Ask Dave: How Do I Relate To Popular Music?
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- Опубліковано 28 лип 2024
- Do I relate to popular music? Well, yes and no. Here's a brief discussion about how a classical music fanatic deals with that other stuff. Oh, and apologies to Don McLean to mixing him up with Don Gillis. I get that says a lot about where I'm coming from!
I can't help but think of the (perhaps apocryphal) story of Gerswhin asking Schoenberg for composing lessons, and Schoenberg refusing, saying, "I would only make you a bad Schoenberg, and you're such a good Gershwin already. "
I think I heard this story but Ravel was the teacher and Gershwin the pupil.
Another story, probably apocryphal, is Gershwin coming to Schoenberg for lessons. Schoenberg asked him how much money he made as a composer. Gershwin, with several Broadway shows to his credit and a whole lot in royalties, told him. Schoenberg replied, "You teach me."
@@steveschwartz8944 It was Stravinsky, not Schoenberg....at a party in Paris (May, 1928), and witnessed by composer Richard Hammond. Apparently Stravinsky denied the conversation had taken place, but ultimately admitted that it had. And why not? It's one of the best quips of all time. LR
@@HassoBenSoba Thanks for the correction.
I think Dave would agree that it's better to be a bad Ravel or Stravinsky than a bad Schoenberg!
I have been a lifelong classical music lover, but also have a parallel interest in the jazz scene: late 50s- 60s Blue Note/ Bill Evans, Herbie Hancock, Miles Davis, jazz guitar, etc.
When my best friend said she thought "classical" music was boring I introduced her to Scheherazade and as a fun curve ball Bizet's Symphony,. She no longer holds that opinion. She in turn opened my ears to the world of 90s UK dance music - I still listen to Haydn.
I don’t know if Dave has ever mentioned a Broadway musical in his chats, but I think there are two musicals which far surpass their original genre. Both by Stephen Sondheim: “A Little Night Music” and “Sweeney Todd”. It’s no wonder that opera companies perform these. I just saw a preview of the B’way revival of “Sweeney”. What an extraordinary masterpiece by any standard.
Your list of song topics other than love reminds me of P.G. Wodehouse's appreciation of modern poetry: "... and James had to read to her - and poetry, at that; and not the jolly, wholesome sort of poetry the boys are turning out nowadays, either - good, honest stuff about sin and gas works and decaying corpses - but the old-fashioned kind with rhymes in it, dealing almost exclusively with love." (From "Honeysuckle Cottage", in "Meet Mr. Mulliner, 1927.)
I call "Classical" music "UNpopular" music to distinguish the two.
Or, as Dave Barry wrote: There are two types of music, classical and popular. Classical music, by definition, is not popular.
'Serious' music and 'entertainment' music is quite a useful distinction.
The main problem is that each individual has his own ability to perceive music. Each human brain is sensitive to a different aspect of music - and some do not listen to music for any of its musical aspects, or perceive something that others simply cannot. One has to be tolerant of others' tastes because you never know what kind of enjoyment you might be missing. Anyway, you should never get stuck in too narrow a spectrum of genres/styles/composers and deprive yourself of discovering the wealth of music available.
I usually ignore lyrics.
About deviding popular music in decades:IMHO this makes some kind of sense, because the technical changes match the turn of the decades. The Synthesizer in the early 70s, then they became smaller and cheaper in the early 80s, so that everybody could use them. In the late 80s you have the Computers entered music (House, Techno).
It's more an organisational thing as well. You can also do this by year, just to see what styles were around at the same time, what different parts of the world did. To have things randomly put together makes it hard to find things too.
A great question... I've been playing classical guitar since I was 10 and played in several Rock bands in the 80's. I do enjoy a lot of "todays" music but ultimately, I continue to be drawn to the classics, whether it is guitar, symphonic, orchestral, well, you get the picture. Happy listening😊
Lieder are (almost always) musical settings of poems and this intimate marriage of words and music is what characterises them. The greatest exponents of lieder writing in history set poems that appealed to them. Vaughan Williams spent his entire life looking for texts that he felt he could set. Schubert set largely romantic poets of his day but also great poets of the past. This is why listening to lieder with the words adds incomparably to the experience. It’s a pity to attack the tiny minority who care about this particular marriage of words and music rather than challenge the 99.5% of the population who will go through life without ever experiencing some of the greatest art out there.
