I love watching like 3 or 4 back to back and seeing the differences in the tiers, but also hearing them say almost the same thing about them. Like they will say strong aoe weak st but brings good buff and is moderately tanky, then one person puts them in A and the other in D! Like WTF?! You just said the spec pumps AOE harder than anyone, and ST is only like 15% behind the class you put in S, so how the hell is that D?! tldr: the actual tiers are never the good part, the good part is the words, the insights, the knowledges. Also its fun when they waffle on where a spec should be after chat starts going in on em lol.
They should better complain of the dog shit play style instead of the damage, feel like they would be happy with only spamming a button if it was top dps. The eclipse system is unappealing and boring, casting two time the same spell opposite to your aoe or single damage rotation is just totally counter Intuitive as well as two time the same dot with the only difference being the color of the spell effect is urgh!!!
As a Ret Pally since Cata, I couldn’t agree more with that ranking. This is the okay-est we’ve been in a very long time. We’re not busted, but we’re also not insanely OP. Feels like we’re slightly better at single target than AOE, especially if you’re running Hammer of Light to absolutely zonk people. Overall, spec feels good, but it could definitely be better.
Boomkin stonks on the rise baby! Love to see it, might dust mine off. Been playing a ton of Demo lock, tried Aff tonight just for funsies and its strong! I like Demo more but can't deny Aff has more punch.
I had a lot of fun playing BM monk in season 4 of dragonflight. I was even able to get up to +10s on it which was fun because I didn't think I'd get a spec that hard to play that high that quickly. Playing it in TWW feels way worse to me. I leveled my monk from 70 to 76 as Brewmaster and I couldn't do any of the large pulls I do on the other tanks while leveling through dungeons and it genuinely felt like my stagger wasn't staggering anything at all. By the time I had like 20% stagger i was at like 15% hp. And since I wasn't staggering I couldn't get big Celestial Brews. I wasn't generating many healing spheres for expel harm despite doing the same stuff I was during season 4 of DF. I don't really understand what I'm doing wrong but BM monk went from super fun and a rewarding challenge to play to feeling genuinely useless and unplayable.
brew scales incredibly hard with gear, while your stats are tanking during leveling it feels very bad. WHen I hit 80 I had 55% stagger with shuffle up. Now at about 606 I'm at 66%. The way the class interacts with its primary stat as well as how vers and crit interact with its mitigation and self healing means it probably always going to have the biggest delta between the start and end of an expansion of any tank. That 11% more stagger made an insane difference and it will only get better with the remaining 30 ilvls this season. A good way to think about it is that if I go from stagger 55 to 66% damage I went from taking 45% to 34% damage which is an almost 25% reduction in the amount of damage going directly into my health bar. Its a crazy ass change into how the class feels. Stick with it mein freund.
@@PULAG Brother look how havoc plays lmao One of the longest openers in the game, a bunch of very short damage windows to line up and forced movement in a patch with no space to move Funny how BFA is gone for years at this point and people still think havoc is generator spender with eyebeam on cd Havoc, enhance, feral and sub are probably the most complex and hardest to play specs atm Mm still simple af though
Hunter not bringing anything? O.o The new trap AoE knockup/interrupt, 1 stun, 1 typhoon, an AoE stun on binding to let tank kite mobs, 1 purge for magic/enrage effects, freezing trap for annoying caster mobs (more situational) and tar tap. Well... I think there are really worse utility kits...
warrior is so unkillable and spell reflect is op. but honestly brew master feels insane. when you get high enough crit and take enough damage you can heal for so much
Feral is so slept on. Just straight wrong her my man. Their damage is more that good and their survivability is great, way better than boomie (survival instincts + free big heals constantly) and great interrupts
No one knows the kitty power and it's likely down to those who can't handle the puss. We as feral mains are banging atm. You are correct, this t list is garbo.
I played with a good Destro on a +8 Grim Batol and I was very surprised how much DPS it was doing even in Grim Batol which is a very small pull dungeon
I don't know how they can do a full talent rework for monks and still have Brewmaster feel like such shit. It just feels weak, there's nothing special that it does and there's nothing unique that it brings. Takes tons of damage, requires the most healing, doesn't do good dps, doesn't have unique utility. It's just sad that it feels like brewmaster gets less and less fun with every expansion
@dorki that doesnt help M+ Players… playing BM for 6 Years straight as a Main and its Like Never Top 2 Tanks. That just sucks, we are always at the lower end tuning wise I.0
Again, the comments shows how different a top player thinks and how the average player thinks. People here saying Hunter have good utility and thinking what they see on leaderboards or raiderio is the meta on week 2... They are comparing this tier list to people playing with no full gear and still not pushing the highest keys... Don't you guys understand that he is talking about beta level keys with full gear??? - also using y'all same logic, only couple of 13 have been timed this week, what do we see? Bear and vdh (vdh is a tier above with the right comp, which is the comp they arew running with), what else? We see frost dk, aug, mage and enh/ele sham. Where are the hunters? ... Got to take everything into consideration, how big a tank can pull? Can a unholy dk have consistants pulls to shine? Can a destro have consistants big pulls to shine? Do we have the correct dispells? can this or that spec survive this with ease or not? do we have range? what about the kicks and stops? All of this is important before going out there talking BS like you know better than top players. Rather have soothe from druid and not hunter, at least druid brings a good raid buff.
