The Government Was Dumping GUN POWDER In The Ocean!
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- Опубліковано 28 вер 2024
- Welcome to Ron Spomer Outdoors! In this episode, I sit down with Chris Hodgdon and talk about the history of the Hodgdon Powder Company. Get ready to learn some fascinating facts about the history of commercial gunpowder in the United States.
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Who is Ron Spomer
For 44 years I’ve had the good fortune to photograph and write about my passion - the outdoor life. Wild creatures and wild places have always stirred me - from the first flushing pheasant that frightened me out of my socks in grandpa’s cornfield to the last whitetail that dismissed me with a wag of its tail. In my attempts to connect with this natural wonder, to become an integral part of our ecosystem and capture a bit of its mystery, I’ve photographed, hiked, hunted, birded, and fished across much of this planet. I've seen the beauty that everyone should see, survived adventures that everyone should experience. I may not have climbed the highest mountains, canoed the wildest rivers, caught the largest fish or shot the biggest bucks, but I’ve tried. Perhaps you have, too. And that’s the essential thing. Being out there, an active participant in our outdoor world.
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Disclaimer
All loading, handloading, gunsmithing, shooting and associated activities and demonstrations depicted in our videos are conducted by trained, certified, professional gun handlers, instructors, and shooters for instructional and entertainment purposes only with emphasis on safety and responsible gun handling. Always check at least 3 industry handloading manuals for handloading data, 2 or 3 online ballistic calculators for ballistic data. Do not modify any cartridge or firearm beyond what the manufacturer recommends. Do not attempt to duplicate, mimic, or replicate anything you see in our videos. Firearms, ammunition, and constituent parts can be extremely dangerous if not used safely.
Sounds like the Hodgdon monopoly is the primary reason for the extreme pricing. 80$-90$ a lb in Canada now.
wow 🙃
Damn. Primers here are stupid prices. Large rifle magnum primers were 60 bucks at beginning of the beer flu. IF you can find em theyre 250.
There was an online auction in the fake flu times where 1000 primers went for $1300.00 Canadian. Nuts right?
Our govt should never be wasting the public's money. Surplus should be returned to the public.
Waste is the Govt's specialty
Ummmm. They are the ones actively trying to disarm us. What makes you think they would return anything that has any connection to firearms back to us little pleebs. That said, in a perfect world, I agree with you 100%
Amen to that !!!
it should but try getting this Idea Done with The DEMS IN Charge with all of their gun control Crap They want to DO IN OUR COUNTRY !!
It would be and thats why they get rid of it
Have always liked and even preferred Hogdon powders. Certainly still among my favorites. Great interview. Too bad powder costs about three times what it did when I started loading, and sometimes more.
Ten times more than when I started reloading. Yes,,,, I’m that old!!!
So even the government uses ye old "tragic boating accident" but took it one step further.
Well said. 👍😡👍
I met grandpa Bruce Hodgdon in his small booth at the NRA convention in Kansas City in 1981 or 82. He was a very down to earth, straight forward guy who answered all my questions without hesitation. I also got to talk to Elmer Keith at that show.
I live only about 35 miles from Hodgdon’s operations at Herington Kansas. I used to occasionally see one of the Hodgdon family members calling on a local gun store. As far as I know, except for Bob and Bruce on the board of directors there are no family members in active daily management of the company.
Why do we pay so much tax? So the government can waste it! It's not only stupid, and wrong, but wasteful, and goes against the very thing this government was supposed to be opposed to. When is enough enough? When more of us stand up and say "I no longer consent to be governed!"
Taxation is fear-based theft under color of law.
Wars are wasteful business. But just as important, the companies thr government contracts for things like arms often insist on very expensive penalties for early termination being built into the contract, so it can actually be cheaper for the government to accept then throw away the product rather than cancel the order when it isn't needed anymore.
Another example from WW2 is that they were still building B-24 bombers even after the war ended. Those planes would roll off the production line and go straight to the scrapyard. Too costly to stop building them. Also, the government had lots of demobilised soldiers coming home and needing work, cancelling production would have meant the B-24 factory workers would be put of a job and competing with all the returning GIs.
@@nerd1000ify Neither of these points absolve the government of wasting our money, because both wars WW1 and WW2 weren't our business to begin with. If our politicians had bothered to study up on the writings of the Founding Fathers, and the wisdom gleaned from 1000+ years of history they discussed, we would have avoided the traps of foreign entanglements. It's Our money, not theirs, our military is for defending this country, not everyone else's countries thousands of miles away. Look at the trillions of dollars we have wasted just since 2000 on pointless wars, and LOST on every front, and we haven't even dipped into how much the NATO alliance has cost us. Where would we be if we had remained neutral through all of those wars? A hell of a lot better off as a Nation and a much richer Nation, which would be admired and respected around the world, rather than joke we've become.
