Bias is best explained explicitly, honestly, accurately. You can't get rid of it in a tire test. All you can do is hope the riders are open with themselves and the audience about their existing review findings. I think also that biases such as square vs radial profile can be "off," because while experience with many tires & treads can tell you what you like, I don't think it's always as simple as square vs radial profile, or whether side knobs are staggered. Correlation is not causation, even though correlation is what many of us use daily when we compare things
@@seanoneil277 Wiki = In a blind or blinded experiment, information which may influence the participants of the experiment is withheld until after the experiment is complete. Good blinding can reduce or eliminate experimental biases that arise from a participants' expectations, observer's effect on the participants, observer bias, confirmation bias, and other sources. I wasn't saying anything about causation/correlation. Right from the start of the video, people are asked which tire/brand they prefer, so bias is immediately built into this review/test. I was trying to say it would be nice if the reviewers didn't know which brand/tire they were riding until after the review.
Good test, love to see strong competition from the non-traditional MTB suppliers. Next time though, please adjust PSI based on compound and riding type. Otherwise you'll blame the tire for being vague, but it's just overpumped for a DD while the rider is leaning too far back...
it kills me to see this tire getting so popular, but it seems like availability has at least gotten better. Mazza is hands-down my favorite aggressive tire I’ve ridden over 30 years of mountain biking. Their Agarro is my go to trail tire. I’m going to try the new Continentals and I’ve heard good things about Vee, but across the brand, no tire company beats Vittoria in my book when combining performance, cost, and quality
The company was contacted and given the terrain, track, and conditions they'll get tested on and they provided the tires that's best suited for said parameters. Be rest assured they know their stuff more than you do.
@@spuddo123 Asking the mfr to provide their recommendation is pretty good. It does remove a rider subjective choice variable. But if the riders are familiar with the terrain, they may actually know which tire (or compound/casing) suits the terrain best from all the options. And, riders vary in their preference for casing suppleness/tread conformity, although better & more aggressive descenders tend to want firmer casings. I'm light in body weight and prefer to ride light on the trail. I don't use DH casings unless I'm on a DH bike. Most times I'd rather use EXO or EXO+ over DD. And so I'm used to flexible casings and tend to find DD and DH casings too firm and the tires too heavy/slow for most of my riding. That would affect my impressions if I were to run a test like Vital did above. Longwinded I know but I think there's some subjectivity that gets left out when the mfr chooses the casing and compound, without knowing the riders' own tendencies/preferences.
Great vid. So helpful to hear from 3of you. Weight, style and preferences help with hearing different opinions. Really impressed. Gonna try the V and Mazza for sure.
Love both my Kryptotals and Michelins. Flip coin htwn the two- and knob pattern totally diff btwn them. Bith hook up excellently and no washouts if I ride reasonably. No DH casings. The typical rider only needs trail casing. Side support and firm corner knobs are most important to me.
I have a bike with the Mazza trail rated tire in 27.5 x 2.6 and it's my favorite tire for here in Minnesota and also when I go to Bentonville. I also like the Specialized Butcher which wasn't tested here.
The Mazza Trail is highly ignored for some reason. The 2.4 is the fastest rolling tire I've ever used that still holds in the turns and you can't go wrong with Vittoria's Graphene layers
Loved the info, obviously an east coast or midwest trail would possibly flip the results. Brands have dropped quality control recently causing my old favorites to no longer make the list. Some brands are too small bead for spec for example or delaminate gum wall tire.
Been riding Vittoria tires for years (NH and WY/CO trails) and I am not surprised to see the Mazza up there. Probably the most predictable front tire I am surprised instead with the Vigilante, I had it once when it came on a used bike I got from a shop in AZ, i was super impressed with it. I tried Continentals (I currently have a set on one of my bikes) and they are quite disappointing. Overall, curious about trying the VEE if I come across one, but still sticking with VIttoria.
Im digging the Continental Kryptotal Re and Fr, way better than the Nobby Nicks they replaced, way more aggressive, faster rolling somehow, great grip, only downside is the added weight for climbs but they are cheaper too!
@@knott4me561 Especially the first version with the wimpy side knobs, that one was a nice XC tire but undergunned most anywhere else. I've seen more punctures out on the trail (others, not me) with the original NN than any other tire. They used to shed the side knobs easily on the 1st version too.
All this test proves is it should(somehow?) been done blind,the first guy saying the Pirelli waved a bit while cornering because of the offset shoulders!,come on,if he hadn't looked at the tyre he would never have thought that. I dont know how a blind test could be implemented but that way no personal preferences or pre conceived ideas would come into play,just how they actually perform
For fun, you should have included Specilized Ground Control (s-works, 2.1). Just to see the difference of how a lightweight xc tire felt vs. enduro tires...
My wheels are ENVE M7's or 735....I run 27.5" wheels with 2.6" tires. I'm a big fan of Vittoria E-Agarro. I run 20 lbs in the rear and 18 lbs in the front No Liners as is Enve's Recommendation!!
So my questions are : How much do you guys weigh ? I am a larger guy like 5'10" and 240 lbs Just a touch of chunk on me. And I find that if I don't run 35 psi or higher I pinch flat or burp the side wall consistenly...