This is all total nonsense. You haven't said a single word about the music as such. Lieder could very easily become popular. If they aren't it'sI not because they set "poems"--many popular songs have words every bit as poetic--but because they have never been promoted in a popular way. That's it. It is you and those like you, who seek to place classical song in a hermetically sealed musical ghetto, that do it the greatest disservice.
I can think of two Schubert songs right off the bat that became so popular that they were and still are regarded as folk songs. Der Lindenbaum (No.5 Winterreise) and Heidenroslein. If they'd had royalties in Schubert's day, he'd have been a rich man and could maybe have afforded a good doctor.
I won't even mention Brahms and his Lullaby. That would have gone platinum in his day.
I always say that there are two kinds of music - music you like and music you don't. Calling it good or bad is a judgement one can make, but someone else is likely to disagree.
But listening experience helps. And marketing and peer pressure can be more important to some than music.
I'm a lover of novelty songs. My hero, besides Dave that is, is DR. DEMENTO who had his own syndicated radio program during the 1970s. One of the songs he use to play was I WANT MY BABY BACK by Jimmy Cross. You can most likely find it here on UA-cam. The songs is hilarious and has a subject matter that not many would like to get into. I know folks, I'm a sicko, but it's too late for me to change. Keep them coming, Dave.
@@ColonelFredPuntridge Yes indeed, TOM LEHRER. The Vatican Rag is my favorite song by Tom, but he had so many good ones. Thanks for the response.
Weird Al, Flight of the Concords? How do you rate them as a novelty fan?
@@GG-cu9pg I like Weird Al, especially his song I'LL BE MELLOW WHEN I'M DEAD, but as with Tom Lehrer, Al has had so many good ones. Hope I don't disappoint you, but I never heard of Flight Of The Conchords. Had to look them up on UA-cam. Like their play on words with Con "CHORDS". I'm an old man who doesn't watch much television and my radio is only on classical music stations, so I guess I'm way behind the times on what is out there. Thanks for making me aware of this group. Will check them out more.
@@FREDGARRISON On the contrary, you’ve given me some good ideas, thank you! Some of my favourites by Concordes, are “Epileptic dogs”, “Tape of love” and “Think about it”.
I know I am probably in the minority, I am 48 years old and the composer who has moved me the most - to tears (lots of tears!), to wonder, to awe - is Ennio Morricone. Dave always talks about a composer creating “tunes.” Ennio’s introduction of the rock guitar in his scores and his mind boggling ability to create a melody for all-time - makes him one of my all time favorites. I would imagine Dave and others on this channel would not put Ennio alongside Mahler or Beethoven (Ennio wouldn’t put himself next to them!) - but I think he created some of the most important music of all time. Not just in the film category. Themes from Cinema Paradiso, The Mission and especially Once Upon A Time in America /West…they are indescribably moving. Just my two cents.
Where we "put" him is irrelevant. Where you put him, is.
This was a great talk!...First of all, I'd like to point out that Pete Townsend from The Who wrote a song about deodorant *Odorono* from The Who Sells Out...but yes, I agree it shouldn't be a question of genre or time period, but a simple and personal assessment of whether any song/piece is good or bad...in my opinion, songs like Yesterday, Eleanor Rigby, She's Leaving Home, Fool on the Hill, the Long and Winding Road, etc, are just as good as ANY lieder I've ever heard by anyone that we love in the classical realm, perhaps in the future these dividing lines will be blurred beyond recognition
In the seventies, when I was a teenager and started to listen to rock music, the kind of rock music I listen to was rather complex, often long songs with instrumental passages or like suites with different songs glued together, often with inspiration from classical music. The style was called progressive rock music but here in Sweden we called it symphonic rock musik. Being used to that, it was a lot easier to start to listen to classical music. Compare it to today’s music, if it’s rap music you like, what could get you interested in classical music? To me, it was only natural to start to listen to classical music. Emerson, Lake and Palmer was a rock group that made their own adaptation of Mussorgsky’s Pictures at an exhibition. I loved it, and became curious about the original work. So I went and bought it and that was my first record with classical music. But I’m worried that today’s kids are very far from beginning to listen to classical music, because today’s popular music will not inspire them to do so.
