Thanks for having me out Jeff. Always a pleasure to shoot. I forgot to mention in the video but the recoil on these were not bad at all. The single WH had so little recoil that I was shooting it one handed with no issues, the 2 WH had about as much recoil as my compact .45ACP. Also no one asked but I did an experiment on how loud they were. I shot a single WH without ear pro on and it was as loud as a 9mm with no ear pro on to me. I wouldn’t advise it, but you could get away with it once in a while.
@davidjernigan8161 Agree! Too much gap. Name of the game is pressure and with the sub pellets it left too much gap to build proper pressure. Would have been better crushing them before loading. If I'm remembering correctly , the sweet spot on these Diablos is 75gr but there are videos of up to 135gr I believe. Could be remembering incorrectly. Been a awhile since I was looking at getting a twin set of these.
I have a felony on my record so I can't legally own a firearm so I got one of these instead. Much better than a baseball bat in a home defense situation.
You can own one of these a day after you get out, and after 7 years in most states, felons are allowed to own firearms in yalls own home. Can't carry it or even take it to the range ever again, but there is that loophole made allowed for self defense
@@DisLike-ks3ln These are classified as a muzzle loader and federally NOT a firearm. That said, I would not get caught in NY with any black powder pistol. I think I still need a pistol permit to have one, but not certain.
Some places still prohibit a felon from owning black powder firearms so you need to find out for sure what the laws are in your area before ordering one.
You should try a buck and ball load. Using a .69 round ball with 4 to 6 .31War. Or 4 .36 cal round balls on top and load with at least 80 grains of FFg black powder. It does a wonderful job and is historically accurate seeing as how that was the standard loading of the smoothbore muskets in Rev war, War of 1812, Mexican War all the way up to the Civil war. A tip to help both velocities and shot spread would be to fill the space around the buckshot balls with a filler such as Grits or cream of wheat.
You sure about that? I know of times and specific places where what you said is true; but I also know of times and places (admittedly, I can't remember the citations to give them) when specific orders were given to _not_ load like that! If I remember correctly, buck'n'ball load was for dense brush, snapshot situations. On open ground, the extra buckshot was simply wasted, so loading it was a waste of supply. I would suggest patterning just a round ball slug, a minié slug, just buckshot, buckshot in a wad, and buck'n'ball (trying top, bottom, and cannisterized), and see what you see!
I tried buck and ball with my 6” Diablo, putting three 00 buck on top of a .715” round ball and 60grains of FFFg Swiss black powder in a musket-style paper cartridge. Very seldom did any of the buckshot hit an 18x24” target at ten yards, but the big ball did; so I deemed it not worth the extra recoil.
@@llEverydayCarnivorellyou know you can move, right? In May, I moved from Washington to AL. I cut my pay in half (almost, 60% of what I was making in WA). I emptied my 401k to make it happen. It was hell. But five months later, it was the best thing I’ve ever done. My pay is almost back to where it was because I work hard, we bought a house, because they’re not absurdly expensive here. Living here feels like we are in Leave it to Beaver or something. Crime basically doesn’t exist where we live. I can go buy whatever. I know it’s hard. Set a date. Let’s say May 22, 2025. Save like your life depends on it. $20k will do it. Get down here to the south. Or Oklahoma, or anywhere but Illinois.
@@llEverydayCarnivorellGet outta that state! My state just changed our constitution carry to include anyone visiting from another state. All these states turning communist and at least one state is assisting everyone so they don't end up in jail while visiting. I'm pretty proud of our state government. Never thought I'd say happy and government in the same sentence. We have the highest firearm ownership in the US and the lowest firearm violence in the US. Yeah, I'm bragging
Ditch the white hots. Those are designed for an inline 50 cal muzzleloader. There is too much gap around the sides. I’d recommend 777, blackthorn 209 or Goex fff. I believe your consistency and velocity will improve greatly. It also gives the added benefit of being able to work up incrementally to find your best load. For instance start at 50gr then add 5 grains per shot until you find the point of diminishing returns. stop there and enjoy. By the way that is a great looking shotgun.
I would definitely try something like 2F loose black powder. I've been shooting black powder small arms and artillery since I was 15, and those velocities are absolutely pathetic. I have a feeling the pelletized powder just isn't cutting it in such a short barrel with such a loose fitting projectile. Especially when you mentioned how badly it was fouling the bore. It really looks like it just isn't burning right. I don't expect blazing velocities, but what you have there is 14th century serpentine powder velocities. Or something out of a .32 cal smoothbore pocket pistol that only has to reach across the table. Or I could be full of ca-ca too, I don't know. I don't have any experience with pelletized BP substitute. Only ever used real, honest to goodness black powder. But in all my experience with the stuff, this seems very not right. But very cool video, as always.
