Exactly which actually makes it sad cause technically he and santos made it their duty to demolish the rest of the world no one else can even think of doing that maybe golden barca but they lost some too
@@berkayyilmaz2928 But the difference is that Pele also played the best players in the world and actually was one of the best strikers in the world. Even if you only consider the goals he scored against competent opposition, his record is still insane. Not as high as he claims it to be but still one of the highest.
Really glad you made this video. People tend to disregard the respective context in which people lived when comparing individuals from different era's......Would be interesting to see how Messi and CR7 will be viewed 50-75 years from now. Imagine trying to explain to your grandkids how good they were and the response your grandkids give you is "well football was easier back then"....Imagine!
Imagine China being the biggest and the most difficult league and people disregarding all european players and praising Oscar or another player that nowadays plays there haha
Not to sound rude, but we have video footage of games back then and now. Defense, strategy, tactics, athleticism even rules became much more hard to beat. No matter what era, when someone sees Leo playing… it will be silence, no comparison to any other player.
@@MikeLandwolf I completely agree with you. But don’t you think people were saying that about Maradona in his day. Granted televised football wasn’t as wide spread as today but the 80’s are not that long ago
@@njabulombuyazi5132 Yes Maradona was greatest for a few years. But consistency that Messi gives… Every player no matter how great they were have disappointed me. Especially Ronaldinho, now Cristiano… but watching Messi play you know he will be better match after match. He gets better with age, he gets better after he gets knocked out, gets better after he twists his ankle, gets better after he loses. The guy is pure force of nature. He is something that nobody has ever seen before. I love Ronaldo, Maradona, Ronaldinho, Pele was and is God of football and maker of the history, we should all be thanking him because of what football is today. Yet nobody should compare anyone to Messi. Words can not describe how good he is.
@@njabulombuyazi5132 plus football or any other sport will not get any better. We have achieved the top nutritions and athletic performance. If it will get better it will be minimal, unnoticeable. This is the apex of every sport, especially football. Unless they start using some kind of performance enhancing drugs, which i highly doubt they will…
at 0:49 the top three are: 3. Iker Casillas (17 scored against by Messi) 2. Gorka Iraizoz (18..) 1. Diego Alves (21...) Iraizoz played mainly for Bilbao whilst Alves spent most of his time in Spain at FC Valencia
@@lv15ballistol no problem lad, not sure if you're Spanish but if you're not I'm actually very impressed that you know about Gorka Iraizoz playing for Espanyol as a youngster, props to you for that
Thank you so much for making this video! I was just thinking the other day about how people who say Pele’s goals in friendlies “don’t count” don’t understand that those friendlies were actually tough games. People really need to brush up on their football/soccer history.
@@Imperador-Vi Heavily doubt it, its a commonly known fact the quality of football has risen to new heights as the years go on. 70s Santos would barely stack up against a championship team these days. Obviously the romanticists will refuse to believe it but its the truth.
@@areebsiddiqui758 So what, we have to measure players on the time they played or else ashley barnes would be better than Pele, besides I would argue back then players had way less resources, and if the players from back then had today's resources they would be even better
@@areebsiddiqui758 I repeat myself, so what players can’t magically play in the way of the future, someday people might say the same about Messi, but we know how good he is regardless compared to the rest
To claim he somehow watered down his career by never playing in a European league is ignorant because it is viewing the situation through modern eyes. Nowadays all the best players in the World go to Europe because that is where the money and best competition is. Back in the days when Pele was at his peak, all of the domestic leagues in the world were primarily filled with domestic players. Seeing someone like Argentinian Alfredo diStefano at Real Madrid was more of an aberration than the norm. Considering they won 3 out of 4 World Cups during his playing days I would say proves Brazil was the best footballing nation in the World at the time and shows Pele actually was competing against the best competition there was by staying in Brazil.
If I'm not wrong, the first world cup in which Brazil brought more players that were playing outside Brazil was in 1986, before that, domestic players dominated the national team
Great video, man! As a brazilian, it's so good to see an english language Football Channel trying to make a contextualized analysis of this topic, instead of a anacronic look. Even if people don't count the 1091 goals as official, It's really tiresome and sad how european public/media try really hard to diminish Pelé's career just because he didn't play "officialy" in European Football. And They didn't considerer the strength of South-American footbal back then, and that Europe's wasn't really that above; in fact, they were pretty much in the same level. Thank you again, for not being "eurocentric" 😁
Thanks Gabriel, it's a shame that most of the comments suggest a lot of people arrived at the video with a pre-conceived idea and aren't willing to entertain anything else, regardless of the truth. Pelé has said some stupid stuff over the years, but the way in which some seek to diminish his legacy is bizarre.
@@HITCSevens tell me about it! It's a tough war for us Brazilians at r/soccer to defend his legacy. Feel free to join us at r/SantosFC and r/futebol and engage with our community
Its funny that santos has made this article after messi broke pele's record. They could not do it earlier. This is ridiculous. Everyone can understand that this is a lie.
Brazil was the best team by a country mile in those decades. Three world cub wins. The Brazilian leagues had tons of talent, and none of it was stolen away by Europe. So imagine all the best Brazilians now in the world, all going back to Brazil and playing. Kinda makes you wonder if Brasil wouldn't be the best league or certainly second or third in the world. The talent is unquestioned, it just mostly moves abroad. Back then it couldn't leave, first because no market existed and then the dictatorship. So let's not pretend modern Brasil Serie A is anything like the regional or national competitions that existed during Pele's career. It's incomparable. Trying to deny Pele's success is just ludicrous, no better than the juvenile Messi/Ronaldo fanboys refusing to acknowledge the other's greatness.
as a brazilian, i can tell you that even if every brazlian player played here, the league would still suck cause our FA is corrupt and dumb as shit and most of the clubs are a mess. just look at what happened in the late 90's/early 00's. it would be fun though lol
The success of Europe's football leagues has more to do with exposure and TV deal money than anything else. Brazilian football didn't make the moves they needed to make in the 60's and 70's to make sure the rest of the world was watching
Could you do a video on the "forgotten" goalscorer in josef bican. I think it would be good especially with everything that is going on at the moment with pele and messi
To be honest, he spent a big chunk combos career in Austria playing against farmers so yeah but still be was a world class player but just not on the level of pele or anyone else
He was. In the league that he played, the top-scorer 12 times during his 27-year career and Europe's top scorer in five consecutive seasons, from 1939-40 to 1943-44 while most of players and the physically fit young men were in the war. To put it simply he was beast in a league where all the other top notch players where fighting wars or defending boarders. He didn't have competition. Bican and Ali Daei are the same breed. Ali was found out tho because when he came to Bayern and other german clubs he was garbage but in asia he was a god among men.
@@raplegend7775 Austrian Football was one of the best in the time he played. Austria got to the semifinals while he was playing for them, surely during the war he had easier competitions, but I, as an Austrian, think that he's a great subject for a Video and I'm sure there's more information to find out about him. But still, Franz Binder probably would've outscored him if they played the same amount of games.
@@forsti3716 RSSSF prolific list used to have Bican with 805+ goals but it was updated recently and now Bican is listed as having 948+ official goals (www.rsssf.com/players/prolific.html ). However, he's not in the top spot anymore and some German dude i've never heard of before has 981+ goals, and that's not the only dude i've never heard of before with huge number of goals: Joe Bambrick, Abe Lenstra, Tommy Lawton, to name just a few, also suddenly "appear out of nowhere" on the list. Even Pele has more goals now (775 official or 1301 goals in you include unofficial) and this is highly suspect for two reasons, IMO: 1 - even in Brazil they don't recognize Pelé with more than 767 official or 1284 (including unofficial) 2 - this update came mere days after CR7 crossed "Bican's old official goals record" in professional competitions of 759, and it has been updated again since then
Europeans do not know the importance of the State football leagues in Brazil. They are championships that fill stadiums and are audience leaders on television.
The same can be claimed for college sports in USA but just because they fill stadiums and have good viewing numbers doesn't mean the quality is comparable with top domestic leagues.
@@umepojke6579 Pelé, Ronaldo, Ronaldinho, Adriano, Neymar, Ceni, Rivelino, Seedorf, Honda, Petkovic. All of these players played in the state leagues. I think the quality of these competitions is good, I just think...
@@umepojke6579 you are right if you look at a state like Rondônia or Tocantins, where the quality of the football is horrible. If you look at a state like São Paulo, where the state championship currently has 16 teams, 5 that are on Série A (top division in Brazil), 4 in série B (second division) and 2 that are on série C (third division), the competition quality is good enough to justify the “hype”
@@gabrielfrancisco3055 How many of those players played in Brazil during their peak? Pele, Rivelino and Ceni. The rest were in Europe for their best years. Plus lots of "minor" leagues have had fantastic players play in them at different stages of their career. The Dutch league has produced and had some of the most talented players play their but I don't think we can claim it's as strong as La Liga.
Who really cares who scored the most? I was 9 and watched Pele in the World Cup on a black and white TV set, I went to Barca and saw Messi, both of them, masters of their craft, both outstanding! Happy New Year dude and thanks for sharing.
I think it’s because Pelé claims he scored 1,283 goals when he really only scored 643 official goals for Santos, 37 for New York Cosmos, and 77 for Brasil. He’s always changing so Messi and Ronaldo won’t pass him so he can stay relevant. Not even google knows the true answer anymore it says 1279 then 1283 on peles Instagram, then says 31 or Cosmos then 37. Then 643 for santos then goes to 1091 like come on I’m surprised FIFA hasn’t stepped in and corrected it saying only official goals count not friendlies.
THANK YOU FOR THIS VIDEO It is really hard to explain this to the young Europeans fans, now I can just show this video! I think you can't compare Messi and Pelé, but I hate when people start to say Pelé scored most of his against amateurs or he isn't that good because he didn't played on Europe. Actually, at Pelé's time Brazilian football was far better than Europe's. Loved the video! VAMO NÁUTICO ⚪🔴⚪🔴
"Pele played in a farmers league" This is BY FAR, the worst argument against Pele, simply because state-level tournaments in Brasil, throughout the 50s, 60s, and even late 80s were not weak, on the contrary, in fact, some of them (São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro, Minas Gerais and Rio Grande do Sul) were very strong. Even stronger than the national championship. First of all, Brazilian football was much stronger then, since almost all Brazilian players would remain in the country. Imagine if Neymar, Coutinho, Marcelo, Firmino, Casemiro, Gabriel Jesus, Paulinho, Thiago Alcantara, Thiago Silva played domestic. The 1958 team? All of them played locally. 1962 team? 1970 team? 1950 second place team? Yeah, you got it. And I'm not talking only about first class players in Spain, England, Germany or Italy. Imagine if the hundreds of brazilian players in Portugal, Ukraine, Japan, Turkey, Russia were playing in Brazil. That was the situation until late 80s. It's also important to notice that Brazil is a huge continental country. There wasn't a national organized tournament until late 60's. State level tournaments were by far the most important events. It must be said that some of Brazilian states are as big as most of European Countries, but football is historically centered on a few of those states. São Paulo and Rio de Janeiro were the main ones, with Minas Gerais and Rio Grande do Sul on close second. In the 1958 team there were 10 players from São Paulo (from 5 different teams), and 12 players from Rio (from 5 different teams). 1962 had 13 from 4 different teams from São Paulo. 1970 team had 11 players from Sâo Paulo (from 5 different teams); If you take a list of teams with most National Champions from the 60's until now, first, second, fourth and fifth places are teams from São Paulo - Palmeiras, Santos, Corinthians and São Paulo FC. All of them, by the way, are also multiple Copa Libertadores Champions. Not to mention medium level teams with multiple second place and third place national honours like Portuguesa, Ponte Preta and Guarany (1978 national champion), that were also playing on São Paulo. Teams from São Paulo have more National Trophies than teams from all the other states combined. So, HOW, HOW, HOW can one say that the São Paulo State was not a very strong Tournament, with FOUR high level teams and a number of medium level teams?!?!?! It was strong! Pele was playing against some of the best! Pele's team, Santos, was playing against some of the world's best players, and beating some of Brazil's best teams. It´s foolish to compare those Brazilian state-level tournaments with German ones, for instance. They are not the same. Nowadays, people forget this, cause the National Tournament is well established, but simply put. State-level Tournaments WERE the most important tournaments throughout the 50's till the 70's. And you know what? THE SAME IS HAPPENING RIGHT NOW IN EUROPE. Imagine this: São Paulo is roughly the size of the UK and has/had 4 high-level teams, Minas Gerais, with two high-level teams, is the size of Spain, Rio has/have 4 high-level teams, Rio Grande do Sul have/has 2, and so on. Those states had very strong state-level championships. One day, they decided to create a strong National Tournament and, little by little, those strong state tournaments begin to shrink. 40 years later, we are calling them "farmer's league" Well, Spain has 2 (maybe 3) strong teams; England has 4, Germany has 2, Italy I don't know anymore, 2 or 3. There are always plans for a Europe League, with all of them. Imagine if little by little they begin to abandon the domestic league in favor of this new continental one. 40 years from now, there will be people saying that Messi or Ronaldo or Muller played in a farmer´s league.
Pele rightfully deserves to be ranked as an all time great. Millennial's dismiss his greatness because his achievements were in the past but all agree Maradona deserves to be up there. Even though there were great players in between Pele and Marordona and it was only when Maradona showed up that people who witnessed both players even considered Maradona take Pele's crown as the best ever. A lot of guys still had Maradona as 1B to Pele's 1A. And after those two, in spite of exceptional players like Van Basten, Platini, Baggio, Romario, Zico, Socrates and so on, people who lived through the late 60's, 70's and 80's still had them as the consensus top two and it pretty much stayed that way right up until Messi and Ronaldo showed up.