Aside from the fact that that is simply not true, (Schwalbe’s factory is in Indonesia, Conti makes their high end tires in Germany) even if it was true: Tire compound, casing and tread design are what determines performance, not the factory they are made in. So, if those factors change, the performance of the tire changes.
I don’t think maxxis has won a single World Cup in 2024 so far. Continental Schwalbe and specialized have clearly done better and it’s kinda surprising how people just stick with maxxis because it’s what they know. 🤷🏼♂️
Why do people look at which tyre is winning the world cup? I can guarantee you that the tyres that the pros are using are not the same as the production models we are riding.
How can you fairly compare tires when you don't get the same application casing and rubber compound for each tires ? Totally pointless test... I really like your content but this one doesn't make any sense at all for me !
They should have incorporated some woodland trail testing as well. Dry, hard pack trails are fun on any tyre. 🤷🏻♂️ Also, you gotta play with your pressures if you’re changing between casings.
@@mrvwbug4423 I spent time in SoCal a few years ago. Trail surfaces are like concrete with dust & tiny-grain gravel in most places. Deep ruts from surface water and trail traffic. Braking bumps also like concrete. Did I say it's slippery? And to me the surface isn't predictably slippery, but maybe that's because I haven't ridden it enough. It made me ride more cautiously than I'm used to, and made me want MaxxGrip front and rear despite rolling resistance. SoCal trails remind me of the MTB equivalent of skiing hardpacked manmade snow. About the direct opposite of nice fluffy snow or grippy groomers.
@@justinlascala2288 Thanks man, glad it helped. I've spent a lot of time on snow and dirt over the past 25 years, and a fair amount before that too. SoCal trails are their own brand of sketchy IMO. I'd have to learn to love drifting if I lived there. And I'm a carver. I did a bit of tire testing about a decade ago, back when DHR II was developed. High Roller 2, Aspen, Ardent Race, and a handful of CST models too. It was a great learning process not just about tires and tread/compound differences, but also casing and PSI sensitivities. I have to thank Bryan Holwell for the opportunity and what he taught me. Funky trivia: the coolest, best tire I tested back then was a 26" ADVantage in 2.4" super tacky with a proto of what ended up EXO casing. I think they later sold them for maybe 2 seasons.
Actually they are the most difficult in terms of grip, which is why the aussies can corner so well. I personally trust deep slop more than loose over hardpack conditions..
I imagine Continental sent the DH casing because its the only casing with the super soft compound. They need to make the enduro and trail casings with the super soft compound. Running that Conti DH casing at the same pressures as the thinner casings from the other brands is unfortunate, it doesn't need the higher pressure. Conti has great design with their new tire line and great quality control, but their bike tire product management seems to be run like a large corporate automotive tire mfg. They need more options on casing and compound.
Interesting to leave PSI the same across the board even though the casing strength is different. I just got the Contis with the DH super soft and noticed I can run it 2 PSI less then my Assegai DD Maxx Grip. That would also help with some of the criticism brought up with it feeling stiff. I will agree about getting it on edge, this past weekend after about 8 rides I've finally got it figured out.
Also, the Conti 2.6 tires have a tread width narrower than the Assegai 2.5, so using the 2.4 vs the Assegai 2.5 is a bit of a difference. I want to use a enduro casing 2.6 with supersoft compound, when they (hopefully) come out.
it doesnt make any sense use the same pressure on a lighter chasing ( super trail magic mary ) and the other ones are gravity or dh, should've been an ultrasoft super gravity to match the others
I thought the same. They used a 40a compound for the Vee Tire, the 3C Maxx Grip for the Assegai, which are the softest compounds of the brands. I am sure the Magic Marry would ranked higher with Ultra Soft and Super Gravity tho.
Why did you assume the best pressure for a tyre is the same pressure for all tyres? I’m not here to tell you what the right pressure is. I’m not here to moan about trivial details. I’m just here to say that all other things being equal, the pressure in a tyre requires tuning for best performance for each specific tyre. The difference is discernible even by an average rider. Most of the decisions made in your time consuming test to focus on each tyre to make a meaningful comparison are reasonable and justifiable. Using a single tyre pressure for all the tyres is an error. I know it mucks up your aim for the test, but that’s a problem we share and ignoring it “for the show” degrades the outcome.
there is no meaningful comparisons if you use various tires with various compounds, and then use them with same pressure and on one type of terrain.... some tires are jack of all trades master of none like assegai, others like more specific terrains such as magic marry, michelin..... :)
Agreed and well said. Like my DH bike I'm driving a difference of 7psi from my trail bike, which is a pretty significant difference. And even the same category tire but different brand has some variability.
Considering the Schwalbe Magic Mary was probably one of the lightest tires there with it's Supertrail casing with soft compound it did surprisingly well. I think you all would have been very impressed with the Super Gravity/ Ultra Soft MM.
Magic Marys rock i have tried other tires but for uk riding where its nearly always wet i love my Marys but i might pick up a Vittoria tire to see whats up and also i run their tire inserts front and back and there great i had in cheap pipe insulators before i got the Vittoria inserts and the pipe insulators worked and gave good rim protection and sidewall performance but the Vittoria inserts were much better and a bit lighter
Why do you compare DD Casing Maxxis with super grip with a Magic Mary trail casing with just the soft compound and not the super gravity super soft...? Doesnt seems fair.
