Those of you bemoaning the engine in question not being preserved, remember we still have "HARDWICKE " of the same class, which was steamed several times in the 70s. Poor old 955 was probably regarded as completely worn out after 2 million miles, she certainly had a short life compared to the Precedents that lasted into LMS days.
IIRC only the NER was really concerned with preserving their history thanks to being the successor to the pioneering Stockton and Darlington Railway. Apart from a couple of broad gauge locomotives the GWR had no interest in preserving their old locomotives even City of Truro almost was scrapped. Those broad gauge locomotives were offered to the NER's museum but never got there are ended up geing scrapped. The reason behind this was the cost, the boards of the other railway companies other than the NER didn't see the point of paying money to retain old locomotives and rolling stock.
I kind of see a bit of myself in No. 955; I'm a creature of habit, I don't ask for much, I just do my job and I do it well, and I'm reasonably content with my place in the world. Who could ask for more?
The US equivalent to the LNWR was the NYC,as two classes of locomotives,were never preserved either,(and both were world famous),I'm referring to the J Class Hudsons,and the S Class Niagaras,none of which was saved! The Railroad President didn't like steam engines,however,one L Class Mohawk(4-8-2),did get preserved,and that against the odds! That's another story,and for later! Thank you,for a footnote,of history,that would be never seen otherwise! Thank you 😇 😊!
2 million miles? Imagine that! The LNWR engines have a distinct aestetic I find very pleasing. The President class is one of my favorites alongside the Webb compound 0-8-0s (maybe a video on those in future?) Charles Dickens shares the year of death with Tristan of the Royal Bavarian Railways, two majestic engines gone forever.
Anthony, thank you for this superb documentary. I live not far from Dickens house in Broadstairs. It is extraordinary that you do such deep research into these locomotives and things that surround them.
This locomotive is really ironic considering Dickens hated steam locomotives and trains, thinking them Industrialist and too Utilitarian, at least from what I read.
Interesting video. For that era, 100,000 miles a year was very creditable. In practice it allows for six trips a week from Manchester to London and back (about 400 miles, 2000 miles in total), allowing time for routine maintenance such as boiler washouts and replacement of worn brake blocks, and more major jobs such as turning tyres, which requires the wheel set to be dropped and removed and might keep the engine out of service for at least a couple of days. I don't know how often locomotives in that era went between major repairs, which would require the locomotive being recalled to Crewe works and being out of service for at least a couple of weeks but I suspect it was dictated by regulations controlling boiler inspections and the periodic need to replace driving wheel and connecting rod big end bearings, which were bronze and white metal and I would be very surprised if these would last much more than 100,000 miles.
Yes I do too, such a shame, for such a huge company to be so under represented in the preservation world. Still I look forward to seeing the Patriot when she's completed. Not LNWR, I know but we'll rooted in it....
Lucky the sister engine Precedent Hardwicke survived long enough into the twenties era of preservation to get preserved. As covered by Anthony : ua-cam.com/video/3Q8Eiy7ATBk/v-deo.html The doyen of them all according to Anthony's valued opinion. Only much later did the idea of multiple examples of a class become likely, eg only Flying Scotsman of a large class. The racing record helped too. What should be the priority , another Precedent or Lady of The Lake.
An amazing achievement for such a simple machine. It causes me to wonder about mileages of some modern traction on withdrawals? What a pity it didn't make it to the preservation era.
Could you cover the Webb compounds. Thanks for the video. To me, the Victorian railways are the most interesting time in railway history, and perhaps the most innovative.
Dickens had been dead for twelve years by the time 955 came along. But yes, a bit.... tasteless. Then again, there was also a locomotive named William Huskisson.... soooo..........
I spoke with an old engineer, who worked on that locomotive named Huskisson. He told me that after the accident, the locomotive had an odd gait. That the motion was a bit stiff. It would occasionally stop dead on the tracks, as if struck by a rocket. And if you don't believe my story is true, just ask the deaf man, he heard it too!
@@AnthonyDawsonHistory Naming something, memento mori, is a long standing tradition. Even the LMR had a glass carriage named Huskisson, for obvious reasons.
How was the mileage ascertained? I assume there was not an odometer on the locomotive and that it could only have been from a log book, kept for servicing interval purposes.
By the Recording Clerk. Very detailed logs of miles run were kept, including total fuel and water consumption as well as oil, grease etc. I've seen the statistics for Charles Dickens and they're mind-boggling. I'll dig them out.
