For future reference, when you need to cool your belt, a good option is to move to Greenland and only machine in winter with the garage door open. It's a little inconvenient, but you can't argue with the results.
@@Hopeless_and_Forlorn Belts I see on linear motion are quite loose. I'm sure you could either use positional accuracy as a means for tightening or temperature. At some point it might drop off.
It might be better to investigate direct-drive with no belt at all -- if Tony really needs speed on the Z-axis then an uprated servo on that axis only would be a better bet. Direct-drive would also mean he won't have to faff around to get the servo carrier plate out of the way of the knee if there's interference plus it removes another source of positional inaccuracy and maintenance when (not if) the belt wears, stretches or breaks.
My 7 year old was watching this at the start with me. When she saw the chisel "Magic" as she called it she actually watched seven more minutes of the video, full of questions and then totally lost interest. Point being, Thank you. Its amazing you got her interested in a part of the world that is of no interest to her . GG
What's more is, seven year olds of today are not like the seven year olds before the millenium ticked over. When i was 7, even though i was a boy and not a girl, i watched and helped in the workshop all the time. I operated machinery like excavators, dumpers, dozers, wood splitters, circular saws, tractors and a few other strange things. Had i been born seven years ago, all i would probably have learned by now is to stuff my face and record Tik Tok garbage and use snapchat. Funny thing is, i've kept myself updated with the times as well. So i can of course do recordings and all that garbage if i wanted to. I do programming as well as operate machinery and a whole host of other things pretty well. Meanwhile, kids these days will probably grow up to be a two trick pony pretty much. Getting by on social score and becoming e-famous.
@@RealCadde Please keep in mind that this is a generalization. Not all Gen Z people like TikTok, not all seven year olds sit on their iPhone X all day. Some of us do enjoy labor. I, as a Gen Z, detest TikTok, love fixing bikes, and do a bit of programming too.
I LOVE a TOT video but seeing my mug (and its being tweaked) made it even better. Top job Tony as usual. Still the only other channel I'll watch the whole video regardless of length.
Hahaha, how did I know The Furzinator watched this one too? Outstanding. Did I really just say Furzinator? I think I need to get out more. Ideally to The Far Frozen North to have a look in Colin’s shed...
I remember the time when a young TOT could karate chop a hunk of aluminum into submission with one chop! It’s a sad day when you have to use a chisel to do it.
I read this as "5 year welding anniversary" I thought, wow, this guy is serious and commited to welding metal together. Almost brought a tear to my eye.....Then I thought, I should get some new reading glasses before I embarrass myself on the internet.
I repair machines in a forging facility with about 30 production turns and grinders. Servo's are the best thing since sliced bread! Black rubber belts may help with the heat. And NEVER underestimate having a "home" position to use. Batteries die all the time, crap happens.
No batteries involved, those servos have a 23bit absolute encoder, but a repeatable home position ist worth a lot when you do things like change the belt or screw up your programming, drive the machine against a mechanical block and your belt jumps a notch or two. Slightly related, the Maho came with glass scales, if the Mach 4 Software can use a secondary measurement system for positioning I would reinstall those too to compensate an possible backlash in the mechanics.
@@WoodmanX yes, but those 23 bits of resolution are applied to 360 degrees of rotation of the servo, so, someone or something making it take more than a full turn in a no power scenario could mess up the home position (I guess. Correct me if i am wrong)mk
@@lcsantos777 It seems 23bit singleturn encoders actually exist, I have no clue where one would need the 0,00004° in angular resolution so. I had simply assumed a 23bit encoder would be a multiturn encoder, that would split angular resolution and turn counts, those do run over at some point, but assuming a typical 12bit reolution for a single turn would leave you with 2048 turns to count, that seems plenty enough for a normal sized milling machine.
@@WoodmanX might not even be because of that. Might be simply because you can add 8bits for some other info, a parity bit, and then you have a nice little 32 bit data frame.
Is it cool with you to say that your videos remind me of a feeling that I had as a kid watching Mr. Rogers Neighborhood? By the time you say thanks for hangin around the shop with me, I'm genuinely happier than before.
Seriously. Being furloughed, and wondering what the hell to do with myself to keep my house healthy and happy has been challenging for my brain health. When I finish any of Tony's latest uploads, I'm ready to get off my ass and go do something. He deserves more patrons than however many he has.
Zed is imperial. The only reason you have imperial is because you were in an empire. The British empire. The British still use Zed. So zed must be imperial.
Look into my eyes, you hear only my voice...you want a ball screw for the Z axis...you need a ball screw for the Z axis...you will be happy with the speed and cooler running with a ball screw for the Z axis. When I snap my fingers, you will awake, refreshed, at ease and very happy with your decision to replace that old, slow, clunky acme screw with a nice, new, sleek, carefully matched ball screw for the Z axis. Thank you for some of the most fun I have on UA-cam! Safe, productive days, and peaceful nights, good sir.
So in that case he'll need some kind of brakes (or holdin ax with the servo), without it all z axis will roll down on ballscrew under its own weight when motor is off
N T, yup that’s one of those complications that caused TOT to stay with the acme screw, while he was going back and forth across much of the project. BUT a spring sustained solenoid brake driven by a slaved relay eliminates that concern. In the end, he’ll be fine either way, but I can’t resist the chance to tease him. His are some of the consistently best videos on YouTub, IMO.
@@leslieaustin151 oh, silly me, not only I was using metrique hammer, I was using metrique anvil! It's a miracle it didn't braze additional metal in the hole!
1:28 confused me. I thought those were just random PNGs or something overlayed on screen then the reflections made me think "Thats good video editing." Then I finally realized its just the lighting and they are real. Also shout out to Brian for sending over the gear.
just a small note to ya. your vids are one of my top five subscriptions. love the humor that you incorporate into the videography, not annoying like some, just perfect. i might be the only one on break on a construction job laughing my ass off meanwhile being inspired and learning at the same time. that you for the time that you put in to create such perfected coolness brother. much appreciation sir.
Hey Old Tony Great production and hilariously instructive as always. My partner brought me a coffee as I began this vid and stayed to watch. She was amazed to see such a clean cut with one strike of a masons chisel. I had to disabuse her of that misunderstanding or I would forever be hounded to try that instead of a hacksaw. Who woulda guesst A fine machinist and a cinematic genius.
keep your PLC / machine network separate (physically isolated) from your home network. preferably VLAN/subnetted and firewalled. because the last thing you want is that machine unexpectantly running/moving/changing/updating while your hands are in it. as a security analyst for machine/process networks....i'm just saying, keep it isolated and keep your hands.
That is typically not a concern for EtherCAT servos. EtherCAT in general does not support TCP/IP. (It is a rarely used extension, which requires special support in both the servo drives and the PC controller software) EtherCAT also don't play well with switches. It needs to be a direct connection to the PC. But I guess the PC could have second NIC. Which of course should not be online.
Yeap. I remember reading an article called "Why is this computer connected to the internet?" or something like that. The premise of the article is why do companies want every computer hooked up to the internet. A computer controlling a piece of machinery at a factory. "Why is this computer connected to the internet?" There is little to no reason that most computers are connected to the internet. The computers can be old, not secure, running old OS's and it doesn't matter.
