I just want to say your inclusion of Starter/Structure Deck concepts for Goat and Edison format is BRILLIANT. I've been really harping on this point (and others you made here) in my own videos and even when I get the chance to speak with Konami reps. I think there are a lot of really great player onboarding and retention tactics being left on the table here, and while I know not every solution is practical or possible for Konami (and that they likely have at least considered these and other methods), there's never any harm in talking about it anyway. Great video as always! 👍🏾
the Time Wizard Structures can be really cool, and I can see them also not being all 3~2-ofs like he showed in the video, being 1-ofs in this card will mean that you get more options when building your deck, and it will use more reprinted of relevant cards to each strategy that are maybe less popular, but can still see play
Although a great idea, I think that it would be better to introduce some sort of official ruling / tiers to the game and restrictiosn based on them. Let's say I wanna play Sky Strikers, well, I can't in Goat or Edison. Maybe allow rouge decks access to powerful staples, and restrict them so tier 0 decks can't use them, and balance how many staples a deck can use depending on their tier. But hey, it's just my opinion.
I think instead of trying to teach the entire game at once people need to take steps. A good two player starter would've had you play with no extra deck then maybe add sycho for game 2 ect.
Yugioh is just boring, unnecessarily complex, long turns where you are just watching your opponent winning by doing a long and unnecessarily complex combo, total lack of collectionability, and very bad looking cards, you should have bad taste in order to play yugioh
I like cardgames. I played yugioh as a kid, had I think, iirc, what id now call a draw based tempo dec based around resummoning des lacooda into a few different attacking life points directly cards that opponents had to deal with while I stayed ahead in the value game. I have been looking for new games to play, moving away from mtg. IN MY PERSONAL PERCEPTION FROM CHECKING IT OUT AS A CARDGAME, THROUGH SOCIAL MEDIA, AS A CARDGAME PLAYER :Yugioh seems to repeat a lot of hasbros corporate mtg issues, have weird art (massivly varying quality with a lot of horny cards I wouldnt want to play because of how they look), be harder and more confusing generally, similarly expensive, if anything more bigoted as a community especially to women which turns me off personally, more stringent deckbuilding with less customisaton and more "pick your choice of supported archetypes" and worse online. And, worst of all, has the public persona of being Cringe. In the end I went for Sorcery Contested Realm, despite it having only official tabletop simulator online support, because it was cheap, customisable and interesting with complexity that produced a fun and different play experience, rather than just a ton of card text.
The biggest problem with Yu-Gi-Oh is that Konami, the company that oversee's the product, are notorious for completely ignoring all feedback from non-Japanese players. Konami priorities success in Japan over international success. Yu-Gi-Oh is the 2nd largest card game in Japan after Pokemon, it is doing well in Japan, but its not doing well internationally, and Konami doesn't seem to care.
TCG is so mismanaged by Konami compared to the OCG: + Worse price, products, quality control, merch, product schedule, reveals, community interaction and presentation + The text format is worse. Even in Master Duel where the latest update gave OCG newest format for old cards (Add numbering, "Select" becomes "Target", etc), TCG only got ✨line break✨. They didn't even fix the problem about cards lying to players because of mistranslation + Doesn't do stuff beyond DM stuff + Doesn't have a database for rulings + Doesn't have a lot of the cool stuff OCG has There are probably more but those are what I can think off the top of my head.
At this point, Konami SHOULD care about the TCG. + One key detail to note is that compared to Japan, the West lacks any competition with the Trading Card Industry (Only Magic and Pokémon). Fast forward to 2024 and now there's more competition in the West (Lorcana, One Piece, Flesh and Blood, Digimon), and it looks like they're doing well. + Additionally, these games are using these tough times to their advantage as they open barriers for play. Take Pokémon for example. For those that may have not known, due to inflation, Pokémon has made pulling rare and powerful cards more common than before. Because of that tactic, it gives players the chance to get into the game; most players wanting to go for a casual experience while holding some powerful staples.
The way I see it... Japanese (game) companies give zero f..ks about its international customer base, to the point that it's overly nationalistic at best... grossly racist at worst. One of the things I noticed more and more about Japanese people (particularly men) is that they are very racist and hate anything that isn't Japanese, no matter how much the rest of the world embraces them. How I see it, if Konami wants to shoot itself in the foot, then let them. The people in that company will soon learn how stupid they are at economics and financing.
Old school yugioh in reality : tribute of the doomed hitting 50/50 spear cretin or sangan and lose to deck out because you cant resolve your monster removal with 3 judgment and jammer in the back row.
Old Yu-Gi-Oh: Pay 1000 lp, steal one monster for 1 turn. Modern Yu-Gi-Oh: -the longest book ever written to say "No, youre not allowed to play the game"-
lol they made tenpai and facing it I'm just like why does this even exist... So you auto win and I can't respond during battle phase??? Why is yugiohs new goal to force people to not play yugioh
Joined a tournament last Friday and Sunday...I only joined the old school format,we already finished our matches while the modern bandwagon kids sitting there yawning listening with other kids xys,tuner,synchro,link, pendulum noble 😆...
Attempted new player here, one of the biggest things that put me off the game were the players, some not all and again region based, both local shops of mine just had very sweaty competitive players who didn't wanna take a break from player at lightning speed and when i tried to slow down and read the cards i have to understand them they wouuld visibly get pissed (this was a casual non tourny game) Again keep in mind this is just my case never really tried the game again
That's 100% correct. I was long time Yugioh player up until the early pendulum era. When I tried to return to the game some time ago I had to stop and read practically every single card my opponents were playing. This visibly upset people and many were very rude about it. I believe this might have something to do with time rules and how long games take. You also don't have the option of just trusting your opponent to play their cards correctly either as trying to get away with cheating has become increasingly common in the Yugioh community. The problem isn't just Konami, it's the players.
Wow, Konami hates their consumers? I wonder who could've told you that: -Metal Gear fans -Contra fans -Castlevania fans -Silent Hill fans -Suikoden fans -Zone of the Enders fans -Rocket Knight Adventures fans -All Hudson-Soft fans with the exception of Bomberman. They do this to all of their fandoms, and it's crazy how ignorant Yugioh players are to Konami's business practices. I mean they got into pachinko AFTER Japan's harsh regulations on the game, which is when companies like SNK pulled out of the market. If they can do something predatory, they will. And that's why I will literally only play Edison unless the box structure changes to make decks as affordable as the Pokemon TCG, with the limit being $200 for a minimum rarity deck.
Pokemon is as cheap as it is mainly because it has a much larger casual playerbase than its own competitive player base. It mostly consists of people buying quantities of specific cards solely because they feature their favorite characters and Pokemon. It also helps that Pokemon is the most successful IP on the planet. YGO isn't and has never been anywhere near as popular as Pokemon. In fact, the TCG is essentially the complete opposite of Pokemon. It has a competitive playerbase that is louder than its casual playerbase. Also, unlike Pokemon, the TCG barely has a collector's market, and demand for specific cards and decks is heavily influenced by talking heads and the market culture within its own community. Copying the OCG rarity distribution wouldn't really solve anything. Because of these factors, YGO becoming as affordable as Pokemon is impossible.
@@Simply_Taido Despite all of that, Konami can do things to make the game more appealing. But it just isn't doing that and considering what chaoticmeatball said, it's just not a surprise at all. Konami is THE GREEDIEST company I know of, and there's a huge list of it around. Hell, I think one of the reasons why a starting point are grey area simulators is because of Konami's greed. There's just no way to get around that. As a certain someone has said many times before: FucKonami.
Magic, meanwhile, has various play formats for the mechanics and sets. Modern uses the most recent sets, and often thw power cards get phased out. Commander, meanwhile, allows the entire history outside of silver bordered and acorn tagged of the cards to be used. While yes, theres metas, theres still the aspect that youre free to do Whatever. Set rotation helps
I'm a new player and while the basic rules for the game aren't complicated, the cards have so much text that I literally have no idea what my opponent is doing or what the choke points are to stop their combos. The learning curve feels really high. I'm still having fun with the game though
As a rule of thumb, the normal summon tends to be a choke point. So, if you don't know what you're facing, dunk on the normal summon, they only have 1 of those after all. The first thing summoned from the Extra Deck can also be a big choke point since they're usually a key extender (think of stuff like junk speeder but a bit less extreme).
Yeah that's my problem, I like master duel but everyone else goes so fast and its hard for me to read all my opponenents stuff so I don't like irl play
@@Cstan55157 Master Duel makes playing so much easier. All the QOLs, being automatic, having mods like Readable Card Effects mod, etc. I honestly can't see how I would be able to play IRL.
Most people dont bother trying to figure out what their opponent’s cards do. Unless they see it more than once. This is why the meme of ygo players not reading is a thing. But you understand why
@acasualgameryt6978 IRL you have 45 minutes for a best of 3, and it's okay if you don't play all three games, especially at locals. Ask your opponent what each card does, or ask to read every card. If they're a decent person (most are) they'll understand that you're new and you don't know what the cards do. I've been playing sporadically for years, I always ask everyone at my locals what all their cards do, even if I think I know. If you want to be the best player you have to learn what all the cards you're playing against do, but most people aren't the best player. If you play against the same cards enough times, or you go home and try out the deck for yourself on a simulator like EDOPRO or Nexus, you can quite quickly learn how other decks work. Learning how other decks work is a skill in and of itself, but again, you can just ask. I normally play rogue decks so basically every card I play people ask for the effect or to read it.
In OCG, you can lay down a card on the field, activate it's effect and summon your boss monsters with just $20. In TCG, it costs $500 dollars just to lay down a single card, and apparently get negated.
Buying 3 structure decks is nowhere near enough to compete with other players. I went to a local tournament with a 3 structure deck combined deck and I got beat so badly. The players there kept telling me I need to buy all these expensive cards to be able to keep up with them and make my own deck.
I haven't played the game since Synchro's were the main thing and even back then the game was getting ridiculous with needing the newest and most expensive cards if you wanna remain competitive. This was well over a decade ago and the power creep has only gotten more worse since then! If I ever play now its classic rulea and only for enjoyment.
for entry the SD's work. 30 bucks is fair. specially when most docus on only 1 ed mechanic. They are competent at teaching the bread and butter plays of the deck.
@@mrbubbles6468structure decks are NOT competitively viable. They can teach basic rules and that's it. Great if they work for your personal group, not for actual playing in game shops or tournaments.
Meanwhile, in Pokemon: you can build a Tier 1 Tournament Ready meta deck for more or less 50/60$ and participate in dozens of major tournaments with cash prizes. The very few times i happen to see a Yugioh player irl i can't not think "Why? Why in hell would you do this to yourself?"
Meanwhile in Magic, by format: Commander; Usually 600-1000 for a comp deck. I run a mono-red turbo burn thats cheaper than most and it still hits 500$ Pauper: The cheapest format with only Commons: 80-150$. Will likely stay relevant unless several cards are on the ban radar. Standard: Oh boy. Rotating format. Rakdos Scam costs 1500$ to build, but RDW can get the job done for about 60$ Modern: Now we're breaking into 2000$ decks. Legacy: This is only for the whales among whales and decks break 10000$. Only OG and colelctors will play this format.
@@nunyabusiness3957Wait what!? I have not played MTG in about 10 years. All the way back in 07/08 you could dominate the nationals with less than 100€/$/. Is it really that bad nowerdays?
@@nunyabusiness3957 commander is mostly casual format anyway, it’s the most popular mtg format and commander is by far the lowest barrier to entry for new players. In casual play you talking anywhere from $50 to $200 decks
As someone who used to play religiously around 2012ish I dropped off hard after pendulums where released and completely quit with link. I've tried a few times to get back into the game but things have just gotten so over the top convoluted that it's hard for me to jump back in.
I introduced Yugioh to some friends when Master Duel came out. We had fun casually building weird decks with the massive backlog of cards. It was when they tried playing in ranked that they lost interest. They repeatedly told me how annoying it was getting Ash Blossom'd or seeing their opponent build up a huge board with omni-negates on turn 1. It's easy as someone that's played for years to tell them to just 'get good' or learn to bait that stuff out and have back-up plans, but I wonder if the power creep has just become too much for new players. Sure, there are people that probably started last week that love the current game, there's always exceptions after all, but I'm worried that power creep has just made the game too much for the average person. Of course, casuals with friends will always be fun, but you can say that about any game. IDK, I just know I buy more statues and figures based on Yugioh than actual booster packs at this point.
I would also like to add, that even people casually teaching friends doesn't always work out as well as some people think, and not just because it's a complicated game, I've seen people trying to teach someone new BEING the ladder in this scenario. They were, for whatever reason, incapable of throttling down a little to not beat a newbie that didn't know what they were doing into the ground. Repeatedly. It's not a welcoming environment. Heck, I've seen people say that was a good thing and encourage it... Which is... Honestly, if you CAN'T slow down, that's one thing. But if you're ENCOURAGING people to play so hard a newbie that doesn't know what they're doing can barely play a card, that's just toxic. And I talk about this from experience. It's not fun, it doesn't feel good from either side, and it actively drives people away from the game.
The pro players are the main playerbase and so new players quit cause they get bodied by the newest and fastest version of the special summon swarm tactic Its not really fun for them to deal with, you guys might see that as a regular tuesday but for a normal guy That's overwhelming.
This is beyond true, even with me being there to guide them. Get them to understand their deck and every combo. I taught one friend who wanted to use Mekk-Knights Another like a classic Weeb. Dragon maids. While Ash is common and they used it too. No joke. I'm watching my friend after doing solo and dueling me in friend duels. Go in, and first game in Rookie. Branded Bestials. He immediately quit. Overall. I'm not saying these cards need to be banned. Frankly I don't know how to fix the issue. I just know. People won't like picking up a game, and then seeing a full bored of negates or just getting cards ripped from hand on turn one.
@@devideby_zero8596 My advice: Teaching should ALWAYS be starting with mid low power mid range decks If you'd describe it as combo, it's probably bad deck to start with If it's running off floodgates, it's probably a bad deck to start with Also, if it's Pendulums, it's probably a bad deck to start with, because Pendulums are the most complicated mechanic Those are my three rules for teaching someone It also helps to find them a deck they like or at least thinks has cool art for them to try Don't force them into a top of the meta good deck, if you're going to push them towards or away from any decks, I would only suggest advising against completely unusable and nonfunctional garbage, like Guardians (Not Gate Guardian, Guardians)
@@baxterbruce9827Just out of curiosity, what would you suggest for a beginner level dragon(-like) deck for someone who considers more than like 3 summons per turn as board spamming and loses interest?
Old cards: "Draw 2 Cards" (banned) New Cards: "your opponent can't do shit, you can Special summon 100 Monsters from your extra Deck, your opponent can't activate any effects, can not be the target of effects, can not get destroyed by card effects, instead of sending this Card to the graveyard, remove 3 Cards from your graveyard and return this shit to the field. Your opponent Skips their next Draw Phase. Your opponent can not activate Magic or Trap Cards unless they Control 3 Tuner Monsters with combined Level of 6 or higher. If this card was special summoned, destroy it at the end of your opponents next draw phase, your opponent looses the game unless they remove three Cards from their graveyard. You can search your deck for any copies of x and add them to your hand"
Even if every meta deck cost 10$, that won't stop Yugiboomer and casuals from complaining and refusing to learn anything. This is gas lighting at best. I could care less about the opinions on casuals say. Casuals are the reason I left many communities
@@soukenmarufwt5224 What the Hell are you even on about? A game should never be pay to win. It has nothing to do with being "casual". Also, learn what gaslighting means before using using a word you don't understand.
The only problem with Pokémon is that it kinda gets stale and boring when you play standard overtime. Pokémon doesn’t really have much interesting interaction like yugioh does unless you play expanded format which is mostly supported online and not in locals.
@@yandoeseverything370 the thing that carries pokemon is definitely prizing, community, and events. tcg itself can get stale quickly so it's not something you want to be playing 24/7 unless your goal is to top every event, but it's still fun enough to pop back into every set release and cook up some new decks. cards being super affordable allows for that.
Before I quit I kept 2 decks for my friends in case they wanna play casually and fun Game not fun for me and it starts to drain me mentally and physically
Feel you. We got a local card shop that only accepts the goat format to be playing. His sales increased dramatically and new people peeked out just to see and some get hooked
New player here. Why the hell are the structure decks only giving people 1 or 2 copies of cards and not just making a single structure deck with everything you need? $30 doesn’t sound like a lot to old players but by comparison other card games have structure decks that include everything you need for less that $20. There’s missing value
Because they could get away with it back when Yugioh was popular and only had Magic the Gathering as it's main competitor. With all of these other card games now coming into the fold with actual value and not ripping off the consumer it becomes even more apparent.
It's been a thing in Yu-Gi-Oh for ages even the digital games do this with Duel links and Master duel decks needing to be bought 3 times to work properly. It's only so they can make you buy more
Digimon does it too. Honestly all these Japanese companies are out of touch, but weebs enjoy being milked. I love Digimon card game, but I'll never pay for it. I'll keep playing the simulator made by fans, and if I wanted to get physical cards I'd print proxies. All these TCG collecting games are gambling scam. There's no way around it. Structure decks will never sell you a complete deck, literally every guide will tell you to buy 2-3 copies which is ridiculous. It's intentional.
corporate greed. once they know you will buy once they know you will want more. they split it up with some good cards at ridiculous price. word of advice, get out while you can
And not only that players using only 3-5 same decks which are current meta, so every time you play you are against the top 5 strongest decks in the game ! Just for the sake of the old days I played tag force 1 few days ago and it was so fun to play, back then yu gi oh was amazing all the way to tag force 6 Yu gi oh back then was totally different game, it was actually playable
No new player wants to deal with the essays worth of text on each card, prices, and the fact that the game ends as soon as it starts due to the power creep.
My opponent kept summoning monsters who all had two paragraphs and he wouldn't even let me read lol. The game is decided turn 1. Yugioh would have never made it past season 1 if it was like it is now
Yu-Gi-Oh has completely been dropped by 4 out of the 5 shops near me. It's a dying game in my region sure a shop has people who play but the stock on the shelves if there is any is a year out of date. It's just too fast and one sided for people to play and pay hundreds to play for half a turn and they you die or brick. They did this to themselves.
