My guess is that perhaps a beartrap was added to the rectifier socket because the 5AR4 often has fewer pins (only 5) in the octal base than a 6V6 does (7 or 8) and therefore can be more prone to working loose and either vibrating microphonically or perhaps actually falling out of the socket. Unless you're changing the socket to a new one where the contacts are closer to the tube base, it might be a good idea to leave that beartrap in place.
I had a nice Princeton Reverb, It burned up in a fire. Had a nice Altec speaker in it, too. I owned it for 35 years. I hated the idea of throwing it out but there was nothing left. I might have been able to salvage the chassis but sometimes its easier to just let the thing go. This was unfortunately one of those times. A Deluxe Reverb, too.
When Crime Converters first came to my area (late 80s?)... I waltzed in for a squiz & theres a Blackface Princeton for $350.. l thought it was a SS reissue til l tilted it forward & saw valves & a covered reverb tank. I raced in next morning & the bastard was gone!! Thirty years later, lm not spewin at all!!! Edit: luv ya work Brad, wish l cd do it.👍
What are "crime converters"? Something like a pawn shop? Back in the 80s I bought a Rivera era Fender vibrolux reverb with the Pull-boost pot at a pawn shop for a 100 bucks. A few years after that I bought a silver face deluxe reverb at a pawnshop for 60 bucks without a speaker.
@@goodun2974 Fkn well done mate!! Both gd scores..l don't seem to have the luck! A mate got a King of Tone pedal & an MXR (some Japanese amp makers design) OD cheap... Cash Converters is Crime Converters & yeah it's a pawnbrokers, scammers paradise. With the Princeton (l missed) l rekn they phd a guitar shop & asked the price retail (the solid state ones were about $380 new). They definitely didn't know they had a 60s BF!! I still check out hock shops in the hope, glad you did well tho.👍
They used chip board for the baffles even in the late 60s. I have a 1967-8 Super Reverb that came with a chip board baffle (long since replaced). It's screwed to cleats like you'd expect in a blackface, but it's not plywood.
What an absolute disgrace! How do these tech's not get shut down. I'm so glad, Brad, that there are still good tech out there like you and Lyle. This is a disgrace to a good classic amp.
I do use dielectric grease on some connections, but it's expensive Dow Corning silicon dielectric grease. Unless it's a tail light on a car you won't even know it's there, because I wipe a tiny bit on the pins and then gently wipe almost all of it off. Oils and greases will collect dirt, and they can also degrade the phenolic in the tube sockets. If you play with guns you know all about the dirt collection all to well and if you work on 1970s stereo equipment you know what they do to phenolics too. You don't need a big ass glob of grease on any tube socket. 99-1/2% of it will just melt off from the heat.
A thin film of silicone dielectric grease is generally OK on low voltage DC connections like your automotive lamps but from what I've read it can cause formation of insulating borosilicates on connections that carry AC. Some years ago, before I had heard about this, I tried using silicone grease on the contacts of a known to fail rotary power switch in an old Kenwood receiver and the switch failed more quickly than it would have if I had just polished the contacts and left them dry. Also worth noting that years ago Cramolin was being promoted as a contact preservative for electronics,, a local shop tried using it on speaker relays in audio equipment and discovered the contacts would turn crusty green. Don't know if it was exacerbated by AC audio currents passing through it or the small amount of DC offset present in most old receivers, but anyway the stuff was bad news!
I know, right! Someone digging into the parts bin. I never understood that. If it was removed and replaced from another device, why would you think it was good to use again? The mind boggles.
Gotta love burnt 70's spaghetti Brad. I'd love to build a Princeton. But I prefer the pre '65 circuit. Which is the best blackface Princeton circuit AB763 ?
I've been thinking, I could just use my dremel and cut a slot between the phase inverter plate supply and grid bias supply to stop any leakage there. The path around it should be long enough where it ceases to be an issue and I don't have to fly any components which I don't really like to do. Can you think of any downsides to doing it that way?
