Core Beliefs of Adoptees MUST WATCH FOR ADOPTIVE PARENTS by Nancy Verrier - Part 2 The Primal Wound
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- Опубліковано 24 гру 2024
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I am very grateful for verriers book, her insight and research. I'm not ashamed of my trauma. Healing and compassion is better than judging myself as unworthy and unloved. I started unravelling the impact of my trauma when I struggled in a relationship at 30. At 62 I'm in a very loving relationship but the healing continues. Thank you Nancy!
Can't overlook the great possibility that the adoptive mother has her own issues and is bringing them into the relationship with the adopted baby.
Hi Janet! Yes an adoptive mother has her own losses to contend with, due to infertility, and it is important for her to grieve her losses and the fantasy of a "biological child." She has a ghost kingdom too. Then it is her responsibility to connect and bond with her adoptive child's loss of the fantasy of a "biological connection" and the child's "ghost kingdom." The more an adoptive parent can accept this, the better a parent they will be.
@@Jeanette-icallySpeaking Difference being is that the adoptive persons biological family is very much alive and probably well. They actually exist. The adoptee is prevented from connecting on any level with its own biological family forever in order to assume the identity of the "ghost" child. Many of us grow up always looking in crowds for people who may be our lost family. The adoptive mother will try hard to deny the reality that the child she is raising has her own roots and will put much effort into transforming the adopted child into her phantom child. The adopted child will assume that her biological family must be really bad in order to justify her relinquishment (or should I say, banishment). And people wonder why we suffer from low self-esteem!
@@janetpatterson137 that is so interesting
@@janetpatterson137 wow you described this so well. It is excruciatingly painful to be rejected and abandoned and then having to live up to the adoptive parents' expectations. So the adopted child is left to deal with all the confusion and grief on own, while striving to please the adoptive parents and become the ghost child. It's a double whammy and leads to one never feeling good enough. :(
These APs especially the women use these children babies to fill a void.
I was adopted at birth. My adoptive parents don't believe in sharing negative feelings. I wasn't allowed to cry. They don't believe therapy is for normal people. They don't believe in medication. Instead, if I told them about The Primal Wound or how I feel, they would laugh in my face and tell me to get over my problems. "Turn that frown upside-down."
When I told them I was going to therapy as an adult, they looked at me like I just told them I got an STD. I wish they had the mental strength to have these conversations, or to even pick up The Primal Wound. So perhaps they could understand why I was an anxious and sad little kid and a suicidal teenager. I have almost no relationship with them now; they are acquaintances who raised me, not my parents.
I'm happy you had the strength to go to therapy. Keep going. It works.
God bless you. I'm very glad you made it past the suicide idations😍💕🌺🌺
Some people just don't get emotions. The problem was not you but your adoptive parents not able to understand things and not willing to deal with emotions. I am happy you are no longer suicidal and NEVER turn to suicide. I am so happy you got therapy. Some people just don't get things. They seem like when it came to emotions they were not open minded.
Yeah it's wrong to buy or sell people anyway. People don't seem to get that no human never gets more than one father or mother but it is interesting to me how many covert narcissists with fertility trauma try to buy other people's babies and then try to constantly get narc supply from an innocent baby and gaslight the adoptee until we finally break free. I know exactly how you feel and do whatever you have to do you don't owe those creeps ANYTHING.
Adopted at birth. It helps that you really get this and can explain it so well.
Thank you so much, 100 pecent true. I always felt in all my life that I am a freak. It makes me feel good that's normal in my case.
Yes it makes sense!
If adoptees like myself are hearing constantly that the primal wound explains their mental health issues, it steers the conversation away from the added damage done by narcisstic adoptive family systems. Over 50 percent of family systems are facing narcissistic abuse in their close circle.
You would be surprised to know how many adoptees in their 40´s 50´s and 60´s are only now beginning to understand it´s NOT JUST THEIR PRIMAL WOUND. Until 6 years of age, the upbringing is responsible for any other mental health issue later in life. I was raised as a baby from Colombia by a malignant narcissistic adoptive mother and her neglectful narcissistic husband. They were Dutch and had no clue whatsoever about my cultural heritage. No interest either.