They recently introduced YGO into the game shop nearby me with EXTREMELY cheap structure decks but events are barely a thing due to aforementioned powercreep. I think in Poland MTG has a massive advantage over other TCG due to costless shipping of cards, while all other TCG has to rely on shady auction sites (and it's extremely hard to recognize fakes at times) or Cardmarket which has absurd shipping costs for Polish realities and inability to ship into those shipping boxes you use code on and we cal InPost.
@@friendlyneighbourhoodsunwheel Oh people still love collecting and buying cards over here, the game just isnt as popular but still really popular in sales
And the game itself is constantly getting more convoluted and confusing from set to set No, seriously, 2017 Yugioh feels like Duel Monsters in terms of complexity compared to now
It power levels new people out “Git good” turns into “get gone” Theres a massive problem with the game itself as we are at the point its a complicated way to play coin flip
@@vala32Mass Effect Legendary edition was on sale for $6 this summer. Is it perfect? No. Is sniping geth troopers more fun than watching someone else play weeb solitaire? Yes.
As someone that played YuGiOh throughout my teens I have really tried to get back into it now that I'm in my 30s but it just doesn't stick. Having so many detailed card-specific mechanics & the tiniest text known to man kind makes it too difficult even for someone that has a background and understanding of the rules. Somehow Magic has been able to introduce new concepts & stay fresh without turning every card into an encyclopedia. Maybe take a page from their book...?
I am a disgruntled, former Magic player. My lesson learned: It makes no sense to fall in love with something that won't love you back and will only be used to extract money from you. YGO has a reputation for being especially egregious in this regard, but personally I would not get into any TCG at all anymore. This hobby is a waste of passion.
@@MrCmon113 In fairness, Magic: The Gathering was supposed to be trading cards for D&D players. Then players went insane and started buying packs by the box, and the game was never the same
Literally every hobby works the way you described? You have to buy more and more supplies and the hobby itself doesn't care about you, but its what enjoyment you get out of doing the hobby that makes it worth doing. The only big difference I'd say is that with certain hobbies, like leatherworking, you get physical objects that you can take pride in having made. (But then I can argue that making a really good deck without netdecking produces a similar feeling.) I get not wanting to deal with MtG or YGO as they are actively predatory towards their consumers, but that doesn't mean every TCG is beyond hope. I sold my MtG collection and got into Flesh and Blood and Lorcana. Don't know if I'll be in in them long term, but I'm having fun with them currently, and that's what really matters. If you aren't having fun don't do something, but maybe look into other card games. There are a LOT, including ones that are out of print especially, and a lot are not anywhere near MtG or YGO's league of anti-consumer behavior.
As someone who loved the Duel Monsters anime and cards, Yu-Gi-Oh has become too complicated and expensive. As much as I'd love to get into it for real, it's become extremely overwhelming for someone like me who has been out of the loop for over 8+ years. Why spend hundreds of dollars to get into the physical TCG when I can jump online with Yugi and Kaiba structure decks in Master Duel for free?
If your local scene has an Edison format tournament, I highly recommend trying to get into that; its April 2010 format and banlist and its extremely fun and easy to start
@@lemlem35 I'm actually a big fighting game guy myself, so I attend some locals for those. There's nothing Yu-Gi-Oh around me at all. A little MTG and that's about it.
You are wrong about one thing though Competitive yugioh has always been expansive and a lot of decks have actually become cheaper and the game is more diverse imo It's still very complicated and Idek how I got into it
@@songoku2711I’m a huge fgc fan as well, and I just found out about the “Vanquish Soul” archetype which is a love letter to the genre (especially 3v3 tag games) Maybe you can look into that to try jumping back in
KONAMI FFS PLEASE SUPPORT LEGACY FORMATS PROPERLY I unironically use Edison Blackwings and bulk bin Hasselberry Dinos to teach my friends yugioh and these older formats or even some bulk bin cards are amazing low power tools for teaching modern ygo
As a 20+ year Magic player, it blows my mind to have chase rares that are core components for meta strats be $150. The worst we usually deal with are $20, MAYBE $30 staples and they certainly don't get milked for cash in two or more subsequent releases before FINALLY getting banned. That's wild, yo.
@@olixx1213 I was about to say, maybe in Standard, but all the formats people actually play now this is not true. That or we have different definitions of "staple" cards XD
Konami should really just release Archetype Structure Decks of archetypes which are around for a decade at minimum, and when I say archetypes I mean EVERY SINGLE ONE
Here's the biggest problems with yugioh: - Rulings: This game can get really confusing, like, there are interactions in this that even I get confused on and I've been playing for years. This is largely due to card text and how konami words certain cards. So, if someone who has years of experience playing yugioh can still get confused about certain rulings, it's pretty evident that new players will struggle. - Power creep: Konami really likes introducing cards that break the game and they tend to cost an arm and a leg, be it a new archetype or powerful staple cards. Now, yugioh isn't the only card game with this issue, but it still deters a lot of new players - Prices: These really powerful cards tend to be over most people's budget and causes many players to miss out on certain cards that could help their deck out tremendously. Unfortunately, with the market being as volatile as it is, it's a struggle to get pricey cards even months after release and forces players to wait until the price drops or Konami introduces a new product with reprints of those powerful cards. There are more reasons, but those are the big 3 that are causing people to steer clear from playing yugioh competitively or even casually
The funny thing is... For MTG the cost of decks are 200 to 1000...but that depends on how far back you want to go. Standard being current is always the cheapest. Tho I'll say this you don't need a 500 dollar deck to be competitive in MTG.
If ____ COMMA you can Special Summon this card (from your hand). If ____ COLON You can Special Summon this card from your hand. The fact that there is a difference between them (i.e. which one Solemn Judgment can negate) is enough to scare away new players IMO. I'll be honest, I can't even remember how I learned the difference.
Most Japanese companies just do not give a flying fuck about making good products for western markets. It took Sony and Atlus literally YEARS before they realized that PC gamers were willing to buy their games, but NOT a console just to play that one game. Another example: Lexus failed horribly in Europe, and everyone knows why. You can get a 3 series with petrol engines and diesel engines anywhere between 150 and 510hp, whilst the Lexus ES can only be had with a 213hp non plug in hybrid... That aint what the European luxury buyer wants. And Konami just follows that trend, by not deaming us worthy enough of their OCG products...
I guess Toyota in the US is an exception. I mean, the Camary is a best seller here, and when you advertise your car (plus the Supra) in something as big as NASCAR here, you should be driving great interest to earn those customers.
It makes sense for Sony, since they make consoles and have always ended up being incredibly popular. Xbox hasn't been good IMO since 360, and that ended like 10 years ago, which is why MS put so much into Game Pass, Xbox on PC, and buying studios to even have anything worth playing.
@@Boyzby the console games are developed on PCs. It makes sense for Microsoft, the PC software company, to push for an online service that gives you a catalogue of games, with the option to outright buy them, and to not have to develop a new console every generation.
I had long-time yugioh friends quit to go play Lorcana. I can't even really talk to them about this game anymore. They are completely uninterested. Konami seems to want young blood coming into the fold, but that seems to be almost a complete improbability now. They simply f'd around for too long and found out too late to try to fix it.
Honestly no? Konami does not care in the least about getting new players. They want to milk to community they have and are slowly realizing that the buying community rapidly shrinks...
No they didn't. They did exactly what they wanted. Rush Duels a thing they market now properly to kids. They don't care about not Japanese market because boomers still control the company and didn't know how to pivot. The fuckers tried to end their Yugioh division for more pachinko only for Corona to happen. Unironically Corona saved a lot of hobby stuff. Just look at how they never made any of the actual merch they could easily do based on stuff that exist from this game. How the fuck don't they have Purrley plushies? Secondary merch that average person might buy like videogames, figures, plushies, accessories and so on. You literally have infinite merch opportunity for this damn series and they don't do it. They only started to do stuff for non-anime characters/cards.
Nobody, NOBODY, NOOOOOBODY wants to watch someone play solitaire and win before your allowed to go. The anime stretched it so thin with new mechanics it needs a complete reboot.
"Why Can't Yugioh Get New Players?" Because the reality of the game has almost no relation with people's perception, or conceptualization of the game. Many people probably still think of the game as a slow plodding thing where two players summon monsters of increasing power, occasionally playing a spell or trap, and grinding the opponent down. Then they play a modern game and lose on turn 0.
A PS5 costs like $500 A meta deck costs the same or more The meta deck is going to get hit especially if it is tier zero providing less enjoyment Meanwhile the PS5 can last several years without obsoletion Maybe that's why people don't get into Yugioh as much
@@TheAnthonyC4 It's investment. If you bought Tear for full price before they got hit hoping to win a tournament or two, expect to never play them again in the TCG, unless you're on copium like me and run them with Skull Servant. It's no longer good enough. The PS5, it does have free games (Genshin duh), but also the amount of games you can choose from will only grow. Think of how much a PS3 goes for nowadays, compared to a deck from the same year. It only gets better with age, unlike yugioh. And if you're thinking you'll play Tear once it's unbanned? Dragon Rulers are still at 1.
@@samuelllakaj5439 You're missing the point in that the PS5 literally has no games and even Sony wants to move past it even though it's their fault the console failed.
@@EinSilverRose actually, s:p little knight QCR IS the price of PS5 alone. lol. wait 3-4 months and it will hit rock bottom to less than 100....so it suks for people who bought the card for 700+. i'm waiting but i was also victim to these fluctuations in price...really really discourages players from even bothering buying cards...bad bad bad investment and playing with antisocial nerds is also tormenting. I just buy to collect and appease myself. I dont' play anymore, I do not buy sealed products, and I do not attend any events
So I was a long time mtg player who turned to YGO to try something new a few months ago. After a few months of playing YGO, from a new player’s perspective there’s a few things that make it incredibly offputting for new players. 1. The wordiness and font on every card. It’s incredibly intimidating to do this for your own cards, but once you understand how your deck works it all makes sense. The issue comes in trying to figure out your opponent. Eventually you just kind of give up and nod your head and say “yup” as they play card after card that you have no idea what it means. 2. The price point. Obvious point. I came in around AGOV right before RA01 came out. I was thinking it was a great time to get into it due to being able to get so many staples for cheap. Then it turned into the season of fire. 3. No mulligans feels bad. I completely understand why you can’t mulligan in YGO. But when you’re used to it from most other TCGs, you go to YGO and you’re just kinda stuck with what you drew. Feels terrible. Going second and drawing no hand traps and watching your opponent FC just feels terrible when you have nothing you can do about it. This might be the biggest thing to me. It feels like there’s certain games where there is 0 you can do; you lost the die roll, you lost the game. 4. The power of the cards feels absurd. I’ve described playing YGO to some of my mtg playing friends as “it’s like playing mtg but the only format anyone plays is legacy. And every deck is a different version of storm.” There’s a lot to like about YGO. YGO is an incredibly fluid card game and when you can get going and see different lines you can take and the different steps you can take to get there it’s incredibly satisfying. I love the way the Extra Deck works in YGO. Having a toolbox available at all times is an attractive reason to play this game. Also, the YGO community has been some of the nicest group of nerds I’ve ever met. Definitely willing to show you the ropes and teach you the game. I’d love to see YGO continue to succeed, the more card games/players we have out at our LGS’ the better it is for us all. But after a few months of actively playing YGO I’ve come to the conclusion that I just don’t like it and that’s ok.
the first point is the main one, higher power level has its niche audience, needing to read an essay of card text regardless of how unique the card has no niche that seeks it. yugioh players only don't understand how heavy of an trade off is needed to make essays of card text the better options.
I’ma be real, whatever Wizards of the Coast have done, they seem way better of a company then Konami If Konami wasn’t so money hungry, and gave the TCG players more to work with, and maybe actually release Rush Duels internationally, it would succeed and bring in tons of new players. But let’s be real, Konami’s always gonna be money hungry, and if Yugioh keeps declining, they’ll just drop it entirely in favor of something else. They only care about it because it makes them money, and once it’s sucked dry, they’ll toss it into the trash bin. Only way I can see the game changing for the better, is if the big executives get kicked out and replaced with new ones with fresh new ideas, but otherwise us Yugioh players are screwed.
It’s funny, a lot of people are fed up with WotC for being so money hungry. Where as WotC has more prize support, Konami prices their products way more competitively. Mtg just had a preconstructed deck that is around $450. Absolutely absurd. I wish YGO would get better prize support and some sort of way to play tcg online without having to go to DB or something
Couple of months after this comment and I’ve completely been priced out of YGO. I sold my whole collection and quit. The meta shifts in this game happen too quickly to stay competitive at any kind of a budget.
5:18 The variety in gameplay? Expression of skill? When I play Yugioh, I get OTKed 4 out of 5 games before being allowed to play. By decks that require very little effort save for how much money you spend and how many times you have to spin wheels to get cards out. I haven't played a Yugioh game with variety in gameplay or skill in nearly a decade and a half. It's what turned me to magic, where OTKs and infinite combos exist, but are either just banned or simply so frowned upon, even in casual play, that you can ignore it. Commander is fun for variety, expression and creativity/collection. Yugioh has nothing like that anymore.
Another problem is that yugioh doesn't really have alternative format support so if you want to play your first game of yugioh and you don't already have friends who play the game, congratulations you're getting thrown straight into the deep end of the meta have fun!
I don't think Yugioh is complicated. It is just unfair and unbalanced. . I think TCG keeps 1-2 dominant decks on purpose. They kill a lot of decks in diverse formats. But they dance avoiding the real problem when the META is monotone (and very expensive). This may be their selling strategy. A dominant deck can create peer pressure for players who don't play the META. Non-META cannot play peacefully because the META is too oppressive. Also, because the majority of players only play with 1-2 of the same decks. This is easier to push them to buy new products, with the ban list. Just make the old META unplayable and offer them the new one. . I don't really like Time Wizard. We have modern "bad" decks and they need a spotlight too. Time Wizard is just old META, the decks in those formats usually already have a lot of spotlight in their era. Also, because it is just an old format, there will be no new cards to make the format fresh. Meanwhile, if we focus on the alternative format with modern low-tier decks. They're up to date, but they are still less oppressive, this will make the learning process easier. Because we can also use new cards, this format will always be fresh.
YGO is super complicated because of the heavy focus on deck searching. It makes the game very difficult to understand and get into, even for people who play other TCGs.
@@EvilMagnitude That's actually what makes it easier. Because you can just memorize the cards you need and search it. If the search is more limited, it will force the player to play with any combination cards they draw. Why you need to learn about multiple different possibilities, when you can start with the same best starter over and over?
i agree. plus people have complained about the game dying every time the game gets like this. there's also the fact that casual is an option. you just need to find a good casual to duel at. or just do master duel or duel links.
My issue with Yugioh is all the archetypes I think have a cool aesthetic or are fun to play aren't viable competitively, the meta is just TOO oppressive where winning against a modern combo deck is basically impossible. You can shout "git gud" all you like but fact of the matter is modern Yugioh is just far too complex and fast paced for casual players. The most fun I had recently was dueling with the Yugi/Kaiba reloaded decks.
Yeah that does suck! One pet peeve I have with some of the archetypes and their designs are that they're either trying to be competitive or their artistic design feels "uninspired". Of course this is my opinion.
Or you could just find and play a better deck that matches your preferences. Ghoti, for example, has an actually good aesthetic, is fun to play, strong enough for newer players to find success at a locals, and, most importantly, it is very affordable. You just have to do research.
@Simply_Taido I've browsed through all the "viable" competitive decks and their aesthetic is either lame as fuck or the the deck itself is so complicated I'm no longer having fun. Modern Yugioh just isn't a game for casual players and it's why the game is dying.
From a Magic player point of view, I don’t understand why they don’t take the Edison legality list and use that as the basis for a new format to print cards into while keeping power level reasonable, maybe even with set rotation.
@@williamdrum9899tcg has a higher profit to cost that’s why. They desperately want to keep the same system and milk whales dry, they don’t want new players, just whales. They only want the new players as fodder and so throw a rarity collection bone once in a while to keep them quiet
The most fun I had is when I tag team with AI playing their stories and winning tournament together, more challenging and fun than playing as the MC or against the MC. YGO Tag force is amazing.
A few problems with current yugioh The tcg has less value in packs than the ocg and it’s just more expensive in the tcg. You’re definitely dropping a few hundred to make a competitive deck. It’s just way too expensive to get into as a hobby. Unlike all other card games yugioh does not have a casual scene. The duel is usually over in the first 4 turns Everyone has the same extra deck and boss monsters. There is no variety in the game. The game is just way too complicated for older players from slower formats.
No casual scene is a huge problem among my friends because most of them dont lay competitively but are competent and play decks that can be strong. The issue is that my casual stuff tends to be a lot worse because old or too good because it got new support. And feel like encouraged to beat their face in so they can't opresse me when playing modern. So I often feel like I only have fun playing competitive in modern yugioh and usually not with friends.
@@Practitioner_of_Diogenessame here, I completely and fully understand what the arrows on the blue cards mean. Me and my trusty summoned skull are doing great!
To me personally, one of the fact I learnt about these structure decks is that if you want your deck to be above average you need to buy at least 3 structure decks of the same type to get the cards you need, which are pretty inconsistent and annoying. If not you can buy singles too but not all lcs have the card you need.
You only talked about the commercial aspect, without really talking about the practical one. In practicality, you also have the synchro, XYZ, pendulum and link nightmare, which essentially makes it near impossible to have any form of creativity, because these systems are so powerful that nothing super meta will resist half a second to it. I played Duel Links because it used to not to have these systems,and now they put all of them, and it's an absolute nightmare and miserable experience to just wait 30 minutes for the rich kid to clean all your board to then finally attack you and end you in one turn. Then, there is the community aspect, with one of the worst and most toxic community of neckbeards ever, which certainly doesn't help either.
I honestly think the future of yugioh is more games. I feel master duel could easily help bring more players new and old, especially if THEY create a year-long GOAT format mode.
They need to bring back solo game (with more story content). One of the strengh of Yu-Gi-Oh is the huge amount of archetype and deck concept, we need a suport to play those deck without having to worry about competitive, just for the sack of enjoying the game.
