Someone tell Cardon that in the day & age of 3 hour podcasts being commonplace & very popular, we won’t tune out if an episode goes long. Many of us love it! ~ And keep up the brilliant work! Cardon is a rockstar!
After being tutored by Jared Halverson for 4-6 hrs, this is super short. I listen to you guys on my daily walks, so the more you talk the longer I walk!
Have known two people who both had PhDs in Physics AND Philosophy, absolute geniuses, creative, insightful, brilliant, and Dave reminds me of both. Then there's the Dos Equis dude.
I've enjoyed a lot of Ward Radio / Midnight Mormon episodes having watched almost all of them.. I've received insights, learned new things, felt an encouragement in continuing to boldly live the gospel, enjoyed conspiracies and had a lot of laughs... But these last two episodes with Dave and Mike have been two of my absolute favorites. What fountains of wisdom these men are, I just had to comment how much I appreciated these insights and the discussions. Keep it up you guys. You are fighting the good fight and shining much light 🙌🫶
Talking scripture is such an awesome podcast Mike and Brice are excellent teachers. Dave's books are so awesome I highly recomend listening and reading their work!!!
My husband and I were talking about the freaks of the world who have the odd desire to learn Hebrew. We agreed that God gave you that desire so that you could help get the truth out in the last days. So, we thank you freaks from the bottom of our hearts because all this stuff is FASCINATING and strengthens our testimonies 😂😂👍🏼
I looked for somewhere to purchase the book on Google and couldn't find anything. I did find a sign up page where you can enter to be notified when the book becomes available starting May 1st. I answered you once and included the address to the sign up page but my posts either didn't make it through or were removed. If you search for "inthelanguageofadam stick of joseph" you should get a hit for the sign up page.
Dave Butler (the guitarist) has many conversations on a few UA-cam channels (Talking Scripture, under the “Mike Geeking Out” playlist; Cwic Show, Scripture Notes, and the Stick of Joseph like the other commenter said). Mike Day (in the baseball cap) has podcast/youtube content called Talking Scripture. There’s also an old playlist called “The Lady in the Temple” over in the Academy for Temple Studies channel. Doesn’t feature Dave (it’s about 10 yrs old) but there are lectures by many scholars (including Margaret Barker who influenced a lot of Dave’s work), BYU profs, and professionals in the humanities with varying viewpoints about the Divine Feminine, LDS and non-LDS.
I second what ginger snaps has commented. I also recommend you get the book temple studies by Margaret Barker, she is the pioneering scholar of the Israelite temple
Loving the convo about Mary and Miriam. My daughters name is Cassandra, I chose it because of a childhood friend and because of the meaning of prophetess, the women from Troy who wasn't listened to and then the men let that horse in hehe. It's great that you and others are talking about the important role women have had in temple worship and also the priesthood. I think in some ways, although not directly related other religions and cultures have cultivated women and men's groups and the importance of each role and responsibility. As our Aboriginal Aussies call it 'Secret Women's Business'.
I have been watching the Archaeology in Israel for a long time, and there definitely seems to be evidence of a concerted effort pre and post diaspora to rewrite early Israelite religion. Even to the point of rewriting God's nature. I can certainly see everything spoken here to be extremely plausible.
OK talk about Mary. Mary the mother of Jesus is mentioned by Margaret Barker. According to the gospel of James, Mary was a temple worker making the new veil when she conceives the Lord. So at the same time Mary was making the veil which represents the body of christ she was making the body of Lord. How does this connect to your Mary thesis? BTW I'm a 6 foot gentle giant too.
I know I missed the live.. but I like these long videos. I listen while at work. I'm Canadian myself. Been in the US since 1995. I still hold onto my sowwy and my oot and aboot..
The Salt lake temple did have a seperate holy of holy"s. It was situated between the two sealing rooms in the celestial room , it had a vase in front of the door and it also had a seperate entrance. I would suppose it is now in the temporary temple in the Joseph smith memorial that the general authoritys use. There was a holy of holy's in the Manti temple prior to the completion of the Salt lake temple.
Yes I have seen this place too. And there was a way to get behind the three rooms and down a flight of stairs to the foyer inside the three great east doors.
@@CMZIEBARTH Only the prophet or apostles under the prophets direction. This room is used for revelation and the ordinance of the second anointing. It is my understanding that all temples have a holy of holies.
I have a picture published by the Church of the holy of holies. It was taken and published to combat someone who broken into the SLC temple. It is in a centennial celebration book - SLC Temple a monument to a people. There are mutiple two seater couches on the walls of the room. A large chandelier with a table underneath and rounding ceiling with half circle and circle motifs.There are vines motifs on the light fixtures.
If we were a pyramid… then for it to be built upon Christ then our foundation is built upon another foundation which is Christ. As we climb Jacob’s latter, as we ascend in the covenants of heaven we are in turn sanctified and renewed and the final pyramid stone is the crown Christ places upon us when we have realigned all that we are to becoming even as He is. So we still have to put in all the work AND become like Him, … And. none of this would be possible without Him! His Grace makes all of this possible, the blue print of how to live our lives and the covenant path are Him, He therefore is the Exemplary Way, He is The True(th) (Straight) way and He is the Light that shines in this world of darkness and those who embrace His light have the way revealed unto their eyes…. Truly no man or woman returns to our Father except it be through The Son!
Kirtland temple is a representation of Revelation 4. 24 seats (24 Elders). Curtain sectioning off congregation into four groups = 4 beasts (see D&C 77). Choir seats in each corner (host of heaven singing and praising God).
The story of Melchizedek calling the wicked priests to repentance (not breaking all their stuff and killing them) makes so much sense in light of D&C 121.41-46 stating the rights of the priesthood are based on the attitude and actions of Melchizedek--he was so great (the greatest among you will be your servant) that God decided to call the high priesthood Melchizedek and even Jesus Christ is called a priest after the order of Melchizedek (Hebrews 5.5-6).
I think this is the longest Cardin has been quiet on his show. That makes me think of what Jordan Peterson says: when he's speaking, it's dead silent. Not even a cough. Everyone is listening intently, wondering "is this the answer?"
