He said at the beggining that every character is tournament viable. Bottom tier in this tier list doesn't mean dogshit, it just means the character is way harder to perform at the same level than the best character. Leo is pretty hard to pilot as his built-in mixups are quite weak. The player needs to be very aware of all Leo's options at all times. AyoRichie can show you the character is viable as he took some games from great players but he still cannot crack the other players.
@@DapperPopz There's this really strong Leo player at my local who just won a stacked tournament last weekend. Clearly such a busted character...hahaha I'm just kidding. Congrats on the big W!
As a leo main. I disagree. I a quite playing asuke to play leo because he has better options and is easier to play in my opinion, and I'm god of destruction now.
This is a really good solid tier list. I wasn’t expecting to be in close agreement. I’m glad you gave Jin in top 5 and have Law right outside of top 5. I used to get so much blowback from people when I was claiming they were top tier.
@@davbro9120 yeah but people are tier-wh*res, they just pick characters that they can win easier with, many fighting game players are just lowly egoists, no skill, no talent, no style😴
Lmao, hard disagree. There are a few things that I just don’t buy. Kuma being a top 10 character is a hot take. Leo being below Lars is also strange (albeit only by one) Leo is literally a better Lars in every aspect. Leo being that low in general is odd
@@YAGB Leo has been downplayed since T7 lmao. She has better CH utility than Lars, better lows, better frames and better stance with FO BU literally being a discount AoP. Her wall carry is almost as good as Lars too. Much of Lars whole kit is fake pressure and gimmicky. Leo's whole kit is legitimate and should be respected
Yoshi gets to keep his multipurpose 1,1 and all his other BS, but Azucena's 1,1 and 2,1 was too strong. There's definitely a Yoshi main on the balance team that keeps him under the radar
I agree with you. Azucena needs to have her 1,1 or 1,2 a bit more safe. Or at least -10 if we are being generous given it's high-mid and high-high that doesn't do anything for her on block.
Yoshi has lost a lot on tools that were actually better in t7, people just hate on him bcs flash destroys the flowcharts and plusframes. Why would azucena need a yoshi 1,1? Yoshi is low tier since forever and one of the few chars on since t1 every game. F that generic dancing coffeehoe. Her design and concept is bottomtier, so should be her gameplay..
Been playing leo since late tag2 and messing ppl up at locals, he/she/it has everything along with an extreme rulebreaking low in df2+3 (highcrush + plus on hit + "unreactable" + only -12 + ch launcher, most good lows only have 2 or maybe 3 of those or you end up with jin d2) and that still isnt enough to compete because in t8 being very good and well rounded is no longer enough.
I wonder why would Kuma be "controversal" to be on top, the character literally have the size of the screen but has evasiveness for some reason, he is immune to lows, his damage is absurdly above normal, his wall combo still broken and "Electric Wind Bear Fist" is the most obnoxious move in the game. 1 launcher = you lost a round.
For the most part, this is a much better tier list. I would argue Feng could be moved up a bit but he's definitely not top 3. King is in a good spot too, he's strong but not top 3-5 like some people think, especially after his nerfs. Unlike the other strong and top tiers, he has a lot of weaknesses. Law was being downplayed for a while too in the beginning of Tekken.
Zafina has no good lows, no good pokes, no 15f launcher, bad punish, bad damage, 26f powercrush -14 on black, bad heat game, The only character that does not recover health and takes damage when attacking, etc. All this makes Zafina bad in tournaments and bad in any format. It's really hard to play with her, In Tekken 7 she had defensive tools, but now she doesn't.
Doesn't jun lose health to? Also her heat isn't that bad like armor on Azazel moves to spam it twice and do o chip damage ... Thinking about that you only do it 2-3 times... Ok it's bad.
@@SOAP2401like you remember eddy,master raven and noctis from t7 and how they reached the finals while the top 3 of t7 tirelist are feng akuma and zafina
d3 counter hit launching isn't a good low? plus on block power crushes in heat isn't good? Slower powercrushes mean less chance for it to trade hits after armor frames. What do you mean she doesn't recover health like everyone else??? Azazel moves leave her grey health.
List seems pretty solid, I did think Lily and Xioyou would be higher but in a tournament setting it’s very different compared to casual. The top 5 seems accurate, maybe Yoshi could be higher than Nina depending on the players using him but overall well explained and seemed mostly non biased which is rare in tier lists tbh 😂
Finally someone that says victor over bryan even if it isnt by much the upsurge of overrating him is insane some people have him in the top row with law like what??bryans dmg is the only thing that even has him so high getting counter hit by moves with a linear 22 frames start up is going to hurt alot with most characters...
I never understood how people put Kuma at b tier, he’s so obviously brain dead in this game, I feel like most people are just stuck in T7 when it comes to certain characters.
Eddy's weakness: No I13 engager, a lot of tools lack tracking, His WS 2 is still fucked up, He has a hard time approaching, he doesn't cashout his advantages as much as majority of the cast, and his 50/50 puts him more of a risk than his OP, so you have to rely more on negativa into 1+2 or delayed 4 and if you trying to go into handstand you either have to by punish with 2,3 or full crouch DF 4 or you just gonna get punched out of it.
I honestly feel like they should make every character on the level of lidia. She's very aggressive but she can only access that aggressiveness through a certain point.
Bro u don’t get a badge of honor for getting to blue using a character in which no knows the matchup. If anything u got to raijin BECAUSE ur playing Jack
The reason most people dont talk about muscle armor is because he doesnt have a backdash. I think king is a solid A teir character but his oki is overally weakened due to recent patches. But he has clear counter play to him due to being a linier character and his wavedash acts like he is a standing character which is a nerf.
