Even much later in life a visit to a historical site with Dad can be memorable. A 2017 visit to Gettysburg proved to be just about the last time that my Dad, then just 90, still outpaced me on Little Round Top and going up the ‘Longstreet’ Tower.
Conscription as building national unity: Nothing taught me more about how fucked Austria is than having to serve in the military for 6 months being taught by completely unmotivated people where I just spent 5 months of that time as a waiter for depressed NCOs for about €2/h. Biggest waste of time not just for me but for society as a whole
Yeah, Cochran is 100% correct. Conscription is a huge waste of young peoples time. If you're a small country with existential military threats, maybe it's necessary. But doing it just for the sake of social engineering is ridiculous.
Thank you, as always, for the calm discussion with some disagreements. It makes listening to GF a pleasure as I hear varying POVs without insults, etc.
I'm with you on that... as much as I love the Good Fellows, and can't wait for the next episode, I have sensed a bit of admiration for Trump in past episodes. Hopefully clarity is forthcoming in a future episode.
It's not the same as going to Normandy, but I recently went to the National D-Day Memorial (privately run) in Bedford, VA. It was a wonderful experience, and I knew quite a bit about D-Day. But the respectful, informative guide at Bedford reminded me of how great the sacrifice of the British, Americans, Canadians, and Free French was. I went home and watched The Longest Day.
I attended two HS graduations this week. Graduates entering the military were recognized to loud cheers and applause. The ratio of females to males was two to one. Something seems to have changed.
Gentlemen, im a massive fan and eagerly devour each of your episodes 🙏🙏. But I have a rare gripe, I’m disappointed in John’s EV comment. It seemed almost flippant and, IMHO, ill considered. I don’t understand the schadenfreude in relation to EVs. They are a legitimate vehicle and irrefutably reduce proximal emissions - there’s no tailpipe. I don’t think they can be dismissed given EVs constitute almost 20% of global vehicle sales. The same amount of thought, consideration and research as goes into all of the rest of The Goodfellows subjects would be greatly appreciated.
Your comment is right on. Why EVs are a left/right issue is beyond me. The challenge is to build new technology independently of China. They have done great work getting the cost of solar down and improving batteries and have clearly won the small car game, as Japan had done earlier. We need to get this environmental tech being made in the west so as not to feed the China military industrial complex
Thank you for this episode. I did enjoy in particular hearing the exchange over the ideas around National Service / Draft / Conscription. This was a good example of genuine dialogue, where the two people engaged in the conversation were making a genuine attempt at understanding each other's position as the other wants to be understood and then find out where the differences are, and what alternatives they could get behind. Too often I find that when it comes to differences in evaluation that we only hear collective agreement on how intrinsically un-understandeable certain opposing positions are. With the assembled intellectual clout and capability for academic rigour I would wish you would more often strive to invite external contributors who have a lived experience different to the narrow set available to yourselves and then strive to understand and demonstrate how your arguments are faring against this. This is partially what I come for in watching this series. While I disagree with quite a lot of your evaluations, I do genuinely want to understand where you're coming from and how you derive your conclusions. And I can applaud you for giving me and others this clarity.
We have reached the budgetary tipping point. We are now spending more on the debt than the military budget. Nothing can be done about this until we go through the next depression, and the people force the government to pass term limits and the removal of donations (bribes) to candidates amendments.
I have to question the conclusions regarding electric vehicles. As I understand it the slow down in vehicle sales is across the board not EV specific, and is likely to recover the growth trajectory when market / interest rates normalise. At least Tesla EVs are net carbon negative I can’t speak for the other manufacturers but apart from Chinese producers they are probably destined to go bust anyway
Great episode. Funny to hear Trump supporters go from chanting “lock her up” to complaining about the politicisation of the judicial system. Seems like the polarised extremes on both sides of the political system have no internally consistent view of the world, just a political football team that they support no matter what they do.
The "Trump supporters" you talk about do NOT constitute the Republican Party or the Trump-voting public prosecutors and judges. Nothing -- absolutely nothing -- was done to Clinton, "lock her up" was just a feel-good chant, and you know it. By contrast, this Democratic administration has weaponized the law against its political opponents. There is a VAST difference between these two things, and if you cannot see that, you have no business commenting about politics.
I served as an officer in the Marine Corps in the 1980's. More senior officers who served in Vietnam recalled when the Corps was forced to accept men who were drafted. They felt that was a disaster that took several years to correct. Conscription is a mistake for the US military.
Hold on, it’s BS to say EV CARS are not better for the environment. It is an absolute fact that EV cars, not necessarily trucks, are better considering the lifetime of vehicles. Even where electricity has higher fossil fuel sources.
