Yeah, learning Hwoarang made me stop bitching about "brain dead" or "broken" characters. Started as a Kazuya main only for the challenge and had an intense hate for Hwoarang. I finally decided to learn him for myself and to my surprise, he was harder for me to pilot than Kazuya, which made me respect him way more. He's now my second main/favorite character and I tip my hat when people whoop my ass with him because he is NOT easy to control.
Very different skill sets involved. Kazuya’s difficulty comes from how limited his tool set is. He doesn’t have that many good buttons, but that also means your decision making is pretty simplified. Small tool bag = easy choices. You don’t have to think that much about when to use what. Characters like Hwo, Raven, Xiaoyu are the opposite. They have massive interconnected move sets. They have more options. This means it’s easier to overwhelm your opponent or wriggle your way out of situations with character specific bullshit, but it also means you have to figure out how and where to use all that extra stuff. You have way more choices to make, and because they’re stance based, you also have to make them very quickly. I felt like I was comfortable on Kazuya after a week or two. Took me a month before I had any semblance of a gameplan on Xiaoyu. So yeah, I agree, Hwo can’t be easy.
Is there any character that's easy to deal with in this game ? No matter who your opponent is, if you don't know the match-up you're cooked. Welcome to tekken 8
Hwo is a scrub character. Most of them have low defense number about 40-50 and they don't need to block because they can keep doing flowchart patterns.
But most hwo players have low defense number because they don't need to block. They keep doing flowchart + frame and that's why they have never learned how to block.
@@jkdman2007 more of a tekken 8 problem imo since there are more characters like that too Not here to argue coz i think maybe they should fix these problems
Hwo hate is indeed a litmus test. All top players unanimously agree he’s mid tier, and all the scrubs unanimously agree that they are in fact scrubs and can’t be bothered to git gud
Yeah this is bullshit and not about tiers, you hwoarang monkeys will never understand because you are in denial about how scrubby hwoarangs playstyle is even at high level. This isn't about tiers, its the design of a character built around flowcharting out of a low-high string.
@@Blackfist030depends on how good his sidestep would be if they added him. TTT2 Baek could death combo off of a good flamingo sidestep, and his flamingo sidestep was outrageously large and fast
Hwoarang exposes how bad people’s defense is. It’s embarrassing to run into people who have worse defense than a hwoarang player and then they go complain that hwo is carried?
@@Arcryoto the opposite is also true. At lower-mid levels Hwoarang players do often go farther than their fundamentals would otherwise allow because he is a "lab" character who you won't be able to defend against until you dedicate time. So in that sense they are often "carried" (even though I hate that term/rationale). He isn't overpowered or anything close to it. But he DOES take people further than their base skills would otherwise allow. This doesn't only apply to him but it does apply. Personally I don't think "carried" matters. We all have access to the same characters (DLC 😬) and at the end of the day all you can do is pick a character and fight the person in front of you. How they feel about your choice and vice versa is irrelevant. Everybody plays who they want.
I agree that hwo will take players higher than they should, but the second you reach ranks where people are patient and know when to actively duck and sidestep, hwoarang gets blown up since he’s a committal character by nature. Hwoarang risks his life way more than people would think but it takes time to learn the holes in his offense.
@@raidenncYeah he's definitely one of the characters that you need to know the matchup for. You'll probably do bad if you don't know the matchup against anyone, but Hwo is one of the characters that just has so much stuff specific to him you need to know, you're basically guaranteed to get shit on if you don't know how he works.
@@Arcryoto he also gets blown up because since those players are being taken higher than they should be it's a bit of a shock to the system when they are fighting people who know how to slow them down. In that since they often get "carried" further than they should be. Not because the character is busted. It's the nature of his design that you will steamroll players up to a certain level and never learn how to actually defend yourself. Hwoarang isn't the only character like this and it's not necessarily a poor balance thing. It's just the design of the character. I mained Ling for a long time and found that my fundamentals were also underdeveloped. Why break throws or punish when nobody at your level and even touch you? Lol. Ling doesn't really win major tournaments at high level either, so it's not that she's busted. But defense is always more difficult than offense and matchups that require a lot of specific knowledge to defend against are going yield outsized results early on. It all balances out in the end which is why the whole conversation on "carried" is pointless and ultimately cope imo. At low level, who cares? At mid level, it'll balance out, and at the highest level, it kinda goes back to "who cares"? Does anybody TRULY think that Ulsan is "carried" by Dragunov and would be completely outclassed otherwise? Play who you want. Beat who is in front of you. Your opponent should do the same. That's really all there is to it.
it wasn't Hwoa who traumatized them, it was ranked FT2 that's the culprit. they have to sit there and deal with a character they struggle with, eat the Ls, and immediately move on, with 0 chance to really learn in the moment. T8 ranked is just some butt
when it comes to hwoa, he was the ORIGINAL stance mixup character and I think that legacy is super prominent in Tekken 8 with new players coming in to see this, they’ll probably relate him with other characters that can vomit in your face like Reina or Victor but see he’s been in this franchise for 5 more games then these two and think he’s MUCH worse when it comes to the fancy shit. Along with that he’s got a lot of counterplay that requires doing something more than just holding back and he’s got a couple moves out of stance that break the norms of tekken. Great example would RFF DF4, i13 mid that’s +8 on block via stance transition. Someone who understands a couple of the fundamentals of the game is going to assume it’s their turn to press, but then you get nailed by the high punch follow up. So many of his mixups work in this way where the opponent feels punished for doing the “right” or “conventional” that it’s no question why he’s so hated. Especially at a lower level.
I deadass used to hate Hwaorang and felt the way the ragers do, and thought he was impossible. Watching your stream, you can clearly see the weaknesses. You can see his weak match-ups. You can see which strings you can interrupt, side-step, etc. and I no longer find him infuriating. Going against a good one, sure, but that's any character. That's just a, "I got diffed" issue, not a character issue. I just feel like it is what you said - it's a litmus test. It's people LARPing and pretending that *you're* Hwaorang, and they take their frustrations out on you as if you are Hwaorang himself, because they can't deal with him. And maybe it's because I'm a Reina main, but I'm *okay* with that when he's frustrating. That means they're good. It's unfortunate that people's lack of emotional regulation and not being able to just contain their frustration results in them using you as their punching bag to moan about him. Frankly, I'd rather watch *and* play against Hwaorang than I would Dragunov's busted ass lmao I don't know how people are saying you got carried by Hwaorang when you also have like...what, 6+ characters in GoD? More than that? And play in pro tournaments frequently? If you're carried, then I'm as light as air and floating because there's no way
I used to feel that Hwo was a just mash heavy, brain dead character. But like as I got better at the game and started learning. It really is just a skill issue/matchup knowledge issue. Every Tekken character has broken stuff if you don’t know the matchup
@@danisflying Yea but its still skill issue like alot of the mixup contains duckable high that can be launch and high thag are very weak to side step or side walk😂 I play hwoarang and let me still you this if you hwoarang plus frame is oppressive try nina in my opinion she is a hwoarang on roids....like the plus frames she got when the guys ss1 cancel with mixup would make any sane player go insane😂😂
@@danisflyingHow does Hwo have a "trash tier" play style? Dude literally risks his life on half the move he throws out, his entire gameplan when attacking is basically just praying you'll fuck up and get hit, because otherwise he's eating a pretty nasty punish.
I feel like at least 90% of the people who hate Hwoarang never played him, at least I know I did. The character honestly is beautifully designed, and you don't realize it until you actually take the time to learn him and climb. I got stuck at Battle Ruler for a week because my flowcharts stopped working. The amount of levelling up as a player I had to do just to go from Battle Ruler to Fujin was insane. Hwoarang players deserve more respect highkey. Very strong, and very hard.
Funny, I just came from that video in which you commented about the mashing out of backturn- I’ve only been taking this game seriously as of THIS month and I got what you were saying. To be fair, I’m a Lili main.
I believe its the natural state of Tekken and I don't see it changing anytime soon. In order to play "actual" Tekken you need to invest time towards learning precise match up knowledge; where most players simply choose to just play the game. They may have had moments where they experience Tekken without the knowledge checks and they want that experience without the arduous proclivities of learning the game. This is what I believe players are truly frustrated about, and naturally they vent that frustration on other players unfairly. I also don't think Hwo is the worst offender on terms of being frustrating to deal with in T8, and I say that as a Kaz player. Granted, I've yet to run into a legacy Hwo player who actually knew what they were doing, and I wont be able to until I learn more match ups so I can actually rank up. That's Tekken.
Hwo is a hard character to play and to play against. People do not understand that Hwo is actually easy to deal with because most of his moves are very telegraphed, just like Zafina's moves are. So basically, the person that guesses right wins. Hwo gives his opponents time to react, which other characters don't do.
Hwoarang has some very beginner friendly spammable moves, when me & my friends started Tekken (Tekken 2-3 in the 90s) you just picked Hwoarang and spammed one (or all 4) buttons to kill EVERYBODY, thats where it comes from, its more of a meme, a scrub killer.... but higher up the ranks especially at Pro level you only get JELOUS when you see a great Hwoarang..... not just because it is such a beauty to watch (lets be honest, his fighting style and Lee Chaolans look the best in Tekken, Taekwondo/Kicking is the sexiest) but also because its so god damn hard to master all his shit and study how to counter it all against any character at the highest level.
