Money played a HUGE part of why I changed my stance on birthing our children. Neither my partner nor I grew up with money and in my family I was the oldest and the youngest is 11 years younger. Seeing the struggles with having an infant was very impactful along with constantly being told how expensive we were. As I got older I was never worried about having money for children themselves but having money for me to continue being me and for us to continue with our goals for the future. Like if all of my teeth fell out due to pregnancy we can now afford the nice dental implants and still have the opportunity to travel. Class and wealth are huge factors in motherhood (especially in the US) that I wish were talked about a lot more.
I am childfree and don't want kids but I have three nephews who I absolutely adore. I really love kids and want to be a part of their lives, just don't want any of my own: Part of the village but not a mother.
That is so beautifully written. People who decide to have children need community and support from the village, and may I add, those who had the chance to experience having a cool „aunt“ person as a child like myself remember them so dearly I am sure - a refreshingly different life to witness :)
I’m childfree and knew at toddlerhood that I didn’t want to be someone’s mom, and as a teenager knew that I didn’t want to experience childbirth. Now at the beginning of perimenopause I feel relief at the thought that soon motherhood cannot possibly be forced or coerced upon me.
I have 2 children. I had postpartum anxiety when I had my first, and while it was partially hormonal, it was also because no one prepared me at all for what motherhood actually is. The best way to describe it is when people say “it’s like having your heart walking out in the world, unprotected.” Which you can’t even conceptualize until it happens. I also found that people only prepared you for the “safe” topics like how many chores you’ll have to do. But what I really struggled with is my immense love for my children and the fact that it made everything else in my life meaningless by comparison. And the best advice I ever read was: you didn’t just create a person, you created a relationship. That had helped me to contextualize all my interactions with my kids and not make it so “overwhelming.” So much of western perspective on motherhood is “omg cute onesieeee!!! Baby cheeks!!!” And I realized how much I didn’t relate to that as a sort of “atypical woman.” The cuteness of a baby doesn’t have anything to do with my role as a mother. To me the cuteness almost does nothing for me, what I love about my kids is such a visceral and all-encompassing thing that cannot be summed up by decorating the nursery or doing more laundry than usual.
I don't want kids- but I really do understand that feeling and frankly, this is one of a small handful of words I've read/heard that made me really reconsider my thoughts on motherhood. Thank you for sharing.
I feel like a lot of people who say "you'll want them one day" haven't really unpacked the idea of personal choice and are instead stuck in the idea of the nuclear family. It's fab to have this video to send them to help educate them, rather than just saying "I deserve a choice" which usually, falls on deaf ears
I regret choosing motherhood! Adrienne Rich's book "Of Woman Born" has a structural analysis of motherhood and helped me think through the reasons why I'm not a fan. Great book recs, as usual. A big hug to you and every commenter.
I have an 8 months old. For me, so far, motherhood has meant living somewhere between flow and chaos, between survival and awe. It has felt like a brutal and beautiful metamorphosis. Love it and don't regret it at all. Am also very glad I was able to chose and wait until I felt ready. (I am 32)
Thanks for this video Leena. I hope it’s okay to share my motherhood journey & raise awareness. TW: Recurrent pregnancy loss. I’m a neurodiverse mum - I’m diagnosed with autism, adhd & ocd & also have chronic pain. Parenting is the hardest thing I’ve ever done. Think crying baby + sensory processing disorder, inability to change routine without extreme distress + toddler who naturally will not stick to a schedule etc. I know a lot of ND people who say they don’t want children because they are ND, but also some brilliant ND parents. I didn’t really want children, but at 24 I fell pregnant & by the time I reached my 2nd trimester I felt like a mother - something I didn’t expect. Then I lost the baby - carried for weeks not knowing his heart had stopped (late missed miscarriage) & only found out when my womb turned sceptic & I collapsed. Fast forward a truly traumatic hospital stay & I was suddenly back to being an unpregnant childless person. But everything had changed - I felt the title of mum was ripped from me & I was obsessed with regaining it. I got pregnant again, but by my 3rd scan the heart had stopped. I recovered from surgery & tried again. Another miscarriage. Then another. After the 3rd loss the NHS started looking into what was wrong. Found out I have a rare chromosome disorder - I could get pregnant easily, but not with a baby that could survive long past birth. My mental health was in tatters & every mother’s day I would sit at home sobbing feeling like a mother without a child. Every so often someone I’d just met would innocently ask “do you have kids?” Or worse an acquaintance would say “No kids yet?! You and your husband best get a move on!” I often burst into tears & exited conversations leaving people mystified as to what they’d done wrong. The question “do you have kids?” seems so innocuous - but it isn’t, & I recommend avoiding it. (I think Leena mentioned this question in a video about things to stop saying in your 20’s if I remember correctly). I’m 32 now & have a wonderful son - who I had via donor egg ivf. Unfortunately the labour left me with ptsd & an inability to carry further children. Having one child took me: 5 years, 4 losses, 3 surgeries, 2 blood transfusions, 1 round of IVF & a labour that nearly cost me my life. Having a child is so personal & many don't understand how hard it can be to get pregnant, keep a pregnancy, be pregnant, give birth & be a parent (particularly an ND one &/or one with physical or mental impairments). I think it’s so important as a society to share our experiences, learn more about experiences outside of our own, & support each others choices
I'm so sorry you had to go through all of that, I can't even imagine how that must have felt 💔 but thank you so much for sharing and I hope you are enjoying life with your son very much.
It is SO HARD being a Mother with ASD/ADHD and other comorbid disorders that come up on a daily basis. Add to that parenting kids with SD/ADHD and other comorbid disorders as well. I feel like I am about 120 years old. I just want to let you know that you are doing an amazing job every single day. You are strong and capable and amazing.
As someone who has children I 100% agree with thus video and all the different comments you have made. No one should be made to feel they have to have children and children deserve to be wanted. Having children is hard work so wanting to have them is important before having children. I know someone don't have the choice to have children or not but for the people that do it really is important.
LEENA. THE TERROR THAT YOU INSTILLED IN ME WITHIN THE FIRST 5 SECONDS ON THIS VIDEO 😭😭 I live in the US and mother's day isn't until May I was so scared 😭😭
As a child/teenager, I always thought I would have kids in the future because everyone would always tell me I was good with kids (I had young cousins and babysat). Then my siblings had kids. I love my nephews and nieces and love spending time with them, but I also love that I can go back to my quiet and peaceful home after hanging out with them. I still love kids but I now realize that I don’t want to be around them 24/7. I want to be able to have hobbies, do whatever I want whenever I want, travel, relax, work on myself, etc. Kids just wouldn’t allow me to live the way I want.
Mentioned this in the live chat but I’d put it here too. Lost my Mum at young age and don’t have any children of my own at the moment, so I use Mother’s Day as a day to treat myself because if my Mum were here still I’d be treating her. Came up with the idea a few years ago and have been doing it ever since, which has helped take the edge off what otherwise would’ve been a bit of a rubbish day. Just thought I’d share for those who might find Mother’s Day a hard day to get through ❤
This reminds me of a beautiful poem by Donna Ashworth, I think it's called "Loss", which talks about how the best thing you can do to honour a lost loved one is love yourself how they loved you. ♥️
I love this. I have a friend who lost her mother to alcohol when she was a young adult. I always send her a text on Mother's Day. I know it's a difficult day for her and I want her to know that she is not alone. My own family doesn't care much about Mother's Day, so I have the capacity to think of her instead.
@@Conval-wi5eh I love this! My friend always messages me on Mother’s Day to see how I’m doing. Friends supporting friends on difficult days is always appreciated.
as the person who currently has a 6 week old baby napping on them rn, the book that felt super honest and still very hopeful about pregnancy and motherhood that I read while I was pregnant myself was Nobody Told Me by Hollie McNish. I keep shoving it into people's hands when they tell me that they're pregnant!
I must get that book, love HM- and congrats! got an 8 month old having nappy-free time on me right now and trying to chew her foot- i'm loving this stage...
One that I'm currently reading (very slowly because of how emotionally intense it feels for me) is "Crying on H Mart" It hits so hard as a Korean person being born and raised elsewhere. The idea that your parents are the only link you have to "your culture" and the implications of losing that link when the inevitable eventually happens. It has me in tears at every chapter
Maya Angelou is one of my favourite writers! I was gifted one book and have gone on to buy and read almost everything she's written. Highly highly recommend!
41 years old and don't want kids, never seriously did. I have gorgeous nephews and nieces that mean the world to me. I get to hug them, nurture them, spend money and time on their interests. But I also get to keep my own life:)
I have known ever since I was a child that I do not want kids of my own, although I’m firm on my choice I am also scared it will change because ultimately it’s not something I want and I feel it would hinder my quality of life. But for any parents out there raising kids with all the love they have, you’re amazing and so powerful.
Agreed, I hate when women are villainsed for not wanting to have children. Penny and Bernadette from "The Big Bang Theory" were upfront about not wanting to have children, only to end up having some by the end, or in Penny's case, being revealed to be pregnant. It's ultimately your choice, and it doesn't matter if people try to guilt trip you by saying that you'll change your mind.
The one that annoyed me the most is Temperance from Bones! They totally destroyed the character just so she can be a mommy. I hate when they do that in tv shows! ''Oh, she's pregnant, ups, nothing we can do here.'' Well, then the plot should be she's getting an abortion.
I don't know why people do that - to force others to have babies - there are already so many unwanted children, why create another one? I have children, because I wanted them, but that only enhances the feeling that child needs to be wanted. I have so many deprived friends from "normal families" who were born just because and considered annoying or even worse by their parents. I don't see any point in that, it's so terrible for them to live with that whole their life :/ (And these are not even abused or otherwise neglected children - just unwanted.)
‘Birth isn’t an in and out experience, nor should we expect it to be’ absolutely hit me! I’m 28 and ‘on the fence’. Growing up, I really thought I wanted kids, I wavered a bit around uni/early 20s before I met my now fiancé at 24 and felt sure again I wanted a family in that way. Suddenly these past couple of months, the reality of that has hit me. What if something happens? What if it’s not a healthy pregnancy? What if the child grows up unhappy? If I make a mistake? If I REGRET having kids? If I can’t cope? You can’t just take it back and that’s so daunting. The more I focus on the ‘what ifs’ the more I wonder how anyone chooses parenthood? Edited to add: I’ve also been referred for an autism diagnosis, I find lack of routine, conflicting or loud noises etc very difficult which adds another layer of worry
There is no logic to choosing to be a parent. I found the more you mull it over, the more you come up with reasons not to - either I wasnt in a job i loved, didnt have a big 'forever' home, wasnt sure how I'd fit childcare around work. My decision ultimately came down to the fact my partner was keen to be a parent and it was an alright (but not perfect) time when both our parents were still well enough to look after our daughter whilst I worked (as was the tradition in both our families and one I hope to continue), and I had recently qualified and been promoted so we were financially more well off and I had more time to dedicate since I wasn't studying for the first time in 11 years 😅 (however there is never enough time for parenting ever!). I never realised just how strong the desire was to be a mother until about 6 weeks after having her. She has filled my life up completely and changed my path forever.
I remember clearly saying to my baby's dr at 6 week check up. "I am so underprepared as a parent I'm stunned that society doesn't prepare us" I think he mentally ticked off a note in his head "mother acknowledges vulnerability will seek help - good parent" Parenting is exhausting in the modern age. More so if ND. Tips for parents with autism - noise cancelling headphones, parenting will likely become a special interest, clear your schedule so you do not have work or business responsibilities - parenting is massive load on an ND person ....but ND kids can really thrive with a parent that is ND like them ...
as even someone who doesn't want kids, I feel for you! society really needs to support parents better. I hope you get lots of support and your partnership is/remains equal!!
