critical if you’re +/- 10%. The time and effort savings is worth it when you have a crap ton of lugs to bust loose.
Plus or minus 10% your good to go.
I HAVE A QUESTION. CAN THOSE BUSES BE CONVERTED TO ALL RIGHT HAND THREAD STUDS.
That feeling when your tyre shop uses torque sticks and you can't open your wheel nuts at home even with a 3 foot long extension.
The reason why they didn’t work is that someone used the stick to remove a nut. They are not designed to remove nuts. Remember they provide torque one way. If you use it to remove nuts then the metal molecules get all out of phase in the stick marking them become useless.
Again the manufacturer says “claims” it works on left and right hand thread both. Listed on ad used in link
Good video but sound was very quiet at bits . Don't know if it was the way Kelly was holding it
I was told that you only run the torque stick up until it vibrates. Any more than that will over torque the nuts.
I have two concerns. First, I know torque sticks work, but I know nothing about their tolerances, forward or reverse. My other concern is the accuracy of the scale on the torque wrench. Do they go out of tolerance with age, use, or improper storage? I was taught to store my torque wrenches with the springs completely loose. But, I have cheap tools for nothing more than goofing off in the back yard. I'm not a mechanic by any means. Any thoughts or discussion would be great for my sake.
I was also taught to back off a torque wrench when not in use. I’ve never had mine calibrated, probably should
@@jerrykorman7770 That's the way I was taught. Back it off to "ZERO" when not in use.
Incorrect! You always keep some tension on the Spring. Leave your torque wrench on the lowest setting leaving some tension. Backing your torque wrench off to 0 is a great way to lose accuracy. That's your midas tip of the week. 😎
That must be a German Toque gun GOOD AND TIGHT
Does your Fuel impact gun have the bluetooth settable torque?
I have the half inch non bluetooth settable version, and I can't get torque sticks to work worth a shit either It might work with an air gun, but on electric, hard no.
Did you want to test breakaway in tighten, or in loosen? I think that you were just going tighter and tighter.
Here in the UK, all (good) tyre shops use a torque wrench to finish off the wheel nuts/bolts. That probably says something, as if those sticks were any good, everyone would be using them.
They're not very common in the United States either. Some shops have them but they're probably about as accurate as the monkey using them
On semis run them on with a 3/4 gun until they quit turning , then they’re torqued
Scott,
The torque stick tended to overtorque most when you were holding your right hand well down the length of the stick. Is it possible that the flexing action of the torque stick was dampered by your hand?
Bob Beal doubt it. It is rotational, torsion. A human hand on the end would not affect that, even if it tried
Do you think that setting 2 would of given a more accurate torque? Setting 3 hammers way faster than 1 inch air impacts
would be handy on a roadside change where its not safe to be . Then crack out the torque wrench which is always on my bus
which of the 4 settings was the gun set at?
Setting 3 and 4 are the same torque, but 4 is the safety setting
Don't hang on to the stick. It changes the physics of the torque transfer.
It moved slightly at 525 which mean yes probably 500 does move that much at that high of torque obviously.
I wonder if those were intended to be used with a ratchet? That would make more sense on the flex part.It looks like its nothing more than a high visibility extension.
The reason they dont work the way they should is because if you read the directions they're designed to be used with a very strict input on the gun. The monster guns we have today are way out of the range of what they were designed for when calibrated
So many variables between rusty nuts, dirty threads and type of impact. I doubt that stick will be very repeatable in it's results. Best thing is get it close like you figured out then finish it with the torque wrench. Even that won't be exact though just because of earlier reasons. 2 things you want to always remember to keep you working longer. Use your weight to help move things, always push if possible not pull your back and joints will thank you!! Also don't use your hand as a hammer!! Sing that to yourself every time you think of doing it. I know many people that have had to have surgery on their hands because of nerve damage. Work safe, work longer. Sorry not trying to lecture just speaking from my own stupid habits! Good luck!
Perhaps Ultra-Torque, will give consistent results.
I will have to try that
Man I always turn my impact guns power down half way when I use torque sticks and every time I have tested it it's only ever been like 5 or 6 pounds over even on rusted studs and that's not gonna break anything or stop someone from changing a flat so I'm ok with torque sticks as long as you turn the power down
I went through this at home. You can’t keep running it for more the. Half a second on high power because it will over tighten. I could see the stick kind of bouncing around and you kept going causing it to over tighten
The stick is designed to not go over. Doesn’t explain 3/4 power or 1/4 power
Torque sticks are difficult to use properly. They are only meant to go one direction. Not both directions. And extending the impact time will not give you an accurate torque. Even though it seems that the torque value in the spring steel should remain the same. I've been using them in the automotive industry for years and limit my torque time to just a few seconds. You will have to get used to your torque time to get an accurate torque limit. All of best from Canada@@BusGreaseMonkey
The ad says works both directions
@@BusGreaseMonkey They may have upgraded that make. Good Stuff
Except not good stuff, it didn’t work.
