Their recreation of the sets were impressive too. The attention to detail and styling (as well as budgetary restraints) at the time with the furniture and lighting was much appreciated.
This was one of the most fun Star Trek episode, i wish we had 2-3 more seasons of DS9, it would have totally been worth it looking back, we are still watching this show today!
I think that's an inside joke. Obviously, if people like to Kirk so much, they would be doing Holodeck programs with him and know exactly what he looked like.
Ironic that Dax talks about how sexy Spock is and then 20 years later, the actress marries Spock's real life son. If that's not the closest thing to time travel and alternate timeline mischief that Bashir was talking about, then I'm not sure what is.
Reminds me of David tenant marrying his favorite doctor who’s daughter then becoming the 10th doctor. Or was he the doctor first then married her? Idk but either way.
@@theareid3794 they met at the set of Season 4. That may not be unique. However Georgia Moffett is the real life daughter of Peter Davison, the 5th Doctor. And just for icing: David and Georgia had they first daughter in 2011. Who is the daughter of a Doctor, Who married to the Doctor's daughter, Who in real life also a daughter of a Doctor.
@@michaelgreenwood3413 That's the thing. They course corrected the worst of S1's gaffs. Honestly the show hit its stride when it jumpped to the 31st century. Granted to make that happened you needed the episodes in the past to lay groundwork and build relationships, but as someone who /HATED/ discovery? I'm glad it found its feet.
Spock noticed and heard them, he had to have. He simply realized that they were Starfleet agents from the future fixing the timeline and logically decided that it was best not to interfere and not to tell Kirk anything about it so as to not make any alterations to the timeline. But he knows they’re there in this scene.
@@PurpledaisyShasta he shows back up for an episode just to lecture them about how irresponsible they are. And probably also to get called a hypocrite cause he has time traveled so much.
Plot armor strikes again. Clearly, they couldn’t have Spock notice them as they weren’t in the original episode; the original scene didn’t have anyone working on a junction box while Kirk was on the intercom. In reality, of course, Spock would most certainly overhear Sisko telling Jadzia to keep working; Vulcans have excellent hearing. Also, given the general situation, anything suspicious would have been investigated, such as new crew members showing up suddenly! These two would have been detained for later questioning (probably by both Kirk and Spock) and thrown in the brig; at least until the Defiant beamed them out. This would have created a plot hole so big, a D7 cruiser could have flown through! 🤣
@@williamsquires3070 Given the size of the Enterprise crew at the time it's unlikely even Spock would recognize all crew members, especially at space dock. Him overhearing their conversation is quite plausible however but given his intelligence he could put together that they are basically working as temporal Starfleet agents
AIO UA-camr TV - Spock wouldn’t know there was a problem with altering the timeline, nor would Kirk. At least, not until they try to apprehend them and question them.
Decades later and the effects of blending the DS9 crew with footage from the original Tribbles episode still stands up. I wish I could see a short video on how they did this.
They made one, I remember seeing it at the time. It started with them blending one guy into a scene standing next to a turbolift & seeing if anyone noticed...
Of all the things that Kirk has done, stared down and fought a Super Man, took on psychics and reality warpers, etc....but what's Sisko interested in? What's it like to fight a lizard man...
Worf: They ARE Klingons, and it is a long story. O’Brien: What happened? Some kind of genetic mutation? Bashir: A viral infection?? Laughs in Capt. Archer: YES!!!
@@skinnyzachfilms yes, when I saw the fetus headed Klingons in the motion picture, I didn't say "hey, Klingons don't look like that!" I thought, "cool, so that's how Klingons look!" And anyway with the war with the Klingons ended with the organian peace treaty , so it was really stupid to drag it out for all those episodes in the spin-offs just cuz kids think Klingons are neat with the big heads.
@@skinnyzachfilms You do realize that everyone knows this right? Trying to come up with an inuniverse justification doesn't mean the real reason is unknown.
I was lucky enough to see DS9 during its initial run, but I missed this episode. A few years later, I did manage to see it, and I was chuckling to myself from start to finish. Apparently, this episode was produced as a way to celebrate Star Trek's 30th anniversary. And may I say that this was one heck of a way to celebrate!
O'Brien: What happened? Some kind of genetic engineering? Bashir: A viral mutation? Worf: No, the first film was given a bigger make-up and effects budget so they decided to make us look less like Puerto Ricans in gold lame` and more like heavy metal rockers with lobsters on our heads.
I still think that they should have just not shown Worf with forehead ridges from the moment they went back in time, and never acknowledged it in dialogue
@@Howyaduing That depends on how it works and how they travel. They're still linked to their original timeline, but if they make significant changes they're then linked to the new timeline as well since they're part of it. If they time travel again and want to return to their own time they'd have to break off the current one to return to their original.
Scotty: "Laddy...Don't you think you should rephrase that?" Klingon: "Quite right. I should. I didn't mean to say that the Enterprise should be hauling garbage. I mean't to say that it should be hauled away. As garbage!"
Considering it is implied that Bashir was born handicapped in multiple ways, it may not be outside the realm of possibility that he did become his own great grandfather
Worf: "They are Klingons, and it is a long story." O'Brien: "What happened? Some genetic engineering?" Bashir: "Viral Mutation?" Star Trek Enterprise: Yes to all of that.
There are reasons, and its humorous that yall get mad at enterprise for those things even tho it was spoken on long before that. Yall just love to be hypocrites tho its the trekkie way.
@@jonathansoko1085 I don't think anyone here has spoken ill of Enterprise. There may be people out there that only accept certain material as canon, and I would like to listen to those people explain their training before calling them names.
Man those Klingons evolve at break neck speed. They go from looking like literal humans in TOS to the more believable non-human alien race in TNG etc to downright mutant-looking savages in Discovery.
@@MrLukejstephens considering Star Trek is huge within the futurama universe as a fictional series that turned wrong into a cult ...it would be hilarious to have Futurama exist in the Trek prime timeline
Worf: "It would be an honor to meet him. My grandfather was his cha'DIch when he was accused of assassination." Would've been a nice opportunity to confirm that Colonel Worf was Commander Worf's grandfather. ;-)
He may be a so tough and ready to do what's got to be done that it's become a meme, but Sisko is also the guy who collects Baseball souvenirs. The man is allowed a range of interests.
This was a great great episode. The colour matching is unreal, and the green screen integration is impeccable! Amazing how 'non canon' it is though. :)
I love Dax's line "I remember this time. I lived in this time. Its hard not to want to be apart of it again" I imagine thats exactly what the og fans of TOS felt like watching this. I grew up in the 90's and DS9 and Voyager were my first series. I remember watching this episode with my grandma and she was so happy watching it. She started with TOS of course so for her it was a nice trip back. Now that im in my early 30's im getting that feeling of missing a time or era of something. For example, I really miss the early internet of the late 90s and early 2000's as well as gaming in the 2000's. The aesthetics along with the mood and how new both the internet and true 3D gaming felt. Good times to pass over into. The era of no Internet and 2D into internet and 3D. It will never be like that again man. Ah it was so fun.
