i think a small bet like 33% pot ott is fine if we can keep their pocket pairs in with that sizing, weaker TX, and draws. Also we will benefit from building the pot for the times we arrive on the river with a flush ; i don't mind checking at all i just think a small bet is also ok here, i just didn't like hero's sizing bc with that sizing you are letting your opponent let go of the hands you dominate with ease, it's better to give them a sizing that they will be forced to think about calling
100% agree, raise the flop, check the turn if you don’t improve, and see what the river brings, protect when hands are exploitable and keep pots small and start building pots when you have a strong hand, say you flop a flush your raising to build the pot or check calling the flop the raise the turn etc...
I think the important thing on the flop to think on is "What is villain's cbet range?" and "what is villain barrelling turn with?" If he's Cbetting a lot more than solver suggests a check is better, as well as if he's betting turns a lot with thin value and bluffs. Or if he is super tight calling the reraise and you fold worse T, 99, 88 Ac2x, Ac3x and get called by Acxc, 23, overpairs and sets with very few 45 and weaker fd. If he is a maniac who 3 bets Tx, FD or 45 type hands as well as all the nuts pot controlling probably better as you can call more turns If he's cbetting a stronger range AND calling with worse raising might be better, as well as if he doesn't fold Tx or middle pockets, gutters, BDFD and would not barrel turn while behind. If you call and he check calls a hand that would have called raise and crying called turn bet because of the clubs (either fd or puts you on a club bluff) that sucks because the pot will be a lot bigger when you're ahead
Love the videos. I’m learning so much during this lockdown. Online, stepped up a notch, and sealing leaks better than that goop the dude slings on the info mercials. I think I’ve been in similar lines to this, although, after meeting the resistance on the flop, I’d check the turn to control pot size and re-evaluate the river. For me, that’d be the main reason I’m there, got position, use it. Thanks again, stay safe.
the question is how the fuck do you expect to win on the turn since you dont even have tptk with that agression showing in your face? beeing a 10nl player i would fold that because you just cannot win too many times, usually when these players are doing that , youre crushed!
The check on turn would have been beautiful. It allows OP player to bluff the river if they flat called the raise on the flop and have a broken draw on the river, plus your still super live with equity and maintaining solid pot control. That 4(S) on the turn as nitty as it sounds was a dirty card and it fills in so much of the opponent's flat call range and folding could be forgiven. Great review though. Loved it.
I feel like raising the flop with KcTc specifically is fantastic. First, you have a made hand. That also gives you 20% to improve to 2-pair or trips by the river for likely the best hand. You also have ~35% raw equity from the flush draw -- call that closer to 20% to account for reverse-implied odds from the ace-high club draws. You have decent showdown value right now, and you're likely never folding, so isn't this the time to build a pot with a combo draw that has huge upside? Like you have 14 outs twice, on top of a decent made hand. Do you think giving up on that is worth moving this into the calling range to take advantage of the rec player dynamic? Really love hearing your analysis!
I think the issue is that you might fold out hands that would otherwise pay more. Worst thing you can do here is fold out a smaller flush draw if the run-out has a club in it.
I'm working through your pre-flop handbook, and I was excited to notice you could approximate percent by multiplying 3/4 times the number of combos and divide by ten.
Under the 4.06 you set, it was around 2.56 more to call into a pop of 7.86, giving you close to correct odds to hitting your flush OR being ahead against weaker hands (smaller pockets) and semibluffs (AQ, AJ, JQ clubs, 5s, 6s) I feel like if you set the solver to a 8.85 raise, the solver probably would've said fold alot more. It would've been a call of 7.35 into a pot of 12.65, requiring you to hit the flushing 1/3 of the times on the river, which is not the case. Just sucks to play against the SB, when they flop a monster hand.
honnestly guys ive been putting in alot of hours every day studying. These vids are definitly super high caliber,very helpfull in the long run and very well explained these guys are just beasts. thank you for the vids james and chris
Wow. Another .05c - 10c wild poker game. Would rather see how this hand would play out with a $5-10 $10-20 game. Therefore, I'm going all in after getting raised on the flop. Bring it.
