SRAM 12 vs CAMPAG 13 speed. Which is best? Battle of the 1x groupsets!
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- Опубліковано 28 вер 2024
- I've pitched SRAM Red/Eagle AXS eTap against Campagnolo's brand new Ekar. Which comes out on top? Which would you buy?
Campagnolo Ekar First Ride • The best 1x groupset i...
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"If you're on a budget, Campy is the clear choice..." Said nobody ever!
Not into gravel but that Ekar with a 40t 9-36 and 13 gears could tempt me into a 1x road set up..
Looks like I am going with Campagnolo. I have been waiting for a sram 2x electronic for 3 months. I have opted for the Campy 38 crank with a 10 to 44 rear meg. Thanks for your information, really good!
One man content creator, GCN Ain't got nothing on you!
The Ekar groupset is geared at gravel, while the SRAM with the Eagle cassette is essentially a MTB setup. When fitted with the 10-44 rather than the 9-42 cassette, Ekar is practically on par with the Eagle 10-50 setup when it comes to the lowest gears. It’s the high gears where there is a difference, but arguably a bike used to climb a 30% dirt trail will not be used to sprint at 60 kph. Ekar makes much more sense as a gravel groupset.
I purchased the Pinarello Grevel frameset when it first came out and had my LBS build it up with SRAM Force One. I have always run Campagnolo on my bikes since buying a steel Eddy Merckx in Belgium in 1985 and having it built with Neuvo Record, but Ekar had not yet been introduced until several months after I had gone SRAM on the Pinarello. So I rode the SRAM for over a year and I disliked the single blade shift lever controlling both up and down, and the brakes needing bleeding too often and not modulating very well. I eventually stripped off all the SRAM and replaced it with Campagnolo Ekar. Now I am happy! The Campagnolo Ergo with separate thumb lever to go to a smaller sprocket and finger lever to shift to a larger sprocket are what I have been used to since the 8 speed Ergoshift era. The Ekar brakes are the same as on the Record/SuperRecord road disk brakes. Superb in every respect! I have the 9-42 cassette on Fulcrum wheels, (an off-brand of Campagnolo), Vittoria Terrano Dry 650 x 47 tubeless tyres, and switch between 38, 40 & 42 tooth chainrings depending on where I will be riding. Now, I have the cycling equivalent of a Ferrari! Cost is not a factor for me, the Campagnolo Ekar is just better. That's just my opinion after riding both the SRAM and the Campagnolo on the same bike.
Is it possible to use the same chain (length) with each chainring?
My great friend who owns a small local bike shop could only get the 40 tooth ring on the 172.5 crank from the distributor. So, he sized the chain length for this with the 9 to 42 cassette. I bought a 38 ring and a 42 ring separately for road and off-road riding. I called Campagnolo to ask this question about chain length to them. They said there is no problem with the correct chain length I have and switching between the 42 and 38 tooth chain rings. The tricky adjustment when initially setting up the derailleur is the "B" screw which governs how close the upper pulley is to the cogs. Need somewhere between 1 and 3 mm for Formula 1 instantaneous shifting performance.
Thanks a lot for answering....I gonna buy an Open up with Ekar...so its even more useable
Don't forget the Ekar does also have a 9-42 and 10-44 cassette along with the 9-36. I'm looking at the 10-44 since I have a Sram 10-42 now in an 11 speed with a 40 front chain ring. I can always go to a 38 front ring and go 9-42 which will give me more speed. I like the idea of 13 speeds and shorter increments for shifting. I agree with many that have said an electronic 1x is overkill and cost is expensive for the Sram.
I have 9-42 ekar cassette
I have SRAM Force ETap on my Diverge Pro Carbon 42cr 10-50 cassette. I don't know the individual group set price as it was part of the package. The exact same functionality without the bling finish. I love the crisp, fast, solid shifting and the range, not to mention the cool servo motor sound. I live near the Niagara Escarpment and have called upon the lowest gear a few times. I tapped out at 57kpm on this setup. David is right; the brakes are wonderful.
That price for SRAM Red is just mental
Cost 4 times my bike!!!!
Not really with SRAM releasing Rival and GX etap AXS. If you did a Rival/GX mullet, you'd probably be at less than Ekar.
@@seanrequiredfieldcannotbel1362 I just put together a Rival/GX AXS mullet build and it cost just a bit less than the Ekar.
Thanks Dave this has been extremely helpful!