The 1990s really were an end of an era, and the beginning of a new one. The 1890s, as well. Back then, industrialization was just starting to take off, warfare was being revolutionized, society was being upended, and the stage was set for the roaring 20s and the two world wars. In the 1980s, the seeds of another technological revolution were planted, they sprouted in the 90s, and by the end of that decade, technology swept up humanity and culture into a whirlwind of rapid advancement in so many directions. Humanity has gone from revolutions happening in thousand-year timescales, to hundred year timescales, and now it feels like we're entering into mere decades between cultural and technological shifts.
This was one of my favorite episodes and I truly wish they would have done another one. Seamless integration of episodes and it was stinkin' fun at the same time. It gives life to their history! Good old Worf, love his AWKWARD moment on the family secrets ;-)
Yes. I liked HOW they explained the mutation that made the Klingons look like that for a century until they managed to get their original appearance back. I thought that storyline in the "Enterprise" series was pretty clever.
@@tsundokus I haven't seen SNW or Prodigy, but they seem to be infinitely better than first 3 seasons of Enterprise. Like if it wasn't for the last season Enterprise would be complete garbage. Kinda like how people treat the never shows that haven't gotten their own final seasons yet. Edit: yep, both of them are better. At least the time bullshit of SNW was just a single episode compared to multiple seasons of Enterprise. Not to mention we already knew it could come up, compared to Enterprise. Prodigy is much more exciting to watch compared to Enterprise.
@@---oq5kb When Enterprise came out, there weren't a lot of other Star Trek options to partake in. And who didn't like Scott Bakula!? The show wasn't the greatest, but it was okay! And let's not forget about T'Pol ;)
@@---oq5kb I mean just look at STD. They call the main character a marry Sue while Janeway gets to do everything she did in voyager and become an admiral
Best explanation for different Klingons was provided by my buddy, who said we only saw the “High Klingons” in TOS. There was a revolution before the first movie and afterwards we only saw the low, or standard Klingons after that.
It's explained in Enterprise by the Klingons essentially gaining some human augment DNA into their genepool which changes them for a few generations until they cure it.
Best explanation I've heard for the change in how Klingons look was that, after having their butts kicked so often by the Federation, their spines had been pushed up and forward over their skulls. =^[.]~=
Amazing how they were able to so brilliantly blend the DS9 crew into a STTOS episode from some what was it at the time? Nearly 30 years? That takes a lot of post production work afterwards to pull it off.
I had friends who worked on Voyager. Apparently EVERYONE in the various show props, costume departments (including staff from the backlot) wanted to be on this episode. THIS was the episode to work on. Guys I knew who made props for the show were super excited to work on the 'retro episode'. And they went to great lengths to match the lighting, the FILM STOCK, the camera lenses of the original show. LOVED IT.
"And we don't discuss it with outsiders." "Oh, yeah, of course not. And if we see any of those outsiders we totally won't talk about it. Now, perhaps you'd like to tell some of your closest friends and people who've fought beside you for years about why the fuck those alleged Klingons look like humans wearing shoe polish."
For all we know, Worf doesn't know the real story either. With the Klingon Empire going back and forth from being honorable to being despicable, for all we know they might have been teaching future generations a false story, like maybe of Romulans or augmented humans forcing themselves on Klingon women or something.
@@theevilascotcompany9255 I mean the actual reason is we didn't get an explanation for it until a later show, and more than anything this was just to point out that no, it wasn't a retcon that Klingons suddenly looked different in TMP.
He was raised by humans, there's a non-zero chance he's never been privy to the details. Hell, I think it's remarkable he can even make the identification at all.
Yeah, I kind of prefer the original explanation: in "real life" the Klingons always looked like Worf/TNG Klingons, they just weren't portrayed that way due to makeup lmitations of the time. This was kind of a cute acknowledgment of the inconsistency but I didn't need a canon "explanation" for it.
I remember interviews where they put that as an option. Time vortex and... Dorn's suddenly in grease paint. ZERO commentary from anybody implying to them it's still the same look.
Me too! It's why I've never watched STD. If I ever do, I'll just imagine the Klingons look the way they're supposed to, and not how they appear on STD.
I love how sisko isn't even entertaining the idea of talking about men with jadiza. He's just like "Let's go old man. I'm not ready for this conversation with a coworker"
1:33 Why do I get this feeling that SiskoHad moments like this all the time when dax Was Curzon. Where he knew that if he didn’t remove DAX from the equation something bad was gonna happen
@@Stormkrow280 Futurama made a Deep Space Nine reference, you mean :P This episode aired 5 years before "Roswell That Ends Well". Bashir is quite attracted to a woman who has the same name as his great-grandmother, and knows that his grandparent's father was unknown, and concludes he could be destined to "meet" with her and become his own great-grandfather. O'Brien tells him he's being absurd, and the increasingly indignant Bashir goes "I can't wait to get back to Deep Space Nine and see your face when you find out that I never existed!" :) Sadly, didn't go through with it, so kudos still due to Futurama for finally making it happen haha.
@@antourte1 If this season happened in the mid 90s, then the joke would be a reference to "The Stupids", especially since Tom Arnold literally sings a song called "I'm my own grandpa", and yes it is as stupid and moronic as it sounds
@@deathbykonami5487 Haha, yes it's definitely not a new joke, I should've mentioned. Hopefully all creative people think about becoming their own grandparent the moment they discover time travel :)
Well he did say he wasn't well versed in this period of time, probably includes medicine as well, and apparently Klingons don't talk about it. Still making fun of Bashir is always a kick !
Similar to how nobody had any idea about Vulcan pon farr until Spock went through it. The alien races in ST seem very reluctant to discuss their biologies, and the Federation is very humanocentric in its outlook.
@@patrickflanagan3762 it helps as well that klingons dont have a very good relationship with the federation until yesterday's enterprise, even then for decades it was reluctant respect.
I remember when hollywood could revisit old content without DEGRADING IT, BELITTLING IT, OR "SUBVERTING" IT! This is a PERFECT example of exploring and appreciating old content.
Man, I love Sisko and Jadzia's friendship. It's so genuine. Even in this scene, the way he lets loose and talks to her about wanting to meet Kirk is a more relaxed side of him that we don't see with anyone else other than Cassidy and Jake.
