Empire of the Grey King - Secret PreHistory of the Ironborn - Song of Ice and Fire - Game of Thrones
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- Опубліковано 27 лис 2023
- Prepare for an all new conception of how the Ironborn nation came into being! I’ve discovered some truly incredible Ironborn worldbuilding secrets - yes, new ones, and even more incredibler. @GreyWasteTim joins me to help explain the Great Empire of the Dawn connections to the Ironborn in this video, with more to come this week! And yes if you are looking for the stream that disappeared from last Sunday, this is part one of the edited version.
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Title image uses "Grey King - The Building of Nagga's Longhall" by Alex Mcclelland - Розваги
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This why i like your channel so much over the others ASOIAF channels. They focus too much on the Targaryen family and Valyria, while GRRM created such an amazing mythology for his world. And you David and Tim make the best Ironborn content. I missed the livestream and stupid UA-cam take it down, so thank you David for putting the content for us anyway. What is dead may never died... 🦑
i agree - Valyria is pretty cool! but the deep (haha) lore that GRRM has invented for ALL the peoples of his world is also cool! (and tbh dragons have never interested me nearly as much as the Dawn Age-type pre-history in ANY given fantasy world, i think that stuff is so cool)
George doesn't even talk about his own mythology
really loving all the ironborn stuff. i never truly appreciated ironborn mythology and symbolism before. always learning something new on this channel and that's what makes it so educational but also refreshing. thanks for all your hard work and dedication. it does not go unnoticed and we really do appreciate it. keep up the great work!
This sentiment must be seconded immediately.
Also Thirded!!!!😊😊😊😊
and fourth'd!
I never liked the ironborn chapters because of the weird accents in the audiobook (rip Roy Detrice, still amazing narrator). It is hard to take seriously when Euron and Vic sound like bad remix Steve Irwin 😅🐊🦑
Samsies!
@@Okcucumber I completely agree, I could never get into audiobooks because of that! I could never find a narrator that I actually could stand their voice for a little bit
The layers of different cultures arriving over time puts me in mind of the Irish Book Of Invasions, with the Fomorians, Fir Bolg, Tuatha de Danann and Milesians overlaying each other.
It's a good day when David uploads
Best Content on UA-cam by a Westerosi Mile!!!
What clever parallels you have found concerning Yi Ti and Leng! I absolutely love how Martin manages to weave in terrifying depths of the Cthulhu Mythos, but manages to do it in such a way that you think it is safely parcelled away in the obvious references amongst islanders who worship The Drowned God... but it then emerges in other places where you thought you were safe (or just had to deal with skinchangers, dragons, and white walkers!) disguised as something which appears as a cognate for tree-worshipping, nature-loving paganism, green-fingered farmer-kings, tree-castles that move, and dryads! I think I also hate him a little bit for the same reason - because it makes me start to suspect that there is actually no hope for the poor people of Planetos! :-)
This smart poster said this a pre floods Earth or the Ice Ages ended way several thousand years early. So before this Earth there 7 types Hominid Humans around Earth.
glad you were able to take this unfortunate incident as an opportunity to create an awesome series. i have a feeling this series will be legendary
I like rewatching the long streams. I find paying attention to David in the first and then the Chat second time round makes David's streams even more beneficial on a historical/lore/knowledge basis... helping to further breakdown hidden histories, mysteries, motives and clues!
I do the opposite! Can’t resist the chat 😂 then rewatch and pay attention later
@@Okcucumber hahaa... yeh, it's either either... vise versa for me if something grabs my attention in the chat...
@@Okcucumber That's one of the best things about LmL's streams as well... how he embeds the chat into his videos. 99.9% of other creators don't do it and if they did... I think it would boost their numbers in views and subscribers. They go hand in hand and it's frustrating watching a Livestream on the rewatch when a creator keeps answering the chat without reading out what the question was or the comment... you're left not knowing what they're talking about until they move on from that.
@@kirstyangel1452Yeah good point! Makes it feel like we're all collaborating on the streams!
@@Okcucumber yeh, you're right...😉
I was 20 mins into the stream when it was taken down yesterday, such a bummer cause I was *hooked* . I'm so excited for this upload! And almost one hour of finest Ironborn content! This is def one of my favourite series you ever did, LET'S GO!