@@vonnikon That is basically every industry system. EtherCat is just another protocol language like CanBUS, RS485 etc. They all work with RJ45 contacts today. Because it is easier to disconnect/re-connect etc. Doesn't require an electrician to assist with the set-up among other things. Not to mention, you can use CAT6 cables for the best magnetic resistance. To be able to handle electrical field distortions that can happen in certain Industrial enclosures. But conversing it to TCP/IP is fairly easy. Just a gateway that acts as a translator.
@@vintagespeed as a technician working on fairly black box equipment troubleshooting an intermittent critical failure, having access to the machine's event logs and settings would have saved me hours on the phone. Ultimately the problem was caused by condensation which they wouldn't be able to detect but it would have saved all the "have you set x to such and such value?" Some times being networked helps but it's entirely dependent on the individual equipment and who has to work on it.
14:15 Its free to turn in one direction and not in the other. The nylon thing adds resistance in the downwards direction. Without it the machine can make the screw turn down due to vibration. It also gives you an equal amount of torque in both directions, this is much more practical for the machinist.
Not just that, but it also balances the load on the motor. When holding stationary, it's always best to try to get as close to no torque when possible to prevent premature failure of the servo.
Nice job Tony!!! Servo control is amazing and fun - I have done high speed servo control design for several years. Fastest so far for me has been 10g of accel to 300ips max speed using a 3HP servo. Watch yourself, these motors can cause some major harm. I really like the accel I saw. Don't go Tim Taylor on us. I have broken several shear pins (among other things) with over-aggressive accels. A few other things to note: 1) From a pure motor standpoint, there is no difference between a servo motor and a stepper motor (other than an encoder which you can add to either). They are both just brushless DC motors. The difference is the control electronics. 2) Often a servo motor (like yours) will include some electronics (like for the encoder, resolver, etc) which a person who wants a stepper doesn't need. Also, servos usually market to a higher end task than steppers so the manufactures often put more $$ into them (like better magnets) so they often have better performance. 3) DC Motors deliver their most power at their highest rated RPM. It is best to gear them accordingly - but with some margin. Never run them at max RPM as the control loop needs room to operate and motor power drops rapidly after the motor reaches max RPM. 4) Servos DO NOT like lag/lash (non-linearity) between the shaft and the load. This can really mess with the control loop. Best to eliminate as much as you can. If you hear any buzzing when the servos are holding position, you need to either eliminate the lash or soften the tuning. The buzzing in not only annoying, it can do mechanical damage. 5) EtherCAT (Ethernet for Control Automation Technology) is cool. It allows the motion controller to talk to all the control electronics over the same wiring and there are a lot of compatible devices. 6) Don't completely give up on limit switches, they can be a really good friend. Control systems can sometime go haywire due to a SW or HW (or operator) failure and having a switch that tells the control system to "go no further" can save slamming several hundred pounds of metal at full speed into a hard stop. 7) Make sure to include a big easy to hit E-Stop (Emergency Stop) switch in your design so you can quickly kill power to all the motors. Not only is it a VERY GOOD idea, it is also the law.
I have been eagerly awaiting an update on the Maho and I am impressed! The time you have spent putting this video series together so people like me can understand the basics of how to upgrade a manual mill to CNC is greatly appreciated. I have learned something and gotten a good laugh from all of your videos. A sincere thanks to you.
13:55 I think the sprag clutch and plastic bushing combination is to balance out the resistance while you're moving the head up or down...the plastic bushing provides extra resistance when moving the head down while you get no extra resistance(besides gravity) when going up. It might even keep it from freewheeling down. Love your videos, take care!
Tony! I’m a rookie mechanical engineer working in my first position where I need an in depth understanding of GD&T. You should start a mini-series going through it! You seem to have a great understanding of it, and your teaching of things with great visuals has been extremely helpful for me. I’d love to see something like that!
I am a trade school student and I have been watching these videos for awhile, I am taking classes on machining with both manual and CNC lathes and mills, since the pandemic started and the schools closed, I've been watching these videos to learn my trade and I've learned alot. Thank you.
This channel is the perfect mix of knowledge, information, visuals, and absurd silliness. I am not or have ever been interested in machining, but I watch all your videos and find them fascinating and hilarious.
ToT you should be proud, your videos have made it to the big leagues. My professor used your lathe chuck and surface grinding videos in my 331 engineering course at NIU, I'd recognize those hands anywhere.
Or maybe the belt is not constructed/ incorrect material composition for the torque application....timing belt not drive belt? Reacon it is flexing/streching, just wait till the rest of the wieght goes on, might just fail, that sprag clutch was probably there to prevent the weight of the mill table combined with gravity from free spinning down when it was manually wound.....just my 20 cent bet ;)
@@AadityaKhare42 Every belt has a maximum force you can use it for. These belts look like T5 belts to me. I switched to T10 (that can handle bigger forces) on my robotmower because the T5 broke. If this T5 breaks TOT is in for a bang.
I am honestly not particularly interested in machining, but your videos are simply so great that I watch all of them, some twice. I really love the small quirks as well as the outstanding attention to detail in the production of both the videos and the actual stuff you make. Thanks so much.
Yup, it contracts when it gets on the pully and releases that stored energy from streaching as heat into the pulley. Mind you, what heat scale was that, are we talking 0.001c or 50c??
No, it's just too heavy of a load for that belt. It will get worse when he adds the X and Y and the workpiece mass to the load. I wager TOT will eventually have to upgrade to a precision chain drive. Or a gear drive.
@@jeffvoight6586 I dunno if your gonna get much back lash with all that weight on it. I guesseing that sprag clutch was also setup to be a bit of a helper in someway in the up direction.
Imagine him hitting that chisel only for it to make a useless "thwack," the aluminum unharmed. Frustrated, he puts the hammer and chisel down, and takes the aluminum to the band saw.
With ToT's superhuman skillz at cutting metal, I figured he wouldn't even have to touch it. I figured he would just tell it to center itself and it would obey his command. :)
I worked with a group of guys who. 30+ years ago, learned a lot about stepper motors "the hard way". These were small, very inexpensive steppers that had a gear box that converted the rotary motion in linear motion. We would drive the motor to one stop at power up and call that zero. Through the "school of hard knocks" we learned that if you hit either stop at max speed, the motor would "bounce" and start running at twice the speed in the WRONG DIRECTION ! We also discovered any time you stopped or changed direction there was a chance of loosing a step. Good thing was, there was "indirect" (but very slow) feedback in the total system, so we never got too far "lost" !
When I refreshed youtube and saw this video, I made an audible "Ooh!". I'm excited to see progress on this, I don't really understand a lot of it, I don't have the brain smarts to, but I enjoy watching for sure!
I predict that Tony will be visited by the ghost of backlash future. The feedback is on the motor, so it doesn't measure where the actual machine is, and this is especially true for a z-axis belt-driven lead-screw.