What a lovely story and what a valuable insight into late Victorian railway operation! I think the policy of one driver one loco is so enlightened and led to those pictures we all know of Victorian/Edwardian engine drivers polishing all the brass fittings and buffing up the paintwork so that the engine flashed in the sunlight. Steam engines are proper characters and getting to know their individual quirks is the route to driving well. Part of the background to all this is that the LNWR were right sticklers in the accounts department, declaring refurbished engines as newbuild (ie "investment", not "maintenance") to avoid (not evade!) tax. This happened particularly with the Precedents, encouraging their longevity.
Depends on if the loco is named. If it has a name like “Charles Dickens” or “Flying Scotsman”, the loco could be male. It might be female if you’re fond of the engine. Ultimately I just call them all “it” to make it easier.
I imagine there were no speedometer or mileometers back in that era. So was the mileage estimated by a clerk keeping track of the diagrammed mileage it would have run if it ran the services it was supposed to. Hopefully refined by excluding the major repair of failure occurrences. Or was there some other way the two million miles was arrived at?
It would have been estimated by the Running Clerk or Running Foreman based on numbers of trips made between Manchester and London. Mileages for every engine were kept with repairs and overhauls X thousand miles run. The LNWR also kept detailed logs of cost per train mile as well.
Whilst the Precedents look lovely in photos, pictures never really do it justice. First time I saw Hardwicke at Shildon, I was totally blown away. And it’s not just a pretty face, I think one of them did 80/85 mph.
Those of you bemoaning the engine in question not being preserved, remember we still have "HARDWICKE " of the same class, which was steamed several times in the 70s. Poor old 955 was probably regarded as completely worn out after 2 million miles, she certainly had a short life compared to the Precedents that lasted into LMS days.
#955 has been immortalised in a scene in the stonework fascade of Crewe townhall.
Disappointing to hear that after setting that unprecedented and unequaled record no one thought to preserve the Charles Dickens
IIRC only the NER was really concerned with preserving their history thanks to being the successor to the pioneering Stockton and Darlington Railway. Apart from a couple of broad gauge locomotives the GWR had no interest in preserving their old locomotives even City of Truro almost was scrapped. Those broad gauge locomotives were offered to the NER's museum but never got there are ended up geing scrapped. The reason behind this was the cost, the boards of the other railway companies other than the NER didn't see the point of paying money to retain old locomotives and rolling stock.
I kind of see a bit of myself in No. 955; I'm a creature of habit, I don't ask for much, I just do my job and I do it well, and I'm reasonably content with my place in the world. Who could ask for more?
The US equivalent to the LNWR was the NYC,as two classes of locomotives,were never preserved either,(and both were world famous),I'm referring to the J Class Hudsons,and the S Class Niagaras,none of which was saved! The Railroad President didn't like steam engines,however,one L Class Mohawk(4-8-2),did get preserved,and that against the odds! That's another story,and for later! Thank you,for a footnote,of history,that would be never seen otherwise! Thank you 😇 😊!
That was a sad end for a notable locomotive, particularly since it was named Charles Dickens.
2 million miles? Imagine that!
The LNWR engines have a distinct aestetic I find very pleasing. The President class is one of my favorites alongside the Webb compound 0-8-0s (maybe a video on those in future?)
Charles Dickens shares the year of death with Tristan of the Royal Bavarian Railways, two majestic engines gone forever.
I just might do something.... perhaps on both?
@@AnthonyDawsonHistory That would be lovely!
Anthony, thank you for this superb documentary. I live not far from Dickens house in Broadstairs. It is extraordinary that you do such deep research into these locomotives and things that surround them.
Many thanks!
This locomotive is really ironic considering Dickens hated steam locomotives and trains, thinking them Industrialist and too Utilitarian, at least from what I read.
Always entertaining!
Was the 2M noted at the time, or is this strictly modern notice?
It was noted at the time and the LNWR made a big thing of it - they had an excellent, and very modern, PR department.
Interesting video.
For that era, 100,000 miles a year was very creditable. In practice it allows for six trips a week from Manchester to London and back (about 400 miles, 2000 miles in total), allowing time for routine maintenance such as boiler washouts and replacement of worn brake blocks, and more major jobs such as turning tyres, which requires the wheel set to be dropped and removed and might keep the engine out of service for at least a couple of days.
I don't know how often locomotives in that era went between major repairs, which would require the locomotive being recalled to Crewe works and being out of service for at least a couple of weeks but I suspect it was dictated by regulations controlling boiler inspections and the periodic need to replace driving wheel and connecting rod big end bearings, which were bronze and white metal and I would be very surprised if these would last much more than 100,000 miles.
