NGC Open Box - "Tears of a Clown" Edition - Mexico 8 Reales
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- Опубліковано 8 лют 2025
- coin in this video are 1¢ eBay auctions:
1938 Germany 2 Mark: www.ebay.com/i...
1927 Afghanistan: www.ebay.com/i...
1951 Saint Thomas: www.ebay.com/i...
1896 Mo AB 8 Reales: www.ebay.com/i...
1877 Go FR 8 Reales: www.ebay.com/i...
1882 Go SB 8 Reales: www.ebay.com/i...
1887 Mo MH 8 Reales: www.ebay.com/i...
1894 Mo AM 8 Reales (-006): www.ebay.com/i...
1894 Mo AM 8 Reales (-007): www.ebay.com/i...
1887 Zs Fs 8 Reales: www.ebay.com/i...
1886 Zs JS 8 Reales: www.ebay.com/i...
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Ben The Coin Geek
Old Pueblo Coin
I would buy those AU cleaned every day doesnt bother me at all.
I am wondering how many 140 year old coins have never been touched up in any way. Seems like most every coin has been treated somehow.
The real question is how many coins in details slabs shouldn't be. I'd argue its a fairly large number. Unless the cleaning is super obvious it shouldn't be labeled as such. A coin can be wiped across cloth by simply being put into a pocket. That would easily leave localized hairlines. Yet TPG's will ding you as cleaned every time. It's rather absurd to me.
It is super obvious to some people
@@rexg9371 obviously not if you watched the video.
@Ok, Groomer I did watch the video and the coins are very obviously cleaned.
@@rexg9371 Well the experts Ben showed them to disagree, Ben disagrees, everyone in the comments disagree. The only people that agree with you is some schmuck who looked at it for 20 seconds.
Moral is, "Do not send a bunch of coins together that someone might think are cleaned." When you send multiples of the same coin type, you are going to have them comparing similars. They will mark one or two cleaned and then be biased against the rest of the group. Always send things in ascending order of grade, and unless you can box in an issue.. A 65, a good 65, a 66, etc. where you can back the grader into a corner where they need to give a higher grade due to progression, it is a bad idea to send in a bunch of the same issue in the same submission. If you have a coin you think is borderline cleaned, send only that coin of that issue and sandwich it between two coins that do not outshine it.
From what I could see, those were die polish lines on the Mexican coins. When they go right up to the devices, it's good evidence. NGC was sleeping on those submissions.
Ben I feel your pain. > sent 2 trade dollars with chopmarks. Came back altered surface 😢
I have to wonder if the graders are not taking enough time to truly understand the coins condition and planchet quality. It seems to me that the graders just assume that it is a cleaned coin and spend less than 10 seconds looking at the coin.
Bingo
The coin from Afghanistan is not found very often.
Ouch! Some days you’re the windshield, some days you’re the bug. Sorry you were the bug this time.
Maybe the graders saw that last coin first?
It looked pretty obvious it was messed with. That could've set the tone for the rest of the lot.
I have a bunch of toned Morgan's that I'm getting ready to submit. I've got a couple of Monster toners that could go either way.that ill wait for another submission to send in with.
The lines on the Afghani coin are absolutely 100% from cleaning. If they were on the planchet pre-strike they would not shine like that. The shine in the recessed lines is from the fresh exposed metal due to the cleaning scratching into the surface. The graders do know what they're doing, despite the comments here from the army of people who like bashing TPGs without actually knowing their stuff themselves.
It's wild how the poster submitted the 8Rs to both services, the coins got called cleaned by both services, and they still think they're potentially not cleaned. They are all clearly cleaned, retoned, and unoriginal. Even that one AU58 has been cleaned, it's just not cleaned badly enough to warrant the designation.
I like this channel at heart, the video quality is fantastic and it's a nice intro to grading interesting coins to newcomers, but I don't like that it's sometimes misleading to beginners and can influence a flawed perspective on grading services as being totally ignorant and incompetent. There will always be times when the TPGs make mistakes, but they generally aren't going to be on run-of-the-mill, standard modern milled silver coins like these. Grading these is not tricky to a professional, and unfortunately the poster is evidently just not showing the coins to the right dealers before submitting.
Es natural que pcgs y ngc te den grado cleaned cuando el cospel está limpiando..es así porque pasó tiempo antes de troquelar y en efecto fue limpiado y algunas de las que presentaste fueron limpiadas químicamente saludos
Do the grading companies give their graders enough time to examine each coin in order to determine whether the lines on your coins are in the planchet or whether they are truly cleaning lines?
