FYI the Eldritch Strike works on any ability from the fighter. If you use either the soul breaker GS or the silver sword of the Astral plane you can give disadvantage on the save for the stun
i understand that battlemaster is better for the average player that doesnt really dive too deep into the system to optimize to the max, but i would like to make a case for Eldritch Knight who can come up ahead if the player knows what they are doing: -EK's war magic while quite worthless on tactician and below, gains a lot of value in honor mode: with haste/bloodlust acitons which only give you 1 attack switching them for a cantrip that then also grants a bonus action attack is actually an upgrade, especially for ranged sharpshooter builds that cant get a BA attack on something like titanstring or gontr -With int based spellcasting being the core of the subclass, EK can much more comfortably make a use out of arcane synergy items, for a sizeable and "free" damage up. With the war magic trick mentioned above it can even make a use out of the synergy ring -with how abundand scrolls are in this game, you can definitely just stock up on so many of them that EK's limited 1/3rd casting stops being a limiting factor. When you combine that with the fact that your triple attack can stack acuity incredibly fast, your lv10 eldritch intertia feature and mystic scoundrel/haste/bloodlust you can actually dish out powerful, irresistible control or blasting spells while also making tons of attacks that are just as devastating as any other fighter's -with the ranged sharpshooter versions specifically, losing out on maneuvers isnt even that big of a loss as you can always just stock up on special arrows and use those instead. all in all, in my opinion Eldritch Knight becomes more and more valuable the more knowledgable and min/max minded the player is
Very good points! These sorts of rankings will usually be different for different difficulties, particularly Honour mode like you mentioned, because of the differing rules. It's similar to how arcane tricksters can be very good spellcasters when they use scrolls because they get a similar effect when they are casting from hidden. I'm not surprised for your preference for EK, as it is a strong subclass for a strong class!
6 EK + 6 Wizard (Abjuration) is a pretty fun non throwing based multiclass. You end up being able to cast 4th level spells which feels a little more gishy than pure EK. Dump strength to just drink elixirs, and start 14 Dex, 16 Con, 16 int and then pump up int with ASI's. It gets a fair bit of extra tankiness from abjuration, can still do a good job smashing things in the face with a 2-hander, and gets some fun versatility like having AoE damage spells to cleanup or CC'ing baddies. The helm of Arcane Acuity helps a lot, though you definitely aren't going to be super busted OP like a swords bard with it. Works great on it's own, but it's even better for some magic based cheese parties. Things like a party built around lightning/cold + create water.
I think that the choice of abjuration is a good one for this build and should let you take a whole load of damage. I once made a fighter cleric multiclass and really enjoyed the extra versatility of spell casting also.
Great vid. Can't wait to see the rest of the classes too. Cleric/Fighter down. I LOVE EK, I did an 'Ice Knight' build on an Honour mode run with a friend. Bosses were cake walks. Cazador didn't even get a single action - Rogue tossed a water bottle at him, Warlock hasted the fighter, -three hits with the Mourning Frost, then a ray of frost gave him the Frozen condition, fight over. Basically same thing for Gortash. Easy mode
The description says "the next spell you cast" but Eldritch strike actually works for ANY saving throw you cause the enemy to roll. Someone already mentioned the stun from silver sword, but you can also use it for on damage effects that proc saves. There's a very strong freeze build where you use the winters clutches gloves to add 2 encrusted with frost stacks to any ice damage, and use drakethroat glaive to add ice damage to every weapon hit. Frost makes the enemy pass a save when they get 5 stacks or they freeze. With 3 weapon attacks, they will have to pass that every round that you attack them, and eldritch strike will give them disadvantage on the freeze save.
Currently running all companions with magic as part of their skill sets, so I do have Lae'zel as an Eldritch Knight. (Once in BG's, all companions will be some variation of Wizard or Sorcerer.) I did dump Strength and use Hill/Cloud Giant potion, so intelligence could be increased. One of my favorite moves to use (depending on the scenario) is to cast a Shocking grasp then swing the sword. This is mostly useful if I want to move Lae'zel (or another party member who is in the area of opportunity) to another part of the battlefield. These are not exactly the most powerful builds, but it's different than I have ever played before. Kind of fun trying new things. XD Thanks for the content!
