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I think when it comes down to it, one of the reasons why The Batman's Firefly seems to be more fondly remembered, is because he just has a more fun personality. His arrogant hot shot temper and the fun of Batman taking him down a peg just made it more fun and made people watching more excited to see him in future episodes.
And the fact that he would transform into a more dangerous threat, Phosphorus, in the final season and almost destroyed Gotham. The Batman version of Firefly was arguably more sympathetic than the comic book version
Here's to hoping we get a video or two on how certain post-DCAU works and even the DCAU tie-in comics did some things better than the otherwise "godly" DCAU itself. Case in point, Hugo Strange in The Batman Adventures and The Batman 2004.
Honestly, I would have liked to have seen more of Garfield's obsession with fire than with Cassidy. The fire motif seemed a bit secondary to Firefly in the episode.
@@jordanloux3883its not purely for sexual gratification, which we know now, but we only learnt that in the early 2000’s, so your probably right about that.
@@jordanloux3883 tbf pyromania's more so a developed relief to tension, which while it can be a kink thing, ain't inherent to it's nature as a disorder. Maybe the writers could've flipped the romantic dynamics with this line of thought in mind, like perhaps some guy faces actually traumatizing abuse at the hands of a lover (ngl im sick of 'man got rejected'), so he turns to fire to not only replace all human intimacy but burn it away. Like vibe wise i'm thinking a sadder tf2 pyro.
it would've been neat if after the initial incident where he sees cassidy surrounded in flames he starts to go mad, the memory mixing in his mind as he mixes the image of cassidy surrounded in flames until he sees the flames AS cassidy, culminating in him becoming obsessed with burnign everything to create his 'goddess of flame' "Look at her batman! Isn't she beautful!? The more i burn the brigther she becomes! MY Cassidy!"
Pyro has the Arkham Knight Firefly cosmetic for a reason. They even have similar delusions, though Lynns is aware it's indeed fire and not bubbles and rainbows like Pyro.
I think the symmetry with Mr Freeze is interesting. Hes made out to be the polar opposite to Freeze in every single way; from motif to motivation. One with fire, the other with ice, one with genuine love and revenge, the other with obsession, possession, and anger at not getting his way. Very interesting.
I can see why they barely used him after. Focused on the wrong aspect, depicted him as an unhinged simp stalker rather than a pyromaniac who worships flames. Just nothing there that warrants many revisits.
Yeah, it's kinda why I prefer his incarnation in The Batman (2004) not only having better design but also making him cocky hot tempered mercury with a flame obsession.
I think the reason why is that they didn't plan on him being firefly, more the inciting incident for the next Firefly (Cassidy) as the video suggested she would have been in a later episode that never happened.
Firefly does have a solid design that I like. And even though I enjoy his debut episode, I like comics interpretation a bit more since him being an arsonist make sense than being a psychotic stalker.
Despite not standing out narratively or anything, this episode stuck with me because of the ending. We don't often linger with the trauma Batman's villains leave on civilians, and Cassidy's full-blown PTSD freeze in the final shot is a perfectly haunting way to close the episode. And no, not every villain has to be more than the hired muscle, and I wish they'd used Firefly more in that regard. Some other villains, too. By the way, congratulations on the sponsorship! I'm glad to see someone paying you for your talents! Just don't sell your soul. Seriously. You read comics! I don't have to tell you the kooky shenanigans someone can cause with one of those things. No, best to keep your souls in a safe, or at least a lockbox. (for real, good on ya)
Haha don’t worry I’m very selective about who I will work with. I’ve had some shady companies reach out about promoting dodgy looking products and I’ve responded with a polite “HELL NO!” The Manly Bands team are friendly people and I dig their Batman rings! I wish I could afford their replica One Ring from Lord of the Rings, but even with my discount code it is still out of my price range 😂
to be fair the reason is 1) the planned idea of building on it to have her fall into the same madness as firefly and 2) to show the consequences of her own petty, bullshit behaviour, a punishment for being not a good person who relied on her status too much
I honestly do like Gotham's take on Firefly where it was the abused sister who then became corrupted then wanted to burn the world down for those who oppressed her
The scene with Firefly’s shrine to Cassidy feels so disturbing to me to this day. I think the music of the scene plays a huge part, but seeing his apartment makes you forget you’re watching Batman for a second and are instead watching a true crime drama or something like that.
This episode is really dark because it's also grounded in reality, I recently watched an episode from one of my favorite anime series Case close/ detective Conan The episode is literally called the stalker. I'm not gonna tell you how it ends but it's not a happy ending.
Gotta love the "Mundanger" trope. If I have a favorite type of show and episode with such a morbid sense of realism, I'd pick Paranoia Agent's "Mellow Maromi", where a Japanese animation team suffer oh so much because of time constraints, too much stringent ambition and neutered passion on the higher-ups' and team's part, and a clumsy, monkey-like, and slowly unhinged co-worker named Saru (not that he's the only one who snaps in the story).
For me I remember seeing firefly as a kid when playing Batman (2004) on the leapfrog. Something about him struck me and has always stuck in my mind. He’s one of my favorite underrated villains
I'm happy to see this video getting so many views. Firefly is an interesting villain to me, but you are right that he really only needed one episode dedicated to him. I gotta say, that song Cassidy sings is terrible, no wonder she put up with him, his pyro is what made her a star. I had no idea about the history of the characters in the comics. Again Tim Bruce's direction with adapting comic material proved to be the best course of action. This Firefly is really the only one I know and is the version I like the best. Also, I thought that Fire Sword of his was pretty cool.
