Wow this is great! I will likely have many questions, but for now... 1. Can you describe your P channel system? What is it made of, what size and number of holes (and ratio of air coming through it versus the grate and door). Where does it draw its air from? Does it come through the top of the door? I don't see a hole in the brick veneer. 2. I've also been trying to figure out a boiler system. Your pump doesn't run continuously? It takes a minute for the water in the heat exchanger to heat up before it kicks on again? Also, I didn't think of the condensation... this is from the wood water vapor condensing on the cool pipes? I have also been looking at the lopez labs boiler, why do they not address condensation? Thank you!
1. P-channel made out of square 40x40mm pipe, 2 pieces, draws air in from the room, comes out the top of the door. Sizes are as follows: P-channel into door 80x25mm, primary air in door 120x50mm. We also have an ash cleanout door that we sometimes leave open for extra air intake (depends on the type and amount of wood in box). 2. Pump is driven by a thermostat, pump runs more frequently when the fire is burning and continues running (for less and less time) for about 24 hours after fire is out. I have 2 trays on either side of the main heater core to collect condensation - that comes out of the house through a copper pipe. There isn't very much, just a little trickle. Depends on the temperature I set on the thermostat.
I can not figure out exactly what kind of ceramics you used for the heat riser construction but it does not look refractory. If it is I'd love to know where did manage to buy it. I'd have some questions - What is the power (heat exchange surface) of the heat exchanger - what is the volume of the buffer tank - where was the container for collecting the condensate placed? - Have you installed any beam over the wall whole
The heat riser is sold as refractory (although it is of very poor quality), did not have any problems with it so far. Bought from: www.heliossa.ro/materiale_refractare.html Have also worked with other brands that are much better, thinner and way more resistant. These I had on hand at that time. 1. The power considering amount of thermal power generated by burning wood for 1hr should be about 17kW (considering 1kg air dried wood=3.7kWh of energy). Mean power about 4kW (batchrocket.eu/en/building#size). 2. Heat exchanger is made out of copper tubing, outside diameter = 22mm, about 50m total length, 10kW, considering 2.8kW/sq m 3. I do not have a buffer tank hooked to the heater, the buffer part is provided by the heated masonry. Water pump runs for a while, heat exchangers fill with cold water from the system, they are heater again by the hot bricks, pump starts. 4. There are 2 containers for condensate made out of stainless steel pipe cut in half placed on the bottom of the bell, under the heat exchangers. Copper pipe is welded to the containers and is run outside. I guess a few liters of condensate drip out from every fire. Pump thermostat is set at ~60 degrees C. 5. There is no beam over the wall hole, I just filled the part on top of the heater with insulation (glass wool). The white part you see in the video is just a sort of drywall that is held in place at the sides. The top of the heater does not heat up at all as there are a few layers of insulation inside as well.
Many detail missing but, interesting build. Planning in making a free-standing batch rocket in the Van Den Berg style, with an altered riser of my own design... which can be easily changed to Peter's, should it not perform. The "p-channel".... is that secondary air? Would appreciate seeing how you heat your water for the baseboards.... even drawings would suffice. Nice job. Thanks for the inspiration.
P-channel is secondary air, correct. The water is heated by the heat exchangers placed left and right inside the second layer of brick, the outer 'bell'. Check this link out for reference: heatkit.com/html/lopezs.htm The difference is I have 2 and they are made of 25mm (1 inch) copper pipe mounted in the Tichelmann schema.
Usa este cumparata de aici: magazinproduse-fonta.ro/usa-semineu/usa-semineu-camelot-cu-geam-de-protectie.html Am bricolat-o sa corespunda necesarului de aer primar/secundar. Asa arata acum: imgur.com/a/uWCuTxe
La final, in faza de jar, trageti jarul in fata, deasupra gratarului? Isteata inovatie, n-am mai vazut-o la altii. Ar merita semnalata lui van den Berg, pentru beneficiul multora. Banuiesc ca reduce semnificativ faza finala, inainte de a inchide cosul...