@SoyemiFGC that's a hit into flamingo though? I mean a low that looks like it will hit, but instead is a flamingo cancel or neutral stance cancel. For example, bryan can spin into a low kick, or a punch, or into nothing
I wanna add to the ""who traumatized them"" discussion cause i am old enough to have been a scrub since tekken 1 and hwo was always the character that 1 friend pocket picked and everytime they lost on their actual main they would go hwo spam like hell and win and i think that is the collective trauma. The other hwo specific thing that makes people hate him is learning his side step because from meory you ss left from no stance ss chest sside in stance and that is from my knowledge a unique trait that is especially frustrating as a scrub. I am a lili player so i feel the hate because of a main. Might get lost in the noise but best of luck at the next event and i hope all your drag opponents drop their combos cause they carried right now.
0:42 "yep thats me. You're probably wondering how I got here. Well it all started about 9 seconds ago when Hwoarang launched me with a ki charge setup that fucking killed me. When I looked at K-wiss he just shrugged and said 'skill issue'"
I'm relatively new to Tekken. This is my first Tekken game (have been playing since release) and I'm Tekken Emperor on Lili and Tekken King on Reina. Due to me not having years (or decades) of legacy knowledge against Hwoarang, the matchup feels miserable to play. One of the main reasons is that playing against Hwoarang teaches you basically nothing. It doesn't teach you literally nothing, but the vast majority of Hwoarangs I play against refuse to block and contest every single interaction. If you jab them a single time, they will use evasive punch or armor. If you do a stance mixup, they will do evasive punch, down jab, or armor. If you land a heat engager, they will down jab, evasive punch or armor. If you heat dash, they will down jab evasive punch or armor. So, when an online Hwoarang whose entire goal is to steal his turn back as soon as possible is all that you play against, beating Hwoarang teaches you nothing because it is almost always a complete stomp where he didn't get to play and he kept doing evasive punch and b3. Beyond that, the Hwoarang blender is extremely unintuitive to get yourself out of. If you try to down jab, you might get your turn back, or you get blown up. If you try to side step, he has a homing mid heat engager. If you try to jab, he has armor. If you just block, he has lows and the jab out of stance is +5 on block. Even if you duck the jab, it is really hard to launch because it recovers basically instantly, so unless you have a launcher from crouch that doesn't put you in standing, you might get counterhit for getting a correct read! In this way, losing to Hwoarang also teaches you nothing because if you are unfamiliar with the matchup, you get blown up every time you try anything including blocking. It is extremely unclear what you are supposed to do without specifically looking up a guide on it or labbing. This is incredibly frustrating for me because I am a visual learner. I try to look at characters in order to understand what they are doing and then try to respond based on what I am seeing. This makes moves like Jack's down jab exceptionally frustrating because he is literally punching Reina in her lower stomach but it's a low. That doesn't look like a low to me! To be clear, I don't think Hwoarang is broken or overpowered. But Hwoarang players are exceptionally annoying, especially when they have no intentions of playing good Tekken. The best experience I've ever had was against a GoD Hwoarang in quick match that actually blocked and wave dashed and contested me on Lili in the open space. I would pretty much always get blown up if he got on top of me, but he wasn't so hellbent on cheating his turn back that we actually got to play neutral. I lost 2-1 and then 2-0 when we rematched, but I was able to take games and it felt awesome! I have since labbed the matchup and generally have an easier time with it now, but it's just not a fun experience. I have never had fun playing against Hwoarang and playing against Hwoarang makes me not want to play anymore. I would rather play against Dragunov every single game for the rest of my life than play against a single Hwoarang ever again, and it honestly has very little to do with the character and with how people play the character. It's very similar to how I feel about Devil Jin, where you are not allowed to ever take your frames against Devil Jin in ranked because they will always Samsara or Backswing Blow. You have to give up your turn on every interaction because Devil Jin players refuse to block (at least in blue, haven't played against any since I hit gold).
Not gonna lie,but how u mentioned that ur a visual learner and its hard to learn anything intuitively is kind of always been a tekken problem I would know since im the same as you on this matter (Ofc its better for some characters and worse for others)
@@Biryani2op It's the main reason I don't like playing against Jack or Eddy, Eddy spends the entire game rolling on the ground and he has lows, mids, and highs that all look pretty much exactly the same (one of his mids is him hitting you in your lower shin and one of his highs is him hitting you in your stomach?). Jack is just so big that him punching you in your upper thigh is a low and it is exceedingly unclear which moves hit where based on looking at them.
Agreed. When I see the comments and know the difference in tool set I feel kind of sad for them. The celebration over d3, 4 being launch punishable when Nina has a similar that is a counter hit full combo betrays them. There are enough online content to help them now and still... 🙄
@@raidennc ok you got it I don’t remember ever comparing the 2 of them being the same thing obviously they are not I meant the string starting out as a low then a high? Obviously she can’t go into stance from it I meant the string itself
To be fair hwoarang is annoying to fight sometimes, but compared to other characters in this game he’s not that bad to fight tbh, also love the videos K-wiss
Why ask people about Hwoarang if your response is only to belittle and mock the players in the vid/comments? It's weird telling people that anyone can find anything frustrating.. but then being a hypocrite when you find out what they don't like... I get that it's skill gap but the same argument can be applied to you when you and what you find annoying. Honestly, all the characters are annoying low key and usually what people hate is relative to their style and ability to adjust
"The same argument can be applied to you and what you find annoying". Well, no because I go ahead and learn what I have to do and I don't bother strangers with my grievances. Which again if people don't want to go ahead and learn that's fine because it's time consuming, this is my job so I have to. But other people's skill issues are not my problem and that's the whole point lol. I find it weird that you think it's okay that people can say whatever they want to me but me making jokes about what others are saying publicly is where you draw the line
@@K-Wiss Look man, I respect you and will continue to watch your vids regardless, I just don't think it's fair to pull the "skill issue" card over "annoying", and likewise you have to apply the "skill issue" card to what annoys you. Ppl just hate certain characters but everyone has to keep the same energy. Honestly a toxic trait of the community is us telling each other we suck because we don't like something. I feel like what's annoying and what's "op" are diff topics. I do agree that Hwoarang is a noob smasher, but I do think he's genuinely an obnoxious design. He's not even that strong but somethings inherently annoying about a cocky ginger kicking you constantly LOL Anyways it's all good man.
@@Sloppyjoey1 "You have to apply the skill issue card to what annoys you". But I don't because I'm not refusing to learn how to deal with characters and then crying about it. I can break down in very fine detail as to why something is OP or what makes something frustrating to deal with. But even if I couldn't do that I'm not going out of my way to cry to others and that is simply my point. The character is hard to deal with but I had people crying "delete Hwoarang" because of a high high string. THAT is the definition of a skill issue. Also when did I say he's not hard to deal with/annoying to deal with? That's not the point at all
"How do you know the jab is a high?" Because it's a fucking jab, and there are no mid jabs. Oh boy, this video's going to be something. 0:27 - 0:56 🤣 High, high string that doesn't jail =DELETE THIS UNBEATABLE CANCER! Ooookay, then. I swear the disdain and vitriol Hwoarang seems to inspire in people goes back way further than Tekken 7, and given that Hwoarang has never been the best character in any game, I don't get why. There are plenty of other characters who've been around for a while that are annoying and have also nearly always been *better* than Hwoarang, like Jin, Bryan, Kazuya, Xiaoyu, Nina, Steve, King, Law, Devil Jin, etc., yet none of them get the same kind of heat Hwoarang does.
I think it's mostly because they see him throwing out 50 kicks in a row and take a bunch of damage and just say "oh he's mashing." He's usually not, and his execution requirements are quite high, but that's what it looks like to a lot of non Hwo players. Compared to most of the cast, matchup knowledge is more important for beating him as well. As a stance character, he focuses less on fundamental offense and defense like for example Kazuya would, and more on his own unique tools for those things. So you really can't figure him out just by fighting him a couple times. Pair that with how he's a noob destroyer who appears to be mindlessly mashing, and the hate starts to make sense even if it's not justified.
Hay Mr. Kwiss, fujin ranked player here. The best way to beat Hwoarang is to step left space him out, and make good reads on his highs also punish his amor moves but duck underneath back lash. Also, you can use down one to stop his blind. Can anyone give me more advice aside from punishing his negative moves. What I said works well but I can't seem to find a way to shut Hwoarang completely down.
Im a surface level tekken player for a long time. And if theres anything I've learned from playing the game is that it gets very easy to get frustrated dealing with characters like hwo. That frustration tends to get out from most people destructively rather than constructively. I haven't personally looked for too many answers to deal with Hwo, since im just a blue rank but I'd imagine its a long list of things to learn. And then its gonna be even harder to put into action unless you have a friend that plays the character. Knowing is one thing but taking advantage is another. I think that barrier is just exacerbated with Hwo. Everyone has been through the scrub grinder its just this is a REALLY hard fighting game. Even if he isn't the strongest at a high level it still takes a high barrier of time. Creates a large amount of communal frustration. Thats outside looking in though.