Despite his motivations in the show being more personal, I feel comic book Firefly (the one from 90's) still better than BTAS/TNBA version. The idea of him being a pyromaniac lashing out on the city because of his miserable childhood makes him a dark reflection of Batman, who also had a tragic childhood but chose a different path. There's even a story (that was written by Paul Dini) in which Firefly tried to burn Gotham citzen, claiming that the city is already doomed by corruption and the only solution is to buried it's people with the flames, unlike Batman, who always belives that he can make Gotham a better place.
I've just found your video essay's and I'm deeply impressed! I really love how you break open each character, or episode you talk about to just pick apart all the little bits and pieces. Like a 4 course meal of interesting observations, summary, opinion, and analysis.
@michaelandreipalon359 also Killer Croc from _The Batman_ (the Cajun version), Orion from JLU, "Heavyman" Koenig on _Static Shock_ . . . I'm pretty sure that I'm missing a few, but they're the other standouts.
🎩We're becoming the meme of the anime girl holding up a beer going "[BLANK] mentioned!!!" with a city but with Annie, ahaha. But yes! Firefly, fun to learn it wasn't BTAS to reinvent this wheel. I daresay we agree that Killer Moth and Firefly have blended together in our minds at points, so the distinction is appreciated. We'd say he's a character more about the spectacle of fire than the actual, well, character himself. And like you expressed, sometimes a character just works like that. Simple and sweet.
It was created by the CEO of Mattel. He apparently used to say the word toyetic a lot and nobody knew what it meant until much later. Basically a toy that looks fun to play with.
It feels like there is a lot more under the surface we never got to see about Firefly. Check out the 1979 movie Don't Go in the House to see a much darker take on a pyromaniac themed character.
Honestly I think I like the comic one before the animated series a little more then the BAS one like just a weird stalker isn't nearly as much fun or has as much room for stories as a pyromaniac who spent there entire life in captivity so know he just destroys the things he could never have I feel like that has way more places it could go
Just subscribed! Huge fan of Batman the animated series and of Batman’s rogues gallery. Will you ever do an episode on Maxie Zeus? He had one episode in the series. I really enjoyed watching that insane and delusional villain and enjoyed his several of his comics stories as well. He’s one that doesn’t get mentioned often. They haven’t even made a figure of him which always made me feel like the BTAS figure rogues gallery is incomplete.
I get whatcha mean with how not every villain has to be psychologically complex. But i think that is what is so interesting about him. How stagnant he actually is on a mental level. There is no room for change or improvement as his literal only solution for any problem simply involves more fire. He is a bottom of the barrel character in that he simply can't get any worse.
Firefly will always be one of my favorite villains. His design sand voice in TNBA was cool, even his short appearance in JL. But making his obsessed over his ex more than fire was disappointing. It made more sense to be in love with Volcana. Even his appearance in The Batman he had a somewhat better relationship. I still think the Arkham games has the most accurate representation of him. I would’ve loved to see what Brendan Fraser could’ve done with the character.
I think even Frollo has more of an awesome edge compared to OB and Bill though. Am somewhat more into mundane yet extremely dangerous foes when it comes to Disney storylines... a theoretical case in point, I'd rather have sequel saga to the Disney cartoons Gravity Falls, Amphibia, and The Owl House have its primary antagonist not be a bloody godlike Collector being and instead be an American (later, NATO/UN) commander (who may suddenly be successful enough to become POTUS and/or *Secretary General)* who LOVES fighting a justified, interdimensional expeditionary war by way of leading their own roughshod, and slowly but surely experienced, multi-organization that pays homage to XCOM, Third Echelon, First Encounter Assault Recon, the Global Defense Initiative, the Global Occult Coalition, Task Force 141, the National Space Defense Force (the Battlezone one), Grendel Squadron, and more... which will eventually lead to them, as mentioned, becoming extremely influential and ending up declaring a "liberating crusade" on their own Earth and WINNING against, say, the Ruskies, the ChiComs, the Iranians, the NoKors, and so on (though said victories may feel like overpowered hypocrisy, considering they might have hired the help of a Multiversal defense force who sympathizes with their ideals and motives... long story on that); this then follows a long, hard, and brutal overthrow against the guy, but even then, did that do any more good than what they did, no matter how exploitative and crass?
I prefer the arsonist version of firefly, but I do think brave and the bold having the original light-belt take on firefly be connected to the rainbow batsuit was clever.
I feel as if Garfield had given Cassidy everything only for her to take it and maybe even verbally abuse him only for him to figure out who she truly is and feel a burning hatred for her and want to get ride of her would be way more interesting and still dark
"Torch Song' was the first episode of TNBA I saw, during my freshman year of college. And that ending--WOW. 😳 I do wonder, though: if Fox didn't want fire-themed villains, how did Pyro manage to show up on X-Men? 🤔
@@Dfturcottmaybe that’s where I heard the word! I remember Bruce Timm using it when talking about Superman’s various costumes in STAS being a request from the toy companies
@@SerumLake if you look up freakazoid and toyetic there’s the clip I thought you were referencing. Ether way, love this deep dive into Batman you’re doing. It’s great and I love watching them.
