How To Degree a Camshaft
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- Опубліковано 15 жов 2024
- Check out Kalvinator Engines: www.kalvinatore...
If you're building a performance engine, degreeing the camshaft is a must. As shown in the video, you need to verify the grind of the cam. If you don't, and there's a problem with performance later, you have only yourself to blame.
More info from Comp Cams found here: www.compcams.com
Thanks to Kevin Frische for his help in this video.
Previous video in the series: • Engine Assembly Cranks...
The #FairmontProject playlist: • ETCG Gets a New Car! -...
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Camera: Brian Kast
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Tools
Degree Wheel: www.compperform...
Degree kits: www.compperform...
Camshaft dial indicator: www.speedwaymot...
Piston stop tool: www.summitraci...
Related videos
Engine dissection: • Dissecting an Engine, ...
The #FairmontProject series: • ETCG Gets a New Car! -...
#DarkMatterPikachu on the Dyno: • The #FairmontProject E...
Engine Balancing Video: • How To Balance an Engi...
Engine Details
Displacement: 363cid
The Block: www.pbm-erson.c...
The Crank: www.pbm-erson.c...
The Heads: performancepar...
Compression: 8.9:1
The Cam: Comp Cams custom grind: 222@.050" 222@.050 .357"lobe lift .571" valve lift (1.6 rocker) .351" lobe lift .562" valve lift (1.6 rocker) 114º separation 4ºadvance
Modified: Edelbrock Performer RPM intake
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Due to factors beyond the control of EricTheCarGuy, it cannot guarantee against unauthorized modifications of this information, or improper use of this information. EricTheCarGuy assumes no liability for property damage or injury incurred as a result of any of the information contained in this video. EricTheCarGuy recommends safe practices when working with power tools, automotive lifts, lifting tools, jack stands, electrical equipment, blunt instruments, chemicals, lubricants, or any other tools or equipment seen or implied in this video. Due to factors beyond the control of EricTheCarGuy, no information contained in this video shall create any express or implied warranty or guarantee of any particular result. Any injury, damage or loss that may result from improper use of these tools, equipment, or the information contained in this video is the sole responsibility of the user and not EricTheCarGuy.
Watching Speed and spike TV when I was younger I always wished that there would be shows exactly like this. It's all the monotonous processes that I appreciate seeing.
Me too. Thanks for the comment.
Yanku Marrah same here. that is why I no longer watch this shows because this is what I really want to see.
+
I agree. A lot of those shows were fun to watch, but they're pretty much 30 minute long commercials for the new stuff coming into the market. This video offers real useful information. I think I need to subscribe :)
Hey Eric, I'm traveling to Canada for an engine build… Will I need a degree wheel graduated in Celsius instead of Fahrenheit? :) Thanks!
First time building my ls2 and was completely stumped and the cam spec sheet was confusing as hell. Found this video after an hour of trying... this video was super easy to understand and got it timed perfectly to spec the first try. Great video!
best engine series on the interwebs! epic channel.
Thanks!
It really is, I'm loving it.
Eric and Brian, you've done it yet again! Didn't realize just how critical that dialing in the cam timing was, but you certainly brought that home. Brian, your camera work is absolutely smooth and professional, and really illustrates the procedures - Thanks!
I understand that the igniting of the fuel is suppose to happen before top dead center, not after, which is correct. From research, knocking has been known to come from the free play of rod caps alone. So 11.45 degrees before top dead center there should be a spark for the timing of the piston to come around. By the time the piston reach the top, the mixture will be set on fire and the next cycle will begin. One great thing is the constant motion of a crankshaft can never be reversed due to the compressing of air. More air in the chamber at one whole time, results in more power. So really I'd say 14.7 is incorrect for Air- fuel ratio and more like 16.1 is best, well 16.0 rounded. Will continue writing. You're great help man.