@@Animexdraco are you thinking of the nintendo DS games? those NPC decks are very close to letting us play fun decks without worrying about being competitive
Definitely a lot to say about why modern day YGO is problematic (at least for some people, myself included). I feel it all stems from uncontrolled power creep, which then has a domino effect…high costs, extreme depth, long turns/short games (short as in small number of turns), focus on negations makes gameplay unfun, constant changing of the meta due to releases and banlists, vast majority of decks/archetypes are unplayable competitively, etc. I loved YGO and play Edison/tengu plant locals and have been having a blast, but I dont think I’ll ever get back into the modern game since dropping out 2 years ago (I tried getting back into it early 2020 after never playing competitively). Solid vid btw!!
Games these days are long Over 30 40 minutes but its mostly just ladder combo's to setup board not really turn to turn gameplay Games at most got 3 turns.
4:42 I feel like Pokemon has done really well in regards to this with the league battle decks. They come with tons of viable cards, an (almost) competitive deck that can actually do pretty well at a locals, and a little pamphlet on suggestions for what cards to add to it to upgrade it. With the gardevoir ex one, you can basically get one of the best decks in format by adding a few cards to it. And it’s only about 30 dollars give or take. Very affordable. I think more games should do stuff like this.
I think a big part of it has to do with how the early series game is entirely different then what it turned into with link and xyz summoning. Most TCGs lean hard into their nostalgia while Yu-Gi-Oh tries to bury it. Yes I know they just did a rerun of classic sets a couple years ago but it changed nothing because of the limited supply
I think beyond legacy formats if Konami is going to support an alternate format they should have one that uses the modern card pool but that is catered to lower power decks. There are so many new decks that come out and a response is more or less, "Wow, this looks fun and interesting, pity it can't hold a candle to the tiered strategies." Like most TCG exclusive archetypes. Legacy formats are good for the environment, but they have a hard cap on the amount of product they sell and in Konami's perspective they might not even see a cent out of it - if someone ONLY plays Edison they can probably pick up the only deck they'll ever play for cheap from a third party. Going straight from a legacy format to the current game - unless the legacy format is TOSS - is not a conversion you're likely to make. The allure of, "Hey, you play Lightsworn in Edison? Well there's these new Lightsworn cards..." may not make a conversion when the person says, "Yeah but the new Lightsworn deck still gets blown out by Snake-Eyes and Tenpai and stuff." If you could give that player an environment where he can play his favorite deck against other comparable strength decks, with the new cards, then he is more likely to look into getting the new cards - and by doing THAT he might actually get the confidence to convert to Advanced format. I also think that if Tactical Try decks are brought to the TCG they should be available in-stores but also offered as print on demand. Evergreen products that let someone immediately leap into the game are just beneficial. If you miss out on buying a Structure Deck near the time of its release and it happens to be the strategy that most interests you, well, you're kinda out of luck. If something like a Structure Deck or a Tactical Try were something you could easily get whenever, perhaps with a SLIGHT markup, it's a win for you since you can get into the game cheaper, faster, and more convenient and it's a win for Konami since they get the money that otherwise would be going to an outside vendor - you can't even really say it's at the detriment of the game stores, either, since it's the choice between someone going to the store more regularly and willing to buy product and that person just not going.
Exactly my thoughts. We need a format where lower power decks can be played against each other, and use new cards. That's my problem with Edison and Goat, the card pull is only so much, and you can't use the new stuff.
Their whole approach to legacy support in modern formats is part of what got me to quit the game after nearly two decades. I played Gravekeeper's for years. They had always been a solid rouge tier archetype that could consistently do well in a local setting and make an occasional splash in a regional. And the last bit of support that they got didn't help them at all. Thrones of Necrovalley would have been fine if it played the way everyone who first laid eyes on it thought that it would. But it you had to choose the effect you got, and it had a hard once per turn clause for absolutely no reason. And if you still want to play GK, you still need three of those cards. But GK has absolutely zero viability now in damn near any modern setting. So why would I waste money trying for the new support? Lightsworn, Six Samurai, Evilswarm, the lost goes on and on. Why are you going to dangle the carrot in front of older players when the carrot is clearly rotten?
@@kiracaos For sure. There are so many low-tier decks of the past that later got support, only it came years too late to be relevant. Those decks with the newer support might have made some pretty viable rogue strategies in their time had that support been there from the start.
Instead of ramping up new archetypes they should just add more support on existing archetypes to matchup to the format to slow down power creep flatten the curve so players can keep their decks for awhile
Yugioh needs something similar to Pokémon Smogon having more formats that allow more decks to shine in different ban list for both speed duels and normal. It will help a lot for encyclopedia series type rule book for those who want to enter more competitive games. The book can explain rulings why some combos don't work.
I don't think they are going to get new players until the game simplifies. I tried to explain the game to someone and they just said fuck it. It's not that they hate complexity, they play 40k. It's that in Yu-Gi-Oh all the complexity is immediately mandatory. There is no "Just play Costodes or generic Marines until you get into the swing of it.
While this would probably make them do better than what they're doing currently, I don't think it solves the problem. As someone who only plays/played casually. Never getting new cards and being stuck in specific point of time isn't appealing, especially since an appeal to Yugioh for me was that there was never that "card rotation" where I can use any card regardless of when it came out as long as it isn't banned. Konami's massive issue is the special summoning power creep. Synchros made it so you didn't need an extra card to special summon extra deck monsters, but you still needed a tuner and non tuner so you couldn't just use any card. Then xyz made it just levels which is way too easy because you can also special summon into summons now, and links have 0 restrictions. They made the power creep ease of access to the extra deck and handtraps/monsters immune to everything. Now it's very difficult to counter play and there is no back and forth. Why would I want to play a card game where there is no back and forth? (Besides something being only weak to one possible thing such as banishing, while being immune to every other destruction. I'm not going to put a bunch of banishing cards just for that scenario when banishing doesn't normally fit in the decks playstyle.)
I think adding code cards for master duel in packs could be a good way to help players transition from duel to paper and vice versa. I want to switch to paper but I like having an online space to test things and it takes forever to get a deck online. If I could have 3 traptrix or dark world structure decks online it would make the transition way easier.
That's a good idea to transition really life products to master duel. They're already doing it a bit with the tactical try decks. Unfortunately they're just an ocg exclusive
thats because konami uses the ocg to see which cards are good then up their rarity for the tcg since idiots will buy anything. case in point dark armed dragon was a rare in the ocg costing less than 5$ then bumped up to secret rare for the tcg with a price of over 200$. konami knows exactly which cards people want the most and make sure to print as few as possible of those to force tcg players to buy more products for playsets.
At least on the West side... It's less on the game becoming meta and more on Konami being deepshit with their customers, their lack of dedication and attention to both the game and playerbase, the bad quality of the cardboards, a lack of interest to communicate with the people, allowing shit like cheating to the point of deleting comment ON A LIVE STREAM, etc. Konami of America is a joke, and the fact that Kevin and Julia (among other like Jerome) are still getting away because most of the playerbase are big consumers, it irks me. Though lately I learned that things may not be going well for once to them, I mean, apparently they are starting to rely on Yugitubers more among others. So yeah. I hope KoA gets ruined in one way or another and they realize that they need to change the people that are sitting in the high chairs. As for OCG, I don't play there, so I can't comment too much, I can only say that they cards are not censored and the rarities are more fairly distributed. The game, they still have Maxx C which is the kind of card that would make people either love it or hate it, among other.
OCG player here so I can comment on it for you. Everything about it is better than TCG apart from a few weird tournament rules around how wins are determined when time is called, Maxx C being legal (it warps it to an astronomical degree), and Konami being too afraid of risk with the banlist.
Finally some one who understands that the game internationally is managed by konami of america has nothing to do with japn, yugioh players dont even know who they're buying from lmao.
Just now catching your video, you were spot on with all of my problems with Yugioh for the past DECADE. Your Retro deck concepts got me checking out the game again, in old formats I never got to properly experience, I would actually pay you money to create these pseudo products as orica just cuz they look cool and gave me huge nostalgia dopamine I hadn’t felt in years.
8:50 100% agree. I quit 5 years ago because it got too expensive for me to play competitively. It hurt seeing my lose value through reprints and the banlist.
You truly spoke the truths there. The issue here is complacency. Konami is so used to Yu-Gi-Oh! doing fine abroad that they see no reason to improve. Especially considering MtG's baffling choices, Yu-Gi-Oh!'s mindset is to just do what they did, but obviously better. Rarity Collection vs. Double Masters 2022, for example. Meanwhile, Pokemon TCG fans are eating better with a company who loves fun. I can safely say that, if MtG decides to reprint cards for (reasonably) cheap (like Doubling Season or Food Chain), abolish the reserved list, and start to do what the fans want (like not making cards exclusively for Universes Beyond and do better products than Secret Lairs or especially the 30th anniversary edition), then Yu-Gi-Oh! would be in serious trouble now in its big three spot.
The idea of retro format decks is awesome, but you know what would be even better? Boxes such as the speed duel ones, that contain many half decks of different archtypes ready to play with friends.
Got into Yu-Gi-Oh when my friend bought me the spirit charmer deck. It was fun at first in our group but when we got more into it and used more meta staples, the fun just died. Went to digimon and mtg after a few years.
Never touching Magic. That shits pure cancer on your wallet. No, you won't convince me that a game that destroys all your cards to be useable at a tournament is good or consumer friendly. Especially since they have been growing desperate.
@@RavenCloak13 tbf we only really ever play commander, and with usually 3-4 players so it just becomes a chaotic shit storm of "random bullshit go!" Though I get it, plus there are a bunch of other card games out there to try so I'd say go check some out if Yu-Gi-Oh is burning you out
I agree, this is excellent. But they will not do that, because they earn less money with it. The most profitable option for them is to sell cards (physical) or online games
the "fun" back and forth is me activating a bunch of effects on your turn as soon as or even before you enter your draw phase,, and then you do the same to me over and over again until one of us out-negates the other's effects.
Hey, I switched from Yugi to Magic many years ago (outside of Master Duel) because as an Altergeist player, I got tired of having to call a judge every time I bounced Manifestation with Silquitous. A friend of mine came back by because he wanted us to play again. So I picked up 3 Fire King structures, got some budget stuff to make it playable, and went to locals for the first time. My first match was against Ghoti Runick, where he had 3 Ghoti monsters trigger during my Standby Phase and I had 3 Fire Kings trigger at the same time, so we had 6 effects go off at once, and he was explaining I can activate one as Chain Link 1 and he gets all his effects, then mine may trigger in another chain, and he asked how I was such a noob that I couldn't understand how chain links work. Why did his effects all stack on the same chain and mine didn't? Don't answer, I don't care, because Outlaws of Thunder Junction drafts are a blast to play and Standard's gonna be so much fun after rotation. I just got my stuff up and left and never went back. It's a game that cannot be played in paper, period.
I am curious as to which cards were used in that scenario now, as all your cards effects should stack on the chain first on your turn if they are trigger effects.
I played irl before taking a massive break and imo in the west or atleast in america there is a big issue with rule sharks and cheats trying get out of confusing people with rulings. I had to call a judge on someone because they were yelling at me that I couldnt bounce their monster with a non targeting destruction eff when their monster only had targeting protection and another guy call a judge on me for using double sleeves (they're legal to use) and then trying to cheat out on activating the multiple things in chain that werent triggers without letting me respond with effects. This happened in the same locals in the exact same day within 2 hours span of time; decided to stick to masterduel until I study overseas in Japan.
I totally agree with this. I've somewhat learned Yu-Gi-Oh through duel links and master duel and have played casually with a friend in paper before but I would absolutely never play at locals or anything ever. The rules without automation are too complicated for me and I hear so many horror stories about new players getting sharked and bodied out of paper play for their first experience, I might as well just go play magic with my friends instead.
"people agree that vanguard is bad and determined by luck" this is unreal to me. i think this is some yugioh brainworm where they convince themselves that "drawing the out" is skillful in some way. just because vanguard has triggers (output randomness) other game players think that it's completely pointless, when yugioh has the *harshest* input randomness I've ever seen. when games end by turn 3 and your opponent can just have every answer on their first turn or open the one card combo? there's no mulligans in yugioh, because there can't be, but every single game is determined by the *opening hand*!! it's incredibly punishing, whereas vanguard is more lax and friendly. i think that type of design space is crucial to fostering a community. yugioh's game design creates its playerbase. the reason they're so toxic is directly correlated to how that game functions. you won't see people freaking out about vanguard because it wears randomness on its sleeve and people know what they signed up for. but for some reason yugioh players (and mtg) never got that memo that yeah, the game is basically always random. sure the top players will win over multiple games, but that requires people to keep playing multiple games. if new players hop into the only place they can play online or in a local environment and get blasted by handtraps/disruption/unbreakable boards, you really think they're gonna keep playing? goat and edison are definitely still determined by opening hands but the people that really stuck with yugioh afterwards have the most sunk-cost fallacy mindsets ive ever seen. there's so many games where the correct play is apparent and determinative. joshua schmidt's latest video on the state of the game goes into this well with the two players at the snake eye mirror just telegraphing the best play because one of them drew the one card combo and the other didn't. who's gonna wanna keep playing that that isn't already invested? im sure there's anecdotal evidence of people going "well i got my friend into the game and they love it" and like cool! im happy for yall! but i think just about any game is more fun with friends. yugioh is up against the wall when it comes to what its design allows and encourages. designs will continue to get more compressed, cards will keep doing more. they only have a competitive market to sell to, so they have to keep upping the stakes. rush duel kiiiinda fixes most of these problems because the opening hand isn't so game-determinative, but that's also got its own problems in a way. i think they're afraid to release it worldwide becausd it will eat into the tcg's market share, whereas in japan the culture of card games is so different. it's a small ass country where commuting is the standard. every town has a card shop within like 15 minutes. you're not gonna get that internationally, so they turn to online, and those environments are best of 1 and incredibly punishing. i dont really know how yugioh can get itself out of this but it's the only game where i see so many people complain about its obvious problems but still give their money to a company that doesn't care about them at all. konami is one of the worst companies in the industry and they will never change this approach. if they do then hey, im happy for everyone and we all win but man. it's so discouraging and unbelievable to hesr yugioh players talk about the game like the company is the only thing holding it back. the design itself is beyond repair. going back to old formats is only gonna work for so long. i guess they could do a goat / edison "expanded" release and print new cards with old designs but how long will that last until that ends up back where we started? i love your videos dude and this isn't aimed at you in any way. i think as a disenfranchised former player who's now making their own game because no card game is making me happy playing it, there's answers to these problems but none of them are "pray the shitty company fixes it." i wish yugioh was more friendly but it's like the game itself prevents that. it's like the marvel or hokuto no ken of card games. you made 1 mistake and now i get to play the game and you dont. or maybe you didnt even make a mistake, maybe just the round starting and youre missing your jab button. thanks for playing. it's no wonder the game can't pick up new players. all these people that fell off absolutely have valid concerns and only the most hopped up players fail to see it. i get it if your friend group is all playing yugioh. but maybe yall could play something else?? or a custom format? anything at all. any game is better with friends. and man if theyre not gonna hang out with you if youre not playing the game then maybe they arent your friends in the first place. sorry for ranting this is stuff that's always on my mind. appreciate all your videos and i hope everyone can have a fun time with whatever they enjoy regardless. im just salty c:
Hi Kirran! I've been following your TCG development and love your insight. However the updates on your game have been scant as of late maybe I'm not looking in the right places but I would love to see the state of The Card Game ™.
Salty or not, this was a good read. Vanguard is my main game and I still enjoy it to this day, even though it's had its ups and...honestly pretty harsh downs. I feel like if Bushiroad would stop trying to push out so many other random games and just focused on Weiss, Vanguard, and Buddyfight (to a point), they wouldn't have kinda driven themselves into a ditch with the fanbases. I'm currently learning Digimon TCG, and it's been interesting, though coming from other games like Yugioh and Vanguard it does have some odd interaction rulings. Back on topic though, I feel like your comment was pretty fair, so thanks for sharing. :)
@@morrisdarling115 hi!! thank you!! i been streaming the process on twitch the past couple years. im in the middle of putting together the tutorial video and website and all this other stuff because the game is actually gonna be in pre-release within a month! free tts demo and hoping to take it to gencon and other places with all the vids returning soon. thanks for asking and the kind words!! i hope you have a great day 💜
You're 100% on point when talking about randomness. I haven't played YGO (or any TCG really) for almost 20 years now, but looking at modern play, it seems like the entire game is governed by what combo starters (if going first) or disruption (if going second) are in your opening hand, and whichever player has the more optimal opening hand is going to win 95% of the time. The reason I walked out on MtG very fast was because I kept finding myself starved of lands or spells during a game, letting my opponent clobber me while I sat there powerless. And the only remedy for that problem offered by my (extremely impatient & unhelpful) local tables was "uhh just build your deck better lol". I know my experience was definitely soured by a local scene that refused to slow down for a new player, but being irreversibly screwed over by bad luck is what I remember as my biggest pain point. I guess getting into YGO is tolerable if you have friends who are willing to patiently walk you through the entire convoluted learning process, or maybe online play if you're OK with being indefinitely steamrolled while you desperately try to learn the meta, but lacking either of those, I can't imagine anyone looking at YGO as an outsider and having a good time
Honestly it's just better being an OCG player. Prices for cards are far cheaper and F/L list is perfect and has timely updates. In the TCG, Konami is just a money hungry company and their F/L list is just cards that they have chosen when they get drunk and they only have a F/L change whenever they feel like it. After switching to OCG and a player in Japan, I can say that my experience playing Yugioh here is infinitely better compared to playing in the US.
or just play casual. if you find a good casual they are really good because you'll be against some creative stuff. plus any player that tries to meta is frowned on or kicked out so bonus.
@thanoseid2883 I am talking about in a competitive sense. Any game can be fun and the experience for playing said game would be pleasant if you would take it at a casual level.
My wife and I actually got into modern Yu-Gi-Oh because of the two player starter pack thing. We had been trying to play with her old collection, but she had very little in the way of complete decks and I found the older game rather grueling. The starter pack really opened things up for us just by having a couple slightly faster cards around and because of it I ended up picking up Master Duel, where I discovered that the modern game with actual decks is way more interesting to me than the slow march of trap cards I'd been introduced to.