@@kevinsyz1201 lol no, Victor is _way_ better than Kuma, you're capping. Victor can actually play neutral, and his stances are still a nightmare to fight against.
Yeah, I totally get why you put leroy here. He's not really played that much in this game, and he's very sub par gameplay wise. His best tools in neutral are b4, db3, and ff22. And all of which are risky and committal. If he's given better moves in neutral that can be threatening or at least safe, and cane turns into a once per round move instead
Yoshi is third because yoshi players can't win jack. If top players were running around playing yoshi and dragunov wasnt winning jack then yoshi would be considered #1
Arslan did start trying Yoshi in tournaments and he got knocked out of it. Yoshi is a great tournament character but he's not a pick up and play tournament character like drag
That is the dumbest logic ever. You can say that about any single character in the game if they were winning tournaments they would be higher. Why aren't they winning tournaments though? Probably because the character isn't as good as you think he is just because you get slaughtered by him and have no idea about the matchup doesn't mean he's top 3. Are you going to claim that Kaneandtrench and Eyemusician etc are bad at Yoshi and that's why they can't win anything? You people that say this are so delusional. Arlsan tried for months now.
@AbdullahMikalRodriguez can't really say I've seen these conversations. Outside of calling him overrated I agree with mostly everything else. Leo is really middle of the road, answer for most situations but none of them anything to write home about.
@User.665 I would agree with that. I dont think he was saying Leo is low tier just that he's praised more than he should be. I would agree with middle of the road.
@@AbdullahMikalRodriguez yeah he's not but I personally don't see him being mentioned at all. I can count the amount of Leo's I've played since launch on one hand
As long as Tier Lists gonna be set based on individuals knowledge, they will shift. Which means they wont be accurate. They are fun, and good for "clicks" but nothing more, and thats how people should take them, but they dont. The only method to set up accurate Tier List is by Official Tournament character placement. Everything else is subjective.
What's crazy is that Zafina's B1+2 locked behind stance is just as punishable as it was in Tekken 7. It still baffles me why they thought it was a neccessary change.
@Blackfist030 this is not true because some characters still have crazy movement that carried over from Tekken 7 like Lili, like Alisa, Like Asuka... they just nerfed Zafina's movement and improved others for the most part. And other characters have long reaching lows. Like imagine removing Feng's DB3 and the commotion that would cause? You're point fails to land.
@brentthompson1607 ....it doesn't fail at all, the game literally shows you, wtf are you even talking about?....and fengs db3 is launch punishable, and he never had zafina movement, and the others you named don't have long reaching lows, your point failed to land, again....they wanted to remove back Dash all day and b1+2 style, that's how everyone outside of shadow played her, and that's why you want the move back, and that's why everyone who played her in 7 dropped her except shadow
@@Blackfist030 in your original reply, you said they got rid of b1+2 to get rid of that "playstyle" and I am telling you that is not true. You literally have Dragunov and Nina as prime examples of crazy movement with crazy pokes. And many more characters are like that. I'm telling you that the removal of B1+2 was solely to nerf Zafina and you have not provided any valid counter.
@@brentthompson1607 ......are you just arguing to argue? We're talking about her running away all day and spamming b1+2, a long range low, you keep naming other characters that have nothing to do with what we're talking about, they took it away, that's why it ain't in the game, because they didn't want that....the game itself is your proof, I don't know what else to tell you dude
In my opinion take away yoshimitsu's damage and a little wall carry and he would basically just be t7 yoshi with a slightly bigger hitbox on nss flash. Do that and yoshi would drop to low mid to bottom tier as other than the characteristics above he hasnt really changed from t7.
Man I can't believe I've been playing nina for so long in the past she is always placed in the bottom tier and now iam starting to get embarrassed playing my main like nah, in the past people keep calling her a hard character and always at the mid to bottom tier but now it's embarrassing😅 but iam glad she found her place, and that's the reason i only keep playing asuka now
I think Asuka is better then Jun because her Heat allow crazy mindless offense with strong 50/50. She also has better stepping game the jun. But I think she has harder execution then Jun. About Eddy, Eddy is really bugged right now, you should watch Jeondding replays / his last twit. Also his 50/50 aren't that great in the end. Hit ff3 - have a hell sweep that gives no oki and a bad install, doesn't clean hit on backdash or small legs. - his mids that all lose to power crushes, parries or anything that is active around frame 8. Reward is heat engager He deals very little damage too. And he isn't as good at keep out as many other characters. Kazuya is a better 50/50 machine for exemple.
@@Goobster56 Yes she is. -F4 and 3+4 require small microdash into 1+4 or DF3 to pickup the opponent + it's hard to react to - Usual combos requires deep dash FF4 into Deep dash FF2,3 - DF2 FF4 is a very strict timing - FF4 combos require 4 deep dashes - Some Sabaki / parries combos require steps to realign, or while stand moves mid combo - FC Throw combo require precise timing on the FF2,3 right after to make sure the opponent doesn't hit the ground -Some counter hit launchers require dash df3 / dash WS4 to be optimised (UF3 / SS4) -wall stuff can be a bit complicated and need good timing - Her oki needs good reaction time overall - She has alot of mini combos / situation where you need to confirm something She isn't the hardest character in the game for sure. But if you don't do these, she deals way less damage / wall carry. To me, she has alot of moves to use in neutral, set play, and alot of stuff going on in her combos making her, a rather average character in terms of difficulty instead of an easy one.
If someone is purple with yoshi forget knowing how to play tekken they dont know how to play yoshi u don't even need to be good at tekken to be tekken god on yoshi just needs to know how to play yoshi himself...
@@SnakeInTheRain I've seen tekken god yoshis bro put them on any other character they hardstuck blue rank yoshis dont even need to be good at the game just good at the character...not all of them but the one that are good at the game and yoshi are GOD rank already..