Cenusa o trag prin gratar inainte sa fac un nou foc, asa ma scuteste de a trebui sa o scot de fiecare data afara. In functie de marimea cenusarului se poate scoate cenusa destul de rar. Mai are avantajul ca pot deschide usa de la cenusar cand aprind focul ( e nevoie de ceva mai mult oxigen in momentul respectiv). Cosul si deschiderile din usa le inchid in momentul in care ramane doar jar in focar.
Intre timp, dupa 2 ani de exploatare gratarul s-a curbat si in final s-a spart de la temperatura prea mare in zona respectiva. Teava pentru aer secundar e inca in conditii bune, probabil pentru ca e racita de aerul care il trage de afara.
@@nimela4937 bună seara! Țeava de admisie a aerului secundar respectiv fanta de trecere a flăcării din focar în tubul ridicător ce dimensiune are? Mulțumesc frumos!
They are refractory brick cylinders. About 8 inches (200mm) inside diameter. Wall thickness is about 1 inch(25mm). Got them from a store here in Romania. They're commonly used for building the inside of chimneys. As far as I know the smaller the wall thickness the better (will get up to temp faster).
An ideal riser would be made entirely out of insulation, so it loses no time (or energy) with heating the wall. As far as I know Peter van den Berg was experimenting with such a riser at one point.
We currently have 5 radiators hooked up to it with a total thermal power of ~3.3kW. Some spaces are heated by the brick heater itself. The house is 115 sq meters. We also have a 100L water heater that is hooked up to the heat exchangers.
Copycat here 😆. I have same fire box followed by 2bells filled with 40gallon hotwater tanks. ?do u pump water to your radiators? If not does the large pipe I saw make flow speed increase or decrease..2nd?, the 5radiators, are they fed in series or parallel from source..great brick work great door work..last question that's a large space, how many times box loaded during the day starting from Sun rise..luved those clay chimney blocks, such a smart block
There are 2 exits for hot air out of the heater: 1. At the base, the primary exit 2. At the top, a smaller, secondary exit, that you open only when heater/chimney is cold. This way hot air is forced to stay at top and only exists when it cools. Look up 'System of Free Gas Movement', Kuznetsov and/or bell principle. Opening at base of V is for ash pit - it's more convenient to take out ash once a week than every day.
Salut, scuze, contul de youtube e separat de cel principal. Iarna trecuta a fost mai blanda, am consumat aproximativ 4 metri cubi de fag, resturi brad, prun pentru 115mp (izolatie 10cm vata bazaltica, mansarda 20cm vata, usi, ferestre lemn cu geam termopan), necesar calculat 7.3kW pentru 22 grade interior in zona climatica 1 (campia Banatului). Focul il facem o data pe zi, aproximativ 2 galeti de 20L de lemne, una pentru pornire, esenta moale si mai subtiri, a 2-a mai groase. Aici e topicul constructiei, unde am primit informatii esentiale: sobarul.com/viewtopic.php?t=1071 Alt site util: batchrocket.eu
Toate detaliile constructiei sa gasesc la: sobarul.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=1071 Un punct bun de plecare este de asemenea: batchrocket.eu Daca ai nelamuriri iti raspund.
Salut, nu am mai accesat de mult contul de youtube. Iarna trecuta (destul de blanda) am ars aprox 1 galeata 20L lemn esenta moale (sau deseuri), 1 galeata 20L esenta tare, 1 galeata 10L porumb boabe. Un singur foc pe zi (24h), temperatura intre 24-21 grade), incalzeste 115 m2, necesar termic total de ~9kW.