So peles " friendly games " were more intense then the actual " official games " just let that sink in for a minute 🙄. In that case I'll definitely count friendly games!
The criteria they used now is different because UEFA and Fifa came up with this idea to declassify games. In Brazil and when Pele played in his era way back in the 1960's everything and every game was considered official. Pele really did score 1090 goals for Santos FC and he has a guinness world record 1284 goals in total. Pele also holds 2 other world records being the only 3 time world cup champion and youngest world champion in history at age 17.
@@electrogem7142 It angers me when people want to diminish Pele and inflate other players ego when in reality no player in history has had a more impressive resume then Pele did. Pele is a 3 time world champion with Brazil, 2 time world champion with Santos making him a 5 time world champion overall. Pele is the only player in history to win 3 World Cups and he has 3 world records: Being the youngest world champion in history winning his first world title at age 17 in 1958 Sweden. Pele also holds a Guinness world record for most goals scored 1284 or 1283 not counting his special farewell goal. Pele also has a world record for 3 World Cups. Pele also was the most talented and highly skilled player in the history of the game being able to hit the ball from his head, juggle, perfect bicycle kicks, volley kicks, pass without looking. Pele speed reached 100 meters in 12 seconds in his time and he was able to jump as high as 6 feet in the air in maximum height. Pele wasn't just a player he was a super athlete literally and he is the most famous men's player in Brazil's history. Brazil is a 5 time world champion with their men's team because of his revolutionary genius and artistic talent. Pele wasn't just a player he was a artist and definition of greatness and perfection. Pele was a perfect player no question. Pele is the definition and text book definition of greatness in the 157 history of the sport since England invented the sport in 1860's. No other player has come close to Pele not in the 19th century, 20th century, 21st century. Pele was the most dominant and most complete player for both his country and clubs which he played for. He was a global superstar and phenomenon.
A lot of people want to know who the greatest player of all time in the men's game happens to be. In terms of dominance and world records and talent hands down Edson Arantes do Nacimento or Pele is the greatest player to play the game. Nobody and I mean nobody not even Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo, Mane Garrincha, Miroslav Klose, Diego Maradona, Zinedine Zidane, Ronaldinho Gaucho, Rivaldo, David Beckham, Bobby Charlton, Zico, Michel Platini, Paulo Rossi, Lothar Matheus, Roger Milla, Eusebio, Daniel Passarella, Fabio Cannavarro, Giovanni Ferrari, Ghigghia, Puskas, Modric, Zlatan Ibahimovic, Romario, Bebeto, Roberto Carlos, Just Fontaine, Alfredo Di Stefano, Xavi, Iniesta, Thomas Muller, Gert Muller, Johan Crufy, Gabriel Batistuta, Carlos Tevez, George Best, Michael Owen, Henry, Rogerio Ceni, Buffon, Neur, and I mean nobody and I mean nobody in this 157 year history of the sport has been as complete as Pele has been. Not since England invented the sport in the 1860's you can compare Pele to every single player from the 19th, 20th, 21st century and Pele stats and math with his world championships, scoring records, skills would come out as the validictorian of his class in all 3.
@@rogerstephenroth8073 so true, but winning arguments against idiots is almost impossible, which i can relate to u, but pele will always be remembered.
If Pele is a fraud for scoring against the opponents he faced in Brazilian league then I wonder what would people say about Messi and Ronaldo now. Everyone faces all type of opposition so this entire claim is bizzare
You know the video is just ass alfieri is just nostalgic for the old games were he wasn't even alive..if peles record were legit they had over 70 years to correct it but didn't say nothing until the record was broken...this shows they are clearly not credible
If they were deemed to be of no value 70 years ago, Pele wouldn’t of bothered playing them, did you watch the vid. Also FIFA retroactively deemed the games as unofficial, not when they were played.
5:45 In all honesty, during that time and up to the 90s, european clubs were much worse than southamerican ones. European football only started to become good when they were able to start buying more southamerican players for their teams, so playing in southamerican competition was way more difficult than playing against europeans.
i would't say they were much worse overall, it was probably pretty even. but the absolute best brazilian teams of the 60's (santos and botafogo), 70's (internacional and cruzeiro) and early 80's (flamengo and atletico mineiro) sure were better then any european ones.
End of the day Pele is GOAT he was doing all that on the ball 50 years before Messi so he is the real Genius , the fact it has taken 50 years for another player to be put in same breath as Pele speaks for it self...and Pele did it in era where defenders could tackle , not now as it is non contact sport , ball heavier then, and pitches bad.
@@kedda4515 but that is one of the reasons, he did things back in the 50s and 60s that players have not long ago started doing. Him Maradona and Di Stefano top 3
@@gmain1977 nah what does that even mean if someone in the future scores 1200 goals he won't be worse than Pele because he was after that's not how it works
It angers me when people want to diminish Pele and inflate other players ego when in reality no player in history has had a more impressive resume then Pele did. Pele is a 3 time world champion with Brazil, 2 time world champion with Santos making him a 5 time world champion overall. Pele is the only player in history to win 3 World Cups and he has 3 world records: Being the youngest world champion in history winning his first world title at age 17 in 1958 Sweden. Pele also holds a Guinness world record for most goals scored 1284 or 1283 not counting his special farewell goal. Pele also has a world record for 3 World Cups. Pele also was the most talented and highly skilled player in the history of the game being able to hit the ball from his head, juggle, perfect bicycle kicks, volley kicks, pass without looking. Pele speed reached 100 meters in 12 seconds in his time and he was able to jump as high as 6 feet in the air in maximum height. Pele wasn't just a player he was a super athlete literally and he is the most famous men's player in Brazil's history. Brazil is a 5 time world champion with their men's team because of his revolutionary genius and artistic talent. Pele wasn't just a player he was a artist and definition of greatness and perfection. Pele was a perfect player no question. Pele is the definition and text book definition of greatness in the 157 history of the sport since England invented the sport in 1860's. No other player has come close to Pele not in the 19th century, 20th century, 21st century. Pele was the most dominant and most complete player for both his country and clubs which he played for. He was a global superstar and phenomenon.
My team actually played 1-1 with Santos in 1969. Pele scored the equalizer in the 78th minute. Josip Bukal gave us the lead in the 45th minute. We used to be so fucking good and now we can't get past Maccabi Tel Aviv in the Europa League qualifiers... where did it go wrong?
I always wonder why Santos dropped off in the mid 60’s just like that. It makes sense now. Basically if Santos concentrated on actual competition, they may have won more and Pele scored more official goals. Modern day millennial fans are probably the most annoying fans. All they see is messi or Ronaldo. Coming second is a disaster. Load of BS. All people read is stats. It’s the overall play of a player that is more important. This is a great video.
Not to mention Pele did not face weak opposition when he played against the European representative in the club world cup either and he still won both of them. He played against Eusebio's Benfica, Eusebio being possibly the greatest European striker or all time and Maldini's Milan that also had at the time Amarildo, who was Pele's backup at the 1962 WC and played most of the games at that cup as a starter due to Pele's injury, which only adds to his legend
I'm technically a millennial as I was a teenager in the year 2000 but I wonder whether you mean fans who are younger..."Gen Z" I think they're called? Me and all my friends of the same age do think Messi & Ronaldo are obviously great but we do remember the older great players. To put into perspective Maradona retired from football when I was in high school so I've been lucky to see some great players and as a "Millennial" its not all about Ronnie and Leo for me.
I think it’s funny how english fans criticize Pele’s talent and goals when the only reason they have a World Cup is because people deliberately injured him in 1966
England should be grateful Pele was injured and not doing well or they would have not won the World Cup in 1966. So England was very lucky that Brazil had a bad world cup.
I don't think they are being fair to Pele because in his time the real records were over 1090 for Santos. Santos games were all considered official in his time. Fifa and UEFA and some assholes decided to change the criteria to discount goals which doesn't reflect the real truth of how many goals Pele actually scored. Pele holds 3 Guinness world records being for 1284 goals being almost double of Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo total goal scored and 3 World Cup championships and not to mention being the youngest world champion at age 17. Pele is a 5 time world champion being 2 time world club champion with Santos 1962-1963 and 3 time world champion with Brazil.
So glad you called out the foolishness of stat culture. It’s almost like people don’t watch football anymore or enjoy it. They just care about numbers and it’s awful. If numbers mattered most people probably wouldn’t realize how important zaha is to palace cuz he doesn’t score enough. Something that simple gets lots to foolishness
The no10 role players used to play wasn’t quite a forward and wasn’t quite a midfielder. So it’s hard to compare goal machines of today with Ronnie. Their core functions were different. You’d rather compare him to someone like KDB to get a better idea.
Like 15 or 20 years ago, FIFA officially recognized, after some lengthy disputes over the matter, that the greatest goal-scorers in history was the trio of Pele, Czech Josef "Pepi" Bican and German Uwe Seeler, stating that no-one will likely ever really know how many goals exactly each of these super-shooters have netted in all official and semi-official matches. Each one of them had SOMETHING over 1000 goals. By then, the debate got settled like so. At least for the time being.
@@THEchrisse95 Yeah, precisely!! Most likely they did not, because at the turn of the millennia the average number of goals scored per game in the whole world of football was steadily decreasing.
@@oscarhaines3541 I have fun seeing ignorant people ignore the history of the beautiful sport, besides jokes are supposed to be funny, typical British Saltiness honestly
Excerpt from FIFAs website From the article “Pele: The greatest of them all” “In the course of his long and unique career, he scored more than 1,200 goals, a record likely to stand for all time, and which includes more than 1,000 goals for Santos, Pele’s club from 1956 to 1974. He also added 72 goals in 92 appearances for A Seleção.”
If you claim that Pele is the best player ever, but you have not watched atleast 10 full 90 minute games of him playing, then I'm sorry to tell you but you are a sheep. You do not posses the capability to make decisions of your own, so you have delegated your thought process to other people. You have been TOLD that he is the greatest and you have accepted that as a fact simply because the oppinion of society has more waight thaqn the limited capabilities of your brain to forge independent decisions.
@@GeneralGreevas One could make the exact same thing about Lionel Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo. If you have not seen Pele play 10 full 90 minutes, you can not call either of these two "the best ever".
@@SuperMyslayer Bradford is one of the larger cities in England and Bradford City is one of the clubs that has been part of the pro-league system in English football for so many years that it definetly deserves a video
They definitely deserve a video in my opinion hopefully alfie will see this at some point and agree are far to big of a club to be in the league and position they are in atm
I just dislike the ignorant myth that offside didn't exist perpetrated by fans and sadly players like Zlatan. All this to discredit Pele's (and by extension players from yesteryear) accomplishments.
I scored 1000 offside goals in my school football pitch, all I had to do was just lurk around in the opposition half and wait for a ball over the top...of you think it shouldn't be considered you are deluded
A lot of people want to know who the greatest player of all time in the men's game happens to be. In terms of dominance and world records and talent hands down Edson Arantes do Nacimento or Pele is the greatest player to play the game. Nobody and I mean nobody not even Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo, Mane Garrincha, Miroslav Klose, Diego Maradona, Zinedine Zidane, Ronaldinho Gaucho, Rivaldo, David Beckham, Bobby Charlton, Zico, Michel Platini, Paulo Rossi, Lothar Matheus, Roger Milla, Eusebio, Daniel Passarella, Fabio Cannavarro, Giovanni Ferrari, Ghigghia, Puskas, Modric, Zlatan Ibahimovic, Romario, Bebeto, Roberto Carlos, Just Fontaine, Alfredo Di Stefano, Xavi, Iniesta, Thomas Muller, Gert Muller, Johan Crufy, Gabriel Batistuta, Carlos Tevez, George Best, Michael Owen, Henry, Rogerio Ceni, Buffon, Neur, and I mean nobody and I mean nobody in this 157 year history of the sport has been as complete as Pele has been. Not since England invented the sport in the 1860's you can compare Pele to every single player from the 19th, 20th, 21st century and Pele stats and math with his world championships, scoring records, skills would come out as the validictorian of his class in all 3.
As a brazilian, I really apreciate this video and your non-european content overall. it gets really tiresome to read people argue that pele only played against farmers and, in the same comment, trying to diminish his exploits in the world cups he won by saying our national teams, composed by players against whom he constantly played, were too good.
I don't think they are being fair to Pele because in his time the real records were over 1090 for Santos. Santos games were all considered official in his time. Fifa and UEFA and some assholes decided to change the criteria to discount goals which doesn't reflect the real truth of how many goals Pele actually scored. Pele holds 3 Guinness world records being for 1284 goals being almost double of Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo total goal scored and 3 World Cup championships and not to mention being the youngest world champion at age 17. Pele is a 5 time world champion being 2 time world club champion with Santos 1962-1963 and 3 time world champion with Brazil.
I am from England but Brazilian fan, England and Europe are just ignorant due to jealousy , part of it is due to racism as well, England had big issue with black players playing in England , they say he played In farmers league but Brazil won 3 world cups out of 4. Britain always been ignorant
@@gmain1977 Well no it is not that, it is they made up a new criteria which discounts Pele's real goal total. Back in Pele's time all the games he played were considered official. When later UEFA and teams from Europe they used a different criteria which would discount goals from what they considered unofficial games. Hence the unofficial-official criteria came into play. Pele's real goal scoring record is a Guinness world record of 1284 goals. He actually scored 1090 for Santos FC in his whole career which is far more then what Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo scored for both club and country, and this is considering it is not even his total number of goals. Pele also won many titles with Brazil, Santos, New York Cosmos before he retired 50 years ago way back in the 1970's.