Popular songs, perhaps not, but film music, television, streaming services, commercials--classical music is all over the place, and there will always be popular song writers who dip into it now and then. This just may not be a good time, but the wheel will turn full circle. I'm not worried.
And yet Emerson's Piano Concerto seemed to puzzle plenty on either side. I love it and liked it from when I first heard it, but both classical people and prog people (in general) don't claim it as the worthy work it is.
I have a good many classical songs in my collection, going back to the middle ages. I also have a lot of popular music in my collection. I have also come to the conclusion that there isn't a serious fundamental difference between classical and popular songs, and the only conclusion that I can draw about the difference between classical and popular music in this situation is that, once the music is old enough, it becomes classical. At present, this seems to apply fully to songs up to about the 1910s. Jazz-based popular music, which was first recorded in 1917 and became very popular in the 1920s, has not yet been brought under the classical umbrella, though maybe it has become "classical" in all but name. These days, jazz is increasingly viewed as a sort of "art music" and many of the old songs from the heyday of jazz-based popular music are referred to as "The Great American Songbook." That sounds like a designation that could easily apply to a group of classical songs. Maybe a century from now, people will be talking about where rap fits within the umbrella of classical music.
To me the interesting question is whether any "popular" music will become classical by virtue of being played frequently in some form centuries (or a century) hence. It seems likely, imo (and weren't Beethoven and Haydn "popular", not the only kind of popular, as both archived/transcribed folk songs, but still very popular as artists themselves?). Another interesting question is whether popular music (including jazz, folk, rock) coming to prominence (consumption-wise) is a reaction to serialism (aka, the "agony of modern music"), which is not to say that I think serialism made no contribution to popular genres. And of course the fact that there are recordings makes the task of remembering/promoting music much easier, and it's hard to say what the impact of that will be, although we currently live in an age where all forms of music can (and do) co-exist.
@@EnriqueHernandez-zk7qc Dowland is still well remembered (e.g. Sting has an album covering his songs). The second point is that they're not merely songs, but more like song-cycles with extended instrumental parts, as well as something functionally like orchestration. So if you take albums that are about 50 years old (and in some kind of recorded repertoire): Close to the Edge, Dark Side of the Moon, Selling England by the Pound, Lark's Tongues in Aspic, Power and the Glory, Physical Graffiti, Blues for Allah, the Grand Wazoo. There is quite a lot within-band unique-style/orchestration combined with instrumental virtuosity. And that's just progressive/instrumental rock from the 70s. Every decade sort of had their thing, and a whole lot of other stuff was(is) happening in Jazz, which is also part of a "pop era".
It's notable that "songs" dominate rock, pop, folk. However, the idea that singing styles are non Bel-canto, or individually merited/valued given unique timbre/style elements of a voice, and the idea that "composition" is a group thing, are new features of a music era (though I'm not saying classical training won't help with either feature). Maybe serialism isn't driving all these characteristics, but also economics (e.g., pop forms are cheaper to perform), and new technologies that allow cheaper orchestra analogs. IMO, an appreciation of the classics helps to appreciate what's good in the pop-era stuff, and vice versa certainly won't hurt an appreciation of the classics. I suspect popular music becoming "classical" will be for some different dimensions of greatness than classical did, and that's ok, but there may still be an overlap in reasons, at least for some cases.
@@EnriqueHernandez-zk7qc Exactly!!! Thats what makes the biggest difference. Pop musicians will only ever be songwriters. Composers are able to write anything, as you said songs are just the smallest and most banal bit of what music can be. Popular musicans are better compared to ancient folk song-writers
Now i really wanna get a Dave Hurwitz's Top 10 Rap songs in my life
And math rock
I think a lot of the distinctions about classical, rock, country, jazz, etc. were invented by the record industry as a marketing tool. I believe it was Arthur Fiedler who observed, "There are only two kinds of music - good music and bad music." And, of course, that's usually a matter of taste. Speaking of music about furniture, deodorants, or your vacation, what are some of your favorite commercial jingles? Some of those can cram quite a bit of musical content into a very short span.
