New York's Lost Hudson River Ghost Fleet
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- Опубліковано 15 чер 2024
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Chapters:
00:00 - Why the Hudson River has military significance
02:29 - How New York ended up with the Hudson Ghost Fleet
04:22 - Why maintenance of a Ghost fleet is so expensive
05:10 - The Alcoa Cruiser
07:14 - Reactivation ships for the Korean / Vietnam war
08:23 - Why a 77-year-old grandmother sued the US Military
09:40 - Why Mothball Fleet ships are maintained
10:33 - Liquidation of the Hudson Ghost Fleet
11:34 - The Story of SS Exochorda
13:32 - What’s Left of the Hudson River Ghost Fleet
17:02 - Why the Hudson River Mothball Fleet needed to be scrapped
IT’S HISTORY - Weekly Tales of American Urban Decay as presented by your host Ryan Socash.
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» CREDIT
Scriptwriter - Brent Sapp,
Editor - Karolina Szwata,
Host - Ryan Socash
Music/Sound Design: Dave Daddario
» NOTICE
Some images may be used for illustrative purposes only - always reflecting the accurate time frame and content. Events of factual error / mispronounced word/spelling mistakes - retractions will be published in this section.
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I'll never forgive Reagan & what the Republican's "Devolved" into. For being the Party of the Military Industrial Complex you're supposed to know better than to knock the foundation out from underneath your Merchant Marine !
I'm an old guy now,82. However, during the early 1960's I frequently traveled on the New York Central Railroad frof NYC to Rochester where I went to college. The Mothball Fleet in the Hudson River was truly a sight to see from the train....a massive flotilla of large gray ships rafted together.
I remember the “mothballed liberty ships “ as my dad called them while going to Bear Mountain on the dinner cruise back in the 60s
As a 71 year old, i went on board of Liberty Ships in wilmington NC
All headed for dismantling. I wish o had taken all that Crockery that was there
@@thomascurran6186 I also visited Bear Mountain during the 60s and remember being able to see some of them from the road on the way north from Bergen County.
The clue is Mothball these sips were prepared for long term storage hence mothball so how did nthis come to be the ghost fleet OR a U tube click bait ?
These ships are from WW II. Moth balling simply means storage, either awaiting return to service, sales to private shipping, or scrapping. So we have ships that were basically obsolete by the early 1950s and deteriorating more every year. Some were sold and converted, some scrapped, but most just sat there, as is what happens at other warship and warplane storage sites. Blame bureaucratic inertia. But this is not click bait.
I'm a dried up Merchant Marine; I was going for my Third Mate's license 30 years ago.
There are several Liberty and Victory ships that are still around today; the John Brown and Jeremiah O'Brien probably deserve their videos, too.
Even by 1970s standards, the ships were obsolete due to their speed (or lack thereof), the labor-intensive steam plants (most modern ships are powered by diesel engines), and that they were breakbulk ships in an increasingly containerized world.
The woes of the US Merchant Marine is nothing new, as evidence by the Jones Act that was passed about the same time Babe Ruth first donned a Yankees uniform. (1920, to be precise.)
I was a young boy and traveled up the Hudson River as part of a cub scout trip. I will never forget that vision of the fleet on the Hudson River. It will be forever etched in my mind. It was just an awesome sight to behold.
I was on a scout trip as well, I think it was in the sixtys, we were going to a hockey game at West Point, I asked my dad what all the ships were for and he said they were Liberity ships used during the war, and yes it was a site to behold, all those ships tightly mourn together.
I seen the same ships at that time WOW !
I also remember driving along side the Hudson River, late 50s, early 60s and seeing these ships sitting in rows next to each other. At the time I was to young to realize exactly what type of ships they were.
Amazing story. I actually saw this fleet when ai was on my way to entering West Point in the summer of 1969. I never forgot that site as we were traveling up Rt 9W north to the Academy. I also recall that they were all gone about a year or two later. I have seen the anchor monument many times. I believe there is also a monument with one of the ship’s wheels nearby.