I was 20 minutes from the end 😅
@@JuanThunder79 oh no, that's worse! But know you can enjoy the whole thing again to hype you up for the great finale, so... yay?😅
Not to not pick, but interestingly, the Indigenous Australians were trading with Indonesians for a significant period - in fact when the British first encountered Aboriginals in the north of the country, they already possessed rifles!
Lie
I really like tim's points about the "jar" and "har" naming scheme as well as the parallels between the gemstone emperors and their less vibrant color coded yitish counterparts. One thing that I want to add that I said during stream is that iron replacing bronze was less a product of iron being that much better for weapons/tools, but rather that it was easier to come by. In the real world, bronze required access to trade routes into what is now afghanistan, and im sure that GRRM has an analogous trade route in his own worlds history.
Jamie referred to Ned's eyes as "cold, and grey, and full of judgment"
The history and mythology of the Ironborn are another of example of how GRRM understands human civilization and even some Earth history. He understands that if there are volcanoes around, there may be metals deposits nearby, like the gold and silver in Valyria. Since the Iron Islands only have Iron, and not other metals, it proves Moon Meteors also hit the Iron Islands.
good point. we don't here about basalt or obsidian or anything like that either
Great channel, great content! I’m very happy that you put in the work to ensure we get the content despite the UA-cam restrictions. Hoping for more lovecraftian related content!!
Great stream, now Ironborn week!
Ironborn week, praise the Squisher kings!
There was so much good stuff in this stream man, I loved it. I’m honestly super excited to rewatch all of this and fully absorb it.
Same!
The Lengi being incredibly tall and strong mariners who live on an island and are pretty terrible (the Lengi used to sacrifice all of the foreigners at the word of the Old Ones) gives me really strong Numenorian vibes (the Numenorians became brutal colonizers and by the end they sacrificed people on Sauron's word)
Also if the "Pearl Palanquin=Pearl Throne=Pearl Thrown=Moon Meteor" detail was an intentional addition by George, that is an absolutely insane attention to symbolic detail
I don't want to keep making additions to my comment but Good Garth, the idea that Garth the Green is related to the Grey King or the Jade Emperors of the GEotD, this whole video is such a "mind-blown" moment. Absolutely loving your content lately, especially since I'm currently taking Ancient World, Intro to Anthropology, and Intro to Archaeology classes in college right now and learning this kind of esoteric/ancient knowledge makes me feel the same as learning about Göbekli Tepe, Çatalhoyuk, and Jericho
Thanks for doing this David! Couldn’t catch the live and was bummed it was taken down.
Every week Dave you get better and better which is truly astonishing!!
Loved the live stream! Keep up the great work... Cause I'm addicted 😅
Love your stuff! So glad you didn’t let UA-cam just take the monetization! Great solution!
I appreciate the condensed versions ofnthe streams, its hard to always have the time to watch but i can keep comin back to them this way
So happy I got to watch it live! But still gonna watch all 4 vids anyway! It was such a great stream! ❤😊❤😊
Missed this live but now I'll enjoy it all week at work
I was there for this live a few days ago and now I'm listening to it again. So much fun, as I always say two great minds doing a great deep dive. Looking forward to the next one.
You weren't being shown in my feed all the sudden you are again. The UA-cam overlords must approve of you breaking into chunks. I like both. Keep up the great work!
So mad I missed the Livestream- that's what I get for hitting play next in queue instead of just PLAY!!!
Totally pumped for Ironborn Week
Love this duo, thanks guys!
Love the haircut! I’m thinking of growing mine out as well.
Yes! I was beginning to suffer from Ironborn history withdrawal
fear not
The suffix part was so slick! Well done!!!
Thrilled to the gills for iron born week ❤🎉❤
This was a great live stream! ❤ I was rewatching when it was taken down. There are so many rabbit holes in this one.
Thanks for condensing it, 4+ hours is a lot to watch in one go
IRONBORN WEEEKKKKK!!!
i was in and out during the live steam, excited to catch what i missed
Something I find very interesting is that almost all ancient cultures have stories of these levels of civilization. People have always known the world was immensely old
Can’t believe the one time!! I don’t immediately watch the livestream, it gets taken down 😂😂
Loved this though🎉
I love your work, David, but when you work together with Tim, you two take it to another level! Thank you.