Being autistic myself (and just having had an ADHD assessment recommended 😅) I wonder what it would be like to have a kid who was autistic in a way that was different to me. I wonder how much of my quiet personality is to do with nature or nurture... My partner is naturally loud and chaotic (but able to regulate some of that as an adult) and what if we had a loud and chaotic kid?? Would I cope? I love working with children though! My dad says that no one is prepared to be a parent and that you just adapt (he's also realising he's autistic)
The more years pass by, the more knowledge you get and wiser you become, the more reasons AGAINST having children that you wonder how can anyone still want them? Nowadays it is the most selfish and irresponsible thing a person can do and the reasons are many!
Child free but in a relationship with someone who has one. I was never set on having them but proximity to parenting has made me CERTAIN I don't want to have my own. Very very occasionally, I get a hormone related "omg I am running out of time" - but it always passes very quickly. I admire women who can do it. Especially in today's world. It is so hard.
I have a step kid and a bio kid and it so not the same! You can make decisions and have authority with your own kid. The love you feel is different. I feel as a nanny or teacher would for my step kid who is now 13, and I feel like bio kid is my heart and soul.
Love to read about that experience here as well. I'm in the same situation and it's interesting how it's impacted my view on having kids. I do see the point that bio kids and step kids aren't the same. But in general I am an introvert, and I've once read "if you recharge by being alone you should really think long and hard about having kids" and I think there's some truth to it. I'm already exhausted after a weekend with the 4 year old of my boyfriend.
@@Jojo-kl6tx oh four year olds can be tough. Phew! But that doesn't last. I met my step daughter when she was five and it was very overwhelming. The childfree step moms suffer a lot. I'm an introvert and also a bit autistic so I love alone time. My husband is hands on and I blinked and now he's 4. End of the day it's your choice, but I'm glad I didn't listen when I was told out "you'll never be able to handle a child".
If you are in a committed relationship with someone who has a kid, you are not child-free (maybe if the kid is an adult, but child-free folks avoid that too for the most part). And if you were never set on having them or not, you are a fence-sitter, not child-free. Childfree folks don't want any kids in their life, step-kids included. Childless folks are usually those who want kids but can't have them. And fence-sitters are the ones who aren't sure what they want. Sorry to bit nitpicky but they are very different groups and it's annoying when they get mixed. That's why many child-free folks get annoying comments like ''Oh, I know so many people who changed their minds, you will too.''
@@Kristina-ek8yt I guess I needed a distinction for a women with no bio kids. I also feel like single dad's go after these women, dumping all the child care on them and guilting them if they don't do it. Like she'll get shamed and guilted "you knew what you were getting into dating him" when they never go after the man and say to him "you knew what you were getting into dating a non parent" .
As a feminist atheist who grew up in a patriarchal, ultra orthodox religious city- the uphill battle I have to fight to get people to respect my bodily autonomy is ridiculous! I do not want biological children and they cannot respect that this is what I'm choosing to do with MY OWN body. To me, doing nothing is the norm and if you do something, you need a good reason to do it, especially if it impacts other people. But somehow having kids is the default and you need a good 'excuse' not too. My brother and his wife can barely look after themselves and they've made the frankly selfish decision to have a child they can't look after properly. People say it's selfish to not have kids, I think it's selfish to have kids you can't look after because you expect them to look after you when you're old.
That blows. I agree with you. Having kids is more selfish than to not have them since your choice gets inflicted on someone else. Hope you can eventually cut all the ties you need to cut to thrive and everything works out great for you.
'The Natural Mother of The Child' by Krys Malcolm Belc is a memoir on being a nonbinary parent! I'm 23 yo with a 5 month old. I started preparering to have a child when I was 17, researching and reading parenting stuff, listening to parenting podcasts etc... Just always knew I wanted to be a mom. None of my friends are thinking about having kids yet. My best friend is pretty sure she doesn't want any, and I support her fully. I love being a mom, and this has always been my dream - but I think people do and should be allowed to, have different dreams, ones that don't involve having kids. I would never wanna convince someone of having a kid they didn't really want, just because I think its the best thing that ever happened to me.
Childless person in my mid 40's here. Personally becoming an Aunt at 16 really helped with giving me a realistic view of babies and motherhood. It didn't put me off but it sure as hell didn't allow me to have a rose tinted view either! Thanks Leena for the book recommendations :-)
I'm a midwife so have bit of a professional interest in these type of books - a couple of these have gone straight onto my MUST HUNT DOWN IMMEDIATELY list. Thank you!
Although I am still unsure if I will have children one day, I am truly fascinated by pregnancy and motherhood as a human experience. I am currently reading a book called 'Letters to My Weird Sisters: On Autism and Motherhood', and I think it would be a great addition to this list. Thank you for another great video Leena! My TBR list is growing longer......
I have this weird thing with the concept of having kids. Buckle up this is going to be a long one. I never wanted children. If you ask my longest friends they'll say: "She's been saying this since 14." I never saw myself as more than a very complicated wreck, chaos with a strange beauty of being alive. But also my own mother raised me with this concept of that I carry all my ancestors and if I don't continue the line of my family somehow everything has been wasted. Everything will be wasted. So I catch myself sometimes thinking that I need to be a mother, I need to have a child, because I don't want my grandmother's eyes or my father's way of smiling be lost to time. But I don't want to be pregnant. I don't want to have a child I need to care for. I already hate working as much as I do because it leaves no room to breath & enjoy my creativity. I do not see me being happy with that decision. Then almost a year ago the first couple in my close circle got pregnant. I congratulated them but they live farther away from me & so I didn't get to see so much of her pregnancy. They came around for New Years and I visited them one day to meet their son. I was nervous, babies usually hate me, (my mom jokingly calls it "Demon Energy") I guess they can feel me radiating that I'm unsure of how to handle them. Their son was lovely. He smiled, he made happy noises, when they gave him to me, he instantly grabbed onto my hair. He was really sweet. I got to carry him in his little carrier close to my chest when we went on a walk so he could sleep. He slept well despite not knowing me for a long time. I enjoyed my day. I got home very happy that I met my friends and how happy they are with their little cuddle bug. I thought a lot about it since then. My friend even asked me why I didn't want to be a mother. And I said: "I don't see myself fit for it. I hate the thought of being pregnant and growing something and I don't want to have to take care of someone all the time with my mental health." And that is still true. I loved being able to meet their son. I love this little kid and I now know I will love all of my friends kids. But it's not what I want. And I will have to live with that feeling seeing everyone complete their "next steps in Life" and have them make experiences & decisions I may never understand. And on some days that makes me sad. It is suddenly as if your not belonging somewhere anymore. But it's my choice and I like to have it. I will be a great "aunt" instead.
The end of your comment made me tear up. It's so hard not to compare even if it's something you don't really want for yourself. Have trust that sticking to your gut feelings is the right thing for you. Bigs hugs!
This is fascinating to read, thank you for sharing. My daughter is 2.5 and something that really shocked me in my own parenting journey is that I've really been able to continue my passions and interests, as well as finding new ones that my daughter loves. Now this isn't me saying you should become a mother! I could never say that, because my experience is my own, and your experience is yours. I just find it completely beautiful how sure you are, and yet how much you enjoy a tiny human. I think it's important for us parents to open up our worlds to include child free friends/members of the community.
I had this "ancestor complex" for a while too. Until I realised sth. Almost no one knows their great grandparents, we will all be forgotten within three generations. I found that kind of freeing. You don't owe anything to previous generations. You're not wasting anything. Time passes and stuff happens, then it gets lost to time and that's ok and unavoidable
I have the ancestor thing and I thought I was alone. I come from a family of hardworking, unwavering, kind and generous, poor people. As a family we suck, but individually, we are badass humans. Sometimes I can't bear the thought that this all will die with me. I feel like the world needs more people like us, and my husband is an amazing man, he would be such a great dad. But I don't want to do it. I don't want the birth, the risk to my mental health, the dedication to someone else 100% of the time... I don't know what to do with this information most of the time. Thank you for sharing your perspective.
I just had my mother corner me and tell me she’s willing to pay to have my eggs frozen in case I change my mind about not wanting kids why is it when someone decides they do want to have kids no says ‘are you sure?’.. but me not wanting them is the end of the world? I just feel icky and like my feelings aren’t being taken into consideration
As someone with an 8.5 year old who STILL struggles with post-natal depression with psychosis symptoms (that I never had prior), thank you. Going to buy What Have I Done now :)
Growing up I always believed that the only people who didn’t have kids were the ones who always knew they didn’t want them and probably didn’t like kids much. I love babies/toddlers and am fascinated by pregnancy, birth and breastfeeding (I am a labor and delivery nurse) so I always assumed I would be a mother. But now, as I’m getting to the age where people around me are having children, I’m not so sure. I’ve never connected well with pre-teens and teens and spending my days driving between school and extracurricular sounds like a nightmare. Children are expensive and i so value the financial flexibility I have as a child-free adult. I am not sure what I want, but I believe parenthood is a decision that people should make enthusiastically and I am so greatful for nuanced conversations on the topic as I navigate this question.
Leena, as a person with endometriosis and unsure whether I will be able to have children, I'm thankful for all conversations about different versions of a fulfilled life that may or may not include children. I'm also grateful about the recommendations. I've noticed that many of us in circles conscious of social justice and climate catastrophe issues perhaps unknowingly reproduce a lot of language à la "it's irresponsable to bring a child into this broken planet" which is much more nuanced in fact (countries with lowest birth rates often those contributing most to climate catastrophe, it's a matter of how resources are used more than anything), plus once you read into it there are really gross and nefarious links to right wing and generally racist eugenic groups and conspiracy theories (replacement theory for example) that spread lots of misinformation about overpopulation. Long story short, I like that you provided concise recommendations that deal with an individual's choice about parenthood.
Ecofascism is a term linked to that rhetoric you mentioned, stuff about "the earth is just overpopulated" etc. Thanks for sharing your perspective. I am most likely infertile, but I don't have a desire to have children. I am very afraid of pregnancy and childbirth and about the commitment and responsibility of having children. I hope I can be a positive presence in the lives of my friends' future children. That will be enough.
Oh such a great comment! I remember reading an article about the overpopulation argument and couldn’t believe how long I was uninformed before. Reminds me of the podcasts Maintenance Phase and You’re wrong about, they touch on Eugenics too for example!
Hey, wishing you a fulfilling journey whether or not bio kids fits into that; endometriosis sounds so painful. Also glad for the point about nuance. Ezra Klein pointed out a role for optimism in a recent podcast on deciding whether to have kids- as far as that is a decision we're in control of. I found the nihilism in a couple of responses here a tad troubling; that parenting is some kind of problematic norm, when my worry for my daughter is that conservatives seem to have no qualms in challenging falling birth rates. I've seen conservative pronatalists point out a hypocrisy in what they see as progressives' professed interest in collectivity but seeing individual happiness/life course as a prime factor in deciding whether or not to have kids. I want the village to be a diverse, inclusive one- having my daughter has made me worry about her life course in a different way to my previous professed concerns for future generations. Basically I think we need to have more honest conversations about demography and the positive potentials of having kids, in ways that don't lead to ethnonationalism or denial of reproductive rights. For example, I was 37 when I had my daughter and while we've thankfully been ok health-wise, there's a bit of me that wishes I'd thought more seriously about fertility and family-building earlier on. In reality I had to battle with thyroid/PCOS issues and a long relationship with a narcissist who I knew deep down would not be a good person to have a kid with, before meeting my now-husband and conceiving my daughter. She's a big source of joy as well as fucking hard work. Anyway, this turned into waffle but again, I hope you get to choose what you want.