Hudson River Tug Captain and SUNY Maritime grad here. I couple of items that were missed in the video. The reason there were a lot of ships is because the war effort for WW2 created a Navy and Merchant fleet the size of which the world had never seen before. Today both fleets pale in comparison. Larger faster ships with modern methods like containers made these old break bulks obsolete, notwithstanding they were obsolete when built, but were acceptable for the war effort, because of their cost and ability to be made quickly.
The navigational hazard was not really a thing. Nothing terribly large can transit past Jones Point. Ships going all the way to Albany have a 25ft draft restriction. Besides Albany there are only a handful of ship and barge docks anyway.
The ships in the reserve fleet served as grain silos for government wheat in years where it was plentiful. The ships were actually serviced at a dock in Peekskill which you can see the remains of today. All of the buildings and tanks have been removed.
I grew up in Westchester county but never saw these ships, They were gone when I was a toddler. However old timers have told me stories of seeing them from the steamboat dock at Verplanck or sneaking over there in small boats.
It was a awesome site seeing these ships from a Hudson River Dayliner as a young boy. My father always wondered if one of these ships took him to Europe in WWII.
Mike Masullo maybe?
Ossining? Apple Ln, Pops, Cleo, OHS. L & T?
I grew up in Ossining, NY maybe 7 miles south of the Ghost Fleet in the 60's. As a kid in a car driving along Route 9A past all the ships was an awesome thing. They were mostly grey, chained together and BIG. I envisioned them on the seas in my young mind. I would wonder if I could sneak out and swim to them to climb aboard and explore them. Love ALL of your videos. Thanks.
My dad served in WW-2 as a member of Torpedo Squadron 10 assigned to CV-6 USS ENTERPRISE. We lived in New Jersey and we often went to visit family members who lived along the Hudson just west side of Hyde Park. He was always so excited about visiting the ghost fleet but also sad at the same time because his ship, the most famous ship of the war was not there and had been scrapped. I’m thinking that it was around 1967 the last time he got to see them.
In the summer of 1965, I went down the Hudson River with my aunt, uncle and 2 cousins on their boat. I still have vivid memories of the “mothball fleet”, West Point, Sing Sing Prison and New York Harbor. To this day, I still remind my cousin of her hanging over the side of the boat when we hit the ocean.
As a young man fresh out of the Army and Navy, I joined The United States Merchant Mariine. Military Sealift Comand (Pacific). I served as a member of the engineering department on The USNS Brostrom / USNS Skylar Otis Bland / USNS Southern Cross and other Fleet Support Vessels. They are long gone by now but they were doing a he'll of a job in the 1970s. Thanks for remembering those proud ships. 😮
I remember my father taking our family on Sunday afternoon drives in the early 60's to drive past the Liberty ships arranged along the river. Somewhere in the flotilla of ships was the one he served on during WWII. As a young boy, I was fascinated by just how many there were and the stories he told of the places he had been during the war. It's been 60 years since I've given any thought to those Sunday trips and this video brought it all back. Thanks for making this video.
Great memories seeing these ships from the deck of the Hudson River Dayliner on the way to Bear Mountain every summer.
Also, my dad (a merchant marine engineering officer) worked for the Federal Government Military Sea Transportation Service (MSTS) at the Brooklyn Army Terminal. One of his responsibilities was to assure the ships in this fleet were being properly maintained.
You mentioned "GRT" several times. This is "Gross Register Tons". It is not a weight. It is actually a complex cubic volume measure for how much cargo can be stowed on board. The same measure is applied to passenger and cruise ships, and does not represent displacement or physical weight of the vessel.
That is something that even some pretty knowledgeable nautical people don't seem to grasp, much less the average person. You very seldom hear on these you tube vids someone who knows the difference between GRT, dead weight tonnage, or displacement. I worked with a man who had crewed on several different types of ships over a number of years, and he did not know the real definitions.
I grew up in Hyde Park, NY and would always drive on Rt 9W to Haverstraw to see my grandparents as my parents grew up there. We would pass these ships all the time in the 70’s. I remember asking my dad what all these ships were for and he would tell me why they were there. It was a sight.