Just had to note that your boomkin experience was on the ptr?. I believe those buffs were already a part of what was available there? If so, they are still in a good spot imo. If not, they are going to be really strong after the buffs.
Thanks for sharing your opinion Dorki, loved watching that video! What Blizzard stil ldoesnt seem to understand is that low utility classes need a very decent throughput to even be considered as a choice in both M+ and Mythic Raiding. My assumption for the next m+ meta: Heal: Thats an easy one, Rsham it is. Skyfury, 12s interrupt, good utility, decent throughput. DPS: Frost and Aug set in stone indeed. I think DPS #3 is gonna be boomkin for that savage AoE and Motw. However I can see going for any of your S-Tier dps choices and picking motw through the tank slot, especially considering boomkin squishyness. These fuckers really hate using bear form. Tank: Wild take, but I think VDH still takes the win. Yeah, both guardian and prot are SUBSTANCIALLY tankier. But that magic damage buff is pretty much worth going for it with Frostdk+Owl. While VDH utility was harshly nerfed, its still superior to what other tanks bring to the table. Plus Frost features a ton of slow, which will help with vdhs suspectibility to melee hits.
No wonder my alts have felt so meh while leveling, my first class was Shaman and it was a ton of fun. On my alts i feel like i stand and hit a lot more
I've just picked up Brew and I see other people mentioning that Brew lacks anything unique? It feels amazing to play and, at a casual level, isn't so squishy the healer has heart attacks (like Blood DK. As someone who heals a lot on the side I prefer consistent damage even if it's more than spikey damage that's more managed) If it is genuinely too weak at high tiers for M+ then I'd say all it really needs is a way to pause stagger more than blackout combo (which currently should pretty much only use TP for damage, Keg for brew CD and Breath in big AoE. The brew drinking pair are functionally bait) Maybe ox stance grants stagger pause for 1s/2s or something upon being triggered giving it a great usage for M+ that wouldn't buff its raid performance? Allowing higher stagger cleanses causing a feedback loop (being hit causes stagger pause, which causes the stagger pool to increase, causing purifying brew to cleanse more, generating more ox stance charges... etc)
Honestly, feral pumps right now, im having no issues but in comparison to the reworks going out feral needs some love. There are a few things I wish were baseline like primal wrath and rampant ferocity. If we can at least get primal wrath id be happy. Boomkin is getting starfall baseline in October so.. why not give feral primal wrath? 🤷♂️
I’ve played feral since wotlk and am currently doing +7 keys with an arcane mage and ele shaman as the other two dps while we farm hero track gear. My burst aoe is insane so I win easily on anything that dies fast but their sustain is higher and their boss damage is much higher. This is with all of us being about 605 ilvl and each of us having 2set.
@larewt tbh I only started playing feral this expansion. I've always been interested in feral, but Blizzard never gave it any love. I figured this might be my last WoW expansion, so I might as well give Feral a go.
Lol all the hunter players are gonna gear survival because of this only to discover that MM absolutely gaps them and is the only spec the top players are using
@@richardfeynman7491 what makes you think so? In the past I thought it was potential dps, but preservation evoker does a lot more. Perhaps PI is that good? Shields letting dps skip mechanics and pump damage?
@@Cain3697 Disc still contributes the most healer dmg if you factor in PI, which contributes massive amounts of dmg when paired with dps cds on aoe. Besides that, the way it heals perfectly aligns with most of the bosses (can have pet up for all the heal checks), and disc has the best 5 party burst healing of all the healers. Beyond that, it actually has tools to help not just yourself, but your team survive 1 shots, with rapture shields (shield can crit for 5m with 4pc), 2x pain sups and barrier. Shaman is of course mandatory as well but both ele and enh are super strong right now.
I must stay in strongly disagree with MM hunter as utility wise it has aoe stun , single stun , slow , root , cc , poison dispel , stealth and big aoe every 45 secs (volley) i believe A would be suitable spot , what do you think?
Being Fury OTP and getting nerfed just cuz we look "OP" on raid fight designed with adds that their spawn alings pretty good with out AoE CDs Blows :'(
Disc A tier? It's D tier for us Priest players. You just dont play it over Holy or Shadow but you dont play Shadow either really as it lacks the damage in M+.
I feel like this tierlist is quite a lot off compared to any other tierlist. Like some classes here are in the lowest tiers, while many others thing they will be poppin
I have 610 windwalker with good parses and barely hitting million overall in m+ xD I don't think it is any good or fun. I wish i started as literally anything else.
I wonder how many people take tier lists seriously enough to be upset about it during the stream? I am not insulting when I say they are too dumb. Insulting implies that it is an undeserved name calling. If you did something dumb and someone calls you dumb, it isnt an insult. It is calling you out. These tier lists are for people that want to push for keys as high as possible, 5 minutes looking into people that make these tier list should tell you that they are talking from the point of view of someone pushing high keys and what is their opinion of what you need out of a party to finish in time those high keys. They do not talk about 10s. He talks about 15s, 20s and higher. The higher you go the more difficult it gets for all classes but for those in A and S it is easier than doing it with the Bs and Cs.