Would something wrapped around the front half of the pellet to bring it up from .50 to .69 work ? Basically a sabot to help center the charge in the bore. Or 3d print a new gas seal design with a little sleeve to hold the pellet centered, so it would be a single piece load that you just ran down the barrel. Not a self contained cartridge because it wouldn't include the primer.
I have the smaller one now for 5 years, loaded traditional with many different loads, left barrel 9 pellets of 00 buck, right barrel 1 oz Foster slug gotta play with powder charge depending on load
I think you will find better consistency in powder, I don't know how to explain it but the pellets, they just don't feel like they go off the same way each time. 60-70 grains of substitute BP appears to pattern the most consistently from what I have seen. Slugs are still about an enigma as to the viability, but with the BH209 it's spicy, would love to see you optimize the loading for the foster slugs in these.
They kick like a mule, but at varying loads they don't seem to stabilize, I would love to see Jeff optimize this loading on the highspeed camera and chrono.
@@MrNikkoz I load 1 oz shot or slug and 60grs FFFg. That is a good one hand load. My home recliner gun has 120 Grs FFFg and slugs. THAT is a two hand load! I have owned it for almost three years. The early guns were soldered barrels and center strip. The new ones are billet machined, one piece. I feel they are stronger guns.
Thanks for the awesome videos guys! Been watching you guys for YEARS now and always excited to see what other new and or wacky ammunition you guys thoroughly test. However… I was deeply disappointed when I hoped on to UA-cam just now and realized after looking… NO ONE HAD EXTENSIVELY TESTED HOW DIFFERENT METALS PERFORM AS SHOTGUN SLUGS!!! I was especially surprised when I realized YOU guys haven’t done that. You’re the most scientific and thorough gun channel I’ve ever seen… the “guga foods” of shotgun ammo. Thank god for the ability to tip and make a simple request…. PLEASE PLEASE PALEEEEEASE test a series of shotgun slugs for each type of metal, period. Like ones made of copper, iron, steel, aluminum, tin, lead, iron oxide, silver, gold, platinum, titanium, etc… you guys get the idea. And again, love your videos and the awesome content you guys constantly put out!😁
Thank you so much! We have tested slugs made of titanium, gold (2 oz), silver, copper, brass, aluminum, cast iron, steel, stainless steel, zinc, pot metal, gallium, bismuth and of course lead.
Thanks for the video. You settled a lot of curiosity. I can’t imagine why only these particular things were produced by a company and not something like a coach gun, too.
Wow what a beautiful bit of workmanship. Again we can't own anything like this in the UK. Sort of thing that would make you feel safer in Tiger Bay after midnight. Could do with more ooomph. More of a tickler than a snootah
Thanks for posting the video. Did American Guncraft provide these pistols? If so then thanks to them. Thanks to Bubba Roundtree Outdoors for the ammo. Thanks to Zach for his shooting. And thanks to Jeff for the tabletop, the loading and his videography .
@@Stuka01210 do you think these gun channels don't get the guns to fire as a way to advertise them? unless they say they bought them you can pretty much figure they were provided the guns to review
White hot pellets need barrel length for velocity and being molded for 50cal barrels you have a lot of airspace around the pellet when in the 12 gauge barrel. I would like to see this repeated with 70 to 80 grains of loose powder (Pyrodex RS, Triple 7 or 3F black) and a traditional wad with say 24 pellets of #4 buck or 30 pellets of F buck. I think you will be surprised at the velocities.
You need to go with a powder form propellant.. black powder or 777. You'll see dramatic increase in performance. Muzzleloading shotguns are finicky creatures. You have to play with a combination of components to find what works best
The results make perfect sense. Doubling the powder load roughly doubles the velocity, and since KE = 1/2(m)(v^2), doubling the velocity quadruples the energy. Two white hots looks like the correct load for this (especially if you hate your wrist)
I never did mention in the video but the recoil was very manageable. Even the 2 white hots didn’t feel any worse than my compact .45acp. I actually shot the one white hot 1 handed in a few shots just because it was easier to get camera shots with it.
I have the 11-inch Desperado in 12 gauge, though I bought the blued/rubber economy version. I bought it several years ago during the insanity where bullets, pellets, slugs, primers etc. were all next to impossible to find. I settled on using .31 Hornady balls intended for cap and ball revolvers. With a load of about 70 grains of Triple 7 and 11 balls, I get a fairly consistent 800-850 fps, a loading which at close range can probably kill anything that walks the earth. One thing I do that you did not was making good use of wads over the powder and then a thick lubricated one over the pellets, all of which I pack down with the ramrod as hard as I can. it could be that I'm getting better velocity than you did simply because the packed wads allow the powder to burn a bit longer before it overcomes the friction, thus allowing the gunpowder to burn more efficiently. Now that the components are a lot easier to find, I bought a box of #4 buck that I'm about to experiment with. I'm going to load about 1.25 ounces of shot with a reduced load of around 50 grains of powder. The reason for this is if I ever need to use this thing to defend my home, I don't want to kill everyone in the apartment building in addition to the burglar. Incidently, for anyone thinking of buying one of these things, I'd recommend avoiding the 6-inch version. I had one and while it's nicely compact and certainly the one most friendly to carry, the barrels are really too short to efficently burn any amount of powder. I was never able to top 750 fps even with only 6 .31 balls and any charge of powder. The 11 inch I have now is great for shooting and making good use of the powder, but is extremely awkward, about like one of my enormous Walker Colts. Take my word for it, the sweet spot is the 8-inch version of the Desperado. I was going to cut down my 11-inch barrels but instead I'm just going to order another of these lovely pistols in 8 inch.