When I was going to school in duchess county I’d have to take the train from NYC to Poughkeepsie and I would pass by the reserve fleet when passing Tarrytown. Always wondered what sort of ships were berthed there. To a 10-11 year old boy, my mind would wonder if any were warships and what sort of battles they were in! It was exciting to see them. Sadly as your video said, they are no more! I made 4 cruises on the USS Independence (CV-62) and sadly she is no more too. She was the last aircraft carrier to have been built in the Brooklyn Navy Yard! That yard is also gone! We as a country as losing our heritage. It might come back to bite our butts one day!!!
It most definitely will if it isn't already
It will come back & bite And bite Hard
Sooner than we think...
I remember seeing the Hudson River Reserve Fleet as a child. Many of them were used to store wheat for the Marshall Plan. Also, two Liberty Ships and two Victory Ships are museums at various places in the USA. TM retired but still interested in historic ships
I remember as a boy in the 60's we went on a family trip from New Rochelle, NY to Bear Mountain.
We drove along the Hudson river and saw the reserve fleet. I think I was told many of them were WW II Destroyers.
Thank you so much for posting this video. My mom and dad moved my brother and me from Brooklyn to Fort Montgomery in 1957 when I was just 5 years old. The job he took was to work on these very ships both in maintaining them, or in some cases removing items for salvage. He worked there for years. One of my memories was my dad taking us to the entrance road in the spring to gather some flowers from the lilac trees that grew there. Your video gives me a lot more info than what I ever knew. All my dad ever called them was the "mothball fleet".
Great video. In 1991.on the way back from the Netherlands over a mothball fleet on the East coast. Most of those are probably gone to scrap aswell.
There were always things to see from the train to NYC from Poughkeepsie. The mothball fleet, Armory Island, and my favorite was was going right through Sing-Sing and being glad I wasn't there.
Remember the ghost ship fleet very well going upstate to visit relatives and my dad would call them the mothball fleet and say that possibly one of them was the ship that brought him back home from ww2 and probably brought him to Korea when he was called back to service. My dad was a proud veteran who served in ww2 and Korea. Miss him
As a kid in the 50's I well remember these ships as our dad would drive our family from our home in New Jersey north on 9W to Bear Mountain state park. Years later in the 60's I would pedal my bike along the same route to Bear Mountain state park, buy a candy bar and head back home.
i was on a liberty ship in 1967/8 Viet nam good ship did the job. ARG-4 USS Tutuila.
I remember seeing them growing up near there. Once, I got to go with some friends of the family's boat in and around the ships. They seemed massive when viewed as a kid in a small boat.
What a cool memory! So lucky you got to see them up close 😊
These old rustbuckets were not only a maintenance headache, they were loaded with asbestos and lead-based paint.
A few have been restored and are operational here on the west coast (e.g., S.S. Jeremial O'Brien and S.S. Red Oak Victory).
As a Steven’s graduate in the 1980’s, the ship was a part of the history shared with incoming students. In fact, the stories are still stared with classes today.
The story of students trying to take her out lives on.
Fun fact, fluid film was actually invented by the U.S. navy to protect engine components and other components that were susceptible to rust.. the originally just globbed tons of greasy onto the components, but found that 1. the grease would dry out, petrify and fail, and 2, when reactivating the ships, it was massively labour intensive to remove said grease, so the navy developed a wax based grease protectant that could easily be removed with solvents
I was grew up north of Albany NY on the Hudson river and didn't know about the gost fleet. The north east has an abundance of historical sites great place to visit.
My gosh, you have done another interesting show ! I'm always pleased . We'll see you next time thank you.
I saw the fleet in the late-60s / early-70s when I used to ride my grandfather’s boat, which he docked in Ossining. I don’t remember how many were left by then, but they certainly made an indelible impression on my young self.
The floating dorm was still around in the early 80s… kept on the piers below the cliff known as Castle Point…. Go Stevens!
In Susuin Bay, California (northeast of San Fran) there used to be the west coast ghost fleet anchorage. Most of the old ships are gone for scrap. I remember looking out the windows of my car as a youngster in the 70s wondering what they were.
Remember them well when I was a kid.
They started towing them out when I was in high school. Could look out the window during classes and see them every day
I may have seen it, or not. About 1965, when on summer vacation in upstate New York, my father parked our 1962 Chevy Impala at a lookout over what he described as the Navy's mothball fleet. But I recall the ships being naval warships with big guns, like destroyers. So maybe it was a different mothball fleet than shown here.