It's tapping into the tribal aspect too. Saying something is fashionable as against something else. That if you listen to one style you can't listen to another. And when styles are narrowly defined It's likely easier to make money as the music can be less creative.
One thing I've discovered is that a lot of pop/rock/blues artists get a lot of inspiration from classical music, but the people who listen to it tend to dismiss it as boring...
I think that's why the 3 minute pop song came in to replace the, sometimes generally long attention span of most classical pieces...
It seems to me when watching some songs and clips of 60s 70s 80s 90s that every song sounds different, there is is lot of influences of pop, rock, jazz, folk, reggae, electro, ethnic music, etc, made in nice harmony....I am not educated in the styles but maybe by hearing I would recognize something...But today many popular songs sound the same, as boring monotone music with boring monotone text ..It sounds like it was written by computer.
@@alenaadamkova7617 that's because it is written by a computer. I think genuine song writers are a dying breed because they can't think of a new sound or style to woo the public..
Country Western music expresses a universal sense of loss -- the singer has lost his girl, his pickup, his gun, his peace of mind, and sometimes his freedom. "I fought the law, and the law won." Sometimes the singer gets strength from his loss: "I'm going to be a movie star, and I don't even have to act" because I lost my girl, my pickup, my gun, etc. Even in a happy tune there is an undercurrent of uneasiness: "Aboleen, Aboleen, prettiest town I ever seen. Weemohn there wohn treat you mean, in Aboleen, my Aboleen." Those Weemohn! Are they anything like die Walküre?
There are a lot of songs that aren't about love or hate. I would recommend Talking Heads' Songs About Buildings and Food 😂
I like the talk, I deduce from it that you think it is entirely possible that there are sublime masterpieces among pop songs of the late 20th and early 21st centuries, sublime in the same way as our classical favorites. Since I am also of an older generation, I would put some songs by Simon and Garfunkle, the Beatles, Queen, and some others in that category. To me it comes down to getting that feeling that the artist has revealed something utterly profound about the world.
When this video ended, UA-cam hit me with a car ad with the Ramones on the soundtrack.
Well, you made clear in a video a while ago that your partner's taste in music requires you to deal with popular music. I am sure this viewpoint is useful when it is his turn to have music on in the apartment. Blessed are the peacemakers.
He enjoys classical music also.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Well, you seem like a very persuasive person.
We wouldn’t have The Velvet Underground without Aaron Copland, Can without Karl Stockhausen, Sonic Youth without Glenn Branca, or Public Enemy without Branford Marsalis. Morrissey sampled Shostakovich’s Symphony No. 5 for his fifth solo album. Metallica covered Alexander Mosolov’s “Iron Foundry,” while Killing Joke’s Jaz Coleman was composer-in-residence with the St. Petersburg State Symphony Orchestra. It's all just music. The wall between popular and classical music isn’t as thick as some might think.
I'm sure I like a lot of music that others would abhor I happen to be extremely fond of instrumental electronic music and listen to it frequently.