A good video would be a comparison on how 90s Spiderman and batman with health with the same censors. Like batman gotta away with guns where spidey has to have lazers
Feels a bit strange that the likes of the more mundanely relatable popstar jerkwad Cassidy and the anti-Superman covert ops failure known as Volcana are far more memorable than him, in my perspective. "Ah, love. A dreadful bond... and yet, *so easily severed."*
Saying that he along with Joker,Harley Quinn, Deadshot and Clayface were only Bat villains appear in Justice league before that stupid Bat embargo as I really believe that other Bat villains should have appeared like the Penguin as he has potential to be a leader of the Injustice league, Riddler, Killer Croc, Scarecrow,Mad Hatter who I would have him Team up with the Mirror Master and I’m sure about Two Face as he isn’t a physical threat to someone who is powerful as Superman as I remember a old Justice League that he does join temporally and also I would have planned to use those one off villains from Batman TAS like Red Claw, Lloyd Ventrix aka the Invisible man, Grant Walker and HARDAC
Curious How Firefly’s backstory in the show could have some biologic base Only male fireflies can produce light to attract females Maybe is a way to show that, no matter if you think the flame of love is ignited, a relationship is made of two parts. Equals that should respect eachother
Eh, I don't know. Having fire villians is actually pretty damn cool. Though I get there's only a few stories you could tell. Maybe have him be a serial stalker that even rocet Roxy wouldn't touch?
It didn’t get that far along, it was just an idea that Rich Fogel set up at the end of Torch Song and would’ve come back to if TNBA had a second season. He said all this in an interview with The Watchtower Database: ua-cam.com/video/DDoY8tCg0Ag/v-deo.htmlsi=8_DD03Qt31e4-r6k
I would have loved an episode that subverted the spurned would be lover. Like crimes are happening with ties to a woman, she tells a heart breaking story of love and breakup turned stalker. So Batman investigates and can't find any evidence the man is the stalker. Batman breaks into his house, dramatic music, and where the shrine is supposed to be! Nothing. Maybe a poster of a woman in a bikini, maybe some sports memorabilia, and that's where Bats puts two and two together, whatever the man's ties to the woman, he's the victim. He moved on like a healthy man should and that wasn't good enough for her, so she has to wreck his life, even unto death. Because if he's not shattered by her rejection she'll shatter him other ways.
How very dare you, this is a BTAS Channel!!! 😂 Nah, it’s cool. One day I might do a video about The Batman, but it isn’t something I’m particularly passionate about.
I always want to watch these videos, but I cannot stand the “beetas” pronunciation. Can’t kill you to say it the regular way. I gotta put this on do not recommend channel.
I prefer the insane pyromaniac version of Firefly from the comics. The animated version is a weird creep who’s broken because a woman didn’t reciprocate his interest. Comic Garfield is much more entertaining as a snarky mercenary with an obsession for burning down everything that gets in his way rather than retreading Mad Hatter’s steps.
Sounds like that one merc from Black Lagoon who kinda looks and carries himself like Hank Hill, cheerfully smiling as he describes how he barbecued his own wife and children.
I always want to watch these videos, but I cannot stand the “beetas” pronunciation. Can’t kill you to say it the regular way. I gotta put this on do not recommend channel.
In Hatter's case, he wasn't even directly rejected/ told no because he never asked. Alice had no idea how he really felt until after he went too far. She thought he was just being a good friend trying to cheer her up after a bad breakup. He just assumed. Like, Jervis, buddy, how do you expect Alice to become your girlfriend if you never ask her out directly? Communication is key, Tetch :P
After his accident I like to imagine Lynn’s has a very damaged gravely voice, like his vocal cords have been severally damaged. It helps add a greater level of menace to the character
I was introduced to Firefly thanks to The Batman. This version was more casual and had more confidence, but his appearance in Batman Arkham Origins is my all time favorite
The DCAU's Firefly, while decent, is also not terribly compelling or memorable. Firefly as not only pyromaniac and serial arsonist, but a depraved stalker as well, doesn't come across as terribly original. His introductory episode, while in some ways frighteningly realistic, is forgettable and his character equally so. To be fair, it's not like there was too much to work with (though I guess the same could be said about Mr. Freeze before Heart of Ice) since the character's presence in the comics didn't exactly leave much of an impact. His reinvention in Knightfall was definitely an improvement over his original Golden Age design and origin, but I think you'd struggle to find anyone saying Firefly is their favourite Batman villain. The lack of personality was partly why Firefly's depiction in The Batman series really resonated with people. Jason Marsden’s voice for the character as an arrogant but fun hot shot along with his spectacular and unmistakable black and yellow design just made the character more fun. It made people watching excited for him to appear again which wasn't really the case for the DCAU Firefly.
I . . . actually liked Firefly when I saw him in TNBA as a kid. Maybe it was just the lightsaber, but I just thought he had a cool design. Then _The Batman_ kinda blew this version out of the water, and I still can't believe that DC never updated his comic design to be closer to that one.
Flashy was definitely the entire design philosophy of The Batman. That particular style didn't quite click for me, personally. But it is refreshing to have a version of the characters that embraces the camp and stylization of the genre, whole heartedly.
@@CapnAlces As always, every animated Batman iteration should always have a certain something that makes it extremely far off from the DCAU, yet also feel as consistently on par with it in return. Cases in point, The Batman 2004 is more energetically youthful and thus flashy, Batman: The Brave and the Bold is entertainingly campy yet also showcases an emotionally and physically stable veteran Dark Knight, and even The Wayne Family Adventures webcomics are down-to-earth yet loose enough to feel right with its character and world interconnections. Who knows what works like Caped Crusader will bring? Bets on having themes not unlike the Black & White comics.
