Other proto-punk bands that influenced early punk rock which were not mentioned here include Captain Beefheart & his Magic band (particularly the LPs Safe As Milk and Trout Mask Replica), Alice Cooper, The Troggs, The Seeds, Flaming Groovies, Pink Fairies/Mick Farren & The Deviants, The Fugs, Can, The Trashmen, T-Rex, The Gorillas, Eddie & The Hot Rods, The Runaways, and Dr. Feelgood.
Good list! Was trying to make sure the video wasn’t 30 minutes long lol I was pretty on the fence about including T-Rex but decided against it for the sake of time. I’m a big fan of those early Alice Cooper albums and figured I’d save him for a Shock Rock video if I ever do one. Thanks for watching!
@@springvancoover I love, love, LOVE The Zombies! They're one my favorite groups. While I'll never pass up a chance to heap them with praise, still, I don't think they are a proto-punk group, or even much of an influence on 1970s punk. For one thing, they don't use a lot of loud distorted noise in their sound. They are less "street" and more sophisticated, and smooth. Even their toughest songs, like What More Can I Do and She Does Everything For Me are more of an influence on psyche (which itself was a scene they missed by half-a-second by breaking up at the birth of it in '67.) Also, I believe their arrangements were very jazzy. You don't find much jazz in punk except in the 'No Wave' of bands like The Contortions, the experimental bands like Pere Ubu and MX80 Sound, some of the more Doors-y sounding songs by The Stranglers, like in their remake of Walk On By, the guitar adventures of Television particularly songs like Little Johnny Jewel, the poetic stylings of Patti Smith Group, and the sax in X-Ray Spex. But I think those jazz influences on protopunk and punk rock come in more through guys like Ornette Coleman, John Coltrane, Robert Ayler, and Sun Ra. Because these are the weirdo-jazz guys who are more inclined to insert a lot more noise and aggression into their jazz. The Zombies weren't influenced by that kind of jazz. They were more into pop-jazz like Ray Charles, Miles Davis, Georgie Fame & The Blue Flames, Booker T and the MGs, and Jimmy Smith. Perhaps most importantly, Colin does not sing anything like an Iggy Pop, Lou Reed, or David Johansson. These guys have more of a monotone shouting or talking technique, while Colin is frequently alternating between crooning and wailing in a high falsetto with a lot of heavy romantic passion. His singing style is perhaps closer to that of Little Anthony, Frankie Lyman, and that is true of The Zombies lyrics as well. Punk lyrics are often more about frustration, lust, and anger, and are not about how it's the time of the season for loving, or about how her voice was soft and cool, her eyes are clear and bright, or don't hurt me now, for her love belongs to me. These are just too romantic. Protopunk lyrics are more like that of the Music Machine: "My social life's a dud, my name is really mud, up to here in lies, I guess I'm down to size." Or The Stooges: "I am the world's forgotten boy, the one who searches to destroy." There's no way we'd hear Colin express a sentiment like "Kick out the jams, motherf***er!" It would not be credible or convincing coming from him. Colin could instead have the sensitivity to sing; "never hurt me 'cause I love you. Never hurt me like before, oh yeah, you're not teaching me a new thing, try to realize and call me when you're ready. Whenever your ready." That's his gift. He really has a gift for that, and it should be appreciated in it's own right for what it is. The Zombies were one of the best and most unique Brit-beat groups ever. It's a shame the band didn't last longer and didn't have more big hits.
@@adamfindlay7091 Lots and lots of the earliest punk and noise groups cite Trout Mask Replica as a big influence, such as Devo, Half Japanese, Meat Puppets, Pere Ubu, Throbbing Gristle, and so forth. But interestingly, not many of these groups actually SOUND very much like Trout Mask Replica, because, really ...who could? It's an album that stands alone in it's uniqueness. Not even other Beefheart albums sound too much like it.
can't believe Fugs weren't mentioned, what's more punk than singing "who can kill a general in his bed / overthrow dictators if they're red / fucking-a-man! / CIA Man!" in 1965???
The influence velvet underground had on alternative bands that came after was very very strong. Pretty much every alternative art rock or punk rock album after it was somewhat inspired by VU. Even bands you would never think like Led Zeppelin, jimmy page went to see VU play live and started practicing the quick down picking from waiting for the man and eventually covered it with the yard birds.
The original punk was Rockabilly. Raucous, up tempo, simple musically and made by 'non musicians', anti establishment. small independent labels etc. Punk was essentially amplified rockabilly. You'll note that the 1970s Rockabilly revival was on the same time line as the emergence of punk.
A nice addition to your proto-punk list here would be the Modern Lovers, circa 1972-73. They were heavily influenced by the VU and the Stooges, but had their own unique sound. Fronted by Jonathan Richman, the band also included Jerry Harrison, later of Talking Heads, Dave Robinson, later of the Cars, and Ernie Brookes, later of the Real Kids.
@@JukeboxHistory Just found it here on YT ua-cam.com/video/ujwAUbRa4cs/v-deo.html Album recorded in 72 and 73, but not released until 76 owing to a dispute with record label. Very influential on LA punk bands, according to John Doe of X. Sex Pistols also covered Modern Lovers tune Roadrunner. Enjoy!
My desert island album! He really exemplified what would come to be called the DIY ethic, started a band so different from everything else at the time.
Great summary of Proto Punk. Well done! There's a great book that extensively covers the music scenes and bands that influenced and led up to Punk. The book is From The Velvets To The Voidoids by Clinton Heylin. What's really cool about the book is that besides talking about the obvious focal point of New York it also examines the fascinating and seminal underground rock scene of Cleveland and Akron Ohio. For some bizarrely cool reason this corner of northeast Ohio spawned some wonderfully uncommercial music that is still woefully underappreciated to this day. But those of us in the know can dig it! I also wanna give a shout out to a band called Debris' from Oklahoma. Yes, Oklahoma. They recorded some wonderfully bizarre and uber underground music in the mid 70s right before Punk came on the scene and exploded. They apparently were tuned into the same Great Subconscious that was inspiring and fueling all the other Proto Punk pioneers. The story of Proto Punk is fascinating if you care to dig deeper and fancy yourself an amateur Rock Historian like me.