If I had to choose between fighting Lili or Tekken god Hwoarang, I'd rather fight Hwoarang everytime. I fought so many Hwoarang's I know the matchup and I'm not afraid.
There is a new onslaught of hwoarang players who are trash that quit once you use actual movement, but yeah all characters needs to be labbed but hwoarang is at the tippy top of needing to lab
What I understand the least is that Hwo haters are in the comment section of Hwo mains saying how Hwo is annoying. Like if you don’t have the time to learn the character, then why do you magically have to time to complain?
In denial about the trash game design that hwoarang is, character doesn't magically become less flowcharty at high ranks and high level whoreang tekken is evidence of that.
Hwo used to piss me off in T7, cause I didnt know the MU. Against a rly good Hwo, I still dont, but I labbed his d3,4 options and his most common strings and set ups which took me maybe half an hour. Since then I never had problems with 90% of all Hworangs I faced and I actually enjoy the MU. A little labbing will set u up against the vast majority of Hwos, cause the vast majority of Hwos just abuses his very basic anti noob stuff. They all get smoked once they reach a higher level where the opponent knows the MU. And thats where most Hwos give up, cause it takes deeper knowledge about the character of what to use when..and the ability to adapt to mind games. In about 4000 hours of tekken Ive enjountered not even a handful of actually good Hwos (dispite Hwo being so common). So if u just lab his most common stuff for a little, u wont be struggling against this character unless u face actual Hwo mains, which are suuuuper rare.
Those guys need to try to learn Hwoarang. See how far they can go with him. He's hard to master. People just love to complain without trying to learn first.
It’s because hworang can feel very overwhelming mentally and it can feel like he’s unbeatable which he isn’t he has his weaknesses it’s just like raven he’s low tier but he starts doing his clone shit it just feels like he’s broke but he’s not it’s just a lot going on and the mind gets clouded
my favourite part of this vid, is the first 4 minutes where the lee is consistently blocking your low mixups and punishing them as you explain why hwoarang is far from the worst offender of some of this absolute bs that tekken 8 has atm.
The reason why Hwo is extremely obnoxious to so many is because he is a pain to lab. He has an insanely large moveset and most of his moves look the same. They look like the same kicks over and over again which doesn't only make them difficult to differentiate but also boring as shit to lab. He also has 3 different "stances" that make it very hard to identify what moves may come next. He also switches between these stances a shit load of time and it feels as if it happens at random. Also, there is very little information online on how to counter the most problematic aspects of Hwo's gameplay. Add to that the fact that he is one of the most played characters in the game right now and there you go. I'm a beginner who just recently reached Tekken God and I can definitely say that there hasn't been a single character I had to lab more often than Hwo. You lab him 20 times and still have games where you feel like you haven't improved even a bit in this matchup. Only NOW I finally feel like I'm at a point where I know enough of his sidesteppable moves, Minus frame moves, Gameplan etc. to deal decently with him. Players at the highest rank however don't have that excuse. It takes real skill to reach the summit with Hwo as much as with any other character.
And just to clarify I don't mean to say that the people who complain are right, just that I can understand the frustration. As annoying as it may be for many, you won't get better if you don't lab matchups. However, you can find a lot of fun in it, and there is nothing better than learning how to counter certain moves and then getting a launch out of it once you apply it in a real match.
Thank you for speaking out without malice, too K-Wiss. You're right, most of us simply haven't played enough to know everything that's going on, and rightfully so it can be extremely frustrating, but people are just ignorant to what they are seeing and refuse to accept that they don't want to learn. With that said, learning is frustrating in this game.
I'm that person; I'm still learnin' and I'm absolutely horrible at this game still. There's character I have horrible times again, as a Jun player. I even get that "You play X Character so you can't feel y or z". I just come to accept some characters are gonna test me- I win, I win. I lose, I lose.
Hworang is one of my favorite match ups personally. He has been around since tekken 3 and is super familiar. I've never mained him just always lab him in each game to learn his frames the best I can. Ppl that complain don't understand he is a specialist character that you can't just pick up like Victor for example. In the right hands sure he can be oppressive but in 8 most of the cast can be lol. Drag, Feng, Nina, Yoshi are the problem right now
I would have expected hwo to be less hated in t8. I hated him in t7 because his offense was so much to deal with, but that's kind of the default now, so he stands out less imo.
Idk how people tolerate fighting games not knowing the basics of each matchup. Yeah in the first month you won't know every character in this game, but it's been a year since the beta.
I was just accused of cheating and playing with auto duck in my comments and being abussed for using using hwoarang at emperor level and the funny thing is I didn't even play the game on that day😂.
Maybe from now just ignore the haters after this cuz u dont need to take stress from the them,unless they become an actual problem(kinda like how darkviperau is rn)
Me personally, I prayed that *every* hwoarang player that crushed my jab with a DF2 in T7 got locked in a dark, windowless, room with legos scattered on the floor. Simultaneously, In the same game, K-wiss was my 4th favorite PRO to watch. At lower lvls hwoarang just presses some people and then they carry that hate in their soul with them like its a fuckin Dybbuk, lmao.
I may have contributed to this problem, i’m not even a hwoarang main, i just play him to relieve the stress from grinding rank on my main… People are actually adding me on steam just to send me death threats 😅
It is a skill issue, but at the same time if the majority of the player base cannot deal with his offence then as a result its a carry character...Hence why you will see a ton of hwo destructions and supremes who would only be blue rank if they were playing leo for example.
Because he is insufferable when you don’t have solid defense or knowledge of the matchup. Now that I’m better at the game I don’t mind fighting him, but I still get a nasty taste in my mouth from how often I had to deal with constantly plus frames and mashing when no other character left me feeling overwhelmed. I enjoyed fighting Drag in the lower ranks more than fighting Hwo and drag is the best character in the game.
The best part of Tekken 8 is everyone is viable, There's not some super astronomical leap the subject experts have to take their main to the higest levels of play. If you look up any character in this game there's probs a youtube channel with a G.O.D. level player that's just clipping people with sick combos, sidesteps, and comebacks. There are characters where their gameplan is much easier to access and that feels frustrating but on a rewatch there are def solutions to their BS. In that clip with Brian, he just had to use one armor get off me tool and he would have had space. He froze and tried to jab out which HW is plus so you can't do. I'm blue rank and I can see that. There have always been people that hate whatever iteration of Tekken is out but T8 is no way the worst Tekken.
I think Hwo is a balanced character however he can be extremely frustrating to fight because his frames are so quick and he can be misleading on whats punishable and whats not but yah Hi K-Wiss love the content
Pro's are a bit out of touch on Hwoarang imo. Annoying =/= OP... Getting kicked by a loud, cocky ginger is actually quite annoying, but more seriously, people hate anything where you have to adjust your play style and know more about them than they need to know about you. This is why no one finds Paul annoying, he doesn't have a million stances, moves, good reach etc and arguably still far less annoying than Eddy/Hwoa. Eddy and Hwoarang fall under "annoying" because they knowledge check you but in a flamboyant way.
@@Sloppyjoey1 Well it's funny because Paul has one of the most ridiculous moves in the game right now with f2 as an i13 heat engager with the same whiff recovery as a jab that is a legitimate problem in the game. Not to mention 50/50 of deathfist launch and -12 heat smash while in heat. See how I explain the opinion?
Yeah honestly K those characters you mentioned in the tournament are probably the most annoying ones I hate going against with my Jack8 lol especially Draganov and Law(il add Jin and lidia in there aswell) 😂
I wanna say this, as someone new to tekken(i picked up 7 about 4 months before 8 dropped) i labbed hwao like crazy cause my troupe in fighting games are characters who uses there legs that hwao isnt even as crazy as yall make him out to be imo hes the most well rounded,amazing pressure great buttons i genuinely think ppl that lose to hwao and throw a tantrum over him lack the ability to adapt ive done mirror matches and everyone does the same thing i do my own thing and it catches ppl off guard if you hate playing against a character much learn what can kill them like we are in a world where we'd rather bitch about a high mid tier character than someone who can evade almost all options because he stance puts her all most on the ground and ducks lows 😂😂😂😂
You can explain this 1000x times K-Wiss they wouldnt understand shit at all, all they do is complain and dont learn the game.. Thats how it is .. hwoarang is just a scrub killer character ngl. Keep up the good work , ur legend.
Personally, I hate fighting Hwoarang, because I am lacking knowledge about the character. I get mad and say “This character is TRAAASH!!”, but I know it’s just cause I didn’t punish properly. I didn’t sidestep. I pressed on disadvantage. And I hate to admit I’m wrong, but I have to, because I screwed up, and I need to learn. It’s why I’m only recently Fujin with Lars after playing from launch. I’m bad, but at least I know that.
I mean I understand the frustration with Hwoarang. I've been a Hwoarang hater since Tekken 6 because that's when I really started playing Tekken, Eddy is a nightmare for me too. I seriously don't like Kazuya though... But in all honesty, my biggest frustration lies with Tekken 8 as a whole. I don't like the Heat system at all. I don't like the guard breaking moves and the overall encouragement and rewarding of the aggressive playstyle... when I play- or should I say, TRY to play defensive, I get absolutely chipped. Not only that you can get to rage art health and heal up a bunch during certain scenarios... it's just not that fun for me. It's a shame because I really like Tekken... I also tried to play Hwoarang, it's really not that easy, the only easy thing I can do is his armoured move and spam 4. I also understand how this negativity towards you affects you and what you say because I feel like TMM is in the same boat in a way, 'cause it's like, you guys are insanely good at the game, and the tiniest complain makes everyone else mad because from their perspective, you're so good that they think you can't complain about anything since you "have it good" type thing... if any of that makes sense.