I would agree - Don Bradley and Dave Butler and Mike some of your best content. How about a discussion between these three? I know that Don mentioned that he saw the endowment in BOM which acted as a point for reconsidering the authenticity of the BOM.
What if the name Nephi is a conglomerate between the nfr/npy for fair and the Naphal/nephilim for gone away to/fallen ones and he uses that play on words when he describes himself as large of stature...one of the connotations we understand is that the nephilim were large people...what if Nephi is both Npy(fair) and nephilim large and gone away from...it seems those meanings are all associated with him. He may have been a large red haired person of goodly demeanor that is gone away or fallen from his homeland thus fitting with all the connotations of Npy/Naphal/nephilim....just a curious rabbit hole to play with...also apparently a variant of Nfy in Egypt was the name of a possible ship Captain which would also fit him as well and be a good title for kings to carry as cast away captains exiled from their homeland
Christ upsetting the tables of the money changers in the temple Court of the Gentiles fits perfectly as a manifestation of His King-hood. The ancient kings destroyed the implements of abominable worship and Christ destroyed the activity in the temple that was denying Gentiles their opportunity to participate in temple worship. This defilement by the merchants would have also been seen by Christ as an abomination that brings desolation to the souls of the Gentiles and to the Temple.
The book mentioned around 2:04:45 is "In The Language of Adam" by Dave Butler. I can't find it anywhere on Google to purchase but I did locate a sign up page where you can enter to be notified when the book becomes available May 1st. I posted the URL for the sign up page within the video comments and the posts were removed. Maybe something to do with having posted the URL for the book sign up page. Perhaps youtube has issues with links that take you out of youtube itself. Anywho. Great video. I love these topics.
There should be a link for it on the Stick of Joseph’s videos with Dave (maybe the first one about the Saudi plates has a link in the description..?) if it’s not here. I know I added my name to the list through their channel.
We can see the same in our day of those who want silence those that oppose them. We learn from the Book of Mormon that the better way is to teach/preach the gospel and call to repentance.
Lehi is an exiled priest who fled for his life with his family to preserve the priesthood and took with him Laman & Lemuel who agreed with/were in league with the corrupt priests at Jerusalem. They weren't just "rebellious kids" they agreed with the "righteous Jews" that wanted to murder his father and cremate his remains on the altar. Lehi's mission, and that of his progeny was to preserve the true doctrine of Christ and the priesthood, keep a record of their "doings" to come forth in the last days to convince the remnant that Jesus is the Anointed One, the covenants of God with Israel remain valid and viable so that the remnant can unite with and save Judah. I'm just geeking out about all of this!
around 48 minute they say talk about the Jews in jerusalem who corrupted the temple. But in the Book of Mormon Nephi sees the bible and says when it was in the hand of the jew it was pure,, but it became corrupted when it went through the hands of the gentiles. Wondering what David and Mike would say
Yeah, and I’m wondering why Joseph Smith would not have addressed this as he was translating it, AND he said that he literally saw ALL biblical events as he went through it.
Walt Disney as a Freemason valued the parallels in fairy tales. Part of Fantasia use to be in the temple presentation. Knight orders are also patterned after Tree of Life motif only they replaced the fruit/tree with the holy grail. My family comes from long lines of Freemasons and Norman Knightly orders with William the Conqueror and again with Robert the Bruce. My ancestors were loyal Norman Knights.
The actions of Melchizedek are the instructions we receive today through the Doctrine and Covenants. We are to preach peace through repentance and not war (smashing things). "No power or influence can or ought to be maintained by virtue of the priesthood, only by persuasion, by long-suffering, by gentleness and meekness, and by love unfeigned; 42 By kindness, and pure knowledge, which shall greatly enlarge the soul without hypocrisy, and without guile- 43 Reproving betimes with sharpness, when moved upon by the Holy Ghost; and then showing forth afterwards an increase of love toward him whom thou hast reproved, lest he esteem thee to be his enemy; 44 That he may know that thy faithfulness is stronger than the cords of death. 45 Let thy bowels also be full of charity towards all men, and to the household of faith, and let virtue garnish thy thoughts unceasingly; then shall thy confidence wax strong in the presence of God; and the doctrine of the priesthood shall distil upon thy soul as the dews from heaven. 46 The Holy Ghost shall be thy constant companion, and thy scepter an unchanging scepter of righteousness and truth; and thy dominion shall be an everlasting dominion, and without compulsory means it shall flow unto thee forever and ever." (Doctrine and Covenants 121:41-46) This is the challenge for us today, as Latter-day Saints.
Contending without contention and leading by example rather than by force, which often allows for others to follow their own will rather than God’s (or *our* estimation of God’s will; I have ancestors that were very pleased to disown their child who married a Catholic, which was culturally accepted by their LDS friends and family but definitely not in-line with the gospel. I also think there is a place and a case to be made for marrying outside the faith, because missionary work! Not the generally recommended course, no, and not always the easiest or best course, but not necessarily a wrong one either).
@@gingersnaps215 God's plan, from the very beginning, centered around Agency of choice. And that choice necessitated opposition. If your ancestors advocated a lack of choice, then that doctrine was not the Lord's doctrine, regardless if they thought it was "culturally acceptable." Joseph made this very clear in the 11th Article of Faith: "We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may." (Articles of Faith 1:11)
Matrilineal Patriarchy is similar to what the Iroquois Confederacy tribes had, where the women chose their tribal leaders and gave them the power to leader, but only because the women have willed it so.
We also have God appearing within the burning bush, and One of the apostles of Christ is known by Christ as having prayed under the fig Tree. So it is interesting to see all of the references to trees and bushes when it comes to prayer and visions and the Lord God's appearance or Angelic appearances!
Mike and Dave actually make me want to go back to church. Never lost my testimony. (Just couldn’t deal with d bags like Cardin every Sunday~ reminds me of Stifler in American Pie smh 🤦♀️ ) I appreciate your service to the 0311 MC guy. My husband is retired Marine. Respect. He’s also catholic and won’t go near a church. But listening to Dave and Mike in the background while he’s around has made the hub give me a side eye. I love the deep dives. I’m a language nerd. Love going back through the Old Testament and picking it apart. Thanks yall!