@@BradsGuitarGarage , Although they are not inexpensive, you can buy insulated turret posts that have a threaded metal base and are designed to be mounted with a tiny bolt or machine screw from underneath, and which have a nylon or ceramic spacer between the threaded metal base and the turret on top. In a worst case scenario when you really need maximum voltage isolation they could be mounted to any phenolic board or a Fender eyelet board, even right through the existing eyelet, and then you can fasten the B+ plate voltage or bias feed and associated components to the turret, which will be completely isolated from the board. I have a small stash of these, new old stock from decades ago, and I figure they would be helpful for allowing the big hot board-scorching, antrace-burning dropping resistors found in blues juniors and hot rod deluxes to be securely mounted to the top of the board if the foils are too damaged to reuse.
Big blob of silicone or hot glue "anchoring" the power cord instead of a cable gland or clamp; and I saw lots of little bits of solder scattered around in there too. What a mess!
@@BradsGuitarGarage, By the way I posted my first UA-cam video this morning ---- totally amateurish and likely to give people motion sickness! ---- but anyway I stopped at the transfer station a.k.a. "The Dump" to drop off some trash while I was on the way to work, and took a video of the nearly full walk-in dumpster for e-waste. The amount of electrical appliances and electronic equipment that we throw out is staggering, and what you'll see in the video is only 4 days worth of collection from a town of about 4900 people.
Man it seems like every cobbled silverface ends up in Australia lol. The few I've had were never even re-capped. Its two extremes, either they've had zero maintenance, or they've been hacked up by cousin Bob.
I discuss that with the customer and see if they're interested. I have a 5E3 here I built that I use to demonstrate the difference. They often decide to install one. And in this one they do, but that's a bit of a spoiler, so I'll leave it there.
" Hey what's that you're watching"? "I'm watching a movie about alien landscapes but it's really boring". "That's not a movie youre watching, man, thats a test pattern, man"!
@@BradsGuitarGarage I can't find an "aww shucks" emoji 😬 but yeah wow, the moment you see burnt or melted wires, you just know you're in for a good time lol
@@BradsGuitarGarage, I was watching it live and saw the chat stream for a fraction of a second and then it disappeared while the alien landscape was still playing, but I refreshed it a few minutes after the video stream began and then the chat showed up....
Has a guilty tech ever recognized these amps and made any comment? Like "oh crap, yeah I sucked back then" or "no that's the best work ever, you just can't recognize quality"? Heh.
Often, the previous "tech" is a player/DIY'er (or their friend) who reads a few gear blogs and then thinks of himself as a "tech". That amp is indeed a mess.
I hate following behind someone who makes a mess, and clearly thats what you have. People who melt wiring, need to practice on something else. Likewise, people who mix up wire termination and leave old filter caps connected, have a lot to learn. Some techs are craftsmen and some are hacks. Units sold here in the United States are usually without the multivoltage transformer, no doubt saves a little in manufacturing. I had not seen this feature before, but always thought they probably offered a multi-tap unit for other markets.
Man, a Princeton is about the nicest practice and a guy can get and some jackasses just went into this Princeton and just made it a mess and it's just a shame to see. Good thing.they got you to straighten it back out... Looks like some jackass sprayed WD40 into all of the tube sockets... What jack assery man...
I only hate pozidrive screws when I have to remove one that somebody else had previously removed and reinstalled with a regular Phillips screwdriver, chewing the shit out of the head. Otherwise pozidrive are generally good , *if you use the right screwdriver bit*! That matter most people aren't aware that lots of Japanese equipment uses Japanese Industrial Standard Phillips screws where the heads are different from an ordinary Phillips. I've been working with tools for over 55 years and I've worked on a lot of old Japanese hifi and yet I only found out about JIS screws in the last 7 or 8 years. Perhaps I would've found out sooner if I was into Japanese motorcycles and had to remove a carburetor...... Some people hate Torx, which seems silly, and other people hate Robertson square drive fasteners, which personally I really like and you'll see used on a lot of things manufactored in Canada. I have a love-hate thing with Allen hex head screws because you really need to determine whether it's metric or SAE Imperial, and whoever was in there before you probably just grabbed the closest hex driver that sort of seemed to fit and then chewed the heck out of the heads.