What a fascinating story! Thanks for sharing.
Glad you enjoyed it!
I have to say I have a fondness for LNWR engines, especially their single wheelers. Shame the did not keep this one.
Yes I do too, such a shame, for such a huge company to be so under represented in the preservation world.
Still I look forward to seeing the Patriot when she's completed.
Not LNWR, I know but we'll rooted in it....
Lucky the sister engine Precedent Hardwicke survived long enough into the twenties era of preservation to get preserved.
As covered by Anthony : ua-cam.com/video/3Q8Eiy7ATBk/v-deo.html
The doyen of them all according to Anthony's valued opinion.
Only much later did the idea of multiple examples of a class become likely, eg only Flying Scotsman of a large class.
The racing record helped too.
What should be the priority , another Precedent or Lady of The Lake.
Would had been lovely if the loco was preserved being honest but agree that everything cannot be preserved, great video
An amazing achievement for such a simple machine. It causes me to wonder about mileages of some modern traction on withdrawals? What a pity it didn't make it to the preservation era.
Great video pf a great engine they certainly were good .
Many thanks! They certainly were!
Could you cover the Webb compounds. Thanks for the video. To me, the Victorian railways are the most interesting time in railway history, and perhaps the most innovative.
Maybe. But I suspect the "but the wheels went round backwards" brigade mught not like what I have to say about them!
It must be unfortunate to have an engine with your name after you've been traumatized by being in a train crash.
Dickens had been dead for twelve years by the time 955 came along. But yes, a bit.... tasteless. Then again, there was also a locomotive named William Huskisson.... soooo..........
@@AnthonyDawsonHistory Had absolutely no idea there was a locomotive named after Huskisson. That feels like a bad omen.
I spoke with an old engineer, who worked on that locomotive named Huskisson. He told me that after the accident, the locomotive had an odd gait. That the motion was a bit stiff. It would occasionally stop dead on the tracks, as if struck by a rocket.
And if you don't believe my story is true, just ask the deaf man, he heard it too!
@@firstnamlastnam2141 Well yeah. It's a bit tasteless....
@@AnthonyDawsonHistory Naming something, memento mori, is a long standing tradition. Even the LMR had a glass carriage named Huskisson, for obvious reasons.
How was the mileage ascertained? I assume there was not an odometer on the locomotive and that it could only have been from a log book, kept for servicing interval purposes.
By the Recording Clerk. Very detailed logs of miles run were kept, including total fuel and water consumption as well as oil, grease etc. I've seen the statistics for Charles Dickens and they're mind-boggling. I'll dig them out.
Staplehurst Rail Crash in Kent.
Loved it
👍😊
At 2.39, is that the origin of the expression "go like the Dickens"?
One can only presume so!
Dickens is another name for the Devil
What a lovely story and what a valuable insight into late Victorian railway operation! I think the policy of one driver one loco is so enlightened and led to those pictures we all know of Victorian/Edwardian engine drivers polishing all the brass fittings and buffing up the paintwork so that the engine flashed in the sunlight. Steam engines are proper characters and getting to know their individual quirks is the route to driving well. Part of the background to all this is that the LNWR were right sticklers in the accounts department, declaring refurbished engines as newbuild (ie "investment", not "maintenance") to avoid (not evade!) tax. This happened particularly with the Precedents, encouraging their longevity.
Seems criminal that they scrapped her...him...them...
Ah! The pronouns!
Depends on if the loco is named. If it has a name like “Charles Dickens” or “Flying Scotsman”, the loco could be male. It might be female if you’re fond of the engine. Ultimately I just call them all “it” to make it easier.
I imagine there were no speedometer or mileometers back in that era.
So was the mileage estimated by a clerk keeping track of the diagrammed mileage it would have run if it ran the services it was supposed to. Hopefully refined by excluding the major repair of failure occurrences.
Or was there some other way the two million miles was arrived at?
It would have been estimated by the Running Clerk or Running Foreman based on numbers of trips made between Manchester and London. Mileages for every engine were kept with repairs and overhauls X thousand miles run. The LNWR also kept detailed logs of cost per train mile as well.
Whilst the Precedents look lovely in photos, pictures never really do it justice.
First time I saw Hardwicke at Shildon, I was totally blown away.
And it’s not just a pretty face, I think one of them did 80/85 mph.