This was so funny how the franchise finally addressed the issue of the 'low budget Klingons' for the first time! Especially when they all look at Worf for an explanation.
and he's wearing gold - that's command/Navigation Though IIRC Uhura wore gold in some early episodes - like all ship support outside of actual engineering. Security should be red
Watching this after watching the Lower Decks/Strange New Worlds crossover is fun. I'd forgotten that when the DS9 crew went back in time they immediately noted how hot Spock is, too!
Never was a DS9 fan, but wow.... this was very well done. I'm gonna have to find the full episode now. I'll maybe give the series another chance. Thank you!
Definitely give it another go. The first Season they were getting used to their roles, by Season 3, it really starts to get good and some of the best episodes in all of Trek come from DS9.
"What happened? Genetic engineering?" "Some kind of viral mutation?" Yep, exactly right. its a long story, about genetic engineering that ended with a viral mutation
“They ARE Klingons, and it is a long story. We do not discuss it with outsiders.” PERFECT WAY TO HANDLE THAT. No explanation, just a fun acknowledgement, and then it MOVES THE FCK ON God i miss how good DS9 was
This is my SECOND favourite DS9 episode, the seamless integration of the modern crew into the classic episode was fantastic and years on the effects STILL hold up. dialogue at 04:07 "Some kind of genetic engineering? A viral Mutation?" When this question was resolved in Enterprise, it was actually BOTH. No idea if the writers of the Enterprise episode ever referenced THIS episode of DS9, but they couldn't have been any more on the nose if they had.
And best of all, the entire episode is a flashback as Cisco explains his actions to the Time Police! Their comment? "Kirk. The man was a menace. Eight violations!"😂 😂
What was the book explanation? On Enterprise it’s explained as a result of a mutated virus after Klingon geneticists attempt to use human augment DNA to create superior Klingons.
The writers of this scene forgot that O'Brien actually met Mr. Scott in an episode of TNG. It might have made more sense for him to think the guy in the red shirt with the Scottish accent seems familiar rather than fanboy over Kirk. Worf would also have met him.
Bashir wanted to be another Marty McFly. hahahaha love that episode it's a shame The Next Generation didn't do something like this before it ended or a Mirror Universe one.
I don't think they did any Mirror Universe episodes on next Generations because Gene Roddenberry was still alive and he wanted to separate next gen from the original series
I love this episode. Dax's exclamation of " but it's James Kirk!" is not suprisingly my favorite moment. Terry Farrell's Jadzia Dax being one of my favorite ST characters. I'm sure I'm not the only James Kirk on Earth and I've met a few others over the years. Anyway great episode of a great show. Ben Sisko is MY favorite Star Trek Captain.
"We do not discuss it with outsiders" Too bad there is nothing as advanced as Wikipedia and ChatGPT in the mid-24th century during which Bashir and O'Brien lived, so they can look up the answer. I can excuse Odo for not being interested either way.
Cmdr Worf is a doppelganger of his grandfather. If other Klingons recognize him (as not fighting the humans), his grandfather might be branded as a coward, or possibly killed... and Cmdr Worf might never been born.
Klingons, by this time, have begun having their forehead ridges again. Many still don't, but many do now If he goes in without that hat, they'll recognize him as Klingon while seeing him socialize with Starfleet personnel. That would cause a major issue, as the Federation and Klingon Empire are one step away from war.
@@michaelmerritt7406 She turned me into a newt... I got better. At THIS time (circa DS9) it hadnt been established yet that they had ridges, lost them, got them back. Thats why this "not talking about it" was tongue in cheek but also lame at the time for not giving a proper explanation. Up until then, I think the convention was to just not acknowledge it in the show. And the audience knows its just the era of TV. I mean it would be like in one episode they talk about how for a few decades all the stars and planets looked really low quality from space. But then dont try to actually explain why, just "we dont talk about it". And now in current Trek its like oh wait we WILL explain there really was some crazy quantum field across the galaxy at that time that really messed with the way the stars and planets looked and moved. I mean they also are explaining why holographic displays went away. Etc.
Question going on though since StarTrek Enterprise added this to the lore, the cause for the Klingon's change in appearance was caused by species wide virus right? Why was Wolf not effected by the virus while he was was in this time period? and if he was would that mean he brought that virus back to the his time period?
But that is definitely something they wouldn't discuss with non-Klingons (outsiders). It would make them, in their eyes, look weak, succumbing to such a disease. Even though no one, but another Klingon, would think that way, old habits die hard.
JJ I agree. It would have been better as a bit of a joke, like the Calvin and Hodges Noodle Incident, it could be something that is referenced but never explained, somewhat in a joking manner to poke fun at the lack of budget from TOS
@@chainsoar Shut up Abrams, you're too cynical. Enterprise handled it brilliantly. One of the endearing qualities of the show was how they'd dip and dodge old Trek canon and sew loose threads together when possible.
While I agree with you that DS9 handled the subject with grace and subtlety (which is more akin to the TNG-style of storytelling), at the same time, I don't think Enterprise took it too far. Star Trek fans (myself included), tend to also like it when the details of backstories get revealed and fleshed-out -- Hmm... in context to the Klingons' change cranial structure.... HAH! A purely coincidental choice of wording on my part. :)
O'brien at the start, to Julian: "Don't you know ANYTHING about this time period?" Also O'brien, when Chekov, some random lieutenant, and Scotty walk in the bar: "ThAt's JaMEs t. KIrk"
I always thought it would have been a good storyline. If the "Soun's augments "d.n.a. was studied by the Klingons. If only because at that point in time .Not having that much contact with humans. They might have thought all humans were this badass .Something the Klingons would respect or fear or at least use. The results being the human looking Klingons . That went on to kick their ass and take over for awhile. Naturally, the Klingons wouldn't want to discuss this with outsiders. Another would be that the Klingons found another ship like the Botony Bay and those humans would caused the same problems for the Klingons as they did for earth.
Back when the immense richness of the Star Trek history was cultivated and respected by non lazy writers and producers, we had this truly amazing episode of Deep Space Nine. Discovery and Strange New Worlds and Nu Trek just don't give a damn, because it's too easy to forget history.
The episode partly came about by accident. The writers were considering revisiting one of the TOS episodes to mark the 30th anniversary but hadn't decided which one until they had a chance encounter with the actor who played Darvin and asked him if he'd be interested in reviving the role.
Still impressive how they managed to blend in the cast with the old Trek footage with a tv budget from the 90's.
Ikr
Their recreation of the sets were impressive too. The attention to detail and styling (as well as budgetary restraints) at the time with the furniture and lighting was much appreciated.
This was one of the most fun Star Trek episode, i wish we had 2-3 more seasons of DS9, it would have totally been worth it looking back, we are still watching this show today!
that’s because they weren’t as lazy or uncreative as you millennials are today. your generation has ruined Star Trek 😠
Not really. You could do a lot with a 1990s sci-fi TV budget. Like episodes like this.