5:09 even tho I understand you comparison, imo, he fits better with the "color themed" (ex Crazy Quilt, Polkadot man) villains rather than "bug themed" ones. And as far as "character incarnetion" are concerned, the "2004 The Batman" version is the best take on Firefly I seen thas far. Bouth character and desighn wise.
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I think when it comes down to it, one of the reasons why The Batman's Firefly seems to be more fondly remembered, is because he just has a more fun personality. His arrogant hot shot temper and the fun of Batman taking him down a peg just made it more fun and made people watching more excited to see him in future episodes.
And the fact that he would transform into a more dangerous threat, Phosphorus, in the final season and almost destroyed Gotham. The Batman version of Firefly was arguably more sympathetic than the comic book version
Oh yes, comic book (and TNBA) Firefly isn’t at all relatable to most people. He’s an awful person.
Here's to hoping we get a video or two on how certain post-DCAU works and even the DCAU tie-in comics did some things better than the otherwise "godly" DCAU itself. Case in point, Hugo Strange in The Batman Adventures and The Batman 2004.
They had their cake and at it too with the episode "white heat" turning their firefly into a tragic figure.
Most people who talk about firefly talk about the 2004 one. Hell he’s the reason most people know him
Honestly, I would have liked to have seen more of Garfield's obsession with fire than with Cassidy. The fire motif seemed a bit secondary to Firefly in the episode.
I can see why, since pyromania is ultimately a sexual fetish and there were clear lines that the censors would not allow on the air.
@@jordanloux3883oh be quiet
@@jordanloux3883its not purely for sexual gratification, which we know now, but we only learnt that in the early 2000’s, so your probably right about that.
@@jordanloux3883 tbf pyromania's more so a developed relief to tension, which while it can be a kink thing, ain't inherent to it's nature as a disorder.
Maybe the writers could've flipped the romantic dynamics with this line of thought in mind, like perhaps some guy faces actually traumatizing abuse at the hands of a lover (ngl im sick of 'man got rejected'), so he turns to fire to not only replace all human intimacy but burn it away.
Like vibe wise i'm thinking a sadder tf2 pyro.
it would've been neat if after the initial incident where he sees cassidy surrounded in flames he starts to go mad, the memory mixing in his mind as he mixes the image of cassidy surrounded in flames until he sees the flames AS cassidy, culminating in him becoming obsessed with burnign everything to create his 'goddess of flame'
"Look at her batman! Isn't she beautful!? The more i burn the brigther she becomes! MY Cassidy!"
I love how Fire fly is a slightly more down to earth version of pyro tf2.
What about the TF Classic take?
Pyro has the Arkham Knight Firefly cosmetic for a reason. They even have similar delusions, though Lynns is aware it's indeed fire and not bubbles and rainbows like Pyro.
I think the symmetry with Mr Freeze is interesting. Hes made out to be the polar opposite to Freeze in every single way; from motif to motivation. One with fire, the other with ice, one with genuine love and revenge, the other with obsession, possession, and anger at not getting his way.
Very interesting.
I can see why they barely used him after. Focused on the wrong aspect, depicted him as an unhinged simp stalker rather than a pyromaniac who worships flames. Just nothing there that warrants many revisits.
Yeah, it's kinda why I prefer his incarnation in The Batman (2004) not only having better design but also making him cocky hot tempered mercury with a flame obsession.
Design's cool, but I think it's too flashy. At least the DCAU version has the right sense of pragmatism.
Mad Hatter is a unhinged simp stalker done right. Firefly was boring. Maybe they should have fleshed out their relationship and it would have worked.
I think the reason why is that they didn't plan on him being firefly, more the inciting incident for the next Firefly (Cassidy) as the video suggested she would have been in a later episode that never happened.
You know nothing
Firefly does have a solid design that I like. And even though I enjoy his debut episode, I like comics interpretation a bit more since him being an arsonist make sense than being a psychotic stalker.
Despite not standing out narratively or anything, this episode stuck with me because of the ending. We don't often linger with the trauma Batman's villains leave on civilians, and Cassidy's full-blown PTSD freeze in the final shot is a perfectly haunting way to close the episode. And no, not every villain has to be more than the hired muscle, and I wish they'd used Firefly more in that regard. Some other villains, too.
By the way, congratulations on the sponsorship! I'm glad to see someone paying you for your talents! Just don't sell your soul. Seriously. You read comics! I don't have to tell you the kooky shenanigans someone can cause with one of those things. No, best to keep your souls in a safe, or at least a lockbox.
(for real, good on ya)
Haha don’t worry I’m very selective about who I will work with. I’ve had some shady companies reach out about promoting dodgy looking products and I’ve responded with a polite “HELL NO!” The Manly Bands team are friendly people and I dig their Batman rings! I wish I could afford their replica One Ring from Lord of the Rings, but even with my discount code it is still out of my price range 😂
Careful with getting a One Ring. We don't some Gollum-esque to bite off a finger.
@@SerumLake Oh, dang, that IS a nice ring. It's gorgeous. It is... precious to me...