@@s1os2s3 finally, someone who can explain the baffling concept behind these tier lists... But if 10s is the peak of your skill level relative to dorki’s being say whatever 15s (I hear the scaling is bonkers) then these meta classes will make that 10 feel a keystone easier. Plus if you pug on limited time budget it may behoove you to play a hero spec that gets you invited. Just saying calling someone stupid maybe means you ain’t thought it thru. Cheers
"mythics" lmao Yeah Dorki, what are you on about, mister M0 is doing good pressing his two pad buttons and killing the shitter mobs while doing zero prio 💪
@@Funkloving Like its closest competitor is fury being the other relatively simple, plate, strength based, dual wielding spec. At least fury has this fast pacing and juggling of short timers to keep it engaging, to keep the pacing and momentum up. Frost just doesn't have the juice unless you're playing Breath. And even then Breath is only fun once every 2 minutes, and viciously punishing if you make a mistake.
You could always try Breath. But people are scared of it because they know they will tank their meter game. I was gonna play Breath but I went Sin Rogue instead. FDK cannot exist without being nerfed, it's too simplistic.
All you need to know about brewmaster, is that they randomly nerfed it's damage TWICE in dragonflight, despite it never being the best damage tank, and didn't even implement the compensation stagger buff. All because a dev saw a fucking twitter screenshot of one brewmaster player doing good damage. Blizzard legitmately hates the spec.
@@PatrykJagielski-u1gthey buffed it today but are nerf8ng it in 11.0.5 by changing gift of the san'layn to activate off dancing rune weapon instead of vampirism blood, which you get way less often. An almost 50% nerf to the worse hero talent option because... reasons
Really? Lol so a hero tree that it's whole shtick is being this blood sucking fiend, and they make it work with rune weapon and not the literal blood ability? Whack @@williamjeanrie8524
In my most humble opinion : Prot paladin deserve D tier (did someone saw one that do not dies on every melee?) Resto druide is far worst than Holy Pal & Priest, deserve to be down to C tier (ok for low B tier, only because of druid buff) Holy priest is insane, just wait to have a good Oracle ;) War prot deserve S tier, just because I fking love to play with a prot war (I'm a healer main) This is my big noob opinion
This is what I hate about world of Warcraft blizzard is always nerfing everything instead of buffing weak classes to make them all fun and on the same tier level and enjoyable to play
Respectfully Dorki aint no way you put fury warr ahead of Ret I have yet to meet the warr who can match my dps aoe ST and our utility is 100 times better
lol putting aff in s tier and destro in d tier when im doing more m+ dmg with destro (like 1.5m without an aug) and also alot better for everyboss that has adds cause aff lock sucks at them idk man, lookin gin raider io aswell both locks doing the same kinda keys
@@arago566 ur prolly just repeating what u heard from other 'tierlists'. comparing what the 2 streamers i mentioned did on beta its not the best on st but also not that far behind. The Aoe on the other hand is beyond crazy
Me as MM dealing good damage completing 7+ with ease now understand why people would reject me for a 2+ while pugging. I understand the creator doing tier list as the revenue is insane, i understand also people in title range caring about specs i do not understand you noobs who never even set foot on a mythic raid or a +10 asking for meta specs on low keys.
Having Dev evoker on C tier while M+ world first race has 2 of them in the comp is nuts. They do amazing AoE and ST damage with the same build, making them translate really well into M+. And evoker is one of the classes that can deal with Xal'atath's bargain easily with the tail swipe on 45s cooldown. (If you don't have a shaman, which imho is the best class to deal with Xal atm with stun totem and the aoe knock up.)
right, i main dev evoker and i have no problem topping charts by a LOT in every instance i'm in, dev is pretty op right now. i think people are just bad at it and don't know how to properly use it, and they don't take advantage of the fact that they have multiple abilities that allow them to cast while moving (which is humongous in m+)
I never understood how people can make these tier lists......that completely contradicts the overall effectiveness of the classes. Perfect example, he put MM Hunter in C tier....meanwhile MM Hunter is top 3 producers in Mythic+ atm. Tons of CC, Damage is through the roof for bosses and aoe....pets can have a bloodlust or extra cc..What more do you want from a class
Right? My only major gripe is not being able to decurse, and that cleanse CD seems like it should be shorter for the amount of mechanics that require it. But that’s just healers in general (aside from resto shaman with cleansing totem) glad they nerfed us by 6% healing tho (I’m TOTALLY not salty about it or anything)
Idk why people rate Shadow Priest so low, I've picked it up for the first time this expansion and I'm constantly topping damage boards in dungeons, demolishing delves and even consistently being in top 10 dps for raids.
Shadow covenant is meant to give +35% buff with shadowfiend and +20% with mindbender, but when you have mindbender + voidwrath, you get 35% with the benefit of the short mindbender cd. Noone really knows if it's intended or a bug.