Because it’s too intimidating, too fast and at other points certain players can be too angry and have no patience. Not everyone of course is this way. But sadly because of these issues, the game is very unforgiving and this ultimately why new players are put off.
I’ll be honest. Me and my fiends only play with proxies. So we can have as much as we want. This sort of hobby is far too expensive in today’s economy otherwise.
How do you make your proxies. I'm looking for a way to make nice proxies so the Edison decks I use to teach the game could have the correct Edison text
I'm glad you mentioned the pricing problem. I feel that that is one of the major roadblocks for many people. Also the lack of an anime proper to pull new players in. Remember when Yugi was on all of the boosters? I got into Yugioh thanks to the anime, like so many others. Accessibility with mitigating power creep can also help. I also feel like maybe introducing retrains as a sort of "series" of rereleases of older 2002-2003 sets could also be cool. Like, most cards in Legend of Blue Eyes had no effects. What if you made a Legend of Blue Eyes Remix booster series, and all the old vanillas now had effects? Use nostalgia to older players, by making their favourite cards from 20 years ago viable again. I think that'd be pretty cool. I'd also love to see more games released with cool twists to the concept. Remember Duelist of the Roses? I loved that game! In short: - Maintain an anime for new blood - Regulate prices and rarities and maybe alot more retrains for older cards - Accessibility to older players, make it fun again for them - More video games
@henrycentury2767 Depends. If competitive, then no because MTG also suffers from powercreep on restricted formats. But as a hobby, yes. Go for commander if you want casual play, at least you can have a flexible budget on what you want to put in your decks.
Or if you do play Yugioh; play the older formats you like back when the game was interactable. Whenever my friends want to try Yugioh I introduce them to Goat and Edison, the modern game is just too far gone at this point.
Why should I pay 80€ for a Booster Box to not have any guarantee I'd find the 70€ I'm searching for when I can buy that single through CardMarket and use those 10€ in useful/liked cheap cards?
It's been years but nowadays more than ever that the new rule is: *Never buy boosters, buy singles* Structure Decks are fine and saves you useless additional shipping costs buuut... Boosters are NOT worth the cost.
And that’s why ygo cards are so expensive. Pokemon cards are cheap because people pull a lot of them, because generally the cards are pretty neat even if you don’t play. Good quality, great art, they’re just nice to have.
The worst part about the price stuff is that it isnt even just your first cards. Some staples may have staying power, but many expensive cards become obsolete over time so that you have to buy this NEW expensive power-creeping staple. I joined yugioh over 3 times, and all 3 times had me getting the hang of using my deck just for 50% of it becoming obsolete (sometimes the whole deck) as soon as the next set hits. "Oh but then you can sell your old cards" yes but due to power-creep making some cards cheaper, even IF you manage to sell your old deck to keep up, you end up in a net negative. And as a shy person it's even worse since I'm just not comfortable in entering the card market. Not to say other card games DON'T have this, but this rotation and constant need to buy new cards only exacarbates the high prices and high barrier of entry. As I said, I managed to win over the barrier of entry, complexity, and high prices 3 times, but gave up every single time because of cards just becoming obsolete for the sake of necessity to buy the next omega-expensive, meta-warping card.
I stop playing Yu-GI-OH in 2013 after I joined the military due to most the people around me playing Magic over Yugioh while we were at sea. I slowly fell out of love with it but always held a place in my heart. in 2018 I thought about getting back into the game but so much changed and new mechanics added, as well as people hating the new rulings/mechanics scared me away. Most of them said building many fun unique decks were dead now. Even to this day I would love to get back into the game after seeing them add support to Charmers to make them usable (even if they are bossless), but after looking at MANY MANY videos it doesnt seem like I would have fun trying to play against someone who is seriously trying to win.
You brought up the massive Deck Build Pack issue, let me just point out that one of my favorite pet decks came from the infamously terrible Ancient Guardians set, Ogdoadic. I wanted to pick up the deck and run 1 (just 1) ultra rare, a copy of Ogdoabyss. When the set came out, I obviously bought singles online instead of try to build the deck the natural way, which is awful for so many reasons. There's 3 ultra rares in a box, and I wasn't even guaranteed to pull all the supers I wanted to run, and it's cheaper to buy online. Why would I bother buying the box? I don't care about collectors rares, let me have the cards I need. It's awful for Konami because the box of Ancient Guardians I'd love to pick up is still sitting on store shelves. It's HORRIBLE for the LGS because, obviously, the box is still sitting there instead of having me pick it up. It's horrible for the vendor selling on TCGPlayer, because he's selling me an Ogdoabyss - one of the 3 ultras in that box - for $5, and shipping costs more than the rest of the deck even on release. It's even not good for me as a player, because it feels like half the experience of a card game is missing when we're playing the TCGPlayer minigame instead of opening packs which is what got us into Yugioh to begin with. It's not good for you reading this, because chances are you're usually doing the same thing because sealed product isn't worth it. It would be so fascinating to see what it's like if Konami's business practices didn't actively make us not want to buy their products. It's honestly insane.
I wanted to get into yugioh, so I downloaded one of the online games but the ridiculous amount of card text and mechanics and turn one insta desth combos just made it so overwhelming. Why would i ever bother to get into yugioh when games like hearthstone are so much easier to get into
This is from the perspective of someone who only played up until like, GX came out: Idk man, the whole appeal of deckbuilding to me is actually finding cool cards that synergize in ways that weren't 100% intended but work well. Yugioh is "Here's a set of cards, they all ONLY interact with these cards, they NEVER do anything outside of this archetype" and that's 80% of your deck, with a few busted exceptions that are crazy strong standalone. Why would I bother with that? The card text is also unreadable af and I could just go and play a way easier to get into TCG like the Digimon, Pokemon or Magic TCGs. infact, I started playing Magic Commander like two years ago and that was a BLAST for a while. The social aspect was great, the fact I could use almost any legendary creature and make it my "deckmaster" and once you get the basic gist of the most common keywords, new ones are a breath of fresh air instead of annoying walls of text... And duels actually last longer than like 2 turns. I also don't play modern at higher powerlevels for that reason. YGO just has way too much powercreep and reading to do, way too restrictive deckbuilding and whenever I FEEL like I wanna play it again, I look at modern and think "nah I'm good", with the older formats also not being interesting enough.
It's not so much that Konami hates us, but rather TCG Konami hates us. OCG Konami clearly cares about their player base by retaining solid pack structures and presenting solid precons to keep the cost of the game fairly low for OCG. Meanwhile TCG core sets are abysmal, over printing commons, players don't seem to understand that just because TCG boxes contain more cards, doesn't mean the packs are worth opening. The only issue OP has at this point (from what I've seen) is the lack of reprints for pivotal cards. Older set cards that have gained traction in usage in the meta have skyrocketed in price due to demand, locking out some decks. Fortunately, there are still some decks that can be built for a reasonable price like The Three Brothers leaders, predominantly using more recent staples and cards over older staples.
@@erickkisreal9398 I'd suppose that TCG still sees enough sales for OCG to accept the state that the market is in. Shops are still paying well for product and the community is still active, so from OCG's limited view, the TCG player base is okay with their TCG boxes.
As someone who loved Duel Monsters and tried to jump back in several times over the past 20 years, Yugioh is by far the worst for beginners. You tell experienced players you're on a budget and that knocks you down to a handful of decks. Locking you in Many of these decks are heavily flawed. Then they point out its tier zero format, and the best deck is $400 +. It's not a good selling point to a new player skeptical of diving in that their choices are extremely limited and you need to pay to win . Games like Pokémon have reprinted cards into the ground and make it easy for one to pick up 2-3 competitive decks for the cost of one Yugioh Budget deck. It's a shame, but I stick to Master Duel when I want my Yugioh fix
Well i think the main issue when it comes to budget decks is that a) They STILL need certain high prized cards to be viable and b) Are very rarely tier 1 or above. Currently Tenpei is the exception with a tier one deck core going for like 50 bucks but in general, the more expensive stuff tends to be better.
"Either konami is stupid, or they actively hate you." It's the latter. The west has ALWAYS, AAAAAALLLLLWAYS been treated like the red headed step child by daddy konami outside of the TCG Premier/TCG Exclusives. And among the other issues and them refusing to ban cards that just came out that are creating T0 formats and second-hand cards for triple digits, it's just us in an abusive relationship with Konami these days and us coming back to them like a battered GF/BF/Spouce. To say nothing about them "testing the waters" with Rush Duel in Duel Links and dangling a POSSIBILITY of them printing rush in english, it's just one of those things...where we're in a lose-lose relationship with Konami.
Plus, you just know if the TCG’s sales drop even lower, Konami will drop it entirely. As soon as they stop gaining money from it, they won’t care about it anymore. I don’t think Yugioh in general will ever get better to be honest, not unless the big execs get replaced, and that probably won’t happen either. We’re screwed either way.
@@leoultimaupgraded9914this is why I’ve decided to just keep 4 roughly equal power decks that I like (Dark magician, gate guardian, utopia and ice barrier) and just decided to only collect and play those decks with friends not attend any events/locals etc, not gonna spend thousands and not gonna bash my head into a meta wall.
Japanese companies only give a shit about Japanese customers. Say what you will about boogymen like Tencent, but they treat every nationality equally. Frankly, it's a fundamental problem with Japanese culture, not just Konami.
My experience with YuGiOh was super mixed. The community is probably one of the most exciting and passionate group of goobers I've ever had the pleasure to play with. There's a level of irony that's almost poisonous and I jive with yall. The problem is the game its self has a barrier to entry that is truly insurmountable. With MTG, I could just pick a limited format like Standard and have a focused* card set to learn while I'm also learning the game. With YGO, I have... every card in the history of the game. I know not everything is viable at all times, but its all available and I dont know what makes a card viable or not viable. So for the foreseeable future, without incredibly deep investment, I will always be weeks or months behind the meta. And I just don't have the time nor inclination to devote the same amount to YGO that I did to MTG in the early 2000s. Im no longer a teenager with infinite energy and an abundance of time. *Standard is no longer focused, or even the most popular format in MTG, and that riles me up bad. We no longer have a simple focused metagame to hook new players, instead everyone's running 100 card singleton decks with complex value engines that have a playlist stretching all the way back to fucking Urza Block that create hour long 'games' or we have 12 sets rotating into Standard at a time. I hate it.
My preferred way of getting new players probably isn't the best one, but I would love to see a new Yugioh rpg Kinda like the World Championship Series. You put players in a rpg like world where they slowly upgrade their deck to beat stronger opponents, encased in a story that motivates them to continue and improve at the game, but without the competitive pressure of pvp. With extremely strong and Meta Deck using optional or postgame bosses. I think there might be a lot of new players being able to enjoy such a single player game and it would also tackle a new market for Konami in terms of Yugioh, which are single player videogames.
There are in my opinion 4 ways of getting new players into the game. Games like you said where you can learn the game on your pace against computer in a story mode Animes to hook up new people Cheaper options to play the card game on locals. promote old formats to get the people back into the game
Personally,people should just not support Konami at all,even if they do good like you said at the end. They have done terrible and rancid shit over the years and need a damn reality check for it. They don’t actively care nor are they interested in giving the tcg community respect and why would they? They mostly seem to be for the way Konami is treating them,not complaining about it as much as they should. The only thing they need to actually get to more people is to make their shit cheap,that’s it. They wouldn’t need to focus on making competitive focused decks. Honestly, I only say that because I hate the competitive side of the game and the community. But like I said,they won’t care nor they ever will, aslong as most of the community are being like braindead sheep and do nothing with how the game is right now.
As a TCG player who's last card game effectively died out, here's why Yu-Gi-Oh doesn't interest me The entire meme is that you blow your entire load on turn one and win or lose. That's disgustingly boring. Not only are games way too quick and force a very specific meta (less creativity is ever allowed as a result) and it means there's an incredibly high knowledge gap, much more than other games, because games don't last long enough to learn where you went wrong (or that you may have done nothing wrong to begin with due to 1 turn kills) A card games best decks should never cause the game to be meme on for frequently being 1 turn. This reason alone is why I just do not care to get into Yu-Gi-Oh.
As someone who had stopped playing Yu-Gi-Oh during Nekroz format, when I randomly started playing Master duel this year, it was the tactical try-out deck of Cyber dragons, that was given to you for a limited period of time FOR FREE even for ranked, that got me back into the game. Even without having crafted any deck, just having easy access to a competitively viable deck and being able to make it until mid plat and then having tons of gems to craft new decks was amazing.
I just want to say your inclusion of Starter/Structure Deck concepts for Goat and Edison format is BRILLIANT. I've been really harping on this point (and others you made here) in my own videos and even when I get the chance to speak with Konami reps. I think there are a lot of really great player onboarding and retention tactics being left on the table here, and while I know not every solution is practical or possible for Konami (and that they likely have at least considered these and other methods), there's never any harm in talking about it anyway. Great video as always! 👍🏾
Delinquent Duo needs a reprint please
the Time Wizard Structures can be really cool, and I can see them also not being all 3~2-ofs like he showed in the video, being 1-ofs in this card will mean that you get more options when building your deck, and it will use more reprinted of relevant cards to each strategy that are maybe less popular, but can still see play
I hope you and MonkeyFight collab sometime
Although a great idea, I think that it would be better to introduce some sort of official ruling / tiers to the game and restrictiosn based on them. Let's say I wanna play Sky Strikers, well, I can't in Goat or Edison. Maybe allow rouge decks access to powerful staples, and restrict them so tier 0 decks can't use them, and balance how many staples a deck can use depending on their tier. But hey, it's just my opinion.
I think instead of trying to teach the entire game at once people need to take steps.
A good two player starter would've had you play with no extra deck then maybe add sycho for game 2 ect.
Being a new Yugioh player is like never working out and choosing the Great Wall of China as your first fitness challenge.
UNDAR RATE & APRE'CIA'TE
Facts
Yugioh is just boring, unnecessarily complex, long turns where you are just watching your opponent winning by doing a long and unnecessarily complex combo, total lack of collectionability, and very bad looking cards, you should have bad taste in order to play yugioh
@@SnkHetz there’s still a lot of fun to have. Once I see a solitary deck, I just scoop. I’m not interested.
I like cardgames. I played yugioh as a kid, had I think, iirc, what id now call a draw based tempo dec based around resummoning des lacooda into a few different attacking life points directly cards that opponents had to deal with while I stayed ahead in the value game.
I have been looking for new games to play, moving away from mtg. IN MY PERSONAL PERCEPTION FROM CHECKING IT OUT AS A CARDGAME, THROUGH SOCIAL MEDIA, AS A CARDGAME PLAYER :Yugioh seems to repeat a lot of hasbros corporate mtg issues, have weird art (massivly varying quality with a lot of horny cards I wouldnt want to play because of how they look), be harder and more confusing generally, similarly expensive, if anything more bigoted as a community especially to women which turns me off personally, more stringent deckbuilding with less customisaton and more "pick your choice of supported archetypes" and worse online. And, worst of all, has the public persona of being Cringe.
In the end I went for Sorcery Contested Realm, despite it having only official tabletop simulator online support, because it was cheap, customisable and interesting with complexity that produced a fun and different play experience, rather than just a ton of card text.
The biggest problem with Yu-Gi-Oh is that Konami, the company that oversee's the product, are notorious for completely ignoring all feedback from non-Japanese players. Konami priorities success in Japan over international success. Yu-Gi-Oh is the 2nd largest card game in Japan after Pokemon, it is doing well in Japan, but its not doing well internationally, and Konami doesn't seem to care.
TCG is so mismanaged by Konami compared to the OCG:
+ Worse price, products, quality control, merch, product schedule, reveals, community interaction and presentation
+ The text format is worse. Even in Master Duel where the latest update gave OCG newest format for old cards (Add numbering, "Select" becomes "Target", etc), TCG only got ✨line break✨. They didn't even fix the problem about cards lying to players because of mistranslation
+ Doesn't do stuff beyond DM stuff
+ Doesn't have a database for rulings
+ Doesn't have a lot of the cool stuff OCG has
There are probably more but those are what I can think off the top of my head.
At this point, Konami SHOULD care about the TCG.
+ One key detail to note is that compared to Japan, the West lacks any competition with the Trading Card Industry (Only Magic and Pokémon). Fast forward to 2024 and now there's more competition in the West (Lorcana, One Piece, Flesh and Blood, Digimon), and it looks like they're doing well.
+ Additionally, these games are using these tough times to their advantage as they open barriers for play. Take Pokémon for example. For those that may have not known, due to inflation, Pokémon has made pulling rare and powerful cards more common than before. Because of that tactic, it gives players the chance to get into the game; most players wanting to go for a casual experience while holding some powerful staples.
Not 2nd largest anymore. I think it fell to 3rd with duel masters going strong in 2nd place now.
As CaliEffect once said, the OCG is their baby and the TCG is their checkbook, we're basically funding the OCG
The way I see it... Japanese (game) companies give zero f..ks about its international customer base, to the point that it's overly nationalistic at best... grossly racist at worst.
One of the things I noticed more and more about Japanese people (particularly men) is that they are very racist and hate anything that isn't Japanese, no matter how much the rest of the world embraces them.
How I see it, if Konami wants to shoot itself in the foot, then let them. The people in that company will soon learn how stupid they are at economics and financing.
Old school yugioh: FLIP: Destroy 1 monster on the field (regardless of position)
Modern Yugioh: (the entire Bee Movie script)
it our turn and need something like completely shutdown opp interaction in MP1 just to let you play in MP1 and that count as unhealthy deck lol
Old school yugioh in reality : tribute of the doomed hitting 50/50 spear cretin or sangan and lose to deck out because you cant resolve your monster removal with 3 judgment and jammer in the back row.
There is an illusion of playing while in fact you will lose no matter what and mirror match is just basically top deck war.
Old Yu-Gi-Oh: Pay 1000 lp, steal one monster for 1 turn.