@@gmain1977 I usually think that english people are upset they they aren't the best at any of the games they invented. I might be wrong, but that's the vibe I get from following british sports media sometimes.
This is BY FAR, the worst argument against Pele, simply because state-level tournaments in Brasil, throughout the 50s, 60s, and even late 80s were not weak, on the contrary, in fact, some of them (São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro, Minas Gerais and Rio Grande do Sul) were very strong. Even stronger than the national championship. First of all, Brazilian football was much stronger then, since almost all Brazilian players would remain in the country. Imagine if Neymar, Coutinho, Marcelo, Firmino, Casemiro, Gabriel Jesus, Paulinho, Thiago Alcantara, Thiago Silva played domestic. The 1958 team? All of them played locally. 1962 team? 1970 team? 1950 second place team? Yeah, you got it. And I'm not talking only about first class players in Spain, England, Germany or Italy. Imagine if the hundreds of brazilian players in Portugal, Ukraine, Japan, Turkey, Russia were playing in Brazil. That was the situation until late 80s. It's also important to notice that Brazil is a huge continental country. There wasn't a national organized tournament until late 60's. State level tournaments were by far the most important events. It must be said that some of Brazilian states are as big as most of European Countries, but football is historically centered on a few of those states. São Paulo and Rio de Janeiro were the main ones, with Minas Gerais and Rio Grande do Sul on close second. In the 1958 team there were 10 players from São Paulo (from 5 different teams), and 12 players from Rio (from 5 different teams). 1962 had 13 from 4 different teams from São Paulo. 1970 team had 11 players from Sâo Paulo (from 5 different teams); If you take a list of teams with most National Champions from the 60's until now, first, second, fourth and fifth places are teams from São Paulo - Palmeiras, Santos, Corinthians and São Paulo FC. All of them, by the way, are also multiple Copa Libertadores Champions. Not to mention medium level teams with multiple second place and third place national honours like Portuguesa, Ponte Preta and Guarany (1978 national champion), that were also playing on São Paulo. Teams from São Paulo have more National Trophies than teams from all the other states combined. So, HOW, HOW, HOW can one say that the São Paulo State was not a very strong Tournament, with FOUR high level teams and a number of medium level teams?!?!?! It was strong! Pele was playing against some of the best! Pele's team, Santos, was playing against some of the world's best players, and beating some of Brazil's best teams. It´s foolish to compare those Brazilian state-level tournaments with German ones, for instance. They are not the same. Nowadays, people forget this, cause the National Tournament is well established, but simply put. State-level Tournaments WERE the most important tournaments throughout the 50's till the 70's. And you know what? THE SAME IS HAPPENING RIGHT NOW IN EUROPE. Imagine this: São Paulo is roughly the size of the UK and has/had 4 high-level teams, Minas Gerais, with two high-level teams, is the size of Spain, Rio has/have 4 high-level teams, Rio Grande do Sul have/has 2, and so on. Those states had very strong state-level championships. One day, they decided to create a strong National Tournament and, little by little, those strong state tournaments begin to shrink. 40 years later, we are calling them "farmer's league" Well, Spain has 2 (maybe 3) strong teams; England has 4, Germany has 2, Italy I don't know anymore, 2 or 3. There are always plans for a Europe League, with all of them. Imagine if little by little they begin to abandon the domestic league in favor of this new continental one. 40 years from now, there will be people saying that Messi or Ronaldo or Muller played in a farmer´s league.
It doesn’t matter if pele didn’t score as many goals as everyone thought he did, it doesn’t change the quality of the player. Yes, many of his goals came from friendly’s but with an incredible goal count of 1,282, you couldn’t equal that number
Pele holds the official Guinness world record for most goals scored 1284 goals he also holds other world records such as youngest world champion in a World Cup at age 17 and the only player in history with 3 World Cups. Those are world records no player has been able to beat so far and this includes the other so called goat candidates in the game who fans wanted to dispute and claim as better then Pele. Pele is the real goat and most complete player who ever played the game. Pele's revolutionary genius and art form is a big reason Brazil eventually became a super power in soccer-football and a 5 time world champion.
Pele was a fantastic player. It's not his goals that make him one of the best. It's the longevity, the beautiful way he scored and more. People get way too bent on his goals because they are actually less than they say they are
Just a small detail, Pelé wasn't "used to score 5 or 6 times agains't são Paulo league" Pelé only scored more than 5 goals in a match once during his whole career and 5 goals only 7 times.
@@vitorqueiroz8791 Pele has 1284 if you count friendlies, Gerd Müller has 1461 if you count friendlies. Source: www.rsssf.com/players/prolific.html#gmueller everything documented, + Bayern's official site also used these numbers before.
@@vitorqueiroz8791 Also if we count everything, then possibly Bican also had more goals since he might had around 1500 goals with every match included. source: www.rsssf.com/players/prolific.html#bican
Pele was unstoppable in more ways than one. I'd love an in depth explanation why he didn't play in Europe from him but its probably no more complex that he was born a one-club man like messi, del piero, totti or giggs and scholes. Pele was so impossibly polite that he'd have felt bad displacing x player at the new club he would've signed for that he'd rather not start that ball even rolling-no reason to leave Santos he was needed there and welcome..
It seems like ppl now just ignore that football exists for decades... i already can imagine the discussion on 2060: ppl saying "Messi and C.Ronaldo weren't that good because they scored on the spanish league, and as you know, the 2060's best league is the chinese, of course, so the rest of history is just garbage"... Ppl just ignore the context and make non sense comparisons. In reading comments saying that Pele is overrated... for god sake... These guys dont love football, they love numbers, but only the numbers that are convenient for them. Thats sad.
Could you do a video on why there is a much smaller culture of away fans traveling to games in Spain compared to other leagues in Europe and if this happens in any other countries
I am not buying into that bullshit from the media, when Messi or Cristiano Ronaldo break Pele's real records then i will be impressed. This record only counted because they discounted 447 goals from Pele.
If you claim that Pele is the best player ever, but you have not watched atleast 10 full 90 minute games of him playing, then I'm sorry to tell you but you are a sheep. You do not posses the capability to make decisions of your own, so you have delegated your thought process to other people. You have been TOLD that he is the greatest and you have accepted that as a fact simply because the oppinion of society has more waight thaqn the limited capabilities of your brain to forge independent decisions.
@@GeneralGreevas My overall claim is fact not opinion and there is no question of a doubt Pele is the real goat and the greatest player in the history of the game. Nobody has won more world titles in Fifa World Cups then Pele with 3 World Cups and 2 World Club championships with Santos FC making him a 5 time world champion all around. Youngest world champion ever at the age of 17 in the 1958 Fifa World Cup in the world championship in Sweden. Most goals in the history of the men's game with a Guinness world record of 1284 goals in total. Pele holds 3 Guinness world records being the only 3 time world cup champion, youngest world champion at age 17 and most goals officially. All this has been certified as Guinness world records. Nobody which I have seen is anywhere near what Pele was. Brazil became a super power in soccer-football because of Pele's revolutionary genius and art to the game. As they say the English invented the game while the Brazilians perfected it "bringing it as a art form with the "jogo bonito" or beautiful game. Pele was the most dominant athlete in his sport which is comparable to other legends from other sports. Pele reputation was so great as a champion he was voted athlete of the 20th century beating the likes of Mark Spitz, Michael Jordan, Carl Lewis, Michael Schumacher, Michael Phelps, Muhammed Ali, you name it. Pele wasn't just a player in the game, the man is the most famous man in Brazil and a icon and legend. Diego Maradona of Argentina heavily was jealous of Pele's genius and thus was subject to the world's biggest rivalry between Brazil and Argentina. It makes a lot of sense though the greatest player in history would be from Brazil, given Brazil has produced the most world champions in the sports history. No other country in the world even among the elite national teams like Germany, Italy respectively 4 time world champions, Uruguay, Argentina, France 2 time world champions and Spain and England world champions respectively in the club of elite 8 world champion nations in the men's team has produced a finer player then Pele. Pele genius was not only reflected by his dominance and art form in the game but his technical abilities as well as he was able to dribble, do perfect bicycle kicks, pass without looking, hit the ball in mid air and score from every angle. Pele was the equivalent of a soccer-football harlem globe trotter player. Pele actually had referee's wanted to hug him because he scored such beautiful goals. Pele when he was booted out by a referee in Colombia, the fans booted the ref and brought back Pele. When Pele and his team Santos visited a team in Africa, they actually stopped a war to see them play. Pele actually managed to take a position as goalie. Pele has won titles competing in every sector of the globe including the Brazilian military team.
@@bungeespeaks6081 No they were actual goals, they changed the criteria with a bullshit unofficial and official games criteria many years later, but in Pele's time all the games he played were official games. Pele scored over 1,000 goals with Santos adding 1091 in total way more then Messi 644 goals. That is one of Pele's real records along with 95 for Brazil's men's national team according to CBF records in Brazil and Guinness world record 1284 goals.
@@bungeespeaks6081 Well Guinness book of world records lists him officially as the biggest goal scorer in history with 1284 goals which is an official world record. When Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo break Pele's real world record in the Guinness book of records then that would be highly impressive.
The obsession with statistics comes from American culture. If you watch any American sports games on tv- baseball, American football, basketball, hockey, the MLS, etc and they are FILLED with statistics, some even downright silly.
Cool video and great to have this context on the friendlies Santos played. I don’t think it makes a real difference to the stats, though - the only fair and just way to tally these things is to count only official games. There’s simply no way of assessing the mindsets of the European teams (or Santos themselves) during the friendlies and say, with any serious authority, that they were ‘trying just as hard or harder, and taking things just as seriously, as they would a la Liga or European Cup game - it’s Santos, yo!’. That doesn’t cut it at all. I doubt that all the hundreds of players involved in those games in which Pele scored cared ‘more’ or as much as they did about the games that would put their own clubs’ names on trophies, or their own names in the record books. Maybe some did. Maybe - maybe - most did. Not all though, and this, and the fact that the levels of care or effort simply can never be quantified, is exactly why it’s only fair that sanctioned, professional, official games count towards records. I’m sure there are at least some players/teams who tried their best against Messi or Gerd Muller in friendlies over the years, but how can you tell? Which goals from Messi’s or Muller’s friendlies get added to theiir totals? The easy (and sensible) answer is: none. In the end it’s the fault of Santos for prioritising glamourball over football: they put Pele in a position where he played much of his career in what effectively were likely (but not always, not to a man) high-quality exhibitions. If Pele *had* played more ‘proper’ games with Santos, he’d surely have scored more official goals (how many, though, no one can say - maybe far fewer than his friendly goals total, maybe more) and no one, including Messi, would be arguing against Santos. Nor, I imagine, would Barcelona or Bayern Munich be scouring the record books for goals scored in friendlies by Messi/Muller to ‘add’ to their totals, so as to outdo the great Pele. Santos made their money during their circus years, and I’m sure they thrilled many fans who loved that they go to see the great Brazilian side. But to now hark back to those wacky times in the 60s and use these games of dubious, unquantifiable quality or worth (in a sporting sense) to do down the verifiable achievements of Messi or Cristiano Ronaldo, or even of Pele’s contemporaries like Muller or, say, Jimmy Greaves, is lame. Pele is obviously one of the greats, and clearly deserves to be in any serious debate about *the* all-time greatest. Santos are being vicariously greedy, though, when it comes to the goals thing.
TBF even in official competitions santos and Pele would beat European teams, and as for the players state of mind imagine if you had the chance to play against the best team in the world, anybody would take it seriously. It’s fair to say officially Messi has more goals, but all 1000+ goals Pele scored are valid
@@Imperador-Vi See, that’s the problem, though: you can’t just assume the ability to assess the psychology of hundreds of guys playing football 50-odd years ago. Many players surely did want to beat Santos with all their hearts - did they all? Did they all take it 100% seriously? Citing the bad tackles on Pele doesn’t mean much, as I can see why European players (shitheaded ones, anyway!) would want to do in the great Pele, especially if he comes over in a circus-like fashion as part of the greatest team of earth. But that doesn’t mean everyone’s giving their all. Maybe they did but you can’t know, and that (among other things) makes it right and fair to judge players by metrics where there are at least some verifiable and agreeable and common parameters. People on here are saying Gerd Muller’s friendly goals don’t count (despite him have similar or better scoring-rates if they’re included than Pele) cos... it’s not Santos? There’s a lot of myth-making going on here. What if the keepers playing against uber-striker Muller considers it the greatest feat of his life to keep out the great German, and but still concedes three goals to him? They don’t count cos they’re not scored by Santos/Pele, I guess. Which makes me wonder, too - does this mean all the Santos players from those years get their friendly goals added to their totals, or just Pele? Do the players from AC Milan or Lyon or wherever who score against Santos get to add *those* goals to their official totals, but goals scored by a AC Milan players in friendlies against, say, powerhouses Real Madrid or Bayern Munich *don’t* include cos.... again, only Santos/teams with special-status Pele in them include in this one-off, made-for-Pele category. None of what I’m saying is an attempt to undermine Pele, who’s clearly an all-time great, a player of supreme ability and with a unique place in the larger story of football. This whole goal-grubbing, special-pleading stuff is beneath him, I think.
@@trevorbyrne4668 football is not the same as it used to be, I think the fact that in Official competitions Santos still beat European teams is evidence enough that other teams respected Santos, and it’s not fair that Pele scored so many valid goals for them to be ignored. Even if they don’t technically were official they can’t be treated as easy goals on friendliest and if he was hunted on the field by the other teams that only makes his life harder
No issues, take away goals and assists....Messi is still an absolute delight to watch aesthetically...the same cannot be said about Pelé and cr7...although Pelé did play in a different era..