@@Pat1711 that's good to hear, but I've seen a lot of people really unhappy with the state of rogue. They didn't really get anything cool with TWW and their tier set is kinda crap. Once other classes get tier set , outlaw is going to fall behind. They're getting almost no damage increase from tier sef
A nice addition to this type video would be to tell what your source of info for this is. Obviously no one plays ecery class and knows truly what every class is capable of.
Why are people making raid arguments for an m+ tier list
Probably because Dorki himself mentioned raid quite a few times, like even he was hedging overall
The overlap is very hard to ignore and even m+ players who hate raiding want to do well in it.
"hacoc might be better for m+ for raid it doesnt look so hot" this is a m+ tier list no?
Cause blizzard refuses to nerf end boss loot forcing most mythic plus players to raid and kill the last 3 bosses if they wanna push for more IO.
@@balance1619 "i have to play the game to get better at the game i hate this game"
Crazy how vastly different streamers tier lists are
I love watching like 3 or 4 back to back and seeing the differences in the tiers, but also hearing them say almost the same thing about them. Like they will say strong aoe weak st but brings good buff and is moderately tanky, then one person puts them in A and the other in D! Like WTF?! You just said the spec pumps AOE harder than anyone, and ST is only like 15% behind the class you put in S, so how the hell is that D?!
tldr: the actual tiers are never the good part, the good part is the words, the insights, the knowledges. Also its fun when they waffle on where a spec should be after chat starts going in on em lol.
Love when prot warrior is top dog
ive waited for forever but it finally happened shaman are the best class in the game never thought id see the day lol
Shaman was busted in Dragonflight for a couple seasons. Especially enhance
@@Terry-f1m This is why I swapped over to playing my BM Hunter in DF. But now it seems their positions have flipped....so back to my Ele Shaman.
Can confirm Boomkin is way fucking stronger than people thought and the buffs aren't even out yet lol.
so boomkin will be playable? :D
Biggest cry wolf class since release.... every fucking tier boomies crying about their dmg to be top or close to top every single time.
@@kristofgula5803it’s completely viable. Will be even better with the buffs.
I've noticed that. They always seem to do that @@MrNarcotix
They should better complain of the dog shit play style instead of the damage, feel like they would be happy with only spamming a button if it was top dps. The eclipse system is unappealing and boring, casting two time the same spell opposite to your aoe or single damage rotation is just totally counter Intuitive as well as two time the same dot with the only difference being the color of the spell effect is urgh!!!
I wouldn't underestimate devs power, especially with the bombardment buff, they do contribute quite a lot of dmg over a dungeon
Do you know that feeling when you are lying on the floor and someone kicks in your teeth? Yes? Dude I main Brewmaster too, what's up?
As a Ret Pally since Cata, I couldn’t agree more with that ranking.
This is the okay-est we’ve been in a very long time. We’re not busted, but we’re also not insanely OP. Feels like we’re slightly better at single target than AOE, especially if you’re running Hammer of Light to absolutely zonk people. Overall, spec feels good, but it could definitely be better.
thx for this tier list, now i can finally start playing the game
Boomkin stonks on the rise baby! Love to see it, might dust mine off. Been playing a ton of Demo lock, tried Aff tonight just for funsies and its strong! I like Demo more but can't deny Aff has more punch.
Woooo! Prime content while we wait for extended maintenance!
I had a lot of fun playing BM monk in season 4 of dragonflight. I was even able to get up to +10s on it which was fun because I didn't think I'd get a spec that hard to play that high that quickly. Playing it in TWW feels way worse to me. I leveled my monk from 70 to 76 as Brewmaster and I couldn't do any of the large pulls I do on the other tanks while leveling through dungeons and it genuinely felt like my stagger wasn't staggering anything at all. By the time I had like 20% stagger i was at like 15% hp. And since I wasn't staggering I couldn't get big Celestial Brews. I wasn't generating many healing spheres for expel harm despite doing the same stuff I was during season 4 of DF.
I don't really understand what I'm doing wrong but BM monk went from super fun and a rewarding challenge to play to feeling genuinely useless and unplayable.
brew scales incredibly hard with gear, while your stats are tanking during leveling it feels very bad.
WHen I hit 80 I had 55% stagger with shuffle up. Now at about 606 I'm at 66%. The way the class interacts with its primary stat as well as how vers and crit interact with its mitigation and self healing means it probably always going to have the biggest delta between the start and end of an expansion of any tank.
That 11% more stagger made an insane difference and it will only get better with the remaining 30 ilvls this season.
A good way to think about it is that if I go from stagger 55 to 66% damage I went from taking 45% to 34% damage which is an almost 25% reduction in the amount of damage going directly into my health bar. Its a crazy ass change into how the class feels.
Stick with it mein freund.
playing both a MM hunter and Havoc demon HUNTER has been truly hell.