Val Larsen has some interesting stuff about all this too. I found his interviews on Gospel Tangents (UA-cam or podcast form). Dave has an interview on that channel, too, from Feb of this year. Dave is also on Stick of Joseph (like 6hrs broken into three parts), Cwic Show, Scripture Notes, and there’s an old episode of Talking Scripture with Dave in the “Mike Geeking Out” UA-cam playlist.
Look up the history of the Isle of Iona, theres a church/cathedral that was supposed to have been built there after Mary and her children and other followers of the Savior ended up there after being run out of France. There were people who recorded the early history. It's located between Ireland and Scotland. Mary, the mother of Jesus, and her brother, Joseph of Arimathea were said to have stayed in Wales; there are many legends about it in Great Britain, but like most things, there are those who have tried to hide it.
Another interesting thing about the number 24 in all this, is that Ammaron told Mormon to wait until he was 24 years old to go retrieve the records from the hill in Mormon 1:3.
Way back when I was studying Israelite Kings at BYU, I remember learning that Israel was economically least prosperous during the reigns of these “supposedly” great Kings. Not sure if that is still the academic view, but it would answer my question of why would the Lord not prosper them if they were so righteous.
You guys definitely should make a supercut of this live episode and the last live episode and if you guys make another one, add that one into the supercut too
Love this. But 1) why do Josiah and Joseph Smith match so perfectly in so many ways if Josiah is wicked? 2) Why didn't the Book of Mormon or Joseph Smith come right out and say Josiah, the Deuteronomists, the authors of Kings & Chronicles, etc were all wicked? Joseph "translated" the Bible and had no problem condemning Psalm of Solomon, but... What about these other books?
1:27:04 thank you Brad! I believe some of the grove worship was bad and idolatrous. We see this today in our church. Members take it upon themselves and begin to worship “differently” than commanded and whole movements have been created from that. .
But isn’t this the same King Hezekiah that Isaiah also praised? Isaiah 53 is about King Hezekiah interceding on behalf of his people to stop the Assyrian threat which we also see as a prophetic type of Christ. Am I missing something? Is maybe both true and it’s more nuanced?
Brigham Young said that Jesus was married, and Orson Hyde preached it twice from the pulpit (one time was during General Conference and I can’t remember if the other was, but regardless it was in public from the pulpit).
A fun FYI: Orson Hyde preached FROM THE PULPIT that Jesus was married. I teased my Stake Pres friend what he would do if I too preached from the pulpit that Jesus was married … he gave me a “delete” gesture. One day he’ll eat then words! Not so much about him but the ruckus it would cause that HE would have to deal with! Ayyyy, members! 😮
If you look at the menorah’s structure, it is chiasmus in nature, with one center point, and corresponding branches before and after that center point. I wonder if it perhaps is the origin for the chiasmus poems and if that is why the bom is full of them. Also, if Christ had to be anointed with seven spirits, which we can tie with chiasmus or just the number seven, and it had to be a woman who did the anointing, then it makes sense to me why the menorah/tree of life would be a symbol of Christ And the divine feminine
Hi Cardon, Always entertaining. A little off-topic and it maybe be a little dull for many but perhaps you could get a history professor or librarian from BYU to talk about novels written about the Mormon experience. I'm sure that there are many LDS book collectors or booksellers who could a lively overview. (More trivia: the MOS (Miliary Occupational Specialty) designation is no longer used but an 11-Bravo was an infantry man, 95 Bravo an MP.......I believe that 11 Bravo was the basic MOS for all soldiers, whether a general or cook).
How do we know that the Deuteronomists didn't edit the story of Hezekiah to elevate Josiah. I have always wondered how they both are described as the most righteous kings, but have way different endings. Hezekiah is the king when the Assyrians come and siege Jerusalem. The Lord then destroys 185,000 Assyrians and they go home. Josiah on the other hand is killed in battle at a young age. What if Hezekiah was righteous, which seems like a fair assumption considering that Judah is saved during his reign, and the Deuteronomists try to use Hezekiah's legacy to solidify their power. Basically, what if 2 Kings 18:4 was inserted by them? If you take that verse out the text still reads coherently.
Why was the Melkezedek High Priesthood restored to Joseph Smith an Ephraimite. When Ephraim and Dan are exempt from the tribes of 144,000 of sealed Melkezedek High Priests after the Order of Enoch?
Right, but not really in the alphabet, like a Latin-based alphabet. The points also aren't in ancient manuscripts (definitely not in the Dead Sea Scrolls; I am unsure of when they first came into regular use), which is why the scribes/translators could play with the words that way. Shift the vowels slightly and you have a totally different word!
Latin authors most commonly refer to the forbidden fruit as a pomum, a Latin word meaning "fruit" or "tree fruit." Not surprisingly, Old French, which descends from Latin, has the word "pom" (modern French "pomme"), which originally meant "fruit" as well, and was used in the earliest Old French translations of Genesis. Pomegranates have 12 Chambers with many seeds. Joseph Smith was sealed to 12 women. We now know most if not all of them were pregnant and not from Joseph Smith. Edgar Cayce taught that pregnant Mary, the mother of Jesus Christ, was selected from 12 virgin Essene initiates at the age of 16 and was betrothed to Joseph, age 35. Question: Who was Mary, the mother of Jesus Christ, sealed to? Judge ye....
Joseph Smith spoke of a Judge Adams and stated that he was a direct descendant of Jesus. So, yes, Jesus was married and had children. And was sealed, I'm certain.
I wish I wouldn’t have missed the live session.😢 I would have liked to get Dave Butler’s perspective of Jeremiah 44. Jeremiah seems to condemned the Israelite woman in Egypt for burning incense, and making bread offerings to Asherah. Am I reading that incorrectly or would Dave just say that the book of Jeremiah was altered and perhaps not trustworthy? Thanks.