It may just be that the sprag clutch and nylon bushing inside the jack shaft housing are your anti-gravity device. Seriously. You are hanging the weight of the X & Y axis from the Z axis. With the servo motor turned off, and no hydraulic (or any other type) brake, this weight creates a downward force that can (will???) turn the screw, and cause some drifting issues. With closed loop, you can certainly continue fighting this downward force by constantly readjusting the Z axis ... but that may be an additional variable in your Z axis positioning that will cause you issues. When fully assembled, you can adjust the nylon bushing for equal force required to raise and lower the Z axis ... knowing that based on the current condition of the sprag clutch outer race, this is a constant wear item that needs periodic adjustment. Counterbalance springs (flat spring stock wound like a clock main spring) are available, and don't have the constant wear, but require careful selection (and maybe some ballast) to get set correctly. The servos may also allow for different torque and speed adjustments in the tuning process to counter the torque change between raising and lowering without the sprag clutch ... but without an integral brake, you'll still get drift. If the servos have holding torque available, kindly ignore all the above! Thanks for sharing. R
it might just be to delete the feel of the weight of the thing so turning it up gives the same resistance n the crank as moving it down (where the weight helps with going down and if oiled enough might even freewheel all the way to the bottom )
@@watahyahknow I came here to make that suggestion, you wouldn't think that it matters, but having to use different ammount of force in one axis really makes the feeling wierd and working with is sucks
4:10 As a toolmaker and fellow machinist of 15 years +, yes I would believe you. I love it when it happens, especially in the 4 jaw on the lathe. Those fig jam moments are rare but they are yours to own.
These videos are the best! Your humour is on point and editin is brilliant. It is because of you I have to explane to my wife why we need a milling machine :D
TOT, You got Z axis to return to .0000. This indicates that you have no mechanical backlash in the Z axis drive train. You are driving via a timing belt and gears and using a lead screw. At some point this drive train will experience drive train backlash. Your position encoder is integral in the servo motor. So you are monitoring only the motor in your servo closed loop system. How is your retrofit going manage machine accuracy and repeatability since you have no machine position feedback? I repaired a large Mazak mill that we purchased used with non functioning linear scale position feedback by using only the motor encoder. A replacement linear scale feedback wasn't deemed cost effective. In this machine design the servo motor was direct coupled and it was naturally a ball screw system. My experience led me to believe that the ball nut and screw backlash and ball screw TAC bearings preload was reliable enough to risk running with only servo motor encoder feedback. We also had inspection equipment to periodically evaluation linear axis positioning accuracy. I don't like trusting any drivetrain that uses a timing belt. I realize that your closed loop system is a big improvement over your open loop stepper motor system. When I broke into the repair trades in the early 1980's, we had several open loop machines that occasionally gave us positioning errors. Your explanation of how this happens is spot on. I used to explain this to new technicians the same way you did. I only ever maintained one CNC machine that didn't employ OT switches and zero reference switches. All is fine until you lose battery backup power and then you lose absolute positioning. When this happened on this machine, the technician's life just got miserable. Life was always so much easier when even an absolute positioning machine could be simply referenced to re-establish lost machine position. I would certainly like to know how your servo motors maintain absolute positioning. Battery life keeps improving, but I would like to know where that battery is located and how long you can expect it to last. I applaud you for the servo retrofit. I no longer take much interest in the effort. That was the type of project for my employment years. I am interested in simpler tasks in my retirement.
In the industrial world we use flags for the axis limits. (Home and Max) Might be worth considering adding a mechanical flag with a EE-SX-671A OMRON photoelectric sensor. Omron also makes a wired one, like the EE-SX671-WR 1M. Url: www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/omron-automation-and-safety/EE-SX671A/OR612-ND/307730
@@byronwatkins2565 usually rotary encoder on the motor and linear on axle, loads of advantages although a bit harder on software, don't know if those drives have the option though
@@Nuno.A Servo motor position (angle) is quite precise; however, gear backlash allows the table position to vary several thousandths. Clockwise motor rotation gives different table position than counterclockwise motor rotation.
@@byronwatkins2565 exactly true, and to avoid backlash, play, on the gears, belts, ball screw, coupling, etc, the table encoder is usually linear, has that give you a very precise position on the last possible moving part, on a vertical is less of a issue has gravity hides many of the issues, with that you can also do temperature compensation and correct backlash.. to a point, too much wear and the axles start shaking has the control goes in to constant overcorrection
You’re the funniest guy ever. Thank you for always making me laugh. You’re also one of the top minds on UA-cam right now. I don’t care how smart veritasium feels when he goes to exploratoriums but unlike you, he doesn’t teach me things that might go over my head. Hundreds of things you say do go over my head. I’ve counted them. But I really do enjoy your knowledge and wisdom, please keep safe and be happy.
My friends dad had a machine shop in his home. He had two Bridgeports and a Boxford lathe. He worked for dream works. He use to do a lot of projects at home. I remember we used to go in there and start cranking away. Man he would get so red faced at us.
4 роки тому+48
Hi sir. How about retired, enjoy time travel and visiting "old friends". Sent me that machine, i'll bring it back to life in a week.
@@stickshaker101 this whole covid bs. Is going to usher in the nwo. Unless we RISE. It's so hard to see people so brainwashed by their tv. Turn it off, it's a weapon. Wearing a mask is submission RISE #WEDONOTCONSENT #WEDONOTCOMPLY
TOT regarding the belts heating up: "I'm not really sure what to do" Us viewers: "what do you think it means?" Soft voice in the background: "Gear cutting video"
@@hackish1 Is there any reason not to use glass scales on the axes? Then backlash anywhere in the system shouldn't matter. I mean I suppose it would add extra cost....
@@blahblahblahblah2933 the sync time is problematic. When you command the motor to turn, there are a lot of things that happen before the axis completes its move. You can't stop the machine after every move. Using the encoder on the servo is a more reliable method.
Hearing you talk about the closed loop and the drill knowing its position made me think : The drill knows where it is at all times. It know this because it knows where it isn`t.
That is very easy. Take an ordinary chisel with desired width and depth of cut. Then prepare a watery solution from Naqudahheptoxide (NqO7) by 11% weight and Chinesiumtrichloride (ChCl3) by 4%. Let the chisel soak over night and it will work as shown in the video. It least in an alternative reality.
If you are moving one object into a relative position to another then it's going to end up at **some** position and that position **could** be that close to where you wanted. I'd believe it's possible to happen to hit that mark......you just couldn't know without then measuring accurately to find out.
With a lead screw, that may be true, but with a properly designed ball screw set up, with preload. The backlash becomes vanishingly small, certainly good enough for home. In very high end CNC, they switch to glass scales for basicaly insane accuracy.
@@teryk The short answer is it depends. But highquality timing belts can get into seriously lil backlash. Many actual machines use em ? Like CNC lathes or packaging equipment (what I design). Realistically you could eliminate everything and put a servo gearbox instead, the "common" servo gearboxs have like 0.05 degree of back lash (3 arc minutes) and you can find better if budget allows.
hey mister this old, long time veiwer here and happily for you also a cnc machine service dude. the belt nois and heat is very standard as it's not ''broken in'' yet. Over time the heat and nois will become lower as the belt softens. Thanks for the great content! Yours truly, Mr. cnc machine service dude
"I also knew I would need a TON of torque. Maybe not 2000 pounds, but a TON of torque nonetheless." Is that a metric ton joke? Cause I am seriously impressed.