Mary said if it was anyone, it’d be her 😱
to be fair the reason is 1) the planned idea of building on it to have her fall into the same madness as firefly and 2) to show the consequences of her own petty, bullshit behaviour, a punishment for being not a good person who relied on her status too much
I honestly do like Gotham's take on Firefly where it was the abused sister who then became corrupted then wanted to burn the world down for those who oppressed her
I THOUGHT FIREFLY WAS SICK AS SHIT AS A KID I FORGOT HE EXISTED
That fireproof suit Batman wore looks like the one from Batman Beyond that Bruce uses to save Terry from Inque.
Something that The Batman (my favorite Batman show) FINALLY has something fans prefer in that over the BTAS version
Hmmmm I also kinda like Ethan a lil better than Matt.
The scene with Firefly’s shrine to Cassidy feels so disturbing to me to this day. I think the music of the scene plays a huge part, but seeing his apartment makes you forget you’re watching Batman for a second and are instead watching a true crime drama or something like that.
Ah yes Firefly.
I haven’t watched much TBNA but I liked The Batman 2004’s take on Firefly and that’s how I found out about him
I wish they did more with phosphorus.
@@lol-fc9kg yeah, I hope they bring back Phosphorus in some way in any future Batman media
he's probably my favorite B-Tier batman Villain his concept is cool and i like his design, his boss battle on Arkham Origins was awesome
"he's awkward and lumbering, a threat"
Bro, friendly fire T_T
This episode is really dark because it's also grounded in reality, I recently watched an episode from one of my favorite anime series Case close/ detective Conan The episode is literally called the stalker. I'm not gonna tell you how it ends but it's not a happy ending.
Gotta love the "Mundanger" trope.
If I have a favorite type of show and episode with such a morbid sense of realism, I'd pick Paranoia Agent's "Mellow Maromi", where a Japanese animation team suffer oh so much because of time constraints, too much stringent ambition and neutered passion on the higher-ups' and team's part, and a clumsy, monkey-like, and slowly unhinged co-worker named Saru (not that he's the only one who snaps in the story).
The original Firefly outfit makes me think of Killer Moth
For me I remember seeing firefly as a kid when playing Batman (2004) on the leapfrog. Something about him struck me and has always stuck in my mind. He’s one of my favorite underrated villains
I'm happy to see this video getting so many views.
Firefly is an interesting villain to me, but you are right that he really only needed one episode dedicated to him. I gotta say, that song Cassidy sings is terrible, no wonder she put up with him, his pyro is what made her a star.
I had no idea about the history of the characters in the comics. Again Tim Bruce's direction with adapting comic material proved to be the best course of action. This Firefly is really the only one I know and is the version I like the best. Also, I thought that Fire Sword of his was pretty cool.
Ironically, Cassidy's VA is a good singer in her own right.
"Some men just want to watch the world burn."
Despite his motivations in the show being more personal, I feel comic book Firefly (the one from 90's) still better than BTAS/TNBA version. The idea of him being a pyromaniac lashing out on the city because of his miserable childhood makes him a dark reflection of Batman, who also had a tragic childhood but chose a different path. There's even a story (that was written by Paul Dini) in which Firefly tried to burn Gotham citzen, claiming that the city is already doomed by corruption and the only solution is to buried it's people with the flames, unlike Batman, who always belives that he can make Gotham a better place.
Hmm, which comic?
@@michaelandreipalon359 Streets of Gotham. Written by Paul Dini.
@@alexandrefrauches132 Thanks!
Ya know firefly gets a bad rep for being the one Batman villain to not mirror him in any way but that’s actually a good point
I love the firefly design from the batman
I've just found your video essay's and I'm deeply impressed! I really love how you break open each character, or episode you talk about to just pick apart all the little bits and pieces. Like a 4 course meal of interesting observations, summary, opinion, and analysis.
Welcome aboard, and bon appetite!
I really like the Batman fire fly suit cause it's cool
Fun fact: firefly was voiced by Hellboy himself, Ron Perlman
Not in The New Batman Adventures!
He was voiced by Mark Rolston who would voice Lex Luthor in YJ years later.
Oh dang IMDB got me messed up then lol
Regardless, Ron Perlman voiced quite A LOT of DC characters over the years, most notable being the DCAU Clayface and Teen Titans' Slade.
@michaelandreipalon359 also Killer Croc from _The Batman_ (the Cajun version), Orion from JLU, "Heavyman" Koenig on _Static Shock_ . . . I'm pretty sure that I'm missing a few, but they're the other standouts.
🎩We're becoming the meme of the anime girl holding up a beer going "[BLANK] mentioned!!!" with a city but with Annie, ahaha.
But yes! Firefly, fun to learn it wasn't BTAS to reinvent this wheel. I daresay we agree that Killer Moth and Firefly have blended together in our minds at points, so the distinction is appreciated. We'd say he's a character more about the spectacle of fire than the actual, well, character himself. And like you expressed, sometimes a character just works like that. Simple and sweet.
Hmm, thought you were referring to Frieren.
Minor note, but I legit thought the word “toyetic” was a made-up word from a Freakazoid episode involving the Freakmobile.
It was created by the CEO of Mattel. He apparently used to say the word toyetic a lot and nobody knew what it meant until much later. Basically a toy that looks fun to play with.
Super-dude extraordinaire . . .
Comic book firefly in the past is ridiculous, but the firefly today is amazing and twisted. Instead of light, he is a pyro maniac.
Dis is gonna be one hot video. Love firefly.
Hope you enjoyed it!