Ive seen EK builds using either str elixers or dex gloves with maxed out int. These builds use either arcane acuity + scrolls for control or arcane synergy for damage. Similar to swords bards or bladelocks but using int.
i believe dexterity checks also include initiative rolls, so that gives some more value to the champion subclass adding half its proficiency bonuses to str dex and con
In tabletop that is true but in bg3 initiative isn't actually considered a skill check, so bards don't get a bonus to it, and having advantage to dexterity checks doesn't help either.
To get a good idea of how ELDRITCH KNIGHT works, especially one with the dual wielder feat, here are some weapons that do extra damage. All are found in Acts 1 & 2. Charge Bound Warhammer +1 (Dammon, Last Light Inn) - d8+1 +d6 electric damage, if it is your pact weapon. Render of Mind and Body +1 (Lann Tarv, Moonrise Towers) short sword. Deals extra d4 psychic damage when you attack with advantage (use with the risky ring to always have advantage). Shadow Blade (reward for finding Arabella's parents) Short sword. Cast spell from ring to create Shadow Blade, requires concentration, does 2d8 psychic damage, Re-sets on short rest. Don't make the mistake I did in getting the Adamantine Longsword where the description says it always crits against an object. The key word is an OBJECT, not a creature. Great against doors maybe, but not enemies. I suggest getting the Hunters Bow (Druids Grove) for a shortbow that gives you Hunters Mark (bonus action to cast). Pair that with the Strange Conduit ring (Inquisitor's chamber in creche Y'llek) that adds d4 psychic damage to weapon attacks when concentrating (in this case with Hunters Mark). Add two levels of spore druid (for symbiotic entity) and while you still have temp hit points from that, your attacks deal another d6 necrotic damage. All these extra bonuses add up............ and you can stack things up more (for example, the Flawed Helldusk Gloves that do an extra d4 fire damage). The Drakethroat Glaive (Roah Moonglow in Moonrise Towers) allows a further d4 of elemental damage to be added to one of your chosen weapons. Add all this together with a tanky Eldritch Knight with a high armour class, but even better, the ability to cast the spell Shield as a reaction to prevent hits, and you have an under-used and under-appreciated class.
My first playthrough was as a Tav with 12 levels as a Champion fighter. Aside from not being particularly powerful, it just wasn’t very fun, because the Champion gets no additional active abilities, just some behind-the-scenes number bonuses that occasionally kick in.
Question... if you were to be a BM Fighter/ Warlock with Pact of the Blade where your hits now scale with Charisma, would the BM maneuvers also scale with charisma? Or are they dependent on if you're using a dex/str weapon? Or just if you have higher dex/str?
Idk how BM gets a 5 out of 10 for multiclassing when it's 3rd level feature is usable by just about any weapon dealing class in the game, more so than EK or Champion which are both hyper focused multiclass builds.
Perhaps I was a bit harsh. I was thinking that the other two subclasses provide a passive ability and that the specialised builds of the other two subclasses can be very strong.
When you use special arrows, you can’t use maneuvers so I often choose Champion for my archers. Champion fighter gets shat on by a lot of UA-camrs but I have done some massive damage through critical hit fishing strategies. I have posted videos show casing that. I did 11 Champion Fighter because War Cleric dip is better than any of the feats available.
Sure, when you have endless supplies of arrows of slaying then Champion gets a higher crit chance, but using so many arrows starts to have a cost that not everyone will be willing to pay. Outside of using consumables I wouldn't rate Champion well at all compared to the other sub classes available. A war cleric dip is a strong choice for almost any martial because of the extra attacks.
@@CasualVeteranGamer I rob merchants so I do have endless supply of arrows. My champion fighter hits like a train so I feel weird seeing so much hate towards it. I think they have the highest ceiling but extremely high maintenance probably.
They changed alot of other subclasses, I don't see why they couldn't at _least_ give Champion something as basic as all the fighting styles or something.