For future reference, when you need to cool your belt, a good option is to move to Greenland and only machine in winter with the garage door open. It's a little inconvenient, but you can't argue with the results.
10/10 life pro tip there.
Don't use V-belt tension setting on a cogged belt.
@@Hopeless_and_Forlorn Belts I see on linear motion are quite loose. I'm sure you could either use positional accuracy as a means for tightening or temperature. At some point it might drop off.
It might be better to investigate direct-drive with no belt at all -- if Tony really needs speed on the Z-axis then an uprated servo on that axis only would be a better bet. Direct-drive would also mean he won't have to faff around to get the servo carrier plate out of the way of the knee if there's interference plus it removes another source of positional inaccuracy and maintenance when (not if) the belt wears, stretches or breaks.
Winter in Greenland with an opened garage door..... I guess you indeed COULDN"T argue, well, maybe forever...
My 7 year old was watching this at the start with me. When she saw the chisel "Magic" as she called it she actually watched seven more minutes of the video, full of questions and then totally lost interest. Point being, Thank you. Its amazing you got her interested in a part of the world that is of no interest to her . GG
The real magic, you got a 7 year old to stay still for 7 minutes. Good on you for that miracle.
What's more is, seven year olds of today are not like the seven year olds before the millenium ticked over.
When i was 7, even though i was a boy and not a girl, i watched and helped in the workshop all the time. I operated machinery like excavators, dumpers, dozers, wood splitters, circular saws, tractors and a few other strange things.
Had i been born seven years ago, all i would probably have learned by now is to stuff my face and record Tik Tok garbage and use snapchat.
Funny thing is, i've kept myself updated with the times as well. So i can of course do recordings and all that garbage if i wanted to. I do programming as well as operate machinery and a whole host of other things pretty well.
Meanwhile, kids these days will probably grow up to be a two trick pony pretty much. Getting by on social score and becoming e-famous.
@@RealCadde Please keep in mind that this is a generalization. Not all Gen Z people like TikTok, not all seven year olds sit on their iPhone X all day. Some of us do enjoy labor. I, as a Gen Z, detest TikTok, love fixing bikes, and do a bit of programming too.
@@RealCadde That's a huge generalization, and every older generation thinks that of the newest generation.
Moral of the story, do more magic maybe in the future vids?
I LOVE a TOT video but seeing my mug (and its being tweaked) made it even better. Top job Tony as usual. Still the only other channel I'll watch the whole video regardless of length.
@colinfurze - Hey Mate - sent you an interesting email....
You guys should do a coop.
Maybe ToT builds an cnc, and you put a flamethrower on it
I watch your vids colin regardless of length. Wish they were a bit longer!
@@bastelwastel8551 now that would be cool
Hahaha, how did I know The Furzinator watched this one too? Outstanding.
Did I really just say Furzinator? I think I need to get out more. Ideally to The Far Frozen North to have a look in Colin’s shed...
I remember the time when a young TOT could karate chop a hunk of aluminum into submission with one chop! It’s a sad day when you have to use a chisel to do it.
I guess he isn't the youngest any more... At least not since that incident.
Precision is better with a chisel.
I think it's because of harder grade of aluminium.
@@tymekuzarczyk6021 Nah, ToT once could karate-chop carbide once. Remember his crappy self-made endmills, before the surface grinder?
He had to use the Chisel he's working on a precision machine
"Do you know what today is?"
My 5 year wedding anniversary - however that can wait for this video
I read this as "5 year welding anniversary" I thought, wow, this guy is serious and commited to welding metal together. Almost brought a tear to my eye.....Then I thought, I should get some new reading glasses before I embarrass myself on the internet.
I repair machines in a forging facility with about 30 production turns and grinders. Servo's are the best thing since sliced bread! Black rubber belts may help with the heat. And NEVER underestimate having a "home" position to use. Batteries die all the time, crap happens.
I kinda just want to see him install a Pete Jackson gear drive setup on it... It would give him the 4:1 he wants too...
No batteries involved, those servos have a 23bit absolute encoder, but a repeatable home position ist worth a lot when you do things like change the belt or screw up your programming, drive the machine against a mechanical block and your belt jumps a notch or two.
Slightly related, the Maho came with glass scales, if the Mach 4 Software can use a secondary measurement system for positioning I would reinstall those too to compensate an possible backlash in the mechanics.
@@WoodmanX yes, but those 23 bits of resolution are applied to 360 degrees of rotation of the servo, so, someone or something making it take more than a full turn in a no power scenario could mess up the home position (I guess. Correct me if i am wrong)mk
@@lcsantos777 It seems 23bit singleturn encoders actually exist, I have no clue where one would need the 0,00004° in angular resolution so. I had simply assumed a 23bit encoder would be a multiturn encoder, that would split angular resolution and turn counts, those do run over at some point, but assuming a typical 12bit reolution for a single turn would leave you with 2048 turns to count, that seems plenty enough for a normal sized milling machine.
@@WoodmanX might not even be because of that. Might be simply because you can add 8bits for some other info, a parity bit, and then you have a nice little 32 bit data frame.
I know what you mean, I once used an Imperial hammer on some metric nails.. Didn't end up well.
That can't be as bad as the time I used my metric files to clean up some imperial parts.
And here I was using a metric adjustable wrench on imperial bolts wondering why it kept rounding the heads.
It is worth remembering that using an imperial boring bar will always give you an "antique" finish.
Yeah, takes 1.27 x more effort.
I would think those metric nails wouldn't bent under imperial command.
1:18 you should have pushed harder with the scribe. It would have made a cleaner cut than the chisel.
@@pupudski8066 nice
I stopped using that method I now just bite the end of the metal off after marking it with a sharpie
@@cmotdibbler4454 I just eyeball it and intimidate it into doing what I want
Wait... you guys haven't heard of lightsabers ?
@@Methar39 Leaves too much slag and takes the temper out of the metal.
When that needle went back to zeroish, I was so excited.
I was rather expecting to see the needle go from zero to one thou in steps of 100 !
Every time now I see something that even vaguely resembles 'MAHO', my stupid brain starts singing: 'MAHO, MAHO, man, I wanna be, a MAHO man'
Oh thank goodness I’m not alone
To me the shape of the machine reminds me of a Mako shark Lol
Will Jackson We need either a techno remix or a full rendition from ToT on Tour (ToToT).
"that thing is the saddle, or the apron ; might even be the knee". I'm glad you're not my surgeon Tony. Nor my butcher.
Whatever it is, I'm afraid it's going to have to come out.
it might be a porkchop , could be a belly or spareribs anything else ? that be 50 quid sir
@@ThisOldTony You do sound a lot like my surgeon
Of course he's not your surgeon. He's the guy that will write g code to the milling machine that will do the surgery.
As soon as I saw EtherCAT in the first few seconds I was sure you was going to try plugging your kitten into that thing! 😁
That would explain the noise!
@@Chris_the_Muso For a few seconds.