@@vb2388 What nonsense. Messi has great skills and he's good to watch, but this is about who is the best. I am more pleased by watching KDB than Messi, doesn't mean he's the better player.
In Pele's era Santos FC in the 1960's was the best club team in the world and they were South American and world club champions in the intercontinental championships. But I have no doubt that Pele's real record for club team is way more then 644 as it hits at 1090.
If you claim that Pele is the best player ever, but you have not watched atleast 10 full 90 minute games of him playing, then I'm sorry to tell you but you are a sheep. You do not posses the capability to make decisions of your own, so you have delegated your thought process to other people. You have been TOLD that he is the greatest and you have accepted that as a fact simply because the oppinion of society has more waight thaqn the limited capabilities of your brain to forge independent decisions.
@@GeneralGreevas do you wanna see and hear from the greatest of the greatest players in football history who saw Pelé play and did also play against him and at the very same time said Pelé was the best ever player in the history of football? tell me if you want a prove of those legendary players saying Pelé was the best ever player, i have the link to that video on this same very social media called youtube so it wouldn't cost you anything or take longer to realise how mistake you are
@@daniel_mensa I am not really convinced we will see someone better then Pele for a long time. I don't see anyone winning 3 World Cups and scoring 1300 goals as well maintaining a high level for both their national teams and club team. The problem with Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo is they are world class club players and underachievers with Argentina and Portugal which is why I can't consider them being compared to the greatest champion in the history of the sport Pele. Pele resume shows he has the most world titles, most goals, most skilled and most technical abilities which have yet to be matched by anyone in the 157 year history of the game. Pele is the valedictorian of the game in the 19th, 20th, 21st century.
@@GeneralGreevas If you do the math and stats based on scoring abilities, world titles, technical abilities Pele was a perfect player all around as a striker-forward. Pele was a superstar athlete or a true super athlete. Pele is the reason Brazil really did gain 5 world championships with their men team and he influenced other legends like Mane Garrincha, Romario, Zico, Ronaldo Nazario da Lima, Ronaldinho Gaucho, Rivaldo, Kaka, Neymar, Bebeto, Carlos Alberto Torres.
One thing has to be clarified: the Campeonato Paulista in the 1960s was by no means a “Weak League” or just a “regional championship”. Yes, it is a state league in Brazil, but its the state league of a 45+ million inhabitants state (larger than Spain) in which, nowadays, more than 30 Brazilian national championships since 1959 have been won by the teams from the São Paulo State. It may be hard for europeans to understand, but Brazil is a continent-sized country and, in the fifties and sixties, there was no sufficient infrastructure to organize a national championship of 20 teams. So, in that time, the winners of the state leagues faced each other in a much shorter playoff-like national championship, in which Santos only played 4 or 5 games to win. Pelé’s goals in the Campeonato Paulista cannot be underestimated, because that was arguably the best league in the world by that time, just read about it and the quality of the opposition he faced every week. MIL GOLS, SÓ PELÉ. MARADONA CHEIRADOR.
We also need to acknowledge that Pelé played in poor conditions compared to today’s game since boots, balls and etc made football much harder to play and he still dominated the world with those conditions, making his accomplishments even more impressive
@@vb2388 they should've. if only because they made a lot of money, and because they wound up shutting up dumb youtube commentators 60 years later that attempt to descredit pele saying he played against farmers (not saying you are one of those, i'm just venting at this point lol).
@@bernardovivas8436 Brazilian league was the best league in the World during the 60s...Santos never should’ve left Brazil to face weaker oppositions in friendlies imo.. Yes, they did it for money and now its costing Pelé’s Legacy.. Pelé’s goal tally stands at 643....I don’t think FIFA is going to change that..
@@vb2388 the thing is, brazil didn't really have a league back then. it was a knock out tournament during which santos played from 4 to 10 games a season. the bulk of the calendar was occupied by the regional championship, which was hugely important, don't get me wrong, but i think santos kind of outgrew that in the mid 1960's.
@@GeneralGreevas didn't Messi play against the Iceland keeper in the 2018 worldcup when it was said that the keeper who SAVED Messi's penalty was a film maker and a camera man, haha now tell me who played with players that had a job beside football🤣
@@bungeespeaks6081 haha one game? lol as if Messi hasn't been playing in his whole career against some 8th division pub teams in that average league called la liga🤣
Pele real record is actually 1090 with Santos FC and he has a Guinness world record 1284 goals career wise. So if they take the real records not the bullshit discounted records using the unofficial-official game discrimination criteria we have Pele's real goals. UEFA and those assholes in Europe invented this shit to discount goals in the era where in Pele's time the goals he scored and the games were considered official. They changed the criteria some years later to discount the total amount of goals unfairly which I think is a load of bullshit. So the reality is Messi isn't anywhere near Pele and neither is Cristiano Ronaldo. Pele could give 2 World Cups to both Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo and still have one for himself. Nobody is better then Pele, not even Diego Maradona, Garrincha, Zidane, Ronaldo Nazario da Lima, David Beckham, Franz Beckenbauer, Romario, Rivaldo, Ronaldinho Gaucho, Zico, Michel Platini, Johan Cruyf, Bobby Charlton, Michael Owen, Paulo Rossi, Giovanni Ferrari, Ghiggia, Puskas, Eusebio, Gert Muller, Miroslav Klose, Just Fontaine, Modric, Xavi, Iniesta, Kaka, Mohammed Salah, Daniel Passarella, Gabriel Batistuta, Roger Milla, Lothar Matheus, Michael Ballack, Iniesta, Fabio Cannavarro, Thomas Mueller, Oliver Kahn, Rogerio Ceni, Carlos Alberto Torres, Dunga, Roberto Carlos, Fabien Barthez, Taffarel, Neymar, Luiz Suarez, Zlatan Ibravimovic.
But Messi scoring 644 goals is far more impressive than Pele's 1000 something goals It's because the competition and the quality of players have improved so so much that a team today battling in relegation could realistically win a league back then...
Well there are many many great players back then in his time like Cruyff, Backenbaur, Maldini, Tresor, Fachetti, Best, Moore, Charlton, Law and many other greats.
That’s completely wrong back then offside rule has much more rules, poor condition pitch, no red cards or yellow cards which mean someone can break u leg yet he will still play the game, leather balls and leather shoes, no fitness diets, no advanced training methods, no technology to do surgeries, or to train with.
The thing is why is FC Santos bringing up Pele's record when someone like Lionel Messi has broken it? What if someone never broke the record, would they have brought up Pele's 1000 goals?
No that is not true, Santos and fans have always believed that Pele scored 1000 goals, the fans even have a chant, but now the club is disputing the claim Messi has more goals
It's not about letting it go. More like a resistance and rebel against the revisionism of football history to favour the current era. Why would a club not fight for its honor? Would Barca not have done the same thing?
Number of goals is just an aspect. More important is he played in the era 1960s when South America dominated the whole world in National as well as Clubs. Brazil won 3 WorldCups, and Brazilian/Arg/÷Urugoay won most of WorldCup for clubs.
I think purple in Europe seem to forget that the Brazilian league was the best in the world up until even the 90s, so there was no real reason for players to need to test themselves outside of Brazil. Think of Garrincha Socrates Zico who never spent significant time out of Brazil and are some of the greatest players ever
If you claim that Pele is the best player ever, but you have not watched atleast 10 full 90 minute games of him playing, then I'm sorry to tell you but you are a sheep. You do not posses the capability to make decisions of your own, so you have delegated your thought process to other people. You have been TOLD that he is the greatest and you have accepted that as a fact simply because the oppinion of society has more waight thaqn the limited capabilities of your brain to forge independent decisions.
Saint Lucia was the only FIFA country not to participate in the FIFA WCQ, can you please please make a video; What is going on in Saint Lucia Football? The local media is not giving this story the attention it deserves.
But a lot of PL clubs have technical directors so managers are not fully responsible for transfer business. Arsenal has Edu, Everton has Marcel Brands, City has Begiristain etc.
@@scoobyskreep3518 but the people who rely on statistics only miss the point constantly, read the book “naked statistics” so many examples of misleading statistics, you can’t turn the world into numbers only
So it seems like Pelé’s goals that didn’t count are more impressive then the ones that did count
Exactly which actually makes it sad cause technically he and santos made it their duty to demolish the rest of the world no one else can even think of doing that maybe golden barca but they lost some too
viper4326 Pele scored against his kids in his back garden as well and counted it towards his tally
@@berkayyilmaz2928 13 goals, hardly a major number
@@berkayyilmaz2928 But the difference is that Pele also played the best players in the world and actually was one of the best strikers in the world.
Even if you only consider the goals he scored against competent opposition, his record is still insane.
Not as high as he claims it to be but still one of the highest.
@@berkayyilmaz2928 seems like someone didn't watcht eh video
Really glad you made this video. People tend to disregard the respective context in which people lived when comparing individuals from different era's......Would be interesting to see how Messi and CR7 will be viewed 50-75 years from now. Imagine trying to explain to your grandkids how good they were and the response your grandkids give you is "well football was easier back then"....Imagine!
Imagine China being the biggest and the most difficult league and people disregarding all european players and praising Oscar or another player that nowadays plays there haha
Not to sound rude, but we have video footage of games back then and now. Defense, strategy, tactics, athleticism even rules became much more hard to beat. No matter what era, when someone sees Leo playing… it will be silence, no comparison to any other player.
@@MikeLandwolf I completely agree with you. But don’t you think people were saying that about Maradona in his day. Granted televised football wasn’t as wide spread as today but the 80’s are not that long ago
@@njabulombuyazi5132 Yes Maradona was greatest for a few years. But consistency that Messi gives… Every player no matter how great they were have disappointed me. Especially Ronaldinho, now Cristiano… but watching Messi play you know he will be better match after match. He gets better with age, he gets better after he gets knocked out, gets better after he twists his ankle, gets better after he loses. The guy is pure force of nature. He is something that nobody has ever seen before. I love Ronaldo, Maradona, Ronaldinho, Pele was and is God of football and maker of the history, we should all be thanking him because of what football is today. Yet nobody should compare anyone to Messi. Words can not describe how good he is.
@@njabulombuyazi5132 plus football or any other sport will not get any better. We have achieved the top nutritions and athletic performance. If it will get better it will be minimal, unnoticeable. This is the apex of every sport, especially football. Unless they start using some kind of performance enhancing drugs, which i highly doubt they will…
When history is so ancient that nobody is sure what is accurate anymore.
The HITC Sevens logo on the top left hides the list.
at 0:49 the top three are:
3. Iker Casillas (17 scored against by Messi)
2. Gorka Iraizoz (18..)
1. Diego Alves (21...)
Iraizoz played mainly for Bilbao whilst Alves spent most of his time in Spain at FC Valencia
@@lv15ballistol Iraizoz played most of his career for Athletic Bilbao, not Espanyol
@@NicoMartiM thanks, my bad i had a false memory sorry
yeah i just checked, he only played for Espanyol when he was younger
Thanks a lot for clearing this up.
@@lv15ballistol no problem lad, not sure if you're Spanish but if you're not I'm actually very impressed that you know about Gorka Iraizoz playing for Espanyol as a youngster, props to you for that
Thank you so much for making this video! I was just thinking the other day about how people who say Pele’s goals in friendlies “don’t count” don’t understand that those friendlies were actually tough games. People really need to brush up on their football/soccer history.
@daniielkoziina Those friendlies were way tougher than the Spanish league
@@Imperador-Vi Heavily doubt it, its a commonly known fact the quality of football has risen to new heights as the years go on. 70s Santos would barely stack up against a championship team these days. Obviously the romanticists will refuse to believe it but its the truth.
@@areebsiddiqui758 So what, we have to measure players on the time they played or else ashley barnes would be better than Pele, besides I would argue back then players had way less resources, and if the players from back then had today's resources they would be even better
@@Imperador-Vi Oh please, just watch the games from back then and compare them to the football played these days. Its miles apart, miles.
@@areebsiddiqui758 I repeat myself, so what players can’t magically play in the way of the future, someday people might say the same about Messi, but we know how good he is regardless compared to the rest
To claim he somehow watered down his career by never playing in a European league is ignorant because it is viewing the situation through modern eyes. Nowadays all the best players in the World go to Europe because that is where the money and best competition is. Back in the days when Pele was at his peak, all of the domestic leagues in the world were primarily filled with domestic players. Seeing someone like Argentinian Alfredo diStefano at Real Madrid was more of an aberration than the norm. Considering they won 3 out of 4 World Cups during his playing days I would say proves Brazil was the best footballing nation in the World at the time and shows Pele actually was competing against the best competition there was by staying in Brazil.
This
True. Pele is goat. Case closed
If I'm not wrong, the first world cup in which Brazil brought more players that were playing outside Brazil was in 1986, before that, domestic players dominated the national team
@@achyutanandjha2964 no he ain’t, Pepe played against construction workers in America lmfaooooooo
@@Jemo0 did u even watch the video
Great video, man! As a brazilian, it's so good to see an english language Football Channel trying to make a contextualized analysis of this topic, instead of a anacronic look. Even if people don't count the 1091 goals as official, It's really tiresome and sad how european public/media try really hard to diminish Pelé's career just because he didn't play "officialy" in European Football. And They didn't considerer the strength of South-American footbal back then, and that Europe's wasn't really that above; in fact, they were pretty much in the same level.