Good. Glad they punish auto bot classes
What kind of content was hell? Curious because the only thing that I found difficult was solo T8 delve which I still competed
@@PULAG Brother look how havoc plays lmao
One of the longest openers in the game, a bunch of very short damage windows to line up and forced movement in a patch with no space to move
Funny how BFA is gone for years at this point and people still think havoc is generator spender with eyebeam on cd
Havoc, enhance, feral and sub are probably the most complex and hardest to play specs atm
Mm still simple af though
@@Mumohan_ ngl if youre comparing havoc to enhance u have no idea what your talking about , havoc is piss easy
Hunter not bringing anything? O.o
The new trap AoE knockup/interrupt, 1 stun, 1 typhoon, an AoE stun on binding to let tank kite mobs, 1 purge for magic/enrage effects, freezing trap for annoying caster mobs (more situational) and tar tap.
Well... I think there are really worse utility kits...
What's growl doing in the top corner?
Kotg boomie boss damage after buffs is pretty sweet. You called it. Best all round dps
Holy another tier list, im dorkin hard
"It's still a hunter..." :D
I have been so happy with frost with this expansion, even if they nerf us at least i got to feel the god complex for a little while.
Middle of B is right where Ret needs to stay. It avoids the nerf hammer
They got nerfed twice now
@@Fredrick215 hopefully no more, i realy like ret this expansion, is fun and very good also for m+
@@Naci-tk7fo holy pally was finally up in high A tier then immediately they nerf it to mid B. Shit is so annoying
@@Sargaxiist2022 i saw some holy in the top dungeons so 100% is viable, there are no bad healers
Totally agree, they perform well and feel strong.
warrior is so unkillable and spell reflect is op. but honestly brew master feels insane. when you get high enough crit and take enough damage you can heal for so much
Feral is so slept on. Just straight wrong her my man. Their damage is more that good and their survivability is great, way better than boomie (survival instincts + free big heals constantly) and great interrupts
No one knows the kitty power and it's likely down to those who can't handle the puss. We as feral mains are banging atm. You are correct, this t list is garbo.
I SEE TIER LIST, I CLICK
Confirmed android. Not human.
destro is a mega sleeper pick, mark my words
I played with a good Destro on a +8 Grim Batol and I was very surprised how much DPS it was doing even in Grim Batol which is a very small pull dungeon
@@cod-the-creator nah, destro is a legit spec. They were extremely underrated
“Good utility” now is the shortest cd on kick and I haven’t seen a single creator talk about it
Always love hearing the dorki theme
I don't know how they can do a full talent rework for monks and still have Brewmaster feel like such shit. It just feels weak, there's nothing special that it does and there's nothing unique that it brings. Takes tons of damage, requires the most healing, doesn't do good dps, doesn't have unique utility. It's just sad that it feels like brewmaster gets less and less fun with every expansion
It feels like stagger isn't working right now. I feel tankier as MW than brew.
it's a powerful raid tank and is looking to be a pick for the rwf
@dorki that doesnt help M+ Players… playing BM for 6 Years straight as a Main and its Like Never Top 2 Tanks. That just sucks, we are always at the lower end tuning wise I.0
People Always hype it in beta And claim Its super strong And then somehow, Its ultra weak on launch in m+.
@@wertui222it really was insanely strong in beta 😭, then it got nerfed, and still felt great, and now it's so mid at best 😅
Cant wait for yummyTV to put this tierlist on repeat on his stream
Again, the comments shows how different a top player thinks and how the average player thinks. People here saying Hunter have good utility and thinking what they see on leaderboards or raiderio is the meta on week 2... They are comparing this tier list to people playing with no full gear and still not pushing the highest keys... Don't you guys understand that he is talking about beta level keys with full gear??? - also using y'all same logic, only couple of 13 have been timed this week, what do we see? Bear and vdh (vdh is a tier above with the right comp, which is the comp they arew running with), what else? We see frost dk, aug, mage and enh/ele sham. Where are the hunters? ... Got to take everything into consideration, how big a tank can pull? Can a unholy dk have consistants pulls to shine? Can a destro have consistants big pulls to shine? Do we have the correct dispells? can this or that spec survive this with ease or not? do we have range? what about the kicks and stops? All of this is important before going out there talking BS like you know better than top players. Rather have soothe from druid and not hunter, at least druid brings a good raid buff.
I think ret for me is bottom A. They feel like the quintessential „you need to be at least this tall“ class.
Just had to note that your boomkin experience was on the ptr?. I believe those buffs were already a part of what was available there? If so, they are still in a good spot imo. If not, they are going to be really strong after the buffs.
Thanks for sharing your opinion Dorki, loved watching that video! What Blizzard stil ldoesnt seem to understand is that low utility classes need a very decent throughput to even be considered as a choice in both M+ and Mythic Raiding.
My assumption for the next m+ meta:
Heal: Thats an easy one, Rsham it is. Skyfury, 12s interrupt, good utility, decent throughput.
DPS: Frost and Aug set in stone indeed. I think DPS #3 is gonna be boomkin for that savage AoE and Motw. However I can see going for any of your S-Tier dps choices and picking motw through the tank slot, especially considering boomkin squishyness. These fuckers really hate using bear form.