Modern Yu-Gi-Oh: -the longest book ever written to say "No, youre not allowed to play the game"-
@@r3zafulmaybe if you had modern mindset, and Solum judgement was limited almost immediately
Old yugioh = you play the game
modern yugioh = you watch your opponent doing shinanigans on first turn for 30mins
lol they made tenpai and facing it I'm just like why does this even exist... So you auto win and I can't respond during battle phase??? Why is yugiohs new goal to force people to not play yugioh
Joined a tournament last Friday and Sunday...I only joined the old school format,we already finished our matches while the modern bandwagon kids sitting there yawning listening with other kids xys,tuner,synchro,link, pendulum noble 😆...
Attempted new player here, one of the biggest things that put me off the game were the players, some not all and again region based, both local shops of mine just had very sweaty competitive players who didn't wanna take a break from player at lightning speed and when i tried to slow down and read the cards i have to understand them they wouuld visibly get pissed (this was a casual non tourny game)
Again keep in mind this is just my case never really tried the game again
really? fuk them. I veteran and love to wait for player to think
That's 100% correct. I was long time Yugioh player up until the early pendulum era. When I tried to return to the game some time ago I had to stop and read practically every single card my opponents were playing. This visibly upset people and many were very rude about it. I believe this might have something to do with time rules and how long games take.
You also don't have the option of just trusting your opponent to play their cards correctly either as trying to get away with cheating has become increasingly common in the Yugioh community.
The problem isn't just Konami, it's the players.
I hate when people take games seriously. It is a GAME. Games are there to have fun with. Settle down
@@evolvedape3341 I'd imagine it won't be fun if your opponent had to stop and read every single card you play, slowing the game significantly. Idk.
@@i_like_lemons are you supposed to _not_ read a card you've never seen before?
Wow, Konami hates their consumers? I wonder who could've told you that:
-Metal Gear fans
-Contra fans
-Castlevania fans
-Silent Hill fans
-Suikoden fans
-Zone of the Enders fans
-Rocket Knight Adventures fans
-All Hudson-Soft fans with the exception of Bomberman.
They do this to all of their fandoms, and it's crazy how ignorant Yugioh players are to Konami's business practices. I mean they got into pachinko AFTER Japan's harsh regulations on the game, which is when companies like SNK pulled out of the market. If they can do something predatory, they will. And that's why I will literally only play Edison unless the box structure changes to make decks as affordable as the Pokemon TCG, with the limit being $200 for a minimum rarity deck.
Pokemon is as cheap as it is mainly because it has a much larger casual playerbase than its own competitive player base. It mostly consists of people buying quantities of specific cards solely because they feature their favorite characters and Pokemon. It also helps that Pokemon is the most successful IP on the planet. YGO isn't and has never been anywhere near as popular as Pokemon. In fact, the TCG is essentially the complete opposite of Pokemon.
It has a competitive playerbase that is louder than its casual playerbase. Also, unlike Pokemon, the TCG barely has a collector's market, and demand for specific cards and decks is heavily influenced by talking heads and the market culture within its own community. Copying the OCG rarity distribution wouldn't really solve anything. Because of these factors, YGO becoming as affordable as Pokemon is impossible.
I'd love more Bloody Roar games...
@@Simply_Taido Despite all of that, Konami can do things to make the game more appealing.
But it just isn't doing that and considering what chaoticmeatball said, it's just not a surprise at all. Konami is THE GREEDIEST company I know of, and there's a huge list of it around.
Hell, I think one of the reasons why a starting point are grey area simulators is because of Konami's greed. There's just no way to get around that.
As a certain someone has said many times before: FucKonami.
@@hickknight wait, what? Master Duel/Duel Link are in the grey area?
@@wahrt Nope, because you need a guide and patience to not get stuck being forced to pay, just to catch up. The daily grind, in essence.
Turns out 25 years of never ending power creep is bad for the game. Who knew.
Magic, meanwhile, has various play formats for the mechanics and sets.
Modern uses the most recent sets, and often thw power cards get phased out.
Commander, meanwhile, allows the entire history outside of silver bordered and acorn tagged of the cards to be used. While yes, theres metas, theres still the aspect that youre free to do Whatever.
Set rotation helps
Magic is older and doing fine. At least mechanically as a card game.
@@ArilliusDM Almost as if putting limits to what a player can do is good for a multiplayer game.
@@N12015Yeah, that's generally how rules work with games.
@lanterns_glow that's not modern that's standard. Modern is every card from 8th edition onwards
I'm a new player and while the basic rules for the game aren't complicated, the cards have so much text that I literally have no idea what my opponent is doing or what the choke points are to stop their combos. The learning curve feels really high. I'm still having fun with the game though
As a rule of thumb, the normal summon tends to be a choke point. So, if you don't know what you're facing, dunk on the normal summon, they only have 1 of those after all. The first thing summoned from the Extra Deck can also be a big choke point since they're usually a key extender (think of stuff like junk speeder but a bit less extreme).
Yeah that's my problem, I like master duel but everyone else goes so fast and its hard for me to read all my opponenents stuff so I don't like irl play
@@Cstan55157 Master Duel makes playing so much easier. All the QOLs, being automatic, having mods like Readable Card Effects mod, etc. I honestly can't see how I would be able to play IRL.
Most people dont bother trying to figure out what their opponent’s cards do. Unless they see it more than once. This is why the meme of ygo players not reading is a thing. But you understand why
@acasualgameryt6978 IRL you have 45 minutes for a best of 3, and it's okay if you don't play all three games, especially at locals. Ask your opponent what each card does, or ask to read every card. If they're a decent person (most are) they'll understand that you're new and you don't know what the cards do. I've been playing sporadically for years, I always ask everyone at my locals what all their cards do, even if I think I know.
If you want to be the best player you have to learn what all the cards you're playing against do, but most people aren't the best player. If you play against the same cards enough times, or you go home and try out the deck for yourself on a simulator like EDOPRO or Nexus, you can quite quickly learn how other decks work. Learning how other decks work is a skill in and of itself, but again, you can just ask. I normally play rogue decks so basically every card I play people ask for the effect or to read it.
In OCG, you can lay down a card on the field, activate it's effect and summon your boss monsters with just $20.
In TCG, it costs $500 dollars just to lay down a single card, and apparently get negated.
FACTS!
Konami prices got ygo players thinking, “maybe it really is just cardboard”
Buying 3 structure decks is nowhere near enough to compete with other players.
I went to a local tournament with a 3 structure deck combined deck and I got beat so badly. The players there kept telling me I need to buy all these expensive cards to be able to keep up with them and make my own deck.
what did you expect…
I haven't played the game since Synchro's were the main thing and even back then the game was getting ridiculous with needing the newest and most expensive cards if you wanna remain competitive. This was well over a decade ago and the power creep has only gotten more worse since then! If I ever play now its classic rulea and only for enjoyment.
@@incredibledn what do I expect? Not to spend like £800 just to keep up with a local scene, not even talking about tournament levels here.
Sounds pretty toxic
@@GinraiPrime666you really need the staples and some extra deck cards to actually be good. You can just build your strat around that.
Too high level of entry both in terms of rules, rulings and complexity as well as price
$8-20 is high entry?
@@mrbubbles6468 What fucking game are you playing that is $8-20?
for entry the SD's work. 30 bucks is fair. specially when most docus on only 1 ed mechanic. They are competent at teaching the bread and butter plays of the deck.
@@mrbubbles6468 Depends. Per deck? Not at all. Per card? That's at best 560 USD.
@@mrbubbles6468structure decks are NOT competitively viable. They can teach basic rules and that's it. Great if they work for your personal group, not for actual playing in game shops or tournaments.
The tactical try decks will never come out in the tcg. Like you said, Konami HATES YOU.
Konami HATES *THE TCG*. They’ll knee to the OCG, but TCG? LOL, Buy our products Suckers.
❎️Konami hates you
✅️Konami "of America" hates you.
I hope you're wrong, but I don't believe you are...
Maxx C is Banned that's Why
@@bonloreto8072 ooh good point. The OCG can keep them then cause Maxx c being banned is a good thing.
Meanwhile, in Pokemon: you can build a Tier 1 Tournament Ready meta deck for more or less 50/60$ and participate in dozens of major tournaments with cash prizes.
The very few times i happen to see a Yugioh player irl i can't not think "Why? Why in hell would you do this to yourself?"
Meanwhile in Magic, by format:
Commander; Usually 600-1000 for a comp deck. I run a mono-red turbo burn thats cheaper than most and it still hits 500$
Pauper: The cheapest format with only Commons: 80-150$. Will likely stay relevant unless several cards are on the ban radar.
Standard: Oh boy. Rotating format. Rakdos Scam costs 1500$ to build, but RDW can get the job done for about 60$
Modern: Now we're breaking into 2000$ decks.
Legacy: This is only for the whales among whales and decks break 10000$. Only OG and colelctors will play this format.
@@nunyabusiness3957Wait what!? I have not played MTG in about 10 years. All the way back in 07/08 you could dominate the nationals with less than 100€/$/. Is it really that bad nowerdays?
Same goes for Cardfight Vanguard. Man, all TCGs that I play are going down the drain
@@nunyabusiness3957 commander is mostly casual format anyway, it’s the most popular mtg format and commander is by far the lowest barrier to entry for new players. In casual play you talking anywhere from $50 to $200 decks
@@RealCodreXno, he’s talking crazy
As someone who used to play religiously around 2012ish I dropped off hard after pendulums where released and completely quit with link.
I've tried a few times to get back into the game but things have just gotten so over the top convoluted that it's hard for me to jump back in.
2011 tengu format
I introduced Yugioh to some friends when Master Duel came out. We had fun casually building weird decks with the massive backlog of cards. It was when they tried playing in ranked that they lost interest. They repeatedly told me how annoying it was getting Ash Blossom'd or seeing their opponent build up a huge board with omni-negates on turn 1. It's easy as someone that's played for years to tell them to just 'get good' or learn to bait that stuff out and have back-up plans, but I wonder if the power creep has just become too much for new players. Sure, there are people that probably started last week that love the current game, there's always exceptions after all, but I'm worried that power creep has just made the game too much for the average person. Of course, casuals with friends will always be fun, but you can say that about any game. IDK, I just know I buy more statues and figures based on Yugioh than actual booster packs at this point.
I would also like to add, that even people casually teaching friends doesn't always work out as well as some people think, and not just because it's a complicated game, I've seen people trying to teach someone new BEING the ladder in this scenario. They were, for whatever reason, incapable of throttling down a little to not beat a newbie that didn't know what they were doing into the ground. Repeatedly. It's not a welcoming environment. Heck, I've seen people say that was a good thing and encourage it... Which is... Honestly, if you CAN'T slow down, that's one thing. But if you're ENCOURAGING people to play so hard a newbie that doesn't know what they're doing can barely play a card, that's just toxic.
And I talk about this from experience. It's not fun, it doesn't feel good from either side, and it actively drives people away from the game.
The pro players are the main playerbase and so new players quit cause they get bodied by the newest and fastest version of the special summon swarm tactic
Its not really fun for them to deal with, you guys might see that as a regular tuesday but for a normal guy
That's overwhelming.
This is beyond true, even with me being there to guide them. Get them to understand their deck and every combo. I taught one friend who wanted to use Mekk-Knights
Another like a classic Weeb. Dragon maids. While Ash is common and they used it too. No joke. I'm watching my friend after doing solo and dueling me in friend duels.
Go in, and first game in Rookie. Branded Bestials. He immediately quit. Overall. I'm not saying these cards need to be banned. Frankly I don't know how to fix the issue. I just know. People won't like picking up a game, and then seeing a full bored of negates or just getting cards ripped from hand on turn one.
@@devideby_zero8596 My advice: Teaching should ALWAYS be starting with mid low power mid range decks
If you'd describe it as combo, it's probably bad deck to start with
If it's running off floodgates, it's probably a bad deck to start with
Also, if it's Pendulums, it's probably a bad deck to start with, because Pendulums are the most complicated mechanic
Those are my three rules for teaching someone
It also helps to find them a deck they like or at least thinks has cool art for them to try
Don't force them into a top of the meta good deck, if you're going to push them towards or away from any decks, I would only suggest advising against completely unusable and nonfunctional garbage, like Guardians (Not Gate Guardian, Guardians)
@@baxterbruce9827Just out of curiosity, what would you suggest for a beginner level dragon(-like) deck for someone who considers more than like 3 summons per turn as board spamming and loses interest?
YGO, Castlevania, Metal Gear, Parodius, Silent Hill, ALL Share the same problem and it's called KONAMI
Metal Gear Kojima killed himself by trying to turn it into a wannabe Hollywood movie series and not a game.
I despise Metal Gear fan boys.
@@soukenmarufwt5224Doesnt mean Konami’s not apart of the problem for a their IPs
I despise Konami’s greedy business practices
@@soukenmarufwt5224 Kojima left ages ago and all they did for years was fucking Survive. That's 100% on them.
The company doesn't know how to treat their products
Hey, Dont forget us Suikoden fans
Old cards: "Draw 2 Cards" (banned)
New Cards: "your opponent can't do shit, you can Special summon 100 Monsters from your extra Deck, your opponent can't activate any effects, can not be the target of effects, can not get destroyed by card effects, instead of sending this Card to the graveyard, remove 3 Cards from your graveyard and return this shit to the field. Your opponent Skips their next Draw Phase. Your opponent can not activate Magic or Trap Cards unless they Control 3 Tuner Monsters with combined Level of 6 or higher. If this card was special summoned, destroy it at the end of your opponents next draw phase, your opponent looses the game unless they remove three Cards from their graveyard. You can search your deck for any copies of x and add them to your hand"
You forgot, "Can only be Special-Link-Synchro-Pendulum-Summoned. Use these effects only once per turn."
"how did you just summon 3 monsters in one turn, isn't that against the rules or something?"
"SCREW THE RULES I HAVE EFFECTS"
Some archetypes are just fucking cruel
Personally I think every card needs to be reprinted to Hell and back. No piece of cardboard should be more than $0.10.
Even if every meta deck cost 10$, that won't stop Yugiboomer and casuals from complaining and refusing to learn anything.
This is gas lighting at best. I could care less about the opinions on casuals say. Casuals are the reason I left many communities
@@soukenmarufwt5224
What the Hell are you even on about?
A game should never be pay to win. It has nothing to do with being "casual". Also, learn what gaslighting means before using using a word you don't understand.
??? Then how will game stores exist? Its probably best Yugioh is just played at Kitchen tables anyways
@@TheYakubian
By selling packs and boxes and holding events. They don't make profit exclusively on singles sales.
@@jovenc4508 who tf gonna buy a box if the cards are worth 10 cents 🤣
I play yugioh but last year i wanted to play pokemom learned the game in like 2 days its really easy to introduce people
I got shifted into Pokémon a lot more during Link era.
The only problem with Pokémon is that it kinda gets stale and boring when you play standard overtime. Pokémon doesn’t really have much interesting interaction like yugioh does unless you play expanded format which is mostly supported online and not in locals.
@@thatman666 what r u're currents thoughts on yu-gi-oh?
@@yandoeseverything370try Dragon Ball Fusion. Is back and forth like goat format
@@yandoeseverything370 the thing that carries pokemon is definitely prizing, community, and events. tcg itself can get stale quickly so it's not something you want to be playing 24/7 unless your goal is to top every event, but it's still fun enough to pop back into every set release and cook up some new decks. cards being super affordable allows for that.
Before I quit I kept 2 decks for my friends in case they wanna play casually and fun
Game not fun for me and it starts to drain me mentally and physically
Fr. Unless you're playing meta, expect to lose. But even then you could always get Runick Stunned. Feels worse the longer you play.
Feel you. We got a local card shop that only accepts the goat format to be playing. His sales increased dramatically and new people peeked out just to see and some get hooked
@@Carlos.Rivera Yeah, "Standard" yugioh is a bitch
@@xgaming6609I play Yu-Gi-Oh Commander. It's more fun
New player here.
Why the hell are the structure decks only giving people 1 or 2 copies of cards and not just making a single structure deck with everything you need? $30 doesn’t sound like a lot to old players but by comparison other card games have structure decks that include everything you need for less that $20. There’s missing value
So you buy more
Because they could get away with it back when Yugioh was popular and only had Magic the Gathering as it's main competitor. With all of these other card games now coming into the fold with actual value and not ripping off the consumer it becomes even more apparent.
It's been a thing in Yu-Gi-Oh for ages even the digital games do this with Duel links and Master duel decks needing to be bought 3 times to work properly.
It's only so they can make you buy more
Digimon does it too. Honestly all these Japanese companies are out of touch, but weebs enjoy being milked. I love Digimon card game, but I'll never pay for it. I'll keep playing the simulator made by fans, and if I wanted to get physical cards I'd print proxies. All these TCG collecting games are gambling scam. There's no way around it. Structure decks will never sell you a complete deck, literally every guide will tell you to buy 2-3 copies which is ridiculous. It's intentional.
corporate greed. once they know you will buy once they know you will want more. they split it up with some good cards at ridiculous price. word of advice, get out while you can
Nobody wants to wait opponent play turn 1 unbreakable board for 30 minutes.
And not only that players using only 3-5 same decks which are current meta, so every time you play you are against the top 5 strongest decks in the game !
Just for the sake of the old days I played tag force 1 few days ago and it was so fun to play, back then yu gi oh was amazing all the way to tag force 6
Yu gi oh back then was totally different game, it was actually playable
@@decakjeisaozasuncem8843tag force 6 and arc v special are such fun games
No new player wants to deal with the essays worth of text on each card, prices, and the fact that the game ends as soon as it starts due to the power creep.
My opponent kept summoning monsters who all had two paragraphs and he wouldn't even let me read lol. The game is decided turn 1. Yugioh would have never made it past season 1 if it was like it is now
Yu-Gi-Oh has completely been dropped by 4 out of the 5 shops near me.
It's a dying game in my region sure a shop has people who play but the stock on the shelves if there is any is a year out of date. It's just too fast and one sided for people to play and pay hundreds to play for half a turn and they you die or brick.
They did this to themselves.
They made it to complicated.
They recently introduced YGO into the game shop nearby me with EXTREMELY cheap structure decks but events are barely a thing due to aforementioned powercreep.
I think in Poland MTG has a massive advantage over other TCG due to costless shipping of cards, while all other TCG has to rely on shady auction sites (and it's extremely hard to recognize fakes at times) or Cardmarket which has absurd shipping costs for Polish realities and inability to ship into those shipping boxes you use code on and we cal InPost.