Sounds like a good read! It’s crazy to think of how many bands cropped up around this time. People really focus on NYC and other popular areas so it’s cool to dive into the other hotspots like you’re saying. I never would have thought Ohio was so big in the underground scene! Thanks for watching
@@JukeboxHistory Debris' released one album in 1976 called Static Disposal. It got reissued a few years back on CD. Wonderfully bizarre and uncommercial.
Pretty good video. Proto Punk is tricky because its very backwards looking and it is pulling together bands and music that did not really interact with each other at the time. For the main bands you got them pretty good. I would say that Death was a band you left out. The underground music of certain eras have a commonality with punk mainly as being raw, less sophisticated music along with a strong DIY ethic or a cottage industry mindset. More or less you get the following: 1950s- Rockabilly and Skiffle (UK) 1960s- Surf Rock, Garage Rock, and Psychadelic Rock Early 1970s- Glam Rock While all of these are not EXACTLY Proto Punk or anywhere near Punk Rock, they fed into it by feel or by influence. Most of these genres are mainly delivered by smaller, local record labels and some were hard to obtain outside their geographic area. Even Rock and Roll was niche and went up the record label sizes as it occured in real time. If you are interested in 1950s DIY music, check out the CD boxset "Rocking Bones." The formula is there. Back in the 1990s the magazine "Guitar Player," wrote a brief column about why they did not cover Punk Rock as a style basically saying it was just "wild Chuck Berry chords," which isn't too far off the mark. I would say lots of Punk had strong Folk and Country influences (later merging in Cow Punk) as the focus was more on the story telling. In most of Proto Punk I have the Folk/Country aspect is not as stong. A surprising influence on Punk and later Post Punk is Girl Groups. While not counter culture it was a touchstone even though there is no way that could be considered Proto Punk. The last thing I will say is that as mentioned in the video, most music labels or scenes are typically retroactively applied and not really used at the time. Punk kindof, sortof embraced it at the time but even core punk bands spent time distancing themselves from the label.
I’ll definitely have to check out that boxset! The breakdown of Proto-Punk is pretty expansive and I found myself leaving more people out than I could put in. The connection to Country is pretty cool tho and I am a fan of some of the Cowpunk stuff. Appreciate you checking out my videos!
The MC5 should be cited as equals to the Stooges. There's a lot of band that could nammed "proto punk", but the VU, the Stooges, the MC5 and the NY Dolls are the originator.
Ask to see the music collection of any British punk from the 70's (like me) besides the influential bands (vinyl), some backstreet unknown bands (tape) and an early Greenday CD, you'll find a Kinks album or two.
"NUGGETS" is the best taster menu for proto punk. If you want to gorge on the 8 course "Cena Italiana" , check out the "PEBBLES" series of compilations.
Street Fighting Man....Communication Breakdown....Now I Wanna by your Dog....Surfing Bird....."When I say I'm in Love you best believe I'm in Luv L U V".....Panic in Detroit.....
I first watched your video on whether or not the Beatles are "that big of a deal" and I'll admit that, before watching it, I was thinking “Okay, let's see how, to his credit, this kid will point out the very undeniable influence the Beatles have had over the past 60 years while trying to still come off as 'so relatable' to a younger online audience that were, say, born in the 21st Century..." so - truth be told - my expectations weren't very great... However, that video is not only very accurate and distills the various aspects of why there is still this "hype" that precedes the Beatles - but that "so relatable" thing that I presumed would be in your video? THAT was not only there, but is actually one of the best things you could have done with that video because not only is it HONEST, but by expressing this about YOURSELF, it not only lends itself to the weight of respecting the accuracy in regards to your coverage of your subject (in that case, the Beatles) but, in fact, accomplishes making your video rather accessible - even to someone like me who, at 46 years old, was simply NOT expecting THAT to be the most impressive characteristic I'd experience when watching the video - it's what convinced me to check out more of your videos, and I'm glad I have!! One thing to always consider when you put yourself out there with your work: anyone can bring the certain skills needed to accomplish a particular goal, but no one can bring the most important part of what you always do bring with you whether you want to or not - which is YOU, man! So, until next time... keep up the good worK!! 😎👌
Good discussion. If you don't already know about him, you should check out Link Wray. His music from the '50s and early '60s was a strong influence on many of the bands later dubbed as proto-punk and then punk. Iggy Pop, Pete Townsend, Jimmy Page, and so many others have cited him as an influence, especially his song Rumble. He invented the power chord that countless others have used for decades. Other bands such as the Modern Lovers, Death, the Punks, the Saints, and so many more contributed to what would become punk.
Punk rock has a long history dating back to the late 1950s with the rockabilly greaser look, to the early 60s surf scene which in conjunction with the British invasion spawned garage rock which gave way to psych/acid rock which gave way to hardrock proto metal and then punk. 1966/67 garage/psych has the most in common with 76/77 punk, just better and more creative. Metal and punk comes from the same hard hitting bands from the late 60s through the early 70s . The MC5 and their little brother band The Stooges (Psychedelic Stooges) were both acid crazed hippie type freak bands that influenced both punk and metal. As did The Who ,The Kinks etc. They all influenced both metal and punk. Check out compilations such as The Brown Acid series, Pebbles series and comps like Acid Dreams, Beyond The Calico Wall, A Fistfull Of Fuzz/ For A Few Fuzz Guitars More and many others to understand the origins of both punk and metal.
I’ve heard of Pebbles but not the Brown Acid series. This is all good info I’ll have to check it out! I’ve always known more about Metal history so it’s cool to see the overlap that Punk has. Especially with the Garage Rock bands. Thanks for watching
Great video, love the Eric Idle-esque man on the street style delivery, was wondering patiently when you were going to get to the the Dolls I grew up listening to most of the bands you mentioned and more. Looking forward to your next drop!!
This is #hamma! Love the content, The Sonics are mindblowing as well as other Garage Rock Bands like the Count Five, the Starfires, the Ugly Fucklings usw. Just #hamma, just hamma!