Tank: Wild take, but I think VDH still takes the win. Yeah, both guardian and prot are SUBSTANCIALLY tankier. But that magic damage buff is pretty much worth going for it with Frostdk+Owl. While VDH utility was harshly nerfed, its still superior to what other tanks bring to the table. Plus Frost features a ton of slow, which will help with vdhs suspectibility to melee hits.
MM is pretty good. Only spec I cant keep up with is Frost DK. Feign death has some decent uses and misdirect is useful with fury wars.
Frost S tier in PvE
Unholy S tier in PvP
Ret is slapping in m+ definitely A tier.
Boomkin feels great to play super fun spec
No wonder my alts have felt so meh while leveling, my first class was Shaman and it was a ton of fun. On my alts i feel like i stand and hit a lot more
I've just picked up Brew and I see other people mentioning that Brew lacks anything unique? It feels amazing to play and, at a casual level, isn't so squishy the healer has heart attacks (like Blood DK. As someone who heals a lot on the side I prefer consistent damage even if it's more than spikey damage that's more managed)
If it is genuinely too weak at high tiers for M+ then I'd say all it really needs is a way to pause stagger more than blackout combo (which currently should pretty much only use TP for damage, Keg for brew CD and Breath in big AoE. The brew drinking pair are functionally bait)
Maybe ox stance grants stagger pause for 1s/2s or something upon being triggered giving it a great usage for M+ that wouldn't buff its raid performance? Allowing higher stagger cleanses causing a feedback loop (being hit causes stagger pause, which causes the stagger pool to increase, causing purifying brew to cleanse more, generating more ox stance charges... etc)
blood doesn't give healers heart attacks the healer can just ignore them if they die it's their own fault.
Bro hit the CLOCK BGM goddamn.
Feral needs to see some big love.. I've never seen a cat so abused. About to call APHIS on blizzard smh.
Im a little confused on that his placement with it, all my dungeons ive been running im usually top dps or 2nd maybe im just playing with shitters XD
feral has uncapped aoe its op asf needs a nerf tbh
Honestly, feral pumps right now, im having no issues but in comparison to the reworks going out feral needs some love. There are a few things I wish were baseline like primal wrath and rampant ferocity. If we can at least get primal wrath id be happy. Boomkin is getting starfall baseline in October so.. why not give feral primal wrath? 🤷♂️
I’ve played feral since wotlk and am currently doing +7 keys with an arcane mage and ele shaman as the other two dps while we farm hero track gear. My burst aoe is insane so I win easily on anything that dies fast but their sustain is higher and their boss damage is much higher. This is with all of us being about 605 ilvl and each of us having 2set.
@larewt tbh I only started playing feral this expansion. I've always been interested in feral, but Blizzard never gave it any love. I figured this might be my last WoW expansion, so I might as well give Feral a go.
Im curious to see how prot pala will be after the patch. Right now I don't playnone but I for sure dislike healing them.
putting pally under druid is nuts
The one time I decide to main tank for my friends is when shaman is popping off, dammit
I've had boomkins in my keys that are absolutely dominating trash packs. The buffs are just going to take it over the top lol
I need more people to watch this video so my Aff lock gets invited, we're really good right now!
Hunters have pretty much everything utlity-wise but a solid M+/AoE raid buff now and do pretty solid damage.
Lol all the hunter players are gonna gear survival because of this only to discover that MM absolutely gaps them and is the only spec the top players are using
To emphasise his clips at the end of him playing Boomkin, he did also have an Aug voker in the group :D just sayin
Disc Priest balance: when a bug doubles your healing and you end up as the 3rd best healer for m+
Disc will probably end up being the best healer for top 0.1%, rsham is just easier for pugs.
@@richardfeynman7491 what makes you think so? In the past I thought it was potential dps, but preservation evoker does a lot more. Perhaps PI is that good? Shields letting dps skip mechanics and pump damage?
@@Cain3697 Disc still contributes the most healer dmg if you factor in PI, which contributes massive amounts of dmg when paired with dps cds on aoe. Besides that, the way it heals perfectly aligns with most of the bosses (can have pet up for all the heal checks), and disc has the best 5 party burst healing of all the healers. Beyond that, it actually has tools to help not just yourself, but your team survive 1 shots, with rapture shields (shield can crit for 5m with 4pc), 2x pain sups and barrier. Shaman is of course mandatory as well but both ele and enh are super strong right now.
I must stay in strongly disagree with MM hunter as utility wise it has aoe stun , single stun , slow , root , cc , poison dispel , stealth and big aoe every 45 secs (volley) i believe A would be suitable spot , what do you think?
Dorki's voice is the Barry White of WoW UA-cam content lol.
As brewmaster main . My goal is just my 10 keys so I chose for pure fun and enjoyment
The shaman is a class S?! Holy molly 😮
Ret paladin is higher than b, at least a if not s.
Surely Fury nerfs get reverted :D
finally good one, thanks to dorki
I have been playing Arms and Outlaw a lot so far, and they both feel a little slept on. Definitely willing to admit that it's a mole person take. 😂
Being Fury OTP and getting nerfed just cuz we look "OP" on raid fight designed with adds that their spawn alings pretty good with out AoE CDs Blows :'(
The outro goes so unbelievably hard
Disc A tier? It's D tier for us Priest players. You just dont play it over Holy or Shadow but you dont play Shadow either really as it lacks the damage in M+.