Funny enough, in NZ all the local shops have dropped Pokemon entirely and only run MTG and Yugioh
@@shelly8563
Oh that's really odd because Pokemon is going gangbusters over here 🤣 and magic isn't going anywhere around here too
@@friendlyneighbourhoodsunwheel Oh people still love collecting and buying cards over here, the game just isnt as popular but still really popular in sales
And the game itself is constantly getting more convoluted and confusing from set to set
No, seriously, 2017 Yugioh feels like Duel Monsters in terms of complexity compared to now
It power levels new people out
“Git good” turns into “get gone”
Theres a massive problem with the game itself as we are at the point its a complicated way to play coin flip
You summarized literally everything perfectly in as few words as needed!
You can spend $900 to get mad playing a complicated coin flip versus someone who hasn't washed in a month, or you can do literally anything else.
@@vala32Mass Effect Legendary edition was on sale for $6 this summer. Is it perfect? No. Is sniping geth troopers more fun than watching someone else play weeb solitaire? Yes.
As someone that played YuGiOh throughout my teens I have really tried to get back into it now that I'm in my 30s but it just doesn't stick. Having so many detailed card-specific mechanics & the tiniest text known to man kind makes it too difficult even for someone that has a background and understanding of the rules. Somehow Magic has been able to introduce new concepts & stay fresh without turning every card into an encyclopedia. Maybe take a page from their book...?
Synchro and xyz are easy to understand, but pendulum and link are terrible, they really need to simplify the game again.
I am a disgruntled, former Magic player. My lesson learned: It makes no sense to fall in love with something that won't love you back and will only be used to extract money from you. YGO has a reputation for being especially egregious in this regard, but personally I would not get into any TCG at all anymore. This hobby is a waste of passion.
Any more?
Collectible cards were always about selling people random pieces of cardboard. Basically a casino for children.
@@MrCmon113 I love my luxury cardboard rectangles
@@MrCmon113 In fairness, Magic: The Gathering was supposed to be trading cards for D&D players. Then players went insane and started buying packs by the box, and the game was never the same
@@MrCmon113Y'know "anymore" can meam "I have learned my lesson", yes?
Literally every hobby works the way you described? You have to buy more and more supplies and the hobby itself doesn't care about you, but its what enjoyment you get out of doing the hobby that makes it worth doing. The only big difference I'd say is that with certain hobbies, like leatherworking, you get physical objects that you can take pride in having made. (But then I can argue that making a really good deck without netdecking produces a similar feeling.) I get not wanting to deal with MtG or YGO as they are actively predatory towards their consumers, but that doesn't mean every TCG is beyond hope. I sold my MtG collection and got into Flesh and Blood and Lorcana. Don't know if I'll be in in them long term, but I'm having fun with them currently, and that's what really matters.
If you aren't having fun don't do something, but maybe look into other card games. There are a LOT, including ones that are out of print especially, and a lot are not anywhere near MtG or YGO's league of anti-consumer behavior.
Komoney needs to listen to it's player base, the number of people giving them free advice on how to fix the game is alarming at this point.
As someone who loved the Duel Monsters anime and cards, Yu-Gi-Oh has become too complicated and expensive. As much as I'd love to get into it for real, it's become extremely overwhelming for someone like me who has been out of the loop for over 8+ years. Why spend hundreds of dollars to get into the physical TCG when I can jump online with Yugi and Kaiba structure decks in Master Duel for free?
If your local scene has an Edison format tournament, I highly recommend trying to get into that; its April 2010 format and banlist and its extremely fun and easy to start
@@lemlem35 I'm actually a big fighting game guy myself, so I attend some locals for those. There's nothing Yu-Gi-Oh around me at all. A little MTG and that's about it.
@@songoku2711 Thats cool, I'm glad theres stuff around for you!
You are wrong about one thing though
Competitive yugioh has always been expansive and a lot of decks have actually become cheaper and the game is more diverse imo
It's still very complicated and Idek how I got into it
@@songoku2711I’m a huge fgc fan as well, and I just found out about the “Vanquish Soul” archetype which is a love letter to the genre (especially 3v3 tag games)
Maybe you can look into that to try jumping back in
KONAMI FFS PLEASE SUPPORT LEGACY FORMATS PROPERLY
I unironically use Edison Blackwings and bulk bin Hasselberry Dinos to teach my friends yugioh and these older formats or even some bulk bin cards are amazing low power tools for teaching modern ygo
As a 20+ year Magic player, it blows my mind to have chase rares that are core components for meta strats be $150. The worst we usually deal with are $20, MAYBE $30 staples and they certainly don't get milked for cash in two or more subsequent releases before FINALLY getting banned. That's wild, yo.
Well depends on the format obviously byeah
@@olixx1213 I was about to say, maybe in Standard, but all the formats people actually play now this is not true. That or we have different definitions of "staple" cards XD
@@oldred890 biggest offender I can think off(that's not Vintage or CEDH ) is the One ring
Konami should really just release Archetype Structure Decks of archetypes which are around for a decade at minimum, and when I say archetypes I mean EVERY SINGLE ONE
Here's the biggest problems with yugioh:
- Rulings: This game can get really confusing, like, there are interactions in this that even I get confused on and I've been playing for years. This is largely due to card text and how konami words certain cards. So, if someone who has years of experience playing yugioh can still get confused about certain rulings, it's pretty evident that new players will struggle.
- Power creep: Konami really likes introducing cards that break the game and they tend to cost an arm and a leg, be it a new archetype or powerful staple cards. Now, yugioh isn't the only card game with this issue, but it still deters a lot of new players
- Prices: These really powerful cards tend to be over most people's budget and causes many players to miss out on certain cards that could help their deck out tremendously. Unfortunately, with the market being as volatile as it is, it's a struggle to get pricey cards even months after release and forces players to wait until the price drops or Konami introduces a new product with reprints of those powerful cards.
There are more reasons, but those are the big 3 that are causing people to steer clear from playing yugioh competitively or even casually
The funny thing is...
For MTG the cost of decks are 200 to 1000...but that depends on how far back you want to go.
Standard being current is always the cheapest.
Tho I'll say this you don't need a 500 dollar deck to be competitive in MTG.
Kashtira is basically a middle finger to just trying. Then they add Ash, Inferm, Zeus, and Baronne and its like "why bother"
Commander in MtG is the more flexible format rather than restricted formats.
If ____ COMMA you can Special Summon this card (from your hand).
If ____ COLON You can Special Summon this card from your hand.
The fact that there is a difference between them (i.e. which one Solemn Judgment can negate) is enough to scare away new players IMO. I'll be honest, I can't even remember how I learned the difference.
@@everyonethinksyoureadeathm5773 how much does it cost to build decent competitive deck to play at least in game store?
Most Japanese companies just do not give a flying fuck about making good products for western markets.
It took Sony and Atlus literally YEARS before they realized that PC gamers were willing to buy their games, but NOT a console just to play that one game.
Another example: Lexus failed horribly in Europe, and everyone knows why. You can get a 3 series with petrol engines and diesel engines anywhere between 150 and 510hp, whilst the Lexus ES can only be had with a 213hp non plug in hybrid... That aint what the European luxury buyer wants.
And Konami just follows that trend, by not deaming us worthy enough of their OCG products...
I guess Toyota in the US is an exception. I mean, the Camary is a best seller here, and when you advertise your car (plus the Supra) in something as big as NASCAR here, you should be driving great interest to earn those customers.
It makes sense for Sony, since they make consoles and have always ended up being incredibly popular. Xbox hasn't been good IMO since 360, and that ended like 10 years ago, which is why MS put so much into Game Pass, Xbox on PC, and buying studios to even have anything worth playing.
@@Boyzby the console games are developed on PCs. It makes sense for Microsoft, the PC software company, to push for an online service that gives you a catalogue of games, with the option to outright buy them, and to not have to develop a new console every generation.
sony is no longer a Japanese companies thoigh since they change headquarters to that damn cali
@@genkeikyou though.
I had long-time yugioh friends quit to go play Lorcana. I can't even really talk to them about this game anymore. They are completely uninterested. Konami seems to want young blood coming into the fold, but that seems to be almost a complete improbability now. They simply f'd around for too long and found out too late to try to fix it.
Honestly no? Konami does not care in the least about getting new players. They want to milk to community they have and are slowly realizing that the buying community rapidly shrinks...
No they didn't.
They did exactly what they wanted.
Rush Duels a thing they market now properly to kids. They don't care about not Japanese market because boomers still control the company and didn't know how to pivot.
The fuckers tried to end their Yugioh division for more pachinko only for Corona to happen. Unironically Corona saved a lot of hobby stuff.
Just look at how they never made any of the actual merch they could easily do based on stuff that exist from this game. How the fuck don't they have Purrley plushies?
Secondary merch that average person might buy like videogames, figures, plushies, accessories and so on. You literally have infinite merch opportunity for this damn series and they don't do it. They only started to do stuff for non-anime characters/cards.
@@RavenCloak13I hope that ONE DAY we finally get Rush Duels
then again Konami will have to fit it into their greedy schedule
Nobody, NOBODY, NOOOOOBODY wants to watch someone play solitaire and win before your allowed to go. The anime stretched it so thin with new mechanics it needs a complete reboot.
That doesnt happen tho
@LucasPlay171 Yes it does
"Why Can't Yugioh Get New Players?" Because the reality of the game has almost no relation with people's perception, or conceptualization of the game. Many people probably still think of the game as a slow plodding thing where two players summon monsters of increasing power, occasionally playing a spell or trap, and grinding the opponent down. Then they play a modern game and lose on turn 0.
Somehow this reminds me of the kid that jesse destroyed lol 😂 Full of excitement in his eyes before reality struck him.
A PS5 costs like $500
A meta deck costs the same or more
The meta deck is going to get hit especially if it is tier zero providing less enjoyment
Meanwhile the PS5 can last several years without obsoletion
Maybe that's why people don't get into Yugioh as much
But the PS5 has no games…
@@TheAnthonyC4 It's investment. If you bought Tear for full price before they got hit hoping to win a tournament or two, expect to never play them again in the TCG, unless you're on copium like me and run them with Skull Servant. It's no longer good enough. The PS5, it does have free games (Genshin duh), but also the amount of games you can choose from will only grow. Think of how much a PS3 goes for nowadays, compared to a deck from the same year. It only gets better with age, unlike yugioh. And if you're thinking you'll play Tear once it's unbanned? Dragon Rulers are still at 1.
@@samuelllakaj5439 You're missing the point in that the PS5 literally has no games and even Sony wants to move past it even though it's their fault the console failed.
A dual land costs nearly $500 and MTG is doing fine. The PS5 was obsolete the day it came out.
@@EinSilverRose actually, s:p little knight QCR IS the price of PS5 alone. lol. wait 3-4 months and it will hit rock bottom to less than 100....so it suks for people who bought the card for 700+. i'm waiting but i was also victim to these fluctuations in price...really really discourages players from even bothering buying cards...bad bad bad investment and playing with antisocial nerds is also tormenting. I just buy to collect and appease myself. I dont' play anymore, I do not buy sealed products, and I do not attend any events
So I was a long time mtg player who turned to YGO to try something new a few months ago. After a few months of playing YGO, from a new player’s perspective there’s a few things that make it incredibly offputting for new players.
1. The wordiness and font on every card. It’s incredibly intimidating to do this for your own cards, but once you understand how your deck works it all makes sense. The issue comes in trying to figure out your opponent. Eventually you just kind of give up and nod your head and say “yup” as they play card after card that you have no idea what it means.
2. The price point. Obvious point. I came in around AGOV right before RA01 came out. I was thinking it was a great time to get into it due to being able to get so many staples for cheap. Then it turned into the season of fire.
3. No mulligans feels bad. I completely understand why you can’t mulligan in YGO. But when you’re used to it from most other TCGs, you go to YGO and you’re just kinda stuck with what you drew. Feels terrible. Going second and drawing no hand traps and watching your opponent FC just feels terrible when you have nothing you can do about it. This might be the biggest thing to me. It feels like there’s certain games where there is 0 you can do; you lost the die roll, you lost the game.
4. The power of the cards feels absurd. I’ve described playing YGO to some of my mtg playing friends as “it’s like playing mtg but the only format anyone plays is legacy. And every deck is a different version of storm.”
There’s a lot to like about YGO. YGO is an incredibly fluid card game and when you can get going and see different lines you can take and the different steps you can take to get there it’s incredibly satisfying. I love the way the Extra Deck works in YGO. Having a toolbox available at all times is an attractive reason to play this game. Also, the YGO community has been some of the nicest group of nerds I’ve ever met. Definitely willing to show you the ropes and teach you the game.
I’d love to see YGO continue to succeed, the more card games/players we have out at our LGS’ the better it is for us all. But after a few months of actively playing YGO I’ve come to the conclusion that I just don’t like it and that’s ok.
the first point is the main one, higher power level has its niche audience, needing to read an essay of card text regardless of how unique the card has no niche that seeks it. yugioh players only don't understand how heavy of an trade off is needed to make essays of card text the better options.
I’ma be real, whatever Wizards of the Coast have done, they seem way better of a company then Konami
If Konami wasn’t so money hungry, and gave the TCG players more to work with, and maybe actually release Rush Duels internationally, it would succeed and bring in tons of new players.
But let’s be real, Konami’s always gonna be money hungry, and if Yugioh keeps declining, they’ll just drop it entirely in favor of something else. They only care about it because it makes them money, and once it’s sucked dry, they’ll toss it into the trash bin.
Only way I can see the game changing for the better, is if the big executives get kicked out and replaced with new ones with fresh new ideas, but otherwise us Yugioh players are screwed.
It’s funny, a lot of people are fed up with WotC for being so money hungry. Where as WotC has more prize support, Konami prices their products way more competitively. Mtg just had a preconstructed deck that is around $450. Absolutely absurd.
I wish YGO would get better prize support and some sort of way to play tcg online without having to go to DB or something
Couple of months after this comment and I’ve completely been priced out of YGO. I sold my whole collection and quit. The meta shifts in this game happen too quickly to stay competitive at any kind of a budget.
There is nothing to like about modern yugioh.
Bro you killed it with the retro structure deck designs you should be proud
Those are awesome. I'd love to get one of those. Especially if there was a Pegasus themed one with Thousand-Eyes Restrict
5:18
The variety in gameplay? Expression of skill? When I play Yugioh, I get OTKed 4 out of 5 games before being allowed to play. By decks that require very little effort save for how much money you spend and how many times you have to spin wheels to get cards out. I haven't played a Yugioh game with variety in gameplay or skill in nearly a decade and a half. It's what turned me to magic, where OTKs and infinite combos exist, but are either just banned or simply so frowned upon, even in casual play, that you can ignore it. Commander is fun for variety, expression and creativity/collection. Yugioh has nothing like that anymore.
Another problem is that yugioh doesn't really have alternative format support so if you want to play your first game of yugioh and you don't already have friends who play the game, congratulations you're getting thrown straight into the deep end of the meta have fun!
this video actually made me daydream about yugioh for 20 minutes and I've been the happiest I ever was as a yugioh player during these minutes.
I don't think Yugioh is complicated. It is just unfair and unbalanced.
.
I think TCG keeps 1-2 dominant decks on purpose. They kill a lot of decks in diverse formats. But they dance avoiding the real problem when the META is monotone (and very expensive). This may be their selling strategy. A dominant deck can create peer pressure for players who don't play the META. Non-META cannot play peacefully because the META is too oppressive. Also, because the majority of players only play with 1-2 of the same decks. This is easier to push them to buy new products, with the ban list. Just make the old META unplayable and offer them the new one.
.
I don't really like Time Wizard. We have modern "bad" decks and they need a spotlight too. Time Wizard is just old META, the decks in those formats usually already have a lot of spotlight in their era. Also, because it is just an old format, there will be no new cards to make the format fresh. Meanwhile, if we focus on the alternative format with modern low-tier decks. They're up to date, but they are still less oppressive, this will make the learning process easier. Because we can also use new cards, this format will always be fresh.
YGO is super complicated because of the heavy focus on deck searching. It makes the game very difficult to understand and get into, even for people who play other TCGs.
@@EvilMagnitude That's actually what makes it easier. Because you can just memorize the cards you need and search it. If the search is more limited, it will force the player to play with any combination cards they draw. Why you need to learn about multiple different possibilities, when you can start with the same best starter over and over?
i agree. plus people have complained about the game dying every time the game gets like this.
there's also the fact that casual is an option. you just need to find a good casual to duel at. or just do master duel or duel links.
100% agree. I think these are some points that many people just don't understand
My issue with Yugioh is all the archetypes I think have a cool aesthetic or are fun to play aren't viable competitively, the meta is just TOO oppressive where winning against a modern combo deck is basically impossible.
You can shout "git gud" all you like but fact of the matter is modern Yugioh is just far too complex and fast paced for casual players. The most fun I had recently was dueling with the Yugi/Kaiba reloaded decks.
Yeah that does suck! One pet peeve I have with some of the archetypes and their designs are that they're either trying to be competitive or their artistic design feels "uninspired". Of course this is my opinion.
modern combo decks are not strong at all, for the past couple formats yugioh has just been completely dominated by midrange decks
Modern combo decks are strong
That's why their used by meta players.
Or you could just find and play a better deck that matches your preferences. Ghoti, for example, has an actually good aesthetic, is fun to play, strong enough for newer players to find success at a locals, and, most importantly, it is very affordable. You just have to do research.
@Simply_Taido I've browsed through all the "viable" competitive decks and their aesthetic is either lame as fuck or the the deck itself is so complicated I'm no longer having fun.
Modern Yugioh just isn't a game for casual players and it's why the game is dying.
Konami treats you like an addict, so you should treat them like drugs. Dive in at your own risk buddy.
From a Magic player point of view, I don’t understand why they don’t take the Edison legality list and use that as the basis for a new format to print cards into while keeping power level reasonable, maybe even with set rotation.
I'd do anything to get that cyber Dragon try deck. Cheap thrusts so close to our fingertips
I don't know why they haven't just unified TCG and OCG at this point.