Voted with my own money for ekar. 9-36 cassette is more than enough range for me, since i dont haveany intention to ride around at walking speed... lol
Obviouly some people do want to do that...so its good to have the choice
Some of us are actually FORCED to ride al walking speeds by the steepness of our local climbs and our lack of watts/excess weight around the waist hahaha.
Tbh if money really was no object, I’d get both: SRAM mullet for the gravel bike and Ekar with the 9-36 cassette for the endurance road bike, which can take up to 35mm tires and can tackle smooth gravel with ease.
Rickardo, i have similar plans for my next Bike. I will buy a trek Domane 38mm tire clearance and a good comfort, but i Think I will go for the wider Range casette, because of steep climbs and i hate to reduce my cadence.
@@Neilz911 Sounds like a good plan. My endurance bike is actually a Domane ALR. I really like the way ir rides. I actually did Grinduro on it and it worked fine
I have the campagnolo chorus 12x2. Works fine for me. (on a steel frame)
I am also building my Curve titan Ultra(an endurance model with 35mm clearance) having the ekar but 40t crank with 9-42 cassette.
I’ve had and still having great experience with e13 Helix cassette. Perfect shifting with all groupset & the best part is you can keep your budget or older 11 speed drivetrain.
Campag all the way if I was to change from my new Shimano GRX Di2 2x
Really, back from electronic to mechanical? First one I heard of. A bit off topic here, but I'm seriously curious - what would tempt you to switch from 2x11, the simpler 1x13 aspect or the (maybe) easier field maintainability for offroad or longer trips? I ride Ultegra RX mechanical, and find that 2x still has the widest range possibility. Switch simply from 12-25 to 11-32, 11-36 or with a longer chain I ride 11-42 with 50/34 up front. No goatlink whatsoever needed. For serious bike packing I'd opt for swapping the chain rings for those subcompact ones that absoluteBLACK make for Shimano, 46/30 or 48/32. (Though I must admit, I never appreciated before how ergonomic Campagnolo hoods appear, and the component design is beautiful.)
@@nikveldkamp8630 Well the Ekar has close ratios higher gears and wider spacing low gears
@@overland_adventure_nz Still doesn't beat the overall range. Steps in terms of percentages between each gear depend on what highest or lowest gear you want to/need to/can push. It's all a calculation game which tradeoff you choose.
Isn't electronic gearing that great as everyone who used it says?
Plus 1x still has the disadvantage of more inherent cross-chaining, and how often I'd need that mechanically inefficient 9T cog, I will have to test.
But still at that price I can upgrade to Di2 and still save some money, even a complete group costs the same as the Ekar group at the online stores here in Europe.
I’m currently on SRAM mechanical 1x11 and I like it a lot. I would love to give Ekar a try, though. That being said, I would put it on my road endurance bike rather than on my gravel bike. My local climbs make me beg for that 50t, so I’m getting one pretty soon!
@@tobycolin6271 you mean 34t chainring + 36t big sprocket?
@@tobycolin6271 for reference I’m currently on a 40t chainring and 42t big sprocket
@@tobycolin6271 thanks for the tip. I gotta tell you I agree that’s the logical/practical approach, but I’ve kinda fallen in love with 1x haha... and when people fall in love they don’t necessarily act logically
@@tobycolin6271 whereas I live in a place where 10% average gradients are the norm for long 10km-20km climbs, with some sections exceeding 18% thrown in along the way (road engineers were definitely not thinking about cyclists back when they build those roads!).
Which would I choose? Campagnolo of course!
Well, if my bike needs a battery to function properly, it comes awfully close to being an e-bike in my opinion. Not to dis Axs or anything, but mechanical shifting is a clear win in my book.
i am surprised that you can't decide, david....its pretty obvious...the EKAR of course!
12 vs 13, once vs twice the price ! Why. Can it be possible to compare the only 13 speed 1x : ROTOR 1x13 vs Campagnolo Ekar. 2 factories known for their racing orientation. As I write this thinkin down, I realize which one suit better my gravel adventure riding style.
Catching the draft of the pup I see.
Great Review! I'm a Campy man so Ekar rang a lot of bells...
Wonder how heavey that ekar crank is?... Really like the look of it, thinking of fitting it to my etap axs setup ;p
615g and remember with campag that will include bearings. Just 40g cups to add to that and that's the whole system
With Campagnolo started making gravel bike groupsets, will they ever return to make MTB groupsets?
I don’t think so. MTB is not a “thing” these days. Not much victuals left there.