8:44
“Listen lady, I only got eyes for one girl and she’s a cat.”
-Bman, probs
Beware The Creeper always made me laugh. I really wish he got another episode.
7:21 I knew she looked familiar!
Thanks for pointing that out.
Any chance you'll ever cover "The Batman" and its versions of the rouges gallery?
Never say never, but I doubt I’ll do lots of videos about that show. Maybe a handful?
I think Cassidy as the second firefly would’ve been an interesting idea. It’s a shame it never happened.
It feels like there is a lot more under the surface we never got to see about Firefly.
Check out the 1979 movie Don't Go in the House to see a much darker take on a pyromaniac themed character.
Honestly I think I like the comic one before the animated series a little more then the BAS one like just a weird stalker isn't nearly as much fun or has as much room for stories as a pyromaniac who spent there entire life in captivity so know he just destroys the things he could never have I feel like that has way more places it could go
Just subscribed! Huge fan of Batman the animated series and of Batman’s rogues gallery. Will you ever do an episode on Maxie Zeus? He had one episode in the series. I really enjoyed watching that insane and delusional villain and enjoyed his several of his comics stories as well. He’s one that doesn’t get mentioned often. They haven’t even made a figure of him which always made me feel like the BTAS figure rogues gallery is incomplete.
He is on the list - fairly low on the list, granted, but on the list nonetheless 👍
I get whatcha mean with how not every villain has to be psychologically complex. But i think that is what is so interesting about him. How stagnant he actually is on a mental level. There is no room for change or improvement as his literal only solution for any problem simply involves more fire. He is a bottom of the barrel character in that he simply can't get any worse.
What’s with cool characters being pyromaniacs: Pyro, Dingodile, Firefly etc
Great video, like always. Thanks man
🫡
Firefly will always be one of my favorite villains. His design sand voice in TNBA was cool, even his short appearance in JL. But making his obsessed over his ex more than fire was disappointing. It made more sense to be in love with Volcana. Even his appearance in The Batman he had a somewhat better relationship. I still think the Arkham games has the most accurate representation of him. I would’ve loved to see what Brendan Fraser could’ve done with the character.
Honestly I feel like Firefly and Volcana can be a great duo together.
It's crazy how many times I thought "Just like Frollo" in this video.
Disney’s best villain!
@@SerumLake
Debatable.
I really like Bill Cipher, Oogie Boogie, and Frollo. But Jafar is a top tier disney villain as well.
Firefly would probably sing an obsessive "if she won't love me I'll kill her" song in front of a fireplace like Frollo.
I think even Frollo has more of an awesome edge compared to OB and Bill though. Am somewhat more into mundane yet extremely dangerous foes when it comes to Disney storylines... a theoretical case in point, I'd rather have sequel saga to the Disney cartoons Gravity Falls, Amphibia, and The Owl House have its primary antagonist not be a bloody godlike Collector being and instead be an American (later, NATO/UN) commander (who may suddenly be successful enough to become POTUS and/or *Secretary General)* who LOVES fighting a justified, interdimensional expeditionary war by way of leading their own roughshod, and slowly but surely experienced, multi-organization that pays homage to XCOM, Third Echelon, First Encounter Assault Recon, the Global Defense Initiative, the Global Occult Coalition, Task Force 141, the National Space Defense Force (the Battlezone one), Grendel Squadron, and more... which will eventually lead to them, as mentioned, becoming extremely influential and ending up declaring a "liberating crusade" on their own Earth and WINNING against, say, the Ruskies, the ChiComs, the Iranians, the NoKors, and so on (though said victories may feel like overpowered hypocrisy, considering they might have hired the help of a Multiversal defense force who sympathizes with their ideals and motives... long story on that); this then follows a long, hard, and brutal overthrow against the guy, but even then, did that do any more good than what they did, no matter how exploitative and crass?
One thing worth noting is that the GI Joe character gave marvel the rights to "a villain named firefly" for a while.
I prefer the arsonist version of firefly, but I do think brave and the bold having the original light-belt take on firefly be connected to the rainbow batsuit was clever.
I like what they did with him in The Batman series by teaming him up with Mr.Freeze.
I feel as if Garfield had given Cassidy everything only for her to take it and maybe even verbally abuse him only for him to figure out who she truly is and feel a burning hatred for her and want to get ride of her would be way more interesting and still dark
"Torch Song' was the first episode of TNBA I saw, during my freshman year of college. And that ending--WOW. 😳
I do wonder, though: if Fox didn't want fire-themed villains, how did Pyro manage to show up on X-Men? 🤔
Fox Kids was so full of bull, I'll say.
Looking back on X-Men, I don’t think that Pyro actually set anything on fire, he could just control fire and turn it into different shapes.
I was excited to hear that the firefly was a pyromaniac, I was dissapointed that BTAS made him a damn simp
Dude thought he could just drop a “toyetic” reference and we wouldn’t catch it. Wooooosh
Sorry, I’m not following. Toyetic is just a word that’s in my vocabulary 🤷♂️
@@SerumLake I apologize, I thought you were making a freakazoid reference
@@Dfturcottmaybe that’s where I heard the word! I remember Bruce Timm using it when talking about Superman’s various costumes in STAS being a request from the toy companies
@@SerumLake if you look up freakazoid and toyetic there’s the clip I thought you were referencing. Ether way, love this deep dive into Batman you’re doing. It’s great and I love watching them.