I feel that when villain opens small from the SB (3x + seems more common these days), leads the flop, calls the raise and check-jams the turn (which brought the possibility of more draws to complete on the river) his range is narrowed down almost completely to made hands betting big for protection vs potential bigger draws hero may have. So from overpairs to trips, maybe a straight. I could see Ax of clubs taking this line too, would many other combos be doing this? Is Ax of spades calling the flop raise often with just the BDFD?
There are likely a chunk of AsXs hands that continue on the flop (anything with the gutshot, pair, or two overcards) given the flop raise isn't sized too massively.
I'm raising the flop every time in this position, or sometimes just going all-in. Once you raise the villain will want to know what you are going to do on the turn. On this turn you must just check / check in case the villain hit their straight, and allowing you to see a free river and hopefully see you make your flush, which hopefully gets a raise on the river you can call. If you raise and get reraised you are not in a good position, having to put more money in to see the river. You say you are worried about the check raise, but you can't be check raised in effective position. If I miss the flush then I would call any reasonable river bet. The main aim for me, once called after my flop raise, is to keep control of the pot size and lose the minimum if I do happen to be beat, or get it all-in with a diguised flush if it comes in.
I don't hate the fold on the river though the call is probably more accurate. Thing is, at these stakes, nobody is going to bluff into strength. You check raised the flop and then led out on the turn. They're not doing this with some goofy spade draw. They're almost always better here. So the math says you need to be right 37% of the time. You have 19% to the river and need to make up the other 18% somehow. Are you really the worst hand 82% of the time? I would say its 'close. However the main thing is, and it's the reason I don't play microstakes, people are aware of the money being played with. It's a cappucino and a bagel. When the money is that inconsequential then they often WILL do goofy stuff like random shoves with weak pairs and such. At the end of the day it's probably worth it just to see how they play.
I've bought GTO+ and I've played around with it for a while now. The problem I keep running into are the hand ranges when I'm trying to study. What type of range could my opponents be using, while knowing the percentage? Should I just use the No Limit option or the Sklansky? What are the most common ranges etc? It's very difficult because these ranges, even though they have the same percentages, have entirely different outcomes.
I think it depends on how aggro this villain is. If we raise, we are not going to win against anything he calls with with just our pair, so we are turning our hand into a bluff with top pair as additional equity. If the villain is likely to keep blasting it with air, we should give him that opportunity. He may even shove a club river representing the flush that we have.
I'm just not sure from a human stand point what kind of player takes a a c-bet call line from a raise on the flop, that jams a turn as a bluff that they wouldn't have jammed on the flop in the first place. I understand from the solver GTO standpoint a certain percentage should act this way if you had 45s or something, but I'm having a really hard time imagining an actual person coming to a conclusion that they have a bluff hand that they called on a raise on the flop that they are now bluffing on a turn when they could have jammed on the flop if they had 56s or 78s that they didn't know they were being dominated by.
Is it a mistake, if I cbet this board quite often? I mean, there are not many draws and also not many possible pairs... And I can double barrel quite often, when an overcard comes
Thank you guys for the analysis. It was my hand :) I have been playing at NL25 ever since, thanks to the teaching by Red Chip Poker! You do a great job! Zsolti07
Where I play (online microstakes) almost no players make dumb double and triple barrels. When they blast they got it. So calling flop here hoping to bluff catch at micros is not the right play imo.
I‘m really surprised about that analysis... what about JT, QT, T9, T8s, Flushdraws... shouldn’t we get value against these hands? Are there really that many better hands in his Turn Check?
I just calculated the hand on the turn with Flopzilla, including all reasonal Tx, Overpairs, sets, 99 and 88 in villains range (no Flushdraws) and we have 60% Equity...ain´t that enaough to raise and bet? 38 of 82 crush us, against this range we have 26% equity... is that the curcial point?