Thank you again, for not being "eurocentric" 😁
Thanks Gabriel, it's a shame that most of the comments suggest a lot of people arrived at the video with a pre-conceived idea and aren't willing to entertain anything else, regardless of the truth. Pelé has said some stupid stuff over the years, but the way in which some seek to diminish his legacy is bizarre.
@@HITCSevens tell me about it! It's a tough war for us Brazilians at r/soccer to defend his legacy. Feel free to join us at r/SantosFC and r/futebol and engage with our community
Grabiel Meireles
You're right and without taking credit from pelé, what Santos was doing was diminishing Messis record, which IS there
@@XmattoX r/soccer is a cesspit. It's a hivemind that tries to diminish anyone that isn't Messi.
Its funny that santos has made this article after messi broke pele's record. They could not do it earlier. This is ridiculous. Everyone can understand that this is a lie.
Brazil was the best team by a country mile in those decades. Three world cub wins. The Brazilian leagues had tons of talent, and none of it was stolen away by Europe. So imagine all the best Brazilians now in the world, all going back to Brazil and playing. Kinda makes you wonder if Brasil wouldn't be the best league or certainly second or third in the world. The talent is unquestioned, it just mostly moves abroad. Back then it couldn't leave, first because no market existed and then the dictatorship. So let's not pretend modern Brasil Serie A is anything like the regional or national competitions that existed during Pele's career. It's incomparable. Trying to deny Pele's success is just ludicrous, no better than the juvenile Messi/Ronaldo fanboys refusing to acknowledge the other's greatness.
as a brazilian, i can tell you that even if every brazlian player played here, the league would still suck cause our FA is corrupt and dumb as shit and most of the clubs are a mess. just look at what happened in the late 90's/early 00's. it would be fun though lol
The success of Europe's football leagues has more to do with exposure and TV deal money than anything else. Brazilian football didn't make the moves they needed to make in the 60's and 70's to make sure the rest of the world was watching
They suck now
"you shouldn't always focus on statistics"
someone tell that to Football Daily
They love to cherry-pick stats
Graziano Pelle is still upping Pelé’s goal record til this day
Pellè, not Pelle.
@@brandonhey7797 joke
Much to everyones disbelieve its actually Peel. Pele is a french surname and there was a goalkeeper who recently used it
He likely used Pele for publicity
Abedi Pele won an African Nations Cup and Champions League yet nobody serenades him with a Stradivarius under a September strawberry moon ??
Could you do a video on the "forgotten" goalscorer in josef bican. I think it would be good especially with everything that is going on at the moment with pele and messi
To be honest, he spent a big chunk combos career in Austria playing against farmers so yeah but still be was a world class player but just not on the level of pele or anyone else
He was. In the league that he played, the top-scorer 12 times during his 27-year career and Europe's top scorer in five consecutive seasons, from 1939-40 to 1943-44 while most of players and the physically fit young men were in the war. To put it simply he was beast in a league where all the other top notch players where fighting wars or defending boarders. He didn't have competition. Bican and Ali Daei are the same breed. Ali was found out tho because when he came to Bayern and other german clubs he was garbage but in asia he was a god among men.
@@raplegend7775 Austrian Football was one of the best in the time he played. Austria got to the semifinals while he was playing for them, surely during the war he had easier competitions, but I, as an Austrian, think that he's a great subject for a Video and I'm sure there's more information to find out about him.
But still, Franz Binder probably would've outscored him if they played the same amount of games.
Ya mate I would love to see that
@@forsti3716 RSSSF prolific list used to have Bican with 805+ goals but it was updated recently and now Bican is listed as having 948+ official goals (www.rsssf.com/players/prolific.html ). However, he's not in the top spot anymore and some German dude i've never heard of before has 981+ goals, and that's not the only dude i've never heard of before with huge number of goals: Joe Bambrick, Abe Lenstra, Tommy Lawton, to name just a few, also suddenly "appear out of nowhere" on the list.
Even Pele has more goals now (775 official or 1301 goals in you include unofficial) and this is highly suspect for two reasons, IMO:
1 - even in Brazil they don't recognize Pelé with more than 767 official or 1284 (including unofficial)
2 - this update came mere days after CR7 crossed "Bican's old official goals record" in professional competitions of 759, and it has been updated again since then
Thanks, Alfie.
As a Santos fan is nice to see a video like this!
2:50 yo that's pele playing against chivas
I think so
The badge looks similar
And also kit design
chivas sucks
Hablen en español prros
Finally some sense being talked instead of stupid rants towards Pele👏
Gerd Muller has more goals than Pele if we count friendlies
Europeans do not know the importance of the State football leagues in Brazil. They are championships that fill stadiums and are audience leaders on television.
The same can be claimed for college sports in USA but just because they fill stadiums and have good viewing numbers doesn't mean the quality is comparable with top domestic leagues.
@@umepojke6579 Pelé, Ronaldo, Ronaldinho, Adriano, Neymar, Ceni, Rivelino, Seedorf, Honda, Petkovic.
All of these players played in the state leagues. I think the quality of these competitions is good, I just think...
@@umepojke6579 you are right if you look at a state like Rondônia or Tocantins, where the quality of the football is horrible.
If you look at a state like São Paulo, where the state championship currently has 16 teams, 5 that are on Série A (top division in Brazil), 4 in série B (second division) and 2 that are on série C (third division), the competition quality is good enough to justify the “hype”
@@gabrielfrancisco3055 How many of those players played in Brazil during their peak? Pele, Rivelino and Ceni. The rest were in Europe for their best years. Plus lots of "minor" leagues have had fantastic players play in them at different stages of their career. The Dutch league has produced and had some of the most talented players play their but I don't think we can claim it's as strong as La Liga.
@@gabrielfrancisco3055 why the fuck you mentioned Honda, he was average even on his prime.
Who really cares who scored the most? I was 9 and watched Pele in the World Cup on a black and white TV set, I went to Barca and saw Messi, both of them, masters of their craft, both outstanding! Happy New Year dude and thanks for sharing.
I think it’s because Pelé claims he scored 1,283 goals when he really only scored 643 official goals for Santos, 37 for New York Cosmos, and 77 for Brasil. He’s always changing so Messi and Ronaldo won’t pass him so he can stay relevant. Not even google knows the true answer anymore it says 1279 then 1283 on peles Instagram, then says 31 or Cosmos then 37. Then 643 for santos then goes to 1091 like come on I’m surprised FIFA hasn’t stepped in and corrected it saying only official goals count not friendlies.
Best XI to never be nominated for the Ballon d’Or?
Ribery darglish jinky Johnston
Xavi Gerrard Iniesta
Carlos. Van dijk Maldini Cafu
Neuer
Bench Henry lewandowski Maradona pele
Edit: the no ballon D’or winners list.
@@skinnyp8829 They were nominated
@@skinnyp8829 no he said nominated not won
I’m a idiot 🤦♂️ still gonna leave it their because that team is juicy.
@@skinnyp8829 lmao
Also people forget he as a number 10 and is estimated to have a ridiculous number of assists
and so is messi your point?
@@Rajesh-ko8fo just pointing it out, some people think he only had goals in his repertoire
@@Imperador-Vi disnt have that much assists tgi
@@azizaamin7867 He has the most assists in World Cup history lmao
@@jeswinjames5986 Lol are you dumb? Messi has the most assists in world cup history with 6. Go search GOOGLE
THANK YOU FOR THIS VIDEO
It is really hard to explain this to the young Europeans fans, now I can just show this video! I think you can't compare Messi and Pelé, but I hate when people start to say Pelé scored most of his against amateurs or he isn't that good because he didn't played on Europe. Actually, at Pelé's time Brazilian football was far better than Europe's.
Loved the video!
VAMO NÁUTICO ⚪🔴⚪🔴
"Pele played in a farmers league"
This is BY FAR, the worst argument against Pele, simply because state-level tournaments in Brasil, throughout the 50s, 60s, and even late 80s were not weak, on the contrary, in fact, some of them (São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro, Minas Gerais and Rio Grande do Sul) were very strong. Even stronger than the national championship.
First of all, Brazilian football was much stronger then, since almost all Brazilian players would remain in the country. Imagine if Neymar, Coutinho, Marcelo, Firmino, Casemiro, Gabriel Jesus, Paulinho, Thiago Alcantara, Thiago Silva played domestic. The 1958 team? All of them played locally. 1962 team? 1970 team? 1950 second place team? Yeah, you got it.
And I'm not talking only about first class players in Spain, England, Germany or Italy. Imagine if the hundreds of brazilian players in Portugal, Ukraine, Japan, Turkey, Russia were playing in Brazil. That was the situation until late 80s.
It's also important to notice that Brazil is a huge continental country. There wasn't a national organized tournament until late 60's. State level tournaments were by far the most important events. It must be said that some of Brazilian states are as big as most of European Countries, but football is historically centered on a few of those states. São Paulo and Rio de Janeiro were the main ones, with Minas Gerais and Rio Grande do Sul on close second.
In the 1958 team there were 10 players from São Paulo (from 5 different teams), and 12 players from Rio (from 5 different teams). 1962 had 13 from 4 different teams from São Paulo. 1970 team had 11 players from Sâo Paulo (from 5 different teams);
If you take a list of teams with most National Champions from the 60's until now, first, second, fourth and fifth places are teams from São Paulo - Palmeiras, Santos, Corinthians and São Paulo FC. All of them, by the way, are also multiple Copa Libertadores Champions. Not to mention medium level teams with multiple second place and third place national honours like Portuguesa, Ponte Preta and Guarany (1978 national champion), that were also playing on São Paulo.
Teams from São Paulo have more National Trophies than teams from all the other states combined.
So, HOW, HOW, HOW can one say that the São Paulo State was not a very strong Tournament, with FOUR high level teams and a number of medium level teams?!?!?!
It was strong! Pele was playing against some of the best! Pele's team, Santos, was playing against some of the world's best players, and beating some of Brazil's best teams.
It´s foolish to compare those Brazilian state-level tournaments with German ones, for instance. They are not the same.
Nowadays, people forget this, cause the National Tournament is well established, but simply put. State-level Tournaments WERE the most important tournaments throughout the 50's till the 70's.
And you know what? THE SAME IS HAPPENING RIGHT NOW IN EUROPE.
Imagine this: São Paulo is roughly the size of the UK and has/had 4 high-level teams, Minas Gerais, with two high-level teams, is the size of Spain, Rio has/have 4 high-level teams, Rio Grande do Sul have/has 2, and so on.
Those states had very strong state-level championships.
One day, they decided to create a strong National Tournament and, little by little, those strong state tournaments begin to shrink. 40 years later, we are calling them "farmer's league"
Well, Spain has 2 (maybe 3) strong teams; England has 4, Germany has 2, Italy I don't know anymore, 2 or 3.
There are always plans for a Europe League, with all of them.
Imagine if little by little they begin to abandon the domestic league in favor of this new continental one.
40 years from now, there will be people saying that Messi or Ronaldo or Muller played in a farmer´s league.
Finally someone who knows what they’re talking about.
Pele rightfully deserves to be ranked as an all time great. Millennial's dismiss his greatness because his achievements were in the past but all agree Maradona deserves to be up there. Even though there were great players in between Pele and Marordona and it was only when Maradona showed up that people who witnessed both players even considered Maradona take Pele's crown as the best ever. A lot of guys still had Maradona as 1B to Pele's 1A. And after those two, in spite of exceptional players like Van Basten, Platini, Baggio, Romario, Zico, Socrates and so on, people who lived through the late 60's, 70's and 80's still had them as the consensus top two and it pretty much stayed that way right up until Messi and Ronaldo showed up.
So peles " friendly games " were more intense then the actual " official games " just let that sink in for a minute 🙄. In that case I'll definitely count friendly games!
The criteria they used now is different because UEFA and Fifa came up with this idea to declassify games. In Brazil and when Pele played in his era way back in the 1960's everything and every game was considered official. Pele really did score 1090 goals for Santos FC and he has a guinness world record 1284 goals in total. Pele also holds 2 other world records being the only 3 time world cup champion and youngest world champion in history at age 17.
@@rogerstephenroth8073 he is also holds a record for having the most hat-tricks, and much more
@@electrogem7142 It angers me when people want to diminish Pele and inflate other players ego when in reality no player in history has had a more impressive resume then Pele did. Pele is a 3 time world champion with Brazil, 2 time world champion with Santos making him a 5 time world champion overall. Pele is the only player in history to win 3 World Cups and he has 3 world records: Being the youngest world champion in history winning his first world title at age 17 in 1958 Sweden. Pele also holds a Guinness world record for most goals scored 1284 or 1283 not counting his special farewell goal. Pele also has a world record for 3 World Cups. Pele also was the most talented and highly skilled player in the history of the game being able to hit the ball from his head, juggle, perfect bicycle kicks, volley kicks, pass without looking. Pele speed reached 100 meters in 12 seconds in his time and he was able to jump as high as 6 feet in the air in maximum height. Pele wasn't just a player he was a super athlete literally and he is the most famous men's player in Brazil's history. Brazil is a 5 time world champion with their men's team because of his revolutionary genius and artistic talent. Pele wasn't just a player he was a artist and definition of greatness and perfection. Pele was a perfect player no question. Pele is the definition and text book definition of greatness in the 157 history of the sport since England invented the sport in 1860's. No other player has come close to Pele not in the 19th century, 20th century, 21st century. Pele was the most dominant and most complete player for both his country and clubs which he played for. He was a global superstar and phenomenon.