It has been a looooooong time since I watched Freakazoid so I’ll have to look it up to remind myself 🫡
A good video would be a comparison on how 90s Spiderman and batman with health with the same censors. Like batman gotta away with guns where spidey has to have lazers
I will always know him as the guy who got that tf2 pyro hat
These videos are starting to make the creepy way the DCAU approaches women feel more and more pervasive then i remembered,
My favourite batman villain
Fun fact: This was the first episode of this show i watched in the hospital
Oh yeah, he was real thirsty for Volcana. As soon as she starts shooting fire from her hands, he was in love.
Feels a bit strange that the likes of the more mundanely relatable popstar jerkwad Cassidy and the anti-Superman covert ops failure known as Volcana are far more memorable than him, in my perspective.
"Ah, love. A dreadful bond... and yet, *so easily severed."*
Davy Jones was the best POTC villain.
@@Xehanort10 You noticed.
Can you please do one on Anarky? I've only known him from Arkham Origins, but he's fascinating just because of how little I know of him
He technically wasn’t in the DCAU (outside of one appearance in Batman Adventures)
Interesting character, but I do think his schtick is overrated and too preachy.
If I ever get around the covering Beware The Batman Anarky will definitely be mentioned 🫡
FIRE IS TOO DANGEROUS FOR CHILDREN!!!
Saying that he along with Joker,Harley Quinn, Deadshot and Clayface were only Bat villains appear in Justice league before that stupid Bat embargo as I really believe that other Bat villains should have appeared like the Penguin as he has potential to be a leader of the Injustice league, Riddler, Killer Croc, Scarecrow,Mad Hatter who I would have him Team up with the Mirror Master and I’m sure about Two Face as he isn’t a physical threat to someone who is powerful as Superman as I remember a old Justice League that he does join temporally and also I would have planned to use those one off villains from Batman TAS like Red Claw, Lloyd Ventrix aka the Invisible man, Grant Walker and HARDAC
Poison Ivy and Wesker/Scarface also appeared, but only as their AU versions that lost to the Justice Lords. Ivy was legitimately creepy.
Dude was literally a murderous psycho stalker🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
I hear the fire fly in the cancelled batwoman movie was suppose to be interesting
One of my favorite villains gets a video…. This is amazing
10:18 looked more like Batman’s mask if you ask me
You should review the gotham show version. I genuinely liked their version of the character.
Warner Bros had Animaniacs so that's how you know their censorship guidelines were super lax 😂
Ah yes my childhood idol
Curious How Firefly’s backstory in the show could have some biologic base
Only male fireflies can produce light to attract females
Maybe is a way to show that, no matter if you think the flame of love is ignited, a relationship is made of two parts. Equals that should respect eachother
didn't he also show up in the 2005 show who was a industiral fire bomber
Eh, I don't know. Having fire villians is actually pretty damn cool. Though I get there's only a few stories you could tell. Maybe have him be a serial stalker that even rocet Roxy wouldn't touch?
Can anyone tell me more about how Cassidy was supposed to be the second Firefly? Did we get any scripts or storyboards on that?
It didn’t get that far along, it was just an idea that Rich Fogel set up at the end of Torch Song and would’ve come back to if TNBA had a second season. He said all this in an interview with The Watchtower Database: ua-cam.com/video/DDoY8tCg0Ag/v-deo.htmlsi=8_DD03Qt31e4-r6k
Did you cover the gene splicing episode
Of Batman Beyond? It’s coming up in about a month
Shoemaker
Firefly had potential but he was handled poorly.
i REAAAAALYY hope that this wasn't a jab at mf Batman Beyond. That show was amazing :X
never! I did a whole month of videos about Batman Beyond for the 25th anniversary back in January
What is the outro music used?
It's a track from Apple's library of royalty-free music. It's very short, I think I've used the entire thing.
I would have loved an episode that subverted the spurned would be lover. Like crimes are happening with ties to a woman, she tells a heart breaking story of love and breakup turned stalker. So Batman investigates and can't find any evidence the man is the stalker. Batman breaks into his house, dramatic music, and where the shrine is supposed to be! Nothing. Maybe a poster of a woman in a bikini, maybe some sports memorabilia, and that's where Bats puts two and two together, whatever the man's ties to the woman, he's the victim. He moved on like a healthy man should and that wasn't good enough for her, so she has to wreck his life, even unto death. Because if he's not shattered by her rejection she'll shatter him other ways.
Perhaps that should be a plot for Caped Crusader.
I guess we’re not counting Batman 04?
How very dare you, this is a BTAS Channel!!! 😂
Nah, it’s cool. One day I might do a video about The Batman, but it isn’t something I’m particularly passionate about.
@@SerumLake I always found his transformation to phosphorus interesting.
What about the Batman’s firefly
He doesn’t talk about the Batman
I would have loved another episode where we see how the girls ptsd developed.
Does anybody know if black mask was in the animated series?
Nope.
Only the tie-in comics
👾
Annie should be brought back, with the same powers as Clayface she'd make a decent hero. 😊
Here's to hoping Caped Crusader does that and succeeds.
Hi
So 99% of villains in this series are just losers or bellow average people?
YOU SERIOUSLY NEED TO WATCH THE EPISODE AGAIN CASSIDY IS THE BAD GUY HERE
I guess you missed the part where I pointed out what an unpleasant person she was?
@@SerumLake no i didn't i'm actually shocked that someone wants to defend such a vile person shocked
I always want to watch these videos, but I cannot stand the “beetas” pronunciation.