When you see the solver is raising ~25% of the time with KTs, is that raise specifically with this hand given it has the flush draw, while checking the others that don't? That would make it a near 100% raise with this hand? I'm probably misunderstanding how the solver works.
I watch your flopzila pro video thats pretty great.I am having trouble to make statistic can you make a video how to create statistic in flopzila.I think it will be very helpful for all who is trying to hand reading
For me, you are talking like it's $10/20 at the bike, and you are playing Garrett. @2nl I feel like it's better to try to get your value before the river because they can only pay you off with better when the river is revealed. But I'm also not particularly profitable hahahah. It's just in my experience, because hero didn't 3bet pre, we have a limited idea of range, and a lot of the time villain can be chasing overs and the combos we are afraid, like sets and A5s are much fewer in number. Possibly I'm my judgment is unbalanced due to the amount of sticky regs in my pool.
@@splitsuit Absolutely I'm massively in favour of depth! I was just adding my thoughts based on my pool at a similar level; the majority are waiting to make hands and don't bluff enough, resulting in my wanting to charge villains before it bricks. Btw I am a big fan of your full body of work! "I love the fact that your squeezing, what I take issue with is the size" poker words to live by!
This GTO means all players play break even. Nobody wins nobody lose. So therefore play GTO against super pro but not against non GTO players. So I doubt this GTO solver can make someone win ...
Aren't they using the word "like" to either describe things they enjoy/value or in place of "such as"? It doesn't stand out as some new age form of valley girl speak, but maybe I'm missing what you're hearing.
I’m really liking the mixture of a solver analysis as well as an exploitative POV. I think you guys have got the format at a great point!
Totally agree.
From someone who is looking to start studying real hard (and running sims etc), but has good instincts.... this is perfect.
Thanks Stevee!
i think a small bet like 33% pot ott is fine if we can keep their pocket pairs in with that sizing, weaker TX, and draws. Also we will benefit from building the pot for the times we arrive on the river with a flush ; i don't mind checking at all i just think a small bet is also ok here, i just didn't like hero's sizing bc with that sizing you are letting your opponent let go of the hands you dominate with ease, it's better to give them a sizing that they will be forced to think about calling
remember when we used to re-raise the flop in these flush draw spots just to check the next street to get the free card, without the solvers :)
uncle ben never needed a solver. Rip uncle ben.
There is no better feeling than the solver giving you the thumbs up for something you've been doing for years =)
@@splitsuit how am I exploiting my opponent with this bet. I am going to write that down and tap it to my computer screen.
100% agree, raise the flop, check the turn if you don’t improve, and see what the river brings, protect when hands are exploitable and keep pots small and start building pots when you have a strong hand, say you flop a flush your raising to build the pot or check calling the flop the raise the turn etc...
I think the important thing on the flop to think on is "What is villain's cbet range?" and "what is villain barrelling turn with?"
If he's Cbetting a lot more than solver suggests a check is better, as well as if he's betting turns a lot with thin value and bluffs. Or if he is super tight calling the reraise and you fold worse T, 99, 88 Ac2x, Ac3x and get called by Acxc, 23, overpairs and sets with very few 45 and weaker fd. If he is a maniac who 3 bets Tx, FD or 45 type hands as well as all the nuts pot controlling probably better as you can call more turns
If he's cbetting a stronger range AND calling with worse raising might be better, as well as if he doesn't fold Tx or middle pockets, gutters, BDFD and would not barrel turn while behind. If you call and he check calls a hand that would have called raise and crying called turn bet because of the clubs (either fd or puts you on a club bluff) that sucks because the pot will be a lot bigger when you're ahead
Is it just me or does Chris sounds alot like Barry White lol?
Sounds more like Scottie Pippen
Love the videos. I’m learning so much during this lockdown. Online, stepped up a notch, and sealing leaks better than that goop the dude slings on the info mercials. I think I’ve been in similar lines to this, although, after meeting the resistance on the flop, I’d check the turn to control pot size and re-evaluate the river. For me, that’d be the main reason I’m there, got position, use it. Thanks again, stay safe.