No, they spend well under 1min per coin.
Yes, absolutely. They don't need to spend long looking at coins because they've been looking at coins for years and know what is or is not as struck within a few seconds.
@@rexg9371 This is utter nonsense and the results speak for themselves. If NGC and PCGS were consistent CAC wouldn't be around and seeing massive growth.
I never said they were 100% consistent. They are people, not robots. That doesn’t mean they aren’t looking at coins for long enough.
@Ok, Groomer the results here just show that many people don’t understand how to grade. The grades assigned look totally correct
I wonder what the surfaces look like on an 8 reales that was straight-graded by NGC. They must have some expectation of what is "normal" and "original" for that coin that doesn't match Ben's experience.
Hey! At least they didn't come back with the dreaded: "Questionable color"!. For your next move, the only sensible things to do, is to crack them out and send them right back to PCGS!!!!!
Ben, you have the patience of Job... No, really, I'd have been willing to sacrifice NGC'S CEO's first born if I got screwed like this. Those Reales are epic and NGC gets paid regardless of how dense they are. My sincere sympathy. Michael
“We’ll start with some coins that are kind of fun.” Shows a Nazi coin first. Uhhhh…
I love any Portuguese republic coinage! My favorite currently is my Portuguese angola 20 escudos!
Paul von Hindenburg was certainly no clown.🤡 As a 99% racially pure Aryan, I can attest to that fact; and many people don't realize that the Swastika was, up until the latter part of the nineteenth century, an ancient religious and cultural symbol dating all the way back to Byzantium and early Christianity, where it evoked a sense of well-being, prosperity and good luck. But I digress; excellent job, Ben, ”The Coin Geek”🤓 in utilizing the correct term: World Coins ! 🌎🌍🌏 😉 So .... in August 1999 Boris Yeltsin, then president of the Russian Federation, selected a virtually unknown former K.G.B agent, Vladimir Putin, as the new prime minister. 🤔 Yes, indeed, how events can ultimately change the course of history. ⚾️⚾️⚾️
ROGER, The LOS ANGELES DODGER
I have an Idea!
If the grading company grades coin as "cleaned" , then it should describe and explain the owner the reason of their decision (maybe in some description document).
Anyway they don't grade free of charge.
It would solve the problem of misunderstanding between the grading company and the coin's
owner !
The person who pays , has a right to know "WHY" !
This is why the grading companies should have an appeals process, so that obvious "mistakes" can be overturned. It is obvious that these coins do not conform to American coins (I have Morgan dollar in mind.) I collect 8 reales from various centuries and find that the grades ascribed to these coins is largely in error. I have no recommendations for you my friend.
I've got 11 8 reales in with PCGS now, expecting similar results sadly. You had some nice looking coins, shame it ends up being worth so much different when they are as bad at grading them as they are.
This just goes to show, Grading is an imperfect endeavor.
Well, some of those things were interesting but most were really disappointing. Sorry you got railroaded, Ben!
If PCGS and NGC have both called the coins cleaned and you still think they're not, then you probably dont know how to grade coins.
in my opinion I would send them to pcgc
Hi Ben. Your 8R's I agree with NGC designation of cleaned. Ben your focusing too much on hairlines that's not the issue. The issue is these are not Proof Like such as Morgan Planchets. The issue is the over all Spottiness of the original toned lawyer in the fields which was removed. It isn't necessarily an issue with scrapes on the your 8R's it's the appearance of the fields in general. NGC, good call. The majority of the 8R's are AU anyways.
Portuguese coins are just amazing pieces.
Hey Ben, why do you think so few of these Mexican 8 Reales seem to exist? Very few are graded even though some mintages are many millions. Were they all melted? Stashed away?
Send to ANACS!!🤷♂️🤷♂️🤷♂️
Give Anacs a try 😊
Wow Ben, you really take it WELL when the graders really get it WRONG! Keep up the awesome videos!!!
No Luck Ben!! Thanks!
Die polish marks?
I put off watching this one for quite a while because the title and thumbnail gave away what the outcome was likely to be. Nice looking Reales so it's a pity. The smaller denominations (2 and 4 R) that I have seen, frequently have some of those same planchet surface characteristics too. I would be happy to own those coins, minus those goofy holder designations! Wasted money. You tried.
lol you got boned
if both TPG's are in agreement on these coins move on. don't be a whiner. use your due diligence before buying suspect coins. to me most of these coins looked cleaned to me and i would have never bought them raw. big risk little reward.
nazi stuff? no ty