I think reproduction is a personal choice that we cannot take from people, so we can't stop people from having kids and we can't force people to have kids. However, I think overpopulation is a valid concern. Luckily for us, once people have access to birth control, we actually dip below replacement rate (which may be a concern for the future - maybe we will have to see how to support parents better if we don't want humans to go extinct in a few hundred years, assuming we don't go extinct before that for another reason). I don't like the assumption that it's the poor countries that are overpopulated - europe and north america have some of the most overpopulated countries. Current birth rates are a bit irrelevant since it was only two or three generations ago that anyone got access to birth control. My grandma had 7 or so siblings, and so did many other people's grandparents. I also don't like the assumptions that people in poor countries are having 8 children because somehow they just love kids - there's no reason an African person would biologically want a different number of children than a European person, and we can see that they don't since once people immigrate to rich countries with access to birth control, they generally don't have as many children. The reality is, many of the people in the poor countries having so many children don't have a choice, there is no access to birth control or abortion, and often they are giving birth alone in a hut and may not even know who the "sperm donor" is. They deserve birth control too. The earth just does not have an infinite carrying capacity. I used to think "overpopulation is a myth" too, but then I had a look at google maps satellite view and was shocked by how much of the earth is destroyed to support farms, which humans need to live. The earth is not just for humans, plants and animals deserve space too. We are an invasive species unfortunately, but luckily most people don't want many children, and we fall below replacement rate when people have a choice. Choice is really the answer to overpopulation.
I read this line recently in a book ( Nettle & Bone) "The history of the world was written in women’s wombs. And women’s blood” and it struck hard. It'd definitely refreshing that these days people and especially women can choose if they want to have kids versus having some duty to reproduce because of past history of the human kind and other people's expectations. I have a 2 year old and for years I've been asked when I"m having kids simply because I've been with my partner for 19 years now, it's honestly exhausting and a bit intrusive. And once I had my child the same people started asking when I'm having more, it just doesn't stop lol. And it's definitely a lot more work and worry than people assume. When you have a kid your heart is outside of your body and you constantly worry, at least I do as a pretty sensitive person.
Last year, I celebrated mother's day as a mom, 2 days after giving birth for the first and only time. This past year has been eye-opening in many ways and I feel differently about my own mother, grandmother, sister, and myself this year than I even did last year immediately after birth. I want a book about motherhood/parenthood changing overtime. And I don't mean in the shallow way of "It's hard when they can't put their own shoes on, but then it's hard when they can put their own shoes on but refuse to."
I love this idea. The relationship between a father and a daughter. I think the trope of Daddy issues focuses on the aftermath of a not so great relationship between a father and a daughter but what does it mean to be a girl dad, and a healthy relationship between a father and a daughter
I read a novel at the start of this year called A Woman of Intelligence by Karin Tanabe that was a really interesting look at motherhood, it dealt with a woman who desperately loved her kids but also desperately wanted to escape from being only their mum and having no identity outside of motherhood. It was full on and could be really bleak at times but I found it illuminating and sobering
I want to add to the list “The Argonauts” by Maggie Nelson! It’s a memoir that really goes into all the complicated feelings of pregnancy and motherhood from the perspective of a *super* queer family. I love Maggie Nelson because she brings so much theory and thoughtfulness to very emotional and messy topics.
As someone who is now 31 and very child free, I really appreciate this video. Also as someone who has a complicated relationship with my own mom, I now have some books to look into. 😅
I had not even hoped Leena would make a whole video on this topic but I'm so happy she did! I do not have nor do I want kids but I have a deep interests in learning about parenting and family psychology and about why people decide to have or not to have kids. Thank you for this! I've only read Sheila Heiti's book so far and I'm excited to discover the other ones from this selection!
My feelings of motherhood have been on a spectrum but after reviewing how much came from internal ableism and a guilt of what about all those children who need homes. I think a lot of it was also my awkward feelings around being an independent women and my deep want to run a house and be a mother. This was something my partner and I really worked through together over time. He never wanted to limit me and my opinions for work (family farm so isolated from my engineering work), and we both had some internal thoughts we had to work through about the value of motherhood. Now I think I want kids and I have worked through the guilt of this just because I was pushed into traditional roles and got out doesn't mean I shouldn't be a mum. Anyway thank you Leena for discussing this so open
Thank you for sharing this! My partner and I are certain we don’t want children, though I’m looking forward to reviewing some of these books to understand different perspectives. I also found listening to motherhood podcasts (Happy Mum, Happy Baby, for example) helpful to gather a bunch of perspectives.
Thank you for this Leena. I've added many of these to my tbr. I'm the same age as you but have always known I wanted to be a mother, but I've never looked deeper into that desire. I've a very complicated relationship with my mother (we pretend it is anything but) so I feel like reading and understanding more perspectives around motherhood can only be a good thing. Especially if it can help me teach my daughter to be true to herself as she grows. Thank you for sharing.
As a mother of 3, I’m extremely worried about the world that I’ve brought them into, with so many world leaders completely unconcerned about our climate by the 2030’s (when my oldest will be in his 30’s) and in 2040’s when my 2 youngest will be in their 30’s) - when my kids will be thinking about kids…
I'm 44 and I have never felt the want or need to have children. I think it was clear fairly early in my life - when I was a kid I never had any dolls, I had a baby carriage for dolls but I put my stuffed animals in there! I've had people (that obviously didn't know me very well) throughout tell me that "oh, you'll regret it!". I find that incredibly odd. Why this need to interfere in other people's life decisions? And what if I *had* a child and regretted that? Let people choose what's best for themselves.
I've just gone through the egg freezing process to make sure I can still have the option of children after chemo. I'm not even a mother and I feel like I'm protecting my children already, so here I go adding all of these books to my tbr! Another book on motherhood I'd recommend (it made me ugly cry on the train) is All My Mothers by Joanna Glen about how different women in your life can be your mother, not just your biological mother
Leena! Thank you so much! I am studying to be a midwife and I think I am going to read all of these books! I know a lot about many of these topics (like post partum depression) but I think it will be good to have the „other“ perspective :)
Very interesting video - since becoming a parent there really is no way to understand the brilliance of it - I thought I didn’t want children but have had one and it’s been completely mind blowing. I have learnt more over these past two years than ever and have a deep sense of purpose now. I wish I’d had a child younger now. It’s completely magical. However I definitely understand it’s not for all especially if you don’t have family support.
I feel like I'm answering all the comments on this page haha, same tho! I had a baby at 39 and he's 2 years and 4 months old as of today and I'm finally starting to feel like I have a normal routine and get my sleep and feel more like a functioning human. The amount of patience you have to harness each day is astronomical.
Yes, such a huge decision and the more you ponder and consider the better for you and for any children you may or may not have. For myself it was a yes and over the past 19 years I have had periods of self doubt about that decision but have never questioned whether it was the right decision for me. That said the majority of my friends did not have children and they are also quite happy with their lives. The older you get the more you realize it's not the choice you make but how you build your life around that choice that will determine your satisfaction and happiness.
I love motherhood, it's the best thing I've ever done and I've never been happier. I don't find it any where near as hard as I expected but we are all good at different things and I don't think everyone should have kids and I am not surprised that not everyone wants kids. I think saying you love motherhood, you find it easy and you are happy is a bit taboo, I've had people call me a liar, smug or anti feminist for just saying how I feel but that's not fair either. We are all different, I don't want to run a marathon, I wouldn't enjoy it and I would find it nearly impossible. There will be people out there who love marathons who relish them and don't find them that difficult. We celebrate them, but we judge mothers who say the same thing. I think we won't move on as a society until women stop viewing people who make different choices to them a judgment on their own choices. If you choose to be child free amazing enjoy it. If you choose to have children amazing enjoy it. Pitting one against the other is just misogyny thinly disguised.
Loved this video a lot and added a fair few to my TBR! As a childfree person, I am also guilty of some of these books seeming irrelevant to me. But you've convinced me as always Leena! 😀
I'm pregnant with my second babe, my first was a preemie but thankfully very healthy and didn't need a nicu stay, but the description of mother ship is making me sob. I just couldn't imagine not being able to hold and feed my baby, its the most instinctual act and my heart goes out to preemie parents especially mothers
I think that as feminists we need to support mothers more. We frame it as this choice but so many people don’t really get that much of a choice or chose it so long ago it’s not really relevant anymore that they once ‘chose it’, but our culture leaves no room for regret. I prefer thinking of children as an oppressed class and we all have some kind of responsibility for bringing up the next generation however small, and supporting mothers along the way. I feel really sorry for mums who gave up their lives to do the most important job in the world with no compensation and they live in regret with no support. So many didn’t have any this information before they had kids.
This was such an interesting video! I wanted to add that my favorite exploration of motherhood in Expectation was actually (spoilers ahead) with the child free character going back to be with her mother after her mom tells her she has terminal cancer. The end of life care and shifting relationship from daughter to carer and mother to patient is really well written and so beautiful. I was actually really glad to have read it before my father passed as it genuinely shifted my perspective on death and loss.
Have 2 children. Don't regret it but also can't recommend. Totally respect how anyone wishes to mother - be that their own children, other children or just other people or whether to not. Relationships are just hard and complex
All of these books seem wonderful, but maybe it's a mix between having a complicated relationship with my mom, being on my period and being a mom myself, I feel like every one of those is going to make me cry. Not going to stop me from putting them on my TBR list, especially Maya Angelou's book. I've never even heard of that one. I have a lot of friends that have chosen not to be mothers and I can't wait to share some of these books with them!
The book I read while having motherhood conversations with myself was "The Red Tent", which shows so many aspects of motherhood, women hood, etc. Really beautifully written too. Great episode!!
Thank you for this! Couldn't agree more with everything you said. Am childfree by choice myself (also by circumstance but I now identify more with childfree by choice). I'll be hunting down these books, can't wait to read them. I already own and ADORE Motherhood by Sheila Heti.
Think I will read some of these over the next years, thanks for making the list. A book I feel handles different variations of motherhood/pregnancy/ really well is Little Fires Everywhere by Celeste Ng.
For those who are up for a well researched nothing-but-hot-facts kinda book: I cannot gush enough about abigail tuckers "mum genes: Inside the New Science of Our Ancient Maternal Instinct". although the title is kinda misleading, because she explains quite well why humans do NOT have a mother instinct. this book seriously blew my mind. there are so many interesting biological things happening with motherhood, like part of your childrens DNA staying in your body and growing livers for you when your own don't work anymore; or how becoming a mother changes your brains grey matter in the same magnitude like having a car accident; or why new mums are shit at remembering anything but why they stay calm at earthquakes. if non-fiction is for you, you will love this book!
Regretting Motherhood by Orna Donath really cemented for me that I do not want to be a mother. Really recommend to anyone who wants to explore the topic
Thank you for this video Leena. This year Mother’s Day is a bit different for me. My mum and I have a great relationship but she’s now been in intensive care and under sedation for four weeks following being hit by a reckless driver. Looking forward to reading a couple of these books to reflect on motherhood while my mum isn’t with me yet. It’s felt like a strange in between phase but she is healing
I wonder if the day will come when I am not startled by the British Mother's Day in thinking that I've somehow forgotten Mother's Day... Thank you for the list Leena. I've always known I'm not going to have kids, but what I wasn't prepared for when I became an adult was people's reactions when they started finding out, and books were there for me during that whole experience ❤
Thank you so much for this video! It is exactly what I needed. The question of whether or not to become a mother seems to be a big one in my friend group at the moment!