@DaniHawkTV stay in the minority. The majority agree he's not higher than B tier. Yes his damage is strong like every other character in tekken 8. He doesn't do any more damage than what someone like kazyua does. Ironically kazyua is stronger than him. Most mishimas were designed to be B tier in normal hands then go up to A tier with people who genuinely knows how to play him. The fact you think combo strings make someone hard or not shows your immature tekken mindset lol.
@@Superfoodcookie i asked him where the execution requirement is and you wrote me a whole essay not answering the question. You haven't formed your own opinion, you're just saying that most people say he's b tier. I know that because heihachi does the most damage of any character and you think it's just okay.
I brought t8, go to practice mode, pick raven, learn his things by watching UA-cam high plays and guides, jump into ranked, telling my self why everyone mashing in blue ranks while am playing more defensive and punishing here and their/ watching replays for mistakes, start to struggle at bushin with match up knowledge more so I start labbing each character more and at that point I felt something is wrong with raven, I feel am doing to much work to carry him, so I switch to a secondary character to see things clearly which is...Raven is shit in this game 💀
I play raven at a low level (purple ranks) and I really think he has some strong tools. His db+3 is kinda slow and can be floated, but it cannot be low paried and is only -12 ob, it is also +5 on hit and opens the opponent to raven's amazing ws mixup pressure and it has similar animation of uf+3, which is a safe laucher, although also slowish and floatable. His combos have great damage and wallcarry, his wall combos are also good imo. His heat is probably not among the best in the game, but I think his pressure on heat is pretty good, especially if you use wr3,4 in heat, which puts you at +7 ob into a very good bt mixup (but I'm not it is unavoidable after a heat engager, I have to test it). Are the other characters really better than him for him to be placed in the lowest tiers in every tier list?
These are great points, but the tier list is about tournament viability. It's mentioned at the start. Raven is arguably more reasonable to fight against, compared to everyone above him. That's all.
Wr most of the time get ss easily , his db3 is reactable if you spam it. His good tools is ws 2 mixed with crouch dashing, his db 2 13i mix up starter and df1 has good tracing but alisa and lili can ss it and yoshi can spin it but would be better if it' 13i Whatever good tools we mention, it's not about him it's about the whole cast doing better.
Bearing in mind the "How effective in tournament" disclaimer. The only thing I'd change about this list, is to put Leo between Feng and Kuma. Maybe shift Lee and Jun anywhere above Reina, into A. That's it. Fair assessment otherwise.
As a long time Law main who switched to Feng recently, (since I can't bring myself to play the dumbdown version of my boy) I think people who said Joka downplaying Feng haven't really try to plays him in higher level. Sure he is strong, but his tools are not as straight forward and efficient like the S-tiers. I think his spot in Joka's list are pretty accurate.
So Kazuya,Steve,Lee, Heihachi are a better character then all the bottom of them?? Yeah nah. Those characters are one of the hardest to play in the game how can they be better lmao
Tbh playing against feng in rank isn’t too bad. And in tournaments he seems to get bullied a lot of the time. It’s not downplaying him. He just ain’t really built for Tekken 8 speed with his tool kit
I don’t understand how high level players describe Feng. They always put him very high, at least A, then always say “but he lacks strength” ??? I guess he’s not dragunov level op but he’s still too strong
Nah, his placement is perfect. He's a very strong character (hence why he's in top 10), but you can't just rely on 5 attacks to win with him like you can with drag and jin. Doesn't have drag's damage and doesn't have yoshi's gimmicks.
TK Lars Vs TG Hwoarang. It's complete fate that Lars loses to hwo and it makes me so mad. The reason I say fate is because LARS's SIDESTEP IS SO SHIT!! It's slow motion and can't even step his own df2 on both sides 🤦.
@@djangotur0910 Hwoarang has every possible tool to counter a move. B1, a whole parry for any punch, a 10 frame launcher, heavy mix up tools, a B3 with insane range that can catch the slightest dash, hell even his orbital is so fast, and Lastly his combo damage is absolutely cracked. It's too much to handle.
@@Fizzy_faizaan ok. B1 is nothing special, -14 on block and easy to make it whiff on a a read. The i10 ch-launcher and mixups are the largest reason I said his heat might be S-tier, but that is heat only. His mixups outside of heat is not all that imo. The fact that you said that B3 ”can catch the slightest dash” makes me believe that you are facing Hwoarangs that do B3 in other ways than as a whiffpunish. In that case, you need to punish that shit. Its highly unsafe. Hwoa is a solid mid tier in my opinion, and many others.
@Fizzy_faizaan his heat turns him into a s tier character but his most of his moves are linear and vulnerable to sidestep and there are cracks in his pressure
Steve in B-Tier and higher than heihachi lee and pretty much the rest below him is crazy. Theres not a single thing that hes better in than 95% of the cast
@@asmallapple1509 no mid homing, got so much shit removed including all ch launchers but b1 which got nerfed to 0 dmg also wall damage gutted, worst punishment in the game got nerfed even more so he wont wallsplat
Steve Main here with multiple characters at Tekken God. Steve is one of the most skewed designs as he is both genuinely strong and genuinely weak. In a Meta like Tekken 8 where you're incentivised to Hit the opponent with strong Mixups Steve does not excel, but in a Meta with improved Sidesteps, Reduced Counter-Hits, and emphasis on Interaction, Steve DOES excel. He's an enigma. In high level Tekken he's still good, but if you can't Box and play "Small Tekken" he is bad. There's no reward and his Mixups don't have the Damage or Range to match other Characters. But in exchange for this, he can't be Stepped in a Game where you're actually allowed to Step. Again, that's a HUGE boon for the Character but that would only come up if you're good enough at the Game that you use Sidestep consistently as an option to beat a Poke. He's good. Solid A Tier IMO. The things he's bad at are punishing in this Meta, but the things he's good at (Small Tekken) he has some of the very best in the entire Game.