I mean it’s possible to like (just about) anything, right? Especially lighter, tap footing types of music. Then there is the whole other question of what inspires you, what leaves a deep mark, what is challenging and what is rewarding. That is how I look at musical pieces, rather than trying to stereotype, or pigeonhole them. There are pieces I love and pieces I can’t stand in every genre. Probably in between (50% or more) is music I am just ambivalent to. And of course, what you are listening to right now is largely driven by what mood you are in 😊
Streaming services have had a big impact on music, especially Millennials and Generation Z, since you now have essentially all music available for less than $10.00 a month and can be exposed to so much more than my allowance of $10.00 and small record store allowed me to hear. Needing to help people wade through all this music has lead to the hyper over labeling of music into the categories you talked about when discussing rap but it has had a much more positive impact on music itself. There is a lot of very exciting music being made by younger people who have listened to a much more broader range of music because they did not have to pay individually for a record or CD nor were they limited to what they heard on the radio. This crossing of genres is especially true of people who play instruments other than those traditionally found in rock music, like instruments often found in classical music. Post Rock is often the catch tag that is labeled to this music that is branching out, much like Progressive Rock did in the late 60's and 70's. (Note: Phillip Glass, Max Ricther, Nils Frahm and others are often listed as being Post Rock when mentioned in Rock publications like Pitchfork.) This mash up of music is often rooted in classical, jazz, rock, electronic and ethnic centric styles and really gets to the heart of what you said in that it defies categorization and is just music. Sigur Ros, Mogwai, Colin Stetson, Johhny Greenfield (and yes, Radiohead), Goodspeed You! Black Emperor, Snarky Puppy and the granddaddy of Post Rock Talk Talk are just a few that cross the line of classical and other generes. I think it is an exciting time for a music lover and look forward to hearing more.
My musical background was playing bass in a heavy metal band in the late 80s and early 90s. It was pretty easy to move from favorites like Iron Maiden's "Rime of the Ancient Mariner" and Led Zeppelin's "Achille's Last Stand" to classical. Classical seemed to explore similar narrative themes and that drew me in. The difference in sound seemed of lesser importance. Wasn't it Charles Ives who said, "What the hell has sound got to do with music!"
Guitarist of the Queen was playing several months ago From the new world. its on youtube. Its interesting guitar version.
Another way of looking at this argument is that, even if you wish to maintain a distinction between classical and popular music, there is no discontinuous transition from one to the other. Looking at the American musical universe, for example, take the jazz masters, or take Gershwin or Copland, is theirs music classical or popular? No way to tell. Other examples could be drawn from the songwriters (Brel, Brassens, Cohen, etc.).
Ask Dave: How do you relate to contemporary classical music?
Same a popular music. There's no such thing as "contemporary classical music." It's just music.
It seems to me that late 20th century avant guard academism left a void for some listeners which more adventurous popular music filled in the form of progressive pop/soul/rock/rap/etc. bands and artists.
So while the distinction between popular song and “art song” is only different in quality (it could go either way) the difference between other classical genres (even more abstract pieces) and progressive popular music can be just as irrelevant. And as Dave rightly says it’s all music. Some pop may have a classic status in 100 years and lots of “classical” will not.
Related to this, I have always been curious which "non-classical" genres are most represented in your record collection. Do you have a lot of Broadway cast albums, for instance? Jazz records?
Lot's of Broadway, film music, jazz, rock, Zarzuela, Sinatra, Gamelan...all kinds of stuff. Music is endlessly fascinating.
Steely Dan, Beatles and Led Zeppelin would be 'safe' guesses....
You know if we all keep at it maybe we can turn this into the 'Greil' Hurwitz channel. Which might be kind of fun.
Thanks for this great presentation, DH. How would you regard Jazz in all its' myriad forms? There is Trad, BeBop,"Modern" "Fusion" etc.
Jazz is in trouble. You know from the fact that there are so many different types trying to differentiate themselves.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Couldn't you say that about Classical Music? I would respectfully disagree there as well. I think that with Classical Music which evolves, Jazz does the same. At times they merge (Ravel/Stravinsky using various Jazz modes-"Blue" notes to communicate their creations). I think neither Classical Music nor Jazz are in trouble but each evolve, and each evolution leaves behind a perfectly valid form to be enjoyed as time goes on.
My main interest is 20th and 21st century serious music. Almost no interest in popular songs. But occasionally something pops out that sounds great to me. Nancy Sinatra’s “These Boots” has a quarter-tone riff on the double bass. The B52s had guitarist Ricky Wilson whose chord structures were modernist. The opening chord in “Party Out of Bounds” is extraordinary. “Quiche Lorraine” is a tiny masterpiece. Some Burt Bacharach songs are simultaneously spiky and sauve. Nirvana can be almost (don’t kill me) Mahleresque.