Tony's cat is very talented, if he fed it enough chips... it might be capable of... err... extruding a ballscrew for him.🤣
@@Chris_the_Muso i can only guess where he would put the ethernet cable
Is it cool with you to say that your videos remind me of a feeling that I had as a kid watching Mr. Rogers Neighborhood? By the time you say thanks for hangin around the shop with me, I'm genuinely happier than before.
Seriously. Being furloughed, and wondering what the hell to do with myself to keep my house healthy and happy has been challenging for my brain health. When I finish any of Tony's latest uploads, I'm ready to get off my ass and go do something. He deserves more patrons than however many he has.
Aaahhh. It just dawned on me. "Zee" is the imperial conversion of the metric "Zed".
Zed is imperial. The only reason you have imperial is because you were in an empire. The British empire. The British still use Zed. So zed must be imperial.
If it had an "H" axis you would be extra screwed up. lol
@@bigbossimmotal h will come up quickly when he connects the rest of the 12 axiseeses.
@@milenko1965 Indeed!
@@benbaselet2026 From TOT, I wouldn't even be surprised. LOL
Look into my eyes, you hear only my voice...you want a ball screw for the Z axis...you need a ball screw for the Z axis...you will be happy with the speed and cooler running with a ball screw for the Z axis. When I snap my fingers, you will awake, refreshed, at ease and very happy with your decision to replace that old, slow, clunky acme screw with a nice, new, sleek, carefully matched ball screw for the Z axis.
Thank you for some of the most fun I have on UA-cam! Safe, productive days, and peaceful nights, good sir.
Help, I don't have a mill but I just got an email receipt for a ball screw I ordered...
@@alexhb12333 don't worry . . . you're not the only one.
[ i ordered three! ]
So in that case he'll need some kind of brakes (or holdin ax with the servo), without it all z axis will roll down on ballscrew under its own weight when motor is off
N T, yup that’s one of those complications that caused TOT to stay with the acme screw, while he was going back and forth across much of the project. BUT a spring sustained solenoid brake driven by a slaved relay eliminates that concern. In the end, he’ll be fine either way, but I can’t resist the chance to tease him.
His are some of the consistently best videos on YouTub, IMO.
@@alexhb12333 What is a ball screw, and why have I now got one?
So... you could ...actually still just put the handwheel on the end with a little longer shaft? Manual wDRO *and* Electric wDRO *and* full auto?
Careful your comment don't get banned for full auto.
I know a guy that did exactly that with his Bridgeport conversion.
I was going to suggest the exact same thing.
13:30 onwards sounded like the doctor who took out my apendix
@@ToreDL87 NO FULL AUTO IN BUILDINGS!
I f&*kin lost it when he hammered the broach thru the pulley bore 😭
I know! That never works out for me for some reason :(
@@benbaselet2026 clearly, you're using imperial broaches, it's easy with metrique ones
666Tomato666 Imperial broaches work fine, as long as you use an Imperial hammer... Les in UK
@@leslieaustin151 oh, silly me, not only I was using metrique hammer, I was using metrique anvil! It's a miracle it didn't braze additional metal in the hole!
666Tomato666 !! 🤔😁 Les
1:28 confused me. I thought those were just random PNGs or something overlayed on screen then the reflections made me think "Thats good video editing." Then I finally realized its just the lighting and they are real. Also shout out to Brian for sending over the gear.
just a small note to ya. your vids are one of my top five subscriptions. love the humor that you incorporate into the videography, not annoying like some, just perfect. i might be the only one on break on a construction job laughing my ass off meanwhile being inspired and learning at the same time. that you for the time that you put in to create such perfected coolness brother. much appreciation sir.
Me seeing Tony scribe a line: i cant wait to see what creative method will he use to split the work piece.
Tony: never dissapoints
4:16
Of course I believe you Tony, you’re the one with the editing software
1:28 Man, that lighting looks so good, those gears look photoshopped into the image.
I thought the exact same thing - had to pause to check the reflections for a second. Might be over-lit... need some shadows to put in some depth.
3:38 screwed my eyes up. I realy couldn't figure out what I was looking at. It was like that eternal staircase.
Hey Old Tony Great production and hilariously instructive as always. My partner brought me a coffee as I began this vid and stayed to watch. She was amazed to see such a clean cut with one strike of a masons chisel. I had to disabuse her of that misunderstanding or I would forever be hounded to try that instead of a hacksaw.
Who woulda guesst A fine machinist and a cinematic genius.
keep your PLC / machine network separate (physically isolated) from your home network. preferably VLAN/subnetted and firewalled. because the last thing you want is that machine unexpectantly running/moving/changing/updating while your hands are in it. as a security analyst for machine/process networks....i'm just saying, keep it isolated and keep your hands.
That is typically not a concern for EtherCAT servos.
EtherCAT in general does not support TCP/IP. (It is a rarely used extension, which requires special support in both the servo drives and the PC controller software)
EtherCAT also don't play well with switches. It needs to be a direct connection to the PC.
But I guess the PC could have second NIC. Which of course should not be online.
Yeap. I remember reading an article called "Why is this computer connected to the internet?" or something like that.
The premise of the article is why do companies want every computer hooked up to the internet. A computer controlling a piece of machinery at a factory.
"Why is this computer connected to the internet?" There is little to no reason that most computers are connected to the internet.
The computers can be old, not secure, running old OS's and it doesn't matter.
@@vonnikon That is basically every industry system. EtherCat is just another protocol language like CanBUS, RS485 etc. They all work with RJ45 contacts today. Because it is easier to disconnect/re-connect etc. Doesn't require an electrician to assist with the set-up among other things. Not to mention, you can use CAT6 cables for the best magnetic resistance. To be able to handle electrical field distortions that can happen in certain Industrial enclosures.
But conversing it to TCP/IP is fairly easy. Just a gateway that acts as a translator.
@@vonnikon every engineer i have ever worked with wanted their machine on the network. every single time. was just a word of warning.
@@vintagespeed as a technician working on fairly black box equipment troubleshooting an intermittent critical failure, having access to the machine's event logs and settings would have saved me hours on the phone. Ultimately the problem was caused by condensation which they wouldn't be able to detect but it would have saved all the "have you set x to such and such value?" Some times being networked helps but it's entirely dependent on the individual equipment and who has to work on it.
14:15 Its free to turn in one direction and not in the other. The nylon thing adds resistance in the downwards direction. Without it the machine can make the screw turn down due to vibration. It also gives you an equal amount of torque in both directions, this is much more practical for the machinist.
Great explanation. Without that clutch, gravity will pull the entire thing down.
Came here to say this. My drill press has the same feature on the crank to raise / lower the head.
This, I'm not sure your servo motors have a 0-rpm holding torque? but without such you will need a brake.
@@rowlandstraylight Especially with a ball screw.
Not just that, but it also balances the load on the motor. When holding stationary, it's always best to try to get as close to no torque when possible to prevent premature failure of the servo.
Nice job Tony!!!
Servo control is amazing and fun - I have done high speed servo control design for several years. Fastest so far for me has been 10g of accel to 300ips max speed using a 3HP servo.
Watch yourself, these motors can cause some major harm. I really like the accel I saw. Don't go Tim Taylor on us. I have broken several shear pins (among other things) with over-aggressive accels.