A lot of people want to know who the greatest player of all time in the men's game happens to be. In terms of dominance and world records and talent hands down Edson Arantes do Nacimento or Pele is the greatest player to play the game. Nobody and I mean nobody not even Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo, Mane Garrincha, Miroslav Klose, Diego Maradona, Zinedine Zidane, Ronaldinho Gaucho, Rivaldo, David Beckham, Bobby Charlton, Zico, Michel Platini, Paulo Rossi, Lothar Matheus, Roger Milla, Eusebio, Daniel Passarella, Fabio Cannavarro, Giovanni Ferrari, Ghigghia, Puskas, Modric, Zlatan Ibahimovic, Romario, Bebeto, Roberto Carlos, Just Fontaine, Alfredo Di Stefano, Xavi, Iniesta, Thomas Muller, Gert Muller, Johan Crufy, Gabriel Batistuta, Carlos Tevez, George Best, Michael Owen, Henry, Rogerio Ceni, Buffon, Neur, and I mean nobody and I mean nobody in this 157 year history of the sport has been as complete as Pele has been. Not since England invented the sport in the 1860's you can compare Pele to every single player from the 19th, 20th, 21st century and Pele stats and math with his world championships, scoring records, skills would come out as the validictorian of his class in all 3.
@@rogerstephenroth8073 so true, but winning arguments against idiots is almost impossible, which i can relate to u, but pele will always be remembered.
If Pele is a fraud for scoring against the opponents he faced in Brazilian league then I wonder what would people say about Messi and Ronaldo now. Everyone faces all type of opposition so this entire claim is bizzare
Exactly
PELE is the Best , Emperor of FOOTBALL ⚽ ⚽
@@bajirao2737 grow up kid, Messi and CR7 surpassed him years ago
The probelm is how football has evolved from some formations and less tactical awareness, now there's a hell of a lot more formations than before
@@achyutanandjha2964 get a life mate how many comment sections you appeared in
This is an incredible videos Alfie, appreciate all your hard work to research this and provide the context.
You know the video is just ass alfieri is just nostalgic for the old games were he wasn't even alive..if peles record were legit they had over 70 years to correct it but didn't say nothing until the record was broken...this shows they are clearly not credible
If they were deemed to be of no value 70 years ago, Pele wouldn’t of bothered playing them, did you watch the vid. Also FIFA retroactively deemed the games as unofficial, not when they were played.
Besides Pele and Santos have always claimed this goal tally, they didn't just bring it up now
5:45
In all honesty, during that time and up to the 90s, european clubs were much worse than southamerican ones. European football only started to become good when they were able to start buying more southamerican players for their teams, so playing in southamerican competition was way more difficult than playing against europeans.
i would't say they were much worse overall, it was probably pretty even. but the absolute best brazilian teams of the 60's (santos and botafogo), 70's (internacional and cruzeiro) and early 80's (flamengo and atletico mineiro) sure were better then any european ones.
great video once again. I totally agree that the obsession with stats is weird and stupid
End of the day Pele is GOAT he was doing all that on the ball 50 years before Messi so he is the real Genius , the fact it has taken 50 years for another player to be put in same breath as Pele speaks for it self...and Pele did it in era where defenders could tackle , not now as it is non contact sport , ball heavier then, and pitches bad.
I mean because he was ahead of his time doesn't mean he's the goat. I still think he's the goat but that's not the reason
@@kedda4515 but that is one of the reasons, he did things back in the 50s and 60s that players have not long ago started doing. Him Maradona and Di Stefano top 3
@@gmain1977 nah what does that even mean if someone in the future scores 1200 goals he won't be worse than Pele because he was after that's not how it works
It angers me when people want to diminish Pele and inflate other players ego when in reality no player in history has had a more impressive resume then Pele did. Pele is a 3 time world champion with Brazil, 2 time world champion with Santos making him a 5 time world champion overall. Pele is the only player in history to win 3 World Cups and he has 3 world records: Being the youngest world champion in history winning his first world title at age 17 in 1958 Sweden. Pele also holds a Guinness world record for most goals scored 1284 or 1283 not counting his special farewell goal. Pele also has a world record for 3 World Cups. Pele also was the most talented and highly skilled player in the history of the game being able to hit the ball from his head, juggle, perfect bicycle kicks, volley kicks, pass without looking. Pele speed reached 100 meters in 12 seconds in his time and he was able to jump as high as 6 feet in the air in maximum height. Pele wasn't just a player he was a super athlete literally and he is the most famous men's player in Brazil's history. Brazil is a 5 time world champion with their men's team because of his revolutionary genius and artistic talent. Pele wasn't just a player he was a artist and definition of greatness and perfection. Pele was a perfect player no question. Pele is the definition and text book definition of greatness in the 157 history of the sport since England invented the sport in 1860's. No other player has come close to Pele not in the 19th century, 20th century, 21st century. Pele was the most dominant and most complete player for both his country and clubs which he played for. He was a global superstar and phenomenon.
Bruh pele just isn’t that good. You watched him play? He’s vsing shit players in 99.9% of his goals
My team actually played 1-1 with Santos in 1969. Pele scored the equalizer in the 78th minute. Josip Bukal gave us the lead in the 45th minute. We used to be so fucking good and now we can't get past Maccabi Tel Aviv in the Europa League qualifiers... where did it go wrong?
Capitalism happened my friend.
#LeavePeleAlone
I always wonder why Santos dropped off in the mid 60’s just like that. It makes sense now. Basically if Santos concentrated on actual competition, they may have won more and Pele scored more official goals.
Modern day millennial fans are probably the most annoying fans. All they see is messi or Ronaldo. Coming second is a disaster. Load of BS. All people read is stats. It’s the overall play of a player that is more important.
This is a great video.
Not to mention Pele did not face weak opposition when he played against the European representative in the club world cup either and he still won both of them. He played against Eusebio's Benfica, Eusebio being possibly the greatest European striker or all time and Maldini's Milan that also had at the time Amarildo, who was Pele's backup at the 1962 WC and played most of the games at that cup as a starter due to Pele's injury, which only adds to his legend
Also Pele scored more in less games, I don't even like Messi and Ronaldo that much, I just pay attention to Mexican players since I support mexico
I'm technically a millennial as I was a teenager in the year 2000 but I wonder whether you mean fans who are younger..."Gen Z" I think they're called? Me and all my friends of the same age do think Messi & Ronaldo are obviously great but we do remember the older great players. To put into perspective Maradona retired from football when I was in high school so I've been lucky to see some great players and as a "Millennial" its not all about Ronnie and Leo for me.
I think it’s funny how english fans criticize Pele’s talent and goals when the only reason they have a World Cup is because people deliberately injured him in 1966
England should be grateful Pele was injured and not doing well or they would have not won the World Cup in 1966. So England was very lucky that Brazil had a bad world cup.
so much wrong with this statement
I don't think they are being fair to Pele because in his time the real records were over 1090 for Santos. Santos games were all considered official in his time. Fifa and UEFA and some assholes decided to change the criteria to discount goals which doesn't reflect the real truth of how many goals Pele actually scored. Pele holds 3 Guinness world records being for 1284 goals being almost double of Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo total goal scored and 3 World Cup championships and not to mention being the youngest world champion at age 17. Pele is a 5 time world champion being 2 time world club champion with Santos 1962-1963 and 3 time world champion with Brazil.
So glad you called out the foolishness of stat culture. It’s almost like people don’t watch football anymore or enjoy it. They just care about numbers and it’s awful. If numbers mattered most people probably wouldn’t realize how important zaha is to palace cuz he doesn’t score enough. Something that simple gets lots to foolishness
I remember looking up ronaldinhos goal numbers and being shocked at how low they actually were, I always envisioned him as a 30 goal a season striker
Ronaldinho was more of a winger/Number 10 rather than a striker
The no10 role players used to play wasn’t quite a forward and wasn’t quite a midfielder. So it’s hard to compare goal machines of today with Ronnie. Their core functions were different. You’d rather compare him to someone like KDB to get a better idea.
Like 15 or 20 years ago, FIFA officially recognized, after some lengthy disputes over the matter, that the greatest goal-scorers in history was the trio of Pele, Czech Josef "Pepi" Bican and German Uwe Seeler, stating that no-one will likely ever really know how many goals exactly each of these super-shooters have netted in all official and semi-official matches. Each one of them had SOMETHING over 1000 goals.
By then, the debate got settled like so. At least for the time being.
They didn't expect someone like Ronaldo or Messi bagging in like an average of like 40/50goals per year.
@@THEchrisse95 Yeah, precisely!! Most likely they did not, because at the turn of the millennia the average number of goals scored per game in the whole world of football was steadily decreasing.
He tore the best of the world apart. That much couldn't come under dispute.
What makes you think prime Santos would beat Macclesfield Town?
The fact they beat All the other best teams in the world at that time
@@Imperador-Vi What makes you think that Macclesfield town wasn't The best team in the world at that time.
Vittorio Bongioanni stop replying to every comment and take a joke you fanboy bellend
@@oscarhaines3541 I have fun seeing ignorant people ignore the history of the beautiful sport, besides jokes are supposed to be funny, typical British Saltiness honestly
@@bryan8191 Fair enough
Excerpt from FIFAs website
From the article “Pele: The greatest of them all”
“In the course of his long and unique career, he scored more than 1,200 goals, a record likely to stand for all time, and which includes more than 1,000 goals for Santos, Pele’s club from 1956 to 1974. He also added 72 goals in 92 appearances for A Seleção.”
If you claim that Pele is the best player ever, but you have not watched atleast 10 full 90 minute games of him playing, then I'm sorry to tell you but you are a sheep. You do not posses the capability to make decisions of your own, so you have delegated your thought process to other people. You have been TOLD that he is the greatest and you have accepted that as a fact simply because the oppinion of society has more waight thaqn the limited capabilities of your brain to forge independent decisions.
@@GeneralGreevas One could make the exact same thing about Lionel Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo. If you have not seen Pele play 10 full 90 minutes, you can not call either of these two "the best ever".
@@GeneralGreevas One day halaand and mbappe fanboys will make fun of ur idols and u will see
The top score of all time is me when I play with my younger sibling friends and my goals can still increase because I have a new younger brother
If you ever need another brother call me 🤙 😉
@@filipmilicevic4264 fine but don't be hurt if your girlfriend has my child, no no i'm just kidding
Day 15 : What On Earth Is Going On At Bradford City
I am from bradford
The club isn't very big and there are definitely clubs in Europe's first division that are more deserving of a video than a 3rd division English side
@@SuperMyslayer Bradford is one of the larger cities in England and Bradford City is one of the clubs that has been part of the pro-league system in English football for so many years that it definetly deserves a video
They definitely deserve a video in my opinion hopefully alfie will see this at some point and agree are far to big of a club to be in the league and position they are in atm
why was pele chillin with sylvester stallone at 2:30
They were shooting a movie. It's called Victory.
I just dislike the ignorant myth that offside didn't exist perpetrated by fans and sadly players like Zlatan. All this to discredit Pele's (and by extension players from yesteryear) accomplishments.
I scored 1000 offside goals in my school football pitch, all I had to do was just lurk around in the opposition half and wait for a ball over the top...of you think it shouldn't be considered you are deluded
@@bungeespeaks6081 The rules back then were actually even harder you had to stay behind three defenders in Pele’s era now it’s just the last man
@HITC, your storytelling is top notch.
Santos Played against Milan not Inter Milan in 1963 6:04.
Another very good video on a contentious subject. Nice one
What a great video really puts this argument in the mud
Gerd Muller has more goals than Pele
A lot of people want to know who the greatest player of all time in the men's game happens to be. In terms of dominance and world records and talent hands down Edson Arantes do Nacimento or Pele is the greatest player to play the game. Nobody and I mean nobody not even Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo, Mane Garrincha, Miroslav Klose, Diego Maradona, Zinedine Zidane, Ronaldinho Gaucho, Rivaldo, David Beckham, Bobby Charlton, Zico, Michel Platini, Paulo Rossi, Lothar Matheus, Roger Milla, Eusebio, Daniel Passarella, Fabio Cannavarro, Giovanni Ferrari, Ghigghia, Puskas, Modric, Zlatan Ibahimovic, Romario, Bebeto, Roberto Carlos, Just Fontaine, Alfredo Di Stefano, Xavi, Iniesta, Thomas Muller, Gert Muller, Johan Crufy, Gabriel Batistuta, Carlos Tevez, George Best, Michael Owen, Henry, Rogerio Ceni, Buffon, Neur, and I mean nobody and I mean nobody in this 157 year history of the sport has been as complete as Pele has been. Not since England invented the sport in the 1860's you can compare Pele to every single player from the 19th, 20th, 21st century and Pele stats and math with his world championships, scoring records, skills would come out as the validictorian of his class in all 3.
As a brazilian, I really apreciate this video and your non-european content overall. it gets really tiresome to read people argue that pele only played against farmers and, in the same comment, trying to diminish his exploits in the world cups he won by saying our national teams, composed by players against whom he constantly played, were too good.
I don't think they are being fair to Pele because in his time the real records were over 1090 for Santos. Santos games were all considered official in his time. Fifa and UEFA and some assholes decided to change the criteria to discount goals which doesn't reflect the real truth of how many goals Pele actually scored. Pele holds 3 Guinness world records being for 1284 goals being almost double of Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo total goal scored and 3 World Cup championships and not to mention being the youngest world champion at age 17. Pele is a 5 time world champion being 2 time world club champion with Santos 1962-1963 and 3 time world champion with Brazil.