If I remember correctly, there were some destroyers moored at Peekskill.
Great vid, 25yrs in the USN it did make me a bit sad, you taught me some stuff.
Possibly being kept for use of it's low background steel. A hot commodity after WW2.
Living in Newburgh when I was young, I remember going with an uncle of mine on his boat down past Storm King Mountain from the Cornwall Yacht Club to cruise near some of the ships in the reserve fleet.
The. first time I saw those ships, it was in the late 1940s when returning from visiting relatives near Tarrytown. We drove past them at night. It was spooky as hell.
You are so thorough. Love em.
I lived in NYC n the 50's and saw that fleet many times on Sunday drive with my Mom and DAd (a WW@ vet), it was just off of route 9W.
The politicians Americans have been enduring with are tremendously substandard thinkers and their appointments to every important agency has shown this like here.
I remember seeing these ships as a kid growing up in Westchester County. The thing to remember is that all of the military equipment built for WWII was expendable. Also, in the 60's container ships were becoming the way to ship commodities. They are more efficient and relatively cheap to build.
We have the reserve fleet down here in the James River. I ve been down here since 2002. Then it was about 100 ships. Now under 10. 2 years ago we did some training in the USCG on one of the ships. It was alot of fun.
SS John W. Brown; SS Jeremiah O'Brien; and SS Arthur M. Huddell. Are museum ships.
I live in Rockland County,NY.
I REMEMBER SEEING ALL THOSE SHIPS!
Just a marker is there to commemorate the Ghost Fleet.
In the late 50's my aunt and uncle had a boat docked on the Hudson. I remember cruising up the river with them passing that fleet when I was probably around 12 years old..
EXCELLENT! FANTASTIC! THANK YOU
Here in CA, we had the Susuin Bay reserve fleet. 100+ ships. Including at one time the USS Iowa, a experimental stealth ship, and Howard Hughes CIA cover ship Glomar Explorer. Which recovered part of a soviet missile submarine.
All gone now except two ships.
I entered the US NAVY in 1965 and, passing along the Hudson River on the road, I viewed this huge fleet. It was a sight not to forget. Years later, during the Viet Nam War, a Liberty ship joined and passed through our little flotilla in the stormy North Atlantic. Truly it seemed like a time warp in the dark, grey storm-tossed seas.
GTR means Gross Register Tons. Its used to measure how much cargo and or people it can carry. It has absolutely nothing to do with dry weight of the 🚢.
I grew up waterskiing on the Hudson River. My father would take our boat up and down the rows of ships anchored together at Jones point and Tompkins cove as I skied behind him. Because of all the rows of ships it was the calmest part of the river. I wish we had iPhones back then so we could have filmed it!
I do remember seeing many of these ships on the Hudson as a child. My Dad told us about their history.
Great video. Can you do a video on The Blue Ridge Parkway and Pisgah Forest, Smokeies which see up to 15 million visitors per year?
I remember these ships, way back when I was a kid, living close to the Hudson River.
Another fascinating insight into,for me, a lesser-known aspect of US History...thank you...dgp/uk
When I was a child in the sixties my family used to take the day lineup to Bear Mountain in the summer and I used to see those ships sitting in the Hudson River
i remember seeing them at the foot of the peekskill bridge near Westpoint in the late 50's ..
My House in Germantown Quincy (Next to Boston) 200 feet from my House great ships went by my Kitchen Window because a quarter mile behind me was the World-famous Bethlehem Steel Shipyard, now there is hardly a trace that would tell you this Huge Shipyard existed, Quincy Suffered with all these Famous Companies that supplied the shipyard are gone, along with the skilled men and Knowhow and Job's / Carrers went with it, sad and sickening, scary too.
About 1048 my parents would travel up RT-9W towards bear Mountain Park. Along the way there was a roadside stop where the Victory Ships were stored in Hudson River. There were row upon row of these ships moored together. 100's of them. I simply recall seeing them as a oddity with little explanation. About 1965 I recall driving on RT-9W and saw these ships still residing there. Now there is a Monument on RT-9W along with a huge chain commemorating the Victory Ships. Now they are all gone. Just the Monument.