yes the slugs you use are the slugs you use to handload regular 12 gauge shotgun shells. they have a sabot on them. you can also use the plastic shotshell holders used in shotgun reloading to make the pellets bunch together.
This was great! I really would like to see a slow motion of the 000 entering the Gell; from what I can see it look like about a 6X6 pattern. Throw in some bones and organs to shatter and smash up; I'd suspect you could get a 6" hole going half way through someone -- or all the way through if you use two propellants.
Love BP rifles and revolvers. Haven't seen his brand of BP before. Pellets are just too compressed and sometimes don't burn off. I stopped using them in 2011 and strictly use powder. Great Video. God Bless
@@jesscobb2279 I used micro fiber cloth patches to swab the barrel. Then I dunked those in water and squeezed them and the water coming off looked like black ink
@taofledermaus I'm sure it did 😆 🤣. That stuff is pure junk. I made some BP from my walnut tree and it's super dirty also. I go through 6-7 patches just to clean out my cylinder. 🤣🤣
Looks like we need Matt to take this to the next level on Demolition Ranch. All types of projectiles, all types of propellant and several blocks of butter...
I'm curious to see if a traditional load will make a difference.Wad, shot+buffer material+over shot card. Yes, in the old days they used polenta a buffer material in black powder shotguns.
I have my own hand cannon with the Super Comanche, 45/.410, ten inch barrel. It is highly accurate with a .410 slug. It has a Modified choke screwed on the end. I currently have 000 Buck in it for home defense...
Hi, I have the 6" gun, if you remove a 12 gauge slug from it's casing, the slug fit's perfect in the barrel. The hollow part in the slug makes it just right for a powder charge.
Y'know, I'd seen ads that featured these and I wondered they got away with making a pistol in 12 gauge. Them being muzzle-loading was one of my theories.
Looks like you're using hot shots for 50 cal rifles and standard 209 primers. Might be why barrel gets so dirty. There was an article that standard 209 primers caused a fast really dirty buildup just forward of chamber. There is a muzzleloader specific 209 that is supposed to be less fouling.
its essentially the same thing that got Shinzo Abe. a black powder double barrel with grape shot. only the Abe gun was electronically fired. i still think its interesting that the shooter used an electronic system instead of hammers
50 grains is just a target shooting load for those pistols - if you're shooting in earnest you want to load around 75-80 grains of powder - that's why your FPS was sucking. You might want to consider scoring a paper cartridge loading kit - or do some research and make your own - the "kit" is entirely hand loading but they allow you to bang out paper cartridges fast and easy ahead of time. Really easy to use, so much so that I can watch TV and roll paper cartridges at the same time with very little practice. Those two guns work far better with slugs as the short barrel results in the obscene spread you're seeing. Word of warning, 100 grains of powder is putting you into the red zone with those guns - go back to black powder or something else you can control and don't clear 90 grains on a regular basis.
I feel like a double barel over-under .410 would be a better option, assuming the pellet charge fits. If not, then a 20ga... but even that's still pretty big @ .61cal (12ga @ .73cal). Reasoning for over-under would simply be so that the aiming bead is in line with both barrels.
Just for reference, my old .177 break-barrel pellet rifle would make sonic booms with ultra-light pellets (don't remember the weight - that was a long time ago 😄). That grape shot is still nasty though!
The one with real wood and steel looks beautiful. With 2F black powder wad, and overshot card, or patched roundball you have quite a lot of possibilities. The patched roundball I would stick to 50 to 60 grain black powder, unless the manufacturer finds a firmer load safe.
For a black powder 12 guage, the minimum load should start at about 75 grains and go up from there. The 50 grain white hot load would work much better in a 28 guage.
They probably could, but with the wait time on tax stamps it probably wouldn't be cost effective for them as a company. I'm assuming you're in America, you can get a tax stamp for shotguns with under a 18" barrel.
@@TheRealWilliamWhite nope 200 dollar tax stamp since they cut down a regular shot gun. its also the same manufactorer/register tax for aows or sbs. look up Paladin Armory
@@TheRealWilliamWhite no kidding, I always figured they were up there with machine guns and other "high class" NFA items. Still don't like the NFA, but I actually learned something
Thanks for having me out Jeff. Always a pleasure to shoot. I forgot to mention in the video but the recoil on these were not bad at all. The single WH had so little recoil that I was shooting it one handed with no issues, the 2 WH had about as much recoil as my compact .45ACP. Also no one asked but I did an experiment on how loud they were. I shot a single WH without ear pro on and it was as loud as a 9mm with no ear pro on to me. I wouldn’t advise it, but you could get away with it once in a while.