When was the last time you calibrated your torque wrench?
It moved at 525 lbs! However, I'm not sure if treating the impact like a hammer drill might be increasing the torque a few pounds over the required torque or not!
By chance does anyone remember what episode he used the torque multiplier in? Like to see that again.
The nut actually moves at both 500 and 525, but it was so small you missed it.
Basic physics says that Torque goes in, Torque MUST go out! Torque Sticks are a FRAUD! As an aircraft mechanic, I ALWAYS use a Torque Wrench - on Planes, my motorcycles and my vehicles. And if anyone else uses one, I MAKE them redo it with a Torque Wrench!
I think that the stick needs to be matched to the impact, but they won't tell you that because they want to sell them.
And keep shareholders happy
I firmly believe that,
if my nuts were torqued to a wheel,
with 500 lbs of force;
I would be unable to move also.
You need to mark the nut and wheel, then compare where they end up, to eliminate breakaway torque.
Torque sticks were never meant to be super accurate, they are to get you consistently close, then final torque with the torque wrench.
Think of them as a torque limiter, not a torque setter.
Correct. This comment needs to be PINNED!
Put a drop of oil on the female end of that extension......It just might go on that Milwaukee a little easier. Just a thought ........
The audio was driving me nuts up and down up and down up and down.
The impact gun somehow dies that
Milwaukee for the win
Well scott left handed nuts are tightened with the left hand lol I know dad used to ride me on it all the time with the nash rambler and his jeep
Torque sticks should only be used with air tools. The electric impacts don't let the stick flex like it should
Those torque sticks will beat the impact to death if you use it alot for tightening wheels.
will be nice to have an air impact because you can run a compressor now :)
Those Milwaukee electric impact guns are more powerful than a lot of air impact guns.
@@BRED510 sure true but not all impacts are created equal, took me a while before i got a decent one, but when i did? it was *nothing* like the cheapo i had been using, same goes for my air hammer not even close.
@@fixt100 very true, but those Milwaukee's aren't cheap, lol.
@@BRED510 honestly i would be surprised if he *didnt* have air tools for his home shop, at least partially anyways.
You seem to forget that there is something called 'Friction' which you are leaving out of the equation. Also, as someone else has mentioned there is moving torque and breakaway torque. I would humbly suggest you lubricate the thread and mating surface of the nut and wheel and try it properly. JR
I have used complete sets of torque sticks, all with lubed lug nuts. Not very accurate as far as I have seen. I always have used torque wrench for the final tightening.
You missed a critical step! What you should have done was tighten the nut with the Torque Stick, put a mark on the nut and wheel to mark nut location and back nut off a half turn or so, THEN tighten to 475 with the torque wrench and see where the mark is. Just trying to go tighter like you were doing does not account for the initial breakaway torque required.
Torque Sticks?!? Haaa? How sbould this work accurate? Even with the wrench you have to use it correclty. Sticking friction vs running friction vs how strong is the impact driver vs lubrication yes/no... but i like the way of just give it a try and see if it works! 🤘
They are not made to have perfect torque ratings. They get all of the lugs pretty damn close to each other which is more important. If you have lugs that call for 100ft.lbs and you torque them all to 105ft.lbs because your wrench is off then so be it. That's good. But if they range between 85ft.lbs and 150ft.lbs that's bad. I Typically use the torque stick to get my lugs to 80ft.lbs then drop the vehicle back on the ground and torque them up to 110ft.lbs with my wrench.
You should try the gun on setting 2 without the torque stick. I would bet the result would be exactly the same. I have never trusted the torque sticks to not over torque everything. I have found my car wheel lug nuts over torqued nearly every time when they have returned from the tire shop. I worked on aircraft in the the U.S. Air Force for 22 years, they never allowed them to be used on aircraft for the same reason.
I did in the video and it turned it further
That thing would be scrap metal if it was mine. Someone used one on my truck one time and my lug nuts came loose.
We used a pneumatic air gun in the shop. Had to send it out every year to get tested.
Pneumatic torque gun I meant
Seems to me that the electric impact to get up to any given torque has to actually hit harder than what you want so that you are using the impact wrench too long and forcing the torque higher. Once the nut stops moving readily you should stop!
I know this is a crazy old thread, but, you didnt buy a torque stick you bought AN EXTENSION for a torque stick. That is a fixed piece of steel with no mechanism to limit how much torque you apply.
Scott, you should put some wd40 or some things on the studs & lug nuts, don't do it dry!
Using penetrating lubricants on lugs can cause the bolts to break under pressure.