But… maybe trigger for flat-bar is released in some day, so you can use Ekar on your Mtb is possible. If you are willing to.
The simplest solution is to get a custom crank from "White Industries" with a smaller chainring smaller than 38T. That will get an MTB range gearing on the bike. However, I am not sure if that actually works since I haven't tested that configuration. 😀
Surely the cost is a major factor and would be great to state that at the outset
Great video, I really enjoy your productions more and more. Here my conclusion is : choose a Shimano GRX !
Why didnt you at keast compare it with the 10-44 cassette??
Differently Ekar. It's much more exclusive and works very well.
If only Sram was 13 speed.
Keep up Shimano!!!
Pity the Ekar isn't electronic....
Hi David, after visiting a local dealer yesterday for a Trek or Ridley I thought let’s watch some earlier reviews again (this one and the one about Classified).
Despite the current lack of components, the dealer also said that they genuinely have more standard components in stock from the most use brands like SRAM and Shimano. So in case of a problem he said, they always have to order from Campagnol/Classified with the drawback of delayed deliveries. I guess (read…hope) it’s just a matter of time that these ‘new’ brands will be more common. Of course it can also be the lack of experience of this dealer with the Campa/Classified components but I wonder if other people get some sort of the same kind of message.
What’s your experience with using those components and getting things serviced/replaced (e.g. in case of broken chain) in reasonable time, is it just matter of time? Anyone else has good experience with using the ‘new’ components?
are the red shifters standard mechanical road shifters? how does it work with 12speed - is the rear der axis?
The red shifters are AXS so electronic. The mechanical ones aren't compatible (11 speed) with the Eagle rear end (12 speed) hence why it's an AXS setup.
Shimano online pricing vs geoblocked SRAM/Campag means there's only one choice.
You can usually get campag discounted heavily online before long (eg Merlin)
Where's Rotor at? They also have 13 speed right?
They do and I've ridden it in the past, and I wasn't impressed - this video was about comparing the newest entrant against my personal current benchmark in the gravel sector
Dumped Sram for its cheap and unreliable Rival leavers for a Campag 11 spd and Rotor 46-30 with a 11-34 Shimano 11spd cassette and Campag H11 shifters Potenza rear mech works brilliantly and only one cross over ratio so I get 21 usable gears. So far 8000+km of use and one chain. Next setup Campag Ekar👍
Fantastic vlog, very informative!
No, David. I have a question: have you tried to pair 1x eTap AXS shifters with a front derailleur? I wonder if they’d work to trigger a front mech. Thank you.
It works, you can set it up with the axs app, then you would have to press both shifters to change the front chainring
More importantly how did you get that campag cassette so clean after months of use?
hi, love the video, can i use a 13 speed campagnolo hub with 11 speed casette?
Ekar all the way
So Campy is nicer and half the price. If you need a smaller chainring and there isn’t one available for the Campy cranks’ BCD, you could buy an aftermarket crank that allows smaller rings and still be well over £1k cheaper.
Weird you're comparing prices of SRAM's highest end electronic groupset vs a mechanical groupset. Apples and oranges.
I'll take the Rotor 1x13!!
Do you have it? If so, how is it? Been looking into it. Thanks
Campagnolo is very expensive, few use it, it is not easily available and it has lagged behind Shimano and SRAM, in the WorldTour the top teams do not use it and few teams have it, the thumb lever is not the most comfortable, its aesthetics are not the best and there are definitely better bands.
Camp. for speed on the flats & Sram Force for the climbs, for me. I'm 4ft'7in" short at only a 100lb. So it makes sense.
Campagnolo
You missed to mention the breaks, specifically the breakfluid which is used. The only reason I don't use SRAM 1x is the DOT fluid which has to be changed at least once a year and it's quite an effort as well.
Best thing you can use is Bionol with a mineral oil system. Highest boiling point of all, biodegradable and you don't have to change it every year.
I'll stick to my mountain bike with suspension for off roading.
That's not what mullet means.
Mullet is 29" front rims, 27/6" rear rims
It can be more than one thing y'know, SRAM have been using mullet to describe this sort of gearing for quite a while, before 29/27.5 mixed wheels became a thing. Anyway it's far from the most important thing to worry about in the world ;)
Omg i just put on sale my 1x13 Ekar in fb market..i will remove it.
Were is shimano grx di2, or a mix of grx di2 and xtr di2
Campag...