(I haven't read it all the way through but--) What My Mother and I Don't Talk About is a collection of essays by different writers discussing their relationships to mothers and it's so far really, really good. This list you've compiled looks so good, I have added most to my tbr!
I'm late to the party so you probably won't see this, but to be fair mother's day is this weekend in Canada where I live. A book to try for non-binary parenting perspectives is "Like a Boy But Not a Boy" by Andrea Bennet. It is a collection of essays. It's on my TBR but I unfortunately haven't gotten to it yet.
I enjoyed this video a lot. I'd also recommend Nobody Told Me by Hollie McNish. I would love recommendations for books about/by women who don't want children and have happy, fulfilling lives. Lately there are more books about different types of parenting, and many about people who want to be parents and can't, which is great, and I've enjoyed these perspectives. But as someone who doesn't want kids I'd also like to read that and the different lives that can be lived instead. Recently I read Great Circle by Maggie Shipsted and appreciated that, and I have Diana Athill's memoirs, but it's so hard to find these kind of experiences. Even articles about being child free always include a line about the writer "of course" loving kids, as if you constantly have to make it extra clear that you're not some kind of monster by not wanting them for yourself.
Not a mother or an artist, but I really learned from the reflections on Birds, Art, Life and immediately gave it to one of the artist/mothers in my life.
So excited to read every single book on that list!! I gave birth 4 weeks ago, the pregnancy was very much planned and I did everything I could to prepare for it mentally and physically, but I could never imagine how hard post partum period is, especially breastfeeding. I always feel like a biggest failure when I talk about it, but I hate it. Yes, because of the pain and various troubles we had, but I also just hate the feeling of it. I’ve never heard anyone talk about it so that feels pretty lonely. I just want my body back after 9 months of playing host to someone.
The first few months are really hard! Hang in there, it gets easier. Those feelings are absolutely valid! Breastfeeding is hard, and sharing our bodies is a lot, both mentally and physically. Fed is best, and formula is perfectly fine. I think I remember the UA-camr unnatural vegan mentioned the same thing: she didn't enjoy the feeling of breastfeeding, but felt pressure as it's expected to be natural and beautiful. She has a few videos on breastfeeding.
I'm pretty sure in my decision, but I love that you're giving us homework to further affirm or broaden our view in the matter, I'm taking note and adding some books to my tbr (my resolution to not buy any new books until I'm done with what I already own is my biggest failure every year)
I have a baby and I wanted to have kids, although I was VERY pressured to have kids by my mother so sometimes I wonder if I would have still chosen to have a baby if it weren’t for that. I love my baby and overall I’m glad I have her and I have no regrets about it. But I will ALWAYS support women who choose not to!!
For me the choice to become a mother was something I was not sure about, then vaguely thought I would want, then knew I wanted, then became like a fundemental Need. It's hard to explain but it really did feel like a non negotiable Drive. When I pictured my future I saw myself baking cookies with a little kid, going on bush walks with them etc (idealised of course but there u go). Now I am a new mum of a 7 month old and still figuring out this new version of me, it's been abit challenging and uncomfortable but tbh I kind of expected it to be. I knew I wanted to become a mum but I also knew that becoming a new person would involve some growing pains. It's also something that's very personal and hard to explain so I would defs love to read more works examining and exploring motherhood 🙂
Non binary parenting book: The natural mother of the child (not read so can't review but on my TBR) Other awesome parenting/pregnancy books: Killing the black body Battling over birth The attachment parenting book Honestly adoption
I've not read it myself, but I've heard good things about The Argonauts by Maggie Nelson, who is non-binary and gender fluid and it's at least partially about their experience with pregnancy.
I would recommend Milk: An Intimate History of Breastfeeding. It's a history of breastfeeding through the eyes of an art historian, as well as memoir of the author's personal experiences. I learned a lot and it helped me (as a mother) feel less alone when it came to feeding my baby too. I would also highly recommend anything by Emily Writes - Rants in the Dark was her first book, but she has three, and they are all a series of stories of varying length about her experiences as a mother (she has two boys). They are a really real look at motherhood that will make you laugh and cry.
Interesting how I watched the book burning video before this one specifically because the title of this filled me with dread. Now that I'm here I wish I'd watched it when it came out as my mother is a narcissist I no longer speak to and her birthday is the same week as Mother's Day. I'm "on the fence" and don't know if it's because I don't want children or that I'm terrified of turning into my mother. Definitely going to pick up Sheila Heti 📚
I thought I read a lot of books about this topic but you proved me wrong, going to make sure I read everything on this list! Some of my favourites are 'Regretting Motherhood' by Orna Donath (interviews of women who live in a culture where women are expected to have children) & 'The Natural Mother of the Child' by Krys Malcolm Bec (nonbinary and brief IVF topics). Honorable fiction mentions are With Teeth and Nightbitch!
This is an excellent list! I loved Letter to my Daughter. Another one I would suggest is Dear Girls by Ali Wong. I deeply enjoyed that one while I was pregnant!
It's really funny how, recently, my best friend told me that she was no longer sure whether she wants to be pregnant. A thought that I have also been having for the last 6 months. We both want to become mothers, were sure of that but we both are worried about the possible physiological and psychological effects that pregnancy could have on us. So this topic is very much present in my thoughts almost daily.
For a queer, if not non-binary perspective, I really enjoyed the conversation around motherhood in Detransition Baby - it really examines how the idea of mothering connects with gender and sexuality, the ways that our sense of womanhood intersects with motherhood, and how society is often cruel to moms and parents who don't appear or present in a heteronormative way. I live in the US and I think representation of queer parenting is especially important right now given the political climate around lgbtq+ (and especially trans) rights in many states at the moment.
I have two wonderful children and they are the best thing that ever happened in my life. I've also been running on 3-4 hours of sleep per night for over two weeks now and am probably delusional.
I am still in the finding out process. For some time I was sure I did not want to have any kids but I also want to be curious about the thought if this is what I really want. I often was pressured by my mother to have kids and this only caused me to absolutely despise the thought.She was a neglegting and abusive mother herself and I would never want this experience for anybody else. I feel like I mothered my mother for lot of my life and I don't know if I would be able to have children with the experiences I made. I am still unsure what would be right for me. I certainly want some kind of family but of which kind is still a question I ask myself.
It's interesting that you mentioned "On Earth we're briefly gorgeous" in for this topic of motherhood, because that's definitely not what I have remembered the most about the book, but indeed it's strongly talking about it. That book was actually one of the only fiction that left me so sad and a bit annoyed at the saddest it made me feel! But I understand we don't always have the same experience for books! Otherwise, great video, and great recommendations, I definetely agree with what you say in the video, me not wanting children as well, because I think a lot of people jump into motherhood without really knowing what's implicated in the motherhood process.
I am 24 now and for the first time in my life I am thinking about becoming a parent one day. I love the idea of a child. My Partner (who I am really really lucky with) also dreams of that. But we both come from families with a lot of Trauma and very complicated parental relationships and are aware of what "being a bad parent" can lead to. So we're trying to be responsible and honest to ourselfs and give us a lot of time to think about this. Thank you for the book suggestions! For me personally the idea of being a loving, caring mother whilst having a mother that does not care about me since my Teenage years, so not having a role model, is very frightening. But maybe it can also be a healing experience with the right people by my side and maybe help from a therapist again when the time has come. Thinking about all the daughters that needed to accomplish life themselves ❤
Thank you for this video! I've known for most of my adult life that I want to be a parent but with a history of mental illness in the family, understanding everything about what could happen is important to me, so most of these, I'm sure, will end up on my TBR. Additionally, as you mentioned wanting to hear about the nonbinary experience of parenthood, the book The Natural Mother of the Child by Krys Malcolm Belc was a very interesting read. The collection of essays around parenting and birth from a nonbinary/trans perspective was really enlightening to read about. Non-book rec is also for Ash Hardell's channel More Ash and Gray as they are starting to share their experience with pregnancy and birth as the carrying partner in their relationship. It is a lot of information that I am happy they are sharing as it is demystifying the process as a whole.
Put nearly every book in this video on my TBR. I have never wanted kids but lately I've been doubting myself and I could really use some literature to guide me, especially as I'm coming off birth control (for unrelated reasons). I'm scared my hormones will trick me into wanting kids and then what will I do?!
Because in the UK, Mothering Sunday started off as a completely different thing, about returning to your "mother church" (i.e. the church where you were christened) during one Sunday in Lent, but more recently it has adopted the American tradition of "mothers day" as well. So it used to just be a church thing but now we use the same day for both celebrations. Not sure about Ireland but I assume it's the same reason.
There is no logic to choosing to be a parent. I found the more you mull it over, the more you come up with reasons not to - either I wasnt in a job i loved, didnt have a big 'forever' home, wasnt sure how I'd fit childcare around work. My decision ultimately came down to the fact my partner was keen to be a parent and it was an alright (but not perfect) time when both our parents were still well enough to look after our daughter whilst I worked (as was the tradition in both our families and one I hope to continue). I had recently qualified and been promoted so we were financially more well off and I had more time to dedicate since I wasn't studying for the first time in 11 years 😅 (however there is never enough time for parenting ever!). I never realised just how strong the desire was to be a mother until about 6 weeks after having her. She has filled my life up completely and changed my path forever.
great video. Whether you choose to have kids or not, I think it should absolutely not be something you do just because it's expected or "the thing." As my mother says, being a parent is the most important job in the world.
I would also recommend (M)otherhood by Pragya Agarwal - so interesting covering, traumatic birth, abortion, surrogacy and so much more! Great for expanding our knowledge of human experience!
Money played a HUGE part of why I changed my stance on birthing our children. Neither my partner nor I grew up with money and in my family I was the oldest and the youngest is 11 years younger. Seeing the struggles with having an infant was very impactful along with constantly being told how expensive we were. As I got older I was never worried about having money for children themselves but having money for me to continue being me and for us to continue with our goals for the future. Like if all of my teeth fell out due to pregnancy we can now afford the nice dental implants and still have the opportunity to travel. Class and wealth are huge factors in motherhood (especially in the US) that I wish were talked about a lot more.
I am childfree and don't want kids but I have three nephews who I absolutely adore. I really love kids and want to be a part of their lives, just don't want any of my own: Part of the village but not a mother.
Same here, 100%
That is so beautifully written. People who decide to have children need community and support from the village, and may I add, those who had the chance to experience having a cool „aunt“ person as a child like myself remember them so dearly I am sure - a refreshingly different life to witness :)
The childless auntie is a very important role in a child's life. Don't let anyone tell you that you aren't part of a village.
We need to judge each other less, in every area, including this one. Stay awesome and strong. 💪
That's exactly how my friend summed it up when I was talking about working with kids and adoring my friend's children but wanting none of my owb
I’m childfree and knew at toddlerhood that I didn’t want to be someone’s mom, and as a teenager knew that I didn’t want to experience childbirth. Now at the beginning of perimenopause I feel relief at the thought that soon motherhood cannot possibly be forced or coerced upon me.
Same sis, so pleased the "fear" to accidentally catch babies will soon be a thing of the past🎉
I have 2 children.
I had postpartum anxiety when I had my first, and while it was partially hormonal, it was also because no one prepared me at all for what motherhood actually is.
The best way to describe it is when people say “it’s like having your heart walking out in the world, unprotected.” Which you can’t even conceptualize until it happens.
I also found that people only prepared you for the “safe” topics like how many chores you’ll have to do. But what I really struggled with is my immense love for my children and the fact that it made everything else in my life meaningless by comparison.
And the best advice I ever read was: you didn’t just create a person, you created a relationship. That had helped me to contextualize all my interactions with my kids and not make it so “overwhelming.”