I am from England but Brazilian fan, England and Europe are just ignorant due to jealousy , part of it is due to racism as well, England had big issue with black players playing in England , they say he played In farmers league but Brazil won 3 world cups out of 4. Britain always been ignorant
@@gmain1977 Well no it is not that, it is they made up a new criteria which discounts Pele's real goal total. Back in Pele's time all the games he played were considered official. When later UEFA and teams from Europe they used a different criteria which would discount goals from what they considered unofficial games. Hence the unofficial-official criteria came into play. Pele's real goal scoring record is a Guinness world record of 1284 goals. He actually scored 1090 for Santos FC in his whole career which is far more then what Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo scored for both club and country, and this is considering it is not even his total number of goals. Pele also won many titles with Brazil, Santos, New York Cosmos before he retired 50 years ago way back in the 1970's.
@@gmain1977 I usually think that english people are upset they they aren't the best at any of the games they invented. I might be wrong, but that's the vibe I get from following british sports media sometimes.
This is BY FAR, the worst argument against Pele, simply because state-level tournaments in Brasil, throughout the 50s, 60s, and even late 80s were not weak, on the contrary, in fact, some of them (São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro, Minas Gerais and Rio Grande do Sul) were very strong. Even stronger than the national championship.
First of all, Brazilian football was much stronger then, since almost all Brazilian players would remain in the country. Imagine if Neymar, Coutinho, Marcelo, Firmino, Casemiro, Gabriel Jesus, Paulinho, Thiago Alcantara, Thiago Silva played domestic. The 1958 team? All of them played locally. 1962 team? 1970 team? 1950 second place team? Yeah, you got it.
And I'm not talking only about first class players in Spain, England, Germany or Italy. Imagine if the hundreds of brazilian players in Portugal, Ukraine, Japan, Turkey, Russia were playing in Brazil. That was the situation until late 80s.
It's also important to notice that Brazil is a huge continental country. There wasn't a national organized tournament until late 60's. State level tournaments were by far the most important events. It must be said that some of Brazilian states are as big as most of European Countries, but football is historically centered on a few of those states. São Paulo and Rio de Janeiro were the main ones, with Minas Gerais and Rio Grande do Sul on close second.
In the 1958 team there were 10 players from São Paulo (from 5 different teams), and 12 players from Rio (from 5 different teams). 1962 had 13 from 4 different teams from São Paulo. 1970 team had 11 players from Sâo Paulo (from 5 different teams);
If you take a list of teams with most National Champions from the 60's until now, first, second, fourth and fifth places are teams from São Paulo - Palmeiras, Santos, Corinthians and São Paulo FC. All of them, by the way, are also multiple Copa Libertadores Champions. Not to mention medium level teams with multiple second place and third place national honours like Portuguesa, Ponte Preta and Guarany (1978 national champion), that were also playing on São Paulo.
Teams from São Paulo have more National Trophies than teams from all the other states combined.
So, HOW, HOW, HOW can one say that the São Paulo State was not a very strong Tournament, with FOUR high level teams and a number of medium level teams?!?!?!
It was strong! Pele was playing against some of the best! Pele's team, Santos, was playing against some of the world's best players, and beating some of Brazil's best teams.
It´s foolish to compare those Brazilian state-level tournaments with German ones, for instance. They are not the same.
Nowadays, people forget this, cause the National Tournament is well established, but simply put. State-level Tournaments WERE the most important tournaments throughout the 50's till the 70's.
And you know what? THE SAME IS HAPPENING RIGHT NOW IN EUROPE.
Imagine this: São Paulo is roughly the size of the UK and has/had 4 high-level teams, Minas Gerais, with two high-level teams, is the size of Spain, Rio has/have 4 high-level teams, Rio Grande do Sul have/has 2, and so on.
Those states had very strong state-level championships.
One day, they decided to create a strong National Tournament and, little by little, those strong state tournaments begin to shrink. 40 years later, we are calling them "farmer's league"
Well, Spain has 2 (maybe 3) strong teams; England has 4, Germany has 2, Italy I don't know anymore, 2 or 3.
There are always plans for a Europe League, with all of them.
Imagine if little by little they begin to abandon the domestic league in favor of this new continental one.
40 years from now, there will be people saying that Messi or Ronaldo or Muller played in a farmer´s league.
It doesn’t matter if pele didn’t score as many goals as everyone thought he did, it doesn’t change the quality of the player. Yes, many of his goals came from friendly’s but with an incredible goal count of 1,282, you couldn’t equal that number
I bet you I have scored over 2000 goals in my college soccer team..I should be the best player in history, same logic
@@bungeespeaks6081 Ir's not unless your college team played the best teams in Europe
Pele holds the official Guinness world record for most goals scored 1284 goals he also holds other world records such as youngest world champion in a World Cup at age 17 and the only player in history with 3 World Cups. Those are world records no player has been able to beat so far and this includes the other so called goat candidates in the game who fans wanted to dispute and claim as better then Pele. Pele is the real goat and most complete player who ever played the game. Pele's revolutionary genius and art form is a big reason Brazil eventually became a super power in soccer-football and a 5 time world champion.
The greatness of players shouldn’t be based off of numbers it should based off of what they brought to this game and how they played
1, 200 goals pele scored. He was that good. Unbelievable but its true!
I just love your videos
Pele was a fantastic player. It's not his goals that make him one of the best. It's the longevity, the beautiful way he scored and more. People get way too bent on his goals because they are actually less than they say they are
Just a small detail, Pelé wasn't "used to score 5 or 6 times agains't são Paulo league" Pelé only scored more than 5 goals in a match once during his whole career and 5 goals only 7 times.
if we count friendlies Gerd Müller had more goals than Pele
No he doesnt :)
Pele had about 1200 goals in total
No one did that many other them him
@@vitorqueiroz8791 Pele has 1284 if you count friendlies, Gerd Müller has 1461 if you count friendlies.
Source: www.rsssf.com/players/prolific.html#gmueller
everything documented, + Bayern's official site also used these numbers before.
@@vitorqueiroz8791 Also if we count everything, then possibly Bican also had more goals since he might had around 1500 goals with every match included.
source: www.rsssf.com/players/prolific.html#bican
@@vitorqueiroz8791 HAHAH you got destroyed lmao.
Pele was unstoppable in more ways than one. I'd love an in depth explanation why he didn't play in Europe from him but its probably no more complex that he was born a one-club man like messi, del piero, totti or giggs and scholes. Pele was so impossibly polite that he'd have felt bad displacing x player at the new club he would've signed for that he'd rather not start that ball even rolling-no reason to leave Santos he was needed there and welcome..
This is such a good video.
It seems like ppl now just ignore that football exists for decades... i already can imagine the discussion on 2060: ppl saying "Messi and C.Ronaldo weren't that good because they scored on the spanish league, and as you know, the 2060's best league is the chinese, of course, so the rest of history is just garbage"... Ppl just ignore the context and make non sense comparisons. In reading comments saying that Pele is overrated... for god sake... These guys dont love football, they love numbers, but only the numbers that are convenient for them. Thats sad.
Very true
Could you do a video on why there is a much smaller culture of away fans traveling to games in Spain compared to other leagues in Europe and if this happens in any other countries
best video you've ever made, on point.
I am not buying into that bullshit from the media, when Messi or Cristiano Ronaldo break Pele's real records then i will be impressed. This record only counted because they discounted 447 goals from Pele.
If you claim that Pele is the best player ever, but you have not watched atleast 10 full 90 minute games of him playing, then I'm sorry to tell you but you are a sheep. You do not posses the capability to make decisions of your own, so you have delegated your thought process to other people. You have been TOLD that he is the greatest and you have accepted that as a fact simply because the oppinion of society has more waight thaqn the limited capabilities of your brain to forge independent decisions.
@@GeneralGreevas My overall claim is fact not opinion and there is no question of a doubt Pele is the real goat and the greatest player in the history of the game. Nobody has won more world titles in Fifa World Cups then Pele with 3 World Cups and 2 World Club championships with Santos FC making him a 5 time world champion all around. Youngest world champion ever at the age of 17 in the 1958 Fifa World Cup in the world championship in Sweden. Most goals in the history of the men's game with a Guinness world record of 1284 goals in total. Pele holds 3 Guinness world records being the only 3 time world cup champion, youngest world champion at age 17 and most goals officially. All this has been certified as Guinness world records.
Nobody which I have seen is anywhere near what Pele was. Brazil became a super power in soccer-football because of Pele's revolutionary genius and art to the game. As they say the English invented the game while the Brazilians perfected it "bringing it as a art form with the "jogo bonito" or beautiful game. Pele was the most dominant athlete in his sport which is comparable to other legends from other sports. Pele reputation was so great as a champion he was voted athlete of the 20th century beating the likes of Mark Spitz, Michael Jordan, Carl Lewis, Michael Schumacher, Michael Phelps, Muhammed Ali, you name it. Pele wasn't just a player in the game, the man is the most famous man in Brazil and a icon and legend. Diego Maradona of Argentina heavily was jealous of Pele's genius and thus was subject to the world's biggest rivalry between Brazil and Argentina. It makes a lot of sense though the greatest player in history would be from Brazil, given Brazil has produced the most world champions in the sports history. No other country in the world even among the elite national teams like Germany, Italy respectively 4 time world champions, Uruguay, Argentina, France 2 time world champions and Spain and England world champions respectively in the club of elite 8 world champion nations in the men's team has produced a finer player then Pele.
Pele genius was not only reflected by his dominance and art form in the game but his technical abilities as well as he was able to dribble, do perfect bicycle kicks, pass without looking, hit the ball in mid air and score from every angle. Pele was the equivalent of a soccer-football harlem globe trotter player. Pele actually had referee's wanted to hug him because he scored such beautiful goals. Pele when he was booted out by a referee in Colombia, the fans booted the ref and brought back Pele. When Pele and his team Santos visited a team in Africa, they actually stopped a war to see them play. Pele actually managed to take a position as goalie. Pele has won titles competing in every sector of the globe including the Brazilian military team.
Peles goal was friendlies against military recruits etc..bang average player who was lucky to play with coal miners and electricians...with mo tactics
@@bungeespeaks6081 No they were actual goals, they changed the criteria with a bullshit unofficial and official games criteria many years later, but in Pele's time all the games he played were official games. Pele scored over 1,000 goals with Santos adding 1091 in total way more then Messi 644 goals. That is one of Pele's real records along with 95 for Brazil's men's national team according to CBF records in Brazil and Guinness world record 1284 goals.
@@bungeespeaks6081 Well Guinness book of world records lists him officially as the biggest goal scorer in history with 1284 goals which is an official world record. When Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo break Pele's real world record in the Guinness book of records then that would be highly impressive.
Exceptional video as always
Ok change in rule count Pele's goals in friendlies and not official matches. Jkjk I never doubted Pele's ability as the goat 🐐🔥
The obsession with statistics comes from American culture. If you watch any American sports games on tv- baseball, American football, basketball, hockey, the MLS, etc and they are FILLED with statistics, some even downright silly.
That’s fax coming from an American the first we do is to pull out stats in a debate instead of looking at what actually happened
I wish I could print out this video's script and paste it all over Football Daily's offices walls
Cool video and great to have this context on the friendlies Santos played. I don’t think it makes a real difference to the stats, though - the only fair and just way to tally these things is to count only official games. There’s simply no way of assessing the mindsets of the European teams (or Santos themselves) during the friendlies and say, with any serious authority, that they were ‘trying just as hard or harder, and taking things just as seriously, as they would a la Liga or European Cup game - it’s Santos, yo!’. That doesn’t cut it at all. I doubt that all the hundreds of players involved in those games in which Pele scored cared ‘more’ or as much as they did about the games that would put their own clubs’ names on trophies, or their own names in the record books. Maybe some did. Maybe - maybe - most did. Not all though, and this, and the fact that the levels of care or effort simply can never be quantified, is exactly why it’s only fair that sanctioned, professional, official games count towards records. I’m sure there are at least some players/teams who tried their best against Messi or Gerd Muller in friendlies over the years, but how can you tell? Which goals from Messi’s or Muller’s friendlies get added to theiir totals? The easy (and sensible) answer is: none.
In the end it’s the fault of Santos for prioritising glamourball over football: they put Pele in a position where he played much of his career in what effectively were likely (but not always, not to a man) high-quality exhibitions. If Pele *had* played more ‘proper’ games with Santos, he’d surely have scored more official goals (how many, though, no one can say - maybe far fewer than his friendly goals total, maybe more) and no one, including Messi, would be arguing against Santos. Nor, I imagine, would Barcelona or Bayern Munich be scouring the record books for goals scored in friendlies by Messi/Muller to ‘add’ to their totals, so as to outdo the great Pele.
Santos made their money during their circus years, and I’m sure they thrilled many fans who loved that they go to see the great Brazilian side. But to now hark back to those wacky times in the 60s and use these games of dubious, unquantifiable quality or worth (in a sporting sense) to do down the verifiable achievements of Messi or Cristiano Ronaldo, or even of Pele’s contemporaries like Muller or, say, Jimmy Greaves, is lame. Pele is obviously one of the greats, and clearly deserves to be in any serious debate about *the* all-time greatest. Santos are being vicariously greedy, though, when it comes to the goals thing.
TBF even in official competitions santos and Pele would beat European teams, and as for the players state of mind imagine if you had the chance to play against the best team in the world, anybody would take it seriously.
It’s fair to say officially Messi has more goals, but all 1000+ goals Pele scored are valid
@@Imperador-Vi See, that’s the problem, though: you can’t just assume the ability to assess the psychology of hundreds of guys playing football 50-odd years ago. Many players surely did want to beat Santos with all their hearts - did they all? Did they all take it 100% seriously? Citing the bad tackles on Pele doesn’t mean much, as I can see why European players (shitheaded ones, anyway!) would want to do in the great Pele, especially if he comes over in a circus-like fashion as part of the greatest team of earth. But that doesn’t mean everyone’s giving their all. Maybe they did but you can’t know, and that (among other things) makes it right and fair to judge players by metrics where there are at least some verifiable and agreeable and common parameters.