Had to take a year break for a myriad of reasons, but finally put on my new Mechanix gloves that had been sitting dormant since arrival and ripped the intake off my Celica head. Something very reassuring about once again being in unknown territory where I know I just need to head to Eric's channel and start watching videos again. Never removed a camshaft before but know everything outside the engine like the back of my hand already thanks solely to Eric, so excited to finally become that confident about the engine itself. Got a friend who is already an expert to make sure I don't fuck it up with something so integral, but intend to fully understand everything I am doing so that it becomes a part of my knowledge base once the job is done.
Thanks Eric, from me and my 91 Celica.
Comp doesn't only do custom cam grinds, they also have a massive variety of off-the-shelf cams for just about every V8 engine you can think of. Anything from low end, torquey cams for trucks, too well rounded cams that work well throughout the entire rpm range, too cams that like to scream to make big power, and everything in between.
Camera-man Brian is doing great work, really smooth, seamless and consistent!
I really enjoying watching, great build! And love your childish moments, you really are happy, and you should be :)
Your the first to explain why the zeroing of the cam wheel is affected by the tdc dwell. While this seems obvious it was the missing link for me. I kind of figure if you can learn even one thing in a video it's a great thing. Thanks.
How anyone ever learns this stuff is beyond me. I'm totally impressed. Great work, boys.
so there i was in the garage looking at the ford 400 motor i have laying in the garage for my78 f250 and thinking about doing a mild build on it and thought i heard about that camshaft degree jiberish wish i knew how to do that and then i said i bet you i know where to find a video on that i watched 90 percent of the faimont videos must have missed this one but now it made understanding the process so much easier i thank you for all the great videos that have helped and i think we can both thank davidsfarm ive learned a lot of tricks and i believe you once said it was the reason you started this channel to begin with again thank you alot
Feel like I'm standing in my grandpas shop as a kid listening to him and my uncle talk. This content is gold
Good stuff! I haven't had to degree a camshaft since Hot Rod U very interesting content!
Me Frische is giving us a lot of knowledge and for that I am thankful. Thank you!
The only more detailed engine video series I know is Jafromobile and his 4G63, but he never turns the jargon down to where normal people can understand
i was just about to add that 2 years too late but im glad jafro was mentioned
This was great to actually see first hand what one need to do when the numbers do not match the cam card, thank you!
Your channel has realism and good knowledge. you're great at what you do Eric!
Thanks Eric, Kevin, Bryan, and the Kalvinator Engine Family. Remarkable progress so far. TTFN.
FINALLY AN ANSWER TO THE QUESTION I'VE BEEN ASKING SINCE I FIRST WATCHED HOTROD TV! Why do you have to degree a cam shaft if it's got a set position for the cam gear? You don't. It's just to check that it's keyed correctly.
And if not, what (if any) adjustment you can make to correct the issue.
Larry Bolan
Yeah I tried to edit my comment but it wouldn't let me for some reason. I meant to add "you don't need to in a factory application where you're using pattern parts." You can take the cam out of one 420A engine and slip it right into another 420A engine and not have to worry about it for example.
Eric, Thank you for uploading these videos. You have literally saved my family and myself THOUSANDS of dollars!!
Suggestion: Maybe you could add some how to's on cars like Lexus, Mercedes, BMW. I own an old 2000 Lexus Es300 and the videos that I have found are of little detail or simply the wrong setup.
Again I love the channel and CAN'T WAIT UNTIL THE FAIRMONT IS DONE!!!
Awesome video. Its not as complicated as some may believe. Follow his step by step explanation and you may be pleasantly surprised. Its a necessary step in building and engine. As opposed to just assembling a bunch of parts. 🤙🏻🤙🏻
This was an excellent demonstration on how to degree a camdhaft....great work guys !
5:55 - I was watching a different video where the instructor made a good point. You don't want to check the average point/ dwell point of a cam lobe the same way you do the piston dwell because often the cam lob ramps up or down differently. So to get the most accurate reading of the cam lobe dwell only check 20 thousands both ways to find the true peak lift point of a cam.
This point seemed very logical to me. Especially when you can clearly see just with the eye, cam lobes are not perfectly center.
Engine building is a black art. So many rituals and invocations.
Everything is a ritual and invocation, even the words you speak. Why do you think they called it SPELLing
@ChrisHallett83 Science is never settled. Engine building is.