Several observations:
You mentioned subsidies and the Reagan Administration in the same sentence. You know government subsidies are anathema to Republicans and this one was an easy one to get rid of since US shipbuilding industry has other obstacles that are much larger and more complex.
Foreign shipbuilders do not have to contend with US Coast Guard regulations, OSHA, and other government agencies in the construction of ships. US built ships might be better built, have safer designs, and better working conditions for the ship builders themselves. But all this costs $$ and turns US ships into Cadillacs against other countries Kias.
Speaking of regulations, one group of regs stands out alone: environmental regulations. Other countries don't have as stringent regulation as the US and are lax in enforcing the regulations they do have. More $$ required for US built ships.
Finally is the standard of living most US citizens enjoy. This requires higher wages and salaries. Lower standards of living in foreign countries mean they don't pay their workers as much as US workers receive. This is probably one of the biggest factors in why merchant ships aren't built here. It is just too expensive to compete against foreign shipyards.
All these factors are also the reason that, once built, most ships serving US ports fly the flags of other countries. To register a ship with the US requires regular inspections, stricter maintenance and thus more cost than registering a ship with most other countries.
Nailed it!
Don’t look back…
Theses ships and their men were/are great. Planes and rockets seem to be today’s version of heavy haulers….
The Hudson River was also known for its high level of pollution…. Not so much today.
The river used to freeze pretty solid in the winter… that must have been interesting for the fleet of ships all lashed together…
😃
We're being turned into a 3rd world country pretty rapidly. Heirarcy wants a New World Order so only rich people will live well. Americans won't like having to live without our spoiled lifestyles.
I remember seeing them anchored out there when I was a boy.
I saw the Hudson river fleet mny time, as I live here. Een though they were old, they were awe inspiring
Yes they are!
I never heard of this. Have family in Pearl River & I went to school in Tarrytown. Oh well. Thanks 👋
The Liberty ships were coal steam fired. Only diesels are economical. Their hulls were also failing from age.
Liberty Ships were built fast and cheap. So many merchant vessels were being sunk, it made no sense to build them with quality, or to last a long time. They were also small and slow by even 1960's standards. They were part of history, but so was the horse and buggy.
@@texaswunderkind I knew an owner. They were fine, except they were very inefficient heavy steam. A lot of expensive materials went into Liberty ships. For hand loaded ships, the size was fine.
March 13, 2024
Do you think it’s at all feasible to repurpose the abandoned SS United States, built in 1951, currently docked at Port of Philadelphia, as an LNG Gas or Compressed Hydrogen Gas cargo ship?
My father's ship the USS Block Island was mothballed in Mobile Bay for years before she was scraped. None of her class of ships were saved.
My grandfather always told me about that pain in the ass lady. He was armed gaurd on liberty ships WW2
My father went to Manilla near the end of the war. He probably went by ship. Maybe one of these?
I believe the reason we will never build this many ships again is due to aircraft. It's so much faster to just fly service members and supplies overseas, that waiting weeks for stuff to arrive. But we still have many good naval fighting and service ships to move stuff into theater.
Not every thing can fly in the volume need for a war, that's why there is a large RoRo fleet anchored at Charleston SC. These ships are loaded and ready to go.
USA can't get enough young people to join the military anymore, so there is less personnel to move anyway.
I think part of it, is a major switch over from steam over to diesel vessels, and an eventual loss of those qualified to sail on steam powered ships diminished significantly. taking an older vessel built in the 40's and converting it to motor would have been extremely cost prohibitive as well, in addition to having a 30+ year old ship in terms of 5steel segregation in addition to the need to modernize and upgrade bridge equipment and engine automation as well. I have made a career on merchant ships that are 40-50+years old, and it is a pain to work on them sometimes because things you wouldn't even think of have been long discontinued by the manufacture, or the company no longer exists, or was sold off 5 times throughout the years, so certain things need to be custom made, which again becomes cost prohibitive to run them, let alone retain in a ghost fleet. there are provisions however for certain vessels not made in the US to be converted for duty in the reserve fleets. usually they are vessels that the government has seized for various reasons from other countries, and have undergone a conversion to bring to US standards.