There was an overhyped and strung out band based in London in 1969 who, after some pop success with some perfect pop singles and albums, decided to get some raw rockers together and play a free live show on the roof of their rehearsal space with a US session keyboardist but it was shut down by the cops… They did a song about a cross dresser, too… And then they broke up later that year… Pure proto punk…
As for the Velvets I'd include their debut The Velvet Underground & Nico, especially the track European Son. As for the shaping of the early (Proto)-Punk sound John Cale's influence is so overlooked, it beggars belief! Not only was he the main protagonist for their then groundbreaking sound on the first two Velvet lp's, but he also produced The Stooges debut, Patti Smith's debut Horses and most of The Modern Lovers debut recorded in 1972. Furthermore he produced and arranged Nico's lp trilogy The Marble Index, Desertshore and The End, providing some of the blueprints for Postpunk and Goth.
So I also saw the Kinks back in the 1980s and I saw The WHO. One of the opening acts was the Clash. That show was crazy. It was at the old Kingdome in Seattle, which has since been removed. Back then most concerts were general seating. So, people were clamoring at the front of the stage to get as close as possible. I got pulled under the stage and escorted around back into the general audience.
I saw The Ramones perform at a place called the Eagle's Hippodrome in Seattle and May 1983. They call it now they Eagles Auditorium. Anyway, there was a crowd of people at the front of the stage slam dancing, which in the 90s became the mosh pit. It was brutal. People came out with black eyes, women too!
Great show - love me some protopunk. Re: Nuggets - most of the tracks on there were not obscurities at all, but charting pop hits. As the series and it's multitude of imitators went on, everything became more and more focused upon obscurities, by necessity, but that first album was almost all stuff that was then currently in regular rotation on oldies radio like KRTH in L.A. or WCBS n NYC.
I saw David Bowie 3 times, twice as david bowie and once as Tin Machine. The first time I saw him, the two warm-up acts were The Thompson Twins and The Tubes. Wow! That was at The Tacoma Dome.
Good job. I was 20 in 1975 and remember the feeling of something new about to happen. I had gotten all rhe Velvets records and Patti Smith's debut. One record not mentioned is the Cale produced Modern Lovers. That record was a huge influence.
The Sonics were one of the bands that really influenced the beloved artists we have today. From Kurt Cobain to Jack White, the Hives and LCD Sound-system
Elvis Presley was a punk too! Even though he dressed in colored suits, wore shiny shoes, and combed his hair, his provocative dance moves and wild onstage energy said otherwise. His signature sound combined rhythm and blues, country, and gospel, which made his sound rock and roll. The Ramones called his first records "early punk music." 50's rock and roll was punk before punk. Modern punk music would not be allowed to exist if it weren't for Elvis Presley. Will you make a video about Elvis and his influences on punk?
I think most people would consider Detroit's 'Death' (not to be confused with the much later Metal band of the same name) to be worthy of at least an honorary mention... And I only say 'honorary' because even though they were active in and around '73, the fact that their label refused to promote them on account of their intransigence on the subject of their name ( _very_ Punk Rock, that!) meant that they never really got sufficient exposure to influence _anything!_ In fact it would be something like 40 years before they would get the recognition they were due, by which time something of a bandwagon would form around them... Not so surprising, when one hears tracks like 'Politicians in my Eyes', which, had there been any justice, would have achieved Instant Classic status the second it was recorded!
Not mentioned a lot, but I think Bob Dylan‘s vocal style circa 1965-66 had an indirect influence on the punk rockers. If you watch some of his 1966 live performances, that style is even more pronounced and could easily qualify as proto-punk (like his 1966 live Like a Rolling Stone from England).
I see it as being three very distinct eras: 1963-67: this would be the pre-punk/garage rock era. Sometimes referred as "60s punk". This is the kind of music that appeared on Nuggets/Pebbles/Back From the Grave type of comps (Sonics, Standells, Monks, Los Saicos, Seeds, etc) and was specifically inspired by the rawer, grittier sounds of the British Invasion For that reason, it also can include specifically those UK bands (Troggs, Pretty Things, Kinks, Who, etc). These groups were the first to be called "punk rock" during the early 70s, but I don't really view it as "proto-punk" in the sense that it was a prototype for what was to come. It was a whole other beast called "punk rock" imo. 1968-73: The first "Protopunk" era. The bands of this era were literal "proto-types" for what was to come. It's even rumored that the term "punk rock" was actually being used in and around certain scenes (and certainly among some more underground music writers). Groups from this era would be stuff like the Velvet Underground, Stooges, MC5, Crushed Butler, New York Dolls, Hollywood Brats, Flamin Groovies, Modern Lovers, David Peel, etc). 1973-75: the last proto-punk era. This era included both bands who formed and fizzled just before punk took off, as well as bands who would continue the sound they started into the punk era and essentially kicking it off. Groups from this era included The Ramones, Dictators, Gizmos, Saints, Real Kids, Rocket From the Tombs, Death, Electric Eels in the U.S. In the U.K. there was Dr. Feelgood, Duck's Deluxe, Johnny Moped. In Australian there was stuff like Coloured Balls.
This is a good breakdown! I like how you separated it. It’s amazing how much progression happened in just a few short years. Do you have a favorite “era”?
@@JukeboxHistory Agreed! Fun list to go through by the way! I love it all, but my favourite era of any music would have to be last proto-punk era. The 73-75 stuff. A lot of people forget that The Ramones first studio recordings took place on Feb 2nd, 1975. There's even footage of them from Sept '74. That predates a lot of what's often considered proto-punk. For that reason I often consider them the first true punk band. The Dictators recordings from 73, Saints "Most Primitive Band in the Wordl" from '74, Real Kids first sessions in Nov 74, Electric Eels; even stuff that trickled into 76 like DMZ, Gizmos, Sex Pistols and stuff like that. I forgot to put the Heartbreakers, DEVO, Teenage Head and Simply Saucer into that category. I guess to be fair, I can go '73 to '76 and cover a lot more stuff that was recorded just before punk rock took off as a movement. Yeah, last era was definitely my fav, but can't go wrong with 60s punk, Stooges, MC5 and Flamin Groovies either! cheers!