The issue of military recruiting from my limited perspective: Cultural differences amongst Americans are reducing interest - Yes, DEI/Woke may change via elections, but it can just change back again the next one and will this fix the underlying issues? Military handling of COVID - not sure this can even be discussed on the internet, but many people didn't like it Many of those typically pro law enforcement and military no longer feel the military will protect their views upon entering. As mentioned, many simply aren't in good shape. Work endurance typical of many previous generations from labor jobs is not as prevalent. Free college promised by the Democrats - why join for the free college then? Free things in general: housing, food, money - Why work if you can float along with as little as possible? I do not think this the case for most people, but it is for some. My nephew joined the Marines and was rejects around 2018. They said he was too out of shape. The kid is a strong as anyone I have met. But he has little endurance of any sort. He doesn't work very often and mostly is attached to electronics (a growing problem for many). He has no discipline and bad habits (diet, sleep pattern, etc.). Plus, with our culture of alcohol and pot it appears he has embraced the culture of addition (porn, electronics, drugs, etc.). Many people are suffering from this and need help. I am unsure if your draft idea is going to help this or make it worse. The idea of some sort of public service may not be bad to build up work endurance and better habits if ran wisely. But I am unsure if direct military service is the best route for most people. I pray our Nation and our military are moral and just, not just a nation under God but also in relationship with Him. I am not sure my comments matter much or help, but I hope they do. I listen to what you guys have to say and often agree in many areas and usually say so when I don't. You guys certainly are interesting to listen to and educational. I appreciate you guys even when we disagree. Best wishes! Manatha
If you're suggesting a draft, you want a WW2 draft, not a Vietnam draft. And right now, you'd get a Vietnam draft. Young people do not feel that America has done anything for them, and mandatory national service in the prime of their life will feel like the ultimate theft. You need to make young Americans feel invested in America; and you're not going to be able to do it after the fact, like with the G.I. Bill after WW2, but as part of the process. They'll need to see a direct connection between their draft service and their lives getting better in America.
Re Niall’s observation that there may not be a global trend of voters lurching to the far right, his counter points need to be placed into context. Albo the Australian PM, won several years ago and is currently massively unpopular (he may get re-elected but only because of minority parties, Australia’s electorate boundaries, etc). No one in Australia would use the Labor party in 2024 as an example of why the far right isn’t gaining traction. Secondly, Niall’s reference to the fact that Biden was elected only a few years ago is, I would argue, irrelevant after the Ukraine and Gaza invasions. If the 2020 election took place after Putin invaded Ukraine (not Crimea) it is doubtful that Biden could have won. TL;DR - there is clearly a trend of right wing voter polarization in democracies around the world. How long before they ruin the opportunity and enact dubious policies is anyone’s guess…
I stopped watching Pottinger once he floated the ridiculous idea of a national service draft. I realize that we all live in our own bubbles, but I can tell you as a college professor that there would be ZERO support for this among the vast majority of young people. The Army can't hit recruiting goals so you want to compel people to join the military? Wasn't the low quality and morale of the recruits the reason why they got rid of the draft in 1973? My youngest son is enlisted and serving our country in the Air Force (currently stationed in Japan) because he WANTED to serve. He loves being in the military, and it was his CHOICE to do so, along with everyone he works beside. That makes a huge difference. This idea is DOA. Seriously implementing it would make the 2020 riots look like child's play.
It’s the same argument with which Alcibiades convinced the Athenians to undertake the Sicilian expedition. It ended in a catastrophic defeat. These gentlemen should read Thucydides again.
A D-Day lesson pertinent to the here and now: the Overlord Transportation Plan. Had Ukraine been properly equipped and advised by the end of 2022 we might not be facing a slow, bloody, ruinous conflict. The outcome at least could hardly have been worse.
I don’t usually chafe this hard due to a pov that I disagree with, but holy shit what an out of touch take. Aimless young people are lying around at their mother’s house so we should send them to die for a government that abandoned them? Only someone wildly, intentionally out of touch could have produced this idea
These guys are the epitome of "out of touch". Think tanks are full of people like this. It's an echo-chamber of imbeciles who assure each other that they are actually really on the ball while shutting out any information to the contrary.
Yeah. Get off the internet bud and actually go interact with real young people. Using the military as a political re-education camp is a pretty f'ing fascist idea. The US military has much more important things to do than that.
Their government didn't abandon them-the battlefield of online propaganda they are doom scrolling through resulted in a generation with a high percentage of spineless jellyfish.
What we’ve learned in the intervening three years is what a Joe Biden administration can accomplish. That should make the decision in November rather easy.
You weren’t around during the Vietnam war were you sport? The draft was a dismal failure, and largely contributed to the degradation of our military and loss of that war. The arrogant politicians trying to run the war were the main culprits.
As someone who has served in the military voluntarily and loves this country dearly, I would flee the nation and renounce my citizenship, if needed, to avoid a draft. Military conscription is tantamount to slavery. I am unwilling to participate in slavery.
If you make a total global empire ; every nation’s defensive action can be seen as aggression . Instead of reducing your footprint abroad and consolidating resources you call for a draft and a trillion dollar defense budget .” Madness… Madness and Stupidity “ .
I was a real "wus" back in 1975. But as a White South African male we were conscripted straight out of school. Only tertiary studies offerred deferment. Cuba and East German proxies were bolstrring the communist protaganists in Angola, South Africa were supporting the Savimbi faction. Who cared amongst us 18 tear old dreamers? I can't claim to have seen any action ( although thats not true for a lot of infantry and parabat battalions I met)...but one things for sure...the iron discipline and my personal determination not to let the system break me, I came out the other end a different man. And I've yet to meet an old veteran who doesn't concur.
Every western country all of a sudden talking about the draft. Attempted power grab by the military industrial complex. Over under of how long before HR mentioned Iran in an episode 😂
I don't understand how HR believes that Hamas can be defeated militarily. The more civilians that are killed in this conflict, the easier it will be for Hamas to recruit fresh soldiers to continue its cause because of the trauma inflicted upon the Palestinian people at the hands of the IDF and the way the Israeli government chose to prosecute this war.