I want to believe there is something here but im finding that clearly Asherah was not something favored by God. In the Gospel library search for… Elijah: Champion of Israel’s God
@@EminezArtus Thanks. Good article. With the prevalence of counterfeits in the world, such as Baal, who was a son of a supreme god, who died and came back to life, clearly a counterfeit of Jehovah, it makes sense that a counterfeit of Asherah would also exist. I suppose their groves outside of the temple, also meant to celebrate the reproductive elements of that symbolism, is what angered God the most.
@@knelson3326 Yes! Right now I'm stuck on the Menorah. It was placed in there by Moses. I guess what I need is evidence that the Menorah was replaced by Asherah. Which goes with your note about counterfeits. I'm studying my butt off haha trying to figure out what is here clearly the spirit pulls us in on this subject and there is something to learn here. But i don't want to go around saying Asherah is good when in reality it's a counterfeit.
One thing that is undisputed by scripture about the menorah is the fact that is was meant to be a stylized almond tree. No idea why an almond tree, but Aaron’s rod/branch was also an almond. I’ve also heard many say they used to grow almond trees and train the branches to look like menorah, but I’ve not gone looking for historical verification of that beyond what I’ve heard discussed.
I don't think there is a page to purchase the book yet. If you search for "inthelanguageofadam stick of joseph" in Google you should get a hit for the sign up page to be notified when the book becomes available starting May 1st.
That’s more a mark of Hebrew writing, I think. And a mark of narrative story and not symbolic story…? I’ve heard it discussed on a lot of different places; my main take away was that it’s a Hebraic literary quirk, and there aren’t nearly as many of them in the current BofM as there were in the manuscripts, and there were a LOT in the Bible, too, that didn’t survive the translators. Repetition/puns within a verse or chapter or section or however the thing was originally laid out is a mark of “pay attention.” (Like the pun Chava/Eve being the mother of all living - the Greek translates Eve to Zoe because of the importance of the pun since Chava and Zoe mean “life”) There’s also the amplification effect with immediate repetition, like “shalom shalom” meaning “perfect peace” and not just “peace peace.”
Oo that’s fun info. Didn’t know that’s where that ordinance (sometimes) took place! I just know it’s a married couple and the woman anoints the man first.
Here's a fun one just for fun....what if the remaining portion of the gold plates are just waiting for us to discover them by figuring out the encoded abtash or other such coded message to take us to them....knowing the Book of Mormon well enough to decipher the messages within is all that is keeping us from finding the more.... probably not but a fun thought and definitely there are encoded messages within the book but likely there is a more qualitative element we are needing to discover within ourselves to render the more witnesses.
Stick of Joseph has some long episodes with Dave (the long haired gentleman), Mike Day and Bryce Howard (absent, Mike was next to Dave) host Talking Scripture which features a discussion with Dave in the “Mike Geeking Out” playlist, and Dave has appeared recently on Cwic Media and Scripture Notes and probably some other places. There’s also an old playlist on the Academy for Temple Studies channel worth checking out called The Lady in the Temple featuring many different views (LDS and non-LDS) about the Divine Feminine.
Someone tell Cardon that in the day & age of 3 hour podcasts being commonplace & very popular, we won’t tune out if an episode goes long. Many of us love it! ~ And keep up the brilliant work! Cardon is a rockstar!
Yeah, especially these podcast 😂
We need 4 hours or more with these guys, we can push pause 😉
After being tutored by Jared Halverson for 4-6 hrs, this is super short. I listen to you guys on my daily walks, so the more you talk the longer I walk!
I work from home and listen while I work, so I'm okay if they're 8 hour podcasts. 😆
@@cinsains1957😂same!
I think that Dave Butler may be the most interesting man I have ever seen. I mean, my gosh. Incredible.
Have known two people who both had PhDs in Physics AND Philosophy, absolute geniuses, creative, insightful, brilliant, and Dave reminds me of both. Then there's the Dos Equis dude.
I've enjoyed a lot of Ward Radio / Midnight Mormon episodes having watched almost all of them.. I've received insights, learned new things, felt an encouragement in continuing to boldly live the gospel, enjoyed conspiracies and had a lot of laughs... But these last two episodes with Dave and Mike have been two of my absolute favorites. What fountains of wisdom these men are, I just had to comment how much I appreciated these insights and the discussions. Keep it up you guys. You are fighting the good fight and shining much light 🙌🫶
These last 2 podcasts have stayed with me for days!! THANK YOU!
One of Ward Radio’s very best streams ever! Right up with the Don Bradley ones. Woohoo!
Talking scripture is such an awesome podcast Mike and Brice are excellent teachers. Dave's books are so awesome I highly recomend listening and reading their work!!!
The last couple of Lives have been my favorite! I would love to see a live with all of you plus Don Bradley. Thank you to all of you!!!
For a few seconds I thought you were talking about multiple mortal probations, lol. "Lives"
@@Misa_Susaki haha that too I guess. J/k!!
Dave Butler, the Johnny Cash of Ward Radio.
I am loving this. I’m subscribing to talking scripture. I could NOT sleep last night. I had to call my mom first thing.
And The Stick of Joseph is also amazing!!!
There is my painting! Of the three I painted for Dave that one was my favorite.
My husband and I were talking about the freaks of the world who have the odd desire to learn Hebrew. We agreed that God gave you that desire so that you could help get the truth out in the last days. So, we thank you freaks from the bottom of our hearts because all this stuff is FASCINATING and strengthens our testimonies 😂😂👍🏼
Please add the link to the book in the description and links to the guests' channels so we can follow them.
2:05:25 that question gets asked and answered. Also, the guitarist and the guest who sits by himself is from the stick of Joseph podcast on yt
I looked for somewhere to purchase the book on Google and couldn't find anything. I did find a sign up page where you can enter to be notified when the book becomes available starting May 1st. I answered you once and included the address to the sign up page but my posts either didn't make it through or were removed. If you search for "inthelanguageofadam stick of joseph" you should get a hit for the sign up page.
If you search for "inthelanguageofadam stick of joseph" you can find page to sign up to be notified when it's available starting May 1st.
