Great take! Recognising the limitations of the test and some solid reasoning how the shoes effects the run. If nothing else the placebo of looking good and lightness do help :)
Please make more running content. I will subscribe and wail. Loooing for some average runner sharing experience like you. Great content, please continue
Most carbon plated shoes has a wear-in period of about 60 km before they start to soften up. After that they'll be more comfortable to run in. All in all a fun video for all of us average runners eyeing these super shoes
@Daniel-ld7xs *disclaimer* My experience with carbon shoes is severely limited, but I'll give you my point of view. I heard a youtuber describing them as the speedo suit of running. Speedo made this insanely fast swimsuit a handful of years ago, which made people break old world records like it was no business. That resonated with me. I think carbon plates CAN be the same, but since the shoes are vastly cheaper, they don't skew the competition as much. That said; you need to already be fast to utilise the carbon plate (as he says in the video), and a carbon plate without good foam won't help you much
Thank you. I had not heard about the wear-in period, but that makes a lot of sense! I guess they’ll also have a point at which the foam start to decrease in performance?
@emilcarlsson they definitely have a point where the foam starts to lose its bounce. I seem to remember most people saying about 300 km of life in the vaporfly 3, but your mileage may vary
The Nikes are good straight out of the box, in fact they already feel noticeably different after 200k. The foam just loses its bounce. This is only relevant if you really want to get the most out of the shoe, I have a pair which I use for speed sessions and they are still good after 700k
I like this test. The only criticism is your Brooks are old and knackered and definitely holding you back. Also im pretty sure they were not fast shoes to start with. Any new shoe that has some energy return would reduce your time. Try this against a pair of Topo Specter 2 (has the peba foam but no plate) or a whole host of faster none plated non peba (but still fast) shoes like the Hoka Mach6 or Asics Superblast 2 or Brooks Hyperion Max. The latter i actually have my 5km PB with at 18.59. Still have only gone sub 20 once with my carbon plated peba Asics, and failed to even do that in my carbon plates peba Nikes!
@emilcarlsson your test was still a really good test, and realistically testing against what you already have is much cheaper than buying another pair of shoes to test against!
For the average runner you’ll notice far less fatigue in your legs afterwards too, as long as you’ve got decently strong calves already. But yeah they’ll definitely make you faster even if just out of placebo effect and driving you to push harder. Full send and have fun
Nice video👏. It did seem much more windy on the second run in the VF. Look forward to the sub-40 project✊ it’s in there, especially in a race with a number on to give you more motivation 🤓
It sure does! My experience was that it was mostly due to the headwind in the beginning of the 2nd run. I don’t think the difference in HR is that big for the last 4Ks. But you’re right. You need to consider effort as well when looking at the results. I did try to give the same effort and stick to the same pace strategy to make it as comparable as possible. It is also worth noting that the HR data comes from my wristwatch, which I don’t know how accurate is.
Please note that the 3 hrs+ half marathon was run on mountain trails ✌️ According to Strava my best effort on a flat half marathon distance is 1:58. Otherwise, yes, that discrepancy would be crazy 😅
Nah. 45 mins is a pretty average time for 10km for an under 50s fit and healthy male, who actually runs, and trains. Ive been running for 2 years, I weigh 90kg so 10kg overweight for my height and am in my 40s. my 10km pb is 42.40 @@MrNadav1995. It's decent for my experience and weight but it's nothing to write home about. My friend who rarely gets in his club team runs about 33mins flat for 10km. That is great and definitely well above average, but not elite.
@@MrNadav1995Compared to the general population it's very fast, but so is 5 or even 6 min tempo. Compared to 20-somethings who run somewhat seriously it's really not that fast.
@@fredriksvard2603 True, that group you described is pretty much the top 20 percent of that age group. Most people at that age group (or at any age group really) dont run at all. I guess saying slow "runner" puts him in the category of someone that runs and trains often. And in that category I would say he is still above average. I just ran the numbers, in my local parkruns he would have finished 55/158 and 18/70 in the male category and that includes people from ages below 18 or above 40...remove those people and he would have placed higher. if you account that a small percent of the top finishers are not "runners" meaning they dont train and race often then it would balance out to around top 25% at least. This is assuming that people that attend parkruns train pretty regularly
Great take! Recognising the limitations of the test and some solid reasoning how the shoes effects the run. If nothing else the placebo of looking good and lightness do help :)
Definitely never underestimate placebo 😬 I glad you liked it!
Please make more running content. I will subscribe and wail. Loooing for some average runner sharing experience like you. Great content, please continue
Much more average-runner-cont coming within the next few weeks. I promise! Thank you so much!
Most carbon plated shoes has a wear-in period of about 60 km before they start to soften up. After that they'll be more comfortable to run in. All in all a fun video for all of us average runners eyeing these super shoes
Would you say carbon plating is somewhat "cheating"?
@Daniel-ld7xs *disclaimer* My experience with carbon shoes is severely limited, but I'll give you my point of view. I heard a youtuber describing them as the speedo suit of running. Speedo made this insanely fast swimsuit a handful of years ago, which made people break old world records like it was no business. That resonated with me. I think carbon plates CAN be the same, but since the shoes are vastly cheaper, they don't skew the competition as much. That said; you need to already be fast to utilise the carbon plate (as he says in the video), and a carbon plate without good foam won't help you much
Thank you. I had not heard about the wear-in period, but that makes a lot of sense! I guess they’ll also have a point at which the foam start to decrease in performance?
@emilcarlsson they definitely have a point where the foam starts to lose its bounce. I seem to remember most people saying about 300 km of life in the vaporfly 3, but your mileage may vary
The Nikes are good straight out of the box, in fact they already feel noticeably different after 200k. The foam just loses its bounce.