Cheers Simon!
Loving these videos. Very interesting dialogue between the two of you.
the question is how the fuck do you expect to win on the turn since you dont even have tptk with that agression showing in your face? beeing a 10nl player i would fold that because you just cannot win too many times, usually when these players are doing that , youre crushed!
FYI solver likes to fold KTs. Solver likes to call with AXs, K4s, T4s all clubs. It doesn't make sense but I double checked
The check on turn would have been beautiful. It allows OP player to bluff the river if they flat called the raise on the flop and have a broken draw on the river, plus your still super live with equity and maintaining solid pot control. That 4(S) on the turn as nitty as it sounds was a dirty card and it fills in so much of the opponent's flat call range and folding could be forgiven. Great review though. Loved it.
Just getting back into poker again. That was great insight and analysis of the hand thank you
Thanks Marius, and welcome back to poker!
I feel like raising the flop with KcTc specifically is fantastic. First, you have a made hand. That also gives you 20% to improve to 2-pair or trips by the river for likely the best hand. You also have ~35% raw equity from the flush draw -- call that closer to 20% to account for reverse-implied odds from the ace-high club draws. You have decent showdown value right now, and you're likely never folding, so isn't this the time to build a pot with a combo draw that has huge upside? Like you have 14 outs twice, on top of a decent made hand. Do you think giving up on that is worth moving this into the calling range to take advantage of the rec player dynamic? Really love hearing your analysis!
I think the issue is that you might fold out hands that would otherwise pay more. Worst thing you can do here is fold out a smaller flush draw if the run-out has a club in it.
2 voices made for radio
I read that as "faces" at first
@@CertifiedSlamboy that's usually the joke, when a dj is involved
both at very different ends of the spectrum too XD
@@CertifiedSlamboy I did too, lol
Thanks Gee!
I'm working through your pre-flop handbook, and I was excited to notice you could approximate percent by multiplying 3/4 times the number of combos and divide by ten.
What does this mean?
Under the 4.06 you set, it was around 2.56 more to call into a pop of 7.86, giving you close to correct odds to hitting your flush OR being ahead against weaker hands (smaller pockets) and semibluffs (AQ, AJ, JQ clubs, 5s, 6s)
I feel like if you set the solver to a 8.85 raise, the solver probably would've said fold alot more. It would've been a call of 7.35 into a pot of 12.65, requiring you to hit the flushing 1/3 of the times on the river, which is not the case.
Just sucks to play against the SB, when they flop a monster hand.
Which solver are you using? Thx
honnestly guys ive been putting in alot of hours every day studying. These vids are definitly super high caliber,very helpfull in the long run and very well explained these guys are just beasts. thank you for the vids james and chris
Chris finally asking James how he’s doing as well to start the show 🤯
lol
Wow. Another .05c - 10c wild poker game. Would rather see how this hand would play out with a $5-10 $10-20 game. Therefore, I'm going all in after getting raised on the flop. Bring it.
I feel that when villain opens small from the SB (3x + seems more common these days), leads the flop, calls the raise and check-jams the turn (which brought the possibility of more draws to complete on the river) his range is narrowed down almost completely to made hands betting big for protection vs potential bigger draws hero may have. So from overpairs to trips, maybe a straight. I could see Ax of clubs taking this line too, would many other combos be doing this? Is Ax of spades calling the flop raise often with just the BDFD?
TLDR: wish I had a solver *sighs*
There are likely a chunk of AsXs hands that continue on the flop (anything with the gutshot, pair, or two overcards) given the flop raise isn't sized too massively.
Any chance you guys could do a vid on defending donk betting from villain when H is the PFR?