Spot on analysis here - especially with inclusion of Australian acts, many of which went to the UK and influenced artists there but received little or no kudos. Great vid, love your channel 🫡
"Proto-punk" is a name mostly used to market an obscure band that played raw rock before the Sex Pistols popularized the idea of punk. Proto-punk is a word you stick to an obscure band that was playing garage rock or metal or hippie hard rock, so you can retro actively promote it as "influential." Like The MC5. No one in the UK punk seems to have heard of the MC5 before 1978, when the Damned, the least important UK band, did a cover, but since they were loud and raw, the MC5 were retroactively called proto-punk, and hugely influential. Today, you can do a youtube video and pick any loud, raw band and call it proto-punk and influential. See: Death.
@@auridisavan1886 so for right now the ones I have uploaded are Proto Punk, 1970s Punk, Post Punk and New Wave. The next two parts will eventually be No Wave and Hardcore Punk. Got some videos in the works before those though!
Everybody go listen to the brontosaurus drums, troglodyte riff, & sullen, howling vocals of "Hang Up", by Tacoma's Fabulous Wailers, who where sort an MC5 onna Pacific Northwest scene where The Sonics was The Stooges, see what i mean? Big brother & li'l brother... truly a punk record, "Hang Up". 🦃⚡🎸😵🦃⚡🎸😵🦃⚡🎸😵🦃
Different bands different people different influences. Ramones: Garage rock, 60ies Girlpop, Surf John Lydon: Can, Captain Beefheart,... I guess it is safe to say british Punk musically was closer to beat music, us Punk closer to rocknroll.
This.. "proto" idea.. What was 1st before 1st, 1st... Etc.... When Any.... Over produced recording and stage antics, clothing style.... The Hatred of this music era and its Big Music industry Support... Was the.. direct cause, the why, the distain for, Take it back, push your aggression, that Music... Made Punk music.. punk... If you don't understand that.. you won't..
A vid on USA glam would be good Harlequin new York dolls new York's Bowie theater star N the kiss twisted sister there in 70 s new York pushed out to subs out of city parts Hollywood prats La USA 70 s part of deep history of UK punk London ss the boys London ss part 2 N afew pub rock bands who faded but lots of UK names linked Harlequin had a hit 45 with 50 s cover over looked glam fans become. Disco N punk fans just change kit all that boring prog rock cloves fashion all come out again in 90 s blink n you miss shops you got to change look a lot o northern soul night same in 80 / 90 change look from rare grove to grange to same open mics in a pub music fashion N buzz there all part of it but same not all jump around
As usual the idea that the 1970s put Punk a pun us is fizz, not FUZZ. The term - Punk - was first used in 1970/71 to describe American music made mostly by cheap teen bands five years before, 1965/66 being prime time. Can't believe I'm writing this and vast people still have no clue. Years ago I felt if I ever heard the term proto-Punk again I'd puke, but that would have been fashionable. But then again Trump just won the presidency, so... Anyway by the mid-Seventies in NYC CBGB, etc came along, grew a zillion bands and then all you had to do was go to the mall and blah blah blah. Anyway again Sixties Punk rules - "cause the original is still the greatest" and if you were a punk in 66 you couldn't go to the mall (butt kicked) or school (kicked out). But you could go to a mental hospital or graveyard. PS "The World Ain't Round It's Square."
Your information is severely lacking in broad context. Sex Pistols, Ramones... blah blah. The Damned put out the FIRST UK punk single. The Ramones should have been mentioned first before the Pistols. What about MC5, or Stooges. Your "History" is not that.
This video is on the bands that were around before the first wave of Punk music. The next video will focus on the the bands you’re referring to. Hope you check it out!
![The History of The Seeds | 60s Punk Pioneers [Mini-documentary]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/5iCgFDskiyI/mqdefault.jpg)
Yeaah 👍👍
Thanks!
And nice 2023!
For sure! Thanks for the suggestion 🤘🏻
@@JukeboxHistory Thanks. And pretty accurate and informative. I consider New York Dolls, Stooges and MC5 the three titans of punk rock hah.
@@shoutingmuteness3902 for sure! It was cool to get to revisit The Stooges because of this video. I don’t think I had listened to them for a few years
@@JukeboxHistory Oh it's an addicting classic. You listen once and always want to listen again heh.
Other proto-punk bands that influenced early punk rock which were not mentioned here include Captain Beefheart & his Magic band (particularly the LPs Safe As Milk and Trout Mask Replica), Alice Cooper, The Troggs, The Seeds, Flaming Groovies, Pink Fairies/Mick Farren & The Deviants, The Fugs, Can, The Trashmen, T-Rex, The Gorillas, Eddie & The Hot Rods, The Runaways, and Dr. Feelgood.
Good list! Was trying to make sure the video wasn’t 30 minutes long lol I was pretty on the fence about including T-Rex but decided against it for the sake of time. I’m a big fan of those early Alice Cooper albums and figured I’d save him for a Shock Rock video if I ever do one. Thanks for watching!