It's kwiss's punishment, ducking of highs and sidestepping that make him good. He's using hwoarang so it's making hwoarang look much better than he is to be honest
i legit feel like i can't complain about crazy characters even back in t7 as a xiao player like, i can't complain about geese? y'all gotta deal with him too wtf 😭
omg yeah, i don't understand people that hate the content but are constantly coming back xD like the hwo haters on your content and just, any comment being thrown at Phi 😭
Because movement is good, dont have an issue with hwo. Ill be honest King, hwoarang and nina . Feel no matter who wrong or weak they are . People just dont wanna deal with them
I fucking DESPISE hwoarang. But that doesn’t stop me from respecting people who are good with him. He’s annoying to fight against for sure for a majority of people, but he’s actually really fun to watch.
Lol Hwaorang is the reason i play tekken 😂😅 Went over my friends house both new 2 tekken his char was hwaorang i got whooped so bad i decided to learn the game to beat him next time... been here ever since 😅😅 Now that i know the game i realise it was a hopeless scenario for me 🤣😂
Hworang is considered annoying by people because he is far easier to play than to counter, its really just that simple At any level besides the very top, you can get away with running your endless 50/50 knowledge checks, and you'll get a decent amount of success. I say this as someone who learned Hwo to play him, anyone who says "its just a skill issue, learn the match" while technically correct, seem to forget how much you need to learn to face him, and since he isn't the most common, you can only learn him by labbing. Consider Reina for instance, she has a sizeable movelist, and a bunch of stances, and people complained about having to learn her matchup, and I'd argue she's less bad because you don't even need to learn as many moves to defend against her
man i just hit tekken king with hwoarang and mfs on socials be talking down on me cause i play hwoarang 😭 and i be doubling down, like yes bro i’m a masher, im a spammer, LEARN THE MATCH UP ! 😭
You sometimes just can't get through some thick-sculled comments about character from people who can't open training mode for 1 second to look at hit properties
Blame this on BTS_J1N and speed kicks But no really haorang is literally just "fundamentals check the character". Do you know how to duck? Do you know how to punish? Do you know how to duck?!?!
From watching you I always get the feeling that Hwo is quite weak especially compared to T7. His poking ability is just not very good in this game, his attacks seem easier to read and generally speaking it feels like you always start off on the back-foot. However he is very noob "unfriendly", like if you don't understand some Tekken fundamentals nor do you take time to learn the match up, he'll feel just as frustrating as going against Xiaoyu
9:55 NAHHH lmao your comment earlier in the vid explaining how normal people wouldn't care if you're good or not refutes this because as soon as your main is on your page, some mf will say something dumb. I like Feng so if I say ANYTING its "WELL FENG IS BUSTED SO STFU" Even your man Joka can't even give his opinion without every other fanbase trying to kill his points lol
But K-wiss, why go into a replay to learn the matchup when I can just go on Twitter and make an entire thread to complain about the character in as much time?
Just seeing Hwoarang in the versus screen is enough to make me mad. Nobody is made at you specifically, as you said in the videos, we are not pros. Maybe Hwoarang is not braindead at your level but for 90% of players, he is. We have no cule of what he is doing and it can be so intimidating. I’ve recently decided to one and done and block all Hwoarang players. And before you ask, yes i hate Hwoarang but i still watch your channel, you are good at the game and you say funny sometimes and i love watching Tekken
Thank you for reading my comment on the video Yes, it's ok to not be good at the game, i agree But come on, some people are just tired from their routines and wanna play some games and a hworang player shows up doing that it will piss them off and make them rage against any hworang player it doesn't matter where The hworang player might be having fun but not his opponent So yes, that video will piss a lot of people Also, some would think "f it I will be the one playing this character" but they see almost 200 moves and move on to paul or law not even a joke or ed and they just spam 3 or 4
"Make them rage against any Hwoarang player it doesn't matter where". Do you not realise how ridiculous that sounds? Because you don't know a match up you're just gonna get angry at anyone that plays that character? Your skill issue is not my problem lmao
@K-Wiss i know, and sorry if i sounded angry against you But people are unpredictable I made a joke bc i struggle with the character, and i really can't play him too, because it's too much stuff to remember
@@LeDanc “the hwoarang player might be having fun but not his opponent” that’s not any hwoarang players problem, learn the match up and stop whining about who YOU specially can and can’t beat and im not trying to be rude I just find your reasoning extremely lame man lol.
Crying as much as them bro. If you click bait a title, why are you surprised that people leave comments like that. Like, we are in an alternate dimension bruv?
Even if we the titles were JUST clickbait it's still ridiculous to act like I can't have an opinion because of the character I play, a character that is also literally weaker than the characters featured in the content: Law, Shaheen, Lili (probably not Hei but he's new so we don't know yet.) But even still it's not just clickbait, the NOT OKAY videos are a series recognisable on the channel by returning viewers and even if one was "click baited" for the first time there's an intro explaining all in the first 40 seconds of the video. And characters like Lili and Shaheen are frustrating to deal with, I fail to see the "click bait"
@K-Wiss You absolutely can have an opinion on anything you want. What I'm saying is that it's not going to stop them from leaving comments like that. I referred to the "Not Okay" as click bait because imo, it's going to grab the attention of both extreme views toward the character. For the people that agree with you, you get some validation and everything is Gucci. On the other hand, the people who don't agree with you are going to lash out in any way they can, i.e hating on Hwo, and that is going to happen even if your take is as level headed as possible. Growing pains from being a content creator is that you're just not going to be able to please everyone. Imo, when you highlight the haters it just emboldens them. They aren't trying to learn or get better they just want a reaction, dont give it to them.
Play against hwoarang enough and you'll be good...play against alisa enough she'll still piss you off...hwoarang can be annoying initially (both to play and to fight against) you get better the more you do it
Damn, Hwo mains really getting treated like second class tekken players. The fact that you guys cannot express your negative opinion on a character, without get flamed by other people because of the character you play is sad (but lowkey deserved).
![REVISITING OLD TEKKEN [Except TTT1 and DR]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/J7y42wsMVU0/mqdefault.jpg)
Yeah, learning Hwoarang made me stop bitching about "brain dead" or "broken" characters.
Started as a Kazuya main only for the challenge and had an intense hate for Hwoarang. I finally decided to learn him for myself and to my surprise, he was harder for me to pilot than Kazuya, which made me respect him way more.
He's now my second main/favorite character and I tip my hat when people whoop my ass with him because he is NOT easy to control.
Very different skill sets involved.
Kazuya’s difficulty comes from how limited his tool set is. He doesn’t have that many good buttons, but that also means your decision making is pretty simplified. Small tool bag = easy choices. You don’t have to think that much about when to use what.
Characters like Hwo, Raven, Xiaoyu are the opposite. They have massive interconnected move sets. They have more options. This means it’s easier to overwhelm your opponent or wriggle your way out of situations with character specific bullshit, but it also means you have to figure out how and where to use all that extra stuff. You have way more choices to make, and because they’re stance based, you also have to make them very quickly.
I felt like I was comfortable on Kazuya after a week or two. Took me a month before I had any semblance of a gameplan on Xiaoyu.
So yeah, I agree, Hwo can’t be easy.
@@WeMissDimebag Exactly, well put.
Agree 😊
Hwo might be hard to pilot, but easier to win with, than most of the roster, am I wrong?
@@Saiko1998just in low level cause literally no body knows what hwo player doing including me.
Is there any character that's easy to deal with in this game ? No matter who your opponent is, if you don't know the match-up you're cooked. Welcome to tekken 8
Bryan is easy to deal with
😂😂😂😂
@@avengernaruto1854 not a bryan player thats good
DVJ lol
Claudio. Dont duck you win lol
Hwoarang is a scrub killer so naturally he'll attract hate from scrubs
😂
everyone in this game is a scrub killer. people only hate Hwoa, because he does have an answer for everything.
literally what i've been saying from day one of tekken 8 (i'm also a scrub)
Hwo is a scrub character. Most of them have low defense number about 40-50 and they don't need to block because they can keep doing flowchart patterns.
@@jkdman2007 one of the high execution characters being called a scrub character, why cant you just admit you dont know how to play against him yet 🥱
People hate hwoarang because he's a test of your defense and we all know how some people are when it comes to defense.
absolute dumbfuck argument
But most hwo players have low defense number because they don't need to block. They keep doing flowchart + frame and that's why they have never learned how to block.
@@jkdman2007 more of a tekken 8 problem imo since there are more characters like that too
Not here to argue coz i think maybe they should fix these problems
Hwo hate is indeed a litmus test. All top players unanimously agree he’s mid tier, and all the scrubs unanimously agree that they are in fact scrubs and can’t be bothered to git gud
Yeah this is bullshit and not about tiers, you hwoarang monkeys will never understand because you are in denial about how scrubby hwoarangs playstyle is even at high level. This isn't about tiers, its the design of a character built around flowcharting out of a low-high string.