O'Brien was partly right; that was in fact William Shatner's stunt double.
Really? Now that is interesting!
Wow! The stuff you learn on UA-cam!
I think that's an inside joke. Obviously, if people like to Kirk so much, they would be doing Holodeck programs with him and know exactly what he looked like.
I think that's the joke
I thought that might be the case. The way O'Brian kept going on about it I thought it might be a gag like that.
Ironic that Dax talks about how sexy Spock is and then 20 years later, the actress marries Spock's real life son. If that's not the closest thing to time travel and alternate timeline mischief that Bashir was talking about, then I'm not sure what is.
Looked that up. Funny that. Guess both have the features the actress/character likes.
R.i.p Rene A.
Reminds me of David tenant marrying his favorite doctor who’s daughter then becoming the 10th doctor. Or was he the doctor first then married her? Idk but either way.
@@theareid3794 they met at the set of Season 4. That may not be unique. However Georgia Moffett is the real life daughter of Peter Davison, the 5th Doctor. And just for icing: David and Georgia had they first daughter in 2011. Who is the daughter of a Doctor, Who married to the Doctor's daughter, Who in real life also a daughter of a Doctor.
In my brother’s words, “Gene Roddenberry was a time traveler. He didn’t die-went home.”
“Those are Klingons?”
-Every Star Trek fan after seeing discovery
and then 99% of them were okay with it come Season 2 when they fixed them.
The Difference is, here Worf can answer with "They are Klingons".
@@michaelgreenwood3413 you mean 99% of the ones who DIDN'T stop watching the show (or
Nah, Discovery isn't canon.
@@michaelgreenwood3413 That's the thing. They course corrected the worst of S1's gaffs.
Honestly the show hit its stride when it jumpped to the 31st century. Granted to make that happened you needed the episodes in the past to lay groundwork and build relationships, but as someone who /HATED/ discovery?
I'm glad it found its feet.
Spock noticed and heard them, he had to have. He simply realized that they were Starfleet agents from the future fixing the timeline and logically decided that it was best not to interfere and not to tell Kirk anything about it so as to not make any alterations to the timeline. But he knows they’re there in this scene.
I would have loved if the Spock from their time showed up at deep space nine after the mission to talk about their trip to the past
Oh God that would be amazing
That makes sense with those blasted vulcan ears
@@PurpledaisyShasta he shows back up for an episode just to lecture them about how irresponsible they are. And probably also to get called a hypocrite cause he has time traveled so much.
That's one of my problems with time travel. If the future is written in stone, via time travelers then logically you have no free will what so ever.
I refuse to believe Spock wouldn’t notice them.
Plot armor strikes again. Clearly, they couldn’t have Spock notice them as they weren’t in the original episode; the original scene didn’t have anyone working on a junction box while Kirk was on the intercom. In reality, of course, Spock would most certainly overhear Sisko telling Jadzia to keep working; Vulcans have excellent hearing. Also, given the general situation, anything suspicious would have been investigated, such as new crew members showing up suddenly! These two would have been detained for later questioning (probably by both Kirk and Spock) and thrown in the brig; at least until the Defiant beamed them out. This would have created a plot hole so big, a D7 cruiser could have flown through! 🤣
@@williamsquires3070 Given the size of the Enterprise crew at the time it's unlikely even Spock would recognize all crew members, especially at space dock. Him overhearing their conversation is quite plausible however but given his intelligence he could put together that they are basically working as temporal Starfleet agents
@@williamsquires3070 I think Spock would never tell Kirk because he don't want to alter the timeline.
AIO UA-camr TV - Spock wouldn’t know there was a problem with altering the timeline, nor would Kirk. At least, not until they try to apprehend them and question them.
@@williamsquires3070 Nah, prime directive.
That episode was very well produced, seamlessly blending the original with DS9.
except the fucking Klingons
@@manofsan I mean "yep those are Klingons too, don't ask, moving on..." is about as seamless as you can get without a total retcon haha.
@Fry Lock I obviously saw Enterprise.
Lol I wonder how Star Trek Enterprise failed at it😭
Not a easy form or concept to pull off but still they could’ve tried harder
The DS9 crew’s hair is still the best part of this very high quality episode. Bring back the beehive.
Decades later and the effects of blending the DS9 crew with footage from the original Tribbles episode still stands up. I wish I could see a short video on how they did this.
They made one, I remember seeing it at the time. It started with them blending one guy into a scene standing next to a turbolift & seeing if anyone noticed...
I've seen already right here in UA-cam... just look for it.. Good luck!!
Of all the things that Kirk has done, stared down and fought a Super Man, took on psychics and reality warpers, etc....but what's Sisko interested in? What's it like to fight a lizard man...
Priorites!
Well Cumberbatch did put up a fight.
Ahh a man of culture I see I do watch to much sf debries
Well sisko has also done all those things, but only kirk has fought a gorn, theyre very reclusive
@@JadenAShelton Unless you play the original Starfleet Command as the Gorn
Worf: They ARE Klingons, and it is a long story.
O’Brien: What happened? Some kind of genetic mutation?
Bashir: A viral infection??
Laughs in Capt. Archer: YES!!!
The real reason is budget. Haha
@@skinnyzachfilms
Yup
@@skinnyzachfilms yes, when I saw the fetus headed Klingons in the motion picture, I didn't say "hey, Klingons don't look like that!" I thought, "cool, so that's how Klingons look!"
And anyway with the war with the Klingons ended with the organian peace treaty , so it was really stupid to drag it out for all those episodes in the spin-offs just cuz kids think Klingons are neat with the big heads.
Worf sighs.... "Lack of make-up"
@@skinnyzachfilms You do realize that everyone knows this right? Trying to come up with an inuniverse justification doesn't mean the real reason is unknown.
I was lucky enough to see DS9 during its initial run, but I missed this episode.
A few years later, I did manage to see it, and I was chuckling to myself from start to finish.
Apparently, this episode was produced as a way to celebrate Star Trek's 30th anniversary. And may I say that this was one heck of a way to celebrate!
Wow. You missed this episode? How did you manage that? Lol
O'Brien: What happened? Some kind of genetic engineering?
Bashir: A viral mutation?
Worf: No, the first film was given a bigger make-up and effects budget so they decided to make us look less like Puerto Ricans in gold lame` and more like heavy metal rockers with lobsters on our heads.
They used both theories in the Enterprise series.
I still think that they should have just not shown Worf with forehead ridges from the moment they went back in time, and never acknowledged it in dialogue
@@personzorz That would have been hilarious.
More Indian than PR...If you look at Day of the Dove..all the extras look like they work in a tandoori restaurant.