It would help if the military spent their money wisely. Just look at the the money wasted to build the littoral combat ship, Zumwalt class DDG, and the new Constellation class FFG.
Thanks for sharing. Good discussion. Worrisome times. I keep thinking that all this potential conflict has sort of clay feet, as it seems to be born of insecurity. Why are Xi and especially Putin so seemingly afraid of the West? Why are they so insecure so as to build up such threatening militaries? Maybe I'm naive. I keep wanting to find ways to work together for the common good to be able to put these insecurities behind us. One idea - an international climate crisis and disaster response team. Any country could participate. They would get excellent training that would enable them to respond to crisis that transcend national borders. One example might have been Fukushima. This horrible incident affected countries surrounding the entire Pacific region. We certainly felt it on the west coast. It was nobody's fault but we all had (have?) to deal with it. I know many countries responded to try to help, but maybe those efforts could have been better coordinated, so that different teams from different countries are equitably represented and are working together. Two of the best ways I've ever found to get to know someone you don't know well - 1.) Work with them. 2.) Travel with them. I like HR's idea of some form of national service. Not necessarily exclusive to the military, but something that still can contribute to the well-being of the country. There could be a skills development component. Not everyone is cut out for military service. That doesn't mean they still can't contribute some energy to the country. It doesn't grow on trees. I went through something like this when I got my EMT, partially inspired by 9/11. It was some way I could give back. Agree it's important for our military to not be politicized. No question it's cheaper to prevent a war than to have to fight one - in a hurry going nowhere for any country, including China. The one thing I feel a sense of concern about is that a war in today's world could truly tip our planet past the point of no return with respect to the global environment. We're too close as it is now. Wish you guys smooth sailing - Thanks again.
"We need to get away from cost plus, while doing something new" Doing something new for firm-fixed? There are more than a few programs I can name, that turned out absolutely disastrously with this idea.
(Not Tsum, Antietam.) Fighting a war as if it is a university debate is how you get forever wars! Fighting not to win but simply to "not lose" is the worst, least humane strategy any military power could possibly adopt.
23:32 I held different opinions towards Matt’s view. Look at recently ccp history, Mao did invade India so as to regain “power”. So in ccp’s view, it’s could be about power if the “leader” wanna start a war. Distraction is also the case. Imagine during wartime different rules can be applied domestically, it’s very useful for those ccp members to do stuff they want. Of course not limited to arrest and kill their political enemies or dissidents etc.
it really annoys me when people say the shortness of labor is due to young people laying on a couch doing nothing. Not saying there aren't some of those people but the facts are simple, its the demographics in 1978 we had approx. 226,545,000 million people in the U.S. with about 4.2 million 18 year olds. In 2023 our population was approx. 335,893,000, a 50% increase from 1978 and we had about 4.2 million 18 year olds. And we had a little of a growth in kids being born in the 2000's. Since then its gone done. 2019 it was 3.7 million.
I’m wondering what Matt and especially HR think about what Trump said on Fox today? As it appears he’s not in the least bit worried about the CCP state nor ruSSia! Neither is deemed a ‘problem’. = Trump on Fox & Friends: "I'm telling you. China and Russia, they're not the problem. We have a problem from within that's really bad."
In the recent national elections, the DPP government- that has been steadfast in a pursuit of an "independent" course- captured the chief executive. BUT the KMT achieved a a new majority in the legislature. And the KMT, that leans more closely to a China-friendly policies, has recently passed laws that seem to undermine presidential powers, and are viewed as tilting closer to Chinese interests. Question for the Goodfelles- if Taiwan hues- on the basis of democratic processes- more to China that before, should the US "defend" Taiwan if the population becomes more pro-Chinese? Maybe a blockade or a war, will become a moot points. Why doesn't McMaster and the others discuss this- maybe the most important factor in the equation- what do the majority of the Taiwanese actually want?.
The idea of national service or military conscription is revolting. I thought that this country learned its lesson with Vietnam - and a lot of help from Ayn Rand. The premise of mandatory service of any kind is that a person belongs to the State - just as it does under communism. If the military can't find eligible people, then have Congress cut the welfare handouts and the corporate bailouts to so that they can offer our service people a more attractive pay. If we can't find voluneers to fight a war for us, then it's our problem , not the kids', social media or not.
The economy expert of this otherwise illustrious panel is sliding ever more rapidly into the moral desert of the Maga movement. Normalising the antics of the current Republican forerunner and questioning the NY trial exposing his systemic criminality, calling it “lawfare”, speaks louder than the good fellow might realise himself.
10:20 What 2 trillion of electric vehicles subsidies? The only company making any significant EV is tesla, and its not getting more than a few billion in emissions credits a year. 10:50 What kind of free market are you talking about. Taiwan is free to make better fabs than intel. When or if China attacks Taiwan the scuttle charges on the fabs will end TSMC as we know it and that means NVidia and amd and apple etc won't have a fab to build its toys. So what kind of free market is going to create an effective policy to deal with the end of TSMC. The chips act is a start, The big issue is that taiwan workers are working 60 to 80 hour weeks at pay much lower than anything Americans want. You need policy to get those chips built out of Taiwan...TSMC was created by Taiwan to guarantee that America would defend them. Pottinger is on the right track, but worry that at some point China can totally disrupt the west by just bluffing Taiwan into destroying their own fabs.