Thank U sir
Great insight of US merchant fleet of 1940 now a ghost fleet. Jussojuan
I pissed on that stone😂
You should be real proud!
@@saddletramp6935 I am☺️✊🏿
As a kid my family was cruising the Hudson and came upon the mothball fleet. My father served in the merchant marine during wwii. we went down one of the rows of ships and we came upon his ship. he got chocked up. I don't remember the ships name now
The USA now how one company from out side America that builds Navy ship. It called Austal. There UA-cam Channel is cool. There a Australian ship building company. They recently open a big ship yard in the USA. They build for several navy’s and custom ferry boats in multiple ship yards around the word.
EXELLENT FOR ALL OF US, WHO SAIL SHIPS, WHO BUILT SHIPS (ESP. THOSE BEAUTIFULL WW2 FREIGHTSHIPS) --AND LOVED THEM
Its funny i use to see these ships in the hudson river and always wonder what ever happen to them . My question has been answered.
Painted on the buildings by the main gates of the Fore River Shipyard, the names of the many ships built there in WWII are fading away - just like America's greatness....
I never saw these but as recently as 20 years ago I saw a similar fleet in the San Francisco Bay area as I trucked freight in and out of the region. I looked on Google Maps and see no sign of them now. Did they meet a similar fate?
Could any of those ships in the inactive "fleet" have been brought back? Sadly no. Technology had passed them by. Freight is moved in containers now and those ships were built for "break bulk cargo", ie individual crates and boxes. Most of this cargo had to be protected from the weather and so was carefully lowered into the cargo holds of these ships and enclosed. Today, some containers are stowed in the much larger holds on container ships, but most actually ride on the main deck in stacks 10 or more containers deep. Those ships with their 20K displacement are just too small for today's freight requirements with container ships rivalling oil tankers in size.
We have found the first ever "Karen". 😂
This is interesting
Sort of dissapointed the Motball fleet at Baonne was not mentioned... That is on the Hudson as well.....
Video on macombs dam bridge?
So wait, "2 miles of ships" went where?!
MAARD is building seven new duel purpose vessels. One the TS Empire State VII was just delivered to Suny Maritime. The Patriot State will soon be delivered to Massachusetts Maritime. They are the first new Training Ships built ever for Merchant Marine Officer training. The same shipyard in Philadelphia will be building container ships after the next training ship is delivered. Yes the Merchant Marine fleet is small but American Mariners cost a high price. Hence why there’s only one large cruise ship that flies the US flag. Mariners don’t want to ship out with MSC because of what they did to so many mariners during Covid. Some people spending almost 2 years away. No thank you.
Saw them many
any times as we crossed the river into the city …. They are burned into my memory.
If they would only have sold them unrestricted, including for transport, more would still be around today, mostly having worked as coasters etc.
@4:52-State route 9 was mentioned by the narrator. Isn't route 9 a U.S. highway?
Why not just recycle the material from the ships instead of allowing to rust in the water.
Could we buy a few of these…..please
They have long since been scrapped. The cost to maintain one would have been more than it was worth.
I served on the USS Oglethorpe AKA 100 from 1966 till it was decomissioned in 1968. Built in 1944 it only served for 24 years of service. Seems such a waste of time and resouces for that little time of service. So much waste in our government.
The SS United States at Port of Philadelphia could possibly be repurposed as a LNG Gas or Compressed Hydrogen Gas cargo ship.
Don't call me Shirley
people look at me funny when i tell em we CANT do what we did in WWII we no longer have that level of industrial flexibility anymore.
U's think the marker would be well kept
The ones that can't be put to good use now/today should be sold for scrap.
We used to be a proper country
Till the democrats found communism a good idea
We still are… have no fear.
😃
It didn’t age out, Americans got lazy and refused to do physical labor like this… hard work doesn’t exist here anymore, it’s sad.
I just learned that only American Ships are allowed to deliver freight to Hawaii ports.
how does one start a ship building company even tho ive never made a boat i got this and the extra billion the navy will give me will be worth opening a shipyard ahahahah
with ICBMS and SLBM subs we don't need a supply fleet like that anymore we can fry the pissants!!!!
Grandma is sketchy! Any real estate ppl here can clarify if the waterfront property rights she claimed were correct?