Can’t kill you to say it the regular way.
I gotta put this on do not recommend channel.
I prefer the insane pyromaniac version of Firefly from the comics. The animated version is a weird creep who’s broken because a woman didn’t reciprocate his interest. Comic Garfield is much more entertaining as a snarky mercenary with an obsession for burning down everything that gets in his way rather than retreading Mad Hatter’s steps.
agree.
Sounds like that one merc from Black Lagoon who kinda looks and carries himself like Hank Hill, cheerfully smiling as he describes how he barbecued his own wife and children.
I always want to watch these videos, but I cannot stand the “beetas” pronunciation.
Can’t kill you to say it the regular way.
I gotta put this on do not recommend channel.
That is the regular way.
In Hatter's case, he wasn't even directly rejected/ told no because he never asked. Alice had no idea how he really felt until after he went too far. She thought he was just being a good friend trying to cheer her up after a bad breakup. He just assumed. Like, Jervis, buddy, how do you expect Alice to become your girlfriend if you never ask her out directly? Communication is key, Tetch :P
"Angels...but they look like nudy women to me." For Firefly, they're one and the same. 😂
After his accident I like to imagine Lynn’s has a very damaged gravely voice, like his vocal cords have been severally damaged. It helps add a greater level of menace to the character
Arkham Firefly sounds like a severe smoker for very similar reasons
@@moblinmajorgeneral yea I do really like Arkham firefly but would personally prefer him talking in a menacing whisper vs the boisterous yell
@@moblinmajorgeneralarkham firefly should be the default
@@moblinmajorgeneral Arkham Knight Firefly sounds worse than in Arkham Origins
I was introduced to Firefly thanks to The Batman. This version was more casual and had more confidence, but his appearance in Batman Arkham Origins is my all time favorite
That was my first introduction to him too. Those were great episodes.
The DCAU's Firefly, while decent, is also not terribly compelling or memorable. Firefly as not only pyromaniac and serial arsonist, but a depraved stalker as well, doesn't come across as terribly original. His introductory episode, while in some ways frighteningly realistic, is forgettable and his character equally so. To be fair, it's not like there was too much to work with (though I guess the same could be said about Mr. Freeze before Heart of Ice) since the character's presence in the comics didn't exactly leave much of an impact. His reinvention in Knightfall was definitely an improvement over his original Golden Age design and origin, but I think you'd struggle to find anyone saying Firefly is their favourite Batman villain. The lack of personality was partly why Firefly's depiction in The Batman series really resonated with people. Jason Marsden’s voice for the character as an arrogant but fun hot shot along with his spectacular and unmistakable black and yellow design just made the character more fun. It made people watching excited for him to appear again which wasn't really the case for the DCAU Firefly.
He had a personality. He was a normal guy who used his engineering skills to earn a quick and easy buck. Also, he was childish.
I . . . actually liked Firefly when I saw him in TNBA as a kid. Maybe it was just the lightsaber, but I just thought he had a cool design.
Then _The Batman_ kinda blew this version out of the water, and I still can't believe that DC never updated his comic design to be closer to that one.
bro should work with scarecrow
Allow me to introduce myself. Firefly is my favourite Batman villain, followed by the Ratcatcher and Killer Moth.
The Batman presented FF as a mischief crook who wanted to escape from poverty with his supportive girlfriend. Not so bad charactership
And then he turned into a walking sun
Having Cassidy becoming the second Firefly to deal with trauma would have been interesting to explore.
I personally prefer the Firefly from The Batman (2004) manly because I like his suit.
Me too. The desighn and the fight scenes were fun to watch. Especially in the episode where he became a flame throwing metahuman.
Design's nice, but feels too flashy for me. The DCAU take is more comfortably pragmatic.
Flashy was definitely the entire design philosophy of The Batman. That particular style didn't quite click for me, personally. But it is refreshing to have a version of the characters that embraces the camp and stylization of the genre, whole heartedly.
@@CapnAlces As always, every animated Batman iteration should always have a certain something that makes it extremely far off from the DCAU, yet also feel as consistently on par with it in return. Cases in point, The Batman 2004 is more energetically youthful and thus flashy, Batman: The Brave and the Bold is entertainingly campy yet also showcases an emotionally and physically stable veteran Dark Knight, and even The Wayne Family Adventures webcomics are down-to-earth yet loose enough to feel right with its character and world interconnections.
Who knows what works like Caped Crusader will bring? Bets on having themes not unlike the Black & White comics.
@@michaelandreipalon359 Perfectly said. And I cannot wait to see what is in store for us in Caped Crusader.
5:09 even tho I understand you comparison, imo, he fits better with the "color themed" (ex Crazy Quilt, Polkadot man) villains rather than "bug themed" ones.
And as far as "character incarnetion" are concerned, the "2004 The Batman" version is the best take on Firefly I seen thas far. Bouth character and desighn wise.
Cassidy as a second Firefly, would've been cool. I do really like the Animated version of Firefly.
Yeah, too bad it had to be scrapped because WB was working on Batman Beyond.
Not that Batman Beyond was a big mistake, all things considered.
@@Isaac-gh5ku I know.
Yeah, wish they explore it more in the Batman Adventure Continues comic instead of having the 2nd Firefly be Deathstroke's sidekick.
@@mechajay3358 Yeah, I liked her, but she needn't have been Firefly.