People on here are saying Gerd Muller’s friendly goals don’t count (despite him have similar or better scoring-rates if they’re included than Pele) cos... it’s not Santos? There’s a lot of myth-making going on here. What if the keepers playing against uber-striker Muller considers it the greatest feat of his life to keep out the great German, and but still concedes three goals to him? They don’t count cos they’re not scored by Santos/Pele, I guess.
Which makes me wonder, too - does this mean all the Santos players from those years get their friendly goals added to their totals, or just Pele? Do the players from AC Milan or Lyon or wherever who score against Santos get to add *those* goals to their official totals, but goals scored by a AC Milan players in friendlies against, say, powerhouses Real Madrid or Bayern Munich *don’t* include cos.... again, only Santos/teams with special-status Pele in them include in this one-off, made-for-Pele category.
None of what I’m saying is an attempt to undermine Pele, who’s clearly an all-time great, a player of supreme ability and with a unique place in the larger story of football. This whole goal-grubbing, special-pleading stuff is beneath him, I think.
@@trevorbyrne4668 football is not the same as it used to be, I think the fact that in Official competitions Santos still beat European teams is evidence enough that other teams respected Santos, and it’s not fair that Pele scored so many valid goals for them to be ignored.
Even if they don’t technically were official they can’t be treated as easy goals on friendliest and if he was hunted on the field by the other teams that only makes his life harder
@@Imperador-Vi still they are friendlies. Doesnt matter how much compettive they are. No disrespect to Pele tho. 756 is still a very good tally.
@@Imperador-Vi santos wont even beat today's championships team lol
Crazy how pelé scoring against real madrid = scoring against his nephews and messi scoring against granada = goat status goals
Messi Ronaldo fanboys in a nutshell.
No issues, take away goals and assists....Messi is still an absolute delight to watch aesthetically...the same cannot be said about Pelé and cr7...although Pelé did play in a different era..
@@vb2388 Absolute nonsense...
@@luizmatte4345 he’s right...
@@vb2388 What nonsense. Messi has great skills and he's good to watch, but this is about who is the best. I am more pleased by watching KDB than Messi, doesn't mean he's the better player.
I used to dislike this channel but I really appreciated when they showed respect towards pele
Short answer: 643
Long answer: 643
actual answer: both
@@Imperador-Vi Yes, but for this record friendlies don't count regardless of the opposition
@@snfcbmf12799 Sure, but it is still unfair to act like he never scored the goals in the first place
@@berkayyilmaz2928 not if the friendliest were only against the strongest in the word and the sacrificed playing weaker teams to do it
@@Imperador-Vi if cr7 or messi played 50 friendlies a year. They probably would have more goals than pele
In Pele's era Santos FC in the 1960's was the best club team in the world and they were South American and world club champions in the intercontinental championships. But I have no doubt that Pele's real record for club team is way more then 644 as it hits at 1090.
If you claim that Pele is the best player ever, but you have not watched atleast 10 full 90 minute games of him playing, then I'm sorry to tell you but you are a sheep. You do not posses the capability to make decisions of your own, so you have delegated your thought process to other people. You have been TOLD that he is the greatest and you have accepted that as a fact simply because the oppinion of society has more waight thaqn the limited capabilities of your brain to forge independent decisions.
@@GeneralGreevas do you wanna see and hear from the greatest of the greatest players in football history who saw Pelé play and did also play against him and at the very same time said Pelé was the best ever player in the history of football? tell me if you want a prove of those legendary players saying Pelé was the best ever player, i have the link to that video on this same very social media called youtube so it wouldn't cost you anything or take longer to realise how mistake you are
@@daniel_mensa I am not really convinced we will see someone better then Pele for a long time. I don't see anyone winning 3 World Cups and scoring 1300 goals as well maintaining a high level for both their national teams and club team. The problem with Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo is they are world class club players and underachievers with Argentina and Portugal which is why I can't consider them being compared to the greatest champion in the history of the sport Pele. Pele resume shows he has the most world titles, most goals, most skilled and most technical abilities which have yet to be matched by anyone in the 157 year history of the game. Pele is the valedictorian of the game in the 19th, 20th, 21st century.
@@GeneralGreevas If you do the math and stats based on scoring abilities, world titles, technical abilities Pele was a perfect player all around as a striker-forward. Pele was a superstar athlete or a true super athlete. Pele is the reason Brazil really did gain 5 world championships with their men team and he influenced other legends like Mane Garrincha, Romario, Zico, Ronaldo Nazario da Lima, Ronaldinho Gaucho, Rivaldo, Kaka, Neymar, Bebeto, Carlos Alberto Torres.
One thing has to be clarified: the Campeonato Paulista in the 1960s was by no means a “Weak League” or just a “regional championship”.
Yes, it is a state league in Brazil, but its the state league of a 45+ million inhabitants state (larger than Spain) in which, nowadays, more than 30 Brazilian national championships since 1959 have been won by the teams from the São Paulo State.
It may be hard for europeans to understand, but Brazil is a continent-sized country and, in the fifties and sixties, there was no sufficient infrastructure to organize a national championship of 20 teams. So, in that time, the winners of the state leagues faced each other in a much shorter playoff-like national championship, in which Santos only played 4 or 5 games to win.
Pelé’s goals in the Campeonato Paulista cannot be underestimated, because that was arguably the best league in the world by that time, just read about it and the quality of the opposition he faced every week.
MIL GOLS, SÓ PELÉ.
MARADONA CHEIRADOR.
Só dei o like pelo Maradona cheirador kkkkk
I kinda agree with Santos but also I fully agree with the video. It doesn't matter.
Can you do a video about fc viitorul, the team Hagi created and led to a title in 16/17?
If I'm not mistaken, Rivaldo's son plays for them?
Who would win a matchup between the best of Newell’s Old Boys vs the best of Santos?
Maradona and Messi vs Pele and Neymar
if you put a eleven together, not just the 2 best, it's not even close
We also need to acknowledge that Pelé played in poor conditions compared to today’s game since boots, balls and etc made football much harder to play and he still dominated the world with those conditions, making his accomplishments even more impressive
This video was very useful
Imo Pele and Santos have a point. The award messi needs to be renamed because it’s inaccurate
Pele acknowledged that Messi had beaten his record. Santos were the ones to complain.
Officially it is correct...Santos never should’ve toured...regardless of how fierce the friendly competitions were..
@@vb2388 they should've. if only because they made a lot of money, and because they wound up shutting up dumb youtube commentators 60 years later that attempt to descredit pele saying he played against farmers (not saying you are one of those, i'm just venting at this point lol).
@@bernardovivas8436 Brazilian league was the best league in the World during the 60s...Santos never should’ve left Brazil to face weaker oppositions in friendlies imo..
Yes, they did it for money and now its costing Pelé’s Legacy..
Pelé’s goal tally stands at 643....I don’t think FIFA is going to change that..
@@vb2388 the thing is, brazil didn't really have a league back then. it was a knock out tournament during which santos played from 4 to 10 games a season. the bulk of the calendar was occupied by the regional championship, which was hugely important, don't get me wrong, but i think santos kind of outgrew that in the mid 1960's.
Kids & English pundits still won't understand this explanation..
But could either of them have done it on a cold, wet, Tuesday night at Stoke?
Pele and Santos did it on a cold, wet night at Stoke in 1969. They won 3-2, Pele scored twice.
😂😂😂😂I love the fact that they actually did and he scored
@@HITCSevens did Shawcross get the Stoke goals both from corners?
While I was obviously being sarcastic, this proves Pele > Messi
@Get Behind Me Satan 😂😂🤣🤣
Good well made video 👍
Pele scored more goals in less games than Messi
Most of the people he played agains had day jobs
@@GeneralGreevas didn't Messi play against the Iceland keeper in the 2018 worldcup when it was said that the keeper who SAVED Messi's penalty was a film maker and a camera man, haha now tell me who played with players that had a job beside football🤣
@@daniel_mensa that was just like 1 game, pele did it every fuckin week
@@bungeespeaks6081 haha one game? lol as if Messi hasn't been playing in his whole career against some 8th division pub teams in that average league called la liga🤣
@@daniel_mensa like eibar and Cadiz 🤣🤣🤣
Pele real record is actually 1090 with Santos FC and he has a Guinness world record 1284 goals career wise. So if they take the real records not the bullshit discounted records using the unofficial-official game discrimination criteria we have Pele's real goals. UEFA and those assholes in Europe invented this shit to discount goals in the era where in Pele's time the goals he scored and the games were considered official. They changed the criteria some years later to discount the total amount of goals unfairly which I think is a load of bullshit. So the reality is Messi isn't anywhere near Pele and neither is Cristiano Ronaldo. Pele could give 2 World Cups to both Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo and still have one for himself. Nobody is better then Pele, not even Diego Maradona, Garrincha, Zidane, Ronaldo Nazario da Lima, David Beckham, Franz Beckenbauer, Romario, Rivaldo, Ronaldinho Gaucho, Zico, Michel Platini, Johan Cruyf, Bobby Charlton, Michael Owen, Paulo Rossi, Giovanni Ferrari, Ghiggia, Puskas, Eusebio, Gert Muller, Miroslav Klose, Just Fontaine, Modric, Xavi, Iniesta, Kaka, Mohammed Salah, Daniel Passarella, Gabriel Batistuta, Roger Milla, Lothar Matheus, Michael Ballack, Iniesta, Fabio Cannavarro, Thomas Mueller, Oliver Kahn, Rogerio Ceni, Carlos Alberto Torres, Dunga, Roberto Carlos, Fabien Barthez, Taffarel, Neymar, Luiz Suarez, Zlatan Ibravimovic.
Does he include Graziano Pelle’s goals too?
Yeah, he takes those two goals into consideration as well...
Hahaha didn’t see that one on twitter 😒
Hilarious, now watch the video
But Messi scoring 644 goals is far more impressive than Pele's 1000 something goals
It's because the competition and the quality of players have improved so so much that a team today battling in relegation could realistically win a league back then...
Well there are many many great players back then in his time like Cruyff, Backenbaur, Maldini, Tresor, Fachetti, Best, Moore, Charlton, Law and many other greats.
That’s completely wrong back then offside rule has much more rules, poor condition pitch, no red cards or yellow cards which mean someone can break u leg yet he will still play the game, leather balls and leather shoes, no fitness diets, no advanced training methods, no technology to do surgeries, or to train with.
The thing is why is FC Santos bringing up Pele's record when someone like Lionel Messi has broken it? What if someone never broke the record, would they have brought up Pele's 1000 goals?
Yeah there insecurity is what makes so many ppl hate pele, despite them being right, it still ain’t official
No that is not true, Santos and fans have always believed that Pele scored 1000 goals, the fans even have a chant, but now the club is disputing the claim Messi has more goals
The football world talk about Pele's 1000 goals since 1969. Wake up kid
@@XmattoX the thing is that not all of them are official, sorry kid.
@@itswalker9 Who is saying they are? Are you really that dumb?
Attempt 2: Do a video on the biggest wins of 2020 (Ajax’s 13-0, Dundalk’s 11-0 etc)
I’m really interested in big results and this would be perfect!!
Sad that Santos isn't just letting it go, even Pele congratulated Leo
It's not about letting it go.
More like a resistance and rebel against the revisionism of football history to favour the current era.
Why would a club not fight for its honor?
Would Barca not have done the same thing?
Sad that you don't try to learn and understand history
Number of goals is just an aspect. More important is he played in the era 1960s when South America dominated the whole world in National as well as Clubs.
Brazil won 3 WorldCups, and Brazilian/Arg/÷Urugoay won most of WorldCup for clubs.
I think purple in Europe seem to forget that the Brazilian league was the best in the world up until even the 90s, so there was no real reason for players to need to test themselves outside of Brazil. Think of Garrincha Socrates Zico who never spent significant time out of Brazil and are some of the greatest players ever
So basically..................Pele is still king.
If you claim that Pele is the best player ever, but you have not watched atleast 10 full 90 minute games of him playing, then I'm sorry to tell you but you are a sheep. You do not posses the capability to make decisions of your own, so you have delegated your thought process to other people. You have been TOLD that he is the greatest and you have accepted that as a fact simply because the oppinion of society has more waight thaqn the limited capabilities of your brain to forge independent decisions.
@@GeneralGreevas Did you even watch the video or are you just air conditioning your mouth?
Last time I was this early arsenal were invincible
Brendan rodgers’ 7 best signings/ worst signings
Man Utd withdrew from the FA cup to play a ‘friendly’ world club championship a few years back...
Saint Lucia was the only FIFA country not to participate in the FIFA WCQ, can you please please make a video; What is going on in Saint Lucia Football? The local media is not giving this story the attention it deserves.
Day one of asking for every premier league manager to be ranked based on their transfer business.
But a lot of PL clubs have technical directors so managers are not fully responsible for transfer business. Arsenal has Edu, Everton has Marcel Brands, City has Begiristain etc.
9:37 damn that pic is HEAVY with trophies. Dani alves, Messi, Pele, Neymar and R9. 5 World cups.
There r 3 levels of lying. The normal liars, the damn liars and statistics.
Ngl people who don’t believe in the science of statistics come off as some of the dumbest people on earth
@@scoobyskreep3518 but the people who rely on statistics only miss the point constantly, read the book “naked statistics” so many examples of misleading statistics, you can’t turn the world into numbers only
@@Imperador-Vi lol I know that book, I’m a stats major
Bruh, stats are killing a lot of sports in ways. Baseball is suffering from it due to analytics.