Hey Chris, this is a paid lesson in CORE but this video covers exactly what you're talking about redchippoker.com/topic/facing-donk-bets/
I'm raising the flop every time in this position, or sometimes just going all-in. Once you raise the villain will want to know what you are going to do on the turn. On this turn you must just check / check in case the villain hit their straight, and allowing you to see a free river and hopefully see you make your flush, which hopefully gets a raise on the river you can call. If you raise and get reraised you are not in a good position, having to put more money in to see the river. You say you are worried about the check raise, but you can't be check raised in effective position. If I miss the flush then I would call any reasonable river bet. The main aim for me, once called after my flop raise, is to keep control of the pot size and lose the minimum if I do happen to be beat, or get it all-in with a diguised flush if it comes in.
what solver do you suggest for purchase?
GTO+ is the most accessible and more than enough for most players imo
I can definitely apply this to my game. Hope you enjoyed the Doug vs Dneggs heads up challenge. I think a lot of door were opened from that for poker.
I don't hate the fold on the river though the call is probably more accurate. Thing is, at these stakes, nobody is going to bluff into strength. You check raised the flop and then led out on the turn. They're not doing this with some goofy spade draw. They're almost always better here. So the math says you need to be right 37% of the time. You have 19% to the river and need to make up the other 18% somehow. Are you really the worst hand 82% of the time? I would say its 'close. However the main thing is, and it's the reason I don't play microstakes, people are aware of the money being played with. It's a cappucino and a bagel. When the money is that inconsequential then they often WILL do goofy stuff like random shoves with weak pairs and such. At the end of the day it's probably worth it just to see how they play.
These two boys should swap voices, would match their looks better.
bearded voice is so fucking annoying it's unreal
in this situation, if you raise, you are pretty committed, i don't really see a raise fold, so gotta go and hope for the best
I've bought GTO+ and I've played around with it for a while now. The problem I keep running into are the hand ranges when I'm trying to study. What type of range could my opponents be using, while knowing the percentage? Should I just use the No Limit option or the Sklansky? What are the most common ranges etc? It's very difficult because these ranges, even though they have the same percentages, have entirely different outcomes.
If you're using it in micros games _that's_ the problem you're going to have. 90% of the time ranges will be completely unknown.
I think it depends on how aggro this villain is. If we raise, we are not going to win against anything he calls with with just our pair, so we are turning our hand into a bluff with top pair as additional equity. If the villain is likely to keep blasting it with air, we should give him that opportunity. He may even shove a club river representing the flush that we have.
james can you tell me if you have a playlist in you re channel of just you and chris analyzing hands ???? thanks
I'm just not sure from a human stand point what kind of player takes a a c-bet call line from a raise on the flop, that jams a turn as a bluff that they wouldn't have jammed on the flop in the first place. I understand from the solver GTO standpoint a certain percentage should act this way if you had 45s or something, but I'm having a really hard time imagining an actual person coming to a conclusion that they have a bluff hand that they called on a raise on the flop that they are now bluffing on a turn when they could have jammed on the flop if they had 56s or 78s that they didn't know they were being dominated by.
It's micros; it's BVB... You need to think about a reg's range here, particularly if they're in any way competent.
This may be a dumb question. If we raise pf to 2.5x instead of 3x, does that mean we can raise more hands?
A few more hands yes exactly! It's not a ton though using strictly GTO (5-10%).
Love the bloop ❤
Is it a mistake, if I cbet this board quite often? I mean, there are not many draws and also not many possible pairs... And I can double barrel quite often, when an overcard comes
Which solver is good and is there a free one?
no but GTO+ is 75 usd
@@romanizzo3412 Is it as good as pio though?
Thank you guys for the analysis. It was my hand :)
I have been playing at NL25 ever since, thanks to the teaching by Red Chip Poker!
You do a great job!
Zsolti07
Cheers Zsolti!
Where I play (online microstakes) almost no players make dumb double and triple barrels. When they blast they got it. So calling flop here hoping to bluff catch at micros is not the right play imo.
You guys are a great duo. Nice questions and answers 👍🏼
Thanks Carl!
love the strat chat! cheers!