Eric: "Isn't that how we learn though? You don't forget when it's the hard way".
Brilliant! Absolutely true!
Later in life people look at you and think you never make mistakes. Well ya did once upon a time!
Great explanations and first hand visual!!! Kevin, out of all the camshafts you have degreed in your profession, on an average, how many cams DID NOT match the cam card numbers? Thanks...
I have built plenty of motors and dont see the this as being critical unless you have an after market cam sprocket that isnt marked. I guess its possible for the pin to be out of place slightly but i would have a serious doubt that the cam would be far enough off to move it an entire tooth so you are really i guess checking if its a cam worth keeping or returning. Personally i would put some faith in todays technology to produce more accurate cams than they use to when timing a cam was more important.
Great vid series and great info. I had no idea about some of these build specs and how they are checked. But dang, waiting for that Dyno footage!! Didnt think it was gonna take this long to see it especially since you had it done in May (right?).
The car is far from done. This was just the engine build series. It fires up on the dyno tomorrow.
EricTheCarGuy ok...thats what i have been waiting for since the teaser vid from 6 months ago. I realize there is lots involved. Most dont show to the extent you have. Tom Petty says that "the waiting is the hardest part".
The suspense is killing me!! Can't wait to hear it run. I know I won't be disappointed.. Good video Eric
ua-cam.com/video/UADOHm6-BJc/v-deo.html
EricTheCarGuy Eric.... Come on now, not your average subscriber here.. Lol, their isn't a video from you that I haven't seen.. But I wasn't clear on what I meant, sorry about that. Lol.. I can't wait to see the Ford going down the road... In one pice.. Lol thanks Eric!!! Can't wait buddy!!
correct me if I am wrong, i've always been told that the cam card shows the suggested values for maximum clearance for the valves, and during tuning, they will need to be slightly adjusted to move the power band.
Loving this build and loving all the details being shown ! Absolutely fascinating 👍
The lobe probably looks larger than advertized because the diameter of the tool tip is larger than a standard roller lifter. So it starts riding up the ramp a lil early and closes a lil late, but the centerline doesn't care because it's at peak lift.
This series for #DarkMatterPikachu should go down as probably the most comprehensive record of a single engine build on YT. I'm so glad to have followed along the whole way. I know wayyy much more now than I did before watching this, and I have even more appreciation for proper machine/speed shops than I already did. Thanks a ton for your hard work and money (well-spent), Eric, as well as Kevin for taking the time out of his day to explain everything. I imagine he could've done the build twice as fast if Eric wasn't there :P
You just destroyed a 1000 hater comments about oil pans and other BS. For that, I am grateful. Brian, Kevin, Justin and I have worked very hard putting this series together. It's so nice when that work is appreciated. Thank you very much.
very well explained. your explanation was better that all i have heard.
How does the timing change when he switched key holes on the crank gear but didn't actually change position of the crank or cam itself? Or was that not shown
Amazing tutorial. Really loving your videos. They've really helped me with building my engine.
Best job of cam shaft degreeing I have ever seen Good job men
Good to see a true pro at work.
Awesome to see this process explained. :)
being diy mostly 4cyl ive never seen multiple settings on the crank key.
now i come to know there are tone of things when you plan to go fast.
thank you very much eric. so much of sharing to your viewers.
That is exactly what I was trying to convey with the #FairmontProject. Thanks for your comment.
i enjoy your channel very much. lot of fun, hope you shine very bright in future. thank you for your time to reply.
Great show. Where can I get the camshaft lobe tool your guest used to measure the lift of the camshaft?
This might be a dumb question...so Eric bought an engine and had it shipped to this company who built it and set it up. Is that the process? If so, how long does it take a shop to do this (seems like a LONG process) and also, how much would something like this cost?
dam still confused on how to degree a camshaft
Watch the video 30 times
Hello Eric, I'm depsperately in need of some tech help. I installed a Pontiac 350 from 1970 with #76 casting heads from a 1965 389/421 GTO and a near duplicate of the 068 HO camshaft. After breaking in the cam I realized that the exhaust port of cylinder #1 didn't change it's color. I pulled the spark plug wire and the engine did not response at all. Since then I've been searching for the reason why #1 isn't firing. I checked compression, wiring, spark plug, distributor and all seams fine to me. I even changed the spark plug. The engine runs at 30° advanced ignition timing at idle speed (650) without vacuum line hooked.