Haha so the pirelli scores low because their expectations were high? These boys are stoned out their tree. I'm no fanboy but I've rode 5 different pirelli's, 3 on the front. All have been outstanding
yes, but it is extremely hard to quantify such variances, making the test extremely difficult and tedious to do; each person would have slightly different pressures due to weight differences etc. Finally, the variance might have had some impact, but it'd be rather small and again difficult to quantify. Since the majority of the tyres were trail-enduro category, it's a reasonable parameter to standardize and focus on other more important and quantifiable variables such as feel based on fixed pressures.
Vigilante is my current fave! I live on the North Coast of BC so I ride everything from mucky wet to dry rocky terrain when I go inland. The WTB tough casings are sweet.
I think Maxxis should complement the Assegai with another model called Titsegai. Assegai name sounds like it should be a rear tire. Titsegai more front focused. 😊
@@thicccboyztv That's where it's at. The others who are weight weenies should be looking at XC tires, not enduro tires. You aren't even timed in the uphill sections.
These tires are starting to get so similar, especially between all Enduro and DH styles, that I'm starting to wonder how many riders would actually notice the differences. Not complaining though, makes it easier to find available tires with a wider range of similar tires. Just my opinion
I actually do care equally about front and rear tires because climbing is such a big part of my riding, but I can admit that the front tire is more important for safety while descending. When your tire slips climbing it sucks, but at least you’re not going to crash as a result (normally)
Nice work guys. While uniform PSIs does help in a data-sorting sense, I'm sure each of the riders here knows that PSI changes can affect tire handling characteristics, and the chosen PSIs may not have been optimal for rider, pace, terrain. I think it would be great to have similar testing done on the lighter casing versions of the tires, for actual trail riding done by the great majority of riders. I don't know anyone personally who runds DH casings on their trail bikes. And trail casings + DH tread patterns ride differently than DH casings with the same tread. More squirm of tread vs casing in the lighter casing versions and PSI gets very critical with lighter casings.
And then you could armchair ride the tires with your VR headset, right? Data geeks seem to think the data tells you how the tire will perform. I'd love to hear the explanation of how that works in reality.
been running a mazza front and rear now for over a year and I was floored by how good it was and how long it has lasted. I really wanted to get my hands on some contis to test but I am overall happy with my Mazzas.
I bought some lighter vittorias for my Trailbike - mainly because i liked the Look. I was surprised how good they felt and got the mazza for my E-Enduro. Love them ever since! And they last so long!
The issue with your test: You tested all the tires in 2.4 width, except the last 2 tires (Vee) (Mazza) at 2.6 width and coincidentally your "test" conclusion favored the 2.6 in width tires over the others. No surprises there.
All my bikes are riding Mazza from vittoria. Loving them. Ride the tyre a bit lower in PSI, as are super thick in sidewall. Last 2x longer than maxxis. Happy days
I've run that Enduro 4c Mazza on the Rear of my Slash and it was awesome! Rolls fast for a heavy 2ply tyre and lasted 2x as many KM's as a MaxxTerra DHR II - and I'm actually still using it on my HT (gets all the hand-me-downs). Vittoria have now released the Mazza Race (1c) which I'm keen to try on the front in-place of my usual MaxxGrip Assegai.
This is the best tire review video I’ve seen. Mainly because I ride the same trails in this video so I can get a better idea of how you guys explain the tires. I would love to see reviews on the Specialized Butcher, Delium and Basanite 👏🏽👏🏽
The only tires that seem to get tested are the stickiest tires ever and in mega DH sidewalls. This is a bit ridiculous IMHO because the Kryptotal Trail is far more durable with a heavy sidewall for a trail casing tire, sticky enough for a variety of conditions and affordable. I give the Kryptotal trail a 9.0 for dry, rocky, loamy, roots. Grip, durability, cornering and rolling resistance are excellent for burly trail tire. I also paired ti with a Xynotal on the rear which is similar to a Dissector. (I used to ride Assegai/Dissector and wanted to try something else at a lower price point).
Too much variability between trail casings. Enduro casings are more consistent across brands. Conti trail casing might be decent, but Maxxis EXO has a VERY short life expectancy on rocks and Schwalbe trail casing is even weaker. Meanwhile Vittoria trail casing is like other brands enduro casing and weighs just as much.
@@mrvwbug4423 Since this test was done I got Conti trail casing Kryptotal F and Xynotal for the rear. Put quite a few miles on them. The casings are much sturdier than EXO or EXO+. I haven't ridden DD so I can't compare. But they are very stout sidewalls and casing in the Trail version, to me at least. Like with energ8t above, they replaced Maxxis. Minion DHF Maxx Grip front, Dissector Maxx Terra rear. Both Maxxis in EXO casing. Big, noticeable difference in casing stoutness. And they roll quite a bit faster.
The WTB Vigilante is by far my favourite front tire. I need to recalculate these results removing his extremely low score. We clearly do not share taste in tires. Vee tires with the shocking results.
For my rocky/rooty terrain here in Ottawa, Canada, I have a 2.6 Minion DHR II rear and 2.6 Minion DHF front on my Yeti SB165 and a 2.4 DHR II Double Down on the rear and a 2.5 Assegai DH on the front. I ran Kenda Nevegals forever, but am quite happy with the Maxxis tires. I'm sure all of these tires are great when brand new and ridden at the right PSI, but hey, I'm not a pro, haha! Cheers
You tested the wrong WTB tire. The Verdict (2.5” Tough High Grip) is an order of magnitude better than the Vigilante, especially on Alpine loose over hard pack as we have here in northern Utah.