Don't US election campaigns have to be longer than UK? British voters vote for the party and by proxy their prime minister whom they generally already know because he or she has usually been the established party leader over a long period of time. Keir Starmer has been Labour Party leader since 2020. Americans in contrast vote for the individual candidate and in many presidential elections have not known anything about a presidential candidate until the election year especially when those candidates are state governors.
The difference between Cold War 1 & 2.... Western Europe was not recognized as part of the Soviet Union while Taiwan is recognized as part of China. Start the conversation with a false equivalency 🎉
Russia have still yet to "test" Poseidon 100 MT detonation to see what sort of tidal waves are most optimal from international waters to travel through national waters and to hit enemy nations cloaked as a "natural disaster, oops". 😉 Enjoy July 4th :)
I didn't know Niall was a gunners fan! COYG! Anyway, I have heard the great Lt. Gen. Ben Hodges disagree with the "Cold War v2" thesis. Back in the day the Cold War seemed to encompass h entire world, Soviet-bloc, NATO/US allies & non-aligned nations- of which in my ancestral home of Yugoslavia, Tito was a founding member after he broke with Stalin in 1948 and successfully left the Soviet-bloc (unlike Hungary 1956 & Czechoslovakia 1968). imho the v2 Cold war seems far less pronounced, it depends on the geopolitical area. China, yes, that's a cold war. Russia,, well for us here in Ukraine, it's not "cold". It has also gone way beyond "cold" for hte rest of Europe I think. Would it be asking too much to get the great General Hodges on to discuss or debate this with Niall and the panel ?
You want people to enlist again? Stop vilifying our country and allowing foreign interests to shake their fat fingers at us in erroneous criticism. Stop allowing American political leaders to speak and behave as if they’re actively working to punish our country from within over past offenses that we’d never repeat. Inspire pride and hope for Americans again by putting on display real achievements. Aside from that, maybe it’s time to give our enlisted something more than just money to attend an anti-American university.
We continue to foolishly spend billons on these gigantic, expensive to operate targets (aircraft carriers)that are indefensible. We would be better served building more submarines and destroyers.
This can't be real 😅. So this is how wars start - people like the first guest just sell the idea of war and for what. Taiwan is in China! If China wants Taiwan let him have it.
Mandatory military service will bring out the best characteristics in America which will transfer benefits afterwards to the private sector. Especially given the impact of social media on youth and AI’s future impact on job creation in sectors that will clearly lose net employment
People are tired of giving their sons and young lives to bs bankers and war economy. Americans wont go for a draft unless defense becomes the goal. Immigrants might for a 'good job'.
If its mandatory for EVERYONE (age 18 to Social security) then I am 100% in favor of mandatory military service but it should still pay like a civilian job or a volunteer. Even the GoodFellows would have to work at a military academy every once in a while.
NOTE: This show was filmed before the Trump verdict went public!
Probably a good thing.
Fine but it's been obvious for a long time that the greatest threat is Washington DC.
And a just and righteous verdict it was.
That would have required a just and righteous trial.
"A nation that makes a great distinction between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting done by fools."
Even much later in life a visit to a historical site with Dad can be memorable. A 2017 visit to Gettysburg proved to be just about the last time that my Dad, then just 90, still outpaced me on Little Round Top and going up the ‘Longstreet’ Tower.
Great presentation and discussion!
Thank you ! You just never disappoint.
Pottinger is a hero. It took courage to call out the ccp so early on
I always look forward to Goodfellows, but this time you jumped the shark. Bring it back home guys
Yes, old time listener aswell, but felt there some quiet unnecessary warmongering vibes.
Conscription as building national unity: Nothing taught me more about how fucked Austria is than having to serve in the military for 6 months being taught by completely unmotivated people where I just spent 5 months of that time as a waiter for depressed NCOs for about €2/h. Biggest waste of time not just for me but for society as a whole
well that is not really national service as in israel or finland, more like waiter Service
Yeah, Cochran is 100% correct. Conscription is a huge waste of young peoples time. If you're a small country with existential military threats, maybe it's necessary. But doing it just for the sake of social engineering is ridiculous.
Great episode! Thanks for incorporating viewer/listener questions in the lightning round.
Thank you, gentlemen. Have a great Summer!
Thank you, as always, for the calm discussion with some disagreements. It makes listening to GF a pleasure as I hear varying POVs without insults, etc.
Outstanding gentlemen. Thank you.
Amazing as usual!
Thank you so much for answering my question on D Day. I couldn’t have asked for a better answer.
So good to watch something where people know how to voice disagreement… and optimism.
Thanks Fellows in credibility informative and interesting, should be mandatory viewing 👏👏👍🇦🇺
Always looking forward to a new episode - also curious to see how the Goodfellows/Hoover analyse the guilty verdict of the former President.
I'm with you on that... as much as I love the Good Fellows, and can't wait for the next episode, I have sensed a bit of admiration for Trump in past episodes. Hopefully clarity is forthcoming in a future episode.
Why are these bot accounts always trying to stimulate some kind of Trump discussion? There's real important things in this world.