This new camera / editing is killer Brad; thanks for the upload!
Thanks mate. Same camera for about a year now, but much more lighting gear and a little more know-how.
Good shit. Get that man a beer. A cheap one.
As others mentioned, the new look is very professional. Glad you included the 'Happy Brad' reference in the thumbnail LOL
My guess is that perhaps a beartrap was added to the rectifier socket because the 5AR4 often has fewer pins (only 5) in the octal base than a 6V6 does (7 or 8) and therefore can be more prone to working loose and either vibrating microphonically or perhaps actually falling out of the socket. Unless you're changing the socket to a new one where the contacts are closer to the tube base, it might be a good idea to leave that beartrap in place.
I had a nice Princeton Reverb, It burned up in a fire. Had a nice Altec speaker in it, too. I owned it for 35 years. I hated the idea of throwing it out but there was nothing left. I might have been able to salvage the chassis but sometimes its easier to just let the thing go. This was unfortunately one of those times. A Deluxe Reverb, too.
Ouch, sorry to hear that Alan.
I hope nobody was hurt.
Good timing, working on a SF PR right now. Quite a mess you have to work with there Brad!
Awesome work, talent & wisdom,
wish I was a neighbor to you, I would do all the amp cleaning for you, but learn all your secrets 😅,
that ax in place of the at would sound bad. You sir are one of the brightest
Nice amp Brad..Love the walk thru and tech info...Great video..Ed..uk..😀
I love the Bob Ross intro, Brad. Great stuff
Hey, I was born a few weeks before Xmas in 1971 in australia and Im a quality product.....
When Crime Converters first came to my area (late 80s?)...
I waltzed in for a squiz & theres a Blackface Princeton for $350.. l thought it was a SS reissue til l tilted it forward & saw valves & a covered reverb tank.
I raced in next morning & the bastard was gone!!
Thirty years later, lm not spewin at all!!!
Edit: luv ya work Brad, wish l cd do it.👍
What are "crime converters"? Something like a pawn shop? Back in the 80s I bought a Rivera era Fender vibrolux reverb with the Pull-boost pot at a pawn shop for a 100 bucks. A few years after that I bought a silver face deluxe reverb at a pawnshop for 60 bucks without a speaker.
@@goodun2974 Fkn well done mate!! Both gd scores..l don't seem to have the luck! A mate got a King of Tone pedal & an MXR (some Japanese amp makers design) OD cheap...
Cash Converters is Crime Converters & yeah it's a pawnbrokers, scammers paradise.
With the Princeton (l missed) l rekn they phd a guitar shop & asked the price retail (the solid state ones were about $380 new). They definitely didn't know they had a 60s BF!!
I still check out hock shops in the hope, glad you did well tho.👍
They used chip board for the baffles even in the late 60s. I have a 1967-8 Super Reverb that came with a chip board baffle (long since replaced). It's screwed to cleats like you'd expect in a blackface, but it's not plywood.
I like the sticker on your solder station mate, I have a smaller one but I can't decide where to put it. Should have bought 10 of them!
Can’t wait for part 2!
Just commenting for the 'alg' .... thanks for the video.
wonderfully filmed!
Video is top notch mate - great quality.
What an absolute disgrace! How do these tech's not get shut down. I'm so glad, Brad, that there are still good tech out there like you and Lyle. This is a disgrace to a good classic amp.
All too common, unfortunately.
Good morning Brad,hope the world treats you well today.
Thanks Bruce! Hope you're doing well too, mate!
@@BradsGuitarGarage every day above ground Brad,no complaints
G'day cobber, 2:07 that dog bone handle looks exactly that from a Peavey Bandit 112 silver stripe.
Might have been the same manufacturer. I don't believe Fender manufactured their own handles after the tweed era.