Definitely Not electronic group set
Neither I'll.stick.to 11 spd di2 thanks
SRAM never again. Never! I had 6 rival levers replaced due to unstoppable leakage, wrongly assembled parts, lose bolts on the reservoir (the bolt screws directly to the carbon!!), washers carving on the carbon body when tightening the handlebar bolts. Ridiculous.
I choose shimano grx 2x11 :)
I'm thinking about switching to ekar just because of that cassette... on gravel you don't need such a huge range, and if you do, you'll be better on a MTB, what you need is exactly what campagnolo has put over the table. I really wish sram made a similar cassette for axs, something like:
10-11-12-13-14-16-19-22-26-32-38-44
I give them 1.5 years, if they don't I'm going with campagnolo...
I think Shimano will come out with a 14 speed cassette and that is when I will ditch everything else
They still haven't launched 12 speed road (even if patents have been filed in the US), so a jump from 11 to 14 seems unlikely. Just wait for campag 2x13 road and everything else will seem obsolete ;)
Mechanical shifting in 2021.?
Why?
It works 100 years, so why not? 🙂
if you travel around the world you will understand why!
@@massimodellagoduria5801
No,i would’t.
@@mikicastan ... a mechanical break is fixed everywhere,
with
an electronical one you'll come back home by train
I'd be worried about the battery falling off on rough terrain. Also, affordability.
Neither, grx.
I'm looking to get the 3T Strada with the ekar groupset. Strangely enough, that weird bike ticks all my boxes for what I want out of a street bike while Canyon, who I absolutely love, is more specialized with their road offerings. It's a $6k bike though and I'm not a good enough rider to warrant it so it's going to be a while before I feel like I can use it effectively
I own the 3T Strada Team campa edition, 38, 9-42, I love it
Very underrated channel. Information is straight forward, detailed, and honest. Hope your channel grows quickly.
The closer ratios and much cheaper price has me on Campys side. For me, SRAMs shift style is the only benefit to their system.
I've been riding Ekar for 4 months now and on the road I forget I'm riding a gravel bike, and I can get up pretty much any trail that my fitness (and genetics) allows. Braking is extremely smooth and quiet. I hope Campagnolo adds some flat bar levers to their range so I can use it on my MTB.
That's awesome, what gear setup do you use if you don't mind sharing? thinking abt getting the Ekar, for 80% Road/Trail and 20% gravel riding
I totally agree, I m extremely happy with my Ekar group & wheel set .. flat bar levers .. when ever Campagnolo produces them would be awesome.
It’s amazing how much better your reviews are than GCN. Once people find out about your channel they will spend more time watching your reviews.
I tried to watch a GCN video of a bike review and immediately turned it off after I noticed the 8 commercial interruptions every 2 minutes on the time line! The add placements may not be directly under their control but holy crap, it's already a paid commercial I'm trying to watch. Why is it so heavily monetized.
@@woosim1003 Yes, I agree that this guy will make it big time someday, hopefully sooner than late! On another note.. The reason as to why a youtube video, such as GCN, has so many commercials is because of sponsors, sponsors, & yeah.. more sponsors! GCN is even sponsored by Orbea, just so they will advertise there bike brand more often than other bike brands. So don't fall for all that marketing PS. Because at the end of the day popular name brand companies usually care more about business profit than they do care about giving people good quality parts for there money's worth!
Also, youtube has now decided to add a commercial in any video that's more than 8 minutes long even. WELL THEN PAY FOR UA-cam PREMIUM IF YOU DON'T WANT COMMERCIALS. Me: "NO, I will NEVER give in"!!
Gcn is one giant ad
I agree. Their reviews seem more honest. GCN seems to only regurgitate the manufacturer's talking points and don't seem to criticize much of anything.
That ekar cassette is just a work of genius. Close ratios plus range. Everyone should be doing that.
It's getting really hard for people to make up reasons why a front transmission is necessary.
Hi David, thank you so much for your videos, I really enjoy how well produced and informative they are. I drive a specialized Diverge 2021 with GRX Di2 (40/11-42), and I am looking into switching to Campas Ekar (38/10-44). Firstly I would get a better gear ration i.e. „Granny gear“ and secondly I would have a much better „spacing“ in the „heavy“ gears. Would you recommend the switch?
Campagnolo wears in, Shimano wears out. Clunk is good!
Well said, and true 😄
@@marcokalle2452 I love Campy but my current main steed has has Red 1X on it for 9 years (probably close to 40k miles) and has never malfunctioned, except when in need to cable tensioning or hanger alignment.