I feel like this tierlist is quite a lot off compared to any other tierlist. Like some classes here are in the lowest tiers, while many others thing they will be poppin
When was the last time fire mage was on top?
I absolutely need to know what this bug is for Disc! I love the class but have been playing resto due to the state disc was in at the start D:
Check warcraftlogs. Disc is doing fine in M+
I have 610 windwalker with good parses and barely hitting million overall in m+ xD I don't think it is any good or fun. I wish i started as literally anything else.
I wonder how many people take tier lists seriously enough to be upset about it during the stream?
I am not insulting when I say they are too dumb. Insulting implies that it is an undeserved name calling. If you did something dumb and someone calls you dumb, it isnt an insult. It is calling you out.
These tier lists are for people that want to push for keys as high as possible, 5 minutes looking into people that make these tier list should tell you that they are talking from the point of view of someone pushing high keys and what is their opinion of what you need out of a party to finish in time those high keys. They do not talk about 10s. He talks about 15s, 20s and higher. The higher you go the more difficult it gets for all classes but for those in A and S it is easier than doing it with the Bs and Cs.
@@s1os2s3 finally, someone who can explain the baffling concept behind these tier lists... But if 10s is the peak of your skill level relative to dorki’s being say whatever 15s (I hear the scaling is bonkers) then these meta classes will make that 10 feel a keystone easier. Plus if you pug on limited time budget it may behoove you to play a hero spec that gets you invited. Just saying calling someone stupid maybe means you ain’t thought it thru. Cheers
idk what talents youre playing cause my paladins is pumpin in both raids and mythics
"mythics" lmao
Yeah Dorki, what are you on about, mister M0 is doing good pressing his two pad buttons and killing the shitter mobs while doing zero prio 💪
@Frawt maybe you're just an idiot cause this is the second time I've seen you talk like this but m+ is out...
Hey u got any talents for the M+ BoS frost dk build?
Man I wish Frost DK was fun to play.
Agreed, just seems so boring and overly simple to play.
@@Funkloving Like its closest competitor is fury being the other relatively simple, plate, strength based, dual wielding spec.
At least fury has this fast pacing and juggling of short timers to keep it engaging, to keep the pacing and momentum up. Frost just doesn't have the juice unless you're playing Breath. And even then Breath is only fun once every 2 minutes, and viciously punishing if you make a mistake.
You could always try Breath. But people are scared of it because they know they will tank their meter game. I was gonna play Breath but I went Sin Rogue instead. FDK cannot exist without being nerfed, it's too simplistic.
I felt the same way. Swapped to unholy never looked back.
Everytime I want to play frost dk I remember dnd cleave and BoS exist
So breath for frost best for raid and mythic plus right now?
DH tank guide soon? 👀
Demo should be higher for sure I've obliterated frost mages in dps
Restealths don't matter for assas. we've been trying to squish this misconception for so long x_____x.
with the master assassin changes they sure as hell might
People sleeping on the Ret Paladin Dream, F :D
I love unholy dk use it for m+ and frost in raids
Destro warlock is not c tier in m+ lol. Have you ran any keys past a 4? We have destro locks maintaing 1.5m mil overall dps.
I guess you don't know who dorki is
@@michaelsmith9303 he's objectively wrong about lock specs tho, but you can't know everything about every class ofc
@michaelsmith9303 This didn't age well did it? Since destro locks are in top 3 for most dps in logs right now.
"Brewmaster is the worst tank but it's the best it's been in a long time" :''''(
Meanwhile they buff blood
because blood mains are noisy af when something upsets them while brewmaster are rare and make noise like a mouse
they only buffed san'layn hero tree but nobody plays that hero talents anyway
All you need to know about brewmaster, is that they randomly nerfed it's damage TWICE in dragonflight, despite it never being the best damage tank, and didn't even implement the compensation stagger buff.
All because a dev saw a fucking twitter screenshot of one brewmaster player doing good damage.
Blizzard legitmately hates the spec.
@@PatrykJagielski-u1gthey buffed it today but are nerf8ng it in 11.0.5 by changing gift of the san'layn to activate off dancing rune weapon instead of vampirism blood, which you get way less often. An almost 50% nerf to the worse hero talent option because... reasons
Really? Lol so a hero tree that it's whole shtick is being this blood sucking fiend, and they make it work with rune weapon and not the literal blood ability? Whack @@williamjeanrie8524
In my most humble opinion :
Prot paladin deserve D tier (did someone saw one that do not dies on every melee?)
Resto druide is far worst than Holy Pal & Priest, deserve to be down to C tier (ok for low B tier, only because of druid buff)
Holy priest is insane, just wait to have a good Oracle ;)
War prot deserve S tier, just because I fking love to play with a prot war (I'm a healer main)
This is my big noob opinion
This is importantt, is feral really that bad pvp? If so I need to switch to warlock before I commit
Feral is a top spec in pvp. It's also better in pve than this. As a long term feral main we are good.