@@springvancoover I love, love, LOVE The Zombies! They're one my favorite groups. While I'll never pass up a chance to heap them with praise, still, I don't think they are a proto-punk group, or even much of an influence on 1970s punk. For one thing, they don't use a lot of loud distorted noise in their sound. They are less "street" and more sophisticated, and smooth. Even their toughest songs, like What More Can I Do and She Does Everything For Me are more of an influence on psyche (which itself was a scene they missed by half-a-second by breaking up at the birth of it in '67.) Also, I believe their arrangements were very jazzy. You don't find much jazz in punk except in the 'No Wave' of bands like The Contortions, the experimental bands like Pere Ubu and MX80 Sound, some of the more Doors-y sounding songs by The Stranglers, like in their remake of Walk On By, the guitar adventures of Television particularly songs like Little Johnny Jewel, the poetic stylings of Patti Smith Group, and the sax in X-Ray Spex. But I think those jazz influences on protopunk and punk rock come in more through guys like Ornette Coleman, John Coltrane, Robert Ayler, and Sun Ra. Because these are the weirdo-jazz guys who are more inclined to insert a lot more noise and aggression into their jazz. The Zombies weren't influenced by that kind of jazz. They were more into pop-jazz like Ray Charles, Miles Davis, Georgie Fame & The Blue Flames, Booker T and the MGs, and Jimmy Smith. Perhaps most importantly, Colin does not sing anything like an Iggy Pop, Lou Reed, or David Johansson. These guys have more of a monotone shouting or talking technique, while Colin is frequently alternating between crooning and wailing in a high falsetto with a lot of heavy romantic passion. His singing style is perhaps closer to that of Little Anthony, Frankie Lyman, and that is true of The Zombies lyrics as well. Punk lyrics are often more about frustration, lust, and anger, and are not about how it's the time of the season for loving, or about how her voice was soft and cool, her eyes are clear and bright, or don't hurt me now, for her love belongs to me. These are just too romantic. Protopunk lyrics are more like that of the Music Machine: "My social life's a dud, my name is really mud, up to here in lies, I guess I'm down to size." Or The Stooges: "I am the world's forgotten boy, the one who searches to destroy." There's no way we'd hear Colin express a sentiment like "Kick out the jams, motherf***er!" It would not be credible or convincing coming from him. Colin could instead have the sensitivity to sing; "never hurt me 'cause I love you. Never hurt me like before, oh yeah, you're not teaching me a new thing, try to realize and call me when you're ready. Whenever your ready." That's his gift. He really has a gift for that, and it should be appreciated in it's own right for what it is. The Zombies were one of the best and most unique Brit-beat groups ever. It's a shame the band didn't last longer and didn't have more big hits.
Yeah Captain BH is super original and often overlook ed.
@@adamfindlay7091 Lots and lots of the earliest punk and noise groups cite Trout Mask Replica as a big influence, such as Devo, Half Japanese, Meat Puppets, Pere Ubu, Throbbing Gristle, and so forth. But interestingly, not many of these groups actually SOUND very much like Trout Mask Replica, because, really ...who could? It's an album that stands alone in it's uniqueness. Not even other Beefheart albums sound too much like it.
can't believe Fugs weren't mentioned, what's more punk than singing "who can kill a general in his bed / overthrow dictators if they're red / fucking-a-man! / CIA Man!" in 1965???
The influence velvet underground had on alternative bands that came after was very very strong. Pretty much every alternative art rock or punk rock album after it was somewhat inspired by VU. Even bands you would never think like Led Zeppelin, jimmy page went to see VU play live and started practicing the quick down picking from waiting for the man and eventually covered it with the yard birds.
The original punk was Rockabilly. Raucous, up tempo, simple musically and made by 'non musicians', anti establishment. small independent labels etc. Punk was essentially amplified rockabilly. You'll note that the 1970s Rockabilly revival was on the same time line as the emergence of punk.
Great video!! You started exactly where I would’ve with The Kinks and even mentioned The Sonics. Nice job!
Thanks so much!
A nice addition to your proto-punk list here would be the Modern Lovers, circa 1972-73. They were heavily influenced by the VU and the Stooges, but had their own unique sound. Fronted by Jonathan Richman, the band also included Jerry Harrison, later of Talking Heads, Dave Robinson, later of the Cars, and Ernie Brookes, later of the Real Kids.
Very cool, I’ll have to check them out! Thanks for watching
@@JukeboxHistory Just found it here on YT ua-cam.com/video/ujwAUbRa4cs/v-deo.html
Album recorded in 72 and 73, but not released until 76 owing to a dispute with record label. Very influential on LA punk bands, according to John Doe of X. Sex Pistols also covered Modern Lovers tune Roadrunner. Enjoy!
John Cale of the Velvets produced most of that album. He also produced the selftiteld debut by The Stooges and also Patti Smith's Horses.
My desert island album! He really exemplified what would come to be called the DIY ethic, started a band so different from everything else at the time.
Great summary of Proto Punk. Well done!
There's a great book that extensively covers the music scenes and bands that influenced and led up to Punk. The book is From The Velvets To The Voidoids by Clinton Heylin. What's really cool about the book is that besides talking about the obvious focal point of New York it also examines the fascinating and seminal underground rock scene of Cleveland and Akron Ohio. For some bizarrely cool reason this corner of northeast Ohio spawned some wonderfully uncommercial music that is still woefully underappreciated to this day. But those of us in the know can dig it!
I also wanna give a shout out to a band called Debris' from Oklahoma. Yes, Oklahoma. They recorded some wonderfully bizarre and uber underground music in the mid 70s right before Punk came on the scene and exploded. They apparently were tuned into the same Great Subconscious that was inspiring and fueling all the other Proto Punk pioneers.
The story of Proto Punk is fascinating if you care to dig deeper and fancy yourself an amateur Rock Historian like me.
Sounds like a good read! It’s crazy to think of how many bands cropped up around this time. People really focus on NYC and other popular areas so it’s cool to dive into the other hotspots like you’re saying. I never would have thought Ohio was so big in the underground scene! Thanks for watching
I’ll also have to check out Debris
@@JukeboxHistory Debris' released one album in 1976 called Static Disposal. It got reissued a few years back on CD. Wonderfully bizarre and uncommercial.
Pretty good video. Proto Punk is tricky because its very backwards looking and it is pulling together bands and music that did not really interact with each other at the time. For the main bands you got them pretty good. I would say that Death was a band you left out.
The underground music of certain eras have a commonality with punk mainly as being raw, less sophisticated music along with a strong DIY ethic or a cottage industry mindset. More or less you get the following:
1950s- Rockabilly and Skiffle (UK)
1960s- Surf Rock, Garage Rock, and Psychadelic Rock
Early 1970s- Glam Rock
While all of these are not EXACTLY Proto Punk or anywhere near Punk Rock, they fed into it by feel or by influence. Most of these genres are mainly delivered by smaller, local record labels and some were hard to obtain outside their geographic area. Even Rock and Roll was niche and went up the record label sizes as it occured in real time. If you are interested in 1950s DIY music, check out the CD boxset "Rocking Bones." The formula is there.