Dave Butler (the guitarist) has many conversations on a few UA-cam channels (Talking Scripture, under the “Mike Geeking Out” playlist; Cwic Show, Scripture Notes, and the Stick of Joseph like the other commenter said). Mike Day (in the baseball cap) has podcast/youtube content called Talking Scripture.
There’s also an old playlist called “The Lady in the Temple” over in the Academy for Temple Studies channel. Doesn’t feature Dave (it’s about 10 yrs old) but there are lectures by many scholars (including Margaret Barker who influenced a lot of Dave’s work), BYU profs, and professionals in the humanities with varying viewpoints about the Divine Feminine, LDS and non-LDS.
I second what ginger snaps has commented. I also recommend you get the book temple studies by Margaret Barker, she is the pioneering scholar of the Israelite temple
Loving the convo about Mary and Miriam. My daughters name is Cassandra, I chose it because of a childhood friend and because of the meaning of prophetess, the women from Troy who wasn't listened to and then the men let that horse in hehe. It's great that you and others are talking about the important role women have had in temple worship and also the priesthood. I think in some ways, although not directly related other religions and cultures have cultivated women and men's groups and the importance of each role and responsibility. As our Aboriginal Aussies call it 'Secret Women's Business'.
I have been watching the Archaeology in Israel for a long time, and there definitely seems to be evidence of a concerted effort pre and post diaspora to rewrite early Israelite religion. Even to the point of rewriting God's nature. I can certainly see everything spoken here to be extremely plausible.
I LOVE DAVE BUTLER and MIKE DAY…such a testimony builder!!! Thank You Ward Radio!!!
I’m fired up, inspired and intrigued.
The gospel is so INTERESTING!.
Thanks to all of you -last two episodes …SUPERB
OK talk about Mary. Mary the mother of Jesus is mentioned by Margaret Barker. According to the gospel of James, Mary was a temple worker making the new veil when she conceives the Lord. So at the same time Mary was making the veil which represents the body of christ she was making the body of Lord. How does this connect to your Mary thesis? BTW I'm a 6 foot gentle giant too.
I know I missed the live.. but I like these long videos. I listen while at work. I'm Canadian myself. Been in the US since 1995. I still hold onto my sowwy and my oot and aboot..
The Salt lake temple did have a seperate holy of holy"s. It was situated between the two sealing rooms in the celestial room , it had a vase in front of the door and it also had a seperate entrance. I would suppose it is now in the temporary temple in the Joseph smith memorial that the general authoritys use. There was a holy of holy's in the Manti temple prior to the completion of the Salt lake temple.
Yes I have seen this place too. And there was a way to get behind the three rooms and down a flight of stairs to the foyer inside the three great east doors.
Holy of holies
General authorities
@@CMZIEBARTH Only the prophet or apostles under the prophets direction. This room is used for revelation and the ordinance of the second anointing. It is my understanding that all temples have a holy of holies.
I have a picture published by the Church of the holy of holies. It was taken and published to combat someone who broken into the SLC temple. It is in a centennial celebration book - SLC Temple a monument to a people. There are mutiple two seater couches on the walls of the room. A large chandelier with a table underneath and rounding ceiling with half circle and circle motifs.There are vines motifs on the light fixtures.
Thanks. I'm just pointing out how each of those terms should be spelled.
It must be painful to attend Sunday School, thanks for all your knowledge! ❤️❤️❤️❤️
Mike Day we need your dissertation!
If one penny is all we can do, Jesus Christ makes up the $49.99.
If we were a pyramid… then for it to be built upon Christ then our foundation is built upon another foundation which is Christ. As we climb Jacob’s latter, as we ascend in the covenants of heaven we are in turn sanctified and renewed and the final pyramid stone is the crown Christ places upon us when we have realigned all that we are to becoming even as He is. So we still have to put in all the work AND become like Him, … And. none of this would be possible without Him! His Grace makes all of this possible, the blue print of how to live our lives and the covenant path are Him, He therefore is the Exemplary Way, He is The True(th) (Straight) way and He is the Light that shines in this world of darkness and those who embrace His light have the way revealed unto their eyes…. Truly no man or woman returns to our Father except it be through The Son!
Nauvoo , Kirkland, Salt Lake, Logan, Manti, Saint George Temples have Holy of Holies in the structure as the Center Place for the Template.
This is great, Add Conor Boyack and it would be epic.
I am so excited for what you guys are doing. I am loving your podcast. I just came across this one looking for more about theI
Second coming.
Kirtland temple is a representation of Revelation 4. 24 seats (24 Elders). Curtain sectioning off congregation into four groups = 4 beasts (see D&C 77). Choir seats in each corner (host of heaven singing and praising God).
The story of Melchizedek calling the wicked priests to repentance (not breaking all their stuff and killing them) makes so much sense in light of D&C 121.41-46 stating the rights of the priesthood are based on the attitude and actions of Melchizedek--he was so great (the greatest among you will be your servant) that God decided to call the high priesthood Melchizedek and even Jesus Christ is called a priest after the order of Melchizedek (Hebrews 5.5-6).
I think this is the longest Cardin has been quiet on his show. That makes me think of what Jordan Peterson says: when he's speaking, it's dead silent. Not even a cough. Everyone is listening intently, wondering "is this the answer?"
I would agree - Don Bradley and Dave Butler and Mike some of your best content. How about a discussion between these three?
I know that Don mentioned that he saw the endowment in BOM which acted as a point for reconsidering the authenticity of the BOM.
How fun to have a job like this. Love it. Thanks for sharing
Yes thanks for your podcasts. My eyes are opening. Lots to learn now.