I‘m really surprised about that analysis... what about JT, QT, T9, T8s, Flushdraws... shouldn’t we get value against these hands? Are there really that many better hands in his Turn Check?
I just calculated the hand on the turn with Flopzilla, including all reasonal Tx, Overpairs, sets, 99 and 88 in villains range (no Flushdraws) and we have 60% Equity...ain´t that enaough to raise and bet? 38 of 82 crush us, against this range we have 26% equity... is that the curcial point?
Any suggestions for online poker in the US? Not interested in using crypto as a deposit option
Cheers for the analysis. Very clear. :)
Thanks Owen!
That does not look like pio. What solver are you using? could i get the link.
GTO+. It's bundled with the GTO Crash Course here if you're interested: redchippoker.com/gto-poker-course/
No point in using GTO at super low limit games--with rare exceptions. The other players are so far out of left field in how they play hands...
^^^ This. Players at micros these days are so clueless they're literally just clicking buttons.
I love these videos for educational purposes but it's so disappointing that you don't get to see what your opponent had :D
how can we access this solver?
It's GTO Plus. Which is also bundled with the GTO Crash Course (With Software) here if you're interested: redchippoker.com/gto-poker-course/
When you see the solver is raising ~25% of the time with KTs, is that raise specifically with this hand given it has the flush draw, while checking the others that don't? That would make it a near 100% raise with this hand? I'm probably misunderstanding how the solver works.
I AM misunderstanding. You were talking about 75% on that particular hand, not all KTs.
I watch your flopzila pro video thats pretty great.I am having trouble to make statistic can you make a video how to create statistic in flopzila.I think it will be very helpful for all who is trying to hand reading
What kind of stat are you trying to make?
I am trying to create
1.backdraw flushdraw and
2. top pair+2nd pair+3rd pair+pp
Who thinks we are ahead here if we call the turn bet and if not, are we getting the odds to call the shove on the turn?
For me, you are talking like it's $10/20 at the bike, and you are playing Garrett. @2nl I feel like it's better to try to get your value before the river because they can only pay you off with better when the river is revealed. But I'm also not particularly profitable hahahah. It's just in my experience, because hero didn't 3bet pre, we have a limited idea of range, and a lot of the time villain can be chasing overs and the combos we are afraid, like sets and A5s are much fewer in number. Possibly I'm my judgment is unbalanced due to the amount of sticky regs in my pool.
We are trying to find the sweet spot in the depth of discussion, so thanks for sharing Ashley! And a player pool full of sticky regs sounds juicy =)
@@splitsuit Absolutely I'm massively in favour of depth! I was just adding my thoughts based on my pool at a similar level; the majority are waiting to make hands and don't bluff enough, resulting in my wanting to charge villains before it bricks. Btw I am a big fan of your full body of work! "I love the fact that your squeezing, what I take issue with is the size" poker words to live by!
@@bogstandardash3751 cheers!
what had he ? what was the river ? Happy new year :)
Hero folded, so no river/showdown =(
Thank you :)
liked this one a lot
This GTO means all players play break even. Nobody wins nobody lose. So therefore play GTO against super pro but not against non GTO players. So I doubt this GTO solver can make someone win ...
Gee, must be nice to flop top pair 2nd kicker. I wouldn't know. If i ever do, I'll never be folding $$$$$$$$$$$$$$🤮
Such a cringe fold after that turn bet.
So nerdy
Damn straight
Do you even play poker? Never heard your name before so why would people take advice from you?
I do play poker, yes. As for taking advice from me, you should 100% test and proof what I suggest (as you should any teacher you learn from)
Can all y’all poker dudes pls stop saying like 1000 times it’s so annoying all of y’all you tubers do it
Aren't they using the word "like" to either describe things they enjoy/value or in place of "such as"? It doesn't stand out as some new age form of valley girl speak, but maybe I'm missing what you're hearing.
Not nearly as annoying as Y'ALL 😂
@@mrgainz7252 long term, "like" is worse.
@@mrgainz7252 long term, "like" is worse.
Are we really saying "like" that often?