As a Hwoarang main this brings me so much joy seeing these losers keep blaming us for being trash at the game xD
Haha me too bro even though I hate mirror matches 😂😂😂
hwoarang main hmmpff. ur not even good playing hwoarang. you wannabe.
They hate us cuz they ain't us 😂
Why dont they just add Baek so Hworang can be the least of yall worries 😈
ONG
People out here complaining about hwo, forgetting that beak do san was worse
Baek wasn't as oppressive
@@Blackfist030 Baek was better bro wym
@@Blackfist030depends on how good his sidestep would be if they added him. TTT2 Baek could death combo off of a good flamingo sidestep, and his flamingo sidestep was outrageously large and fast
They put replays on the rematch screen. Nobody has an excuse now
"That won't stop me, 'cause I can't read (frames)!"
Hwoarang exposes how bad people’s defense is.
It’s embarrassing to run into people who have worse defense than a hwoarang player and then they go complain that hwo is carried?
@@Arcryoto the opposite is also true. At lower-mid levels Hwoarang players do often go farther than their fundamentals would otherwise allow because he is a "lab" character who you won't be able to defend against until you dedicate time. So in that sense they are often "carried" (even though I hate that term/rationale).
He isn't overpowered or anything close to it. But he DOES take people further than their base skills would otherwise allow. This doesn't only apply to him but it does apply.
Personally I don't think "carried" matters. We all have access to the same characters (DLC 😬) and at the end of the day all you can do is pick a character and fight the person in front of you. How they feel about your choice and vice versa is irrelevant. Everybody plays who they want.
I agree that hwo will take players higher than they should, but the second you reach ranks where people are patient and know when to actively duck and sidestep, hwoarang gets blown up since he’s a committal character by nature. Hwoarang risks his life way more than people would think but it takes time to learn the holes in his offense.
@@raidenncYeah he's definitely one of the characters that you need to know the matchup for. You'll probably do bad if you don't know the matchup against anyone, but Hwo is one of the characters that just has so much stuff specific to him you need to know, you're basically guaranteed to get shit on if you don't know how he works.
@@Arcryoto he also gets blown up because since those players are being taken higher than they should be it's a bit of a shock to the system when they are fighting people who know how to slow them down. In that since they often get "carried" further than they should be. Not because the character is busted. It's the nature of his design that you will steamroll players up to a certain level and never learn how to actually defend yourself. Hwoarang isn't the only character like this and it's not necessarily a poor balance thing. It's just the design of the character.
I mained Ling for a long time and found that my fundamentals were also underdeveloped. Why break throws or punish when nobody at your level and even touch you? Lol. Ling doesn't really win major tournaments at high level either, so it's not that she's busted. But defense is always more difficult than offense and matchups that require a lot of specific knowledge to defend against are going yield outsized results early on.
It all balances out in the end which is why the whole conversation on "carried" is pointless and ultimately cope imo. At low level, who cares? At mid level, it'll balance out, and at the highest level, it kinda goes back to "who cares"? Does anybody TRULY think that Ulsan is "carried" by Dragunov and would be completely outclassed otherwise?
Play who you want. Beat who is in front of you. Your opponent should do the same. That's really all there is to it.
it wasn't Hwoa who traumatized them, it was ranked FT2 that's the culprit. they have to sit there and deal with a character they struggle with, eat the Ls, and immediately move on, with 0 chance to really learn in the moment. T8 ranked is just some butt
when it comes to hwoa, he was the ORIGINAL stance mixup character and I think that legacy is super prominent in Tekken 8 with new players coming in to see this, they’ll probably relate him with other characters that can vomit in your face like Reina or Victor but see he’s been in this franchise for 5 more games then these two and think he’s MUCH worse when it comes to the fancy shit. Along with that he’s got a lot of counterplay that requires doing something more than just holding back and he’s got a couple moves out of stance that break the norms of tekken. Great example would RFF DF4, i13 mid that’s +8 on block via stance transition. Someone who understands a couple of the fundamentals of the game is going to assume it’s their turn to press, but then you get nailed by the high punch follow up. So many of his mixups work in this way where the opponent feels punished for doing the “right” or “conventional” that it’s no question why he’s so hated. Especially at a lower level.
I deadass used to hate Hwaorang and felt the way the ragers do, and thought he was impossible.
Watching your stream, you can clearly see the weaknesses. You can see his weak match-ups. You can see which strings you can interrupt, side-step, etc. and I no longer find him infuriating. Going against a good one, sure, but that's any character. That's just a, "I got diffed" issue, not a character issue.
I just feel like it is what you said - it's a litmus test. It's people LARPing and pretending that *you're* Hwaorang, and they take their frustrations out on you as if you are Hwaorang himself, because they can't deal with him. And maybe it's because I'm a Reina main, but I'm *okay* with that when he's frustrating. That means they're good. It's unfortunate that people's lack of emotional regulation and not being able to just contain their frustration results in them using you as their punching bag to moan about him.
Frankly, I'd rather watch *and* play against Hwaorang than I would Dragunov's busted ass lmao I don't know how people are saying you got carried by Hwaorang when you also have like...what, 6+ characters in GoD? More than that? And play in pro tournaments frequently? If you're carried, then I'm as light as air and floating because there's no way
I used to feel that Hwo was a just mash heavy, brain dead character. But like as I got better at the game and started learning. It really is just a skill issue/matchup knowledge issue. Every Tekken character has broken stuff if you don’t know the matchup
trash argument, not all characters are designed the same and some have more trash tier playstyles than others such as hwoarang
@@danisflying
Yea but its still skill issue like alot of the mixup contains duckable high that can be launch and high thag are very weak to side step or side walk😂
I play hwoarang and let me still you this if you hwoarang plus frame is oppressive try nina in my opinion she is a hwoarang on roids....like the plus frames she got when the guys ss1 cancel with mixup would make any sane player go insane😂😂
@@danisflyingHow does Hwo have a "trash tier" play style? Dude literally risks his life on half the move he throws out, his entire gameplan when attacking is basically just praying you'll fuck up and get hit, because otherwise he's eating a pretty nasty punish.
It's me. I single handedly upset the whole tekken community with my hwo playstyle. Every stage is crystal lake when I'm on
we are upset because we have to share oxygen with hwoarang monkeys
I feel like at least 90% of the people who hate Hwoarang never played him, at least I know I did. The character honestly is beautifully designed, and you don't realize it until you actually take the time to learn him and climb. I got stuck at Battle Ruler for a week because my flowcharts stopped working. The amount of levelling up as a player I had to do just to go from Battle Ruler to Fujin was insane. Hwoarang players deserve more respect highkey. Very strong, and very hard.
yeah alright mate keep mashing d3,4
@@danisflying bro if ur still losing to d3,4 mashers, ur genuinely terrible 😭
@@danisflying keep having bad defense lmao
Funny, I just came from that video in which you commented about the mashing out of backturn- I’ve only been taking this game seriously as of THIS month and I got what you were saying.
To be fair, I’m a Lili main.
I believe its the natural state of Tekken and I don't see it changing anytime soon. In order to play "actual" Tekken you need to invest time towards learning precise match up knowledge; where most players simply choose to just play the game. They may have had moments where they experience Tekken without the knowledge checks and they want that experience without the arduous proclivities of learning the game. This is what I believe players are truly frustrated about, and naturally they vent that frustration on other players unfairly. I also don't think Hwo is the worst offender on terms of being frustrating to deal with in T8, and I say that as a Kaz player. Granted, I've yet to run into a legacy Hwo player who actually knew what they were doing, and I wont be able to until I learn more match ups so I can actually rank up. That's Tekken.
It’s Bryan for me. I hate that fucking match up!! Has so many launchers.
"An unholy amount of time" - good turn of phrase, i like it, very sophisticated language buddy 😂
Hwo is a hard character to play and to play against. People do not understand that Hwo is actually easy to deal with because most of his moves are very telegraphed, just like Zafina's moves are. So basically, the person that guesses right wins. Hwo gives his opponents time to react, which other characters don't do.
Hwoarang has some very beginner friendly spammable moves, when me & my friends started Tekken (Tekken 2-3 in the 90s) you just picked Hwoarang and spammed one (or all 4) buttons to kill EVERYBODY, thats where it comes from, its more of a meme, a scrub killer.... but higher up the ranks especially at Pro level you only get JELOUS when you see a great Hwoarang..... not just because it is such a beauty to watch (lets be honest, his fighting style and Lee Chaolans look the best in Tekken, Taekwondo/Kicking is the sexiest) but also because its so god damn hard to master all his shit and study how to counter it all against any character at the highest level.
If hwoarang ever got a low that he could cancel, he would legitimately become broken as fuck
Db,4 into flamingo
@SoyemiFGC that's a hit into flamingo though?
I mean a low that looks like it will hit, but instead is a flamingo cancel or neutral stance cancel. For example, bryan can spin into a low kick, or a punch, or into nothing
I wanna add to the ""who traumatized them"" discussion cause i am old enough to have been a scrub since tekken 1 and hwo was always the character that 1 friend pocket picked and everytime they lost on their actual main they would go hwo spam like hell and win and i think that is the collective trauma.