What if the name Nephi is a conglomerate between the nfr/npy for fair and the Naphal/nephilim for gone away to/fallen ones and he uses that play on words when he describes himself as large of stature...one of the connotations we understand is that the nephilim were large people...what if Nephi is both Npy(fair) and nephilim large and gone away from...it seems those meanings are all associated with him. He may have been a large red haired person of goodly demeanor that is gone away or fallen from his homeland thus fitting with all the connotations of Npy/Naphal/nephilim....just a curious rabbit hole to play with...also apparently a variant of Nfy in Egypt was the name of a possible ship Captain which would also fit him as well and be a good title for kings to carry as cast away captains exiled from their homeland
The difference between a Temple and an Endowment House is an Existing Working Holy of Holies
Christ upsetting the tables of the money changers in the temple Court of the Gentiles fits perfectly as a manifestation of His King-hood. The ancient kings destroyed the implements of abominable worship and Christ destroyed the activity in the temple that was denying Gentiles their opportunity to participate in temple worship. This defilement by the merchants would have also been seen by Christ as an abomination that brings desolation to the souls of the Gentiles and to the Temple.
The book mentioned around 2:04:45 is "In The Language of Adam" by Dave Butler. I can't find it anywhere on Google to purchase but I did locate a sign up page where you can enter to be notified when the book becomes available May 1st. I posted the URL for the sign up page within the video comments and the posts were removed. Maybe something to do with having posted the URL for the book sign up page. Perhaps youtube has issues with links that take you out of youtube itself. Anywho. Great video. I love these topics.
Think I have heard on Stick of Joseph it comes out May 1
There should be a link for it on the Stick of Joseph’s videos with Dave (maybe the first one about the Saudi plates has a link in the description..?) if it’s not here. I know I added my name to the list through their channel.
There is now a link in the description of this video.
Preach, brothers!
We can see the same in our day of those who want silence those that oppose them.
We learn from the Book of Mormon that the better way is to teach/preach the gospel and call to repentance.
Lehi is an exiled priest who fled for his life with his family to preserve the priesthood and took with him Laman & Lemuel who agreed with/were in league with the corrupt priests at Jerusalem. They weren't just "rebellious kids" they agreed with the "righteous Jews" that wanted to murder his father and cremate his remains on the altar. Lehi's mission, and that of his progeny was to preserve the true doctrine of Christ and the priesthood, keep a record of their "doings" to come forth in the last days to convince the remnant that Jesus is the Anointed One, the covenants of God with Israel remain valid and viable so that the remnant can unite with and save Judah. I'm just geeking out about all of this!
In the Celestial room of Salt Lake Temple on the wall above the veil is a Lady in a shell with 2 children on each side. What do you think or know?
love you guys, I just found all you all...life changing information, thank you!!! >>>>> Cardon- which Cardon ancestor are you from?
around 48 minute they say talk about the Jews in jerusalem who corrupted the temple. But in the Book of Mormon Nephi sees the bible and says when it was in the hand of the jew it was pure,, but it became corrupted when it went through the hands of the gentiles. Wondering what David and Mike would say
Yeah, and I’m wondering why Joseph Smith would not have addressed this as he was translating it, AND he said that he literally saw ALL biblical events as he went through it.
Amazing stuff thanks you everyone
Walt Disney as a Freemason valued the parallels in fairy tales. Part of Fantasia use to be in the temple presentation. Knight orders are also patterned after Tree of Life motif only they replaced the fruit/tree with the holy grail. My family comes from long lines of Freemasons and Norman Knightly orders with William the Conqueror and again with Robert the Bruce. My ancestors were loyal Norman Knights.
I was taught the camar and Cumorah connection by Stephen Ricks in Hebrew class at BYU. Not sure if he owns the original idea though.
The actions of Melchizedek are the instructions we receive today through the Doctrine and Covenants. We are to preach peace through repentance and not war (smashing things). "No power or influence can or ought to be maintained by virtue of the priesthood, only by persuasion, by long-suffering, by gentleness and meekness, and by love unfeigned;
42 By kindness, and pure knowledge, which shall greatly enlarge the soul without hypocrisy, and without guile-
43 Reproving betimes with sharpness, when moved upon by the Holy Ghost; and then showing forth afterwards an increase of love toward him whom thou hast reproved, lest he esteem thee to be his enemy;
44 That he may know that thy faithfulness is stronger than the cords of death.
45 Let thy bowels also be full of charity towards all men, and to the household of faith, and let virtue garnish thy thoughts unceasingly; then shall thy confidence wax strong in the presence of God; and the doctrine of the priesthood shall distil upon thy soul as the dews from heaven.
46 The Holy Ghost shall be thy constant companion, and thy scepter an unchanging scepter of righteousness and truth; and thy dominion shall be an everlasting dominion, and without compulsory means it shall flow unto thee forever and ever."
(Doctrine and Covenants 121:41-46) This is the challenge for us today, as Latter-day Saints.
Contending without contention and leading by example rather than by force, which often allows for others to follow their own will rather than God’s (or *our* estimation of God’s will; I have ancestors that were very pleased to disown their child who married a Catholic, which was culturally accepted by their LDS friends and family but definitely not in-line with the gospel. I also think there is a place and a case to be made for marrying outside the faith, because missionary work! Not the generally recommended course, no, and not always the easiest or best course, but not necessarily a wrong one either).
@@gingersnaps215 God's plan, from the very beginning, centered around Agency of choice. And that choice necessitated opposition. If your ancestors advocated a lack of choice, then that doctrine was not the Lord's doctrine, regardless if they thought it was "culturally acceptable." Joseph made this very clear in the 11th Article of Faith: "We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may." (Articles of Faith 1:11)
@@oxfordbuckingham5841 yes, sorry, that was my point; the cultural acceptance was out of line with doctrine. It was poorly phrased.
@@gingersnaps215 God bless you!
I was at the Oakland Temple on Saturday and can confirm that the Celestial Room matches the description spoken of.
Big fan of William Blake and his artwork. One of the eminent men that requested their temple ordinances from Wilford Woodruff in the St George Temple.
Matrilineal Patriarchy is similar to what the Iroquois Confederacy tribes had, where the women chose their tribal leaders and gave them the power to leader, but only because the women have willed it so.
We also have God appearing within the burning bush, and One of the apostles of Christ is known by Christ as having prayed under the fig Tree. So it is interesting to see all of the references to trees and bushes when it comes to prayer and visions and the Lord God's appearance or Angelic appearances!