A few other things to note:
1) From a pure motor standpoint, there is no difference between a servo motor and a stepper motor (other than an encoder which you can add to either). They are both just brushless DC motors. The difference is the control electronics.
2) Often a servo motor (like yours) will include some electronics (like for the encoder, resolver, etc) which a person who wants a stepper doesn't need. Also, servos usually market to a higher end task than steppers so the manufactures often put more $$ into them (like better magnets) so they often have better performance.
3) DC Motors deliver their most power at their highest rated RPM. It is best to gear them accordingly - but with some margin. Never run them at max RPM as the control loop needs room to operate and motor power drops rapidly after the motor reaches max RPM.
4) Servos DO NOT like lag/lash (non-linearity) between the shaft and the load. This can really mess with the control loop. Best to eliminate as much as you can. If you hear any buzzing when the servos are holding position, you need to either eliminate the lash or soften the tuning. The buzzing in not only annoying, it can do mechanical damage.
5) EtherCAT (Ethernet for Control Automation Technology) is cool. It allows the motion controller to talk to all the control electronics over the same wiring and there are a lot of compatible devices.
6) Don't completely give up on limit switches, they can be a really good friend. Control systems can sometime go haywire due to a SW or HW (or operator) failure and having a switch that tells the control system to "go no further" can save slamming several hundred pounds of metal at full speed into a hard stop.
7) Make sure to include a big easy to hit E-Stop (Emergency Stop) switch in your design so you can quickly kill power to all the motors. Not only is it a VERY GOOD idea, it is also the law.
Two stormtroopers walk into a bar on Corusant. There's so little going on, they fall asleep.
They're in an Imperial Boring Bar.
Imperial Forces want to know your location.
That's the one Elon Musk owns, right?
that_G_EvanP - Or will now, since you mentioned it!
At a candy store, a distracted shopper walks into a Mars Bar.
Wingnut Stickman - Good one 👍🏻
I have been eagerly awaiting an update on the Maho and I am impressed! The time you have spent putting this video series together so people like me can understand the basics of how to upgrade a manual mill to CNC is greatly appreciated. I have learned something and gotten a good laugh from all of your videos. A sincere thanks to you.
13:55 I think the sprag clutch and plastic bushing combination is to balance out the resistance while you're moving the head up or down...the plastic bushing provides extra resistance when moving the head down while you get no extra resistance(besides gravity) when going up. It might even keep it from freewheeling down.
Love your videos, take care!
This Old Tony is the Chef John of whatever it is This Old Tony does. Keep going strong bruh..
And remember, you're the Vince Vaughn of your fillet mignon.
8:26 - I have that same mug from Colin and i cant belive that you edited "safety tie" to "subscribe"! Man I love your videos :D
Half the fun of this old tony vids is seeing when and where he sneaks in the subscribe.
@@Mint_drake I couldn't find it in the last one. I think it's a fake. ;o)
How the hell did you notice that? I missed it totally
he deserves all the subs
@@colinfurze All my favorite UA-camr's on this channel
Tony! I’m a rookie mechanical engineer working in my first position where I need an in depth understanding of GD&T. You should start a mini-series going through it! You seem to have a great understanding of it, and your teaching of things with great visuals has been extremely helpful for me. I’d love to see something like that!
Scott, try gdandtbasics.com. No affiliation just a happy customer.
I am a trade school student and I have been watching these videos for awhile, I am taking classes on machining with both manual and CNC lathes and mills, since the pandemic started and the schools closed, I've been watching these videos to learn my trade and I've learned alot. Thank you.
This channel is the perfect mix of knowledge, information, visuals, and absurd silliness. I am not or have ever been interested in machining, but I watch all your videos and find them fascinating and hilarious.
i just started learning how to cut aluminum with a chisel... its a lot of studying but i think i understand the concepts....
It's easier if you start with metric tooling, rather than converting from imperial before your first cut.
Ok, so I am a complete noob about this stuff, but I assume it is not actually possible to split a block of aluminum with a chisel...
@@Warhawk76 Depends on the size of the block...
and the chisel...
If brute force isn’t solving your problem, you aren’t using enough.
@@Warhawk76 Correct! Tongues are firmly in cheek with all this banter :-D
omg praise be!. i can only re watch so many old episodes
I was just listening to old motown when i saw the notification, how serendipitous.
I know absolutely nothing about machining but it is something that has always interest me. I really enjoy watching your videos.
ToT you should be proud, your videos have made it to the big leagues. My professor used your lathe chuck and surface grinding videos in my 331 engineering course at NIU, I'd recognize those hands anywhere.
high belt temperature means the belt is too tight or too small for the force you are putting on it. i put my money on the latter.
Or maybe the belt is not constructed/ incorrect material composition for the torque application....timing belt not drive belt? Reacon it is flexing/streching, just wait till the rest of the wieght goes on, might just fail, that sprag clutch was probably there to prevent the weight of the mill table combined with gravity from free spinning down when it was manually wound.....just my 20 cent bet ;)
What do you mean by too small for the force?
@@AadityaKhare42 Every belt has a maximum force you can use it for. These belts look like T5 belts to me. I switched to T10 (that can handle bigger forces) on my robotmower because the T5 broke. If this T5 breaks TOT is in for a bang.
I’m not a big fan of using belt drives for high loads.
@@nogmeerjan it will probably just turn out that he was using an metric set of drive wheels and belt rather than imperial....lol ;)
My new pickup line : "Hey baby want to come over and see my servo on my mounting flange?"
You may have heard of the late 90's rapper by the name of "Mr. Serv-O". He was with No Limit Records.
Tried it. Knee collided with ball-screws in the Z axis at over 500 mm/sec.
"We'll burn that bridge when we cross it" excellent malamor
"cross that bridge when we burn it" is a fun one.
It's one I use all the time.
"Too many hurdles to jump through"
I am honestly not particularly interested in machining, but your videos are simply so great that I watch all of them, some twice. I really love the small quirks as well as the outstanding attention to detail in the production of both the videos and the actual stuff you make. Thanks so much.
That motion test clip with the indicator floored me. I’m super excited to see the rest of the conversion, good luck Old Tony!
@9:05 Oh, now I get it.
I've always wondered why they call it "breaking the corners"
I’m betting the heat on the belt is because it’s too tight.
Yup, it contracts when it gets on the pully and releases that stored energy from streaching as heat into the pulley. Mind you, what heat scale was that, are we talking 0.001c or 50c??
I was searching for a comment like that, or otherwise I would have written it myself
Yeah, but if he loosens it, he's going to get backlash for his troubles.
No, it's just too heavy of a load for that belt. It will get worse when he adds the X and Y and the workpiece mass to the load. I wager TOT will eventually have to upgrade to a precision chain drive. Or a gear drive.
@@jeffvoight6586 I dunno if your gonna get much back lash with all that weight on it. I guesseing that sprag clutch was also setup to be a bit of a helper in someway in the up direction.
"Voe mahoton!" That is Finnish from the Savolax region and means: "Gee, TOT is a Retrofit Wizard!" Thank you and keep on churning! 😁👍
Today, after many years of watching and enjoying This Old Tony videos, I have finally become a patron.