Some rock albums really are worth listening to (my main classical musical interests lie in 20th century). Do you know "Spiderland" by Slint (1991)?
I also didn't distinguish between classical and pop. The individual work was always more important than genre or style. It was only in my late teens that I learned of a supposed divide.
Yet I've never gotten comfortable with the term "classical music." We know roughly what it means, but a whiff of smugness lingers about it. I feel similarly about "art music." "Concert music" takes away some of the superiority, but pop is also heard at concerts.
Can anyone suggest a descriptive term for classical, without hierarchical implications?
Music that musicians repeatedly choose to perform and that has an enduring appeal to listeners for its musical merits.
Well it's also known as orchestral music, piano music, chamber music, operatic etc. There doesn't have to be an umbrella term for them. Maybe you could call it composer music rather than songwriter music? Composer suggesting someone who writes in all these different genres.
While I feel your discomfort for the term, when I refer to a genre, I want a recognisable name more than a fitting one. I seldom want to explain in detail what I mean. Genre names can be misnomers but people more or less know what they refer to.
That's the advantage of the term, but it nevertheless carries a lot of baggage. I'm not bothered by the elite implications as such, rather by the barriers they impose on more people enjoying it. We are a sliver of a sliver of a market. Orchestras are going under. Too many conservatory graduates work in other fields. I worry that the plethora we now enjoy will shrink to the point of triviality.
Am I Lebrechting?
I think subgenres can be silly but they are also helpful to find out what you like. Just like a classical music fan might veer towards late romanticism instead of baroque, also a jazz fan might really be into hard bop instead of post-bop and a rap fan prefer hardcore rap to pop rap. Sure, classical music might have a larger variety in form than those genres but that's more of a music historian thing anyway. For the rest of us, genres help us find out what kind of music sounds best for our ears!
Just my two cents on the matter.
It could be useful for judging music in a style, to see what is more creative. But to make music like a supermarket where you just limit what you eat to habit seems against the creative spirit.
@@joebloggs396 yes, totally agree. In the ideal world genres could be used as a helpful way of categorising things in your mind but not a limiting factor. For example, I love all the genres mentioned above!
I can tell by your picture alone....😂
Songs about furniture, deodorant and vacations? That's Frank Zappa's turf. Funny you mentioned that.
@@ColonelFredPuntridge My building has every convenience, it's gonna make life easy for me! (77)
The dangerous kitchen...
Are there any gangsta rapppers you like?
Just curious what your favorite Hard Rock/Heavy Metal song is))
I don't have a favorite song, but I like Led Zeppelin and Black Sabbath, among others. Motley Crue has its charms, with or without the umlauts.
@@DavesClassicalGuide "If I Could Choose Only One Work By . . . . . Motley Crue. Go on, Dave, give it a go!
@@johnenock7939 🙂
My idea is that music should be judged according to purpose or function. I would argue that music meant for dancing should be evaluated differently from music mea t for singing. However, I wonder whether music that really fits a purpose can be regarded as poor in more general terms. Can the music of an opera rhat does not work on stage still be considered great music? Can music for religious liturgies that works well for that purpose be bad in general? Maybe music for the 'moshpit' has to be evaluated, appreciated , differently than music for Symphony Hall.
Though the main function is to engage, to move, to excite. Somebody may not be religious and still love a work in that style. So perhaps art can live outside narrower original intentions.
I listen to popular music to keep up to date with the interests of young people. My nephews and nieces are into Kpop and there are Kpop groups that are fun and entertaining to watch. I don't want to be a fuddy-duddy of an uncle.
to your discussion I would comment with a question.....I have just listened to ''dark side of the moon'' by pink floyds (whose ''celebrated'' 50 years of creation this year).....classical music or popular music...?
As I said, it's a distinction without a difference. The disc is a classic.
"Dark Side of the Moon" is GOOD music. Classical, schmassical! Rock, schmock!
In a certain sense, some Popular Music can be considered "Classical": the Beatles, Pink Floyd, Simon and Garfunkel (just to stay within the realm of what has been mentioned by Dave) have been such a big part of Culture and History of the second half of the 20th Century, we might consider them as "Classics" of the period.