So much of western perspective on motherhood is “omg cute onesieeee!!! Baby cheeks!!!” And I realized how much I didn’t relate to that as a sort of “atypical woman.” The cuteness of a baby doesn’t have anything to do with my role as a mother. To me the cuteness almost does nothing for me, what I love about my kids is such a visceral and all-encompassing thing that cannot be summed up by decorating the nursery or doing more laundry than usual.
That makes me want to call my mother and tell her how much i love her. And i'm 35
this is so interesting. thank you for sharing
This is such a brilliant description. Thank you for sharing. I have one and this feels incredibly accurate.
This was tremendously helpful to me. Thank you.
I don't want kids- but I really do understand that feeling and frankly, this is one of a small handful of words I've read/heard that made me really reconsider my thoughts on motherhood.
Thank you for sharing.
I feel like a lot of people who say "you'll want them one day" haven't really unpacked the idea of personal choice and are instead stuck in the idea of the nuclear family. It's fab to have this video to send them to help educate them, rather than just saying "I deserve a choice" which usually, falls on deaf ears
I regret choosing motherhood!
Adrienne Rich's book "Of Woman Born" has a structural analysis of motherhood and helped me think through the reasons why I'm not a fan.
Great book recs, as usual. A big hug to you and every commenter.
I have an 8 months old. For me, so far, motherhood has meant living somewhere between flow and chaos, between survival and awe. It has felt like a brutal and beautiful metamorphosis.
Love it and don't regret it at all. Am also very glad I was able to chose and wait until I felt ready. (I am 32)
Thanks for this video Leena. I hope it’s okay to share my motherhood journey & raise awareness. TW: Recurrent pregnancy loss.
I’m a neurodiverse mum - I’m diagnosed with autism, adhd & ocd & also have chronic pain. Parenting is the hardest thing I’ve ever done. Think crying baby + sensory processing disorder, inability to change routine without extreme distress + toddler who naturally will not stick to a schedule etc. I know a lot of ND people who say they don’t want children because they are ND, but also some brilliant ND parents.
I didn’t really want children, but at 24 I fell pregnant & by the time I reached my 2nd trimester I felt like a mother - something I didn’t expect. Then I lost the baby - carried for weeks not knowing his heart had stopped (late missed miscarriage) & only found out when my womb turned sceptic & I collapsed. Fast forward a truly traumatic hospital stay & I was suddenly back to being an unpregnant childless person. But everything had changed - I felt the title of mum was ripped from me & I was obsessed with regaining it.
I got pregnant again, but by my 3rd scan the heart had stopped. I recovered from surgery & tried again. Another miscarriage. Then another. After the 3rd loss the NHS started looking into what was wrong. Found out I have a rare chromosome disorder - I could get pregnant easily, but not with a baby that could survive long past birth.
My mental health was in tatters & every mother’s day I would sit at home sobbing feeling like a mother without a child.
Every so often someone I’d just met would innocently ask “do you have kids?”
Or worse an acquaintance would say “No kids yet?! You and your husband best get a move on!” I often burst into tears & exited conversations leaving people mystified as to what they’d done wrong. The question “do you have kids?” seems so innocuous - but it isn’t, & I recommend avoiding it. (I think Leena mentioned this question in a video about things to stop saying in your 20’s if I remember correctly).
I’m 32 now & have a wonderful son - who I had via donor egg ivf. Unfortunately the labour left me with ptsd & an inability to carry further children.
Having one child took me: 5 years, 4 losses, 3 surgeries, 2 blood transfusions, 1 round of IVF & a labour that nearly cost me my life.
Having a child is so personal & many don't understand how hard it can be to get pregnant, keep a pregnancy, be pregnant, give birth & be a parent (particularly an ND one &/or one with physical or mental impairments). I think it’s so important as a society to share our experiences, learn more about experiences outside of our own, & support each others choices
wow, thank you so much for sharing, you are an incredibly strong person for going through all that ❤
I'm so sorry you had to go through all of that, I can't even imagine how that must have felt 💔 but thank you so much for sharing and I hope you are enjoying life with your son very much.
@@mollya8230 thank you so much♥️
@@LHMLHW thank you for your kind words ❤ I’m definitely enjoying life with my son - it’s hard work but he’s just brilliant & worth everything 😌
It is SO HARD being a Mother with ASD/ADHD and other comorbid disorders that come up on a daily basis. Add to that parenting kids with SD/ADHD and other comorbid disorders as well. I feel like I am about 120 years old. I just want to let you know that you are doing an amazing job every single day. You are strong and capable and amazing.
As someone who has children I 100% agree with thus video and all the different comments you have made. No one should be made to feel they have to have children and children deserve to be wanted. Having children is hard work so wanting to have them is important before having children. I know someone don't have the choice to have children or not but for the people that do it really is important.
LEENA. THE TERROR THAT YOU INSTILLED IN ME WITHIN THE FIRST 5 SECONDS ON THIS VIDEO 😭😭 I live in the US and mother's day isn't until May I was so scared 😭😭
Lol I had to google it, same!!
SAME
Yeah it's in May in Australia too 😅
It is in november here in norway. I suppose sometimes Lena torgets she has an audience outside u.k
SAME
As a child/teenager, I always thought I would have kids in the future because everyone would always tell me I was good with kids (I had young cousins and babysat). Then my siblings had kids. I love my nephews and nieces and love spending time with them, but I also love that I can go back to my quiet and peaceful home after hanging out with them. I still love kids but I now realize that I don’t want to be around them 24/7. I want to be able to have hobbies, do whatever I want whenever I want, travel, relax, work on myself, etc. Kids just wouldn’t allow me to live the way I want.
Mentioned this in the live chat but I’d put it here too.
Lost my Mum at young age and don’t have any children of my own at the moment, so I use Mother’s Day as a day to treat myself because if my Mum were here still I’d be treating her. Came up with the idea a few years ago and have been doing it ever since, which has helped take the edge off what otherwise would’ve been a bit of a rubbish day. Just thought I’d share for those who might find Mother’s Day a hard day to get through ❤
This reminds me of a beautiful poem by Donna Ashworth, I think it's called "Loss", which talks about how the best thing you can do to honour a lost loved one is love yourself how they loved you.
♥️
The poem is called "on those days", the book is Loss xx
I love this. I have a friend who lost her mother to alcohol when she was a young adult. I always send her a text on Mother's Day. I know it's a difficult day for her and I want her to know that she is not alone. My own family doesn't care much about Mother's Day, so I have the capacity to think of her instead.
@@Conval-wi5eh I love this! My friend always messages me on Mother’s Day to see how I’m doing. Friends supporting friends on difficult days is always appreciated.
@@SmoliverTwist So glad to hear that you have people around you that show you support :) It's a blessing.
Thanks for this video, Leena. It's normal for women not to have any kids during their lifetime. At the end of the day, it's their choice.
Absolutely!
I think like everything physical, it isn't purely a choice, although choices do come into it, and yes, it is very normal.
A woman that doesn't want to be a mother is dysfunctional.
ilove you leena norms ♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️
as the person who currently has a 6 week old baby napping on them rn, the book that felt super honest and still very hopeful about pregnancy and motherhood that I read while I was pregnant myself was Nobody Told Me by Hollie McNish. I keep shoving it into people's hands when they tell me that they're pregnant!
I must get that book, love HM- and congrats! got an 8 month old having nappy-free time on me right now and trying to chew her foot- i'm loving this stage...
One that I'm currently reading (very slowly because of how emotionally intense it feels for me) is "Crying on H Mart"
It hits so hard as a Korean person being born and raised elsewhere. The idea that your parents are the only link you have to "your culture" and the implications of losing that link when the inevitable eventually happens.
It has me in tears at every chapter
Ohh that is a wonderful book ❤️
I just finished that book! It was so beautiful all the way through
Okay but why did I cry when you read the part where Maya Angelou lists all the "daughters" her book is for?
Hot same
me too omg! almost puts me off reading it because how emotional will the whole thing make me if just that made me cry!
Same here!
Oh the entire book makes me cry, my copy is so dogearred. It really feels like a sit down with an older wiser mother. ❤
Maya Angelou is one of my favourite writers! I was gifted one book and have gone on to buy and read almost everything she's written. Highly highly recommend!
My subscription feed is full of Sims 4 infant update videos and then Leena questioning the whole idea of having infants. Quite fitting, I'd say.
Mine too! Ngl I assumed leena was a simmer not that it was Mother’s Day in the UK XD.
41 years old and don't want kids, never seriously did. I have gorgeous nephews and nieces that mean the world to me. I get to hug them, nurture them, spend money and time on their interests. But I also get to keep my own life:)
I have known ever since I was a child that I do not want kids of my own, although I’m firm on my choice I am also scared it will change because ultimately it’s not something I want and I feel it would hinder my quality of life. But for any parents out there raising kids with all the love they have, you’re amazing and so powerful.
Agreed, I hate when women are villainsed for not wanting to have children. Penny and Bernadette from "The Big Bang Theory" were upfront about not wanting to have children, only to end up having some by the end, or in Penny's case, being revealed to be pregnant. It's ultimately your choice, and it doesn't matter if people try to guilt trip you by saying that you'll change your mind.
The one that annoyed me the most is Temperance from Bones! They totally destroyed the character just so she can be a mommy. I hate when they do that in tv shows! ''Oh, she's pregnant, ups, nothing we can do here.'' Well, then the plot should be she's getting an abortion.
I don't know why people do that - to force others to have babies - there are already so many unwanted children, why create another one? I have children, because I wanted them, but that only enhances the feeling that child needs to be wanted. I have so many deprived friends from "normal families" who were born just because and considered annoying or even worse by their parents. I don't see any point in that, it's so terrible for them to live with that whole their life :/ (And these are not even abused or otherwise neglected children - just unwanted.)
‘Birth isn’t an in and out experience, nor should we expect it to be’ absolutely hit me! I’m 28 and ‘on the fence’. Growing up, I really thought I wanted kids, I wavered a bit around uni/early 20s before I met my now fiancé at 24 and felt sure again I wanted a family in that way. Suddenly these past couple of months, the reality of that has hit me. What if something happens? What if it’s not a healthy pregnancy? What if the child grows up unhappy? If I make a mistake? If I REGRET having kids? If I can’t cope? You can’t just take it back and that’s so daunting. The more I focus on the ‘what ifs’ the more I wonder how anyone chooses parenthood?
Edited to add: I’ve also been referred for an autism diagnosis, I find lack of routine, conflicting or loud noises etc very difficult which adds another layer of worry
There is no logic to choosing to be a parent. I found the more you mull it over, the more you come up with reasons not to - either I wasnt in a job i loved, didnt have a big 'forever' home, wasnt sure how I'd fit childcare around work.
My decision ultimately came down to the fact my partner was keen to be a parent and it was an alright (but not perfect) time when both our parents were still well enough to look after our daughter whilst I worked (as was the tradition in both our families and one I hope to continue), and I had recently qualified and been promoted so we were financially more well off and I had more time to dedicate since I wasn't studying for the first time in 11 years 😅 (however there is never enough time for parenting ever!).
I never realised just how strong the desire was to be a mother until about 6 weeks after having her. She has filled my life up completely and changed my path forever.
I remember clearly saying to my baby's dr at 6 week check up. "I am so underprepared as a parent I'm stunned that society doesn't prepare us" I think he mentally ticked off a note in his head "mother acknowledges vulnerability will seek help - good parent"
Parenting is exhausting in the modern age. More so if ND.