@@projektkobra2247I assumed they were supposed to be vaguely middle eastern. Something like the pirates of the black sea
"We can't risk altering the timeline."
Your presence has already altered it. Go wild.
Like when I have a cold I go roll around in a bed of heroin needles :P
As far as most time travel shows go this really was well managed any more fulling and they definitely would’ve screwed up the future.
@@Howyaduing They would've just created an alternate timeline. Their own would be unaffected.
@@BeeWaifu but can they get back to their original timeline after the change has been made??
@@Howyaduing That depends on how it works and how they travel. They're still linked to their original timeline, but if they make significant changes they're then linked to the new timeline as well since they're part of it. If they time travel again and want to return to their own time they'd have to break off the current one to return to their original.
Nobody had old video of Klingons? Seriously, that's like saying Australians had horns on their heads 100 years ago, but we never knew.
Who says the australians didn’t?🤪
@@willscorner8423 what do you think they hide under their hats lol
For all we know they actually did
You'd be amazed what people can forget in 100 years. Especially if a campaign of disinformation is put into action early enough in that span of time.
Well, it was originally a penal colony.
Scotty: "Laddy...Don't you think you should rephrase that?"
Klingon: "Quite right. I should. I didn't mean to say that the Enterprise should be hauling garbage. I mean't to say that it should be hauled away. As garbage!"
Scotty stands up. Punches the Klingon. Starts a bar fight.
@@Yasuda9000 Scotty punched that Klingon so hard that all of that Klingon’s descendants had ridges and it became a dominant genetic trait
@@Stormkrow280 and it reverberated through to the past and created the augment virus to explain the smooth foreheads of TOS.
And Scotty took that personally.
You can insult every crew member. But you insult the Enterprise around Scotty. You are a dead man.
"Mr. Worf?"
"We had... budget constraints."
01:32 Lmao Cisco's little "Let's go."
Like he realizes the danger he's in having a flirty Dax around, taking like he would to a child.
And later, when Dax is like “Bones had the hands of a surgeon 😉😏”, Sisko looks right into the camera like “you see what I have to put up with?”
You gotta admit though. Those two make an excelant team. Imagine the trouble Sisko and Curzon got up to.
Haha came here for the comment, made me laugh out loud. He was done with Dax.
Considering it is implied that Bashir was born handicapped in multiple ways, it may not be outside the realm of possibility that he did become his own great grandfather
Oh damn!
Well, it's why his parents did the entire genetic engineering thing to fix his genetic defects. He's basically the better version of Philip J. Fry
That’s exactly what I think every time I watch this episode!
what ep is that from?
@@celestialsalamander Trials and Tribble-ations
Worf: "They are Klingons, and it is a long story."
O'Brien: "What happened? Some genetic engineering?"
Bashir: "Viral Mutation?"
Star Trek Enterprise: Yes to all of that.
STD: KlingOrcs
I always thought it was just makeup and props of the time. Is there another reason?
There are reasons, and its humorous that yall get mad at enterprise for those things even tho it was spoken on long before that. Yall just love to be hypocrites tho its the trekkie way.
@@jonathansoko1085 I don't think anyone here has spoken ill of Enterprise. There may be people out there that only accept certain material as canon, and I would like to listen to those people explain their training before calling them names.
What happen??
Man those Klingons evolve at break neck speed. They go from looking like literal humans in TOS to the more believable non-human alien race in TNG etc to downright mutant-looking savages in Discovery.
I refuse to acknowledge the STD trainwreck as canon 😑
Remember, they began to look different in Star Trek the motion picture
@@txdomino I liked their design in the Abrams films.
@@sirmount2636 per canon, Disco, Kelvin and TNG Klingons all exist as different Ethnicities of Klingons in the prime timeline.
"Discovery" isnt Trek...its garbage.
Dr. Bashir has been watching too much ‘Futurama’.
Didn’t this come out before futurama?
@@MrLukejstephens considering Star Trek is huge within the futurama universe as a fictional series that turned wrong into a cult ...it would be hilarious to have Futurama exist in the Trek prime timeline
He almost did the nasty in the past-y.
@@Infinity238Sex?
@@Infinity238 that past nastification is the only thing that can save the Federation
Worf: "It would be an honor to meet him. My grandfather was his cha'DIch when he was accused of assassination."
Would've been a nice opportunity to confirm that Colonel Worf was Commander Worf's grandfather. ;-)
Worf, son of Mogh, son of... Worf.
@Tony White But not in Worf's.
That was a missed opportunity.
I think there was an episode of TNG where Worf mentions that his grandfather was at the Khitomer conference, implying that to be Colonel Worf.
Not cha'dich, he was his appointed defense counsel. It's not the same thing.
Of all the things he could ask Kirk, the one question that comes to Benjamin Sisko's mind:
"WHAT WAS IT LIKE TO PUNCH A DINOSAUR MAN?"
Well, he did punch an omnipotent being from an incomprehensible continuum once... Kirk would approve xD
@@MadTurnip
Q: "Jean Luc Picard would never punch me."
Sisko: "I'm not Jean Luc Picard."
At least he knows enough to ask about something that happened in season 1 and didn't ask about something that happened in season 3 or about V'Ger.
@@stvdagger8074 We do not talk about season 3. -_-
He may be a so tough and ready to do what's got to be done that it's become a meme, but Sisko is also the guy who collects Baseball souvenirs.
The man is allowed a range of interests.
This was a great great episode. The colour matching is unreal, and the green screen integration is impeccable! Amazing how 'non canon' it is though. :)
I love this episode so much, it looks like it was filmed back in the day and the cast just looked proper next to the original footage
Props to the lighting crew and cinematographers.
@@rsrt6910 And to the crew and set designers who constructed very TOS looking hallways for the actors to walk through and hang out in.
I love Dax's line "I remember this time. I lived in this time. Its hard not to want to be apart of it again"
I imagine thats exactly what the og fans of TOS felt like watching this. I grew up in the 90's and DS9 and Voyager were my first series. I remember watching this episode with my grandma and she was so happy watching it. She started with TOS of course so for her it was a nice trip back.
Now that im in my early 30's im getting that feeling of missing a time or era of something. For example, I really miss the early internet of the late 90s and early 2000's as well as gaming in the 2000's. The aesthetics along with the mood and how new both the internet and true 3D gaming felt. Good times to pass over into. The era of no Internet and 2D into internet and 3D. It will never be like that again man. Ah it was so fun.
I imagine that's exactly why the wrote it that way. Much ado was being made about Star Treks 30th anniversary.
I’d pay a lot of money to go back to 1996 or 1997.
@ArmyJames I wish I could go back to 2005. I was born in 2001. I hated the 2010s and how bad the economy & my life got wrecked in recent times.