They are largely anti-Trump. Their anti-Trump stance after 3 years of this Biden sh1t show is depressing
It's not the same as going to Normandy, but I recently went to the National D-Day Memorial (privately run) in Bedford, VA. It was a wonderful experience, and I knew quite a bit about D-Day. But the respectful, informative guide at Bedford reminded me of how great the sacrifice of the British, Americans, Canadians, and Free French was. I went home and watched The Longest Day.
I attended two HS graduations this week. Graduates entering the military were recognized to loud cheers and applause. The ratio of females to males was two to one. Something seems to have changed.
22:30. Matt - please re-examine your statement in light of war on Ukraine. If you don’t see it, you need more information.
First time I've seen this. Interesting discussions.
I am a Cold War Marine. There would be no surer sign of the demise of our republic than a military draft.
I love you guys!
Love, a word too often thrown around lightly as if it’s trivial
A great way to start the summer.
Better focus on ways to prevent a civil war in US.
Matt is a hero for calling out the ccp. Unlike J.Cochrane who thinks CCP is omnipotent.
Great show
Gentlemen, im a massive fan and eagerly devour each of your episodes 🙏🙏. But I have a rare gripe, I’m disappointed in John’s EV comment. It seemed almost flippant and, IMHO, ill considered. I don’t understand the schadenfreude in relation to EVs. They are a legitimate vehicle and irrefutably reduce proximal emissions - there’s no tailpipe. I don’t think they can be dismissed given EVs constitute almost 20% of global vehicle sales. The same amount of thought, consideration and research as goes into all of the rest of The Goodfellows subjects would be greatly appreciated.
Your comment is right on. Why EVs are a left/right issue is beyond me. The challenge is to build new technology independently of China. They have done great work getting the cost of solar down and improving batteries and have clearly
won the small car game, as Japan had done earlier. We need to get this environmental tech being made in the west so as not
to feed the China military industrial complex
Thank you for this episode. I did enjoy in particular hearing the exchange over the ideas around National Service / Draft / Conscription. This was a good example of genuine dialogue, where the two people engaged in the conversation were making a genuine attempt at understanding each other's position as the other wants to be understood and then find out where the differences are, and what alternatives they could get behind.
Too often I find that when it comes to differences in evaluation that we only hear collective agreement on how intrinsically un-understandeable certain opposing positions are. With the assembled intellectual clout and capability for academic rigour I would wish you would more often strive to invite external contributors who have a lived experience different to the narrow set available to yourselves and then strive to understand and demonstrate how your arguments are faring against this.
This is partially what I come for in watching this series. While I disagree with quite a lot of your evaluations, I do genuinely want to understand where you're coming from and how you derive your conclusions. And I can applaud you for giving me and others this clarity.
I don't think government employees understand how angry the American people are with the whole military industrial complex and these constant wars.
We have reached the budgetary tipping point. We are now spending more on the debt than the military budget. Nothing can be done about this until we go through the next depression, and the people force the government to pass term limits and the removal of donations (bribes) to candidates amendments.
I have to question the conclusions regarding electric vehicles. As I understand it the slow down in vehicle sales is across the board not EV specific, and is likely to recover the growth trajectory when market / interest rates normalise. At least Tesla EVs are net carbon negative I can’t speak for the other manufacturers but apart from Chinese producers they are probably destined to go bust anyway
Great episode. Funny to hear Trump supporters go from chanting “lock her up” to complaining about the politicisation of the judicial system. Seems like the polarised extremes on both sides of the political system have no internally consistent view of the world, just a political football team that they support no matter what they do.
Are you sure that those are the same people ?
Isn't it more likely that supporters of the same party act in different ways ?
The "Trump supporters" you talk about do NOT constitute the Republican Party or the Trump-voting public prosecutors and judges. Nothing -- absolutely nothing -- was done to Clinton, "lock her up" was just a feel-good chant, and you know it. By contrast, this Democratic administration has weaponized the law against its political opponents. There is a VAST difference between these two things, and if you cannot see that, you have no business commenting about politics.
Shhh. You can't say that here. Pointing out right wing hypocrisy is woke these days.
Bubble Minds of DC all together
"Perceptions of weakness are provocative". H.R. McMaster
If you grow up in the hood you learn quickly how true that statement is
I served as an officer in the Marine Corps in the 1980's. More senior officers who served in Vietnam recalled when the Corps was forced to accept men who were drafted. They felt that was a disaster that took several years to correct. Conscription is a mistake for the US military.
Hold on, it’s BS to say EV CARS are not better for the environment. It is an absolute fact that EV cars, not necessarily trucks, are better considering the lifetime of vehicles. Even where electricity has higher fossil fuel sources.
Yes, more incentives to bring vets into top universities!
The issue of military recruiting from my limited perspective:
Cultural differences amongst Americans are reducing interest - Yes, DEI/Woke may change via elections, but it can just change back again the next one and will this fix the underlying issues?
Military handling of COVID - not sure this can even be discussed on the internet, but many people didn't like it
Many of those typically pro law enforcement and military no longer feel the military will protect their views upon entering.
As mentioned, many simply aren't in good shape. Work endurance typical of many previous generations from labor jobs is not as prevalent.
Free college promised by the Democrats - why join for the free college then?
Free things in general: housing, food, money - Why work if you can float along with as little as possible? I do not think this the case for most people, but it is for some.