Tips for parents with autism - noise cancelling headphones, parenting will likely become a special interest, clear your schedule so you do not have work or business responsibilities - parenting is massive load on an ND person ....but ND kids can really thrive with a parent that is ND like them ...
as even someone who doesn't want kids, I feel for you! society really needs to support parents better. I hope you get lots of support and your partnership is/remains equal!!
Being autistic myself (and just having had an ADHD assessment recommended 😅) I wonder what it would be like to have a kid who was autistic in a way that was different to me. I wonder how much of my quiet personality is to do with nature or nurture... My partner is naturally loud and chaotic (but able to regulate some of that as an adult) and what if we had a loud and chaotic kid?? Would I cope? I love working with children though!
My dad says that no one is prepared to be a parent and that you just adapt (he's also realising he's autistic)
The more years pass by, the more knowledge you get and wiser you become, the more reasons AGAINST having children that you wonder how can anyone still want them? Nowadays it is the most selfish and irresponsible thing a person can do and the reasons are many!
The "Larger than an Orange" cover is- wow- maybe one of the most striking I've ever seen. Sounds like it fits the content well
Child free but in a relationship with someone who has one.
I was never set on having them but proximity to parenting has made me CERTAIN I don't want to have my own.
Very very occasionally, I get a hormone related "omg I am running out of time" - but it always passes very quickly.
I admire women who can do it. Especially in today's world. It is so hard.
I have a step kid and a bio kid and it so not the same! You can make decisions and have authority with your own kid. The love you feel is different. I feel as a nanny or teacher would for my step kid who is now 13, and I feel like bio kid is my heart and soul.
Love to read about that experience here as well. I'm in the same situation and it's interesting how it's impacted my view on having kids. I do see the point that bio kids and step kids aren't the same. But in general I am an introvert, and I've once read "if you recharge by being alone you should really think long and hard about having kids" and I think there's some truth to it. I'm already exhausted after a weekend with the 4 year old of my boyfriend.
@@Jojo-kl6tx oh four year olds can be tough. Phew! But that doesn't last.
I met my step daughter when she was five and it was very overwhelming.
The childfree step moms suffer a lot.
I'm an introvert and also a bit autistic so I love alone time. My husband is hands on and I blinked and now he's 4.
End of the day it's your choice, but I'm glad I didn't listen when I was told out "you'll never be able to handle a child".
If you are in a committed relationship with someone who has a kid, you are not child-free (maybe if the kid is an adult, but child-free folks avoid that too for the most part). And if you were never set on having them or not, you are a fence-sitter, not child-free. Childfree folks don't want any kids in their life, step-kids included. Childless folks are usually those who want kids but can't have them. And fence-sitters are the ones who aren't sure what they want. Sorry to bit nitpicky but they are very different groups and it's annoying when they get mixed. That's why many child-free folks get annoying comments like ''Oh, I know so many people who changed their minds, you will too.''
@@Kristina-ek8yt I guess I needed a distinction for a women with no bio kids. I also feel like single dad's go after these women, dumping all the child care on them and guilting them if they don't do it.
Like she'll get shamed and guilted "you knew what you were getting into dating him" when they never go after the man and say to him "you knew what you were getting into dating a non parent" .
As a feminist atheist who grew up in a patriarchal, ultra orthodox religious city- the uphill battle I have to fight to get people to respect my bodily autonomy is ridiculous! I do not want biological children and they cannot respect that this is what I'm choosing to do with MY OWN body.
To me, doing nothing is the norm and if you do something, you need a good reason to do it, especially if it impacts other people. But somehow having kids is the default and you need a good 'excuse' not too.
My brother and his wife can barely look after themselves and they've made the frankly selfish decision to have a child they can't look after properly. People say it's selfish to not have kids, I think it's selfish to have kids you can't look after because you expect them to look after you when you're old.
That blows. I agree with you. Having kids is more selfish than to not have them since your choice gets inflicted on someone else. Hope you can eventually cut all the ties you need to cut to thrive and everything works out great for you.
@@annnee6818 aww thank you
'The Natural Mother of The Child' by Krys Malcolm Belc is a memoir on being a nonbinary parent!
I'm 23 yo with a 5 month old. I started preparering to have a child when I was 17, researching and reading parenting stuff, listening to parenting podcasts etc... Just always knew I wanted to be a mom. None of my friends are thinking about having kids yet. My best friend is pretty sure she doesn't want any, and I support her fully. I love being a mom, and this has always been my dream - but I think people do and should be allowed to, have different dreams, ones that don't involve having kids. I would never wanna convince someone of having a kid they didn't really want, just because I think its the best thing that ever happened to me.
Childless person in my mid 40's here. Personally becoming an Aunt at 16 really helped with giving me a realistic view of babies and motherhood. It didn't put me off but it sure as hell didn't allow me to have a rose tinted view either! Thanks Leena for the book recommendations :-)
I'm a midwife so have bit of a professional interest in these type of books - a couple of these have gone straight onto my MUST HUNT DOWN IMMEDIATELY list. Thank you!
Thank you for your important work. Midwives are heroes
Although I am still unsure if I will have children one day, I am truly fascinated by pregnancy and motherhood as a human experience. I am currently reading a book called 'Letters to My Weird Sisters: On Autism and Motherhood', and I think it would be a great addition to this list. Thank you for another great video Leena! My TBR list is growing longer......
I have this weird thing with the concept of having kids. Buckle up this is going to be a long one.
I never wanted children. If you ask my longest friends they'll say: "She's been saying this since 14." I never saw myself as more than a very complicated wreck, chaos with a strange beauty of being alive. But also my own mother raised me with this concept of that I carry all my ancestors and if I don't continue the line of my family somehow everything has been wasted. Everything will be wasted. So I catch myself sometimes thinking that I need to be a mother, I need to have a child, because I don't want my grandmother's eyes or my father's way of smiling be lost to time.
But I don't want to be pregnant. I don't want to have a child I need to care for. I already hate working as much as I do because it leaves no room to breath & enjoy my creativity. I do not see me being happy with that decision.
Then almost a year ago the first couple in my close circle got pregnant. I congratulated them but they live farther away from me & so I didn't get to see so much of her pregnancy. They came around for New Years and I visited them one day to meet their son. I was nervous, babies usually hate me, (my mom jokingly calls it "Demon Energy") I guess they can feel me radiating that I'm unsure of how to handle them.
Their son was lovely. He smiled, he made happy noises, when they gave him to me, he instantly grabbed onto my hair. He was really sweet. I got to carry him in his little carrier close to my chest when we went on a walk so he could sleep. He slept well despite not knowing me for a long time. I enjoyed my day. I got home very happy that I met my friends and how happy they are with their little cuddle bug.
I thought a lot about it since then. My friend even asked me why I didn't want to be a mother. And I said: "I don't see myself fit for it. I hate the thought of being pregnant and growing something and I don't want to have to take care of someone all the time with my mental health." And that is still true. I loved being able to meet their son. I love this little kid and I now know I will love all of my friends kids. But it's not what I want. And I will have to live with that feeling seeing everyone complete their "next steps in Life" and have them make experiences & decisions I may never understand. And on some days that makes me sad. It is suddenly as if your not belonging somewhere anymore. But it's my choice and I like to have it.
I will be a great "aunt" instead.
The end of your comment made me tear up. It's so hard not to compare even if it's something you don't really want for yourself. Have trust that sticking to your gut feelings is the right thing for you. Bigs hugs!
@@kaiju_k5042 Aww Thank you for your kind words & big hugs back.
This is fascinating to read, thank you for sharing. My daughter is 2.5 and something that really shocked me in my own parenting journey is that I've really been able to continue my passions and interests, as well as finding new ones that my daughter loves. Now this isn't me saying you should become a mother! I could never say that, because my experience is my own, and your experience is yours. I just find it completely beautiful how sure you are, and yet how much you enjoy a tiny human. I think it's important for us parents to open up our worlds to include child free friends/members of the community.
I had this "ancestor complex" for a while too. Until I realised sth. Almost no one knows their great grandparents, we will all be forgotten within three generations. I found that kind of freeing. You don't owe anything to previous generations. You're not wasting anything. Time passes and stuff happens, then it gets lost to time and that's ok and unavoidable
I have the ancestor thing and I thought I was alone. I come from a family of hardworking, unwavering, kind and generous, poor people. As a family we suck, but individually, we are badass humans. Sometimes I can't bear the thought that this all will die with me. I feel like the world needs more people like us, and my husband is an amazing man, he would be such a great dad. But I don't want to do it. I don't want the birth, the risk to my mental health, the dedication to someone else 100% of the time... I don't know what to do with this information most of the time. Thank you for sharing your perspective.
A mother is a role not a bloodline… oh my god YES
I just had my mother corner me and tell me she’s willing to pay to have my eggs frozen in case I change my mind about not wanting kids
why is it when someone decides they do want to have kids no says ‘are you sure?’.. but me not wanting them is the end of the world?
I just feel icky and like my feelings aren’t being taken into consideration
As someone with an 8.5 year old who STILL struggles with post-natal depression with psychosis symptoms (that I never had prior), thank you. Going to buy What Have I Done now :)
Growing up I always believed that the only people who didn’t have kids were the ones who always knew they didn’t want them and probably didn’t like kids much. I love babies/toddlers and am fascinated by pregnancy, birth and breastfeeding (I am a labor and delivery nurse) so I always assumed I would be a mother. But now, as I’m getting to the age where people around me are having children, I’m not so sure. I’ve never connected well with pre-teens and teens and spending my days driving between school and extracurricular sounds like a nightmare. Children are expensive and i so value the financial flexibility I have as a child-free adult.
I am not sure what I want, but I believe parenthood is a decision that people should make enthusiastically and I am so greatful for nuanced conversations on the topic as I navigate this question.
I am someone who is sitting on the fence on whether or not to have kids so some of these books are definitely going on my tbr. Thank you so much.
Found out I was pregnant 3 days back, thinking about motherhood a lot this week! Good vid lots to digest here!
Aww congrats
Leena, as a person with endometriosis and unsure whether I will be able to have children, I'm thankful for all conversations about different versions of a fulfilled life that may or may not include children. I'm also grateful about the recommendations. I've noticed that many of us in circles conscious of social justice and climate catastrophe issues perhaps unknowingly reproduce a lot of language à la "it's irresponsable to bring a child into this broken planet" which is much more nuanced in fact (countries with lowest birth rates often those contributing most to climate catastrophe, it's a matter of how resources are used more than anything), plus once you read into it there are really gross and nefarious links to right wing and generally racist eugenic groups and conspiracy theories (replacement theory for example) that spread lots of misinformation about overpopulation. Long story short, I like that you provided concise recommendations that deal with an individual's choice about parenthood.
Ecofascism is a term linked to that rhetoric you mentioned, stuff about "the earth is just overpopulated" etc. Thanks for sharing your perspective. I am most likely infertile, but I don't have a desire to have children. I am very afraid of pregnancy and childbirth and about the commitment and responsibility of having children. I hope I can be a positive presence in the lives of my friends' future children. That will be enough.
Oh such a great comment! I remember reading an article about the overpopulation argument and couldn’t believe how long I was uninformed before. Reminds me of the podcasts Maintenance Phase and You’re wrong about, they touch on Eugenics too for example!
Important comment!!!!!!