@ No she has never been that way in T7 and before. She was fine balance wise. I’ve seen how low she was in usage charts in 7 & and how high she went in 8. No one complained about Nina before T8. You’re just downplaying her since you main her and in fact, we all know you’ll all move to Anna whenever they plan on adding her again just like you did in 7.
@@since2133 Ive mained nina for 10 years buddy i know what im talking about u can ask any other nina main the same thing… yall complain about stuff she already had in previous tekkens.. maybe if you learn the matchup and you wouldn’t be crying so much and i don’t main her anymore i main lee
@@Cutthroat__ you don’t need to try and demean me because I’ve been playing tekken way longer than you since Tekken 3. Nina’s boring ass has better strings now in T8 that are mids, in heat she’s insane… actually I don’t even need to go further with a delusional stan when everyone has Nina in their top 3 list 🤣🤣
This is definitely going to lead to a lot of civil discussion in the Tekken community.
didnt know you had a youtube channel! proud new member of the Joka army ;)
Leo in bottom tier is crazy, the single most underrated char in the game
Unfortunately not, what do you struggle with vs him?
He said at the beggining that every character is tournament viable. Bottom tier in this tier list doesn't mean dogshit, it just means the character is way harder to perform at the same level than the best character. Leo is pretty hard to pilot as his built-in mixups are quite weak. The player needs to be very aware of all Leo's options at all times.
AyoRichie can show you the character is viable as he took some games from great players but he still cannot crack the other players.
@@DapperPopz There's this really strong Leo player at my local who just won a stacked tournament last weekend. Clearly such a busted character...hahaha I'm just kidding. Congrats on the big W!
People will forever struggle with the idea that some chars must be bottom tier in a tier list even if all are competitively viable.
As a leo main. I disagree. I a quite playing asuke to play leo because he has better options and is easier to play in my opinion, and I'm god of destruction now.
Awesome tierlist, JoKa 🤠👍🏼
Great list, thanks chief.
This is a really good solid tier list. I wasn’t expecting to be in close agreement. I’m glad you gave Jin in top 5 and have Law right outside of top 5. I used to get so much blowback from people when I was claiming they were top tier.
Zafina and Azucena are much more fun when you see tekken through a dancing rhythm game lense.
Also drag and Yoshi they can dance and fun🙂
@@davbro9120 yeah but people are tier-wh*res, they just pick characters that they can win easier with, many fighting game players are just lowly egoists, no skill, no talent, no style😴
Azucena is super fun to watch with her dodges, feints and taunts.
Grest work making this 👍🏼
Great tier list bro
Just remember guys tierlist doesn't apply to average ranked experience, where u can beat someone to death with knowledge checks or skill
This is definitely the most solid tier list I have seen on this game so far
Lmao, hard disagree. There are a few things that I just don’t buy. Kuma being a top 10 character is a hot take. Leo being below Lars is also strange (albeit only by one) Leo is literally a better Lars in every aspect. Leo being that low in general is odd
@@chyeaimawesome2089 curious, what makes leo the better lars?
@@YAGB Leo has been downplayed since T7 lmao. She has better CH utility than Lars, better lows, better frames and better stance with FO BU literally being a discount AoP. Her wall carry is almost as good as Lars too. Much of Lars whole kit is fake pressure and gimmicky. Leo's whole kit is legitimate and should be respected
@@chyeaimawesome2089 what counter hit utility has leo? Fastest mid CH of leo is d2 and that move is like 21 frames or am i missing something?
Its still great because its + on block, forces duck and fast enough@@cosmedcarton
Good tier list. Thanks, Joka.
As a Azucena main, I agree with your thoughts. Really happy you’re considering picking her up 👌
I have literally been at your stream when you said and I quote "LAW is not very good, imo" end quote...
Yoshi gets to keep his multipurpose 1,1 and all his other BS, but Azucena's 1,1 and 2,1 was too strong. There's definitely a Yoshi main on the balance team that keeps him under the radar
I agree with you. Azucena needs to have her 1,1 or 1,2 a bit more safe. Or at least -10 if we are being generous given it's high-mid and high-high that doesn't do anything for her on block.
1,1 being unsafe makes sense but the 2,1 nerf was always unnecessary. Hopefully they undo it eventually. Make it -3 again.
Yoshi has lost a lot on tools that were actually better in t7, people just hate on him bcs flash destroys the flowcharts and plusframes.
Why would azucena need a yoshi 1,1? Yoshi is low tier since forever and one of the few chars on since t1 every game. F that generic dancing coffeehoe. Her design and concept is bottomtier, so should be her gameplay..
Please 11:28 show an instance. I legit want to know when you can step this move because im getting annihilated by it. Kills my momentum.
Been playing leo since late tag2 and messing ppl up at locals, he/she/it has everything along with an extreme rulebreaking low in df2+3 (highcrush + plus on hit + "unreactable" + only -12 + ch launcher, most good lows only have 2 or maybe 3 of those or you end up with jin d2) and that still isnt enough to compete because in t8 being very good and well rounded is no longer enough.
She. No woke sh8.
I wonder why would Kuma be "controversal" to be on top, the character literally have the size of the screen but has evasiveness for some reason, he is immune to lows, his damage is absurdly above normal, his wall combo still broken and "Electric Wind Bear Fist" is the most obnoxious move in the game.
1 launcher = you lost a round.
I know this is old now but Steve and Hworang should be in A tier.