The other hwo specific thing that makes people hate him is learning his side step because from meory you ss left from no stance ss chest sside in stance and that is from my knowledge a unique trait that is especially frustrating as a scrub.
I am a lili player so i feel the hate because of a main. Might get lost in the noise but best of luck at the next event and i hope all your drag opponents drop their combos cause they carried right now.
0:42 "yep thats me. You're probably wondering how I got here. Well it all started about 9 seconds ago when Hwoarang launched me with a ki charge setup that fucking killed me. When I looked at K-wiss he just shrugged and said 'skill issue'"
Too many people be having a opinion on stuff they don't understand. This man pays his bills playing this game, let the man cook.
Nice cringe language
@@danisflying u hate urself so much, its rather concerning... gtfoh
@@danisflying Who asked you?
I'm relatively new to Tekken. This is my first Tekken game (have been playing since release) and I'm Tekken Emperor on Lili and Tekken King on Reina. Due to me not having years (or decades) of legacy knowledge against Hwoarang, the matchup feels miserable to play. One of the main reasons is that playing against Hwoarang teaches you basically nothing. It doesn't teach you literally nothing, but the vast majority of Hwoarangs I play against refuse to block and contest every single interaction. If you jab them a single time, they will use evasive punch or armor. If you do a stance mixup, they will do evasive punch, down jab, or armor. If you land a heat engager, they will down jab, evasive punch or armor. If you heat dash, they will down jab evasive punch or armor. So, when an online Hwoarang whose entire goal is to steal his turn back as soon as possible is all that you play against, beating Hwoarang teaches you nothing because it is almost always a complete stomp where he didn't get to play and he kept doing evasive punch and b3. Beyond that, the Hwoarang blender is extremely unintuitive to get yourself out of. If you try to down jab, you might get your turn back, or you get blown up. If you try to side step, he has a homing mid heat engager. If you try to jab, he has armor. If you just block, he has lows and the jab out of stance is +5 on block. Even if you duck the jab, it is really hard to launch because it recovers basically instantly, so unless you have a launcher from crouch that doesn't put you in standing, you might get counterhit for getting a correct read! In this way, losing to Hwoarang also teaches you nothing because if you are unfamiliar with the matchup, you get blown up every time you try anything including blocking.
It is extremely unclear what you are supposed to do without specifically looking up a guide on it or labbing. This is incredibly frustrating for me because I am a visual learner. I try to look at characters in order to understand what they are doing and then try to respond based on what I am seeing. This makes moves like Jack's down jab exceptionally frustrating because he is literally punching Reina in her lower stomach but it's a low. That doesn't look like a low to me! To be clear, I don't think Hwoarang is broken or overpowered. But Hwoarang players are exceptionally annoying, especially when they have no intentions of playing good Tekken. The best experience I've ever had was against a GoD Hwoarang in quick match that actually blocked and wave dashed and contested me on Lili in the open space. I would pretty much always get blown up if he got on top of me, but he wasn't so hellbent on cheating his turn back that we actually got to play neutral. I lost 2-1 and then 2-0 when we rematched, but I was able to take games and it felt awesome! I have since labbed the matchup and generally have an easier time with it now, but it's just not a fun experience. I have never had fun playing against Hwoarang and playing against Hwoarang makes me not want to play anymore. I would rather play against Dragunov every single game for the rest of my life than play against a single Hwoarang ever again, and it honestly has very little to do with the character and with how people play the character. It's very similar to how I feel about Devil Jin, where you are not allowed to ever take your frames against Devil Jin in ranked because they will always Samsara or Backswing Blow. You have to give up your turn on every interaction because Devil Jin players refuse to block (at least in blue, haven't played against any since I hit gold).
Not gonna lie,but how u mentioned that ur a visual learner and its hard to learn anything intuitively is kind of always been a tekken problem
I would know since im the same as you on this matter
(Ofc its better for some characters and worse for others)
@@Biryani2op It's the main reason I don't like playing against Jack or Eddy, Eddy spends the entire game rolling on the ground and he has lows, mids, and highs that all look pretty much exactly the same (one of his mids is him hitting you in your lower shin and one of his highs is him hitting you in your stomach?). Jack is just so big that him punching you in your upper thigh is a low and it is exceedingly unclear which moves hit where based on looking at them.
@@raphtheboygenius yea man agreed
Agreed. When I see the comments and know the difference in tool set I feel kind of sad for them. The celebration over d3, 4 being launch punishable when Nina has a similar that is a counter hit full combo betrays them. There are enough online content to help them now and still... 🙄
The same people that celebrated the d3,4 change still cannot launch it correctly, you hate to see it
What does Nina have that is similar to d34?
@@raidenncI think it’s 3,4,3 same fucking string damn near
@@ShizuoHeiwa absolutely not. Not even close to the same use case.
@@raidennc ok you got it I don’t remember ever comparing the 2 of them being the same thing obviously they are not I meant the string starting out as a low then a high? Obviously she can’t go into stance from it I meant the string itself
"This video is completely invaid because you're a Hwoarang player"
To be fair hwoarang is annoying to fight sometimes, but compared to other characters in this game he’s not that bad to fight tbh, also love the videos K-wiss
Why ask people about Hwoarang if your response is only to belittle and mock the players in the vid/comments? It's weird telling people that anyone can find anything frustrating.. but then being a hypocrite when you find out what they don't like... I get that it's skill gap but the same argument can be applied to you when you and what you find annoying. Honestly, all the characters are annoying low key and usually what people hate is relative to their style and ability to adjust
"The same argument can be applied to you and what you find annoying". Well, no because I go ahead and learn what I have to do and I don't bother strangers with my grievances. Which again if people don't want to go ahead and learn that's fine because it's time consuming, this is my job so I have to. But other people's skill issues are not my problem and that's the whole point lol. I find it weird that you think it's okay that people can say whatever they want to me but me making jokes about what others are saying publicly is where you draw the line
@@K-Wiss Look man, I respect you and will continue to watch your vids regardless, I just don't think it's fair to pull the "skill issue" card over "annoying", and likewise you have to apply the "skill issue" card to what annoys you. Ppl just hate certain characters but everyone has to keep the same energy.
Honestly a toxic trait of the community is us telling each other we suck because we don't like something. I feel like what's annoying and what's "op" are diff topics.
I do agree that Hwoarang is a noob smasher, but I do think he's genuinely an obnoxious design. He's not even that strong but somethings inherently annoying about a cocky ginger kicking you constantly LOL
Anyways it's all good man.
@@K-Wiss also thanks for the reply
@@Sloppyjoey1 "You have to apply the skill issue card to what annoys you". But I don't because I'm not refusing to learn how to deal with characters and then crying about it. I can break down in very fine detail as to why something is OP or what makes something frustrating to deal with. But even if I couldn't do that I'm not going out of my way to cry to others and that is simply my point. The character is hard to deal with but I had people crying "delete Hwoarang" because of a high high string. THAT is the definition of a skill issue. Also when did I say he's not hard to deal with/annoying to deal with? That's not the point at all
Did we watch the same video? At no point did he belittle anyone.
Imaging trying to play 2D with a linear character that’s very plus up close
"How do you know the jab is a high?" Because it's a fucking jab, and there are no mid jabs. Oh boy, this video's going to be something.
0:27 - 0:56 🤣
High, high string that doesn't jail =DELETE THIS UNBEATABLE CANCER! Ooookay, then.
I swear the disdain and vitriol Hwoarang seems to inspire in people goes back way further than Tekken 7, and given that Hwoarang has never been the best character in any game, I don't get why. There are plenty of other characters who've been around for a while that are annoying and have also nearly always been *better* than Hwoarang, like Jin, Bryan, Kazuya, Xiaoyu, Nina, Steve, King, Law, Devil Jin, etc., yet none of them get the same kind of heat Hwoarang does.
I think it's mostly because they see him throwing out 50 kicks in a row and take a bunch of damage and just say "oh he's mashing." He's usually not, and his execution requirements are quite high, but that's what it looks like to a lot of non Hwo players.
Compared to most of the cast, matchup knowledge is more important for beating him as well. As a stance character, he focuses less on fundamental offense and defense like for example Kazuya would, and more on his own unique tools for those things. So you really can't figure him out just by fighting him a couple times. Pair that with how he's a noob destroyer who appears to be mindlessly mashing, and the hate starts to make sense even if it's not justified.
there is 10x more annoying characters to learn or play against people are just copeing (zafina, lili ,ling, bears)
Hay Mr. Kwiss, fujin ranked player here. The best way to beat Hwoarang is to step left space him out, and make good reads on his highs also punish his amor moves but duck underneath back lash. Also, you can use down one to stop his blind. Can anyone give me more advice aside from punishing his negative moves. What I said works well but I can't seem to find a way to shut Hwoarang completely down.
Im a surface level tekken player for a long time. And if theres anything I've learned from playing the game is that it gets very easy to get frustrated dealing with characters like hwo. That frustration tends to get out from most people destructively rather than constructively. I haven't personally looked for too many answers to deal with Hwo, since im just a blue rank but I'd imagine its a long list of things to learn. And then its gonna be even harder to put into action unless you have a friend that plays the character. Knowing is one thing but taking advantage is another. I think that barrier is just exacerbated with Hwo. Everyone has been through the scrub grinder its just this is a REALLY hard fighting game. Even if he isn't the strongest at a high level it still takes a high barrier of time. Creates a large amount of communal frustration. Thats outside looking in though.