@@seanoneil277 in northern nj, the whole trail is an obstacle. we ride more rocks than dirt. Maxxis tires are great as long as you toss them after a couple rides.
@@mustclime5311 I've ridden northern NJ, and places far rockier. You're doing something wrong to buzz through tires that fast, most likely what I implied earlier combined with insufficient PSI. But congrats on trying to be the internet tough guy today. Some people have ridden those "rocky northern NJ" trails as well as places far steeper and rockier. And without the problems you mention.
Yep. I'm WAY too much of a weight weenie to go to the DH casing, and even the DD casing is a heavy pain in the ass. EXO+ has its days; but I'm kinda just over Maxxis. Considering I've been running a Shwalbe SuperTrail casing and it's held up far better than the EXO+ and even better than the DDs.
I'm on the Kryptos but with the Enduro casing and so far I love them for summer riding in BC. Over the winter I was on Magic Mary's, ultra soft with super gravity casing which I also loved in the wet/variable conditions.
Thanks for the great review. Nice you dont have too much rain there. I happed to live in very rainy country, so winter is grip on ice done by spokes. And most of the year the wider the tire the better it handles soft mud holes without sinking too much in.
![[UA] Eternal Fire проти NAVI | EPL Season 20 Malta](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/chvlsDygrZM/mqdefault.jpg)
It would be nice to see a Blind or double-blind test to remove bias.
Bias is best explained explicitly, honestly, accurately. You can't get rid of it in a tire test. All you can do is hope the riders are open with themselves and the audience about their existing review findings.
I think also that biases such as square vs radial profile can be "off," because while experience with many tires & treads can tell you what you like, I don't think it's always as simple as square vs radial profile, or whether side knobs are staggered. Correlation is not causation, even though correlation is what many of us use daily when we compare things
Blind riding? 😝🫣
@@MrEtnie 😂
@@MrEtnie It's the ultimate test!
@@seanoneil277 Wiki = In a blind or blinded experiment, information which may influence the participants of the experiment is withheld until after the experiment is complete. Good blinding can reduce or eliminate experimental biases that arise from a participants' expectations, observer's effect on the participants, observer bias, confirmation bias, and other sources.
I wasn't saying anything about causation/correlation. Right from the start of the video, people are asked which tire/brand they prefer, so bias is immediately built into this review/test. I was trying to say it would be nice if the reviewers didn't know which brand/tire they were riding until after the review.
Could be a blind test, scrapping the brand on the tire and doing the test.
They can tell exactly what tire they're running by the thread pattern
@@XavieRibeiro25double blind test, no lables and blind fold the testers so they can't see the tread
@@comeridewithmeAE😂😂😂
Put big fenders on. Take off blindfold once rider is on bike.
@@joerivers1716 that's the real way to do it haha
Good test, love to see strong competition from the non-traditional MTB suppliers. Next time though, please adjust PSI based on compound and riding type. Otherwise you'll blame the tire for being vague, but it's just overpumped for a DD while the rider is leaning too far back...
Add some Specialized tires next time! Or some direct to consumer options like Delium or Versus 🤟
Lol. Actually surprised they didn’t include Specialized…because their Specialized.
Also Hutchinson and Teravail.
The Butcher is an awesome front tire ...
Been riding that Vittoria Mazza front and rear for a couple years now. Best kept secret in mtb tires imo.
totally
it kills me to see this tire getting so popular, but it seems like availability has at least gotten better. Mazza is hands-down my favorite aggressive tire I’ve ridden over 30 years of mountain biking. Their Agarro is my go to trail tire. I’m going to try the new Continentals and I’ve heard good things about Vee, but across the brand, no tire company beats Vittoria in my book when combining performance, cost, and quality
@@SprSonik13 same feeling. At least like you said supply is better now.
2.6f / 2.4 rear in trail casing. Best trail bike setup by far.
Would have liked to see how the correct version of the Continental Kryptotal would have stacked up.
Obviously the DH was not suited to the task.
The company was contacted and given the terrain, track, and conditions they'll get tested on and they provided the tires that's best suited for said parameters. Be rest assured they know their stuff more than you do.
Vital literally contacted the company and asked which is the best tire, but sure it was OBVIOUSLY the wrong tire for the conditions
Literally every review of the Kryptotal says get the DH casing and don't bother with the rest.
@@spuddo123 Asking the mfr to provide their recommendation is pretty good. It does remove a rider subjective choice variable.
But if the riders are familiar with the terrain, they may actually know which tire (or compound/casing) suits the terrain best from all the options.
And, riders vary in their preference for casing suppleness/tread conformity, although better & more aggressive descenders tend to want firmer casings.
I'm light in body weight and prefer to ride light on the trail. I don't use DH casings unless I'm on a DH bike. Most times I'd rather use EXO or EXO+ over DD. And so I'm used to flexible casings and tend to find DD and DH casings too firm and the tires too heavy/slow for most of my riding. That would affect my impressions if I were to run a test like Vital did above.
Longwinded I know but I think there's some subjectivity that gets left out when the mfr chooses the casing and compound, without knowing the riders' own tendencies/preferences.