Mike and Dave actually make me want to go back to church. Never lost my testimony. (Just couldn’t deal with d bags like Cardin every Sunday~ reminds me of Stifler in American Pie smh 🤦♀️ )
I appreciate your service to the 0311 MC guy. My husband is retired Marine. Respect. He’s also catholic and won’t go near a church. But listening to Dave and Mike in the background while he’s around has made the hub give me a side eye.
I love the deep dives. I’m a language nerd. Love going back through the Old Testament and picking it apart. Thanks yall!
Val Larsen has some interesting stuff about all this too. I found his interviews on Gospel Tangents (UA-cam or podcast form). Dave has an interview on that channel, too, from Feb of this year. Dave is also on Stick of Joseph (like 6hrs broken into three parts), Cwic Show, Scripture Notes, and there’s an old episode of Talking Scripture with Dave in the “Mike Geeking Out” UA-cam playlist.
I'm sure he was the fun cool missionary you know they are not all the same
Look up the history of the Isle of Iona, theres a church/cathedral that was supposed to have been built there after Mary and her children and other followers of the Savior ended up there after being run out of France. There were people who recorded the early history. It's located between Ireland and Scotland. Mary, the mother of Jesus, and her brother, Joseph of Arimathea were said to have stayed in Wales; there are many legends about it in Great Britain, but like most things, there are those who have tried to hide it.
Another interesting thing about the number 24 in all this, is that Ammaron told Mormon to wait until he was 24 years old to go retrieve the records from the hill in Mormon 1:3.
Way back when I was studying Israelite Kings at BYU, I remember learning that Israel was economically least prosperous during the reigns of these “supposedly” great Kings. Not sure if that is still the academic view, but it would answer my question of why would the Lord not prosper them if they were so righteous.
GIDDY UP!
This is a great video. Very well done.
Hey Brad Witbeck are you King Mosiah!!!!
You guys definitely should make a supercut of this live episode and the last live episode and if you guys make another one, add that one into the supercut too
Love this. But 1) why do Josiah and Joseph Smith match so perfectly in so many ways if Josiah is wicked? 2) Why didn't the Book of Mormon or Joseph Smith come right out and say Josiah, the Deuteronomists, the authors of Kings & Chronicles, etc were all wicked? Joseph "translated" the Bible and had no problem condemning Psalm of Solomon, but... What about these other books?
Have you guys seen some of the videos on the channel Mormon Yeshiva? He would be an awesome guest to have on your show.
1:27:04 thank you Brad! I believe some of the grove worship was bad and idolatrous. We see this today in our church. Members take it upon themselves and begin to worship “differently” than commanded and whole movements have been created from that. .
what did i just listen to 😂😂😂 Dave, some things are too sacred to share with others- like your singing.
But isn’t this the same King Hezekiah that Isaiah also praised? Isaiah 53 is about King Hezekiah interceding on behalf of his people to stop the Assyrian threat which we also see as a prophetic type of Christ. Am I missing something? Is maybe both true and it’s more nuanced?
1:12 twenty-four temple complex? Ideas?
Don’t forget Elder Oaks talk 1985… Taking upon us The Name of Christ….. future event done by Christ upon our heads….. calling and election?
The Holy of Holies? It's on the floor above the celestial room. I stood outside it in 1964.
So interesting- it’s like when the mom gets to pin on the rank of her scout when they earn it!
Great show Brothers !
Please do a podcast on the red heifers
I've been waiting for Dave to write a fantasy series based in Kalternis. Any plans?
Dave, Don, and Mike should do a UA-cam channel together. That would be epic!
Brigham Young said that Jesus was married, and Orson Hyde preached it twice from the pulpit (one time was during General Conference and I can’t remember if the other was, but regardless it was in public from the pulpit).
A fun FYI: Orson Hyde preached FROM THE PULPIT that Jesus was married. I teased my Stake Pres friend what he would do if I too preached from the pulpit that Jesus was married … he gave me a “delete” gesture. One day he’ll eat then words! Not so much about him but the ruckus it would cause that HE would have to deal with! Ayyyy, members! 😮
at 25:56 We see the person sneaking behind Mike and Dave. We can see you! next time army crawl.
If you look at the menorah’s structure, it is chiasmus in nature, with one center point, and corresponding branches before and after that center point. I wonder if it perhaps is the origin for the chiasmus poems and if that is why the bom is full of them. Also, if Christ had to be anointed with seven spirits, which we can tie with chiasmus or just the number seven, and it had to be a woman who did the anointing, then it makes sense to me why the menorah/tree of life would be a symbol of Christ And the divine feminine
Hi Cardon, Always entertaining. A little off-topic and it maybe be a little dull for many but perhaps you could get a history professor or librarian from BYU to talk about novels written about the Mormon experience. I'm sure that there are many LDS book collectors or booksellers who could a lively overview. (More trivia: the MOS (Miliary Occupational Specialty) designation is no longer used but an 11-Bravo was an infantry man, 95 Bravo an MP.......I believe that 11 Bravo was the basic MOS for all soldiers, whether a general or cook).
Y’all should put some timestamps
This is EPIC 💯
So should I add disclaimers to deuteronomy and 2 kings in my Bible?
How do we know that the Deuteronomists didn't edit the story of Hezekiah to elevate Josiah. I have always wondered how they both are described as the most righteous kings, but have way different endings. Hezekiah is the king when the Assyrians come and siege Jerusalem. The Lord then destroys 185,000 Assyrians and they go home. Josiah on the other hand is killed in battle at a young age. What if Hezekiah was righteous, which seems like a fair assumption considering that Judah is saved during his reign, and the Deuteronomists try to use Hezekiah's legacy to solidify their power. Basically, what if 2 Kings 18:4 was inserted by them? If you take that verse out the text still reads coherently.
When is the audiobook coming out? My ADD makes it hard to sit long enough to read a book. 🥴
Why was the Melkezedek High Priesthood restored to Joseph Smith an Ephraimite. When Ephraim and Dan are exempt from the tribes of 144,000 of sealed Melkezedek High Priests after the Order of Enoch?
30:25
40:25 "Cay-mor-ene?" CS Lewis had "Telmarines" in Narnis. How did he come ip with rhat?
I had this thought, too!