If I had to choose between fighting Lili or Tekken god Hwoarang, I'd rather fight Hwoarang everytime. I fought so many Hwoarang's I know the matchup and I'm not afraid.
hwoarangs design is wack with infinite mashing, carries trash players and takes an unreasonable amount learning to counter him.
And here you are making the *choice* to cry instead of learning
There is a new onslaught of hwoarang players who are trash that quit once you use actual movement, but yeah all characters needs to be labbed but hwoarang is at the tippy top of needing to lab
It’s really hard to get away with mashing as Hwoarang past red/purple rank I feel like hwo haters are a loud minority
Next time just say you're sorry af because you're don't know how to duck or block
@@K-Wiss i just answered your question, so instead of replying with an immature comment you should thank me for enlighten you with knowledge
What I understand the least is that Hwo haters are in the comment section of Hwo mains saying how Hwo is annoying. Like if you don’t have the time to learn the character, then why do you magically have to time to complain?
In denial about the trash game design that hwoarang is, character doesn't magically become less flowcharty at high ranks and high level whoreang tekken is evidence of that.
Smoothest hwoarang ever much love and keep up with the content🙏 don’t let these clowns discredit you over a skill issue
His gambling Ki charge during heat 💀💀💀💀. LET'S GO GAMBLING
Hwo used to piss me off in T7, cause I didnt know the MU. Against a rly good Hwo, I still dont, but I labbed his d3,4 options and his most common strings and set ups which took me maybe half an hour. Since then I never had problems with 90% of all Hworangs I faced and I actually enjoy the MU.
A little labbing will set u up against the vast majority of Hwos, cause the vast majority of Hwos just abuses his very basic anti noob stuff. They all get smoked once they reach a higher level where the opponent knows the MU. And thats where most Hwos give up, cause it takes deeper knowledge about the character of what to use when..and the ability to adapt to mind games.
In about 4000 hours of tekken Ive enjountered not even a handful of actually good Hwos (dispite Hwo being so common). So if u just lab his most common stuff for a little, u wont be struggling against this character unless u face actual Hwo mains, which are suuuuper rare.
Those guys need to try to learn Hwoarang. See how far they can go with him. He's hard to master. People just love to complain without trying to learn first.
It’s because hworang can feel very overwhelming mentally and it can feel like he’s unbeatable which he isn’t he has his weaknesses it’s just like raven he’s low tier but he starts doing his clone shit it just feels like he’s broke but he’s not it’s just a lot going on and the mind gets clouded
my favourite part of this vid, is the first 4 minutes where the lee is consistently blocking your low mixups and punishing them as you explain why hwoarang is far from the worst offender of some of this absolute bs that tekken 8 has atm.
The reason why Hwo is extremely obnoxious to so many is because he is a pain to lab. He has an insanely large moveset and most of his moves look the same. They look like the same kicks over and over again which doesn't only make them difficult to differentiate but also boring as shit to lab. He also has 3 different "stances" that make it very hard to identify what moves may come next. He also switches between these stances a shit load of time and it feels as if it happens at random. Also, there is very little information online on how to counter the most problematic aspects of Hwo's gameplay. Add to that the fact that he is one of the most played characters in the game right now and there you go. I'm a beginner who just recently reached Tekken God and I can definitely say that there hasn't been a single character I had to lab more often than Hwo. You lab him 20 times and still have games where you feel like you haven't improved even a bit in this matchup. Only NOW I finally feel like I'm at a point where I know enough of his sidesteppable moves, Minus frame moves, Gameplan etc. to deal decently with him. Players at the highest rank however don't have that excuse. It takes real skill to reach the summit with Hwo as much as with any other character.
And just to clarify I don't mean to say that the people who complain are right, just that I can understand the frustration. As annoying as it may be for many, you won't get better if you don't lab matchups. However, you can find a lot of fun in it, and there is nothing better than learning how to counter certain moves and then getting a launch out of it once you apply it in a real match.
Thank you for speaking out without malice, too K-Wiss. You're right, most of us simply haven't played enough to know everything that's going on, and rightfully so it can be extremely frustrating, but people are just ignorant to what they are seeing and refuse to accept that they don't want to learn.
With that said, learning is frustrating in this game.
I'm that person; I'm still learnin' and I'm absolutely horrible at this game still. There's character I have horrible times again, as a Jun player. I even get that "You play X Character so you can't feel y or z".
I just come to accept some characters are gonna test me- I win, I win. I lose, I lose.
Hworang is one of my favorite match ups personally. He has been around since tekken 3 and is super familiar. I've never mained him just always lab him in each game to learn his frames the best I can. Ppl that complain don't understand he is a specialist character that you can't just pick up like Victor for example. In the right hands sure he can be oppressive but in 8 most of the cast can be lol. Drag, Feng, Nina, Yoshi are the problem right now
I would have expected hwo to be less hated in t8. I hated him in t7 because his offense was so much to deal with, but that's kind of the default now, so he stands out less imo.
You bear the collective sin of every hwoarang
Idk how people tolerate fighting games not knowing the basics of each matchup. Yeah in the first month you won't know every character in this game, but it's been a year since the beta.
I was just accused of cheating and playing with auto duck in my comments and being abussed for using using hwoarang at emperor level and the funny thing is I didn't even play the game on that day😂.
Maybe from now just ignore the haters after this cuz u dont need to take stress from the them,unless they become an actual problem(kinda like how darkviperau is rn)
0 seconds in already a banger ❤
Me personally, I prayed that *every* hwoarang player that crushed my jab with a DF2 in T7 got locked in a dark, windowless, room with legos scattered on the floor. Simultaneously, In the same game, K-wiss was my 4th favorite PRO to watch. At lower lvls hwoarang just presses some people and then they carry that hate in their soul with them like its a fuckin Dybbuk, lmao.
I may have contributed to this problem, i’m not even a hwoarang main, i just play him to relieve the stress from grinding rank on my main…
People are actually adding me on steam just to send me death threats 😅
and you deserve it
@@danisflying if you're dying to d3,4 then maybe just uninstall the game my guy. 🤐
Imagine if they give him guard break and power ups too. 🤣
It is a skill issue, but at the same time if the majority of the player base cannot deal with his offence then as a result its a carry character...Hence why you will see a ton of hwo destructions and supremes who would only be blue rank if they were playing leo for example.
Because he is insufferable when you don’t have solid defense or knowledge of the matchup. Now that I’m better at the game I don’t mind fighting him, but I still get a nasty taste in my mouth from how often I had to deal with constantly plus frames and mashing when no other character left me feeling overwhelmed. I enjoyed fighting Drag in the lower ranks more than fighting Hwo and drag is the best character in the game.
The best part of Tekken 8 is everyone is viable, There's not some super astronomical leap the subject experts have to take their main to the higest levels of play. If you look up any character in this game there's probs a youtube channel with a G.O.D. level player that's just clipping people with sick combos, sidesteps, and comebacks. There are characters where their gameplan is much easier to access and that feels frustrating but on a rewatch there are def solutions to their BS. In that clip with Brian, he just had to use one armor get off me tool and he would have had space. He froze and tried to jab out which HW is plus so you can't do. I'm blue rank and I can see that. There have always been people that hate whatever iteration of Tekken is out but T8 is no way the worst Tekken.
It was me. I'm the hwoarang main they warned you about.
I think Hwo is a balanced character however he can be extremely frustrating to fight because his frames are so quick and he can be misleading on whats punishable and whats not but yah Hi K-Wiss love the content
I guess people just don’t want to lab hworang or something.
Pro's are a bit out of touch on Hwoarang imo. Annoying =/= OP... Getting kicked by a loud, cocky ginger is actually quite annoying, but more seriously, people hate anything where you have to adjust your play style and know more about them than they need to know about you. This is why no one finds Paul annoying, he doesn't have a million stances, moves, good reach etc and arguably still far less annoying than Eddy/Hwoa. Eddy and Hwoarang fall under "annoying" because they knowledge check you but in a flamboyant way.
"No one finds Paul annoying" is very funny
@@K-Wiss now you're mocking people for what they think is annoying? Didn't you just rant about this? A little objectivity goes a long way man.
@@Sloppyjoey1 Well it's funny because Paul has one of the most ridiculous moves in the game right now with f2 as an i13 heat engager with the same whiff recovery as a jab that is a legitimate problem in the game. Not to mention 50/50 of deathfist launch and -12 heat smash while in heat. See how I explain the opinion?
@@Sloppyjoey1Huh? Where did K wiss mock players for finding characters annoying? Are you just making stuff up out of thin air?