Back in the 1990s the magazine "Guitar Player," wrote a brief column about why they did not cover Punk Rock as a style basically saying it was just "wild Chuck Berry chords," which isn't too far off the mark. I would say lots of Punk had strong Folk and Country influences (later merging in Cow Punk) as the focus was more on the story telling. In most of Proto Punk I have the Folk/Country aspect is not as stong. A surprising influence on Punk and later Post Punk is Girl Groups. While not counter culture it was a touchstone even though there is no way that could be considered Proto Punk.
The last thing I will say is that as mentioned in the video, most music labels or scenes are typically retroactively applied and not really used at the time. Punk kindof, sortof embraced it at the time but even core punk bands spent time distancing themselves from the label.
I’ll definitely have to check out that boxset! The breakdown of Proto-Punk is pretty expansive and I found myself leaving more people out than I could put in. The connection to Country is pretty cool tho and I am a fan of some of the Cowpunk stuff. Appreciate you checking out my videos!
The MC5 should be cited as equals to the Stooges. There's a lot of band that could nammed "proto punk", but the VU, the Stooges, the MC5 and the NY Dolls are the originator.
Ask to see the music collection of any British punk from the 70's (like me) besides the influential bands (vinyl), some backstreet unknown bands (tape) and an early Greenday CD, you'll find a Kinks album or two.
The Kinks are such a classic group 🤘🏻
"NUGGETS" is the best taster menu for proto punk. If you want to gorge on the 8 course "Cena Italiana" , check out the "PEBBLES" series of compilations.
I’ll have to check it out! Thanks for sharing
Street Fighting Man....Communication Breakdown....Now I Wanna by your Dog....Surfing Bird....."When I say I'm in Love you best believe I'm in Luv L U V".....Panic in Detroit.....
I first watched your video on whether or not the Beatles are "that big of a deal" and I'll admit that, before watching it, I was thinking “Okay, let's see how, to his credit, this kid will point out the very undeniable influence the Beatles have had over the past 60 years while trying to still come off as 'so relatable' to a younger online audience that were, say, born in the 21st Century..." so - truth be told - my expectations weren't very great...
However, that video is not only very accurate and distills the various aspects of why there is still this "hype" that precedes the Beatles - but that "so relatable" thing that I presumed would be in your video? THAT was not only there, but is actually one of the best things you could have done with that video because not only is it HONEST, but by expressing this about YOURSELF, it not only lends itself to the weight of respecting the accuracy in regards to your coverage of your subject (in that case, the Beatles) but, in fact, accomplishes making your video rather accessible - even to someone like me who, at 46 years old, was simply NOT expecting THAT to be the most impressive characteristic I'd experience when watching the video - it's what convinced me to check out more of your videos, and I'm glad I have!!
One thing to always consider when you put yourself out there with your work: anyone can bring the certain skills needed to accomplish a particular goal, but no one can bring the most important part of what you always do bring with you whether you want to or not - which is YOU, man!
So, until next time... keep up the good worK!! 😎👌
8 minutes in, I'm thinking, surely he's going to mention the New York Dolls, isn't he..? :p Looking forward to the next one!
Couldn’t leave them out! Thanks for watching
Good discussion. If you don't already know about him, you should check out Link Wray. His music from the '50s and early '60s was a strong influence on many of the bands later dubbed as proto-punk and then punk. Iggy Pop, Pete Townsend, Jimmy Page, and so many others have cited him as an influence, especially his song Rumble. He invented the power chord that countless others have used for decades. Other bands such as the Modern Lovers, Death, the Punks, the Saints, and so many more contributed to what would become punk.
Punk rock has a long history dating back to the late 1950s with the rockabilly greaser look, to the early 60s surf scene which in conjunction with the British invasion spawned garage rock which gave way to psych/acid rock which gave way to hardrock proto metal and then punk. 1966/67 garage/psych has the most in common with 76/77 punk, just better and more creative. Metal and punk comes from the same hard hitting bands from the late 60s through the early 70s . The MC5 and their little brother band The Stooges (Psychedelic Stooges) were both acid crazed hippie type freak bands that influenced both punk and metal. As did The Who ,The Kinks etc. They all influenced both metal and punk. Check out compilations such as The Brown Acid series, Pebbles series and comps like Acid Dreams, Beyond The Calico Wall, A Fistfull Of Fuzz/ For A Few Fuzz Guitars More and many others to understand the origins of both punk and metal.
I’ve heard of Pebbles but not the Brown Acid series. This is all good info I’ll have to check it out! I’ve always known more about Metal history so it’s cool to see the overlap that Punk has. Especially with the Garage Rock bands. Thanks for watching
So very well done!
Had a brother who was eight years older, who fell hard for The Stooges…
Great video, love the Eric Idle-esque man on the street style delivery, was wondering patiently when you were going to get to the the Dolls I grew up listening to most of the bands you mentioned and more. Looking forward to your next drop!!
For sure! Definitely had to save the Dolls for last 😂 thanks for watching
This is #hamma! Love the content,
The Sonics are mindblowing
as well as other Garage Rock Bands like the Count Five, the Starfires, the Ugly Fucklings usw.
Just #hamma, just hamma!
The Garage Rock rabbit hole is a fun one to go down! Thanks for watching
This was dope bro!! I like the research put into it man.
Appreciate it! Definitely a lot of resources out there for it. Thanks for watching
excellent video. can't wait to watch the rest!!!
Thanks man! 🤠
more bandz: The Music Machine / ? & The Mysterians / The Standells / The Leaves
I’ll have to check them out! Thanks for watching
One very important band that you missed out is Blue Cheer. One of the originators of the distorted rock and punk sound
Blue Cheer could have definitely fit in this video! Instrumental in the Metal genre as well
There was an overhyped and strung out band based in London in 1969 who,
after some pop success with some perfect pop singles and albums, decided to get some raw rockers together and play a free live show on the roof of their rehearsal space with a
US session keyboardist
but it was shut down by the cops…
They did a song about
a cross dresser, too…
And then they broke up later that year…
Pure proto punk…
As for the Velvets I'd include their debut The Velvet Underground & Nico, especially the track European Son.