They also managed to adopt another baby boy from a different city in Colombia, who would defy their authority from the first minute. He always enjoyed the conflicts within in the familysystem and turned into a very toxic narcissistic personality himself. With mental health issues and severe adiction from the age of 10. However he became the Golden Child as he was the Flying Monkey in our system.
I am the only empath in this dysfunctional abusive family system which led the way to my several mental health issues as neither of these relationships were based on safety or healthy boundaries. To be fully traumabonded in these systems can set an adult adoptee up for lifelong incapacities. For this ADOPTIVE PARENTS ARE FULLY RESPONSIBLE IF THEY WERE NEVER WILLING TO SEEK DECENT LONG TERM FAMILY THERAPY TO HEAL THE PRIMAL WOUNDS THEY HAVE ADDED IN THEIR OWN FAMILY SYSTEM. With books like these, a narcissist adoptive parents will find it tremendously easy to keep putting blame and responsibility on the shoulders of their non biological adopted child.
This has been my life long battle even though I have been in therapy for Bipolar Disorder and many other issues. If I knew I suffered from complex trauma, leading me to stay stuck in the push and pull dynamic with my adoptive familymembers, I would have saved at least 25 years of my tears and frustration. I urge anyone suffering from long term traumatic wounds, to inform yourself through Dr Ramani´s work on narcissism. She has free content on You Tube that will benefit you in ways that most therapists can´t. They are simply not aware of this framework. It explains both why your familymembers behave the way they do and how much your own conduct, helps to keep this naricissitic family system in place.
Currently I am on a healing journey. I found an amazing adoption therapist who is helping me untangle my past traumatic experiences. We have been working for over 6 years. Inner work requieres a long breath. WHEN CONDITIONED INTO BELIEFSTRUCTURES THAT WERE DAMAGING TO THE SOUL AND AVOIDED YOUR IDENTITY TO BLOSSOM, IT TAKES DECADES TO DECONSTRUCT THOSE MESSAGES.
The fantasy of adopting a child is based on the fantasy of the old and current message. Adoption is a wonderful thing and everybody involved benefits from it. Until you know how many adult adoptees end up broken, in the waiting room of their first therapist. My adoptive parents never ever wanted to be part of family therapy. They refused on the bases of the message that I WAS TOO SENSITIVE, TOO DIFFICULT AND NOT GRATEFUL ENOUGH. I am proud to say I managed to build a good and simple life 5000 km away from my abusers. Having build healthy friendships, single by choice and accepting of the fact that my adoption story is one out of many. However there is hope in healing and surviving when handed the right tools.
This book is not helpful for adult adoptees that have heard the message over and over how DIFFICULT ADOPTION IS FOR ADOPTIVE PARENTS. Often from their own adoptive parents! THEY CAN NOT BE EXPECTED TO CARRY RESPONSIBILITY FOR UNRESOLVED COMPLEX TRAUMA OF THEIR ADOPTIVE PARENTS OR ANYONE ELSE FOR THAT MATTER.
THAT IS A BURDEN TO BIG TO CARRY ALONG THEIR OWN STRUGGLES, EVEN THOUGH ADOPTEES WILL FIND MANY WAYS TO JUSTIFY THEIR ADOPTIVE PARENTS EMOTIONAL BEHAVIOURS. THIS IS A MESSAGE THAT WAS TAUGHT FROM A YOUNG AGE AND WILL LAST A LIFE TIME. IT THEREFOR WILL DEBILATE ANY CHANCE ON A HEALTHY ADULT LIFE. FOR WHICH THE ADOPTEES ARE HELD ACCOUNTABLE WHEREVER THEY TURN.
“Too sensitive, too difficult, not grateful”… ahh. That is so painfully familiar.