I love how your test trails are right in my backyard. I ride those trails everyday
Umm, how was my trail work? Like the new kicker on berms? Looks like you had fun. You're welcome. Good to see you back in SD.
Great vid. So helpful to hear from 3of you. Weight, style and preferences help with hearing different opinions. Really impressed. Gonna try the V and Mazza for sure.
Love both my Kryptotals and Michelins. Flip coin htwn the two- and knob pattern totally diff btwn them. Bith hook up excellently and no washouts if I ride reasonably. No DH casings. The typical rider only needs trail casing. Side support and firm corner knobs are most important to me.
Thanks. Learned a lot, never looked into vee or mazza really
I have a bike with the Mazza trail rated tire in 27.5 x 2.6 and it's my favorite tire for here in Minnesota and also when I go to Bentonville.
I also like the Specialized Butcher which wasn't tested here.
The Mazza Trail is highly ignored for some reason. The 2.4 is the fastest rolling tire I've ever used that still holds in the turns and you can't go wrong with Vittoria's Graphene layers
Loved the info, obviously an east coast or midwest trail would possibly flip the results. Brands have dropped quality control recently causing my old favorites to no longer make the list. Some brands are too small bead for spec for example or delaminate gum wall tire.
The Vee Tire tread pattern reminds me of one of my favourite tires of all time, the IRC Kujo DH.
Great test
But missing one important!
Rolling speed
And and some Kenda like the pinner pro
Magic mary 2.4 super gravity ultra soft 👌👌
Been riding Vittoria tires for years (NH and WY/CO trails) and I am not surprised to see the Mazza up there. Probably the most predictable front tire I am surprised instead with the Vigilante, I had it once when it came on a used bike I got from a shop in AZ, i was super impressed with it. I tried Continentals (I currently have a set on one of my bikes) and they are quite disappointing. Overall, curious about trying the VEE if I come across one, but still sticking with VIttoria.
I’m in az and the best rider I know, like top ten on many strava segments ONLY runs vigilante.
Hi Vital, are you making a video for MTB back tire as well?
Kenda hellkat front pinner rear ❤
Great stuff,i hope a wet and loose conditions comparison video is on the way
Im digging the Continental Kryptotal Re and Fr, way better than the Nobby Nicks they replaced, way more aggressive, faster rolling somehow, great grip, only downside is the added weight for climbs but they are cheaper too!
Nn possibly the worst mtb tyre ever made
@@knott4me561 yeah not exactly a meaningful comparison
@@knott4me561 Especially the first version with the wimpy side knobs, that one was a nice XC tire but undergunned most anywhere else. I've seen more punctures out on the trail (others, not me) with the original NN than any other tire. They used to shed the side knobs easily on the 1st version too.
Schwalbe all the way for me tried nearly every type !
All this test proves is it should(somehow?) been done blind,the first guy saying the Pirelli waved a bit while cornering because of the offset shoulders!,come on,if he hadn't looked at the tyre he would never have thought that. I dont know how a blind test could be implemented but that way no personal preferences or pre conceived ideas would come into play,just how they actually perform
For fun, you should have included Specilized Ground Control (s-works, 2.1). Just to see the difference of how a lightweight xc tire felt vs. enduro tires...
Magic Mary ( ultrasoft) and Michelin DH 34 Magy X are my favorites front tires , Assegai is grippy , but on bone dry only ...but that's me.
My wheels are ENVE M7's or 735....I run 27.5" wheels with 2.6" tires. I'm a big fan of Vittoria E-Agarro. I run 20 lbs in the rear and 18 lbs in the front No Liners as is Enve's Recommendation!!
Been listening to the B practice podcast since last year. I thought for sure Tanner was going to look like a 13 year old
Schwalbes new Tacky Chan i basicly a Magic Mary evolution. I realy enjoy it as a front tire
Maxxis should rename all their mtb tires to wobblers.
Every tyre is amazing in the dry!
Well, they're not gonna find a moist trail within 1000mi of SoCal right now haha
Vittoria maza are the best?😮
Did I miss the rum width? And no Bontrager or Specialized?
27.5 x 2.8 rocket kron tires front and rear for me in the eastern US
So my questions are :
How much do you guys weigh ?
I am a larger guy like 5'10" and 240 lbs
Just a touch of chunk on me. And I find that if I don't run 35 psi or higher I pinch flat or burp the side wall consistenly...
To not have the Specialized Butcher in this test seems odd to me!! Considering the amount of Stumpys out there that mostly come with Butchers
Where in SoCal were these tested?
Do you guys ride here a lot? Would be fun to put around out there with ya
Loose over hardpack is what Maxxis Dissecrtor is for, not Assegai. Strange choice for testing...
I'd like to try those michelins
Where are these trails?
Wish they timed the downhill segments so it was less qualitative with subjective scores applied
What makes a good front tyre?
Shimano brakes.
Why are you testing tires for different purposes?
Missed out on the Schwalbe Tacky Chan ...
Isn’t it still a prototype or is it out now?
mazza i want try
Specialized CANNIBAL...
Side knobs? Thought those were just for looks 🤣
Rear tires? Theres only one, the DHR 2, it goes
Assagai for the gnar
No specialized Butcher
This video was sponsored by Maxxis ;)
In all seriousness, seemed like fair analysis
I think by asking ChatGPT for its opinion about these tires you'll get more realistic reviews 😅
The joke is most tyres are made in the same factory in Thailand with the same machinery just different compounds and branding.