5 is a bit too low for the battlemaster multiclass score, its usually the class people go for when they multiclass with fighter unless they go throwing or crit heavy. You get most of the power of it at level 3
Yeah, Champion not just bad, its lack luster. Like, the only thing you can do is normal attack that all and nothing more. Some people might say then use special arrows, but Eldritch Knight can use special arrows too and give enemies disadvantage on that saving throw. Through, if you stack enough crit then you can actually do doing some kind of slow without saving throw with the Blightbringer. In Honour mode, one of my friends that stack reduce crit range enough to crit on 16 and use the risky ring to have like 44% crit and just normal attack or arrows of multi target. 11lv champion fighter, 1lv dark one warlock for a crown control build.
Eldritch knight will always be better than battlemaster to me for one reason. Movement. If battlemaster has even one turn of not hitting then a EK will out damage it massively. EK will never have to waste turns not attacking because of all its movement spells let alone the defensive kit. Even if you account for items the EK or gish items are so strong yes you can put misty step on a BM with the boots but there are much better boots that a EK can use. Both are still hyper strong classes tho
Yeah, they get three attacks per action at level 11. Although the hunter ranger gets the volley ability with each attack which targets all enemies in an area, but special arrows cannot be used in conjunction with volley.
@@aoiwaffle6438 That and like the boss said, they have a lot of flexibility of what to do with each shot thanks to those maneuvers which come back on a short rest. I think the ranger catches up a bit at the end game, but that's a long time waiting. With that said, some may just enjoy ranger archer more and there is nothing wrong with that either.
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #30 ДВА В ОДНОМ [Один человек]• Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/nrXy15orKhY/mqdefault.jpg)
FYI the Eldritch Strike works on any ability from the fighter. If you use either the soul breaker GS or the silver sword of the Astral plane you can give disadvantage on the save for the stun
Good to know, thanks.
i understand that battlemaster is better for the average player that doesnt really dive too deep into the system to optimize to the max, but i would like to make a case for Eldritch Knight who can come up ahead if the player knows what they are doing:
-EK's war magic while quite worthless on tactician and below, gains a lot of value in honor mode: with haste/bloodlust acitons which only give you 1 attack switching them for a cantrip that then also grants a bonus action attack is actually an upgrade, especially for ranged sharpshooter builds that cant get a BA attack on something like titanstring or gontr
-With int based spellcasting being the core of the subclass, EK can much more comfortably make a use out of arcane synergy items, for a sizeable and "free" damage up. With the war magic trick mentioned above it can even make a use out of the synergy ring
-with how abundand scrolls are in this game, you can definitely just stock up on so many of them that EK's limited 1/3rd casting stops being a limiting factor. When you combine that with the fact that your triple attack can stack acuity incredibly fast, your lv10 eldritch intertia feature and mystic scoundrel/haste/bloodlust you can actually dish out powerful, irresistible control or blasting spells while also making tons of attacks that are just as devastating as any other fighter's
-with the ranged sharpshooter versions specifically, losing out on maneuvers isnt even that big of a loss as you can always just stock up on special arrows and use those instead.
all in all, in my opinion Eldritch Knight becomes more and more valuable the more knowledgable and min/max minded the player is
Very good points!
These sorts of rankings will usually be different for different difficulties, particularly Honour mode like you mentioned, because of the differing rules.
It's similar to how arcane tricksters can be very good spellcasters when they use scrolls because they get a similar effect when they are casting from hidden.
I'm not surprised for your preference for EK, as it is a strong subclass for a strong class!
6 EK + 6 Wizard (Abjuration) is a pretty fun non throwing based multiclass. You end up being able to cast 4th level spells which feels a little more gishy than pure EK. Dump strength to just drink elixirs, and start 14 Dex, 16 Con, 16 int and then pump up int with ASI's. It gets a fair bit of extra tankiness from abjuration, can still do a good job smashing things in the face with a 2-hander, and gets some fun versatility like having AoE damage spells to cleanup or CC'ing baddies. The helm of Arcane Acuity helps a lot, though you definitely aren't going to be super busted OP like a swords bard with it.
Works great on it's own, but it's even better for some magic based cheese parties. Things like a party built around lightning/cold + create water.