This is only relevant if you really want to get the most out of the shoe, I have a pair which I use for speed sessions and they are still good after 700k
Nice editting, Good video!
Strength training for the calves (and legs/core) will help handle the faster paces/stiffness of the carbon plate.
That’s a great tip. I’m definitely trying that. Thank you!🙏
I like this test. The only criticism is your Brooks are old and knackered and definitely holding you back. Also im pretty sure they were not fast shoes to start with. Any new shoe that has some energy return would reduce your time. Try this against a pair of Topo Specter 2 (has the peba foam but no plate) or a whole host of faster none plated non peba (but still fast) shoes like the Hoka Mach6 or Asics Superblast 2 or Brooks Hyperion Max. The latter i actually have my 5km PB with at 18.59. Still have only gone sub 20 once with my carbon plated peba Asics, and failed to even do that in my carbon plates peba Nikes!
Your criticism is totally valid. And those are great tips! I will definitely look into a couple of those models. Thanks a lot!
@emilcarlsson your test was still a really good test, and realistically testing against what you already have is much cheaper than buying another pair of shoes to test against!
Thank You
rate the vid bro. keep it up.
Thanks dude! Means a lot 🫶
Nice PBs, im hoping to break 40 soon too.
Best of luck to you too! There’s just something magical about breaking that barrier 😬
For the average runner you’ll notice far less fatigue in your legs afterwards too, as long as you’ve got decently strong calves already. But yeah they’ll definitely make you faster even if just out of placebo effect and driving you to push harder.
Full send and have fun
Nice video👏. It did seem much more windy on the second run in the VF. Look forward to the sub-40 project✊ it’s in there, especially in a race with a number on to give you more motivation 🤓
First video in the sub 40-project is coming up shortly! And signing up for a race is a great idea. Thanks, dude! 🫡
🔥🔥🔥
Good video a sub 45 is a fast runner I think average would be more like 60 min.
Really interesting video 👍 Danish accent? Your English is fantastic.
Yes! That’s a thick danish accent. Thank you so much 🖤 I do try my best to be understandable.
Insane vid bro, one question how long was your runs between the first and second 10k?
Thanks dude!! I did 3 very easy runs between the two 10Ks: a 4,5 K, a 10 K, and a 2k as a sort of Shake out run. All 3 in pace 6-7.00 ✌️
Cool video mate.
For me it's about 10s per kilometres while i feel like making same or similar efforts. They do help me run faster but i do feel the stiffness.
Cool. That’s not too far from my experience of +7,7s per km I guess. Can I ask what your 10k PB is?
@emilcarlsson42:52 iirc
@emilcarlsson42:52
@emilcarlssonslightly under 43 iirc
Finally you have thrown away the only non-nike element of your clothes
Does heart rate comparason not show you actually also worked harder ?
It sure does! My experience was that it was mostly due to the headwind in the beginning of the 2nd run. I don’t think the difference in HR is that big for the last 4Ks. But you’re right. You need to consider effort as well when looking at the results. I did try to give the same effort and stick to the same pace strategy to make it as comparable as possible. It is also worth noting that the HR data comes from my wristwatch, which I don’t know how accurate is.
Spennende med MAF trening.. Følger deg for å lære...
ja veldig veldig spennende. Jeg er glad du følger med!
3 hrs for half mara but 45 for 10k! insane
Please note that the 3 hrs+ half marathon was run on mountain trails ✌️ According to Strava my best effort on a flat half marathon distance is 1:58. Otherwise, yes, that discrepancy would be crazy 😅
@emilcarlsson I guess your time for a flat half will be around 1:40. Good job on the trails!
@emilcarlssonyour 10k suggests way lower than a 1.58 HM. If you hit sub 40 you’ll be in the sub 1.30 neighbourhood. Good luck 💪
I agree. I’m pretty confident that I could maintain around 5:00 /km for a HM. Thank you! 🏔️🙏
I’m dreaming of that sub 40 and sub 1:30 in the HM! Hope I’ll get there.
I don’t wear nike because they are really uncomfortable and narrow
Oh please…..a “slower pace” at 4:30 min/km is NOT an”average runner.”
This is 10k race pace, 4:30 min/k is pretty average for his age and gender if you look at some results of local 10k runs
@@TBasianeyes its not average at all my guy maybe like top 20 percent. But he is not elite
Nah. 45 mins is a pretty average time for 10km for an under 50s fit and healthy male, who actually runs, and trains. Ive been running for 2 years, I weigh 90kg so 10kg overweight for my height and am in my 40s. my 10km pb is 42.40 @@MrNadav1995. It's decent for my experience and weight but it's nothing to write home about. My friend who rarely gets in his club team runs about 33mins flat for 10km. That is great and definitely well above average, but not elite.
@@MrNadav1995Compared to the general population it's very fast, but so is 5 or even 6 min tempo. Compared to 20-somethings who run somewhat seriously it's really not that fast.
@@fredriksvard2603 True, that group you described is pretty much the top 20 percent of that age group. Most people at that age group (or at any age group really) dont run at all. I guess saying slow "runner" puts him in the category of someone that runs and trains often. And in that category I would say he is still above average. I just ran the numbers, in my local parkruns he would have finished 55/158 and 18/70 in the male category and that includes people from ages below 18 or above 40...remove those people and he would have placed higher. if you account that a small percent of the top finishers are not "runners" meaning they dont train and race often then it would balance out to around top 25% at least. This is assuming that people that attend parkruns train pretty regularly
yuk\