Aside from the fact that that is simply not true, (Schwalbe’s factory is in Indonesia, Conti makes their high end tires in Germany) even if it was true:
Tire compound, casing and tread design are what determines performance, not the factory they are made in. So, if those factors change, the performance of the tire changes.
I don’t think maxxis has won a single World Cup in 2024 so far. Continental Schwalbe and specialized have clearly done better and it’s kinda surprising how people just stick with maxxis because it’s what they know. 🤷🏼♂️
Why do people look at which tyre is winning the world cup? I can guarantee you that the tyres that the pros are using are not the same as the production models we are riding.
Haha, where's the proper offroad tires? Wheres the fat rubber. Wakey Wakey.
I'm so tired of tires' focus on attire.
How can you fairly compare tires when you don't get the same application casing and rubber compound for each tires ?
Totally pointless test...
I really like your content but this one doesn't make any sense at all for me !
They should have incorporated some woodland trail testing as well. Dry, hard pack trails are fun on any tyre. 🤷🏻♂️
Also, you gotta play with your pressures if you’re changing between casings.
There really aren't any moist, woodland trails in SoCal where they were testing.
@@mrvwbug4423 I spent time in SoCal a few years ago. Trail surfaces are like concrete with dust & tiny-grain gravel in most places. Deep ruts from surface water and trail traffic. Braking bumps also like concrete. Did I say it's slippery? And to me the surface isn't predictably slippery, but maybe that's because I haven't ridden it enough.
It made me ride more cautiously than I'm used to, and made me want MaxxGrip front and rear despite rolling resistance.
SoCal trails remind me of the MTB equivalent of skiing hardpacked manmade snow. About the direct opposite of nice fluffy snow or grippy groomers.
@@seanoneil277Good analogy with the snow. Especially since a lot of us ski in the off season.
@@justinlascala2288 Thanks man, glad it helped. I've spent a lot of time on snow and dirt over the past 25 years, and a fair amount before that too. SoCal trails are their own brand of sketchy IMO. I'd have to learn to love drifting if I lived there. And I'm a carver.
I did a bit of tire testing about a decade ago, back when DHR II was developed. High Roller 2, Aspen, Ardent Race, and a handful of CST models too. It was a great learning process not just about tires and tread/compound differences, but also casing and PSI sensitivities. I have to thank Bryan Holwell for the opportunity and what he taught me.
Funky trivia: the coolest, best tire I tested back then was a 26" ADVantage in 2.4" super tacky with a proto of what ended up EXO casing. I think they later sold them for maybe 2 seasons.
Actually they are the most difficult in terms of grip, which is why the aussies can corner so well. I personally trust deep slop more than loose over hardpack conditions..
I imagine Continental sent the DH casing because its the only casing with the super soft compound. They need to make the enduro and trail casings with the super soft compound. Running that Conti DH casing at the same pressures as the thinner casings from the other brands is unfortunate, it doesn't need the higher pressure. Conti has great design with their new tire line and great quality control, but their bike tire product management seems to be run like a large corporate automotive tire mfg. They need more options on casing and compound.
Ya im 160lbs on 55lb ebike running 20 psi front 25 psi rear Conti Argotal DH 2.4 Soft, mullet wheels.
Agreed, I think the Enduro casing would have been a better comparison, even with the harder soft compound.
I think they got robbed.
I love the dh cased continental tires on my dh and enduro bike.
No 26" either. They have given up on us :(
@@Atosark Kryptotal Front and Rear are both on Contis website in 26x2.4. I have no idea where to order them from though.
Interesting to leave PSI the same across the board even though the casing strength is different. I just got the Contis with the DH super soft and noticed I can run it 2 PSI less then my Assegai DD Maxx Grip. That would also help with some of the criticism brought up with it feeling stiff. I will agree about getting it on edge, this past weekend after about 8 rides I've finally got it figured out.
I’m running the same tyre, my normal 21 psi made the tyre feel harsh for me, dropped to 18 and loving it
Also, the Conti 2.6 tires have a tread width narrower than the Assegai 2.5, so using the 2.4 vs the Assegai 2.5 is a bit of a difference. I want to use a enduro casing 2.6 with supersoft compound, when they (hopefully) come out.
it doesnt make any sense use the same pressure on a lighter chasing ( super trail magic mary ) and the other ones are gravity or dh, should've been an ultrasoft super gravity to match the others
I agree
I thought the same. They used a 40a compound for the Vee Tire, the 3C Maxx Grip for the Assegai, which are the softest compounds of the brands. I am sure the Magic Marry would ranked higher with Ultra Soft and Super Gravity tho.
@@quiet-Shadow indeed
It like if they picked a dual compound exo assegai
It just doesn’t match with the others
This ☝️was wondering exactly the same…
Why did you assume the best pressure for a tyre is the same pressure for all tyres? I’m not here to tell you what the right pressure is. I’m not here to moan about trivial details. I’m just here to say that all other things being equal, the pressure in a tyre requires tuning for best performance for each specific tyre. The difference is discernible even by an average rider. Most of the decisions made in your time consuming test to focus on each tyre to make a meaningful comparison are reasonable and justifiable. Using a single tyre pressure for all the tyres is an error. I know it mucks up your aim for the test, but that’s a problem we share and ignoring it “for the show” degrades the outcome.
there is no meaningful comparisons if you use various tires with various compounds, and then use them with same pressure and on one type of terrain.... some tires are jack of all trades master of none like assegai, others like more specific terrains such as magic marry, michelin..... :)
Agreed and well said. Like my DH bike I'm driving a difference of 7psi from my trail bike, which is a pretty significant difference. And even the same category tire but different brand has some variability.