Hey, wishing you a fulfilling journey whether or not bio kids fits into that; endometriosis sounds so painful. Also glad for the point about nuance. Ezra Klein pointed out a role for optimism in a recent podcast on deciding whether to have kids- as far as that is a decision we're in control of. I found the nihilism in a couple of responses here a tad troubling; that parenting is some kind of problematic norm, when my worry for my daughter is that conservatives seem to have no qualms in challenging falling birth rates. I've seen conservative pronatalists point out a hypocrisy in what they see as progressives' professed interest in collectivity but seeing individual happiness/life course as a prime factor in deciding whether or not to have kids. I want the village to be a diverse, inclusive one- having my daughter has made me worry about her life course in a different way to my previous professed concerns for future generations. Basically I think we need to have more honest conversations about demography and the positive potentials of having kids, in ways that don't lead to ethnonationalism or denial of reproductive rights. For example, I was 37 when I had my daughter and while we've thankfully been ok health-wise, there's a bit of me that wishes I'd thought more seriously about fertility and family-building earlier on. In reality I had to battle with thyroid/PCOS issues and a long relationship with a narcissist who I knew deep down would not be a good person to have a kid with, before meeting my now-husband and conceiving my daughter. She's a big source of joy as well as fucking hard work. Anyway, this turned into waffle but again, I hope you get to choose what you want.
I think reproduction is a personal choice that we cannot take from people, so we can't stop people from having kids and we can't force people to have kids. However, I think overpopulation is a valid concern. Luckily for us, once people have access to birth control, we actually dip below replacement rate (which may be a concern for the future - maybe we will have to see how to support parents better if we don't want humans to go extinct in a few hundred years, assuming we don't go extinct before that for another reason).
I don't like the assumption that it's the poor countries that are overpopulated - europe and north america have some of the most overpopulated countries. Current birth rates are a bit irrelevant since it was only two or three generations ago that anyone got access to birth control. My grandma had 7 or so siblings, and so did many other people's grandparents.
I also don't like the assumptions that people in poor countries are having 8 children because somehow they just love kids - there's no reason an African person would biologically want a different number of children than a European person, and we can see that they don't since once people immigrate to rich countries with access to birth control, they generally don't have as many children. The reality is, many of the people in the poor countries having so many children don't have a choice, there is no access to birth control or abortion, and often they are giving birth alone in a hut and may not even know who the "sperm donor" is. They deserve birth control too.
The earth just does not have an infinite carrying capacity. I used to think "overpopulation is a myth" too, but then I had a look at google maps satellite view and was shocked by how much of the earth is destroyed to support farms, which humans need to live. The earth is not just for humans, plants and animals deserve space too. We are an invasive species unfortunately, but luckily most people don't want many children, and we fall below replacement rate when people have a choice. Choice is really the answer to overpopulation.
I read this line recently in a book ( Nettle & Bone) "The history of the world was written in women’s wombs. And women’s blood” and it struck hard. It'd definitely refreshing that these days people and especially women can choose if they want to have kids versus having some duty to reproduce because of past history of the human kind and other people's expectations.
I have a 2 year old and for years I've been asked when I"m having kids simply because I've been with my partner for 19 years now, it's honestly exhausting and a bit intrusive. And once I had my child the same people started asking when I'm having more, it just doesn't stop lol. And it's definitely a lot more work and worry than people assume. When you have a kid your heart is outside of your body and you constantly worry, at least I do as a pretty sensitive person.
Last year, I celebrated mother's day as a mom, 2 days after giving birth for the first and only time. This past year has been eye-opening in many ways and I feel differently about my own mother, grandmother, sister, and myself this year than I even did last year immediately after birth.
I want a book about motherhood/parenthood changing overtime. And I don't mean in the shallow way of "It's hard when they can't put their own shoes on, but then it's hard when they can put their own shoes on but refuse to."
This has been one of my favourite Leena videos ever, could you do one for father's day too?😊🤣
I don’t think I’ve read nearly as many on fathers YET but I guess I DO have until June… really glad you enjoyed x
I love this idea. The relationship between a father and a daughter. I think the trope of Daddy issues focuses on the aftermath of a not so great relationship between a father and a daughter but what does it mean to be a girl dad, and a healthy relationship between a father and a daughter
I read a novel at the start of this year called A Woman of Intelligence by Karin Tanabe that was a really interesting look at motherhood, it dealt with a woman who desperately loved her kids but also desperately wanted to escape from being only their mum and having no identity outside of motherhood. It was full on and could be really bleak at times but I found it illuminating and sobering
I want to add to the list “The Argonauts” by Maggie Nelson! It’s a memoir that really goes into all the complicated feelings of pregnancy and motherhood from the perspective of a *super* queer family. I love Maggie Nelson because she brings so much theory and thoughtfulness to very emotional and messy topics.
As someone who is now 31 and very child free, I really appreciate this video. Also as someone who has a complicated relationship with my own mom, I now have some books to look into. 😅
My 2 month old son is napping on me right now but I can’t wait to watch this 👀
I had not even hoped Leena would make a whole video on this topic but I'm so happy she did! I do not have nor do I want kids but I have a deep interests in learning about parenting and family psychology and about why people decide to have or not to have kids. Thank you for this! I've only read Sheila Heiti's book so far and I'm excited to discover the other ones from this selection!
I felt such a deep terror for about 3 seconds before I remembered that American mother's day is a different day.
My feelings of motherhood have been on a spectrum but after reviewing how much came from internal ableism and a guilt of what about all those children who need homes. I think a lot of it was also my awkward feelings around being an independent women and my deep want to run a house and be a mother. This was something my partner and I really worked through together over time. He never wanted to limit me and my opinions for work (family farm so isolated from my engineering work), and we both had some internal thoughts we had to work through about the value of motherhood. Now I think I want kids and I have worked through the guilt of this just because I was pushed into traditional roles and got out doesn't mean I shouldn't be a mum. Anyway thank you Leena for discussing this so open
33, child free by choice and immediately ordering that first book. Been looking for something like this! Tysm 🥺
Ditto!
Thank you for sharing this! My partner and I are certain we don’t want children, though I’m looking forward to reviewing some of these books to understand different perspectives. I also found listening to motherhood podcasts (Happy Mum, Happy Baby, for example) helpful to gather a bunch of perspectives.
Giovanna Fletcher seems like a total gem so I bet it's a lovely listen. x
Thank you for this Leena. I've added many of these to my tbr.
I'm the same age as you but have always known I wanted to be a mother, but I've never looked deeper into that desire. I've a very complicated relationship with my mother (we pretend it is anything but) so I feel like reading and understanding more perspectives around motherhood can only be a good thing. Especially if it can help me teach my daughter to be true to herself as she grows. Thank you for sharing.
I absolutely cannot get enough of your book chats. Thanks for another illuminating video, Leena!
As a mother of 3, I’m extremely worried about the world that I’ve brought them into, with so many world leaders completely unconcerned about our climate by the 2030’s (when my oldest will be in his 30’s) and in 2040’s when my 2 youngest will be in their 30’s) - when my kids will be thinking about kids…
I'm 44 and I have never felt the want or need to have children. I think it was clear fairly early in my life - when I was a kid I never had any dolls, I had a baby carriage for dolls but I put my stuffed animals in there! I've had people (that obviously didn't know me very well) throughout tell me that "oh, you'll regret it!". I find that incredibly odd. Why this need to interfere in other people's life decisions? And what if I *had* a child and regretted that? Let people choose what's best for themselves.
❤
I've just gone through the egg freezing process to make sure I can still have the option of children after chemo. I'm not even a mother and I feel like I'm protecting my children already, so here I go adding all of these books to my tbr! Another book on motherhood I'd recommend (it made me ugly cry on the train) is All My Mothers by Joanna Glen about how different women in your life can be your mother, not just your biological mother
Leena! Thank you so much! I am studying to be a midwife and I think I am going to read all of these books!
I know a lot about many of these topics (like post partum depression) but I think it will be good to have the „other“ perspective :)
Very interesting video - since becoming a parent there really is no way to understand the brilliance of it - I thought I didn’t want children but have had one and it’s been completely mind blowing. I have learnt more over these past two years than ever and have a deep sense of purpose now. I wish I’d had a child younger now. It’s completely magical. However I definitely understand it’s not for all especially if you don’t have family support.
I feel like I'm answering all the comments on this page haha, same tho! I had a baby at 39 and he's 2 years and 4 months old as of today and I'm finally starting to feel like I have a normal routine and get my sleep and feel more like a functioning human. The amount of patience you have to harness each day is astronomical.
I'm so into this video idea. I'm a mum and I bloody love challenging my views on parenthood, let's freaking do this!
Yes, such a huge decision and the more you ponder and consider the better for you and for any children you may or may not have. For myself it was a yes and over the past 19 years I have had periods of self doubt about that decision but have never questioned whether it was the right decision for me. That said the majority of my friends did not have children and they are also quite happy with their lives. The older you get the more you realize it's not the choice you make but how you build your life around that choice that will determine your satisfaction and happiness.
I love motherhood, it's the best thing I've ever done and I've never been happier. I don't find it any where near as hard as I expected but we are all good at different things and I don't think everyone should have kids and I am not surprised that not everyone wants kids.
I think saying you love motherhood, you find it easy and you are happy is a bit taboo, I've had people call me a liar, smug or anti feminist for just saying how I feel but that's not fair either.
We are all different, I don't want to run a marathon, I wouldn't enjoy it and I would find it nearly impossible. There will be people out there who love marathons who relish them and don't find them that difficult. We celebrate them, but we judge mothers who say the same thing.
I think we won't move on as a society until women stop viewing people who make different choices to them a judgment on their own choices.
If you choose to be child free amazing enjoy it. If you choose to have children amazing enjoy it. Pitting one against the other is just misogyny thinly disguised.
Loved this video a lot and added a fair few to my TBR! As a childfree person, I am also guilty of some of these books seeming irrelevant to me. But you've convinced me as always Leena! 😀
Wonderful! Then my work here is done ;)
I'm pregnant with my second babe, my first was a preemie but thankfully very healthy and didn't need a nicu stay, but the description of mother ship is making me sob. I just couldn't imagine not being able to hold and feed my baby, its the most instinctual act and my heart goes out to preemie parents especially mothers
I think that as feminists we need to support mothers more. We frame it as this choice but so many people don’t really get that much of a choice or chose it so long ago it’s not really relevant anymore that they once ‘chose it’, but our culture leaves no room for regret. I prefer thinking of children as an oppressed class and we all have some kind of responsibility for bringing up the next generation however small, and supporting mothers along the way. I feel really sorry for mums who gave up their lives to do the most important job in the world with no compensation and they live in regret with no support. So many didn’t have any this information before they had kids.
This was such an interesting video! I wanted to add that my favorite exploration of motherhood in Expectation was actually (spoilers ahead) with the child free character going back to be with her mother after her mom tells her she has terminal cancer. The end of life care and shifting relationship from daughter to carer and mother to patient is really well written and so beautiful. I was actually really glad to have read it before my father passed as it genuinely shifted my perspective on death and loss.
Have 2 children. Don't regret it but also can't recommend. Totally respect how anyone wishes to mother - be that their own children, other children or just other people or whether to not. Relationships are just hard and complex
All of these books seem wonderful, but maybe it's a mix between having a complicated relationship with my mom, being on my period and being a mom myself, I feel like every one of those is going to make me cry. Not going to stop me from putting them on my TBR list, especially Maya Angelou's book. I've never even heard of that one. I have a lot of friends that have chosen not to be mothers and I can't wait to share some of these books with them!
The book I read while having motherhood conversations with myself was "The Red Tent", which shows so many aspects of motherhood, women hood, etc. Really beautifully written too. Great episode!!
Thank you for this! Couldn't agree more with everything you said. Am childfree by choice myself (also by circumstance but I now identify more with childfree by choice). I'll be hunting down these books, can't wait to read them. I already own and ADORE Motherhood by Sheila Heti.
Think I will read some of these over the next years, thanks for making the list. A book I feel handles different variations of motherhood/pregnancy/ really well is Little Fires Everywhere by Celeste Ng.