I really enjoyed the marathon LIVESTREAM with David & Tim, but it’s nice to have quickie too! Thanks
Cheers! For having this wonderful channel 🎉🎉🎉🎉
Just engagin’ with the content here, Barnes.
Now I get to watch the stream again, except this time I get the all artistic eye candy. Cool.
I'm just reposting here because the last video was removed. I came across an interesting phenomenon called a "water hammer". It's common in closed pipe systems. It can cause explosions and loud cracking noises. It's confirmed in the Arianne chapter, that Dorne has tunnels used by the children. I'm wondering if the underground tunnels were used to cause the "Hammer of the Waters". The name itself is similar enough. Idk, I'm still new to all the lore and this might be super far-fetched. Could also explain the drowned "watery halls". Love your videos!
Happy ironborn week everybody 🎉
What an opening, got me excited. I'm stopping this 15 seconds in to catch up on yesterday. I'll be back in 4 hours or so 😛
Update: should've waited a little longer before commenting and searching 😂
I was just thinking about the Grey King earlier so this is amazingly timed
Thankyou for your pre-video introduction explaining what happened to your livestream - I had to work and was so excited to watch it on my day off (today) and thought I'd gone crazy being unable to find it!
Only saw a small piece of the livestream, but really appreciate this thorough exploration of ironborn culture, fascinating!
The fact that the first Emperor after the Long Winter is named Pearl, which is the gemstone most associated with the moon, underlines the new, greater importance of the now lonely moon. We’re in a new era and the most visible sign of that is the lonely Pearl in the night time sky - it’s the most epic and appropriate name for your dynasty trying to stamp authority over the remains of the GEOTD. It also works as a threat against potential rivals: I control the remaining moon and disobey me and I’ll wreak havoc and destruction and bring forth a new Long Winter.
love it
Yay! This was an awesome stream. I caught the end live. I’m glad you were able to edit and repost, you deserve every penny of the monetization. Can’t wait to see the next parts when they’re ready.
thank you for reposting this! i’m enjoying it just as much and i feel like i am picking up more than i did while watching it live! thank you for all content dave!!
Regret missing the livestream, but this was really interesting.
Gimme the good stuff!
Thanks for the extra efforts in the video! Glad for another great discussion with you and GWT!
Thanks for that video ! It was awesome
honestly, i‘m not even upset. the content of the stream was so interesting, i‘m happy to watch it a second time. and the extra editing is soo awesome! thank you ♥️
Yay!! New video.
Great work! Thanks for all the content LML!
I’m glad this is back, I was about 3/4 of the way through the replay and it died. I was hoping it would come back. What I saw was awesome! I’m looking forward to this.
Great as always, thanks for your content!
Thanks David.
I’ve been catching up on your Meteorite Theory videos lately. I recently learned that ‘Meteors’ are made from remnants of Super Nova explosions and they are born and travel through the Icy depths of Space.
They are actually born of Ice and Fire.
Fascinating.
Nice one Dave & Tim. To be honest, I kinda prefer this format of shorter, bite-sized videos than multi-hour marathons. I can usuallly fit an hour-long video in soon after it goes up, but three or four hours livestreams may have to wait weeks for a slot, and I can't watch them live (in the UK & no TV licence).
Aye I wasnt expecting a vid today !!! Thanks man
Excellent job thank you
Waaaah!!! Soooo good 🤯👏👏👏 it always amazes me how much stuff u guys r able to uncover! It shows how good u r and how good George's writing is... so many layers upon layers to unpack 🤯
Love you and Grey Waste Tim.
I love the Ironborn focus. Keep at it and hope you're well!
Thank you David and Tim. Amazing work.
George is just amazing
I listen to your videos every morning when I’m working and as always I am stunned to see just how much thought and work GRRM has put into his ASOIAF series. You’re doing an amazing job, thank you!
Beautiful!
Sucks youtube is insane with the demonetization these days. This was one of your best streams maybe ever.
It was truly a sick stream it was awesome - and long - and omg I just said that out loud in my mind and it sounds funny 😁 but still posting this
Dope video as always but fwiw i like your essay style videos over convos like these, even outlined/structured ones. They're just more interesting to follow, but then I did grow up in the pre-podcast era
Excellent video!! All the work put into it really does show!! The Mad King one was a masterpiece as well!!
thank you so much!
You guys' commitment to show and teach us is truly commendable. Great work, amazing content, and unparallel talent from both. Gracias×1000!