🖤@@BradsGuitarGarage
"Everyone's got a hard on for old valves....." (17 mins 24sec) My Mrs had to ask me what on earth made me laugh so much.......so funny but so true😂
I know your pain Brad. Just had one of these on my bench. The tech who worked on it before did all the same things. Burned wires everywhere.
I do use dielectric grease on some connections, but it's expensive Dow Corning silicon dielectric grease. Unless it's a tail light on a car you won't even know it's there, because I wipe a tiny bit on the pins and then gently wipe almost all of it off. Oils and greases will collect dirt, and they can also degrade the phenolic in the tube sockets. If you play with guns you know all about the dirt collection all to well and if you work on 1970s stereo equipment you know what they do to phenolics too. You don't need a big ass glob of grease on any tube socket. 99-1/2% of it will just melt off from the heat.
A thin film of silicone dielectric grease is generally OK on low voltage DC connections like your automotive lamps but from what I've read it can cause formation of insulating borosilicates on connections that carry AC. Some years ago, before I had heard about this, I tried using silicone grease on the contacts of a known to fail rotary power switch in an old Kenwood receiver and the switch failed more quickly than it would have if I had just polished the contacts and left them dry.
Also worth noting that years ago Cramolin was being promoted as a contact preservative for electronics,, a local shop tried using it on speaker relays in audio equipment and discovered the contacts would turn crusty green. Don't know if it was exacerbated by AC audio currents passing through it or the small amount of DC offset present in most old receivers, but anyway the stuff was bad news!
The replacement can cap is older than the amp. Quality! 🙂
I know, right! Someone digging into the parts bin.
I never understood that. If it was removed and replaced from another device, why would you think it was good to use again?
The mind boggles.
Gotta love burnt 70's spaghetti Brad. I'd love to build a Princeton. But I prefer the pre '65 circuit. Which is the best blackface Princeton circuit AB763 ?
The Princeton Reverb circuit was AA1164.
Very different from the AB763.
With the price of used and/or new amp and conditions of used amp, it makes you want to build your own.
So many possibilities in a DIY build, too!
This is the only way I’m going to have a JCM800 2203. When they appear they’re prohibitively expensive and they’re also hacked to shit on top of it.
I've been thinking, I could just use my dremel and cut a slot between the phase inverter plate supply and grid bias supply to stop any leakage there. The path around it should be long enough where it ceases to be an issue and I don't have to fly any components which I don't really like to do. Can you think of any downsides to doing it that way?
That should work, but so does cleaning it thoroughly.
@@BradsGuitarGarage , Although they are not inexpensive, you can buy insulated turret posts that have a threaded metal base and are designed to be mounted with a tiny bolt or machine screw from underneath, and which have a nylon or ceramic spacer between the threaded metal base and the turret on top. In a worst case scenario when you really need maximum voltage isolation they could be mounted to any phenolic board or a Fender eyelet board, even right through the existing eyelet, and then you can fasten the B+ plate voltage or bias feed and associated components to the turret, which will be completely isolated from the board. I have a small stash of these, new old stock from decades ago, and I figure they would be helpful for allowing the big hot board-scorching, antrace-burning dropping resistors found in blues juniors and hot rod deluxes to be securely mounted to the top of the board if the foils are too damaged to reuse.
Big blob of silicone or hot glue "anchoring" the power cord instead of a cable gland or clamp; and I saw lots of little bits of solder scattered around in there too. What a mess!
Nah, that's just a translucent nylon cable gland. I totally would have mentioned it if they tried to use silicone! Lol!
@@BradsGuitarGarage, By the way I posted my first UA-cam video this morning ---- totally amateurish and likely to give people motion sickness! ---- but anyway I stopped at the transfer station a.k.a. "The Dump" to drop off some trash while I was on the way to work, and took a video of the nearly full walk-in dumpster for e-waste. The amount of electrical appliances and electronic equipment that we throw out is staggering, and what you'll see in the video is only 4 days worth of collection from a town of about 4900 people.