OldAls Buna! Va multumesc pentru raspuns.....sa -o folositi sanatos ....am vrut sa stiu consumul pt ca o sa -mi fac si eu una asemanatoare...stiu ca asemenea tipuri de sobe au arderea curata si un randament f bun ,cu toate ca sint multe opinii contra ..... va multumesc din nou si multe sezoane fara probleme 👍
Sunt cateva aspecte care trebuie luate in considerare: 1. Randamentul arderii, care e destul de bun cu sistem batch rocket al lui Peter van den Berg. De asemenea ajunge rapid la randament maxim, trebuie alimentat mai rar (comparativ cu sistemul rocket clasic) si asigura o ardere curata. 2. Mentinerea caldurii, asigurata de sistemul clopot. 3. Intretinere putina. In afara de aspecte estetice, legate de constructie, pret, disponibilate, nu vad ce opinii contra ar putea exista. PS: Am luat in considerare si construirea sobei afara, doar ca era mai greu sa folosim cuptorul :).
You should be very proud at such impressive work.
very nice, thanks 4 sharing 👍👍
It is quite a Glorious heater you have made! Awesome work!
Thanks, it was my first build, there are some improvements to be made, in project but most in building technique.
Very very nice something built to look good and last thank you
Looks better in the video lol
Wow this is great! I will likely have many questions, but for now...
1. Can you describe your P channel system? What is it made of, what size and number of holes (and ratio of air coming through it versus the grate and door). Where does it draw its air from? Does it come through the top of the door? I don't see a hole in the brick veneer.
2. I've also been trying to figure out a boiler system. Your pump doesn't run continuously? It takes a minute for the water in the heat exchanger to heat up before it kicks on again? Also, I didn't think of the condensation... this is from the wood water vapor condensing on the cool pipes? I have also been looking at the lopez labs boiler, why do they not address condensation?
Thank you!
1. P-channel made out of square 40x40mm pipe, 2 pieces, draws air in from the room, comes out the top of the door.
Sizes are as follows: P-channel into door 80x25mm, primary air in door 120x50mm. We also have an ash cleanout door that we sometimes leave open for extra air intake (depends on the type and amount of wood in box).
2. Pump is driven by a thermostat, pump runs more frequently when the fire is burning and continues running (for less and less time) for about 24 hours after fire is out.
I have 2 trays on either side of the main heater core to collect condensation - that comes out of the house through a copper pipe. There isn't very much, just a little trickle. Depends on the temperature I set on the thermostat.
Buna! Cum se comporta soba si ce consum aveti la ia pe luna? Multa sanatate !
I can not figure out exactly what kind of ceramics you used for the heat riser construction but it does not look refractory.
If it is I'd love to know where did manage to buy it.
I'd have some questions
- What is the power (heat exchange surface) of the heat exchanger
- what is the volume of the buffer tank
- where was the container for collecting the condensate placed?
- Have you installed any beam over the wall whole
The heat riser is sold as refractory (although it is of very poor quality), did not have any problems with it so far. Bought from: www.heliossa.ro/materiale_refractare.html
Have also worked with other brands that are much better, thinner and way more resistant. These I had on hand at that time.
1. The power considering amount of thermal power generated by burning wood for 1hr should be about 17kW (considering 1kg air dried wood=3.7kWh of energy). Mean power about 4kW (batchrocket.eu/en/building#size).
2. Heat exchanger is made out of copper tubing, outside diameter = 22mm, about 50m total length, 10kW, considering 2.8kW/sq m
3. I do not have a buffer tank hooked to the heater, the buffer part is provided by the heated masonry. Water pump runs for a while, heat exchangers fill with cold water from the system, they are heater again by the hot bricks, pump starts.
4. There are 2 containers for condensate made out of stainless steel pipe cut in half placed on the bottom of the bell, under the heat exchangers. Copper pipe is welded to the containers and is run outside. I guess a few liters of condensate drip out from every fire. Pump thermostat is set at ~60 degrees C.