Super awesome!
Long live King David
Great video as per usual.
Round 1 of 4 LmL & grey waste tim smashing it out of th park cannot wait for 2,3&4
❤️💚💚❤️
Cogs are ocean going craft but they are sail driven exclusively and so are dead in the water without either a strong current to carry them along or a wind to fill their sails. These could be armed and manned as fighting ships but are arguably better suited for merchantmen. A longship however is a more maneuverable vessel that can be powered by sails or oars and its sleeker design in many cases likely would have resulted in better handling capabilities and speed making them better suited to war and raiding while also being capable trading vessels
Love it, mate. Awesome video, as always. I think 'Har' would be a prefix rather than a suffix, though
he was trying to say that it was the family name, but yeah. the prefix is the "last name" or family name. That's why the other dynasty has Jar Loi, Jar Har, Jar etc etc
The stream was epic but I'm here for ironborn week
I think when Tim whispered tape might have got y’all flagged. Still ridiculous but glad you are bringing it back like this. Y’all had so much be energy and information through this the 4 hour cast felt like flew by.
This!!! Love the post editing to match the conversation! Idk how long this took you or your editor but every livestream should be repackaged this way! I’ll volunteer editing time if need be!
haha I'd need a paid video editor to do this every week but it's def a tool in the toolbelt
Amazing Deep dive 👏love the section with gem stone emperors
Can’t wait for the rest of the series. Iron born time!!
Dave and Tim are the Carlson and Hancock of ASOIAF - nice one fellas.
a comment got into a video, life goals completed.
Towards the end you mention the Stone and Salt marriage culture being a throwback to Leng, it is also parallel in the main story were the more advanced neo-Mariners, the Targaryen foreigners, bring their incestual marriage practices to Westeros where it clashes with Andal/First Men practices, but eventually it rubs off slightly.
Wiiiiii happy it’s up
Har in the Ironborn could be related to Chinese Hai which means sea. Like Shanghai, Bei hai, etc. which means by the sea or north sea etc. In Chinese, the northern dialect adds an R sound to the end on many words like Hai becomes Har. Kai becomes Kar, like Wong Kar Wai the director of many Chinese movies.
BTW, George may have read some Chinese philosophy because. One of the most famous Chinese philosophers is Lao Zi which means 'Old Master ', who is said to predate all others. This is obviously paralleled to the old ones in ASOIAF.
well i don't know if you've seen my old video called Tyrion Targaryen but Tyrion has EXTENSIVE Sun Wukong parallels (the demon monkey thing being the tip off) so I'd guess yes
What is dead may never die
But rises again with more anthropological insight combined with mythical ancient history and symbolism
@@ThommyofThenn 😂😂
It's become plain to me as an avid reader of Martin's work, that he's well aware of all the peripheral theories of our own human evolution, catastrophes during the last ice age and the younger dryas period, etc. I think he has woven many parallel stories into one all encompassing history (much like our own reality) and, like a gardener, truly doesn't adhere to one "true" version of history but leaves much open for interpretation - and therefore also leaving much of the story malleable for future story building.
I saw all this in the live stream re-watch, but here I am. To boost the views and watch time. Because that's what heroes do. 😎
@26:40 I know this sounds strange, and I don't want to sound bitchy when the author is also probably not thinking like me. I am an island girl who came to the USA. Not many of us swim, especially us girls. We are just never taught because we actually fear the water for many reasons, from being pulled into by rogue waves, to being killed in Bagyong, to superstitions about sea monsters. A lot of people say to me, but y'all get on boats and go out into the sea. Yes, but a lot of people don't realize that around much of the Philippines you can just walk out into the seas for...well a good way. Maybe a kilometer before the sea goes above your head, at least in the two places that I lived at growing up, which was Valencia and Naawan. I was really surprised when papa moved us back to the USA that most of my friends could swim and were not afraid and didn't fear the water. Because I could not and I still am scared of the gods of the sea, even if I am Christian.
I'm terrified of the ocean too. I won't go out far at all swimming
Another banger
It was wild ......shame I missed parts
Damn a 4 hour long stream? I think breaking it up is a very good idea 😅
Lol, DL and GWT are probably the only ones that could convince me that maybe Robert shouldn't have finished the job...
Maybe...
Appreciate your work! Thank you!