The visual gags on this channel are absolutely legendary. I love it.
@4:19 .0001 inch? Why yes, Tony! We totally beli...
18:40 "I no longer have to beat my kids"
I learned about not playing with dad's precisely set caliper when we were headed to the hardware store.
1:17 I was half expecting something anticlimactic happening by this time instead of the usual gag... i swear, any day now, This Old Tony will have us!
There was one time he made us sit through an entire bandsaw cut realtime as we waited for something to happen lol
Imagine him hitting that chisel only for it to make a useless "thwack," the aluminum unharmed. Frustrated, he puts the hammer and chisel down, and takes the aluminum to the band saw.
By not replacing the Z axis bearing by a ball one, he just created another opportunity for a video.
Keep up your excellent work!
Don't worry too much about the screw. You aren't making a mistake, you're educating us about what doesn't work.
I want a This Old Tony belt cooler shirt.
I would believe that you zeroed that buy eye
Doing it by sound or feel would be harder
With ToT's superhuman skillz at cutting metal, I figured he wouldn't even have to touch it.
I figured he would just tell it to center itself and it would obey his command. :)
Who else here is old enough to get his "let my fingers do the walking" reference?
Or the title, "Movin' On Up!"
Jlll
Poor bvvc CV bc c xx bcb my bvbbnnbb
To be a good day to my church by mcxc meuk tho to mujtxy to I guess it to the
Y
I worked with a group of guys who. 30+ years ago, learned a lot about stepper motors "the hard way". These were small, very inexpensive steppers that had a gear box that converted the rotary motion in linear motion. We would drive the motor to one stop at power up and call that zero. Through the "school of hard knocks" we learned that if you hit either stop at max speed, the motor would "bounce" and start running at twice the speed in the WRONG DIRECTION ! We also discovered any time you stopped or changed direction there was a chance of loosing a step. Good thing was, there was "indirect" (but very slow) feedback in the total system, so we never got too far "lost" !
Been missing your videos. not like not watching them, just havent been any new ones. Glad to see the MAHO is getting the its move on.
When I refreshed youtube and saw this video, I made an audible "Ooh!". I'm excited to see progress on this, I don't really understand a lot of it, I don't have the brain smarts to, but I enjoy watching for sure!
“Liquid cooled belts?” Linus tech tips has entered the chat.
Cross drilled is really the way to go.
@@craggslist Mighty Car Mods has entered the chat.
I predict that Tony will be visited by the ghost of backlash future. The feedback is on the motor, so it doesn't measure where the actual machine is, and this is especially true for a z-axis belt-driven lead-screw.
Tony, urgent, I've watched your future video, and you definitely regretted not going with a ball screw, head on back in time ASAP and change it!
I've been dreaming about this moment
"It doesn't do anything, it's just dead weight for now going along with the ride"
Yup, that's me.
@Evi1M4chine no
Describes my ride through life quite perfectly.
It may just be that the sprag clutch and nylon bushing inside the jack shaft housing are your anti-gravity device.
Seriously. You are hanging the weight of the X & Y axis from the Z axis. With the servo motor turned off, and no hydraulic (or any other type) brake, this weight creates a downward force that can (will???) turn the screw, and cause some drifting issues.
With closed loop, you can certainly continue fighting this downward force by constantly readjusting the Z axis ... but that may be an additional variable in your Z axis positioning that will cause you issues.
When fully assembled, you can adjust the nylon bushing for equal force required to raise and lower the Z axis ... knowing that based on the current condition of the sprag clutch outer race, this is a constant wear item that needs periodic adjustment.
Counterbalance springs (flat spring stock wound like a clock main spring) are available, and don't have the constant wear, but require careful selection (and maybe some ballast) to get set correctly.
The servos may also allow for different torque and speed adjustments in the tuning process to counter the torque change between raising and lowering without the sprag clutch ... but without an integral brake, you'll still get drift.
If the servos have holding torque available, kindly ignore all the above!
Thanks for sharing.
R
it might just be to delete the feel of the weight of the thing so turning it up gives the same resistance n the crank as moving it down (where the weight helps with going down and if oiled enough might even freewheel all the way to the bottom )
@@watahyahknow I came here to make that suggestion, you wouldn't think that it matters, but having to use different ammount of force in one axis really makes the feeling wierd and working with is sucks
Good to see your still doing well old Tony. Got worried for a while, didn't Z a video from you in weeks. Love your sense of humor.
4:10 As a toolmaker and fellow machinist of 15 years +, yes I would believe you. I love it when it happens, especially in the 4 jaw on the lathe. Those fig jam moments are rare but they are yours to own.
Just what I need after being bed bound from knee surgery!!! Mr OG TOE-Knee
1:19 Cmon man I know that the older techniques are less accurate but how did you miss the scribe line that much with the chisel!
The moment I’ve been waiting for...
Hi TOT knowing that there are imperial boring bar out there made my day! thanks for keeping me informed
These videos are the best! Your humour is on point and editin is brilliant. It is because of you I have to explane to my wife why we need a milling machine :D
TOT,
You got Z axis to return to .0000. This indicates that you have no mechanical backlash in the Z axis drive train. You are driving via a timing belt and gears and using a lead screw. At some point this drive train will experience drive train backlash. Your position encoder is integral in the servo motor. So you are monitoring only the motor in your servo closed loop system. How is your retrofit going manage machine accuracy and repeatability since you have no machine position feedback?
I repaired a large Mazak mill that we purchased used with non functioning linear scale position feedback by using only the motor encoder. A replacement linear scale feedback wasn't deemed cost effective. In this machine design the servo motor was direct coupled and it was naturally a ball screw system. My experience led me to believe that the ball nut and screw backlash and ball screw TAC bearings preload was reliable enough to risk running with only servo motor encoder feedback. We also had inspection equipment to periodically evaluation linear axis positioning accuracy. I don't like trusting any drivetrain that uses a timing belt.
I realize that your closed loop system is a big improvement over your open loop stepper motor system. When I broke into the repair trades in the early 1980's, we had several open loop machines that occasionally gave us positioning errors. Your explanation of how this happens is spot on. I used to explain this to new technicians the same way you did.
I only ever maintained one CNC machine that didn't employ OT switches and zero reference switches. All is fine until you lose battery backup power and then you lose absolute positioning. When this happened on this machine, the technician's life just got miserable. Life was always so much easier when even an absolute positioning machine could be simply referenced to re-establish lost machine position. I would certainly like to know how your servo motors maintain absolute positioning. Battery life keeps improving, but I would like to know where that battery is located and how long you can expect it to last.
I applaud you for the servo retrofit. I no longer take much interest in the effort. That was the type of project for my employment years. I am interested in simpler tasks in my retirement.
In the industrial world we use flags for the axis limits. (Home and Max) Might be worth considering adding a mechanical flag with a EE-SX-671A OMRON photoelectric sensor. Omron also makes a wired one, like the EE-SX671-WR 1M. Url: www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/omron-automation-and-safety/EE-SX671A/OR612-ND/307730
Tony: "I centered this, by eye, to within one ten-thou..."