Yeah honestly K those characters you mentioned in the tournament are probably the most annoying ones I hate going against with my Jack8 lol especially Draganov and Law(il add Jin and lidia in there aswell) 😂
I wanna say this, as someone new to tekken(i picked up 7 about 4 months before 8 dropped) i labbed hwao like crazy cause my troupe in fighting games are characters who uses there legs that hwao isnt even as crazy as yall make him out to be imo hes the most well rounded,amazing pressure great buttons i genuinely think ppl that lose to hwao and throw a tantrum over him lack the ability to adapt ive done mirror matches and everyone does the same thing i do my own thing and it catches ppl off guard if you hate playing against a character much learn what can kill them like we are in a world where we'd rather bitch about a high mid tier character than someone who can evade almost all options because he stance puts her all most on the ground and ducks lows 😂😂😂😂
You can explain this 1000x times K-Wiss they wouldnt understand shit at all, all they do is complain and dont learn the game.. Thats how it is .. hwoarang is just a scrub killer character ngl. Keep up the good work , ur legend.
It’s overall skill issues for the people that can’t handle or even lab Hworang. 😅
Guys, the hwoarang player is talking again...
Personally, I hate fighting Hwoarang, because I am lacking knowledge about the character. I get mad and say “This character is TRAAASH!!”, but I know it’s just cause I didn’t punish properly. I didn’t sidestep. I pressed on disadvantage. And I hate to admit I’m wrong, but I have to, because I screwed up, and I need to learn. It’s why I’m only recently Fujin with Lars after playing from launch. I’m bad, but at least I know that.
I mean I understand the frustration with Hwoarang. I've been a Hwoarang hater since Tekken 6 because that's when I really started playing Tekken, Eddy is a nightmare for me too. I seriously don't like Kazuya though... But in all honesty, my biggest frustration lies with Tekken 8 as a whole. I don't like the Heat system at all. I don't like the guard breaking moves and the overall encouragement and rewarding of the aggressive playstyle... when I play- or should I say, TRY to play defensive, I get absolutely chipped. Not only that you can get to rage art health and heal up a bunch during certain scenarios... it's just not that fun for me. It's a shame because I really like Tekken...
I also tried to play Hwoarang, it's really not that easy, the only easy thing I can do is his armoured move and spam 4.
I also understand how this negativity towards you affects you and what you say because I feel like TMM is in the same boat in a way, 'cause it's like, you guys are insanely good at the game, and the tiniest complain makes everyone else mad because from their perspective, you're so good that they think you can't complain about anything since you "have it good" type thing... if any of that makes sense.
I think the Tekken players who go on Twitter might be cooked. They should've spent that time in the lab clearly.
It's kwiss's punishment, ducking of highs and sidestepping that make him good. He's using hwoarang so it's making hwoarang look much better than he is to be honest
i legit feel like i can't complain about crazy characters even back in t7 as a xiao player like, i can't complain about geese? y'all gotta deal with him too wtf 😭
omg yeah, i don't understand people that hate the content but are constantly coming back xD like the hwo haters on your content and just, any comment being thrown at Phi 😭
Bro I've seen hwo mains that are like 40 on defense while GoD rank. That's not only a rant, this is a based complain from the community.
Because movement is good, dont have an issue with hwo.
Ill be honest
King, hwoarang and nina . Feel no matter who wrong or weak they are . People just dont wanna deal with them
I fucking DESPISE hwoarang. But that doesn’t stop me from respecting people who are good with him. He’s annoying to fight against for sure for a majority of people, but he’s actually really fun to watch.
my head hurt after watching this. not your fault Kwiss. these Hwo haters are a different breed.
Lol Hwaorang is the reason i play tekken 😂😅 Went over my friends house both new 2 tekken his char was hwaorang i got whooped so bad i decided to learn the game to beat him next time... been here ever since 😅😅 Now that i know the game i realise it was a hopeless scenario for me 🤣😂
Hworang is considered annoying by people because he is far easier to play than to counter, its really just that simple
At any level besides the very top, you can get away with running your endless 50/50 knowledge checks, and you'll get a decent amount of success. I say this as someone who learned Hwo to play him, anyone who says "its just a skill issue, learn the match" while technically correct, seem to forget how much you need to learn to face him, and since he isn't the most common, you can only learn him by labbing.
Consider Reina for instance, she has a sizeable movelist, and a bunch of stances, and people complained about having to learn her matchup, and I'd argue she's less bad because you don't even need to learn as many moves to defend against her
man i just hit tekken king with hwoarang and mfs on socials be talking down on me cause i play hwoarang 😭
and i be doubling down, like yes bro i’m a masher, im a spammer, LEARN THE MATCH UP ! 😭
Whoreang monkey
You sometimes just can't get through some thick-sculled comments about character from people who can't open training mode for 1 second to look at hit properties
Blame this on BTS_J1N and speed kicks
But no really haorang is literally just "fundamentals check the character".
Do you know how to duck? Do you know how to punish? Do you know how to duck?!?!
Ah yes, ducking is somehow the solution as if mid options don't exist. Dumbfuck argument
Hworang and yoshi play a different game from everyone else
From watching you I always get the feeling that Hwo is quite weak especially compared to T7. His poking ability is just not very good in this game, his attacks seem easier to read and generally speaking it feels like you always start off on the back-foot. However he is very noob "unfriendly", like if you don't understand some Tekken fundamentals nor do you take time to learn the match up, he'll feel just as frustrating as going against Xiaoyu
I play Hwoarang
I have my steam profile open on purpose
I receive hate comments twice an hour
Those are my trophies
If the next DLC character is Baek I’m gonna laugh my aese off 🌚
9:55 NAHHH lmao your comment earlier in the vid explaining how normal people wouldn't care if you're good or not refutes this because as soon as your main is on your page, some mf will say something dumb. I like Feng so if I say ANYTING its "WELL FENG IS BUSTED SO STFU"
Even your man Joka can't even give his opinion without every other fanbase trying to kill his points lol
But K-wiss, why go into a replay to learn the matchup when I can just go on Twitter and make an entire thread to complain about the character in as much time?
It's definitely, bts jin, and basuka terrorizing people with Hwo it's quality content
hworang just do alot of us noobs dirty is all and people like to cry
I wonder if Yeonarang and rest get the same comments in their videos lol
Just seeing Hwoarang in the versus screen is enough to make me mad. Nobody is made at you specifically, as you said in the videos, we are not pros. Maybe Hwoarang is not braindead at your level but for 90% of players, he is. We have no cule of what he is doing and it can be so intimidating. I’ve recently decided to one and done and block all Hwoarang players. And before you ask, yes i hate Hwoarang but i still watch your channel, you are good at the game and you say funny sometimes and i love watching Tekken
Thank you for reading my comment on the video
Yes, it's ok to not be good at the game, i agree
But come on, some people are just tired from their routines and wanna play some games and a hworang player shows up doing that it will piss them off and make them rage against any hworang player it doesn't matter where
The hworang player might be having fun but not his opponent
So yes, that video will piss a lot of people
Also, some would think "f it I will be the one playing this character" but they see almost 200 moves and move on to paul or law not even a joke or ed and they just spam 3 or 4
"Make them rage against any Hwoarang player it doesn't matter where". Do you not realise how ridiculous that sounds? Because you don't know a match up you're just gonna get angry at anyone that plays that character? Your skill issue is not my problem lmao
@K-Wiss i know, and sorry if i sounded angry against you
But people are unpredictable
I made a joke bc i struggle with the character, and i really can't play him too, because it's too much stuff to remember
@@LeDanc “the hwoarang player might be having fun but not his opponent” that’s not any hwoarang players problem, learn the match up and stop whining about who YOU specially can and can’t beat and im not trying to be rude I just find your reasoning extremely lame man lol.
K-wiss, can you still believe they still together after all that shit??
i think people have hwoarang issues cus as a new player him and eddy are so hard to deal with and you just keep that opinion forever
Ngl i hate every character i lose too😂😂😂
But i dont invalidate others opinions because they use the character i lose too.
Crying as much as them bro. If you click bait a title, why are you surprised that people leave comments like that. Like, we are in an alternate dimension bruv?
The hate just never stops
Even if we the titles were JUST clickbait it's still ridiculous to act like I can't have an opinion because of the character I play, a character that is also literally weaker than the characters featured in the content: Law, Shaheen, Lili (probably not Hei but he's new so we don't know yet.) But even still it's not just clickbait, the NOT OKAY videos are a series recognisable on the channel by returning viewers and even if one was "click baited" for the first time there's an intro explaining all in the first 40 seconds of the video. And characters like Lili and Shaheen are frustrating to deal with, I fail to see the "click bait"
@K-Wiss You absolutely can have an opinion on anything you want. What I'm saying is that it's not going to stop them from leaving comments like that. I referred to the "Not Okay" as click bait because imo, it's going to grab the attention of both extreme views toward the character. For the people that agree with you, you get some validation and everything is Gucci. On the other hand, the people who don't agree with you are going to lash out in any way they can, i.e hating on Hwo, and that is going to happen even if your take is as level headed as possible. Growing pains from being a content creator is that you're just not going to be able to please everyone. Imo, when you highlight the haters it just emboldens them. They aren't trying to learn or get better they just want a reaction, dont give it to them.
Play against hwoarang enough and you'll be good...play against alisa enough she'll still piss you off...hwoarang can be annoying initially (both to play and to fight against) you get better the more you do it
Damn, Hwo mains really getting treated like second class tekken players. The fact that you guys cannot express your negative opinion on a character, without get flamed by other people because of the character you play is sad (but lowkey deserved).