I think that the choice of abjuration is a good one for this build and should let you take a whole load of damage. I once made a fighter cleric multiclass and really enjoyed the extra versatility of spell casting also.
Completely agree, except the feat that gives you one superiority die is terrible and even worse on battlemaster.
Great vid. Can't wait to see the rest of the classes too. Cleric/Fighter down.
I LOVE EK, I did an 'Ice Knight' build on an Honour mode run with a friend. Bosses were cake walks. Cazador didn't even get a single action - Rogue tossed a water bottle at him, Warlock hasted the fighter, -three hits with the Mourning Frost, then a ray of frost gave him the Frozen condition, fight over. Basically same thing for Gortash. Easy mode
The description says "the next spell you cast" but Eldritch strike actually works for ANY saving throw you cause the enemy to roll. Someone already mentioned the stun from silver sword, but you can also use it for on damage effects that proc saves. There's a very strong freeze build where you use the winters clutches gloves to add 2 encrusted with frost stacks to any ice damage, and use drakethroat glaive to add ice damage to every weapon hit. Frost makes the enemy pass a save when they get 5 stacks or they freeze. With 3 weapon attacks, they will have to pass that every round that you attack them, and eldritch strike will give them disadvantage on the freeze save.
Currently running all companions with magic as part of their skill sets, so I do have Lae'zel as an Eldritch Knight. (Once in BG's, all companions will be some variation of Wizard or Sorcerer.) I did dump Strength and use Hill/Cloud Giant potion, so intelligence could be increased. One of my favorite moves to use (depending on the scenario) is to cast a Shocking grasp then swing the sword. This is mostly useful if I want to move Lae'zel (or another party member who is in the area of opportunity) to another part of the battlefield. These are not exactly the most powerful builds, but it's different than I have ever played before. Kind of fun trying new things. XD Thanks for the content!
Good ol' elixirs of strength! Letting us create builds that focus on another stat.
My cleric is holding a javelin+1 that Karlach cast bound weapon on. I throw the javelin, it goes back to the cleric.
Ive seen EK builds using either str elixers or dex gloves with maxed out int. These builds use either arcane acuity + scrolls for control or arcane synergy for damage. Similar to swords bards or bladelocks but using int.
They would certainly be strong builds. I think that says more about the items than the class, not that EK is weak or anything!
Hi CVG, thanks for the video. I like EK, bit of sword and magic
i believe dexterity checks also include initiative rolls, so that gives some more value to the champion subclass adding half its proficiency bonuses to str dex and con
In tabletop that is true but in bg3 initiative isn't actually considered a skill check, so bards don't get a bonus to it, and having advantage to dexterity checks doesn't help either.
To get a good idea of how ELDRITCH KNIGHT works, especially one with the dual wielder feat, here are some weapons that do extra damage. All are found in Acts 1 & 2.
Charge Bound Warhammer +1 (Dammon, Last Light Inn) - d8+1 +d6 electric damage, if it is your pact weapon.
Render of Mind and Body +1 (Lann Tarv, Moonrise Towers) short sword. Deals extra d4 psychic damage when you attack with advantage (use with the risky ring to always have advantage).
Shadow Blade (reward for finding Arabella's parents) Short sword. Cast spell from ring to create Shadow Blade, requires concentration, does 2d8 psychic damage, Re-sets on short rest.
Don't make the mistake I did in getting the Adamantine Longsword where the description says it always crits against an object. The key word is an OBJECT, not a creature. Great against doors maybe, but not enemies.
I suggest getting the Hunters Bow (Druids Grove) for a shortbow that gives you Hunters Mark (bonus action to cast). Pair that with the Strange Conduit ring (Inquisitor's chamber in creche Y'llek) that adds d4 psychic damage to weapon attacks when concentrating (in this case with Hunters Mark). Add two levels of spore druid (for symbiotic entity) and while you still have temp hit points from that, your attacks deal another d6 necrotic damage. All these extra bonuses add up............ and you can stack things up more (for example, the Flawed Helldusk Gloves that do an extra d4 fire damage). The Drakethroat Glaive (Roah Moonglow in Moonrise Towers) allows a further d4 of elemental damage to be added to one of your chosen weapons.