Thank you for being in the video. This was something else for sure but very interesting
Cool breeze 😊
Dude you were fantastic! Good video!
Definitely a gorgeous pistol!
The accuracy of a pistol, the range of a shotgun, and the rate of fire of a musket, all combined in one expensive highly-polished package!
You've sold me. I'll take two.
Me in bed with my girl.
Sounds terrible when you say it like that... lmfao
The British army went one worse. They called it the SA80.
@@petegarnett7731 friggin GOT EM
Maybe the white hots are part of the problem since they are loose in the bore unlike loose powder that would fill the cross section of the bore.
Very interesting idea.
The 11" barrel didn't help either.
@@elementalist1984you don’t know anything.
@davidjernigan8161 Agree! Too much gap. Name of the game is pressure and with the sub pellets it left too much gap to build proper pressure. Would have been better crushing them before loading. If I'm remembering correctly , the sweet spot on these Diablos is 75gr but there are videos of up to 135gr I believe. Could be remembering incorrectly. Been a awhile since I was looking at getting a twin set of these.
Had a similar idea.
I have a felony on my record so I can't legally own a firearm so I got one of these instead. Much better than a baseball bat in a home defense situation.
Can we own one with felony
You can own one of these a day after you get out, and after 7 years in most states, felons are allowed to own firearms in yalls own home. Can't carry it or even take it to the range ever again, but there is that loophole made allowed for self defense
@@DisLike-ks3ln as far as I know it is not a firearm by definition though it does throw hot ash.
@@DisLike-ks3ln These are classified as a muzzle loader and federally NOT a firearm. That said, I would not get caught in NY with any black powder pistol. I think I still need a pistol permit to have one, but not certain.
Some places still prohibit a felon from owning black powder firearms so you need to find out for sure what the laws are in your area before ordering one.
You should try a buck and ball load. Using a .69 round ball with 4 to 6 .31War. Or 4 .36 cal round balls on top and load with at least 80 grains of FFg black powder. It does a wonderful job and is historically accurate seeing as how that was the standard loading of the smoothbore muskets in Rev war, War of 1812, Mexican War all the way up to the Civil war. A tip to help both velocities and shot spread would be to fill the space around the buckshot balls with a filler such as Grits or cream of wheat.
Filling the space with wax and birdshot seems like a good idea.
Seconding Buck & Ball, tried and true loading.
You sure about that?
I know of times and specific places where what you said is true; but I also know of times and places (admittedly, I can't remember the citations to give them) when specific orders were given to _not_ load like that! If I remember correctly, buck'n'ball load was for dense brush, snapshot situations. On open ground, the extra buckshot was simply wasted, so loading it was a waste of supply.
I would suggest patterning just a round ball slug, a minié slug, just buckshot, buckshot in a wad, and buck'n'ball (trying top, bottom, and cannisterized), and see what you see!
They also need to get a shorter table for the get blocks. 😂
I tried buck and ball with my 6” Diablo, putting three 00 buck on top of a .715” round ball and 60grains of FFFg Swiss black powder in a musket-style paper cartridge. Very seldom did any of the buckshot hit an 18x24” target at ten yards, but the big ball did; so I deemed it not worth the extra recoil.
The Nickel Finish and Walnut Wood make that thing look GOOD!👍🏻🇺🇲
Unfortunately black powder isn't friendly towards nickel .
Save $400 on a blued one. How much do these run?!? The cost of freedom seems awfully high.
@@jacka55six60 yeah it does look though but pricey.
As someone not from the USA, thank you very much for putting metric measurements in!
I think you found a whole new era of the channel. Best slug for those with an unfortunate felony.
Wish that was true. In my state the stupid primers are considered firearms. I literally have to shoot flintlock muskets 🤷
@@llEverydayCarnivorellyou know you can move, right? In May, I moved from Washington to AL. I cut my pay in half (almost, 60% of what I was making in WA). I emptied my 401k to make it happen. It was hell. But five months later, it was the best thing I’ve ever done. My pay is almost back to where it was because I work hard, we bought a house, because they’re not absurdly expensive here. Living here feels like we are in Leave it to Beaver or something. Crime basically doesn’t exist where we live. I can go buy whatever.
I know it’s hard. Set a date. Let’s say May 22, 2025. Save like your life depends on it. $20k will do it. Get down here to the south. Or Oklahoma, or anywhere but Illinois.