Agreed! Also highly recommend her newest book, Our Missing Hearts.
For those who are up for a well researched nothing-but-hot-facts kinda book: I cannot gush enough about abigail tuckers "mum genes: Inside the New Science of Our Ancient Maternal Instinct".
although the title is kinda misleading, because she explains quite well why humans do NOT have a mother instinct.
this book seriously blew my mind. there are so many interesting biological things happening with motherhood, like part of your childrens DNA staying in your body and growing livers for you when your own don't work anymore; or how becoming a mother changes your brains grey matter in the same magnitude like having a car accident; or why new mums are shit at remembering anything but why they stay calm at earthquakes.
if non-fiction is for you, you will love this book!
Regretting Motherhood by Orna Donath really cemented for me that I do not want to be a mother. Really recommend to anyone who wants to explore the topic
Thank you for this video Leena. This year Mother’s Day is a bit different for me. My mum and I have a great relationship but she’s now been in intensive care and under sedation for four weeks following being hit by a reckless driver. Looking forward to reading a couple of these books to reflect on motherhood while my mum isn’t with me yet. It’s felt like a strange in between phase but she is healing
I wonder if the day will come when I am not startled by the British Mother's Day in thinking that I've somehow forgotten Mother's Day... Thank you for the list Leena. I've always known I'm not going to have kids, but what I wasn't prepared for when I became an adult was people's reactions when they started finding out, and books were there for me during that whole experience ❤
Thank you so much for this video! It is exactly what I needed. The question of whether or not to become a mother seems to be a big one in my friend group at the moment!
(I haven't read it all the way through but--) What My Mother and I Don't Talk About is a collection of essays by different writers discussing their relationships to mothers and it's so far really, really good. This list you've compiled looks so good, I have added most to my tbr!
Yes. Books for every topic. Yes
I'm late to the party so you probably won't see this, but to be fair mother's day is this weekend in Canada where I live. A book to try for non-binary parenting perspectives is "Like a Boy But Not a Boy" by Andrea Bennet. It is a collection of essays. It's on my TBR but I unfortunately haven't gotten to it yet.
I enjoyed this video a lot. I'd also recommend Nobody Told Me by Hollie McNish. I would love recommendations for books about/by women who don't want children and have happy, fulfilling lives. Lately there are more books about different types of parenting, and many about people who want to be parents and can't, which is great, and I've enjoyed these perspectives. But as someone who doesn't want kids I'd also like to read that and the different lives that can be lived instead. Recently I read Great Circle by Maggie Shipsted and appreciated that, and I have Diana Athill's memoirs, but it's so hard to find these kind of experiences. Even articles about being child free always include a line about the writer "of course" loving kids, as if you constantly have to make it extra clear that you're not some kind of monster by not wanting them for yourself.
Not a mother or an artist, but I really learned from the reflections on Birds, Art, Life and immediately gave it to one of the artist/mothers in my life.
So excited to read every single book on that list!! I gave birth 4 weeks ago, the pregnancy was very much planned and I did everything I could to prepare for it mentally and physically, but I could never imagine how hard post partum period is, especially breastfeeding. I always feel like a biggest failure when I talk about it, but I hate it. Yes, because of the pain and various troubles we had, but I also just hate the feeling of it. I’ve never heard anyone talk about it so that feels pretty lonely. I just want my body back after 9 months of playing host to someone.
The first few months are really hard! Hang in there, it gets easier.
Those feelings are absolutely valid! Breastfeeding is hard, and sharing our bodies is a lot, both mentally and physically.
Fed is best, and formula is perfectly fine.
I think I remember the UA-camr unnatural vegan mentioned the same thing: she didn't enjoy the feeling of breastfeeding, but felt pressure as it's expected to be natural and beautiful. She has a few videos on breastfeeding.
Use formula if you’re struggling! No point making yourself miserable: mine was formula fed from birth and doing great
I'm pretty sure in my decision, but I love that you're giving us homework to further affirm or broaden our view in the matter, I'm taking note and adding some books to my tbr (my resolution to not buy any new books until I'm done with what I already own is my biggest failure every year)
I have a baby and I wanted to have kids, although I was VERY pressured to have kids by my mother so sometimes I wonder if I would have still chosen to have a baby if it weren’t for that. I love my baby and overall I’m glad I have her and I have no regrets about it. But I will ALWAYS support women who choose not to!!
You are the best! To live in a world where motherhood is obvious, would love to read and form my own perspective for my life. Always helping ❤
For me the choice to become a mother was something I was not sure about, then vaguely thought I would want, then knew I wanted, then became like a fundemental Need. It's hard to explain but it really did feel like a non negotiable Drive. When I pictured my future I saw myself baking cookies with a little kid, going on bush walks with them etc (idealised of course but there u go). Now I am a new mum of a 7 month old and still figuring out this new version of me, it's been abit challenging and uncomfortable but tbh I kind of expected it to be. I knew I wanted to become a mum but I also knew that becoming a new person would involve some growing pains. It's also something that's very personal and hard to explain so I would defs love to read more works examining and exploring motherhood 🙂
Non binary parenting book:
The natural mother of the child (not read so can't review but on my TBR)
Other awesome parenting/pregnancy books:
Killing the black body
Battling over birth
The attachment parenting book
Honestly adoption
I've not read it myself, but I've heard good things about The Argonauts by Maggie Nelson, who is non-binary and gender fluid and it's at least partially about their experience with pregnancy.
Plus one this! I have read this and I really enjoyed it. There is a part about pregnancy experience, and the experience of having a child.
I would recommend Milk: An Intimate History of Breastfeeding. It's a history of breastfeeding through the eyes of an art historian, as well as memoir of the author's personal experiences. I learned a lot and it helped me (as a mother) feel less alone when it came to feeding my baby too. I would also highly recommend anything by Emily Writes - Rants in the Dark was her first book, but she has three, and they are all a series of stories of varying length about her experiences as a mother (she has two boys). They are a really real look at motherhood that will make you laugh and cry.
Interesting how I watched the book burning video before this one specifically because the title of this filled me with dread. Now that I'm here I wish I'd watched it when it came out as my mother is a narcissist I no longer speak to and her birthday is the same week as Mother's Day. I'm "on the fence" and don't know if it's because I don't want children or that I'm terrified of turning into my mother. Definitely going to pick up Sheila Heti 📚
I thought I read a lot of books about this topic but you proved me wrong, going to make sure I read everything on this list! Some of my favourites are 'Regretting Motherhood' by Orna Donath (interviews of women who live in a culture where women are expected to have children) & 'The Natural Mother of the Child' by Krys Malcolm Bec (nonbinary and brief IVF topics). Honorable fiction mentions are With Teeth and Nightbitch!
This is an excellent list! I loved Letter to my Daughter. Another one I would suggest is Dear Girls by Ali Wong. I deeply enjoyed that one while I was pregnant!
It's really funny how, recently, my best friend told me that she was no longer sure whether she wants to be pregnant. A thought that I have also been having for the last 6 months. We both want to become mothers, were sure of that but we both are worried about the possible physiological and psychological effects that pregnancy could have on us. So this topic is very much present in my thoughts almost daily.
For a queer, if not non-binary perspective, I really enjoyed the conversation around motherhood in Detransition Baby - it really examines how the idea of mothering connects with gender and sexuality, the ways that our sense of womanhood intersects with motherhood, and how society is often cruel to moms and parents who don't appear or present in a heteronormative way. I live in the US and I think representation of queer parenting is especially important right now given the political climate around lgbtq+ (and especially trans) rights in many states at the moment.
I have two wonderful children and they are the best thing that ever happened in my life.
I've also been running on 3-4 hours of sleep per night for over two weeks now and am probably delusional.
I am still in the finding out process. For some time I was sure I did not want to have any kids but I also want to be curious about the thought if this is what I really want. I often was pressured by my mother to have kids and this only caused me to absolutely despise the thought.She was a neglegting and abusive mother herself and I would never want this experience for anybody else. I feel like I mothered my mother for lot of my life and I don't know if I would be able to have children with the experiences I made. I am still unsure what would be right for me. I certainly want some kind of family but of which kind is still a question I ask myself.
It's interesting that you mentioned "On Earth we're briefly gorgeous" in for this topic of motherhood, because that's definitely not what I have remembered the most about the book, but indeed it's strongly talking about it. That book was actually one of the only fiction that left me so sad and a bit annoyed at the saddest it made me feel! But I understand we don't always have the same experience for books! Otherwise, great video, and great recommendations, I definetely agree with what you say in the video, me not wanting children as well, because I think a lot of people jump into motherhood without really knowing what's implicated in the motherhood process.
I am 24 now and for the first time in my life I am thinking about becoming a parent one day. I love the idea of a child. My Partner (who I am really really lucky with) also dreams of that. But we both come from families with a lot of Trauma and very complicated parental relationships and are aware of what "being a bad parent" can lead to. So we're trying to be responsible and honest to ourselfs and give us a lot of time to think about this. Thank you for the book suggestions! For me personally the idea of being a loving, caring mother whilst having a mother that does not care about me since my Teenage years, so not having a role model, is very frightening. But maybe it can also be a healing experience with the right people by my side and maybe help from a therapist again when the time has come. Thinking about all the daughters that needed to accomplish life themselves ❤
Thank you for this video! I've known for most of my adult life that I want to be a parent but with a history of mental illness in the family, understanding everything about what could happen is important to me, so most of these, I'm sure, will end up on my TBR. Additionally, as you mentioned wanting to hear about the nonbinary experience of parenthood, the book The Natural Mother of the Child by Krys Malcolm Belc was a very interesting read. The collection of essays around parenting and birth from a nonbinary/trans perspective was really enlightening to read about. Non-book rec is also for Ash Hardell's channel More Ash and Gray as they are starting to share their experience with pregnancy and birth as the carrying partner in their relationship. It is a lot of information that I am happy they are sharing as it is demystifying the process as a whole.
Put nearly every book in this video on my TBR. I have never wanted kids but lately I've been doubting myself and I could really use some literature to guide me, especially as I'm coming off birth control (for unrelated reasons). I'm scared my hormones will trick me into wanting kids and then what will I do?!
I always forget mother's day in the UK and Ireland is in March, not sure why its in May almost everywhere else.
Because in the UK, Mothering Sunday started off as a completely different thing, about returning to your "mother church" (i.e. the church where you were christened) during one Sunday in Lent, but more recently it has adopted the American tradition of "mothers day" as well. So it used to just be a church thing but now we use the same day for both celebrations. Not sure about Ireland but I assume it's the same reason.
@@really-quite-exhausted for Ireland the reason is very simple...colonisation ;)
There is no logic to choosing to be a parent. I found the more you mull it over, the more you come up with reasons not to - either I wasnt in a job i loved, didnt have a big 'forever' home, wasnt sure how I'd fit childcare around work.
My decision ultimately came down to the fact my partner was keen to be a parent and it was an alright (but not perfect) time when both our parents were still well enough to look after our daughter whilst I worked (as was the tradition in both our families and one I hope to continue). I had recently qualified and been promoted so we were financially more well off and I had more time to dedicate since I wasn't studying for the first time in 11 years 😅 (however there is never enough time for parenting ever!).
I never realised just how strong the desire was to be a mother until about 6 weeks after having her. She has filled my life up completely and changed my path forever.
great video. Whether you choose to have kids or not, I think it should absolutely not be something you do just because it's expected or "the thing." As my mother says, being a parent is the most important job in the world.
I would also recommend (M)otherhood by Pragya Agarwal - so interesting covering, traumatic birth, abortion, surrogacy and so much more! Great for expanding our knowledge of human experience!