@@Mark-ff8ir I don't think I mentioned Sram now did I? I'll choose Sram over Shimano any day of the week
I've had two Sram 1x systems (one on a MTB, the other a CX) - and they're fine. However, for me, there is a downside; the jumps between gears. Not as much as a problem off road, but on road it's a nuisance - sometimes you can go from spinning to grinding.
Really interested in Ekar for my Gravel bike, which I haven't yet bought.
Been there, I love the simplicity of my 1x11 and the range is rather honest. I only spin out the 40x11 on downhills, in which case I just enjoy the pull of gravity, but on group rides there is ONE particular gear jump that drives me nuts at a around 33Km/h, forcing me to choose between 83rpm and 103rpm
One reason why 2xs are still viable. Same range but tighter gear ratios.
@@johndef5075 I can’t argue with that on a logical or practical basis. Nevertheless, from an emotional basis and aesthetic basis, I have gone 1x and don’t wanna go back 😂
@@tobycolin6271 hhhmm... you got me thinking 🤔
Curious what you think of the possibility of using one of the larger front chainrings (42 or 44) on the Ekar groupset with maybe the 9-42 cassette for just a road bike. 13 speeds seems pretty reasonable for a 1x road setup if you ask me.
For a road bike you are better to use some other groupset, like the chorus (if you still want campy) cheaper and 12x2
I love the sram axs mullet setup and have it with sram force levers and crank and that brings the cost down soewhat. I have a 40t on the front and 10-52 rear. I can climb almost anything albeit slowly😂
Hi there from Ireland, did you watch Juliet Elliott dream build on UA-cam?
Is it possible to use a Force 1 chainring with the 12 speed flat top chain & the cassette?
I just don't like the chainring on her Marin bike in video.
Seems like Campagnolo is the only compagny, still willing to invest in high performance mechanical groupsets. For the difference in price, Iĺl treat myself with a handbuilt wheelset.
A weight comparison is always nice:)
Do you think 1x is just for Gravel, in a one-bike setup which groupset would work better on the road with a different cassette?
Also, I would have liked to hear more about the different hub standards and wheel choices, is it still pretty limited for campag?
I have heard that 1X setups are more noisy than 2X, any difference in sound between these two setups?
I was going to add weights, but SRAM doesn’t publish weights for this setup and I didn’t want to take it all apart! Both these groupsets are quiet and in my experience 1x makes no more noise than 2x and in some cases it’s quieter because there’s no front mech rub. Campag has made its new freehub design widely available and loads of wheel brands are now offering compatible options so helpfully that won’t be a problem in the long term
Forza Campagnolo…sempre!!!
My new sub 7 kg Gravel machine (Open U.P.P.E.R. with Beast 700C wheels and components) will be fitted with the Campagnolo Ekar group set featuring the 38t chainring and 9-42 cassette. I am considering to add a 650C wheel set with the 10-44 cassette and knobby tires for hard core off-road use. Can’t wait!
Thanks for the thorough comparison. Great video!
I use at mtb 3x10, at race bike 2x11. I won't change. 😉
I am with you there. 1x is so stupid. The compromises has very little advantage for real world riding. Road boost is coming too, which is completely retarded. I have been and will probably only start buying bikes from custom bike builders who use traditional standards.
that campy setup is what id want on both a road and gravel bike
Great review, thanks for that! I think I will go for Sram, but with Force instead of Red. There is no advantage in Red imo on a gravel bike, and pricewise Sram and Campa will be equal then. I'm very positive about Sram Red AXS on my road bike, so why change to Campa, though I really like this Ekar groupset.
Easy choice for me as I would rather walk than ride anything with SRAM's logo on it. Just bought a bike with EKAR despite the many more offerings with SRAM or Shimano, usually for less money.
Any comment on the chain/cassette durability of Ekar?
Also, maybe review those Shamal Carbon wheels?
Great vid, thanks!
Having ridden both, I think the Campagnolo cassette and chain are much higher quality than the SRAM.
Don’t understand why SRAM don’t offer a mullet packaged groupset. You can’t buy the groupset as one - you have to buy it all individually or buy two sets and resell all the spares. It smacks of profiteering by SRAM
Yes it is rather odd - I had to price up all the components separately but guess in a way it lets you mix and match more easily?