@@alphazuluz yeah move out of Illinois and come to America
@@llEverydayCarnivorellGet outta that state! My state just changed our constitution carry to include anyone visiting from another state. All these states turning communist and at least one state is assisting everyone so they don't end up in jail while visiting. I'm pretty proud of our state government. Never thought I'd say happy and government in the same sentence. We have the highest firearm ownership in the US and the lowest firearm violence in the US. Yeah, I'm bragging
Ditch the white hots. Those are designed for an inline 50 cal muzzleloader. There is too much gap around the sides. I’d recommend 777, blackthorn 209 or Goex fff. I believe your consistency and velocity will improve greatly. It also gives the added benefit of being able to work up incrementally to find your best load. For instance start at 50gr then add 5 grains per shot until you find the point of diminishing returns. stop there and enjoy. By the way that is a great looking shotgun.
I would definitely try something like 2F loose black powder. I've been shooting black powder small arms and artillery since I was 15, and those velocities are absolutely pathetic. I have a feeling the pelletized powder just isn't cutting it in such a short barrel with such a loose fitting projectile. Especially when you mentioned how badly it was fouling the bore. It really looks like it just isn't burning right. I don't expect blazing velocities, but what you have there is 14th century serpentine powder velocities. Or something out of a .32 cal smoothbore pocket pistol that only has to reach across the table. Or I could be full of ca-ca too, I don't know. I don't have any experience with pelletized BP substitute. Only ever used real, honest to goodness black powder. But in all my experience with the stuff, this seems very not right. But very cool video, as always.
I was thinking the same thing.
You're correct. I have learned to stay away from the "better than black" nonsense as well.
Would something wrapped around the front half of the pellet to bring it up from .50 to .69 work ? Basically a sabot to help center the charge in the bore.
Or 3d print a new gas seal design with a little sleeve to hold the pellet centered, so it would be a single piece load that you just ran down the barrel. Not a self contained cartridge because it wouldn't include the primer.
You're absolutely right, he should source himself a can of Swiss 2F blackpowder.
@@johndoe-so2efStuff like Pyrodex works, but it doesn't excel in any aspect, and it's worthless as a priming powder, burns very poorly in open air.
I have the smaller one now for 5 years, loaded traditional with many different loads, left barrel 9 pellets of 00 buck, right barrel 1 oz Foster slug gotta play with powder charge depending on load
It's simple. Taofledermaus uploads, video gets watched.
I feel an El Dorado movie marathon coming on! “He was limpin’ after I shot em!” “He was limpin before ya shot him!”
But, do you *like*?
That's a nice lookin wall hanger. The shiny one.
Did he seriously just call a hole in the paper next to the ear, "one in the Trump"?
I was looking for this comment. If you hadn't, I was gonna
It would be the same injury Trump got hence "The Trump" name.
Weird. Cant wait to hear that lame joke for the next 20 years
Yes, yes he did
You guys almost make it seem like gun owners come in all flavors...
The 2 pellets was awesome + l really like the Double-Barrel Shotgun Pistol .......
Old F-4 Phantom pilot Shoe🇺🇸
.....Thank you Jeff and Zac
thanks Steve
I think you will find better consistency in powder, I don't know how to explain it but the pellets, they just don't feel like they go off the same way each time. 60-70 grains of substitute BP appears to pattern the most consistently from what I have seen. Slugs are still about an enigma as to the viability, but with the BH209 it's spicy, would love to see you optimize the loading for the foster slugs in these.
Basically legal sawed off shotgun, 😉 without being a illegal sawed off shotgun
Its just a miniature double barreled handheld cannon loaded with grapeshot! Nothing suspicius! 😂
This thing is fun but it’s got nothing on the Mossberg Shockwave.
Plenty of legal options just get an AOW, Short barreled tax stamp our just a shockwave off store shelves.
@@bullboo1 hate to break it to you but a shockwave if carried concealed is a unregistered aow and will get you in legal trouble.
Legally, not even a shotgun.
I bought one years ago. Great gun , more work but more fun.
Yipee, looks like a most capable sail boat defense doo-hicka-machine. Thanks for the detailed demonstration.
You Almost Kentucky Ballistics-ed your chronograph. I’d wonder about the effects of clothing on the penetration of the gel with both loads.
"She be kickin' "
The cannoneer would be proud 😅💪
Those are some deadly Bao Buns you cooked up, Jeff.
That’s a clean looking gun
it's not a gun... neither is it a shotgun... it's a hand cannon. But yeah, it does look clean
@ it’s a water pistol
yup
Interesting. Good shooting Zack. Great video Jeff!
I call BS. Try It on my 6pK ABS!!
I would love to see one with rifled slugs
yes slugs!
They kick like a mule, but at varying loads they don't seem to stabilize, I would love to see Jeff optimize this loading on the highspeed camera and chrono.
I was going to comment that, maybe 3/4oz with two of the charges.
@@MrNikkoz I load 1 oz shot or slug and 60grs FFFg. That is a good one hand load. My home recliner gun has 120 Grs FFFg and slugs. THAT is a two hand load! I have owned it for almost three years. The early guns were soldered barrels and center strip. The new ones are billet machined, one piece. I feel they are stronger guns.