As for the shaping of the early (Proto)-Punk sound John Cale's influence is so overlooked, it beggars belief! Not only was he the main protagonist for their then groundbreaking sound on the first two Velvet lp's, but he also produced The Stooges debut, Patti Smith's debut Horses and most of The Modern Lovers debut recorded in 1972. Furthermore he produced and arranged Nico's lp trilogy The Marble Index, Desertshore and The End, providing some of the blueprints for Postpunk and Goth.
I always considered The Animals to be an influence on punk rock as well, but this list was pretty solid.
So I also saw the Kinks back in the 1980s and I saw The WHO. One of the opening acts was the Clash. That show was crazy. It was at the old Kingdome in Seattle, which has since been removed. Back then most concerts were general seating. So, people
were clamoring at the front of the stage to get as close as possible. I got pulled under the stage and escorted around back into the general audience.
Nice work, man, you have a new subscriber. I’ll be back for the next video!
Glad you liked it! Thanks for the sub and thanks for watching
I saw The Ramones perform at a place called the Eagle's Hippodrome in Seattle and May 1983. They call it now they Eagles Auditorium. Anyway, there was a crowd of people at the front of the stage slam dancing, which in the 90s became the mosh pit. It was brutal. People came out with black eyes, women too!
Great show - love me some protopunk. Re: Nuggets - most of the tracks on there were not obscurities at all, but charting pop hits. As the series and it's multitude of imitators went on, everything became more and more focused upon obscurities, by necessity, but that first album was almost all stuff that was then currently in regular rotation on oldies radio like KRTH in L.A. or WCBS n NYC.
I saw David Bowie 3 times, twice as david bowie and once as Tin Machine. The first time I saw him, the two warm-up acts were The Thompson Twins and The Tubes. Wow! That was at The Tacoma Dome.
The Missing Links (1965) Australia. The Ramones look like them.
Good job. I was 20 in 1975 and remember the feeling of something new about to happen. I had gotten all rhe Velvets records and Patti Smith's debut. One record not mentioned is the Cale produced Modern Lovers. That record was a huge influence.
So impressive!!! ❤
Thank you!
Watched the 4 episodes backwards, worth it!
... time to start a band 😀
Thx!
You're 100 percent corrrright. Glad you touched on Nuggets. Yes if it was not for NY Dolls no sex pistols, ask ask S jones.
The Sonics were one of the bands that really influenced the beloved artists we have today. From Kurt Cobain to Jack White, the Hives and LCD Sound-system
awesome video, hope your channel gets bigger. i would love a video on goth rock/new wave
Thanks so much! And I think New Wave might be in the cards 🤨
So glad I found your channel! Just subbed.
Thanks so much!
Really well done. Again.
Thank you!
#2 PLEASE!
Comin’ right up! 🏃🏻♂️
Elvis Presley was a punk too! Even though he dressed in colored suits, wore shiny shoes, and combed his hair, his provocative dance moves and wild onstage energy said otherwise. His signature sound combined rhythm and blues, country, and gospel, which made his sound rock and roll. The Ramones called his first records "early punk music." 50's rock and roll was punk before punk. Modern punk music would not be allowed to exist if it weren't for Elvis Presley. Will you make a video about Elvis and his influences on punk?
The Music Machine ("Talk Talk") Dirty Words ("Why") The Savages ("The World Ain't Round It's Square")
I think most people would consider Detroit's 'Death' (not to be confused with the much later Metal band of the same name) to be worthy of at least an honorary mention... And I only say 'honorary' because even though they were active in and around '73, the fact that their label refused to promote them on account of their intransigence on the subject of their name ( _very_ Punk Rock, that!) meant that they never really got sufficient exposure to influence _anything!_ In fact it would be something like 40 years before they would get the recognition they were due, by which time something of a bandwagon would form around them... Not so surprising, when one hears tracks like 'Politicians in my Eyes', which, had there been any justice, would have achieved Instant Classic status the second it was recorded!
Not mentioned a lot, but I think Bob Dylan‘s vocal style circa 1965-66 had an indirect influence on the punk rockers. If you watch some of his 1966 live performances, that style is even more pronounced and could easily qualify as proto-punk (like his 1966 live Like a Rolling Stone from England).
I see it as being three very distinct eras:
1963-67: this would be the pre-punk/garage rock era. Sometimes referred as "60s punk". This is the kind of music that
appeared on Nuggets/Pebbles/Back From the Grave type of comps (Sonics, Standells, Monks, Los Saicos, Seeds, etc) and was specifically inspired by the rawer, grittier sounds of the British Invasion For that reason, it also can include specifically those UK bands (Troggs, Pretty Things, Kinks, Who, etc). These groups were the first to be called "punk rock" during the early 70s, but I don't really view it as "proto-punk" in the sense that it was a prototype for what was to come. It was a whole other beast called "punk rock" imo.
1968-73: The first "Protopunk" era. The bands of this era were literal "proto-types" for what was to come. It's even rumored that the term "punk rock" was actually being used in and around certain scenes (and certainly among some more underground music writers). Groups from this era would be stuff like the Velvet Underground, Stooges, MC5, Crushed Butler, New York Dolls, Hollywood Brats, Flamin Groovies, Modern Lovers, David Peel, etc).
1973-75: the last proto-punk era. This era included both bands who formed and fizzled just before punk took off, as well as bands who would continue the sound they started into the punk era and essentially kicking it off. Groups from this era included The Ramones, Dictators, Gizmos, Saints, Real Kids, Rocket From the Tombs, Death, Electric Eels in the U.S. In the U.K. there was Dr. Feelgood, Duck's Deluxe, Johnny Moped. In Australian there was stuff like Coloured Balls.