The 1990s really were an end of an era, and the beginning of a new one. The 1890s, as well. Back then, industrialization was just starting to take off, warfare was being revolutionized, society was being upended, and the stage was set for the roaring 20s and the two world wars. In the 1980s, the seeds of another technological revolution were planted, they sprouted in the 90s, and by the end of that decade, technology swept up humanity and culture into a whirlwind of rapid advancement in so many directions.
Humanity has gone from revolutions happening in thousand-year timescales, to hundred year timescales, and now it feels like we're entering into mere decades between cultural and technological shifts.
This was one of my favorite episodes and I truly wish they would have done another one. Seamless integration of episodes and it was stinkin' fun at the same time. It gives life to their history!
Good old Worf, love his AWKWARD moment on the family secrets ;-)
While Enterprise isn’t among my favourite Star Trek shows, the way they took the gag in this scene and made it a compelling story was very impressive.
Yes. I liked HOW they explained the mutation that made the Klingons look like that for a century until they managed to get their original appearance back. I thought that storyline in the "Enterprise" series was pretty clever.
Honestly that’s the last well written Star Trek show got a rushed ending but compared to every other show that came after it’s a masterpiece
@@tsundokus I haven't seen SNW or Prodigy, but they seem to be infinitely better than first 3 seasons of Enterprise.
Like if it wasn't for the last season Enterprise would be complete garbage. Kinda like how people treat the never shows that haven't gotten their own final seasons yet.
Edit: yep, both of them are better. At least the time bullshit of SNW was just a single episode compared to multiple seasons of Enterprise. Not to mention we already knew it could come up, compared to Enterprise.
Prodigy is much more exciting to watch compared to Enterprise.
@@---oq5kb When Enterprise came out, there weren't a lot of other Star Trek options to partake in. And who didn't like Scott Bakula!? The show wasn't the greatest, but it was okay! And let's not forget about T'Pol ;)
@@---oq5kb I mean just look at STD. They call the main character a marry Sue while Janeway gets to do everything she did in voyager and become an admiral
Another Spock fan girl. Same girl same!
Ironically, Terry Farrell married Leonard Nimoy's son, Adam, about 3 years ago.
Best explanation for different Klingons was provided by my buddy, who said we only saw the “High Klingons” in TOS. There was a revolution before the first movie and afterwards we only saw the low, or standard Klingons after that.
As explained in 'Debt of Honor'.
I've always preferred "We do not discuss it with outsiders". It just leaves enough ambiguity so that we can fill in the gaps ourselves.
It's explained in Enterprise by the Klingons essentially gaining some human augment DNA into their genepool which changes them for a few generations until they cure it.
Best explanation I've heard for the change in how Klingons look was that, after having their butts kicked so often by the Federation, their spines had been pushed up and forward over their skulls. =^[.]~=
The 'Debt of Honor' explanation.
Amazing how they were able to so brilliantly blend the DS9 crew into a STTOS episode from some what was it at the time? Nearly 30 years? That takes a lot of post production work afterwards to pull it off.
Yes. And because of that it seems to me that laziness is the reason why anybody would notice a green screen without trying these days.
I had friends who worked on Voyager. Apparently EVERYONE in the various show props, costume departments (including staff from the backlot) wanted to be on this episode. THIS was the episode to work on. Guys I knew who made props for the show were super excited to work on the 'retro episode'. And they went to great lengths to match the lighting, the FILM STOCK, the camera lenses of the original show. LOVED IT.
I don't know if anyone noticed this but around 0:46 it looks like Kirk notices Jadzia and wants to speak to her but the call stops him
It seems that way... Oh Kirk you Casanova. 💘
"And we don't discuss it with outsiders."
"Oh, yeah, of course not. And if we see any of those outsiders we totally won't talk about it. Now, perhaps you'd like to tell some of your closest friends and people who've fought beside you for years about why the fuck those alleged Klingons look like humans wearing shoe polish."
For all we know, Worf doesn't know the real story either. With the Klingon Empire going back and forth from being honorable to being despicable, for all we know they might have been teaching future generations a false story, like maybe of Romulans or augmented humans forcing themselves on Klingon women or something.
it was explaiend on enterprise
@@randomrazr Which would be great if this footage weren't taken from Deep Space Nine.
@@theevilascotcompany9255 I mean the actual reason is we didn't get an explanation for it until a later show, and more than anything this was just to point out that no, it wasn't a retcon that Klingons suddenly looked different in TMP.
He was raised by humans, there's a non-zero chance he's never been privy to the details. Hell, I think it's remarkable he can even make the identification at all.
What also would have been fun is to put Dorn in the classic (lack of) makeup and have the characters never notice.
Yeah, I kind of prefer the original explanation: in "real life" the Klingons always looked like Worf/TNG Klingons, they just weren't portrayed that way due to makeup lmitations of the time. This was kind of a cute acknowledgment of the inconsistency but I didn't need a canon "explanation" for it.
I remember interviews where they put that as an option. Time vortex and... Dorn's suddenly in grease paint. ZERO commentary from anybody implying to them it's still the same look.
Seeing them in those 60s hairdos always gives me a chuckle.
3:45
Basically my reaction when I first saw the Klingons in Discovery.
Me too! It's why I've never watched STD. If I ever do, I'll just imagine the Klingons look the way they're supposed to, and not how they appear on STD.
Who ever disigned the Klingons in std should be burned at the stake right
@@ARMEN-wb7ve of course
@@martyklestadt6766 it got better in Season 2 when they actually grew their hair out.
Those old female TOS uniforms always looked so damned sexy! Love the tights and boots combo, and Dax rocks it so well!
I love how sisko isn't even entertaining the idea of talking about men with jadiza. He's just like
"Let's go old man. I'm not ready for this conversation with a coworker"
"Yaas queen, I'd totally want a Spock on the streets and a Kirk in the sheets, mmmm'kaaayy..." 😻
@@theevilascotcompany9255 other way around.
@@caramelldansen2204 You only want it every 7 years?!?
1:33 Why do I get this feeling that SiskoHad moments like this all the time when dax Was Curzon. Where he knew that if he didn’t remove DAX from the equation something bad was gonna happen
Me to Doctor bashir : "I'm not taking temporal lectures from you Mr. "Im my own grandpa"!"
unicron3000 Futurama Refrence?
@@Stormkrow280 Futurama made a Deep Space Nine reference, you mean :P This episode aired 5 years before "Roswell That Ends Well".
Bashir is quite attracted to a woman who has the same name as his great-grandmother, and knows that his grandparent's father was unknown, and concludes he could be destined to "meet" with her and become his own great-grandfather. O'Brien tells him he's being absurd, and the increasingly indignant Bashir goes "I can't wait to get back to Deep Space Nine and see your face when you find out that I never existed!" :)
Sadly, didn't go through with it, so kudos still due to Futurama for finally making it happen haha.