In your opinion, why does everyone say that Yoshimitsu is broken but he hasn't won any important competition yet?
most accurate tierlist so far
For the most part, this is a much better tier list. I would argue Feng could be moved up a bit but he's definitely not top 3. King is in a good spot too, he's strong but not top 3-5 like some people think, especially after his nerfs. Unlike the other strong and top tiers, he has a lot of weaknesses. Law was being downplayed for a while too in the beginning of Tekken.
Zafina has no good lows, no good pokes, no 15f launcher, bad punish, bad damage, 26f powercrush -14 on black, bad heat game, The only character that does not recover health and takes damage when attacking, etc. All this makes Zafina bad in tournaments and bad in any format. It's really hard to play with her, In Tekken 7 she had defensive tools, but now she doesn't.
Shadow just beat Knee and Ulsan with this twisty demon. She at least a lil busted.
Doesn't jun lose health to?
Also her heat isn't that bad like armor on Azazel moves to spam it twice and do o chip damage ... Thinking about that you only do it 2-3 times... Ok it's bad.
@@SOAP2401 Shadow doing hard work not the character.
@@SOAP2401like you remember eddy,master raven and noctis from t7 and how they reached the finals while the top 3 of t7 tirelist are feng akuma and zafina
d3 counter hit launching isn't a good low? plus on block power crushes in heat isn't good? Slower powercrushes mean less chance for it to trade hits after armor frames. What do you mean she doesn't recover health like everyone else??? Azazel moves leave her grey health.
List seems pretty solid, I did think Lily and Xioyou would be higher but in a tournament setting it’s very different compared to casual. The top 5 seems accurate, maybe Yoshi could be higher than Nina depending on the players using him but overall well explained and seemed mostly non biased which is rare in tier lists tbh 😂
Solid list. I’m starting to think yoshi could be top 1 or top 2 though
The 'good' asuka 50 50 is defeated by pressing back only one time, no need to kbd.
Finally someone that says victor over bryan even if it isnt by much the upsurge of overrating him is insane some people have him in the top row with law like what??bryans dmg is the only thing that even has him so high getting counter hit by moves with a linear 22 frames start up is going to hurt alot with most characters...
I never understood how people put Kuma at b tier, he’s so obviously brain dead in this game, I feel like most people are just stuck in T7 when it comes to certain characters.
How do you lose to kuma
Let's GOOOOOO JoKa's Jun ?? I must be dreaming 🤩
great feng up-play boss 👍
Nino hearing he plays a top 10 character be like. BOAH GEIL EY
Eddy's weakness: No I13 engager, a lot of tools lack tracking, His WS 2 is still fucked up, He has a hard time approaching, he doesn't cashout his advantages as much as majority of the cast, and his 50/50 puts him more of a risk than his OP, so you have to rely more on negativa into 1+2 or delayed 4 and if you trying to go into handstand you either have to by punish with 2,3 or full crouch DF 4 or you just gonna get punched out of it.
What is Laws B212?
@@xJoKa you mean back 122?
Was meant to say B122 😅
I honestly feel like they should make every character on the level of lidia. She's very aggressive but she can only access that aggressiveness through a certain point.
I'd put Jun, Jack and Leo a tier higher but I think that's it. Great tierlist.
Why is Asuka C tier exactly? You only listed her strenghts. I know she is an high risk character and quite linear, but what are your opinions?
The goat
Why I can feel the Jin main community malding right now after this video?
Good
Nah we really don’t care no point In Explaining further
Drag, Nina, Yoshi, Alisa, Feng in top 5 in no perticular order. Law Shaheen King Jin Claudio top 10 in not perticular order. End of discussion
Pakistan Steve haven't won any international tournaments
I play jack because hes fun af, im proud to be raijin so far with him, everyone using op characters like scrubs😂
In the video he said everyone was strong and tourney viable. No1 is OP
@ i watched the video parrot, some are op imo
@@heroicsquirrel3195 nah you're just ass
Bro u don’t get a badge of honor for getting to blue using a character in which no knows the matchup. If anything u got to raijin BECAUSE ur playing Jack
@@heroicsquirrel3195 Jack carried you man, sorry to say. You just need a reality check.
Pretty based, but first three characters still stronger than other chars in s, they all can be possibly top 1 and I can't say so about Alisa or Jin
Ling placement/reasoning is perfect.
I’d put Bryan ahead of Law in A tier, that character is so insanely strong
Nah law go stances= more 50/50 ws 4 11i plus frames into stance is the fastest way to mixups in the game.
Yeah right, put law next to Jin
Not true, Bryan requires a good neutral and core Tekken, he is right there.
stop mashing
Law is better than Jin, Law is perfect
The reason most people dont talk about muscle armor is because he doesnt have a backdash.
I think king is a solid A teir character but his oki is overally weakened due to recent patches.
But he has clear counter play to him due to being a linier character and his wavedash acts like he is a standing character which is a nerf.
Whats the importance on df1? Genuine question
fair list. though I think it's a little ft2 bias. Bryan under Kuma and Victor surprised me a bit.
He straight up said this is a first to 2 tier list at the very beginning of the video lmao
Victor is better than Bryan :)
Kuma is definitely stronger than bryan and victor lol
@@kevinsyz1201 lol no, Victor is _way_ better than Kuma, you're capping. Victor can actually play neutral, and his stances are still a nightmare to fight against.