How important is it to degree in a cam? Can a "undegreed" cam cause the problem? In my opinion it's a timing problem, isn't it?
Greetings from Germany and thank you for your help.
Great video Eric. Is this the same for LS engines? I'm looking to get a bigger camshaft for my Lq9.
I dont understand how moving the crank sprocket changes the timing if the crank and cam are in the same position
If you didn’t have the keyway in the crank gear, couldn’t you just time it 2 degrees advanced using a torque angle gauge or something similar to measure the movement after TDC?
Hello Eric, it seems that when Kevin repositioned the crank sprocket that he only rotated it an nothing else (Cam sprocket, crank shaft, etc). Is that the only adjustment needed when you need to change the timing? I am working on a 5.3L LM7 with a Comp Cam and Comp double roller timing gear set and want to make sure that I get this right. Thanks in advanced.
Ok now I want to go build an engine with Master Yoda...and of course you too Eric :D Such a good series, even though I've never turned a wrench on an engine I've learned a lot and thinkin' about buildin' one just because.
Keith Brettell. .:vv.
Keith Brettell
Thanks for pointing out the back lash.
I first thought it said "How to degrease a camshaft" and started wondering how they could spend almost 15 minutes on degreasing the camshaft :-D
That would have been a show like no other! :-)
Nice job Kevin. Thanks ETCG.
Best cam video out there. Machining is about tolerances, not perfection. So... suppose all errors stacked up together towards advance or retard on work being plus or minus a half degree on a cam where lobes got profiles perfectly ground? Crank key + broaching of crank sprocket + dowel pin on cam + dowel pin hole on cam sprocket + sprocket teeth [crank vs. cam] = 2 1/2 degrees error. Nobody did bad work, but things just sometimes add up.
All I understand here is how to degree a crankshaft and I think it's more accurate to use dial gauge than piston stopper together with degree wheel to find the true tdc.
Amazing professional scientific but this video for advance people we need video for beginners with more detailes. Step by step. Best regards,
Question. I think I know the answer for this but I'm still curious. Could you not compensate for those degrees when you're doing the distributor timing or is this just so much more precise?
Kinda makes me wish I would have sprung for the double roller timing set with adjustable crank sprocket. I didn't think on it since I was going at the time with a late model stock engine but now im doing a short block build with a crane roller cam.
Thanks for a GREAT video and explaining the what's and why's of cam timing and why you degree your cam. I just spent 3 days trying to get mine degreed in correctly. I kept having issues with my readings. Finally figured out a good place to setup my dial indicator. This is my first performance engine build so I am really trying to pay attention to everything I do as I assemble the engine.
Love the "Your Bottom is farther out, than your Top" comment! Perfect Timing!!! ;)
Thanks for the video. I need to watch it a few more times to understand it all
are you able to degree a cam while the engine is still in the engine bay? (sohc)
great build and effort. If we could just delete the slaughter and butchery of the oil pan video this shop would be blemish free.
I could not disagree with you more. The pan is fine, the return is fine, it doesn't leak. Give it up.
foxdmulder ok Mr perfect, shit happens when you're in the heat of the build
Its an oil pan. The only reason people bitched so much is because that was the only part of the build they could actually wrap their heads around. Justin might of rushed through it a little haphazardly but would taking another hour to work on that pan made any difference in power output? No, it's superficial, and it works.
Way better than my video on the subject.
Do you have to degree the cam when replacing a cam and lifters and timing chain? Can you pull it TBC and put it back TBC?
Thanks guys. Starting to remember.
I have a 99 Mitsubishi gs spyder ,
The soft top and the skeleton and motors are just damaged and just needs to be replace . I read and heard that some places charge 1G! To replace just the soft top !!!