Man it seems like every cobbled silverface ends up in Australia lol. The few I've had were never even re-capped. Its two extremes, either they've had zero maintenance, or they've been hacked up by cousin Bob.
Seems to be the case, mate!
All hacked up by uncle granddad.
Do you typically add a phase inverter grid stop to these?
I discuss that with the customer and see if they're interested. I have a 5E3 here I built that I use to demonstrate the difference. They often decide to install one. And in this one they do, but that's a bit of a spoiler, so I'll leave it there.
" Hey what's that you're watching"? "I'm watching a movie about alien landscapes but it's really boring". "That's not a movie youre watching, man, thats a test pattern, man"!
it's hard to get good techs these days aye
You're one of 'em, big fella!
@@BradsGuitarGarage I can't find an "aww shucks" emoji 😬 but yeah wow, the moment you see burnt or melted wires, you just know you're in for a good time lol
BTW, I don't see the chat stream for some reason.
It typically appears a day or two after initial release.
@@BradsGuitarGarage, I was watching it live and saw the chat stream for a fraction of a second and then it disappeared while the alien landscape was still playing, but I refreshed it a few minutes after the video stream began and then the chat showed up....
@@goodun2974 Weird.
And the chat replay seems to be immediate for the premieres.
It must just be the livestreams that take a day or two to show up.
"Have I ever told you how much I hate flat head screw?"
Seeing as you're sane you really didn't need to.
That's debatable!
@@BradsGuitarGarage Weelll, sane-ish enough.
@@kennieminski7080 , Considering the stresses of daily life, some days the most you can hope for is to be sanity adjacent.
@@goodun2974 I barely even get post cards from sanity these days.
Has a guilty tech ever recognized these amps and made any comment? Like "oh crap, yeah I sucked back then" or "no that's the best work ever, you just can't recognize quality"? Heh.
Nope.
Often, the previous "tech" is a player/DIY'er (or their friend) who reads a few gear blogs and then thinks of himself as a "tech". That amp is indeed a mess.
I hate following behind someone who makes a mess, and clearly thats what you have. People who melt wiring, need to practice on something else. Likewise, people who mix up wire termination and leave old filter caps connected, have a lot to learn. Some techs are craftsmen and some are hacks. Units sold here in the United States are usually without the multivoltage transformer, no doubt saves a little in manufacturing. I had not seen this feature before, but always thought they probably offered a multi-tap unit for other markets.
It seems SF amps were subject to experimentation and abuse on a regular basis.
There is absolutely no reason to use flat head screws. I hate them too
Man, a Princeton is about the nicest practice and a guy can get and some jackasses just went into this Princeton and just made it a mess and it's just a shame to see. Good thing.they got you to straighten it back out... Looks like some jackass sprayed WD40 into all of the tube sockets... What jack assery man...
Major hackage.
You know it, mate!
I've seen worse, though.
BURNED WIRE EVERYWHERE DONT PAY YOUR TECH IN WHISKEY LOL
Just luv fixing others "repairs"... NOT !
I hate philips/pozi too
I only hate pozidrive screws when I have to remove one that somebody else had previously removed and reinstalled with a regular Phillips screwdriver, chewing the shit out of the head. Otherwise pozidrive are generally good , *if you use the right screwdriver bit*! That matter most people aren't aware that lots of Japanese equipment uses Japanese Industrial Standard Phillips screws where the heads are different from an ordinary Phillips. I've been working with tools for over 55 years and I've worked on a lot of old Japanese hifi and yet I only found out about JIS screws in the last 7 or 8 years. Perhaps I would've found out sooner if I was into Japanese motorcycles and had to remove a carburetor......
Some people hate Torx, which seems silly, and other people hate Robertson square drive fasteners, which personally I really like and you'll see used on a lot of things manufactored in Canada. I have a love-hate thing with Allen hex head screws because you really need to determine whether it's metric or SAE Imperial, and whoever was in there before you probably just grabbed the closest hex driver that sort of seemed to fit and then chewed the heck out of the heads.