Add all this together with a tanky Eldritch Knight with a high armour class, but even better, the ability to cast the spell Shield as a reaction to prevent hits, and you have an under-used and under-appreciated class.
My first playthrough was as a Tav with 12 levels as a Champion fighter. Aside from not being particularly powerful, it just wasn’t very fun, because the Champion gets no additional active abilities, just some behind-the-scenes number bonuses that occasionally kick in.
Yeah, it's a very passive subclass, perhaps the most passive subclass in the entire game.
They are capable of being very powerful but only if you really know how to min-max
Question... if you were to be a BM Fighter/ Warlock with Pact of the Blade where your hits now scale with Charisma, would the BM maneuvers also scale with charisma? Or are they dependent on if you're using a dex/str weapon? Or just if you have higher dex/str?
Idk how BM gets a 5 out of 10 for multiclassing when it's 3rd level feature is usable by just about any weapon dealing class in the game, more so than EK or Champion which are both hyper focused multiclass builds.
Perhaps I was a bit harsh. I was thinking that the other two subclasses provide a passive ability and that the specialised builds of the other two subclasses can be very strong.
When you use special arrows, you can’t use maneuvers so I often choose Champion for my archers. Champion fighter gets shat on by a lot of UA-camrs but I have done some massive damage through critical hit fishing strategies. I have posted videos show casing that.
I did 11 Champion Fighter because War Cleric dip is better than any of the feats available.
Sure, when you have endless supplies of arrows of slaying then Champion gets a higher crit chance, but using so many arrows starts to have a cost that not everyone will be willing to pay. Outside of using consumables I wouldn't rate Champion well at all compared to the other sub classes available.
A war cleric dip is a strong choice for almost any martial because of the extra attacks.
@@CasualVeteranGamer I rob merchants so I do have endless supply of arrows. My champion fighter hits like a train so I feel weird seeing so much hate towards it. I think they have the highest ceiling but extremely high maintenance probably.
They changed alot of other subclasses, I don't see why they couldn't at _least_ give Champion something as basic as all the fighting styles or something.
Agreed!
5 is a bit too low for the battlemaster multiclass score, its usually the class people go for when they multiclass with fighter unless they go throwing or crit heavy. You get most of the power of it at level 3
With the right items and with shield spell EK can become unhittable
Yeah, Champion not just bad, its lack luster. Like, the only thing you can do is normal attack that all and nothing more. Some people might say then use special arrows, but Eldritch Knight can use special arrows too and give enemies disadvantage on that saving throw. Through, if you stack enough crit then you can actually do doing some kind of slow without saving throw with the Blightbringer. In Honour mode, one of my friends that stack reduce crit range enough to crit on 16 and use the risky ring to have like 44% crit and just normal attack or arrows of multi target. 11lv champion fighter, 1lv dark one warlock for a crown control build.
Eldritch knight will always be better than battlemaster to me for one reason. Movement.
If battlemaster has even one turn of not hitting then a EK will out damage it massively.
EK will never have to waste turns not attacking because of all its movement spells let alone the defensive kit.
Even if you account for items the EK or gish items are so strong yes you can put misty step on a BM with the boots but there are much better boots that a EK can use.
Both are still hyper strong classes tho
Battle master does make my favorite archer in 5e...probably still in BG3 as well. Sorry Ranger.
They get so many more options of what to do with their ranged attack than a ranger!
They shoot more arrows per turn right?
Yeah, they get three attacks per action at level 11. Although the hunter ranger gets the volley ability with each attack which targets all enemies in an area, but special arrows cannot be used in conjunction with volley.
@@aoiwaffle6438 That and like the boss said, they have a lot of flexibility of what to do with each shot thanks to those maneuvers which come back on a short rest. I think the ranger catches up a bit at the end game, but that's a long time waiting. With that said, some may just enjoy ranger archer more and there is nothing wrong with that either.
@@liberalideas8224 11 fighter archer is my choice if I want to min-max. Bard/Ranger/Rogue can shoot arrows pretty well too imo.