Considering the Schwalbe Magic Mary was probably one of the lightest tires there with it's Supertrail casing with soft compound it did surprisingly well. I think you all would have been very impressed with the Super Gravity/ Ultra Soft MM.
Magic Marys rock i have tried other tires but for uk riding where its nearly always wet i love my Marys but i might pick up a Vittoria tire to see whats up and also i run their tire inserts front and back and there great i had in cheap pipe insulators before i got the Vittoria inserts and the pipe insulators worked and gave good rim protection and sidewall performance but the Vittoria inserts were much better and a bit lighter
Why do you compare DD Casing Maxxis with super grip with a Magic Mary trail casing with just the soft compound and not the super gravity super soft...? Doesnt seems fair.
It's based on what the tire manufacturer sent them. They asked the manufacturers to send what they thought worked best in SoCal conditions.
@@mrvwbug4423 ok ty
Haha so the pirelli scores low because their expectations were high? These boys are stoned out their tree. I'm no fanboy but I've rode 5 different pirelli's, 3 on the front. All have been outstanding
Imo the only issue here was using control-pressure...not fair since having different casing on different tires
yes, but it is extremely hard to quantify such variances, making the test extremely difficult and tedious to do; each person would have slightly different pressures due to weight differences etc.
Finally, the variance might have had some impact, but it'd be rather small and again difficult to quantify. Since the majority of the tyres were trail-enduro category, it's a reasonable parameter to standardize and focus on other more important and quantifiable variables such as feel based on fixed pressures.
Vigilante is my current fave! I live on the North Coast of BC so I ride everything from mucky wet to dry rocky terrain when I go inland. The WTB tough casings are sweet.
I think Maxxis should complement the Assegai with another model called Titsegai. Assegai name sounds like it should be a rear tire. Titsegai more front focused. 😊
For a lot of us, rolling resistance and weight are pretty important as well.
Anyone who pedals themselves, agreed 😂
I mean many people pedal for an hour for a 6 minute descent and go full coil and dh casing
@@thicccboyztv That's where it's at. The others who are weight weenies should be looking at XC tires, not enduro tires. You aren't even timed in the uphill sections.
These tires are starting to get so similar, especially between all Enduro and DH styles, that I'm starting to wonder how many riders would actually notice the differences. Not complaining though, makes it easier to find available tires with a wider range of similar tires. Just my opinion
Every Maxxis rider ever: "I gave it a few more points overall because it has really loud yellow labeling".
I actually do care equally about front and rear tires because climbing is such a big part of my riding, but I can admit that the front tire is more important for safety while descending. When your tire slips climbing it sucks, but at least you’re not going to crash as a result (normally)
Nice work guys.
While uniform PSIs does help in a data-sorting sense, I'm sure each of the riders here knows that PSI changes can affect tire handling characteristics, and the chosen PSIs may not have been optimal for rider, pace, terrain.
I think it would be great to have similar testing done on the lighter casing versions of the tires, for actual trail riding done by the great majority of riders. I don't know anyone personally who runds DH casings on their trail bikes. And trail casings + DH tread patterns ride differently than DH casings with the same tread. More squirm of tread vs casing in the lighter casing versions and PSI gets very critical with lighter casings.
Why didn't you mention weight? I think the tires should all be close in weight. Super Trail vs DH tires?
This video could have been a table/spreadsheet.
And then you could armchair ride the tires with your VR headset, right?
Data geeks seem to think the data tells you how the tire will perform. I'd love to hear the explanation of how that works in reality.
Why is there no overall summary?
Rolling resistance or speed was not discussed either which I was also looking for.
Great Reviews. Guarantee nobody was thinking Vee and Vittoria would score highest in test.
Vittoria is absolutely smashing it in Europe. Where Schwalbe was the go to brand, this has now become Vittoria.
been running a mazza front and rear now for over a year and I was floored by how good it was and how long it has lasted. I really wanted to get my hands on some contis to test but I am overall happy with my Mazzas.
@@shamewizard3187 it's almost as if it has been so heavily marketed by GMBN... 😂
I bought some lighter vittorias for my Trailbike - mainly because i liked the Look.
I was surprised how good they felt and got the mazza for my E-Enduro. Love them ever since! And they last so long!
The Vee was the surprise. I've ridden the Mazza before and it's flat out the best cornering tire I've ever ridden.
The issue with your test:
You tested all the tires in 2.4 width, except the last 2 tires (Vee) (Mazza) at 2.6 width and coincidentally your "test" conclusion favored the 2.6 in width tires over the others. No surprises there.
Vittora's 2.6 is akin to a Maxxis 2.5, they run narrow.
Great test, thanks for all the effort putting it together. Would be awesome to see a wet conditions edition.
All my bikes are riding Mazza from vittoria. Loving them. Ride the tyre a bit lower in PSI, as are super thick in sidewall. Last 2x longer than maxxis. Happy days
Yeppp. I have tried many different things and I still love those the most, especially when things get off-camber.