Same Bryan is way better than Kuma and Victor
Yeah, I totally get why you put leroy here. He's not really played that much in this game, and he's very sub par gameplay wise. His best tools in neutral are b4, db3, and ff22. And all of which are risky and committal. If he's given better moves in neutral that can be threatening or at least safe, and cane turns into a once per round move instead
4:55 great movement but she’s very stubby. She needs the movement
Yoshi is third because yoshi players can't win jack. If top players were running around playing yoshi and dragunov wasnt winning jack then yoshi would be considered #1
Arslan did start trying Yoshi in tournaments and he got knocked out of it. Yoshi is a great tournament character but he's not a pick up and play tournament character like drag
That is the dumbest logic ever. You can say that about any single character in the game if they were winning tournaments they would be higher. Why aren't they winning tournaments though? Probably because the character isn't as good as you think he is just because you get slaughtered by him and have no idea about the matchup doesn't mean he's top 3. Are you going to claim that Kaneandtrench and Eyemusician etc are bad at Yoshi and that's why they can't win anything? You people that say this are so delusional. Arlsan tried for months now.
@Phoenix-uy6dy thanks for the laugh.
@@vinjingainer Keep arguing with numbers.
how many times has yoshi been in top 8.
How can Leo be overrated? no one talks about him and no one plays him.
But when people do talk about him they always praise him and say he's great... yet no one plays him.
@AbdullahMikalRodriguez can't really say I've seen these conversations.
Outside of calling him overrated I agree with mostly everything else. Leo is really middle of the road, answer for most situations but none of them anything to write home about.
@User.665 I would agree with that. I dont think he was saying Leo is low tier just that he's praised more than he should be. I would agree with middle of the road.
@@AbdullahMikalRodriguez yeah he's not but I personally don't see him being mentioned at all. I can count the amount of Leo's I've played since launch on one hand
@@AbdullahMikalRodriguezher
What's the song that plays during Nina's placement? It goes kinda hard.
9:57 By where you placed him, you were not joking.
Whats the music at the beginning
Tekken 6 Arisa, one of my favorite Tekken tracks 🤙
It’s ok I want people to think Leo a bad character C tier fine 😏 hopefully get some buffs lol
As long as Tier Lists gonna be set based on individuals knowledge, they will shift. Which means they wont be accurate. They are fun, and good for "clicks" but nothing more, and thats how people should take them, but they dont. The only method to set up accurate Tier List is by Official Tournament character placement. Everything else is subjective.
“Respect to all the kazuya players, for sure”.
Hey, much love brother. Respect to all the heihachi players like yourself 🤘🖤
I disagree with Heihachi being so low based solely on his mongo damage. Bro feels like I’m fighting a boss character.
What's the name of the song when he reviews eddy
Sadly I have no clue, hopefully one of the boys will enlighten us someday soon 😂
if panda is D tier why i lost vs him everytime xDDDDD
What's crazy is that Zafina's B1+2 locked behind stance is just as punishable as it was in Tekken 7. It still baffles me why they thought it was a neccessary change.
They wanna eliminate certain playstyles, and back dashing all day and poking with B1+2 is one of them
@Blackfist030 this is not true because some characters still have crazy movement that carried over from Tekken 7 like Lili, like Alisa, Like Asuka... they just nerfed Zafina's movement and improved others for the most part. And other characters have long reaching lows. Like imagine removing Feng's DB3 and the commotion that would cause? You're point fails to land.
@brentthompson1607 ....it doesn't fail at all, the game literally shows you, wtf are you even talking about?....and fengs db3 is launch punishable, and he never had zafina movement, and the others you named don't have long reaching lows, your point failed to land, again....they wanted to remove back Dash all day and b1+2 style, that's how everyone outside of shadow played her, and that's why you want the move back, and that's why everyone who played her in 7 dropped her except shadow
@@Blackfist030 in your original reply, you said they got rid of b1+2 to get rid of that "playstyle" and I am telling you that is not true. You literally have Dragunov and Nina as prime examples of crazy movement with crazy pokes. And many more characters are like that. I'm telling you that the removal of B1+2 was solely to nerf Zafina and you have not provided any valid counter.
@@brentthompson1607 ......are you just arguing to argue? We're talking about her running away all day and spamming b1+2, a long range low, you keep naming other characters that have nothing to do with what we're talking about, they took it away, that's why it ain't in the game, because they didn't want that....the game itself is your proof, I don't know what else to tell you dude
Saying hwoarang doesn’t have good panic tools when he has b1 is crazy
That’s a terrible move lol doesn’t give any real advantage on hit and if it gets blocked which most good players block it it’s hella punishable
In my opinion take away yoshimitsu's damage and a little wall carry and he would basically just be t7 yoshi with a slightly bigger hitbox on nss flash. Do that and yoshi would drop to low mid to bottom tier as other than the characteristics above he hasnt really changed from t7.
cousins furniture getting all this free advertisement
Man I can't believe I've been playing nina for so long in the past she is always placed in the bottom tier and now iam starting to get embarrassed playing my main like nah, in the past people keep calling her a hard character and always at the mid to bottom tier but now it's embarrassing😅 but iam glad she found her place, and that's the reason i only keep playing asuka now
Im a Asuka Main and you mentioned like 10 good things about her but literally no reason why she is in C Tier and not higher 😅
My main being bottom 2 makes me feel valid that all match ups are BS and I can complain whenever I lose 🤣
Yup Buff Lars
#BuffLars
Nope they need to stop buffing braindead characters and he’s definitely one of the most ones he gets buffed every patch
@@Cutthroat__ how is lars braindead
Nobody is weak. Its more about who has more gimmicky stuff than others
To this logic, DVJ would be top tier then
Zafina and raven should be S then
nobody is weak but some character are stronger than the others
blue rank talk
@ecoterrorism_liker7251 *tekken emp
who had "Kuma top 10" on their Tekken 8 bingo card
If you wanna understand what Leroy is just imagine feng but worse in every conceivable way
Small critique. Start low to high instead of high to low
Super talented guy
Great tierlist,
whats the ost tho
The downplay for hei is insane
I think Asuka is better then Jun because her Heat allow crazy mindless offense with strong 50/50. She also has better stepping game the jun. But I think she has harder execution then Jun.