My nephew joined the Marines and was rejects around 2018. They said he was too out of shape. The kid is a strong as anyone I have met. But he has little endurance of any sort. He doesn't work very often and mostly is attached to electronics (a growing problem for many). He has no discipline and bad habits (diet, sleep pattern, etc.). Plus, with our culture of alcohol and pot it appears he has embraced the culture of addition (porn, electronics, drugs, etc.). Many people are suffering from this and need help.
I am unsure if your draft idea is going to help this or make it worse. The idea of some sort of public service may not be bad to build up work endurance and better habits if ran wisely. But I am unsure if direct military service is the best route for most people.
I pray our Nation and our military are moral and just, not just a nation under God but also in relationship with Him. I am not sure my comments matter much or help, but I hope they do. I listen to what you guys have to say and often agree in many areas and usually say so when I don't. You guys certainly are interesting to listen to and educational. I appreciate you guys even when we disagree. Best wishes!
Manatha
Our 8th grade class trip was to Gettysburg. This must have been in 1995.
If you're suggesting a draft, you want a WW2 draft, not a Vietnam draft. And right now, you'd get a Vietnam draft. Young people do not feel that America has done anything for them, and mandatory national service in the prime of their life will feel like the ultimate theft. You need to make young Americans feel invested in America; and you're not going to be able to do it after the fact, like with the G.I. Bill after WW2, but as part of the process. They'll need to see a direct connection between their draft service and their lives getting better in America.
Re Niall’s observation that there may not be a global trend of voters lurching to the far right, his counter points need to be placed into context. Albo the Australian PM, won several years ago and is currently massively unpopular (he may get re-elected but only because of minority parties, Australia’s electorate boundaries, etc). No one in Australia would use the Labor party in 2024 as an example of why the far right isn’t gaining traction. Secondly, Niall’s reference to the fact that Biden was elected only a few years ago is, I would argue, irrelevant after the Ukraine and Gaza invasions. If the 2020 election took place after Putin invaded Ukraine (not Crimea) it is doubtful that Biden could have won. TL;DR - there is clearly a trend of right wing voter polarization in democracies around the world. How long before they ruin the opportunity and enact dubious policies is anyone’s guess…
Can’t wait to read that book on China. I’m terrified that our country is ignoring the fire breathing dragon staring at us across the Pacific.
It's across the pacific.
We'll be fine
I stopped watching Pottinger once he floated the ridiculous idea of a national service draft. I realize that we all live in our own bubbles, but I can tell you as a college professor that there would be ZERO support for this among the vast majority of young people.
The Army can't hit recruiting goals so you want to compel people to join the military?
Wasn't the low quality and morale of the recruits the reason why they got rid of the draft in 1973?
My youngest son is enlisted and serving our country in the Air Force (currently stationed in Japan) because he WANTED to serve. He loves being in the military, and it was his CHOICE to do so, along with everyone he works beside. That makes a huge difference.
This idea is DOA. Seriously implementing it would make the 2020 riots look like child's play.
Conscripting people into the army to do manual labor sounds like something the soviet union would have done, is he high or insne ?
It’s the same argument with which Alcibiades convinced the Athenians to undertake the Sicilian expedition. It ended in a catastrophic defeat. These gentlemen should read Thucydides again.
A D-Day lesson pertinent to the here and now: the Overlord Transportation Plan. Had Ukraine been properly equipped and advised by the end of 2022 we might not be facing a slow, bloody, ruinous conflict. The outcome at least could hardly have been worse.
I don’t usually chafe this hard due to a pov that I disagree with, but holy shit what an out of touch take. Aimless young people are lying around at their mother’s house so we should send them to die for a government that abandoned them? Only someone wildly, intentionally out of touch could have produced this idea
These guys are the epitome of "out of touch". Think tanks are full of people like this. It's an echo-chamber of imbeciles who assure each other that they are actually really on the ball while shutting out any information to the contrary.
What about the trump trial? These guy can make sense on a lot of issues but they need to see what kind of man trump is. A friend of Putin also
People don't want to support and volunteer for our failing and politicized military, so let's force people. Top draw idea 👌
Yeah. Get off the internet bud and actually go interact with real young people. Using the military as a political re-education camp is a pretty f'ing fascist idea. The US military has much more important things to do than that.
Their government didn't abandon them-the battlefield of online propaganda they are doom scrolling through resulted in a generation with a high percentage of spineless jellyfish.
What we’ve learned in the intervening three years is what a Joe Biden administration can accomplish. That should make the decision in November rather easy.
National service fine, but just using young people as forced unpaid labour for the army is disgusting , unamercian
You weren’t around during the Vietnam war were you sport? The draft was a dismal failure, and largely contributed to the degradation of our military and loss of that war. The arrogant politicians trying to run the war were the main culprits.
Lunatics talking about a draft in this country in this century lol.
Read Pottenger's article. Great conversation. H.R.'s eye brows are interesting.
Does the American administration hear the voices of the Good Fellows?
As someone who has served in the military voluntarily and loves this country dearly, I would flee the nation and renounce my citizenship, if needed, to avoid a draft. Military conscription is tantamount to slavery. I am unwilling to participate in slavery.
"we need to bring back something like the draft". 👀
If you make a total global empire ; every nation’s defensive action can be seen as aggression . Instead of reducing your footprint abroad and consolidating resources you call for a draft and a trillion dollar defense budget .” Madness… Madness and Stupidity “ .