The Kryptotal FR Trail casing is also pretty burly and sticky enough for most trail conditions. Def worth trying if your local trails call for it.
I've run that Enduro 4c Mazza on the Rear of my Slash and it was awesome!
Rolls fast for a heavy 2ply tyre and lasted 2x as many KM's as a MaxxTerra DHR II - and I'm actually still using it on my HT (gets all the hand-me-downs).
Vittoria have now released the Mazza Race (1c) which I'm keen to try on the front in-place of my usual MaxxGrip Assegai.
This is the best tire review video I’ve seen. Mainly because I ride the same trails in this video so I can get a better idea of how you guys explain the tires. I would love to see reviews on the Specialized Butcher, Delium and Basanite 👏🏽👏🏽
Please wear elbow pads. 🤕
Running the same psi across the board is not good experimental design - running the optimal psi for each tire would be a better comparison
Best front tire content on the planet. Also, who else notices how stable Zeb is? lol
I prefer the Zeb over the 38 (ultimate vs factory), all day. Zeb is just so much smoother, easier to dial in, and frankly, I like the looks better.
Nice test guys but all the tires should have the same width to make it fair.
The only tires that seem to get tested are the stickiest tires ever and in mega DH sidewalls. This is a bit ridiculous IMHO because the Kryptotal Trail is far more durable with a heavy sidewall for a trail casing tire, sticky enough for a variety of conditions and affordable. I give the Kryptotal trail a 9.0 for dry, rocky, loamy, roots. Grip, durability, cornering and rolling resistance are excellent for burly trail tire. I also paired ti with a Xynotal on the rear which is similar to a Dissector. (I used to ride Assegai/Dissector and wanted to try something else at a lower price point).
Too much variability between trail casings. Enduro casings are more consistent across brands. Conti trail casing might be decent, but Maxxis EXO has a VERY short life expectancy on rocks and Schwalbe trail casing is even weaker. Meanwhile Vittoria trail casing is like other brands enduro casing and weighs just as much.
@@mrvwbug4423 Since this test was done I got Conti trail casing Kryptotal F and Xynotal for the rear. Put quite a few miles on them. The casings are much sturdier than EXO or EXO+. I haven't ridden DD so I can't compare. But they are very stout sidewalls and casing in the Trail version, to me at least.
Like with energ8t above, they replaced Maxxis. Minion DHF Maxx Grip front, Dissector Maxx Terra rear. Both Maxxis in EXO casing. Big, noticeable difference in casing stoutness. And they roll quite a bit faster.
The WTB Vigilante is by far my favourite front tire. I need to recalculate these results removing his extremely low score. We clearly do not share taste in tires.
Vee tires with the shocking results.
For my rocky/rooty terrain here in Ottawa, Canada, I have a 2.6 Minion DHR II rear and 2.6 Minion DHF front on my Yeti SB165 and a 2.4 DHR II Double Down on the rear and a 2.5 Assegai DH on the front. I ran Kenda Nevegals forever, but am quite happy with the Maxxis tires. I'm sure all of these tires are great when brand new and ridden at the right PSI, but hey, I'm not a pro, haha! Cheers
You tested the wrong WTB tire. The Verdict (2.5” Tough High Grip) is an order of magnitude better than the Vigilante, especially on Alpine loose over hard pack as we have here in northern Utah.
got tired of maxxis cassing failing. Great tires if you replace them every couple of weeks. Maxxis are great new, crap with age, more so than others.
It helps to unweight when you encounter trail obstacles.
@@seanoneil277 in northern nj, the whole trail is an obstacle. we ride more rocks than dirt. Maxxis tires are great as long as you toss them after a couple rides.
@@mustclime5311 I've ridden northern NJ, and places far rockier. You're doing something wrong to buzz through tires that fast, most likely what I implied earlier combined with insufficient PSI. But congrats on trying to be the internet tough guy today. Some people have ridden those "rocky northern NJ" trails as well as places far steeper and rockier. And without the problems you mention.
Yep. I'm WAY too much of a weight weenie to go to the DH casing, and even the DD casing is a heavy pain in the ass. EXO+ has its days; but I'm kinda just over Maxxis. Considering I've been running a Shwalbe SuperTrail casing and it's held up far better than the EXO+ and even better than the DDs.
I'm on the Kryptos but with the Enduro casing and so far I love them for summer riding in BC. Over the winter I was on Magic Mary's, ultra soft with super gravity casing which I also loved in the wet/variable conditions.
Complaining about the dh casing when on a trail bike? They do enduro and trail compounds for a reason lmao
And not a single specialized tire tested. Maxxis is so HYPED!
Got WTB Vigilante 29x2.3 for my 2022 Patrol 094 n it's not only great for loam n sandy, but also in tarmac.
Thanks for the great review. Nice you dont have too much rain there. I happed to live in very rainy country, so winter is grip on ice done by spokes. And most of the year the wider the tire the better it handles soft mud holes without sinking too much in.
Why would they pick more downhill casings for a front tire on trail bikes 🤦🏽♂️
Was insightful but the whole time i kept thinking that they’re comparing each tire to their favorite tire, the one they became skilled on
I’d be interested to know how the dhr2 and krypto rear perform as front tires?