Blake was not a yodeler. I'm pretty certain about that.
Even this Boomer nerd knows who Brandon Sanderson is. Get with it Cardon! 😂😂😂❤
Does Dave sleep?
Wow, I’m interested in your books. Are you giving some away or selling some?😅
Cardon you have so many haters in the exmormon sphere. You are pushing them where it hurts, keep it up man.
Its almost like Hezekiah and josiah were trying to usurp the title of Melchizedek
43:50 ancient Hebrew does have vowels above and below letters, like Brad said later
Right, but not really in the alphabet, like a Latin-based alphabet. The points also aren't in ancient manuscripts (definitely not in the Dead Sea Scrolls; I am unsure of when they first came into regular use), which is why the scribes/translators could play with the words that way. Shift the vowels slightly and you have a totally different word!
Interesting in Portuguese, "keep the commandments" is "guardar os mandamentos." Much more similar to "guard the commandments."
Latin authors most commonly refer to the forbidden fruit as a pomum, a Latin word meaning "fruit" or "tree fruit." Not surprisingly, Old French, which descends from Latin, has the word "pom" (modern French "pomme"), which originally meant "fruit" as well, and was used in the earliest Old French translations of Genesis.
Pomegranates have 12 Chambers with many seeds.
Joseph Smith was sealed to 12 women.
We now know most if not all of them were pregnant and not from Joseph Smith.
Edgar Cayce taught that pregnant Mary, the mother of Jesus Christ, was selected from 12 virgin Essene initiates at the age of 16 and was betrothed to Joseph, age 35.
Question: Who was Mary, the mother of Jesus Christ, sealed to?
Judge ye....
Joseph Smith spoke of a Judge Adams and stated that he was a direct descendant of Jesus. So, yes, Jesus was married and had children. And was sealed, I'm certain.
I wish I wouldn’t have missed the live session.😢 I would have liked to get Dave Butler’s perspective of Jeremiah 44. Jeremiah seems to condemned the Israelite woman in Egypt for burning incense, and making bread offerings to Asherah. Am I reading that incorrectly or would Dave just say that the book of Jeremiah was altered and perhaps not trustworthy? Thanks.
I’d like to know too. There must be a proper and improper form of worship.
I want to believe there is something here but im finding that clearly Asherah was not something favored by God.
In the Gospel library search for…
Elijah: Champion of Israel’s God
@@EminezArtus Thanks. Good article. With the prevalence of counterfeits in the world, such as Baal, who was a son of a supreme god, who died and came back to life, clearly a counterfeit of Jehovah, it makes sense that a counterfeit of Asherah would also exist. I suppose their groves outside of the temple, also meant to celebrate the reproductive elements of that symbolism, is what angered God the most.
@@knelson3326 Yes! Right now I'm stuck on the Menorah. It was placed in there by Moses. I guess what I need is evidence that the Menorah was replaced by Asherah. Which goes with your note about counterfeits. I'm studying my butt off haha trying to figure out what is here clearly the spirit pulls us in on this subject and there is something to learn here. But i don't want to go around saying Asherah is good when in reality it's a counterfeit.
One thing that is undisputed by scripture about the menorah is the fact that is was meant to be a stylized almond tree. No idea why an almond tree, but Aaron’s rod/branch was also an almond. I’ve also heard many say they used to grow almond trees and train the branches to look like menorah, but I’ve not gone looking for historical verification of that beyond what I’ve heard discussed.
Book link?
I don't think there is a page to purchase the book yet. If you search for "inthelanguageofadam stick of joseph" in Google you should get a hit for the sign up page to be notified when the book becomes available starting May 1st.
If you search for "inthelanguageofadam stick of joseph" you can find page to sign up to be notified when it's available starting May 1st.
It should be on the Stick of Joseph’s channel (maybe in the description of one of the videos for the Saudi plates..?) if it’s not here.
Is the word khumri related to cumorsh or the kumarim?
Oops cumorah
So if repetition = important… what the hell are the insights and nuances that give, “if it came to pass” a deep important meaning?
That’s more a mark of Hebrew writing, I think. And a mark of narrative story and not symbolic story…? I’ve heard it discussed on a lot of different places; my main take away was that it’s a Hebraic literary quirk, and there aren’t nearly as many of them in the current BofM as there were in the manuscripts, and there were a LOT in the Bible, too, that didn’t survive the translators.
Repetition/puns within a verse or chapter or section or however the thing was originally laid out is a mark of “pay attention.” (Like the pun Chava/Eve being the mother of all living - the Greek translates Eve to Zoe because of the importance of the pun since Chava and Zoe mean “life”)
There’s also the amplification effect with immediate repetition, like “shalom shalom” meaning “perfect peace” and not just “peace peace.”
Doesnt Gideon take counsel with a prophetess? Or was that another person?
The Calling and Election Made Sure has been called the second Endowment and was performed in some cases in the Holy of Holies.
Oo that’s fun info. Didn’t know that’s where that ordinance (sometimes) took place! I just know it’s a married couple and the woman anoints the man first.
Here's a fun one just for fun....what if the remaining portion of the gold plates are just waiting for us to discover them by figuring out the encoded abtash or other such coded message to take us to them....knowing the Book of Mormon well enough to decipher the messages within is all that is keeping us from finding the more.... probably not but a fun thought and definitely there are encoded messages within the book but likely there is a more qualitative element we are needing to discover within ourselves to render the more witnesses.
Can I find these guys? Do they have a podcast?
Stick of Joseph has some long episodes with Dave (the long haired gentleman), Mike Day and Bryce Howard (absent, Mike was next to Dave) host Talking Scripture which features a discussion with Dave in the “Mike Geeking Out” playlist, and Dave has appeared recently on Cwic Media and Scripture Notes and probably some other places.
There’s also an old playlist on the Academy for Temple Studies channel worth checking out called The Lady in the Temple featuring many different views (LDS and non-LDS) about the Divine Feminine.
What does this mean for Isaiah though? Was he against the Deuteronomist reforms maybe?
That is a theory about why it’s so cryptic! To perhaps better elude any edits.