Classics, yes. Classical, no...at least in the case of S&G. Beatles did do some classical music - notably Eleanor Rigby and Revolution #9. Pink Floyd: yes, at times. But classic is something older and still cherished...like a 57 Chevy. Classical is a style.
Bravo. IMO "classical" etc is a distinction derived from record company marketing. A totally artificial distinction.
All of what i listen to falls in the "classical" category of a record store (if such still existed). But i definitely appreciate what you'd find in other sections.
Don Gillis? Did you mean Don McLean in reference to ‘America Pie’.
Of course. If you look at the description you'll see I caught that one. Freudian slip? Anyway, I love them both and there are only so many "Dons" out there.
You obviously know he meant that. lol
Oops. Caught it. Sorry. Sadly, we opportunistic musicians would rather point it out publicly in the comments section, feeding our own egos, rather than take the time to read the description and feel less important. Gotta go back to my hole in the ground now. 😄
Who is Don Gillis (sp?)? I thought American Pie was by Don McLean. Incidentally, a counter example to all pop songs being about love (if this song is about love, that certainly isn’t clear).
Watch the Don Gillis video--we all know it was Don McLean--look at the video description.
Don McClean really loved those guys! (Haha!)
There should definitely be more songs about deodorant.
And toilet paper.
And acne, tattoos and "shaky hands".
Check out collections of classic commercials. You will probably find what you need.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Haven't you ever heard The Who's song "Odorono"?
Nirvana - "Smells Like Teen Spirit" is my favorite in this sub-genre
I think there is a "lowest common denominator" thing that can cause distorted meaning in populist music-a potentially dangerous thing.
There's a difference between "populist" and "popular."
I mean it's up to the audience to decide what it likes, not the composer to decide what the audience will like because too much of the latter could influence public perception in an unhealthy way.
@@adamfrye246 I have no idea what you just said!
The bad stuff in classical gets filtered out more than the bad stuff in popular, imo.
@@adamfrye246 True, as a general rule in classical music, the crap doesn't rise to the top.
I just wanted to quickly mention, since you talked specifically about Rock n Roll as "Rocking and Rolling." In early blues songs it was a term referencing, or kind of code, for having sex, not really dancing. A lot of what is early rock music is based on the blues and heavily influenced by blues and R&B music. That may seem a small point, but sexual references, in early rock and roll and the term itself, created a stir and a backlash among ultra-conservative clergy and church goers. And why rock and roll had a bad rep in its early days, often derided for being "pornographic and obscene." In fact, the classic rock and roll song "Louie, Louie" was investigated by the FBI. They listened to the song and did a complete listening test in the FBI Lab and finally issued a full report to then Attorney General Robert Kennedy, with the conclusion that the song's lyrics were mostly "incomprehensible." Something rock and roll fans pretty much already knew. Really, it's a true story.
Some people just have no sense of humor.
Are Elton John and Metallica the same genre?
Of course.
They're both just songwriters
NO! Elton John is very tuneful. Metallica is not.
@@spqr369 Both classed as Popular Music. In The Times arts pages, virtually anything can appear in the "Pop' reviews other than classical, jazz or folk. Rammstein, Kylie, Elton, Throbbing Gristle . . . . . all pop.
@@spqr369 There's more to music than "tunes" as you define them.
I think the division of popular music into decades is a cultural side effect. It causes the listener to associate the work with memories of the time it was created.
When I was a teenager I used to listen to classical music crossover prog rock bands but listening to them now they don't stand up.
Check back in a hundred years.
Will do.
Do you refer to bands like Ekseption or Focus? I still like Focus quite a bit; they largely went their own way.
ELP's "The Barbarian" still sounds fantastic to me.
@@johnenock7939 Yes, I heard it again. It's still pretty good, admittedly. I'm thinking of ELP's The Great Gates of Kyiv (unfortunately they spell it with the Russian 'Kiev').
Songs about furniture and deodorant could be interesting 😂
Let’s be honest, most popular modern music is insipid dribble.
True, but not “on message”..
So is most "classical" music, or music of any period.
As it likely was hundreds of years ago...