So entertaining to listen to McNaster like he really knows what’s going on 😂 2 out 4 guys shouldn’t be there at all
I was a real "wus" back in 1975. But as a White South African male we were conscripted straight out of school. Only tertiary studies offerred deferment. Cuba and East German proxies were bolstrring the communist protaganists in Angola, South Africa were supporting the Savimbi faction.
Who cared amongst us 18 tear old dreamers?
I can't claim to have seen any action ( although thats not true for a lot of infantry and parabat battalions I met)...but one things for sure...the iron discipline and my personal determination not to let the system break me, I came out the other end a different man. And I've yet to meet an old veteran who doesn't concur.
The doors of hell have now been opened.
Thanks for washing
Every western country all of a sudden talking about the draft. Attempted power grab by the military industrial complex.
Over under of how long before HR mentioned Iran in an episode 😂
I detest the fact that we are always subjected against our will to the circus. That happens every year in our politics with elections.
I don't understand how HR believes that Hamas can be defeated militarily. The more civilians that are killed in this conflict, the easier it will be for Hamas to recruit fresh soldiers to continue its cause because of the trauma inflicted upon the Palestinian people at the hands of the IDF and the way the Israeli government chose to prosecute this war.
It would help if the military spent their money wisely. Just look at the the money wasted to build the littoral combat ship, Zumwalt class DDG, and the new Constellation class FFG.
These men are completely insane. They are like Daenerys Targaryen. They have no understanding that THEY are the aggressors.
Anyone who references that abysmal work from Martin should be disregarded immediately.
I wished the gentlemen had touched on the new low of Iyatolla's acknowledgment of students and faculty supporting the regime.
2:27 Guest & Goodfellows
27:17 Year in review
38:39 Lightening Round
Thanks for sharing. Good discussion. Worrisome times. I keep thinking that all this potential conflict has sort of clay feet, as it seems to be born of insecurity. Why are Xi and especially Putin so seemingly afraid of the West? Why are they so insecure so as to build up such threatening militaries? Maybe I'm naive. I keep wanting to find ways to work together for the common good to be able to put these insecurities behind us. One idea - an international climate crisis and disaster response team. Any country could participate. They would get excellent training that would enable them to respond to crisis that transcend national borders. One example might have been Fukushima. This horrible incident affected countries surrounding the entire Pacific region. We certainly felt it on the west coast. It was nobody's fault but we all had (have?) to deal with it. I know many countries responded to try to help, but maybe those efforts could have been better coordinated, so that different teams from different countries are equitably represented and are working together. Two of the best ways I've ever found to get to know someone you don't know well - 1.) Work with them. 2.) Travel with them.
I like HR's idea of some form of national service. Not necessarily exclusive to the military, but something that still can contribute to the well-being of the country. There could be a skills development component. Not everyone is cut out for military service. That doesn't mean they still can't contribute some energy to the country. It doesn't grow on trees. I went through something like this when I got my EMT, partially inspired by 9/11. It was some way I could give back.
Agree it's important for our military to not be politicized. No question it's cheaper to prevent a war than to have to fight one - in a hurry going nowhere for any country, including China. The one thing I feel a sense of concern about is that a war in today's world could truly tip our planet past the point of no return with respect to the global environment. We're too close as it is now.
Wish you guys smooth sailing -
Thanks again.
Have guests on with different opinions.debate is educational.agreement is boring.
HELL NO!!!
🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬
To conscription!
...or any other mandatory involuntary mandates from a government.
#tyrannical
"We need to get away from cost plus, while doing something new"
Doing something new for firm-fixed? There are more than a few programs I can name, that turned out absolutely disastrously with this idea.
Can't believe I'm agreeing with the libertarian but he's right
Hey, Bill what do you got against John Wayne?
(Not Tsum, Antietam.) Fighting a war as if it is a university debate is how you get forever wars! Fighting not to win but simply to "not lose" is the worst, least humane strategy any military power could possibly adopt.
No Pottinger I am not sitting on my couch.
23:32 I held different opinions towards Matt’s view. Look at recently ccp history, Mao did invade India so as to regain “power”. So in ccp’s view, it’s could be about power if the “leader” wanna start a war. Distraction is also the case. Imagine during wartime different rules can be applied domestically, it’s very useful for those ccp members to do stuff they want. Of course not limited to arrest and kill their political enemies or dissidents etc.
it really annoys me when people say the shortness of labor is due to young people laying on a couch doing nothing. Not saying there aren't some of those people but the facts are simple, its the demographics in 1978 we had approx. 226,545,000 million people in the U.S. with about 4.2 million 18 year olds. In 2023 our population was approx. 335,893,000, a 50% increase from 1978 and we had about 4.2 million 18 year olds. And we had a little of a growth in kids being born in the 2000's. Since then its gone done. 2019 it was 3.7 million.
I’m wondering what Matt and especially HR think about what Trump said on Fox today?
As it appears he’s not in the least bit worried about the CCP state nor ruSSia! Neither is deemed a ‘problem’.
= Trump on Fox & Friends: "I'm telling you. China and Russia, they're not the problem. We have a problem from within that's really bad."
Taiwan needs to be looking and learning from Ukraine
PRC could simply do a missile blockage. No crossing need. PRC is dominating in missiles and Unmanned aircrafts.