About Eddy, Eddy is really bugged right now, you should watch Jeondding replays / his last twit.
Also his 50/50 aren't that great in the end.
Hit ff3
- have a hell sweep that gives no oki and a bad install, doesn't clean hit on backdash or small legs.
- his mids that all lose to power crushes, parries or anything that is active around frame 8. Reward is heat engager
He deals very little damage too. And he isn't as good at keep out as many other characters. Kazuya is a better 50/50 machine for exemple.
Asuka is not harder execution than Jun stop it
@@Goobster56 Yes she is.
-F4 and 3+4 require small microdash into 1+4 or DF3 to pickup the opponent + it's hard to react to
- Usual combos requires deep dash FF4 into Deep dash FF2,3
- DF2 FF4 is a very strict timing
- FF4 combos require 4 deep dashes
- Some Sabaki / parries combos require steps to realign, or while stand moves mid combo
- FC Throw combo require precise timing on the FF2,3 right after to make sure the opponent doesn't hit the ground
-Some counter hit launchers require dash df3 / dash WS4 to be optimised (UF3 / SS4)
-wall stuff can be a bit complicated and need good timing
- Her oki needs good reaction time overall
- She has alot of mini combos / situation where you need to confirm something
She isn't the hardest character in the game for sure. But if you don't do these, she deals way less damage / wall carry.
To me, she has alot of moves to use in neutral, set play, and alot of stuff going on in her combos making her, a rather average character in terms of difficulty instead of an easy one.
Imo Leo is so strong, ppl need to realize that
Leo has high combo damage. The problem is that his tracking is subpar.
nbdy gvs afk
Playing neutral against Leo is so aggravating.. i agree
Casuals who cant defend against the most basic Feng "DOWNPLAYED OMG HES S-TIER TOP 1 OH MAI GAWDDDDD!!!!!!!" 😂😂😂😂😂😂
The purple rank Yoshi and Alisa mains in this comment section are wilding lmao
If someone is purple with yoshi forget knowing how to play tekken they dont know how to play yoshi u don't even need to be good at tekken to be tekken god on yoshi just needs to know how to play yoshi himself...
@@lestonclark2398well that's just not true lol
@@SnakeInTheRain I've seen tekken god yoshis bro put them on any other character they hardstuck blue rank yoshis dont even need to be good at the game just good at the character...not all of them but the one that are good at the game and yoshi are GOD rank already..
Heihachi in B🤣
If this guy played drag he would put him in c tier 🤣
Heihachi is another character that has high combo damage, but subpar tracking and steep execution requirements.
@@marcusjones9084 steep? Does he even have one hard move/combo?
@DaniHawkTV stay in the minority. The majority agree he's not higher than B tier. Yes his damage is strong like every other character in tekken 8. He doesn't do any more damage than what someone like kazyua does. Ironically kazyua is stronger than him. Most mishimas were designed to be B tier in normal hands then go up to A tier with people who genuinely knows how to play him. The fact you think combo strings make someone hard or not shows your immature tekken mindset lol.
@@Superfoodcookieexactly hei is definitely b tier easily
@@Superfoodcookie i asked him where the execution requirement is and you wrote me a whole essay not answering the question. You haven't formed your own opinion, you're just saying that most people say he's b tier. I know that because heihachi does the most damage of any character and you think it's just okay.
why panda???
Being a Raven main since Tekken 5, yes, that is the correct place for Raven in T8 (Season 1).
I brought t8, go to practice mode, pick raven, learn his things by watching UA-cam high plays and guides, jump into ranked, telling my self why everyone mashing in blue ranks while am playing more defensive and punishing here and their/ watching replays for mistakes, start to struggle at bushin with match up knowledge more so I start labbing each character more and at that point I felt something is wrong with raven, I feel am doing to much work to carry him, so I switch to a secondary character to see things clearly which is...Raven is shit in this game 💀
@jokrwx3 mad respect man... I feel you, bro.
@@jokrwx3 if you think Raven is shit you gotta do more practice bro
That's the thing, you need to carry the charchter, Also when the last time you heared about pinya?
@@swagdaws8824
I play raven at a low level (purple ranks) and I really think he has some strong tools.
His db+3 is kinda slow and can be floated, but it cannot be low paried and is only -12 ob, it is also +5 on hit and opens the opponent to raven's amazing ws mixup pressure and it has similar animation of uf+3, which is a safe laucher, although also slowish and floatable.
His combos have great damage and wallcarry, his wall combos are also good imo.
His heat is probably not among the best in the game, but I think his pressure on heat is pretty good, especially if you use wr3,4 in heat, which puts you at +7 ob into a very good bt mixup (but I'm not it is unavoidable after a heat engager, I have to test it).
Are the other characters really better than him for him to be placed in the lowest tiers in every tier list?
Yes
These are great points, but the tier list is about tournament viability. It's mentioned at the start.
Raven is arguably more reasonable to fight against, compared to everyone above him.
That's all.
Let’s give Raven some buffs, he needs it 👍
I play raven and if raven was tekken 8 gigs buffed his clones in heat would be plus
Wr most of the time get ss easily , his db3 is reactable if you spam it. His good tools is ws 2 mixed with crouch dashing, his db 2 13i mix up starter and df1 has good tracing but alisa and lili can ss it and yoshi can spin it but would be better if it' 13i
Whatever good tools we mention, it's not about him it's about the whole cast doing better.
Bearing in mind the "How effective in tournament" disclaimer.
The only thing I'd change about this list, is to put Leo between Feng and Kuma.
Maybe shift Lee and Jun anywhere above Reina, into A.