I STILL CRY ALOT.AND I'LL BE 50 THIS YEAR. BECOMING HOMELESS HAS DRASTICALLY AFFECTED MY MENTAL HEALTH. BUT ALWAYS OLD STUFF COMES UP NO MATTER THE NEW TRAUMA. MY BIRTH MUM WAS RAPED BY A MENTALLY UNSTABLE MAN. I HAVE SUFFERED DEPRESSION ALL MY LIFE. I MET MY BIRTH MUM.TWICE. AND HER OTHER THREE CHILDREN( ALL A DECADE YOUNGER THAN ME ). IT WASN'T A FAIRYTALE REUNION. THEY COULDN'T HANDLE MY CRYING. I HAD TO INITIATE ALL THE CONVERSATION. IT WAS TOUGH. LIKE BEING REJECTED ALL OVER AGAIN. HAVEN'T PURSUED LOOKING FOR PATERNAL PARENT. GOT ENOUGH ON MY PLATE JUST TRYING TO GET THROUGH UNBELIEVABLE OUTPOURING OF GRIEF ALMOST DAILY. I AM SINGLE. I ISOLATE FROM EVERYONE. ONE THING MY BIRTH MUM SAID TO ME WHEN I VISTED HER WAS " I'M NOT GOING TO BABY YOU". THAT COMMENT REALLY PUSHED SOME BUTTONS I GOTTA TELL YOU. I ACCEPT THE WHOLE JOURNEY AS MY KARMA....WHATEVER. BUT GEE IT'S BEEN A TRAUMATIC JOURNEY. REALLY TALENTED IN A COUPLE OF CREATIVE FIELDS BUT NEVER ABLE TO REACH FULL POTENTIAL. I'D LOVE TO HAVE A HOUSE AND AN ART STUDIO SO I CAN PAINT AGAIN. I WAS TOLD THIS YEAR THAT I CANNOT REGULATE MY EMOTIONS. WAS TOLD THAT IN A MENTAL HEALTH FACILITY. BEFORE THAT IT WAS BIPOLAR....THEN TRAITS OF BORDERLINE PERSONALITY DISORDER. I FOUND OUT BY ACCIDENT AT 23. MY PSYCHOLOGIST A LONG TIME AGO SAID I NEED TO BECOME EMOTIONALLY INDEPENDENT.
💖
I am deeply saddened to hear your mental health challenges. Know you are not alone. Please join us online at our free support groups, so you can meet other adoptees and feel less alone in this experience here: celiacenter.org/events-calendar-support-groups/
Your answer to this is Jesus. God knows all about you and only He can deliver you from these tormenting thoughts. When they try to come back (thoughts) His word will work every single time. Join a strong faith believing church. Come back and let me know your progress. I'm praying for you.
I’m so scared for my son. I have no idea about the people who are raising him. I was told they’re very good people, thoroughly vetted, and that they just wanted a baby so badly. My son was given up for adoption by my ex without my consent. We planned to have a baby but her family convinced her she wasn’t ready so she gave him up. She realized she couldn’t do it also. I offered many times to take him but she refused. If she couldn’t do it then she wasn’t going to allow me to do it. I never consented to the adoption. I ended up walking away from my ex a month before my son was born due to rampant emotional and psychological abuse from her. She also hit and pushed my mother and then broke my windshield a week later. She showed zero remorse and all she said was “your mother made it worse by calling the police. You DO NOT call the police on me”. Like she is so high and mighty, that how dare we did that. Yea you hit my mother but we should have just let that go. Physical violence is where I draw the line with anyone. Pregnant or not. If I’m in love with you or not. Friend or family. I don’t care you’re gone.
I spent tens of thousands of dollars to stop the adoption. I hired three different lawyers because it was an out of state adoption. I did everything I was supposed to do in the right time periods. The judge in my state ignored my filings and simply said it was an out of state issue now. After the trial the other judge ruled against me and terminated my rights because she said I couldn’t prove Kelsey vs Kelsey. Which was the case my lawyer used as part of his argument. I never got to be there for my son’s birth. Wasn’t even told when he was born. I still have yet to even see a photo. When I asked for one the adoptive parents said my ex isn’t comfortable with that but oh maybe she will be once everything is finalized. Why they need her permission to give me one photo during the holidays is way beyond me. Even though her rights are terminated and she has zero legal say or rights over the child. Now my son is with a couple who were baby crazy, 2500 miles away, that I know nothing about except how badly they wanted a baby. I worry about him everyday especially due to the fact my ex has extreme mental illness and it also mental illness runs in her family. My ex was upset almost every day of the pregnancy too and I worry about the repercussions of that on him also.