5. There is no beam over the wall hole, I just filled the part on top of the heater with insulation (glass wool). The white part you see in the video is just a sort of drywall that is held in place at the sides. The top of the heater does not heat up at all as there are a few layers of insulation inside as well.
puteti,va rog, sa ne impartiti planurile?
Many detail missing but, interesting build.
Planning in making a free-standing batch rocket in the Van Den Berg style, with an altered riser of my own design... which can be easily changed to Peter's, should it not perform.
The "p-channel".... is that secondary air?
Would appreciate seeing how you heat your water for the baseboards.... even drawings would suffice.
Nice job. Thanks for the inspiration.
P-channel is secondary air, correct.
The water is heated by the heat exchangers placed left and right inside the second layer of brick, the outer 'bell'. Check this link out for reference: heatkit.com/html/lopezs.htm
The difference is I have 2 and they are made of 25mm (1 inch) copper pipe mounted in the Tichelmann schema.
Felicitari, o treaba foarte bine facuta!
Usa este confectionata DIY, sau cumparata? De unde?
Usa este cumparata de aici: magazinproduse-fonta.ro/usa-semineu/usa-semineu-camelot-cu-geam-de-protectie.html
Am bricolat-o sa corespunda necesarului de aer primar/secundar.
Asa arata acum: imgur.com/a/uWCuTxe
awesome!
Thanks.
La final, in faza de jar, trageti jarul in fata, deasupra gratarului? Isteata inovatie, n-am mai vazut-o la altii. Ar merita semnalata lui van den Berg, pentru beneficiul multora. Banuiesc ca reduce semnificativ faza finala, inainte de a inchide cosul...
Cenusa o trag prin gratar inainte sa fac un nou foc, asa ma scuteste de a trebui sa o scot de fiecare data afara. In functie de marimea cenusarului se poate scoate cenusa destul de rar. Mai are avantajul ca pot deschide usa de la cenusar cand aprind focul ( e nevoie de ceva mai mult oxigen in momentul respectiv). Cosul si deschiderile din usa le inchid in momentul in care ramane doar jar in focar.
Intre timp, dupa 2 ani de exploatare gratarul s-a curbat si in final s-a spart de la temperatura prea mare in zona respectiva. Teava pentru aer secundar e inca in conditii bune, probabil pentru ca e racita de aerul care il trage de afara.
@@nimela4937 bună seara!
Țeava de admisie a aerului secundar respectiv fanta de trecere a flăcării din focar în tubul ridicător ce dimensiune are? Mulțumesc frumos!
Am căutat dar nu stăpânesc bine netul va rog înălțimea raizerului dacă vreți un ultim efort .Va mulțumesc!
Aici e un forum cu toate detaliile dacă vă interesează. :) sobarul.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=1071
Placile pe care lea-ti pus deasupra focarului din ce sunt?
Placi de samota 50x25x4cm, cumparate de la Arad, 28lei/buc.
Very nice.What are those cylindrical pieces you used for the riser and where did you get them?
They are refractory brick cylinders. About 8 inches (200mm) inside diameter. Wall thickness is about 1 inch(25mm). Got them from a store here in Romania. They're commonly used for building the inside of chimneys. As far as I know the smaller the wall thickness the better (will get up to temp faster).
how will that affect the double vortex? will it make it stronger?
Mandala man Good enough for gov't!
An ideal riser would be made entirely out of insulation, so it loses no time (or energy) with heating the wall. As far as I know Peter van den Berg was experimenting with such a riser at one point.
schimbatorul de caldura este tip registru? citi metri de teava?
Aproximativ 50 de metri de teava cupru D22. Schimbatoare tip regisutru, cu legaturile in sistem Tichelmann.
very nice!! we just built one too ans are very happy with it. the boiler, oven and ash grill are great additions. are the radiators working well
?
We currently have 5 radiators hooked up to it with a total thermal power of ~3.3kW. Some spaces are heated by the brick heater itself. The house is 115 sq meters. We also have a 100L water heater that is hooked up to the heat exchangers.