@@williamdrum9899tcg has a higher profit to cost that’s why. They desperately want to keep the same system and milk whales dry, they don’t want new players, just whales. They only want the new players as fodder and so throw a rarity collection bone once in a while to keep them quiet
Most fun i had in Yu-Gi-Oh was playing forbidden memories, duelist of roses, or the Gameboy games when the duels were simplified
The most fun I had is when I tag team with AI playing their stories and winning tournament together, more challenging and fun than playing as the MC or against the MC.
YGO Tag force is amazing.
@@ReigoVassalthe social aspect made it very immersive, and some duelist were very challenging.
Those games are not even Yu-Gi-Oh lol, you had fun playing other card games entirely
A few problems with current yugioh
The tcg has less value in packs than the ocg and it’s just more expensive in the tcg.
You’re definitely dropping a few hundred to make a competitive deck. It’s just way too expensive to get into as a hobby.
Unlike all other card games yugioh does not have a casual scene. The duel is usually over in the first 4 turns
Everyone has the same extra deck and boss monsters. There is no variety in the game.
The game is just way too complicated for older players from slower formats.
No casual scene is a huge problem among my friends because most of them dont lay competitively but are competent and play decks that can be strong. The issue is that my casual stuff tends to be a lot worse because old or too good because it got new support. And feel like encouraged to beat their face in so they can't opresse me when playing modern. So I often feel like I only have fun playing competitive in modern yugioh and usually not with friends.
Hi.
Player that stopped in '08.
Came back in 2021 and I'm not confused at all. So... uh... that last sentence isn't exactly true.
@@Practitioner_of_Diogenessame here, I completely and fully understand what the arrows on the blue cards mean. Me and my trusty summoned skull are doing great!
To me personally, one of the fact I learnt about these structure decks is that if you want your deck to be above average you need to buy at least 3 structure decks of the same type to get the cards you need, which are pretty inconsistent and annoying. If not you can buy singles too but not all lcs have the card you need.
You only talked about the commercial aspect, without really talking about the practical one. In practicality, you also have the synchro, XYZ, pendulum and link nightmare, which essentially makes it near impossible to have any form of creativity, because these systems are so powerful that nothing super meta will resist half a second to it. I played Duel Links because it used to not to have these systems,and now they put all of them, and it's an absolute nightmare and miserable experience to just wait 30 minutes for the rich kid to clean all your board to then finally attack you and end you in one turn. Then, there is the community aspect, with one of the worst and most toxic community of neckbeards ever, which certainly doesn't help either.
I honestly think the future of yugioh is more games. I feel master duel could easily help bring more players new and old, especially if THEY create a year-long GOAT format mode.
They need to bring back solo game (with more story content). One of the strengh of Yu-Gi-Oh is the huge amount of archetype and deck concept, we need a suport to play those deck without having to worry about competitive, just for the sack of enjoying the game.
*permanent goat
@@Animexdraco yes!
@Animexdraco Solo games would be cool, sadly i doubt it but i hope
@@Animexdraco are you thinking of the nintendo DS games? those NPC decks are very close to letting us play fun decks without worrying about being competitive
Definitely a lot to say about why modern day YGO is problematic (at least for some people, myself included). I feel it all stems from uncontrolled power creep, which then has a domino effect…high costs, extreme depth, long turns/short games (short as in small number of turns), focus on negations makes gameplay unfun, constant changing of the meta due to releases and banlists, vast majority of decks/archetypes are unplayable competitively, etc.
I loved YGO and play Edison/tengu plant locals and have been having a blast, but I dont think I’ll ever get back into the modern game since dropping out 2 years ago (I tried getting back into it early 2020 after never playing competitively). Solid vid btw!!
Games these days are long
Over 30 40 minutes but its mostly just ladder combo's to setup board not really turn to turn gameplay
Games at most got 3 turns.
@@DragonBallsolosyourverseI’ve seen games go to turns 4-5 still way way faster than a decade ago
Mostly 1 to 3 turns tho
Yugioh is killing itself at this point
Yup its like a cash cow that has been milked dry and konami is just beating it with a stick now.
good
4:42 I feel like Pokemon has done really well in regards to this with the league battle decks. They come with tons of viable cards, an (almost) competitive deck that can actually do pretty well at a locals, and a little pamphlet on suggestions for what cards to add to it to upgrade it. With the gardevoir ex one, you can basically get one of the best decks in format by adding a few cards to it. And it’s only about 30 dollars give or take. Very affordable. I think more games should do stuff like this.
I think a big part of it has to do with how the early series game is entirely different then what it turned into with link and xyz summoning. Most TCGs lean hard into their nostalgia while Yu-Gi-Oh tries to bury it. Yes I know they just did a rerun of classic sets a couple years ago but it changed nothing because of the limited supply
I think beyond legacy formats if Konami is going to support an alternate format they should have one that uses the modern card pool but that is catered to lower power decks. There are so many new decks that come out and a response is more or less, "Wow, this looks fun and interesting, pity it can't hold a candle to the tiered strategies." Like most TCG exclusive archetypes. Legacy formats are good for the environment, but they have a hard cap on the amount of product they sell and in Konami's perspective they might not even see a cent out of it - if someone ONLY plays Edison they can probably pick up the only deck they'll ever play for cheap from a third party.
Going straight from a legacy format to the current game - unless the legacy format is TOSS - is not a conversion you're likely to make. The allure of, "Hey, you play Lightsworn in Edison? Well there's these new Lightsworn cards..." may not make a conversion when the person says, "Yeah but the new Lightsworn deck still gets blown out by Snake-Eyes and Tenpai and stuff." If you could give that player an environment where he can play his favorite deck against other comparable strength decks, with the new cards, then he is more likely to look into getting the new cards - and by doing THAT he might actually get the confidence to convert to Advanced format.
I also think that if Tactical Try decks are brought to the TCG they should be available in-stores but also offered as print on demand. Evergreen products that let someone immediately leap into the game are just beneficial. If you miss out on buying a Structure Deck near the time of its release and it happens to be the strategy that most interests you, well, you're kinda out of luck. If something like a Structure Deck or a Tactical Try were something you could easily get whenever, perhaps with a SLIGHT markup, it's a win for you since you can get into the game cheaper, faster, and more convenient and it's a win for Konami since they get the money that otherwise would be going to an outside vendor - you can't even really say it's at the detriment of the game stores, either, since it's the choice between someone going to the store more regularly and willing to buy product and that person just not going.
Exactly my thoughts. We need a format where lower power decks can be played against each other, and use new cards. That's my problem with Edison and Goat, the card pull is only so much, and you can't use the new stuff.
Their whole approach to legacy support in modern formats is part of what got me to quit the game after nearly two decades. I played Gravekeeper's for years. They had always been a solid rouge tier archetype that could consistently do well in a local setting and make an occasional splash in a regional. And the last bit of support that they got didn't help them at all. Thrones of Necrovalley would have been fine if it played the way everyone who first laid eyes on it thought that it would. But it you had to choose the effect you got, and it had a hard once per turn clause for absolutely no reason. And if you still want to play GK, you still need three of those cards. But GK has absolutely zero viability now in damn near any modern setting. So why would I waste money trying for the new support? Lightsworn, Six Samurai, Evilswarm, the lost goes on and on. Why are you going to dangle the carrot in front of older players when the carrot is clearly rotten?
@@kiracaos For sure. There are so many low-tier decks of the past that later got support, only it came years too late to be relevant. Those decks with the newer support might have made some pretty viable rogue strategies in their time had that support been there from the start.
That might be pretty fun to do a custom banlist for tbh
Instead of ramping up new archetypes they should just add more support on existing archetypes to matchup to the format to slow down power creep flatten the curve so players can keep their decks for awhile
Yeah they need to have a series for a while where they go back in time or something
Or maybe like a mini Yugioh, smaller characters, big heads lol
Yugioh needs something similar to Pokémon Smogon having more formats that allow more decks to shine in different ban list for both speed duels and normal. It will help a lot for encyclopedia series type rule book for those who want to enter more competitive games. The book can explain rulings why some combos don't work.
I don't think they are going to get new players until the game simplifies. I tried to explain the game to someone and they just said fuck it. It's not that they hate complexity, they play 40k. It's that in Yu-Gi-Oh all the complexity is immediately mandatory. There is no "Just play Costodes or generic Marines until you get into the swing of it.
While this would probably make them do better than what they're doing currently, I don't think it solves the problem. As someone who only plays/played casually. Never getting new cards and being stuck in specific point of time isn't appealing, especially since an appeal to Yugioh for me was that there was never that "card rotation" where I can use any card regardless of when it came out as long as it isn't banned. Konami's massive issue is the special summoning power creep. Synchros made it so you didn't need an extra card to special summon extra deck monsters, but you still needed a tuner and non tuner so you couldn't just use any card. Then xyz made it just levels which is way too easy because you can also special summon into summons now, and links have 0 restrictions. They made the power creep ease of access to the extra deck and handtraps/monsters immune to everything. Now it's very difficult to counter play and there is no back and forth. Why would I want to play a card game where there is no back and forth? (Besides something being only weak to one possible thing such as banishing, while being immune to every other destruction. I'm not going to put a bunch of banishing cards just for that scenario when banishing doesn't normally fit in the decks playstyle.)
I think adding code cards for master duel in packs could be a good way to help players transition from duel to paper and vice versa. I want to switch to paper but I like having an online space to test things and it takes forever to get a deck online.
If I could have 3 traptrix or dark world structure decks online it would make the transition way easier.
That's a good idea to transition really life products to master duel. They're already doing it a bit with the tactical try decks. Unfortunately they're just an ocg exclusive
Ocg sealed product makes Tcg feel like a scam
Yet y’all still buy it like dummies
Because they are?
thats because konami uses the ocg to see which cards are good then up their rarity for the tcg since idiots will buy anything.
case in point dark armed dragon was a rare in the ocg costing less than 5$ then bumped up to secret rare for the tcg with a price of over 200$.
konami knows exactly which cards people want the most and make sure to print as few as possible of those to force tcg players to buy more products for playsets.
All trading card games are scams compared to other competitive games or consumer products.
At least on the West side... It's less on the game becoming meta and more on Konami being deepshit with their customers, their lack of dedication and attention to both the game and playerbase, the bad quality of the cardboards, a lack of interest to communicate with the people, allowing shit like cheating to the point of deleting comment ON A LIVE STREAM, etc. Konami of America is a joke, and the fact that Kevin and Julia (among other like Jerome) are still getting away because most of the playerbase are big consumers, it irks me. Though lately I learned that things may not be going well for once to them, I mean, apparently they are starting to rely on Yugitubers more among others. So yeah. I hope KoA gets ruined in one way or another and they realize that they need to change the people that are sitting in the high chairs.
As for OCG, I don't play there, so I can't comment too much, I can only say that they cards are not censored and the rarities are more fairly distributed. The game, they still have Maxx C which is the kind of card that would make people either love it or hate it, among other.
Maxx C is likely getting banned to sell Purulia. Purulia is basically Maxx C but with the common complaints fixed.
OCG player here so I can comment on it for you. Everything about it is better than TCG apart from a few weird tournament rules around how wins are determined when time is called, Maxx C being legal (it warps it to an astronomical degree), and Konami being too afraid of risk with the banlist.
use their last names too so people fully know who you're referring to
Finally some one who understands that the game internationally is managed by konami of america has nothing to do with japn, yugioh players dont even know who they're buying from lmao.
Just now catching your video, you were spot on with all of my problems with Yugioh for the past DECADE. Your Retro deck concepts got me checking out the game again, in old formats I never got to properly experience, I would actually pay you money to create these pseudo products as orica just cuz they look cool and gave me huge nostalgia dopamine I hadn’t felt in years.
8:50
100% agree.
I quit 5 years ago because it got too expensive for me to play competitively. It hurt seeing my lose value through reprints and the banlist.
You truly spoke the truths there.
The issue here is complacency.
Konami is so used to Yu-Gi-Oh! doing fine abroad that they see no reason to improve.
Especially considering MtG's baffling choices, Yu-Gi-Oh!'s mindset is to just do what they did, but obviously better. Rarity Collection vs. Double Masters 2022, for example.
Meanwhile, Pokemon TCG fans are eating better with a company who loves fun.
I can safely say that, if MtG decides to reprint cards for (reasonably) cheap (like Doubling Season or Food Chain), abolish the reserved list, and start to do what the fans want (like not making cards exclusively for Universes Beyond and do better products than Secret Lairs or especially the 30th anniversary edition), then Yu-Gi-Oh! would be in serious trouble now in its big three spot.
The idea of retro format decks is awesome, but you know what would be even better? Boxes such as the speed duel ones, that contain many half decks of different archtypes ready to play with friends.
Got into Yu-Gi-Oh when my friend bought me the spirit charmer deck. It was fun at first in our group but when we got more into it and used more meta staples, the fun just died. Went to digimon and mtg after a few years.
Never touching Magic. That shits pure cancer on your wallet.
No, you won't convince me that a game that destroys all your cards to be useable at a tournament is good or consumer friendly. Especially since they have been growing desperate.
@@RavenCloak13 tbf we only really ever play commander, and with usually 3-4 players so it just becomes a chaotic shit storm of "random bullshit go!"
Though I get it, plus there are a bunch of other card games out there to try so I'd say go check some out if Yu-Gi-Oh is burning you out
the best way for yugioh to survive is through single player video games.
I agree, this is excellent. But they will not do that, because they earn less money with it. The most profitable option for them is to sell cards (physical) or online games
LOL "the fun back and forth". Bro, this isnt 2004 anymore. There is no back and forth in modern Yu-Gi-Oh
I think he's confusing his HAT experience with current ygo.
To be fair 2011 Yugioh had some decent back and forth. 😂
the "fun" back and forth is me activating a bunch of effects on your turn as soon as or even before you enter your draw phase,, and then you do the same to me over and over again until one of us out-negates the other's effects.
@@GeeMannn fucking stupid play
Hey, I switched from Yugi to Magic many years ago (outside of Master Duel) because as an Altergeist player, I got tired of having to call a judge every time I bounced Manifestation with Silquitous.
A friend of mine came back by because he wanted us to play again. So I picked up 3 Fire King structures, got some budget stuff to make it playable, and went to locals for the first time.
My first match was against Ghoti Runick, where he had 3 Ghoti monsters trigger during my Standby Phase and I had 3 Fire Kings trigger at the same time, so we had 6 effects go off at once, and he was explaining I can activate one as Chain Link 1 and he gets all his effects, then mine may trigger in another chain, and he asked how I was such a noob that I couldn't understand how chain links work. Why did his effects all stack on the same chain and mine didn't? Don't answer, I don't care, because Outlaws of Thunder Junction drafts are a blast to play and Standard's gonna be so much fun after rotation.
I just got my stuff up and left and never went back. It's a game that cannot be played in paper, period.
Build a cube, peak way to draft mtg
I am curious as to which cards were used in that scenario now, as all your cards effects should stack on the chain first on your turn if they are trigger effects.
to be fair altergiests just have crazy rulings.
I played irl before taking a massive break and imo in the west or atleast in america there is a big issue with rule sharks and cheats trying get out of confusing people with rulings. I had to call a judge on someone because they were yelling at me that I couldnt bounce their monster with a non targeting destruction eff when their monster only had targeting protection and another guy call a judge on me for using double sleeves (they're legal to use) and then trying to cheat out on activating the multiple things in chain that werent triggers without letting me respond with effects. This happened in the same locals in the exact same day within 2 hours span of time; decided to stick to masterduel until I study overseas in Japan.
I totally agree with this. I've somewhat learned Yu-Gi-Oh through duel links and master duel and have played casually with a friend in paper before but I would absolutely never play at locals or anything ever. The rules without automation are too complicated for me and I hear so many horror stories about new players getting sharked and bodied out of paper play for their first experience, I might as well just go play magic with my friends instead.
"people agree that vanguard is bad and determined by luck"
this is unreal to me. i think this is some yugioh brainworm where they convince themselves that "drawing the out" is skillful in some way. just because vanguard has triggers (output randomness) other game players think that it's completely pointless, when yugioh has the *harshest* input randomness I've ever seen. when games end by turn 3 and your opponent can just have every answer on their first turn or open the one card combo? there's no mulligans in yugioh, because there can't be, but every single game is determined by the *opening hand*!! it's incredibly punishing, whereas vanguard is more lax and friendly. i think that type of design space is crucial to fostering a community. yugioh's game design creates its playerbase. the reason they're so toxic is directly correlated to how that game functions. you won't see people freaking out about vanguard because it wears randomness on its sleeve and people know what they signed up for. but for some reason yugioh players (and mtg) never got that memo that yeah, the game is basically always random. sure the top players will win over multiple games, but that requires people to keep playing multiple games. if new players hop into the only place they can play online or in a local environment and get blasted by handtraps/disruption/unbreakable boards, you really think they're gonna keep playing?
goat and edison are definitely still determined by opening hands but the people that really stuck with yugioh afterwards have the most sunk-cost fallacy mindsets ive ever seen. there's so many games where the correct play is apparent and determinative. joshua schmidt's latest video on the state of the game goes into this well with the two players at the snake eye mirror just telegraphing the best play because one of them drew the one card combo and the other didn't. who's gonna wanna keep playing that that isn't already invested?
im sure there's anecdotal evidence of people going "well i got my friend into the game and they love it" and like cool! im happy for yall! but i think just about any game is more fun with friends. yugioh is up against the wall when it comes to what its design allows and encourages. designs will continue to get more compressed, cards will keep doing more. they only have a competitive market to sell to, so they have to keep upping the stakes. rush duel kiiiinda fixes most of these problems because the opening hand isn't so game-determinative, but that's also got its own problems in a way. i think they're afraid to release it worldwide becausd it will eat into the tcg's market share, whereas in japan the culture of card games is so different. it's a small ass country where commuting is the standard. every town has a card shop within like 15 minutes. you're not gonna get that internationally, so they turn to online, and those environments are best of 1 and incredibly punishing.
i dont really know how yugioh can get itself out of this but it's the only game where i see so many people complain about its obvious problems but still give their money to a company that doesn't care about them at all. konami is one of the worst companies in the industry and they will never change this approach. if they do then hey, im happy for everyone and we all win but man. it's so discouraging and unbelievable to hesr yugioh players talk about the game like the company is the only thing holding it back. the design itself is beyond repair. going back to old formats is only gonna work for so long. i guess they could do a goat / edison "expanded" release and print new cards with old designs but how long will that last until that ends up back where we started?
i love your videos dude and this isn't aimed at you in any way. i think as a disenfranchised former player who's now making their own game because no card game is making me happy playing it, there's answers to these problems but none of them are "pray the shitty company fixes it." i wish yugioh was more friendly but it's like the game itself prevents that. it's like the marvel or hokuto no ken of card games. you made 1 mistake and now i get to play the game and you dont. or maybe you didnt even make a mistake, maybe just the round starting and youre missing your jab button. thanks for playing. it's no wonder the game can't pick up new players. all these people that fell off absolutely have valid concerns and only the most hopped up players fail to see it. i get it if your friend group is all playing yugioh. but maybe yall could play something else?? or a custom format? anything at all. any game is better with friends. and man if theyre not gonna hang out with you if youre not playing the game then maybe they arent your friends in the first place.
sorry for ranting this is stuff that's always on my mind. appreciate all your videos and i hope everyone can have a fun time with whatever they enjoy regardless. im just salty c:
Hi Kirran! I've been following your TCG development and love your insight. However the updates on your game have been scant as of late maybe I'm not looking in the right places but I would love to see the state of The Card Game ™.