Me: chuckles
My wife: "Wow, he's good. Can you do that?"
Lol i believe im he cut a piece of metal with a chisels.... just kidding
HAHAHAHA!
well can you?
/s
@Khaffit TOT was joking, now commenter's wife thinks hubby can't do what TOT can lol.
Setting anything to 1/10000 by eye would be ludicrous
@Khaffit setting anything to 5/1000 by eye would be impossible
The servo DRO does not allow for backlash so be careful.
I wonder if it'd be better to close the loop on the axes instead of the motors.
@@LanceThumping For optimum results, you would use a double loop. Using only table sensors would cause oscillations.
@@byronwatkins2565 usually rotary encoder on the motor and linear on axle, loads of advantages although a bit harder on software, don't know if those drives have the option though
@@Nuno.A Servo motor position (angle) is quite precise; however, gear backlash allows the table position to vary several thousandths. Clockwise motor rotation gives different table position than counterclockwise motor rotation.
@@byronwatkins2565 exactly true, and to avoid backlash, play, on the gears, belts, ball screw, coupling, etc, the table encoder is usually linear, has that give you a very precise position on the last possible moving part, on a vertical is less of a issue has gravity hides many of the issues, with that you can also do temperature compensation and correct backlash.. to a point, too much wear and the axles start shaking has the control goes in to constant overcorrection
8:15 Love the Colin Furze easter-egg :P
You’re the funniest guy ever. Thank you for always making me laugh. You’re also one of the top minds on UA-cam right now. I don’t care how smart veritasium feels when he goes to exploratoriums but unlike you, he doesn’t teach me things that might go over my head. Hundreds of things you say do go over my head. I’ve counted them. But I really do enjoy your knowledge and wisdom, please keep safe and be happy.
My friends dad had a machine shop in his home. He had two Bridgeports and a Boxford lathe. He worked for dream works. He use to do a lot of projects at home. I remember we used to go in there and start cranking away. Man he would get so red faced at us.
Hi sir. How about retired, enjoy time travel and visiting "old friends". Sent me that machine, i'll bring it back to life in a week.
Hello matey ! All good ?
Holy crap! Its Ca Lem! Cool! And yeah: no idle boast. he could do it in a week or less.
"Do you know what today is" since lockdown started, i barely know if its night or day, tony
its may be vember
Fake virus to take our country down. Time is NOW RISE #WEDONOTCONSENT #WEDONOTCOMPLY
@@wcmwfab935 Well, that escalated quickly...
@@stickshaker101 Probably using a stepper motor and inexplicably lost thier place?
@@stickshaker101 this whole covid bs. Is going to usher in the nwo. Unless we RISE. It's so hard to see people so brainwashed by their tv. Turn it off, it's a weapon. Wearing a mask is submission RISE #WEDONOTCONSENT #WEDONOTCOMPLY
TOT regarding the belts heating up: "I'm not really sure what to do"
Us viewers: "what do you think it means?"
Soft voice in the background: "Gear cutting video"
The backlash is a problem and that is why they direct drive or use belts
@@hackish1 Is there any reason not to use glass scales on the axes? Then backlash anywhere in the system shouldn't matter. I mean I suppose it would add extra cost....
@@blahblahblahblah2933 the sync time is problematic. When you command the motor to turn, there are a lot of things that happen before the axis completes its move. You can't stop the machine after every move.
Using the encoder on the servo is a more reliable method.
The possibility of a closed loop is something very nice, thanks for letting us know about that system :D
The 1 mil subscriber special where you mill TOT was here in mild steel using the converted maho is gunna be awesome. Keep it up Tony!
I will believe anybody that still uses Sir Mix-a-Lot references .
I was really expecting the theme from The Jeffersons.
Me too, I guess TOT has resorted to clickbait titles
@@jasnterry1313 I think yo mean clickawesome titles :)
@@jasnterry1313 We are an odd demographic if a Jeffersons reference is viable click bait. "Weezie, where's my micrometer!"
8:24. Furze gets everywherre!
Furze has a video he filmed like Tony, and name checks him.
Good old uncle Fuzzy!
Hearing you talk about the closed loop and the drill knowing its position made me think :
The drill knows where it is at all times. It know this because it knows where it isn`t.
I'm glad to see that you made progress on the MAHO. Looking forward to see the rest of the build!
Can anyone help me finding the amazon affiliate link for the chisel? I was about to buy a big bandsaw, but now... pfffffff ni en pedo :D
That is very easy. Take an ordinary chisel with desired width and depth of cut. Then prepare a watery solution from Naqudahheptoxide (NqO7) by 11% weight and Chinesiumtrichloride (ChCl3) by 4%. Let the chisel soak over night and it will work as shown in the video. It least in an alternative reality.
"would you believe me if I centered this part to within 1 ten thousandths?"
No.
If you are moving one object into a relative position to another then it's going to end up at **some** position and that position **could** be that close to where you wanted.
I'd believe it's possible to happen to hit that mark......you just couldn't know without then measuring accurately to find out.
3:25 That camera angle made me question reality
His videography has really taken off since he started using drone footage.
Wow! Quirky humor, absolutely amazing camera work and editing on a par with the content. Very enjoyable
Fantastic video! Tony I can not tell you all I learn from you. Thank you 😄
Receiving 600 upvotes in half the video overall time since upload. You know we do love you, don'tya?
I don't think the encoders in the servos can completely replace linear scales because they'll still be subject to backlash in the lead screw.
With a lead screw, that may be true, but with a properly designed ball screw set up, with preload. The backlash becomes vanishingly small, certainly good enough for home. In very high end CNC, they switch to glass scales for basicaly insane accuracy.
@@Kevgti5 and with a belt driving a lead screw?
@@teryk a belt driving some gears, which in turn drive the soon to be quite worn screw.
Yeah...
@@teryk The short answer is it depends. But highquality timing belts can get into seriously lil backlash. Many actual machines use em ? Like CNC lathes or packaging equipment (what I design). Realistically you could eliminate everything and put a servo gearbox instead, the "common" servo gearboxs have like 0.05 degree of back lash (3 arc minutes) and you can find better if budget allows.
The captions when you tested it said [applause] i laughed pretty hard
hey mister this old, long time veiwer here and happily for you also a cnc machine service dude. the belt nois and heat is very standard as it's not ''broken in'' yet. Over time the heat and nois will become lower as the belt softens.
Thanks for the great content!
Yours truly, Mr. cnc machine service dude
I'm concerned that the pulley introduces another potential for lost steps, especially if the belt breaks. Is this a valid concern?
EtherCat beckhoff standard. The fastest system out there. Perfect for cnc machines.
Nice video tot. So nice to see this old hardware get a new life
"I also knew I would need a TON of torque. Maybe not 2000 pounds, but a TON of torque nonetheless."
Is that a metric ton joke? Cause I am seriously impressed.
imperial ton is 2,000 pounds, it was a standard ton joke
@@herzogsbuick Apparently an imperial ton and a metric ton are around the same. Imperial ton is 2240 lbs.
@@pagaiba3 a long ton is 2240, short ton is 2000lbs
@@herzogsbuick alright