This is a good breakdown! I like how you separated it. It’s amazing how much progression happened in just a few short years. Do you have a favorite “era”?
@@JukeboxHistory Agreed! Fun list to go through by the way!
I love it all, but my favourite era of any music would have to be last proto-punk era. The 73-75 stuff.
A lot of people forget that The Ramones first studio recordings took place on Feb 2nd, 1975. There's even footage of them from Sept '74. That predates a lot of what's often considered proto-punk. For that reason I often consider them the first true punk band. The Dictators recordings from 73, Saints "Most Primitive Band in the Wordl" from '74, Real Kids first sessions in Nov 74, Electric Eels; even stuff that trickled into 76 like DMZ, Gizmos, Sex Pistols and stuff like that. I forgot to put the Heartbreakers, DEVO, Teenage Head and Simply Saucer into that category. I guess to be fair, I can go '73 to '76 and cover a lot more stuff that was recorded just before punk rock took off as a movement.
Yeah, last era was definitely my fav, but can't go wrong with 60s punk, Stooges, MC5 and Flamin Groovies either! cheers!
Spot on analysis here - especially with inclusion of Australian acts, many of which went to the UK and influenced artists there but received little or no kudos.
Great vid, love your channel 🫡
Actually I really did enjoy this video. It was extremely accurate.
Photo at 1:06: See the young rebels, expressing their disdain for conformity.
The Stooges to me are the penultimate Rock n Roll band
Yea man! They’re one of the best
Then who is the last rock n roll band?
@@206Vin I was going to ask the same thing.
"Proto-punk" is a name mostly used to market an obscure band that played raw rock before the Sex Pistols popularized the idea of punk. Proto-punk is a word you stick to an obscure band that was playing garage rock or metal or hippie hard rock, so you can retro actively promote it as "influential." Like The MC5. No one in the UK punk seems to have heard of the MC5 before 1978, when the Damned, the least important UK band, did a cover, but since they were loud and raw, the MC5 were retroactively called proto-punk, and hugely influential. Today, you can do a youtube video and pick any loud, raw band and call it proto-punk and influential. See: Death.
The ubiqutous use of proto is maddening
Great and interesting video, but leaving out Suicide is almost criminal- they were the first band to bill themselves as a punk rock band
Saving them for the No Wave video. Could’ve mentioned them here tho
@@JukeboxHistory Oh, my bad. Very fair in that case! Super excited for the No Wave video then! What other videos in the series are you making?
@@auridisavan1886 so for right now the ones I have uploaded are Proto Punk, 1970s Punk, Post Punk and New Wave. The next two parts will eventually be No Wave and Hardcore Punk. Got some videos in the works before those though!
man, hordes of people styled like our cultures and how we grew up everywhere, like it's fucking normal
Before i watch i am assuming proto punk is MC5 and The Stooges.
Bodies in the Morgue Chopped Up
Omg Styled like Our Generation
And telling Our Stories How WE Grew UP ?
If you want a good early punk rocker, vegitable man by syd Barrett of Pink Floyd
Everybody go listen to the brontosaurus drums, troglodyte riff, & sullen, howling vocals of "Hang Up", by Tacoma's Fabulous Wailers, who where sort an MC5 onna Pacific Northwest scene where The Sonics was The Stooges, see what i mean? Big brother & li'l brother... truly a punk record, "Hang Up". 🦃⚡🎸😵🦃⚡🎸😵🦃⚡🎸😵🦃
😁👍
Different bands different people different influences.
Ramones: Garage rock, 60ies Girlpop, Surf
John Lydon: Can, Captain Beefheart,...
I guess it is safe to say british Punk musically was closer to beat music, us Punk closer to rocknroll.
Raw Power
What is that jingle sound in the background? Turn it off.
This.. "proto" idea..
What was 1st before 1st, 1st... Etc....
When Any.... Over produced recording and stage antics, clothing style....
The Hatred of this music era and its Big Music industry Support...
Was the.. direct cause, the why, the distain for, Take it back, push your aggression, that Music... Made Punk music.. punk...
If you don't understand that.. you won't..
I could not beleive The Sonics were a 60s band!
Right! They were so ahead of their time
Completely 60's ???????????????
Not even a mention for Suicide? Talk about a surface-level take.
The history of the 1970s Glam Rock ?!?! Glam/punk
A vid on USA glam would be good Harlequin new York dolls new York's Bowie theater star N the kiss twisted sister there in 70 s new York pushed out to subs out of city parts Hollywood prats La USA 70 s part of deep history of UK punk London ss the boys London ss part 2 N afew pub rock bands who faded but lots of UK names linked Harlequin had a hit 45 with 50 s cover over looked glam fans become. Disco N punk fans just change kit all that boring prog rock cloves fashion all come out again in 90 s blink n you miss shops you got to change look a lot o northern soul night same in 80 / 90 change look from rare grove to grange to same open mics in a pub music fashion N buzz there all part of it but same not all jump around
As usual the idea that the 1970s put Punk a pun us is fizz, not FUZZ. The term - Punk - was first used in 1970/71 to describe American music made mostly by cheap teen bands five years before, 1965/66 being prime time. Can't believe I'm writing this and vast people still have no clue. Years ago I felt if I ever heard the term proto-Punk again I'd puke, but that would have been fashionable. But then again Trump just won the presidency, so... Anyway by the mid-Seventies in NYC CBGB, etc came along, grew a zillion bands and then all you had to do was go to the mall and blah blah blah. Anyway again Sixties Punk rules - "cause the original is still the greatest" and if you were a punk in 66 you couldn't go to the mall (butt kicked) or school (kicked out). But you could go to a mental hospital or graveyard. PS "The World Ain't Round It's Square."
Your information is severely lacking in broad context. Sex Pistols, Ramones... blah blah. The Damned put out the FIRST UK punk single. The Ramones should have been mentioned first before the Pistols. What about MC5, or Stooges. Your "History" is not that.
this is proto-punk not punk rock
This video is on the bands that were around before the first wave of Punk music. The next video will focus on the the bands you’re referring to. Hope you check it out!