@@davidarthur there are force axs 1x groupset packages - but they have road force derailleur. I have force Axs on my road bike and think it’s great - wanted it for my gravel bike and couldn’t believe I would have to buy an eagle derailleur separately. Very odd
I have a 2020 Diverge Sport Carbon with 105 GRX. 99% I ride on road. My question is, is it worth to upgrade to Sram Red 12 Etap? Newbie here... TIA.
Where can you get an Ekar groupset. I have looked on line and found it hard to find somewhere you could buy this groupset
All the usual German and Italian outlets (Bike 24, Bike Components, Lordgun,...) have it If it's easy to import it in the UK under current circumstances is another matter.
Probikekit
I have just bought a new mountain bike with a 1X drive train. First for me and so far I am loving it. I will be reviewing my bike soon on my channel
I like the idea of the Campy gearing I'm just thinking those shifter buttons are going to annoy me even some accidental shifts when the terrain gets tricky. Case of trying it out.
Comparing the price between a mechanical system (essentially second tier tech since Ekar is not close to Record) and a top tier electronic system isn't fair at all. If you compare to the combo of Force AXS and second tier electronic mountain systems it's a much more fair comparison in terms of equipment . At that point the price is reasonably close, and the premium can be chalked up to SRAM being fully wireless.
Don't get me wrong, I like the idea of Ekar, but I would 100% trade the 9, 10, and maybe 11 tooth cogs for more single tooth spacing in the teens and maybe one larger cog at the end. To me a 12-40+ 13-speed cassette and a 38+ chainring would be great. I'm just not sold on the necessity of the super small tooth cogs for the average person riding off pavement.
Campy easiest gear 38/44T isn't low enough for me...even SRAM's AXS Wide goes lower. Other than pro riders, if you're climbing off-road on a 10% grade or doing any bikepacking, you'll want the lowest possible gear ratio!
Relooking at this given recent sram updates. I have been a die hard road 2x. But I am probably now going to 46 or 48t and 10 44. This gives me simplicity, weight saving, wider range. And I am considering putting it on a gravel e bike. The pivot e-vault. U should have a look. Would welcome your thoughts.
Sram makes good expensive stuffs, but their low end stuff leave much to be desire.. i'll go with campy and shimano on anything simply because they gives me much less grieves when im supposed to be having fun...
I know this is a year old, but important to note in price comparison is that it's also an XX1 rear derailleur when you could pay half of that for a gx eagle axs derailleur, even the xo1 axs derailleur is ~$200 less. Match that with an xo1 chain rather than an xx1 chain and you have a much more solid value per dollar.
I think he used mallet absolutely wrong. Mullet is 29er wheel front and 27.5 rear MTB. Has nothing to do with a group set setaup. Sram offer lower price electronic gravel group sets. Mid level is actually priced very close to ecar. Unless you buy backpacking bike I see no reason to spend money on Ekar. Campy is also very niche product and usually more expensive to repair and replace.
Ekar seems to be well thought through. I do use all brands on various bikes and they're all good, but.. 2 steps up in the smallest sprockets is a big no no for a all-purpose bike. SRAM and Shimano cassettes have some problems for me on a 1x setup.
Also, if you mix the components with a mtb rear, isn't it more expensive to purchase as compared to getting a full groupset ?
Electronic on a bilke? No thanks for me.
Campag...noglo!
campa
Ekar!
Ekar
If you were going to build your own personal bike that was going to be ridden 80%+ on the road and you had to choose between 1x Ekar or 2x GRX or SRAM, which would you choose? Is the availability of parts / cost to maintain in the future something you would consider? I'm very much struggling with this decision. Thank you for your great content! I loved the 6 reasons for 1x video.
Must be nice to test and review $10,000 bikes that 95% of riders can't afford... I had Campy only once on a Bianchi and never really liked it. Went to Dura Ace and never looked back.
We talk about 12 and 13 but jury is still out on durability
Not really for 12 speed - it's been out for years and seems to be holding up pretty well, even at the cheaper level groupsets.
Campagnolo for me. If someone is hauling 20kg let them go buy a 50 tooth cog.
Bloomin' 'eck Dave. When shopping with my wife she has trouble choosing which shoes or top to buy and I always tell her to get them both which makes her extremely happy (happy wife etc....)
But... I would have trouble choosing between either of these and I don't think I would receive the same response.
Solution? Hmmm!
Unless you allow the wife a choice between a £1500 pair of Loubs and a £3,000 Chloe bag, and say "oh, get them both", in which case I'm sure you'd be OK too. ;-D