This is what I hate about world of Warcraft blizzard is always nerfing everything instead of buffing weak classes to make them all fun and on the same tier level and enjoyable to play
all top keys with VDH and here we say its not so good.
OFFICIAL Tier List. That's an insta click!
and now destro locks are better than affliction
Huh
Is this tier list accurate? Im new to retail and i want to choose a main so its important, i played only classic for like 3 years
For S1, yeah. It's pretty spot on. Ngl, if you want to be happy in WoW, play mage or whatever tank/healer is good currently.
Respectfully Dorki aint no way you put fury warr ahead of Ret I have yet to meet the warr who can match my dps aoe ST and our utility is 100 times better
lol putting aff in s tier and destro in d tier when im doing more m+ dmg with destro (like 1.5m without an aug) and also alot better for everyboss that has adds cause aff lock sucks at them idk man, lookin gin raider io aswell both locks doing the same kinda keys
Assa not in S-tier is kinda surprising tbh
it is 100% stier but theres not many good ones playing it on beta^^ mostly cassual and zerocool
@@Idkidkidkidk456 theres not many playing it* Thats just rogue is general, id wager its the least played class in the game 😂🤣
Rogue is good But the single Target Like he say is Not that good compered to other S Tier classes
@@arago566 ur prolly just repeating what u heard from other 'tierlists'. comparing what the 2 streamers i mentioned did on beta its not the best on st but also not that far behind. The Aoe on the other hand is beyond crazy
@@Idkidkidkidk456 no I Play it by myself
For me is hard to believe that VDH is not S tier, it looks so strong now D:
Me as MM dealing good damage completing 7+ with ease now understand why people would reject me for a 2+ while pugging. I understand the creator doing tier list as the revenue is insane, i understand also people in title range caring about specs i do not understand you noobs who never even set foot on a mythic raid or a +10 asking for meta specs on low keys.
Having Dev evoker on C tier while M+ world first race has 2 of them in the comp is nuts. They do amazing AoE and ST damage with the same build, making them translate really well into M+. And evoker is one of the classes that can deal with Xal'atath's bargain easily with the tail swipe on 45s cooldown. (If you don't have a shaman, which imho is the best class to deal with Xal atm with stun totem and the aoe knock up.)
do you know if they're stronger than unholy/frost dk
right, i main dev evoker and i have no problem topping charts by a LOT in every instance i'm in, dev is pretty op right now. i think people are just bad at it and don't know how to properly use it, and they don't take advantage of the fact that they have multiple abilities that allow them to cast while moving (which is humongous in m+)
@@halcyon3600 isnt evoker really easy to play
comparing raid statistics on an m+ tier lists and forgetting aug is in almost every competitive group for evoker utility already o7
They need to rework bm compleatly
I never understood how people can make these tier lists......that completely contradicts the overall effectiveness of the classes. Perfect example, he put MM Hunter in C tier....meanwhile MM Hunter is top 3 producers in Mythic+ atm. Tons of CC, Damage is through the roof for bosses and aoe....pets can have a bloodlust or extra cc..What more do you want from a class
I feel holy pally feel better than B imo, but tier lists are tier lists.
Right? My only major gripe is not being able to decurse, and that cleanse CD seems like it should be shorter for the amount of mechanics that require it. But that’s just healers in general (aside from resto shaman with cleansing totem) glad they nerfed us by 6% healing tho (I’m TOTALLY not salty about it or anything)
Devastation is at top bro :D wtf odd analisis
Idk why people rate Shadow Priest so low, I've picked it up for the first time this expansion and I'm constantly topping damage boards in dungeons, demolishing delves and even consistently being in top 10 dps for raids.
That at best anecdotal and as such the best counter argument is just to say play with better people because that's just objectively wrong
Assa rogue low Single target?? Carried all my Keys at minimum 1,2 Mil Overall with 800-1mil Boss dps, id say decent enough
Anyone know what the disc priest bug is exactly?
nope... im playing disc but have no clue!
Shadow covenant is meant to give +35% buff with shadowfiend and +20% with mindbender, but when you have mindbender + voidwrath, you get 35% with the benefit of the short mindbender cd. Noone really knows if it's intended or a bug.
Havoc with 4 piece rocks Myhthic +
It’s funny how everyone was putting outlaw so low before the season hit but now people are changing their tune!
It's still shit to play and nothing new in this expansion
@@sketchyx8307 Shit to play? Most fun spec to play imo, love the fast paced playstyle~
@@Pat1711 that's good to hear, but I've seen a lot of people really unhappy with the state of rogue. They didn't really get anything cool with TWW and their tier set is kinda crap. Once other classes get tier set , outlaw is going to fall behind. They're getting almost no damage increase from tier sef
@@sketchyx8307 Outlaw tier set got mega buffed today, much better than where it was at before.
Why is mistweaver low B? U just put it in there and didnt talk about it😅
A nice addition to this type video would be to tell what your source of info for this is. Obviously no one plays ecery class and knows truly what every class is capable of.