It’s amazing now that they’re claiming I’m the bad guy for trying to fight to keep my son. As if the adoptive parents birthed him themselves and I’m just some bad man trying to steal a baby. They’re the ones who legally stole a baby. That’s the truth. Oh and also what this all did to my ex. Even though she’s the one who gave him up. Poor darling was so distraught over me trying to stop the adoption. Oooh poor her. Now they all need time to heal I’m told. Yet I’m just nothing right? I’m the guy who wanted my son and had him ripped away from me yet screw me right? I don’t need to heal. I don’t get anything. This adoption never should have happened. I hope my son gets mad at all three of them someday and he will know the truth. I’m saving everything. Every email, every court document and filing. He will know too that they’re the ones keeping him out of his life. They will have to answer for that someday. What are they going to say? Oh we did it because your mother wanted us to? They going to lie and say I’m a bad man?
As someone adopted in similar circumstance (my father had no say in the matter), I encourage you to keep fighting for your son, but you need to understand that the gynocentric society you live in doesn't give a sh*t about fathers and their sons, or males in general for that matter. I was able to see for myself through the web of self-serving lies spun by my mothers so there is hope for your son.
this is an old comment, so I dont know if your situation has changed - or even if you will see this. I just wanted to say that I am adopted. My father also had ZERO say in that. I never ever thought about how he felt about it and he did not ever go into it (we met when I was 21 - I found him). BUT, he recently passed away and I was really so broken and it suddenly really hit me - how little choice he had in the matter (bearing in mind, I was born LONG ago in 1970 - when the male had even less space to talk about this). It really struck me how much we ALL had acted like he was okay with it all along. I hope that you get to object to this somehow, or at least get to meet your son and be part of his life. Its a messed up system. Its sad though as you are also quite unique I think as so many men seem to NOT care at all. Anyway - what your gender does or doesnt do doesnt make you. Lots of love
My adoptive parents found out they were four months pregnant when they had only had me for three weeks. I was expected to look after him, including feeding and changing his nappies from when I was nine months old. Apparently I had to have a purpose once they had their own baby.
This is excellent. Thank you
My husband and a grandchild were premies, and spent the first month in an incubator. And another daughter had post partum depression for all 3 of her babies. There are lots of sources of the primal wound, but I can't say my husband or daughter have any attachment issues.
Amazing lady
You only have one mother. Once she is stolen or gone or leaves that's it
Great book and accurate insights
I am all of this and more. I have to accept the wound, as it is 67 years, my birth mother has died, my adoptive mother has died. I am still suffering.
Me too.
I am 71 and all I can say is me too.
Wow....thank you for this talk...amazing
Thanks for listening
I assume there must be a Part 1 to this? Does anyone know what it's called? Thank you.
Here is the entire playlist of Nancy's talk in order... ua-cam.com/play/PLv3YZUTYaRRsV83MoxBVYR75_4ux3Um9r.html
What about newborns adopted by relatives but living accross the country from the birth mother and not ever seeing genetic mirroring? I feel like I still am looking for who I am.
My life was supposed to be like this but instead my great aunt and uncle decided that they wanted to move back to be near family and my birth mom had to watch them raise me right infront of her face every holiday, 0/10 do not reccommend
Now my biethmom wont speak to me at 34 and she works down the street, its like rejection all over again
I know that Nancy Verrier is from the Seattle area. Is it possible to get her contact info. I have tried to go on her site but I am unable to access it. I am an international adoptee married to an international adoptee and I would love to address some things with her via email or snail mail. Thank you!
Yes her site is inaccessible. I am not sure why. Please check again in a few weeks. Her email is there.