That's it. Fair assessment otherwise.
As a long time Law main who switched to Feng recently, (since I can't bring myself to play the dumbdown version of my boy) I think people who said Joka downplaying Feng haven't really try to plays him in higher level. Sure he is strong, but his tools are not as straight forward and efficient like the S-tiers. I think his spot in Joka's list are pretty accurate.
People forget that the top 10 characters is not that far apart from eachother its just the top 5 are busted over the top and need to be toned down...
feng S tier and Leo at least B Tier then its perfect
So Kazuya,Steve,Lee, Heihachi are a better character then all the bottom of them?? Yeah nah. Those characters are one of the hardest to play in the game how can they be better lmao
Saying jun has great lows is wild but ight
Leo is my nightmare. I cant punish him 😂
So Dragunov gets nerfed like 2 times and he's still #1? Wtf is bamco doing, lmao.
Good stuff calling out Shaheen's tracking. df1 and d3 being almost homing is incredibly silly and makes some matchups feel borderline unfair.
The feng downplay is real
Nah, its absolutely fine to have him outside of top 5.
Tbh playing against feng in rank isn’t too bad. And in tournaments he seems to get bullied a lot of the time. It’s not downplaying him. He just ain’t really built for Tekken 8 speed with his tool kit
He's not top 5
I don’t understand how high level players describe Feng. They always put him very high, at least A, then always say “but he lacks strength” ??? I guess he’s not dragunov level op but he’s still too strong
Nah, his placement is perfect. He's a very strong character (hence why he's in top 10), but you can't just rely on 5 attacks to win with him like you can with drag and jin. Doesn't have drag's damage and doesn't have yoshi's gimmicks.
Interesting basically
Hwoarang is an undercover S tier robber. With the amount of broken shit I've seen from him, I'm actually SHOCKED that he ain't been nerfed.
TK Lars Vs TG Hwoarang. It's complete fate that Lars loses to hwo and it makes me so mad. The reason I say fate is because LARS's SIDESTEP IS SO SHIT!! It's slow motion and can't even step his own df2 on both sides 🤦.
His heat might be S-tier. But I dont think the character as a whole is S-tier. Why do you think so?
@@djangotur0910 Hwoarang has every possible tool to counter a move. B1, a whole parry for any punch, a 10 frame launcher, heavy mix up tools, a B3 with insane range that can catch the slightest dash, hell even his orbital is so fast, and Lastly his combo damage is absolutely cracked.
It's too much to handle.
@@Fizzy_faizaan ok. B1 is nothing special, -14 on block and easy to make it whiff on a a read. The i10 ch-launcher and mixups are the largest reason I said his heat might be S-tier, but that is heat only. His mixups outside of heat is not all that imo.
The fact that you said that B3 ”can catch the slightest dash” makes me believe that you are facing Hwoarangs that do B3 in other ways than as a whiffpunish. In that case, you need to punish that shit. Its highly unsafe.
Hwoa is a solid mid tier in my opinion, and many others.
@Fizzy_faizaan his heat turns him into a s tier character but his most of his moves are linear and vulnerable to sidestep and there are cracks in his pressure
Steve in B-Tier and higher than heihachi lee and pretty much the rest below him is crazy. Theres not a single thing that hes better in than 95% of the cast
steve main here ofc
One of the strongest generics in the game??? Forces opponent to play small which he has an advantage in???
Cope 😂
@@asmallapple1509 no mid homing, got so much shit removed including all ch launchers but b1 which got nerfed to 0 dmg also wall damage gutted, worst punishment in the game got nerfed even more so he wont wallsplat
Steve Main here with multiple characters at Tekken God. Steve is one of the most skewed designs as he is both genuinely strong and genuinely weak. In a Meta like Tekken 8 where you're incentivised to Hit the opponent with strong Mixups Steve does not excel, but in a Meta with improved Sidesteps, Reduced Counter-Hits, and emphasis on Interaction, Steve DOES excel.
He's an enigma. In high level Tekken he's still good, but if you can't Box and play "Small Tekken" he is bad. There's no reward and his Mixups don't have the Damage or Range to match other Characters. But in exchange for this, he can't be Stepped in a Game where you're actually allowed to Step. Again, that's a HUGE boon for the Character but that would only come up if you're good enough at the Game that you use Sidestep consistently as an option to beat a Poke.
He's good. Solid A Tier IMO. The things he's bad at are punishing in this Meta, but the things he's good at (Small Tekken) he has some of the very best in the entire Game.
Nah Steve is broke in this game imo if you have strong fundamentals
No one likes Nina as a character in general. Devs thought making her busted would change our feelings towards her but it got worse.
Us nina mains don’t care what yall think bruh i promise you.. she always been that way
@ No she has never been that way in T7 and before. She was fine balance wise. I’ve seen how low she was in usage charts in 7 & and how high she went in 8. No one complained about Nina before T8. You’re just downplaying her since you main her and in fact, we all know you’ll all move to Anna whenever they plan on adding her again just like you did in 7.
@@since2133 Ive mained nina for 10 years buddy i know what im talking about u can ask any other nina main the same thing… yall complain about stuff she already had in previous tekkens.. maybe if you learn the matchup and you wouldn’t be crying so much and i don’t main her anymore i main lee
@@since2133 since you wanna assume everything ill assume you don’t know the matchup kid and other nina’s smoke you lol i would be mad too
@@Cutthroat__ you don’t need to try and demean me because I’ve been playing tekken way longer than you since Tekken 3. Nina’s boring ass has better strings now in T8 that are mids, in heat she’s insane… actually I don’t even need to go further with a delusional stan when everyone has Nina in their top 3 list 🤣🤣
46:20 Yes Joka, BUFF LEROY PLEASE