Mandatory draft. But zero deferrals. Period. I bet most of our elites would shun that
In the recent national elections, the DPP government- that has been steadfast in a pursuit of an "independent" course- captured the chief executive. BUT the KMT achieved a a new majority in the legislature. And the KMT, that leans more closely to a China-friendly policies, has recently passed laws that seem to undermine presidential powers, and are viewed as tilting closer to Chinese interests. Question for the Goodfelles- if Taiwan hues- on the basis of democratic processes- more to China that before, should the US "defend" Taiwan if the population becomes more pro-Chinese? Maybe a blockade or a war, will become a moot points. Why doesn't McMaster and the others discuss this- maybe the most important factor in the equation- what do the majority of the Taiwanese actually want?.
The idea of national service or military conscription is revolting. I thought that this country learned its lesson with Vietnam - and a lot of help from Ayn Rand. The premise of mandatory service of any kind is that a person belongs to the State - just as it does under communism. If the military can't find eligible people, then have Congress cut the welfare handouts and the corporate bailouts to so that they can offer our service people a more attractive pay. If we can't find voluneers to fight a war for us, then it's our problem , not the kids', social media or not.
The economy expert of this otherwise illustrious panel is sliding ever more rapidly into the moral desert of the Maga movement. Normalising the antics of the current Republican forerunner and questioning the NY trial exposing his systemic criminality, calling it “lawfare”, speaks louder than the good fellow might realise himself.
These people need to establish detente with reality.
yes for mandatory draft
Pottinger is totally out in wild with his strategic fantasies. In the meantime there is peace to win for the Ukrainian people and for a stable Europe.
10:20 What 2 trillion of electric vehicles subsidies? The only company making any significant EV is tesla, and its not getting more than a few billion in emissions credits a year.
10:50 What kind of free market are you talking about. Taiwan is free to make better fabs than intel. When or if China attacks Taiwan the scuttle charges on the fabs will end TSMC as we know it and that means NVidia and amd and apple etc won't have a fab to build its toys. So what kind of free market is going to create an effective policy to deal with the end of TSMC.
The chips act is a start, The big issue is that taiwan workers are working 60 to 80 hour weeks at pay much lower than anything Americans want. You need policy to get those chips built out of Taiwan...TSMC was created by Taiwan to guarantee that America would defend them.
Pottinger is on the right track, but worry that at some point China can totally disrupt the west by just bluffing Taiwan into destroying their own fabs.
Don't US election campaigns have to be longer than UK? British voters vote for the party and by proxy their prime minister whom they generally already know because he or she has usually been the established party leader over a long period of time. Keir Starmer has been Labour Party leader since 2020. Americans in contrast vote for the individual candidate and in many presidential elections have not known anything about a presidential candidate until the election year especially when those candidates are state governors.
The difference between Cold War 1 & 2.... Western Europe was not recognized as part of the Soviet Union while Taiwan is recognized as part of China. Start the conversation with a false equivalency 🎉
Russia have still yet to "test" Poseidon 100 MT detonation to see what sort of tidal waves are most optimal from international waters to travel through national waters and to hit enemy nations cloaked as a "natural disaster, oops". 😉 Enjoy July 4th :)
I didn't know Niall was a gunners fan! COYG! Anyway, I have heard the great Lt. Gen. Ben Hodges disagree with the "Cold War v2" thesis. Back in the day the Cold War seemed to encompass h entire world, Soviet-bloc, NATO/US allies & non-aligned nations- of which in my ancestral home of Yugoslavia, Tito was a founding member after he broke with Stalin in 1948 and successfully left the Soviet-bloc (unlike Hungary 1956 & Czechoslovakia 1968). imho the v2 Cold war seems far less pronounced, it depends on the geopolitical area. China, yes, that's a cold war. Russia,, well for us here in Ukraine, it's not "cold". It has also gone way beyond "cold" for hte rest of Europe I think. Would it be asking too much to get the great General Hodges on to discuss or debate this with Niall and the panel ?
You want people to enlist again? Stop vilifying our country and allowing foreign interests to shake their fat fingers at us in erroneous criticism. Stop allowing American political leaders to speak and behave as if they’re actively working to punish our country from within over past offenses that we’d never repeat. Inspire pride and hope for Americans again by putting on display real achievements. Aside from that, maybe it’s time to give our enlisted something more than just money to attend an anti-American university.
Question:
Do you think your guests should have questions for you? If yes, be sure you have questions for me.
We continue to foolishly spend billons on these gigantic, expensive to operate targets (aircraft carriers)that are indefensible. We would be better served building more submarines and destroyers.
Mandatory service would help. But is it possible?
ONLY THING I WOULD BELIVE FROM THESE SO CALLED ACADEMICS, THERE LIPS MOVE.
This can't be real 😅. So this is how wars start - people like the first guest just sell the idea of war and for what. Taiwan is in China! If China wants Taiwan let him have it.
⭐
Mandatory military service will bring out the best characteristics in America which will transfer benefits afterwards to the private sector. Especially given the impact of social media on youth and AI’s future impact on job creation in sectors that will clearly lose net employment
People are tired of giving their sons and young lives to bs bankers and war economy. Americans wont go for a draft unless defense becomes the goal. Immigrants might for a 'good job'.
It will also empower an incompetent government to get many of those people killed overseas
If its mandatory for EVERYONE (age 18 to Social security) then I am 100% in favor of mandatory military service but it should still pay like a civilian job or a volunteer. Even the GoodFellows would have to work at a military academy every once in a while.