I understand how adoptees would develop the primal wound. I feel for them. Yet, I also know that the primal wound is universal and lies deep in the unconscious of every human being. The religions and traditions called this "the human condition". When one undergoes spiritual awakening, one makes a journey deep into the bowels of the unconscious. When all the pain, suffering, and grief are released, one bottoms out and comes face to face with the primal wound...which is the fear of non being and non existence. That is of course an over simplification. This knowledge of the primal wound, if understood, it could completely transform humanity.
As an adoptee I thought Primal Wound would be a great read and help me understand and learn. It's awful. Constantly portraying an adopted child as permanently damaged and fractured emotionally. If I was looking to adopt a child, I would be totally off by this book loading up the issues I would face throughout this child's growing years and into adulthood. Yes, adoptees have varying thoughts and challenges from being totally uninterested in the fact they were/are adoptees to finding it problematic or anywhere in between but the irony of this book is it paints a bottle half empty or negative picture of all adopted people which can only make it harder for a child to be adopted should a potential parent read it. PS - With respect, unless you are adopted yourself, you cannot write or teach about being adopted other than in an academic way and I believe this book was written by such an author. Sure, write about the research or the experience of parenting an adoptee but, the whole experience of being adopted is within and cannot be understood unless you are yourself adopted.
This book helped me tremendously as an adoptee because it gave me a term that appropriately described my experience as an infant- Primal Wound. I was an infant who cried and cried so much it freaked out my (adoptive) mother. She even shook me to the point it terrified her enough to seek mental health (thank god). Never was my crying thought to be related to adoption. I heard this story from a negative point of view- I caused my (adoptive) mom so much anguish because I was a “stubborn baby” and later a “brat”. I 100% agree that only an adoptee can understand and write about our experience. But if it weren’t for Nancy Newton Verrier (who is an adoptive parent) I would be left without an understanding of what is common to the early life experiences of adoptees. I’m grateful she put academic thought into her experience as an adoptive parent. Her work isn’t perfect (what is) but it’s helped me nurture my inner child and heal my adult mind. If an adoptive parent is put off by this book, good, better adoptive parents are out there (for infants). Older children who need forever parents face these and other obstacles that only the most prepared potential parents should tackle. An abusive home can grow from the home that adopted based on fantasy of a potential reality.
I’m led to believe you may have experienced a more ideal adoptive mother than I did. I love mine with my heart and soul- some biological children have had more damaging experiences with their bio-moms. But, the damage she alone caused to my mental health was rooted in my status in her household as an adopted child. My adoptive father was not the best example of patience, but he never made me feel awful about myself and my connection with him was as pure as it would have been if I were his biological daughter. He traveled for work M-F most of my young life, when the greatest damage was done. When he was home everything was better for me. Sharing my thoughts for other adoptees and adoptive parents who visit this thread. I appreciate and value your opinion of the book. I had a few cringe moments reading it too.
Adoption is not all rainbows. People need to know the truth. Agency lie to parents. I would rather know the pros and cons than being surprised. I am a birth mom. I never knew about the book until after
I totally agree. It makes the adoptee think they've got more issues than they 'might have. It also will put many prospective parents off adopting. Many adoptees are well balanced and don't have extreme issues
Really? Im tired of the world glamorizing it and never talking about the bad parts, if youre an exception to the experience then youre one of the lucky ones, bless
I am very grateful for verriers book, her insight and research. I'm not ashamed of my trauma. Healing and compassion is better than judging myself as unworthy and unloved. I started unravelling the impact of the trauma when I struggled in a relationship at 30. At 62 I'm in a very loving relationship but the healing continues. Thank you Nancy!
Can anyone recommend a good female therapist in the psychodynamic therapeutic paradigm? I'm a 46 year old hetero male.
Where are you located?
@@Jeanette-icallySpeaking Vietnam. I'm American.
@@coughforme21 www.yoffetherapy.com/
All this rings true. I'm a 49yr man. I need therapy in north Jersey, does anyone know a therapist in the tri state area?
Amazing lady