Salty or not, this was a good read. Vanguard is my main game and I still enjoy it to this day, even though it's had its ups and...honestly pretty harsh downs. I feel like if Bushiroad would stop trying to push out so many other random games and just focused on Weiss, Vanguard, and Buddyfight (to a point), they wouldn't have kinda driven themselves into a ditch with the fanbases. I'm currently learning Digimon TCG, and it's been interesting, though coming from other games like Yugioh and Vanguard it does have some odd interaction rulings. Back on topic though, I feel like your comment was pretty fair, so thanks for sharing. :)
@@morrisdarling115 hi!! thank you!! i been streaming the process on twitch the past couple years. im in the middle of putting together the tutorial video and website and all this other stuff because the game is actually gonna be in pre-release within a month! free tts demo and hoping to take it to gencon and other places with all the vids returning soon. thanks for asking and the kind words!! i hope you have a great day 💜
damn such salt
You're 100% on point when talking about randomness. I haven't played YGO (or any TCG really) for almost 20 years now, but looking at modern play, it seems like the entire game is governed by what combo starters (if going first) or disruption (if going second) are in your opening hand, and whichever player has the more optimal opening hand is going to win 95% of the time. The reason I walked out on MtG very fast was because I kept finding myself starved of lands or spells during a game, letting my opponent clobber me while I sat there powerless. And the only remedy for that problem offered by my (extremely impatient & unhelpful) local tables was "uhh just build your deck better lol". I know my experience was definitely soured by a local scene that refused to slow down for a new player, but being irreversibly screwed over by bad luck is what I remember as my biggest pain point.
I guess getting into YGO is tolerable if you have friends who are willing to patiently walk you through the entire convoluted learning process, or maybe online play if you're OK with being indefinitely steamrolled while you desperately try to learn the meta, but lacking either of those, I can't imagine anyone looking at YGO as an outsider and having a good time
Honestly it's just better being an OCG player. Prices for cards are far cheaper and F/L list is perfect and has timely updates.
In the TCG, Konami is just a money hungry company and their F/L list is just cards that they have chosen when they get drunk and they only have a F/L change whenever they feel like it.
After switching to OCG and a player in Japan, I can say that my experience playing Yugioh here is infinitely better compared to playing in the US.
I'm in Master Duel now because it seems to follow more of the OCG philosophy than TCG.
@@spicymemes7458I see, and even that seems somewhat expensive
at-least you can many copies of a certain broken card or deck whenever
or just play casual. if you find a good casual they are really good because you'll be against some creative stuff. plus any player that tries to meta is frowned on or kicked out so bonus.
@thanoseid2883 I am talking about in a competitive sense. Any game can be fun and the experience for playing said game would be pleasant if you would take it at a casual level.
My wife and I actually got into modern Yu-Gi-Oh because of the two player starter pack thing. We had been trying to play with her old collection, but she had very little in the way of complete decks and I found the older game rather grueling. The starter pack really opened things up for us just by having a couple slightly faster cards around and because of it I ended up picking up Master Duel, where I discovered that the modern game with actual decks is way more interesting to me than the slow march of trap cards I'd been introduced to.
Because it’s too intimidating, too fast and at other points certain players can be too angry and have no patience.
Not everyone of course is this way. But sadly because of these issues, the game is very unforgiving and this ultimately why new players are put off.
I’ll be honest. Me and my fiends only play with proxies. So we can have as much as we want. This sort of hobby is far too expensive in today’s economy otherwise.
How do you make your proxies. I'm looking for a way to make nice proxies so the Edison decks I use to teach the game could have the correct Edison text
@@josephcourtright8071Yugipedia? There would be gallery there too for old cards, reprints and erratad cards and infos on it
You could just write on a piece of paper with a pen/pencil and slide it into a card sleeve.
I buy my cards from the bargain bin at my game shop. It's a lot of digging but there's a few gems here and there
I'm glad you mentioned the pricing problem. I feel that that is one of the major roadblocks for many people. Also the lack of an anime proper to pull new players in. Remember when Yugi was on all of the boosters? I got into Yugioh thanks to the anime, like so many others. Accessibility with mitigating power creep can also help. I also feel like maybe introducing retrains as a sort of "series" of rereleases of older 2002-2003 sets could also be cool. Like, most cards in Legend of Blue Eyes had no effects. What if you made a Legend of Blue Eyes Remix booster series, and all the old vanillas now had effects? Use nostalgia to older players, by making their favourite cards from 20 years ago viable again. I think that'd be pretty cool.
I'd also love to see more games released with cool twists to the concept. Remember Duelist of the Roses? I loved that game!
In short:
- Maintain an anime for new blood
- Regulate prices and rarities and maybe alot more retrains for older cards
- Accessibility to older players, make it fun again for them
- More video games
Im going to be real. Don't play yugioh, and if you do, quit. Save yourself a big headache and your wallet.
Is magic the gathering worth it?
@@henrycentury2767 idk I never played magic
@henrycentury2767
Depends. If competitive, then no because MTG also suffers from powercreep on restricted formats.
But as a hobby, yes. Go for commander if you want casual play, at least you can have a flexible budget on what you want to put in your decks.
Yes
Or if you do play Yugioh; play the older formats you like back when the game was interactable. Whenever my friends want to try Yugioh I introduce them to Goat and Edison, the modern game is just too far gone at this point.
I can’t imagine, even as a consistent yugioh player, why you’d EVER buy a booster pack when you can just buy individual cards on eBay.
Why should I pay 80€ for a Booster Box to not have any guarantee I'd find the 70€ I'm searching for when I can buy that single through CardMarket and use those 10€ in useful/liked cheap cards?
It's been years but nowadays more than ever that the new rule is:
*Never buy boosters, buy singles*
Structure Decks are fine and saves you useless additional shipping costs buuut... Boosters are NOT worth the cost.
And that’s why ygo cards are so expensive. Pokemon cards are cheap because people pull a lot of them, because generally the cards are pretty neat even if you don’t play. Good quality, great art, they’re just nice to have.
@@tracylaurenmarrow4639 if they gave me a good reason to buy packs I would. I buy Pokémon packs and still don’t even know how to play the game
The worst part about the price stuff is that it isnt even just your first cards. Some staples may have staying power, but many expensive cards become obsolete over time so that you have to buy this NEW expensive power-creeping staple. I joined yugioh over 3 times, and all 3 times had me getting the hang of using my deck just for 50% of it becoming obsolete (sometimes the whole deck) as soon as the next set hits.
"Oh but then you can sell your old cards" yes but due to power-creep making some cards cheaper, even IF you manage to sell your old deck to keep up, you end up in a net negative. And as a shy person it's even worse since I'm just not comfortable in entering the card market.
Not to say other card games DON'T have this, but this rotation and constant need to buy new cards only exacarbates the high prices and high barrier of entry. As I said, I managed to win over the barrier of entry, complexity, and high prices 3 times, but gave up every single time because of cards just becoming obsolete for the sake of necessity to buy the next omega-expensive, meta-warping card.
This video makes way too sense for Konami to execute correctly
*much sense*
I stop playing Yu-GI-OH in 2013 after I joined the military due to most the people around me playing Magic over Yugioh while we were at sea. I slowly fell out of love with it but always held a place in my heart. in 2018 I thought about getting back into the game but so much changed and new mechanics added, as well as people hating the new rulings/mechanics scared me away. Most of them said building many fun unique decks were dead now. Even to this day I would love to get back into the game after seeing them add support to Charmers to make them usable (even if they are bossless), but after looking at MANY MANY videos it doesnt seem like I would have fun trying to play against someone who is seriously trying to win.
Yeah nah stick to mtg lol
technically the charmer links are great staples. That's about it. Also, still no Dharc spiritual art.
Try Hearthstone if you want a casual TCG. I only play meme decks in the Wild format
You brought up the massive Deck Build Pack issue, let me just point out that one of my favorite pet decks came from the infamously terrible Ancient Guardians set, Ogdoadic.
I wanted to pick up the deck and run 1 (just 1) ultra rare, a copy of Ogdoabyss.
When the set came out, I obviously bought singles online instead of try to build the deck the natural way, which is awful for so many reasons.
There's 3 ultra rares in a box, and I wasn't even guaranteed to pull all the supers I wanted to run, and it's cheaper to buy online. Why would I bother buying the box?
I don't care about collectors rares, let me have the cards I need.
It's awful for Konami because the box of Ancient Guardians I'd love to pick up is still sitting on store shelves.
It's HORRIBLE for the LGS because, obviously, the box is still sitting there instead of having me pick it up.
It's horrible for the vendor selling on TCGPlayer, because he's selling me an Ogdoabyss - one of the 3 ultras in that box - for $5, and shipping costs more than the rest of the deck even on release.
It's even not good for me as a player, because it feels like half the experience of a card game is missing when we're playing the TCGPlayer minigame instead of opening packs which is what got us into Yugioh to begin with.
It's not good for you reading this, because chances are you're usually doing the same thing because sealed product isn't worth it.
It would be so fascinating to see what it's like if Konami's business practices didn't actively make us not want to buy their products. It's honestly insane.
I wanted to get into yugioh, so I downloaded one of the online games but the ridiculous amount of card text and mechanics and turn one insta desth combos just made it so overwhelming. Why would i ever bother to get into yugioh when games like hearthstone are so much easier to get into
This is from the perspective of someone who only played up until like, GX came out:
Idk man, the whole appeal of deckbuilding to me is actually finding cool cards that synergize in ways that weren't 100% intended but work well. Yugioh is "Here's a set of cards, they all ONLY interact with these cards, they NEVER do anything outside of this archetype" and that's 80% of your deck, with a few busted exceptions that are crazy strong standalone. Why would I bother with that? The card text is also unreadable af and I could just go and play a way easier to get into TCG like the Digimon, Pokemon or Magic TCGs. infact, I started playing Magic Commander like two years ago and that was a BLAST for a while. The social aspect was great, the fact I could use almost any legendary creature and make it my "deckmaster" and once you get the basic gist of the most common keywords, new ones are a breath of fresh air instead of annoying walls of text... And duels actually last longer than like 2 turns. I also don't play modern at higher powerlevels for that reason.
YGO just has way too much powercreep and reading to do, way too restrictive deckbuilding and whenever I FEEL like I wanna play it again, I look at modern and think "nah I'm good", with the older formats also not being interesting enough.
It's not so much that Konami hates us, but rather TCG Konami hates us. OCG Konami clearly cares about their player base by retaining solid pack structures and presenting solid precons to keep the cost of the game fairly low for OCG.
Meanwhile TCG core sets are abysmal, over printing commons, players don't seem to understand that just because TCG boxes contain more cards, doesn't mean the packs are worth opening.
The only issue OP has at this point (from what I've seen) is the lack of reprints for pivotal cards. Older set cards that have gained traction in usage in the meta have skyrocketed in price due to demand, locking out some decks. Fortunately, there are still some decks that can be built for a reasonable price like The Three Brothers leaders, predominantly using more recent staples and cards over older staples.
but ocg has say over how the tcg operates. so how come ocg isn't at least trying to get tcg to change?
@@erickkisreal9398 I'd suppose that TCG still sees enough sales for OCG to accept the state that the market is in. Shops are still paying well for product and the community is still active, so from OCG's limited view, the TCG player base is okay with their TCG boxes.
As someone who loved Duel Monsters and tried to jump back in several times over the past 20 years, Yugioh is by far the worst for beginners.
You tell experienced players you're on a budget and that knocks you down to a handful of decks. Locking you in
Many of these decks are heavily flawed.
Then they point out its tier zero format, and the best deck is $400 +.
It's not a good selling point to a new player skeptical of diving in that their choices are extremely limited and you need to pay to win .
Games like Pokémon have reprinted cards into the ground and make it easy for one to pick up 2-3 competitive decks for the cost of one Yugioh Budget deck.
It's a shame, but I stick to Master Duel when I want my Yugioh fix
Well i think the main issue when it comes to budget decks is that a) They STILL need certain high prized cards to be viable and b) Are very rarely tier 1 or above. Currently Tenpei is the exception with a tier one deck core going for like 50 bucks but in general, the more expensive stuff tends to be better.
"Either konami is stupid, or they actively hate you."
It's the latter. The west has ALWAYS, AAAAAALLLLLWAYS been treated like the red headed step child by daddy konami outside of the TCG Premier/TCG Exclusives. And among the other issues and them refusing to ban cards that just came out that are creating T0 formats and second-hand cards for triple digits, it's just us in an abusive relationship with Konami these days and us coming back to them like a battered GF/BF/Spouce. To say nothing about them "testing the waters" with Rush Duel in Duel Links and dangling a POSSIBILITY of them printing rush in english, it's just one of those things...where we're in a lose-lose relationship with Konami.
Plus, you just know if the TCG’s sales drop even lower, Konami will drop it entirely. As soon as they stop gaining money from it, they won’t care about it anymore.
I don’t think Yugioh in general will ever get better to be honest, not unless the big execs get replaced, and that probably won’t happen either.
We’re screwed either way.
@@leoultimaupgraded9914this is why I’ve decided to just keep 4 roughly equal power decks that I like (Dark magician, gate guardian, utopia and ice barrier) and just decided to only collect and play those decks with friends not attend any events/locals etc, not gonna spend thousands and not gonna bash my head into a meta wall.
Actually BlackRock owns 4% of Konami.
Japanese companies only give a shit about Japanese customers. Say what you will about boogymen like Tencent, but they treat every nationality equally. Frankly, it's a fundamental problem with Japanese culture, not just Konami.
It might have to do with the fact that the first game they play involves them not being able to play cards on their turn and then instantly losing
My experience with YuGiOh was super mixed. The community is probably one of the most exciting and passionate group of goobers I've ever had the pleasure to play with. There's a level of irony that's almost poisonous and I jive with yall. The problem is the game its self has a barrier to entry that is truly insurmountable.
With MTG, I could just pick a limited format like Standard and have a focused* card set to learn while I'm also learning the game. With YGO, I have... every card in the history of the game. I know not everything is viable at all times, but its all available and I dont know what makes a card viable or not viable. So for the foreseeable future, without incredibly deep investment, I will always be weeks or months behind the meta. And I just don't have the time nor inclination to devote the same amount to YGO that I did to MTG in the early 2000s. Im no longer a teenager with infinite energy and an abundance of time.
*Standard is no longer focused, or even the most popular format in MTG, and that riles me up bad. We no longer have a simple focused metagame to hook new players, instead everyone's running 100 card singleton decks with complex value engines that have a playlist stretching all the way back to fucking Urza Block that create hour long 'games' or we have 12 sets rotating into Standard at a time. I hate it.
My preferred way of getting new players probably isn't the best one, but I would love to see a new Yugioh rpg
Kinda like the World Championship Series. You put players in a rpg like world where they slowly upgrade their deck to beat stronger opponents, encased in a story that motivates them to continue and improve at the game, but without the competitive pressure of pvp.
With extremely strong and Meta Deck using optional or postgame bosses.
I think there might be a lot of new players being able to enjoy such a single player game and it would also tackle a new market for Konami in terms of Yugioh, which are single player videogames.
you're thinking the nintendo DS games right? I miss those
There are in my opinion 4 ways of getting new players into the game.
Games like you said where you can learn the game on your pace against computer in a story mode
Animes to hook up new people
Cheaper options to play the card game on locals.
promote old formats to get the people back into the game
so fucking cringe
Personally,people should just not support Konami at all,even if they do good like you said at the end. They have done terrible and rancid shit over the years and need a damn reality check for it. They don’t actively care nor are they interested in giving the tcg community respect and why would they? They mostly seem to be for the way Konami is treating them,not complaining about it as much as they should. The only thing they need to actually get to more people is to make their shit cheap,that’s it. They wouldn’t need to focus on making competitive focused decks. Honestly, I only say that because I hate the competitive side of the game and the community. But like I said,they won’t care nor they ever will, aslong as most of the community are being like braindead sheep and do nothing with how the game is right now.
11:45 I’m gonna go with the latter. They hate us.
As a TCG player who's last card game effectively died out, here's why Yu-Gi-Oh doesn't interest me
The entire meme is that you blow your entire load on turn one and win or lose. That's disgustingly boring. Not only are games way too quick and force a very specific meta (less creativity is ever allowed as a result) and it means there's an incredibly high knowledge gap, much more than other games, because games don't last long enough to learn where you went wrong (or that you may have done nothing wrong to begin with due to 1 turn kills)
A card games best decks should never cause the game to be meme on for frequently being 1 turn. This reason alone is why I just do not care to get into Yu-Gi-Oh.
As someone who had stopped playing Yu-Gi-Oh during Nekroz format, when I randomly started playing Master duel this year, it was the tactical try-out deck of Cyber dragons, that was given to you for a limited period of time FOR FREE even for ranked, that got me back into the game. Even without having crafted any deck, just having easy access to a competitively viable deck and being able to make it until mid plat and then having tons of gems to craft new decks was amazing.