CHAIN SHOT!!!
I feel like this channel isnt so much about testing shells, but about shooting stuff and looking at it, the cool shot is just a cool bonus
4:56 "one on the Trump!" God you guys never stop surprising 😅
The double whitehots out of the bigger of the two on the gel block was AWESOME!!!!!
Jeff's Hipster Hand Cannon from a Mad World!
Thanks for the awesome videos guys!
Been watching you guys for YEARS now and always excited to see what other new and or wacky ammunition you guys thoroughly test.
However… I was deeply disappointed when I hoped on to UA-cam just now and realized after looking… NO ONE HAD EXTENSIVELY TESTED HOW DIFFERENT METALS PERFORM AS SHOTGUN SLUGS!!!
I was especially surprised when I realized YOU guys haven’t done that. You’re the most scientific and thorough gun channel I’ve ever seen… the “guga foods” of shotgun ammo.
Thank god for the ability to tip and make a simple request…. PLEASE PLEASE PALEEEEEASE test a series of shotgun slugs for each type of metal, period. Like ones made of copper, iron, steel, aluminum, tin, lead, iron oxide, silver, gold, platinum, titanium, etc… you guys get the idea.
And again, love your videos and the awesome content you guys constantly put out!😁
Thank you so much! We have tested slugs made of titanium, gold (2 oz), silver, copper, brass, aluminum, cast iron, steel, stainless steel, zinc, pot metal, gallium, bismuth and of course lead.
I've aways liked waxed 1 oz BB loads . They're wicked loads .
16:22 thank you Jeff. Very informative and beautifully imaged. Zac thank you too man.
Glad you enjoyed it
I almost missed this episode.
Just got back from a week-long camping trip, and NOOO INTERNET.
THANKS GUYS.
👍
thank you Kevin
The ability to be your own Maus with this would be interesting, so many options
Nice gun, funky looking grips though.
there are bigger grips but you have to get a sized holster from the maker to fit it
Thanks for the video. You settled a lot of curiosity. I can’t imagine why only these particular things were produced by a company and not something like a coach gun, too.
Wow what a beautiful bit of workmanship. Again we can't own anything like this in the UK. Sort of thing that would make you feel safer in Tiger Bay after midnight. Could do with more ooomph. More of a tickler than a snootah
Because this is black powder I'm 99% sure you can get these mailed to use with no background check. Damn I love America.
technically you could own one its smoothbore and black powder....you can own black powder revolvers
How’s Wales this evening? London is awful🤙
We can buy them in the UK with no license, actually. However...you will need a license for the powder and primers. And we can't carry them in public.
@spudgunn8695 spot on
Wow!! surprising results Jeff! great video...
thank you Wade!
It’s so good looking!
I got one of the very first of these.
Found 3F 777 and #4 buck plated buck to be my favorite loading that or a round ball. Was a fun little toy.
Bloody bots, man.
Anyways, grapeshot handcannon let's effing gooooooooo!
I fint remember who made it but when Walmart first opened they sold a double barrel pistol that shot 410 shells.
Thanks for posting the video. Did American Guncraft provide these pistols? If so then thanks to them. Thanks to Bubba Roundtree Outdoors for the ammo. Thanks to Zach for his shooting. And thanks to Jeff for the tabletop, the loading and his videography .
Thank you for thanking them. 😊
Ofc they did, cant you tell how scripted this is? Pretty sure they should disclose their relationship with the manufacturer
@@Stuka01210 do you think these gun channels don't get the guns to fire as a way to advertise them? unless they say they bought them you can pretty much figure they were provided the guns to review
@@toomanyaccounts ye ofc, thats why im saying that this piece of information should be disclosed. "Thanks for xyz for sending them over" for example
White hot pellets need barrel length for velocity and being molded for 50cal barrels you have a lot of airspace around the pellet when in the 12 gauge barrel. I would like to see this repeated with 70 to 80 grains of loose powder (Pyrodex RS, Triple 7 or 3F black) and a traditional wad with say 24 pellets of #4 buck or 30 pellets of F buck. I think you will be surprised at the velocities.
Would be cool to see this with swiss black powder and a foster slug great vid tho!
The cost exceeding a real shotgun, the range of a bat and the power of a weak air rifle. What a wonderful product
Cool pistol, would look nice on my Harley! 😁🇺🇲
Mount half a dozen🤩🤙
Hell yeah brother that sounds perfect for the all American sausagefest. 🦅🦅
Yeah but then the Terminator would want it for sure.
You need to go with a powder form propellant.. black powder or 777. You'll see dramatic increase in performance.
Muzzleloading shotguns are finicky creatures. You have to play with a combination of components to find what works best
I've Been Thinking About Getting One, Now I Know I Want To Get One In 11" Black.