I know how to work on cars basic and some advance stuff but I never did a soft top job . If u can get a 2g eclipse and do a whole replacement vid that be sweet!
In SoCal California JDM is becoming lifestyle so I won't be the only one looking for this
This is utterly amazing! I had no idea it was so detailed.
So. Your camshaft has graduated? ;)
Travis Piper fuck u
fuzzy wuzzy wow, what an intellectual response to a joke.
Rick B I think it’s too advanced for you
I like the bent wire bolted to the block as an indicator.. what was that lined up with on the engine?
It's not. You line the degree wheel up with the pointer. Doesn't really matter where it's placed to start with. That's what we were doing at the beginning of the video.
EricTheCarGuy did you guys have rings in the pistons when you degreed the cam? Is it advisable one way or the other?
Thank you! Great video BTW!
Kevin is a master. His kid could not do this.
Thanks, been looking for such a detailed instruction for a while. Really good video Guys, keep them coming.
Great. And now we need a second video on how to DIY :D
How does just moving the crank sprocket change the crank angle? Nothing moved?
Have watched several. But this was really informative thank you
It's impossible to get it right on spec with the spec sheet. I at least have never seen one fall exactly within specs on all categories, and I worked at a machine shop for several years, and built a many engines.
what block is this? i noticed you called cylinder # 2 if it were a gm. but you called it cylinder number one.
hey Eric do they have replacement blocks there for vintage cars? ...like the 50s GM?
Depends on the make and model. These days you can get just about anything.
isn't the whole point of getting this custom ground to enable you to use tighter tolerances? frankly I don't know much about grinding camshafts, but several degrees off just sounds like sloppy work to me
I have a question for you can you cut the airbox breath more air to save fuel is that a good idea?
No...haha
Where can I buy one of those valve spring compressor like the purple one in the back?
Does this only apply to symmetrical cam lobe design? Some more exotic type engines use asymmetric cam lobes and rotate the opposite way to the engine. ......potentially confusing? ??
You make great Videos !!
Greetings from Bavaria (Germany)
nice video Eric I have a question can you make a video using a sbc
4:00 The final check looks like 24 degrees. I am hoping it is the angle of the camera off to the right of center.
is it possible to degree a camshaft with the engine in the car?
If the radius of the indicator follow is just slightly larger than the radius of the cam follower that can be why there's a two degree difference.
No, but lifter bore clearance and lifter bore to cam geometry can introduce a discrepancy.
radbot1 exactly. That's why it's better to use the lifter you plan on using
Cam timing can also effect vacuum and engine temperatures…which is exactly what is happening to me, with my Oldsmobile 350
i'm still confused with the true TDC part. if you are using a piston stop that's about .200 in the hole, how is that TRUE TDC? I have a bottom end right now that is .005 in the hole at TDC... how does this equal true TDC just by hitting 23 degrees before and after TDC?
PANTYEATR1 you rotate until it stops, then rotate the other direction until it stops. Then you split the difference and that gives you true tdc.
So even if you know top dead center before and after installation, you need to degree the cam? Just confused on all this camshaft stuff
Theoretically, if the cam manufacturer had top knotch tollerances, you could just throw it in, set timing, and roll with it. But, mass production, poor machine calibrations result in off grinds.
Do you have to degree it ?
what is the procedure for advancing or retarding the gear is the cam timing is off. The cam gear dot points down, what do you do with the crank once you change the gear position?
That's an awesome dial indicator!!!
Comp Cams does have "off the shelf" grinds but for the same price you can get a custom grind.
I like when he's happy too, I happen to know what Mr. Frische looks like when he's angry... not a pretty sight... or feeling for that matter...
Nice video Eric is it the same whit OHC engines?
The principles are the same, but the actual procedure and fixturing/tooling is different.
How about a 4v? Building my cobra and I dont want to pay someone because I want to learn. But I have a clean used cam from a buddy out of a couple year older car with more duration but I dont have all the specs like provided on that comp cam paper how would I go about
Is degreeing necessary
learn a lot from this series. thx man!
Is there a way to degree a camshaft with the intake and heads on?
great video and analogy like he said! Thanks for sharing Eric!