Copycat here 😆. I have same fire box followed by 2bells filled with 40gallon hotwater tanks. ?do u pump water to your radiators? If not does the large pipe I saw make flow speed increase or decrease..2nd?, the 5radiators, are they fed in series or parallel from source..great brick work great door work..last question that's a large space, how many times box loaded during the day starting from Sun rise..luved those clay chimney blocks, such a smart block
WHY THE SLOT IN THE BASE OF THE CHIMNEY ?????????WHY THE OPENING UNDER THE V FORMATION ????
There are 2 exits for hot air out of the heater:
1. At the base, the primary exit
2. At the top, a smaller, secondary exit, that you open only when heater/chimney is cold.
This way hot air is forced to stay at top and only exists when it cools. Look up
'System of Free Gas Movement', Kuznetsov and/or bell principle.
Opening at base of V is for ash pit - it's more convenient to take out ash once a week than every day.
Buna...poti sa dai citeva detalii ....cit consuma,m2 incalziti..etc ...daca esti amabil....ca nu prea vrei sa raspunzi.....😆
Salut, scuze, contul de youtube e separat de cel principal.
Iarna trecuta a fost mai blanda, am consumat aproximativ 4 metri cubi de fag, resturi brad, prun pentru 115mp (izolatie 10cm vata bazaltica, mansarda 20cm vata, usi, ferestre lemn cu geam termopan), necesar calculat 7.3kW pentru 22 grade interior in zona climatica 1 (campia Banatului).
Focul il facem o data pe zi, aproximativ 2 galeti de 20L de lemne, una pentru pornire, esenta moale si mai subtiri, a 2-a mai groase.
Aici e topicul constructiei, unde am primit informatii esentiale: sobarul.com/viewtopic.php?t=1071
Alt site util: batchrocket.eu
looks like a masonry stove, i like..., can you share the details please?
imgur.com/a/HilPn1N
as vrea sa discutam putin la telefon daca este posibil
Toate detaliile constructiei sa gasesc la: sobarul.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=1071
Un punct bun de plecare este de asemenea: batchrocket.eu
Daca ai nelamuriri iti raspund.
Как устроен котел??
Очень доволен им до сих пор, требуется только ожог / день.
+++
Buna...poti sa dai citeva detalii ....cit consuma,m2 incalziti..etc ...daca esti amabil....ca nu prea vrei sa raspunzi.....😆
Salut, nu am mai accesat de mult contul de youtube.
Iarna trecuta (destul de blanda) am ars aprox 1 galeata 20L lemn esenta moale (sau deseuri), 1 galeata 20L esenta tare, 1 galeata 10L porumb boabe.
Un singur foc pe zi (24h), temperatura intre 24-21 grade), incalzeste 115 m2, necesar termic total de ~9kW.
OldAls Buna! Va multumesc pentru raspuns.....sa -o folositi sanatos ....am vrut sa stiu consumul pt ca o sa -mi fac si eu una asemanatoare...stiu ca asemenea tipuri de sobe au arderea curata si un randament f bun ,cu toate ca sint multe opinii contra ..... va multumesc din nou si multe sezoane fara probleme 👍
Sunt cateva aspecte care trebuie luate in considerare:
1. Randamentul arderii, care e destul de bun cu sistem batch rocket al lui Peter van den Berg. De asemenea ajunge rapid la randament maxim, trebuie alimentat mai rar (comparativ cu sistemul rocket clasic) si asigura o ardere curata.
2. Mentinerea caldurii, asigurata de sistemul clopot.
3. Intretinere putina.
In afara de aspecte estetice, legate de constructie, pret, disponibilate, nu vad ce opinii contra ar putea exista.
PS: Am luat in considerare si construirea sobei afara, doar ca era mai greu sa folosim cuptorul :).
OldAls corect..multumesc 🙋