The 6" gun draws from the hip like a six gun. Cock while drawing and shoot. 60Grs of FFFg makes a good one hand load.
Another great video! Thank you!
thank you
I'm reminded of the Dirty Dozen !
" Very pretty general , but can they fight ?"
So black powder and point blank !
Great video ✌️
0:20 OMG they're shooting at the bees again - monsters!
Love your videos!
Surprisingly effective. It is an option. Thank you gentlemen.
The results make perfect sense. Doubling the powder load roughly doubles the velocity, and since KE = 1/2(m)(v^2), doubling the velocity quadruples the energy. Two white hots looks like the correct load for this (especially if you hate your wrist)
I never did mention in the video but the recoil was very manageable. Even the 2 white hots didn’t feel any worse than my compact .45acp. I actually shot the one white hot 1 handed in a few shots just because it was easier to get camera shots with it.
That thing is pretty
I have the 11-inch Desperado in 12 gauge, though I bought the blued/rubber economy version. I bought it several years ago during the insanity where bullets, pellets, slugs, primers etc. were all next to impossible to find. I settled on using .31 Hornady balls intended for cap and ball revolvers. With a load of about 70 grains of Triple 7 and 11 balls, I get a fairly consistent 800-850 fps, a loading which at close range can probably kill anything that walks the earth. One thing I do that you did not was making good use of wads over the powder and then a thick lubricated one over the pellets, all of which I pack down with the ramrod as hard as I can. it could be that I'm getting better velocity than you did simply because the packed wads allow the powder to burn a bit longer before it overcomes the friction, thus allowing the gunpowder to burn more efficiently.
Now that the components are a lot easier to find, I bought a box of #4 buck that I'm about to experiment with. I'm going to load about 1.25 ounces of shot with a reduced load of around 50 grains of powder. The reason for this is if I ever need to use this thing to defend my home, I don't want to kill everyone in the apartment building in addition to the burglar.
Incidently, for anyone thinking of buying one of these things, I'd recommend avoiding the 6-inch version. I had one and while it's nicely compact and certainly the one most friendly to carry, the barrels are really too short to efficently burn any amount of powder. I was never able to top 750 fps even with only 6 .31 balls and any charge of powder. The 11 inch I have now is great for shooting and making good use of the powder, but is extremely awkward, about like one of my enormous Walker Colts. Take my word for it, the sweet spot is the 8-inch version of the Desperado. I was going to cut down my 11-inch barrels but instead I'm just going to order another of these lovely pistols in 8 inch.
"One on the Trump" - I almost wet myself when I heard that!
Not only great for room-to-room CQB, but a wonderful smoke screen to aid serripitous movement! ;)
Can you Pop a slug thru it? It would be interesting IMO to see how that would work....
yes the slugs you use are the slugs you use to handload regular 12 gauge shotgun shells. they have a sabot on them. you can also use the plastic shotshell holders used in shotgun reloading to make the pellets bunch together.
ua-cam.com/video/ywR5M0MJVCA/v-deo.html we did some slug tests and even shot both barrels at once
This was great! I really would like to see a slow motion of the 000 entering the Gell; from what I can see it look like about a 6X6 pattern. Throw in some bones and organs to shatter and smash up; I'd suspect you could get a 6" hole going half way through someone -- or all the way through if you use two propellants.
It would work very well on everything on the other side of the room
Remember, switching to your secondary is faster than reloading.
Merica!
I Absolutely Love Round Tree's Buckshot Molds I Own Several of His Molds !!!
It is called a "Hand Cannon"...I wonder how it does for self-defense? 😅
Bit smokey, maybe, and switching to your sidearm is DEFINITELY faster than reloading. Other than that, not a bad deal.
@@remcovanvliet3018 I think it would be better for boarding a ship in a pirate attack!
Not something I would buy myself, but I was still interesting to see. You always make the videos interesting!
thanks
Am I the first who's not a bot in comments? :)
No, but T is working hard to remove them right away.
@@izzyplusplusplus1004
Thats cool.
You could be a bot. They’re getting pretty sophisticated these days. You should probably go outside and get a civilian to confirm your status.
@@tomwinterfishing9065 anything online should be sus.
Even your own acct.
Love BP rifles and revolvers. Haven't seen his brand of BP before. Pellets are just too compressed and sometimes don't burn off. I stopped using them in 2011 and strictly use powder. Great Video. God Bless
thanks! I should have shown the filth on the patch after swabbing the barrel. The fouling was so bad
@@taofledermaus I can imagine how bad it is. I've cleaned out some very dirty barrels with those pellets.
@@jesscobb2279 I used micro fiber cloth patches to swab the barrel. Then I dunked those in water and squeezed them and the water coming off looked like black ink
@taofledermaus I'm sure it did 😆 🤣. That stuff is pure junk. I made some BP from my walnut tree and it's super dirty also. I go through 6-7 patches just to clean out my cylinder. 🤣🤣
The bots holy shit
Report them for sexual content. These burner 'channels' are just fronts for XXX sites.