@@antourte1 If this season happened in the mid 90s, then the joke would be a reference to "The Stupids", especially since Tom Arnold literally sings a song called "I'm my own grandpa", and yes it is as stupid and moronic as it sounds
@@deathbykonami5487 Haha, yes it's definitely not a new joke, I should've mentioned. Hopefully all creative people think about becoming their own grandparent the moment they discover time travel :)
"But it's..its...*James Kirk*!" Love Dax's enthusiasm.
Love how this clip starts with the doctor seriously contemplating getting it on with his great-grandmother. Gotta love time travel.
Futurama Writers: "Hmmmm we could do something with that"
Its was a great episode, using footage of the original seires merging with ds9
Sisko: habitually calls dax 'old man'
Also sisko: holds dax's hand while entering turbolift.
Dax: He's so much more handsome in person. Those eyes!
Sisko: Kirk had quite a reputation as a ladies man.
Dax: Not him. Spock!
Sisko: -_-
And then, years later, the actress who played Dax married Leonard Nimoy's son. So maybe there was a hint of truth in the statement.
@@briansammond7801 Wait wha-
(Google searches)
Huh...you learn something new everyday.
And Dax knew McCoy would become a Doctor because he had the hands of one. Man may not have liked pointy ears, but he had a thing for spots.
Plot hole - the historic Klingons would have recognized Worf as a Klingon as well
I love how the bar maid thinks they are so hammered they cant tell the difference between humans and klingons.
JULIAN BASHIR- THE DOCTOR- DOESN’T KNOW ABOUT THE KLINGON EVOLUTION?
Well he did say he wasn't well versed in this period of time, probably includes medicine as well, and apparently Klingons don't talk about it.
Still making fun of Bashir is always a kick !
Similar to how nobody had any idea about Vulcan pon farr until Spock went through it. The alien races in ST seem very reluctant to discuss their biologies, and the Federation is very humanocentric in its outlook.
@@patrickflanagan3762 it helps as well that klingons dont have a very good relationship with the federation until yesterday's enterprise, even then for decades it was reluctant respect.
@@patrickflanagan3762 "The fact that my internal arrangement differs from yours, doctor, pleases me no end"
The writers hadn't figured it out yet
They really nailed the look and feel of TOS. And those haircuts! Lol
The conversation that inspired Futurama episode. The one Fry became his own grandfather.
I remember when hollywood could revisit old content without DEGRADING IT, BELITTLING IT, OR "SUBVERTING" IT! This is a PERFECT example of exploring and appreciating old content.
Man, I love Sisko and Jadzia's friendship. It's so genuine. Even in this scene, the way he lets loose and talks to her about wanting to meet Kirk is a more relaxed side of him that we don't see with anyone else other than Cassidy and Jake.
This was so funny how the franchise finally addressed the issue of the 'low budget Klingons' for the first time! Especially when they all look at Worf for an explanation.
I heard that the security officer was William Shatner's body double.
Yes he was.
You mean 'stunt double'. In the biz a 'body double' means something different, if you know what I mean ;)
and he's wearing gold - that's command/Navigation Though IIRC Uhura wore gold in some early episodes - like all ship support outside of actual engineering. Security should be red
Watching this after watching the Lower Decks/Strange New Worlds crossover is fun. I'd forgotten that when the DS9 crew went back in time they immediately noted how hot Spock is, too!
I love this episode! You get all three versions of Star Trek: the original, TGN (Worf), and DS9.
Never was a DS9 fan, but wow.... this was very well done. I'm gonna have to find the full episode now. I'll maybe give the series another chance. Thank you!
Definitely give it another go. The first Season they were getting used to their roles, by Season 3, it really starts to get good and some of the best episodes in all of Trek come from DS9.
It's amazing that after all these years the producers were able to retcon Klingon physiology through an episode of Star Trek Enterprise.
I'd phrase it more like "the producers chose to retcon the increased makeup budget"
I'd love it if a girl looked at me the way Dax looked at Spock...
"What happened? Genetic engineering?"
"Some kind of viral mutation?"
Yep, exactly right. its a long story, about genetic engineering that ended with a viral mutation
They were examined in star trek enterprise for what happened
Worf's just too embarrassed to admit that the Klingon's looked that way because they couldn't afford facial prosthetics.
Until the movies started lol
One of the best DS9 episodes. Just the right mix of action and humor. And excellent split screen effects
Bashir just nails the Bones cosplay! :D
“They ARE Klingons, and it is a long story. We do not discuss it with outsiders.”
PERFECT WAY TO HANDLE THAT. No explanation, just a fun acknowledgement, and then it MOVES THE FCK ON
God i miss how good DS9 was
Jadzia was killing it in that dress
She was certainly killing ME in that dress..... woweeeee
just about every episode of TOS there was at least 1 looker
Those legs were hurting man bone
This is my SECOND favourite DS9 episode, the seamless integration of the modern crew into the classic episode was fantastic and years on the effects STILL hold up.
dialogue at 04:07
"Some kind of genetic engineering?
A viral Mutation?"
When this question was resolved in Enterprise, it was actually BOTH.
No idea if the writers of the Enterprise episode ever referenced THIS episode of DS9, but they couldn't have been any more on the nose if they had.
Sisko resisting the urge to geek out, until the end. Giving Kirk a padd to sign.😂😂
And best of all, the entire episode is a flashback as Cisco explains his actions to the Time Police! Their comment? "Kirk. The man was a menace. Eight violations!"😂 😂
Meanwhile Janeway: rookie numbers.
Rene I think is the only guy that could pull off "Klingons?" look around and be convincing.
Honestly this was so well done! I hope they got some awards for it. One of my all time favorite DS9 episodes.
I so love sisko's 'let's go".
4:45 - yeah the DS9 people are about to see what happens when a Klingon insults a certain starship to a certain Scotsman's face.
In some of the books about the Klingon Empire , the difference was explained. Not sure if it was ever considered "cannon " though
What was the book explanation? On Enterprise it’s explained as a result of a mutated virus after Klingon geneticists attempt to use human augment DNA to create superior Klingons.
The real reason is budget.
@@NoPowerintheVerse now I'm wanting to know that myself actually
00:58 I love Dax responding to the over the top way Kirk greets the guy on the intercom
Sico and Dax look like a teenage boy who took some responsibility and tries to watch out his lustful elderly sister lol
The blending of the old and new cast is simply amazing.
Did the show ever mention Worf's forehead changing shape in TNG?