There are so many bots, fake accounts, and scam accounts catfishing on UA-cam. If someone says you won a prize, don't click the link.
As always Jeff great video. No matter what the results are y’all put that effort in to try and make them work ❤️
Thanks 👍
60 Grains = Dram.
1200 scruples
Pretty cool little weapon. Well done as always Jeff
thanks
Fun fact you can squeeze off 1.000009 rounds a half hour
Seeing that smoke is giving me olfactory hallucinations.
Looks like we need Matt to take this to the next level on Demolition Ranch. All types of projectiles, all types of propellant and several blocks of butter...
"One on the Trump" BAHAHAHAHA Thats good
I'm curious to see if a traditional load will make a difference.Wad, shot+buffer material+over shot card. Yes, in the old days they used polenta a buffer material in black powder shotguns.
Holy shit the bots are in full force! The video isn't even 4 minutes old!
They arrive when the video drops. Report them for sexual content - the 'channels' are fronts for XXX sites.
Nice looking gun!!
finally a diablo
I have my own hand cannon with the Super Comanche, 45/.410, ten inch barrel. It is highly accurate with a .410 slug. It has a Modified choke screwed on the end. I currently have 000 Buck in it for home defense...
Thank you. I bet it would work awesome with rock salt 😂😂😂😅
Like the different format .... Great video !
Glad you liked it!
Hi, I have the 6" gun, if you remove a 12 gauge slug from it's casing, the slug fit's perfect in the barrel. The hollow part in the slug makes it just right for a powder charge.
I hope to see more tests with these muzzle loaders, really ring them out!
Y'know, I'd seen ads that featured these and I wondered they got away with making a pistol in 12 gauge. Them being muzzle-loading was one of my theories.
Looks like you're using hot shots for 50 cal rifles and standard 209 primers. Might be why barrel gets so dirty.
There was an article that standard 209 primers caused a fast really dirty buildup just forward of chamber.
There is a muzzleloader specific 209 that is supposed to be less fouling.
its essentially the same thing that got Shinzo Abe. a black powder double barrel with grape shot. only the Abe gun was electronically fired. i still think its interesting that the shooter used an electronic system instead of hammers
because batteries are so reliable huh? lol
50 grains is just a target shooting load for those pistols - if you're shooting in earnest you want to load around 75-80 grains of powder - that's why your FPS was sucking.
You might want to consider scoring a paper cartridge loading kit - or do some research and make your own - the "kit" is entirely hand loading but they allow you to bang out paper cartridges fast and easy ahead of time. Really easy to use, so much so that I can watch TV and roll paper cartridges at the same time with very little practice.
Those two guns work far better with slugs as the short barrel results in the obscene spread you're seeing.
Word of warning, 100 grains of powder is putting you into the red zone with those guns - go back to black powder or something else you can control and don't clear 90 grains on a regular basis.
Good job Zack! And great video!
Thanks!
I feel like a double barel over-under .410 would be a better option, assuming the pellet charge fits. If not, then a 20ga... but even that's still pretty big @ .61cal (12ga @ .73cal).
Reasoning for over-under would simply be so that the aiming bead is in line with both barrels.
Pretty awesome man personally I've always wanted to get a black powder blunderbuss.
Just for reference, my old .177 break-barrel pellet rifle would make sonic booms with ultra-light pellets (don't remember the weight - that was a long time ago 😄). That grape shot is still nasty though!
The one with real wood and steel looks beautiful. With 2F black powder wad, and overshot card, or patched roundball you have quite a lot of possibilities. The patched roundball I would stick to 50 to 60 grain black powder, unless the manufacturer finds a firmer load safe.
Jeff, you need to try a much LARGER buck shot size. I think you know what I'm talking about. Great stuff man!
not really, but thanks for watching!
For a black powder 12 guage, the minimum load should start at about 75 grains and go up from there. The 50 grain white hot load would work much better in a 28 guage.
9:00 I have NERF Blasters that hit harder than that on full-auto. Still, with that kind of weight behind each pellet, that's more than serviceable.
ok
With larger bore muzzleloaders you're better with loose powder usually like 3F so it will burn faster
I wish they could legally make these for smokeless powder/modern shells. Thanks for the video!
They probably could, but with the wait time on tax stamps it probably wouldn't be cost effective for them as a company. I'm assuming you're in America, you can get a tax stamp for shotguns with under a 18" barrel.
They can, it's just an NFA item and has a 5$ tax stamp.
@@TheRealWilliamWhite nope 200 dollar tax stamp since they cut down a regular shot gun. its also the same manufactorer/register tax for aows or sbs. look up Paladin Armory
they are called Bear Claws. look up Paladin Armory
@@TheRealWilliamWhite no kidding, I always figured they were up there with machine guns and other "high class" NFA items.
Still don't like the NFA, but I actually learned something