Didn't that happen because someone actually broke in and stole it lol
The writers of this scene forgot that O'Brien actually met Mr. Scott in an episode of TNG. It might have made more sense for him to think the guy in the red shirt with the Scottish accent seems familiar rather than fanboy over Kirk. Worf would also have met him.
Bashir wanted to be another Marty McFly. hahahaha love that episode it's a shame The Next Generation didn't do something like this before it ended or a Mirror Universe one.
Not Marty McFly, but Fry from Futurama. He actually was his grandfather.
@@spaceflight1019 I forgot about that Futurama episode about Fry going back in time too.
I don't think they did any Mirror Universe episodes on next Generations because Gene Roddenberry was still alive and he wanted to separate next gen from the original series
@@josephlatourette8329 , I think you're right. I don't recall any Mirror Universe eps on DS9 either.
@@spaceflight1019 Actually, there are quite a few chapters about the Mirror Universe on DS9. Live long and Prosper!
Michael Dorn played in TOS, TNG, DS9, and Picard. Ha also appeared in five of the thirteen movies.
I love that Worf is just as interested in meeting Kirk as the others are
Terry who played Dax in real life did marry Leonard’s (Spock’s) son ;)
Can we all agree that TOS Klingons look better than the Klingons on Discovery?
Low bar, man. Like, a tripping hazard in hell low.
Ahhh discovery, the definition of if its ain't broke don't "fix" it
I love this episode. Dax's exclamation of " but it's James Kirk!" is not suprisingly my favorite moment. Terry Farrell's Jadzia Dax being one of my favorite ST characters. I'm sure I'm not the only James Kirk on Earth and I've met a few others over the years. Anyway great episode of a great show. Ben Sisko is MY favorite Star Trek Captain.
Years later dax marries spock's son!
"We do not discuss it with outsiders"
Too bad there is nothing as advanced as Wikipedia and ChatGPT in the mid-24th century during which Bashir and O'Brien lived, so they can look up the answer. I can excuse Odo for not being interested either way.
Why would Worf try to cover up his forehead instead of just claiming hes some obscure species no ones really heard of before.
The other klingons would recognize him.
You will be asking questions too if you seen one of your own kind and a non human clothing.
Cmdr Worf is a doppelganger of his grandfather.
If other Klingons recognize him (as not fighting the humans), his grandfather might be branded as a coward, or possibly killed... and Cmdr Worf might never been born.
Klingons, by this time, have begun having their forehead ridges again. Many still don't, but many do now
If he goes in without that hat, they'll recognize him as Klingon while seeing him socialize with Starfleet personnel. That would cause a major issue, as the Federation and Klingon Empire are one step away from war.
@@michaelmerritt7406 She turned me into a newt... I got better. At THIS time (circa DS9) it hadnt been established yet that they had ridges, lost them, got them back. Thats why this "not talking about it" was tongue in cheek but also lame at the time for not giving a proper explanation. Up until then, I think the convention was to just not acknowledge it in the show. And the audience knows its just the era of TV. I mean it would be like in one episode they talk about how for a few decades all the stars and planets looked really low quality from space. But then dont try to actually explain why, just "we dont talk about it". And now in current Trek its like oh wait we WILL explain there really was some crazy quantum field across the galaxy at that time that really messed with the way the stars and planets looked and moved. I mean they also are explaining why holographic displays went away. Etc.
Worf in the classic star trek? That's cool
Dax is sooooo fine
That TOS uniform certainly does flatter her. I was groovin on the TOS female uni when T'Pol wore it in the mirror-universe ENTERPRISE episode, too.
@@xaenon that was the uhura style slutwear?
@@basteagui Slutwear? Good heavens, I thought all the prudes died out like sixty sixty years ago.....
Question going on though since StarTrek Enterprise added this to the lore, the cause for the Klingon's change in appearance was caused by species wide virus right? Why was Wolf not effected by the virus while he was was in this time period? and if he was would that mean he brought that virus back to the his time period?
I flaw that they forget to realize Spock is still alive in the 24th century
I don't think jazida meet spock
@@Maharaja_of_Punjab spock is still alive in the 24th century
I would have loved to be in the room with the DS9 writers as they discussed how best to handle the great Forehead Ridge Conundrum.
This is incredible I've never seen this before
Kirk once rescued Lt. Captain Worf on Veridian 3 (in the movie Star Trek Generations).
The way DS9 dealt with the change in Klingons was perfect. Too bad Enterprise decided to take it too far with the whole “Augmentation Virus” plot.
But that is definitely something they wouldn't discuss with non-Klingons (outsiders). It would make them, in their eyes, look weak, succumbing to such a disease. Even though no one, but another Klingon, would think that way, old habits die hard.
JJ redesign was nearly a decade before TNG...
JJ I agree. It would have been better as a bit of a joke, like the Calvin and Hodges Noodle Incident, it could be something that is referenced but never explained, somewhat in a joking manner to poke fun at the lack of budget from TOS
@@chainsoar Shut up Abrams, you're too cynical. Enterprise handled it brilliantly. One of the endearing qualities of the show was how they'd dip and dodge old Trek canon and sew loose threads together when possible.
While I agree with you that DS9 handled the subject with grace and subtlety (which is more akin to the TNG-style of storytelling), at the same time, I don't think Enterprise took it too far. Star Trek fans (myself included), tend to also like it when the details of backstories get revealed and fleshed-out -- Hmm... in context to the Klingons' change cranial structure.... HAH! A purely coincidental choice of wording on my part. :)
O'brien at the start, to Julian: "Don't you know ANYTHING about this time period?"
Also O'brien, when Chekov, some random lieutenant, and Scotty walk in the bar: "ThAt's JaMEs t. KIrk"
Also, wouldn't you think O'Brien, the engineer, would be geeking out more about Montgomery Scott?
I always thought it would have been a good storyline. If the "Soun's augments "d.n.a. was studied by the Klingons. If only because at that point in time .Not having that much contact with humans. They might have thought all humans were this badass .Something the Klingons would respect or fear or at least use. The results being the human looking Klingons . That went on to kick their ass and take over for awhile. Naturally, the Klingons wouldn't want to discuss this with outsiders. Another would be that the Klingons found another ship like the Botony Bay and those humans would caused the same problems for the Klingons as they did for earth.
Probably the best integration from a modern series to a previous series.
Back when the immense richness of the Star Trek history was cultivated and respected by non lazy writers and producers, we had this truly amazing episode of Deep Space Nine.
Discovery and Strange New Worlds and Nu Trek just don't give a damn, because it's too easy to forget history.
The episode partly came about by accident. The writers were considering revisiting one of the TOS episodes to mark the 30th anniversary but hadn't decided which one until they had a chance encounter with the actor who played Darvin and asked him if he'd be interested in reviving the role.