@wod5203 In case you were unaware, the US only became a combatant in WW2 when the Japanese attacked first. So I think it very much was the USA's business, self defense being a fundamental principle of the constitution and all that...
@@nerd1000ify Why did they attack us? It wasn't because our 'diplomats' were doing everything in their capacity to disregard or dishonor the Japanese diplomats? It certainly wasn't because we offered aid to the Chinese who were actively engaged with the Japanese was it? It wasn't because Hitler allied with Japan and directed them to provoke us because we were also dirty-dealing with European partners actively engaged with Germany. So yeah, if we had had minded our own business and avoided foreign entanglements, we wouldn't have wasted our resources, lives, and wouldn't be the worlds police force now.
Not only great products, but an absolutely wonderful family. Hodgdon has a powder for just about any need, and they back them up with the best reloading manuals in the business, which really matters, especially for newbies. I learned to handload when I was just a kid, and proudly sported a big brass Hodgdon belt buckle all through high school. Can't say enough good things about them and their products. Thanks for the great interview Ron.
He should be ashamed because of powder selling for $52.00 a lb.
I used to buy pulled powder in 2.5 gallon jugs for 35.00 shipped to my door. Same guy would sell casings and the pulled bullets. I used to get the ap and apit in 500 count bags for 20.00 each and a box of 2k count casings for 50.00. F!! I miss those deals.
Powder in the ocean and now powder in the white house…
Must be where all the RL-26 and Trailboss went
For sure, easier to find unicorn shit.
POV: you ran out of tea to dump in the sea
Interesting tale on the history of a fine company. Thanks, Ron
I live up in Canada and if it wasn't for you guys we would have no powder Alliant it's absolutely nowhere to be found. So I want to thank you guys for keeping us going up here.
Thanks, Hodgdon Thank you, Ron great information from Mr. Hodgdon
You should have seen the numbers of M60 barrel assemblies (with bipod) we used for rebar in concrete in Germany! This was in 1967-68.
Seriously? What am I saying. Of course they were used. Those pesky rebar shortages cause folks to be creative.
If they were shot out, I could see that.
We, at the time, had to remove them from the plastic bags and throw away the vapor wrap.
@@LRRPFco52 Brand new.
@@davidmuse8548 That's waste/fraud/abuse, but also SOP for the garritroopers in-charge.
Very nice interview Ron. Thank you
Thanks Chris! Love your Powders, keep em coming!
I sure would like to believe that the consumer, or the handloader is where your heart lies, but it sure is hard when all these manufacturers are pumping out loaded ammunition, and there’s no powder available to the hand loader
I was going to Gunsmithing School in Susanville in 1951 and started in reloading. One of my buddies a WW2 Marine vet, also a reloader, he arranged to order 400 pounds of 4895 from Hodgeon, it came in a RR car all strapped down in the middle of the car. We all splurged and I got 15 pounds which cost me $10... what a deal!
Thank you so much Chris I have been handloading since the early 70s!
"We have all the brands that everyone knows."
Hodgdon sounds more and more like a monopoly as the interview goes on.
It is, but who cares. They make a great product.
@@Yettiattack Monopolies are never good.
@@StudleyDuderight you are welcome to start your own powder company no one is stopping you.
@@Yettiattackstart a black powder company if mommy and daddy government will let you. Its more lacking at the moment with no more Goex
What a treat to get this fascinating history lesson from two very knowledgeable gentlemen! Pls. keep them coming Mr. Ron! Blsgs., SY,gg
When my son and i went to the Philmont Boy Scout camp in New Mexico, there was a shotgun reloading camp sponsored by Hodgdon. The boys LOVED it. They each loaded 2 hulls and got to fire them.
Neat history video.. Much appreciated..
Nothing new with that. The UK dumped millions of tons of ordnance after WW1 & 2 in the waters around the UK. I know, coz fishermen kept finding some and I had to dispose of it - the fun part of being an RN Diving and Bomb Disposal Officer.
Great video Ron. The question about H4831/H4831SC is something I’ve had for a while.
Great video Ron 👍 keep em coming
When you work up the right load for your rifle it feels great going into the field with complete confidence that you can make the perfect shot that makes the perfect hunt a reality.
Try buying 4895 now. I can’t find it anywhere!
I love what you do Ron! Keep it up please and thank you sir!
Used H4831 In My .270 Winchester For Ever 40 Years A Jack O'Conner Favorite Handload . Excellent Powder. Would Buy It By The 8 Lbs Keg On Last Keg Now.
Abandoning taxpayer purchased goods is malfeasance. Dumping hazmat is pollution and littering. Charges ought to be levied in all but extreme circumstances.
Recoup tax dollars, don't waste them.
Great stuff, Ron -- thank you!
Now if only there were primers available we could go and do some shooting.
If you want to help the handloaders I like to see some powder on the Shelf and also at a decent price. I've been loading since the sixties also 3031 IMR back then was around $2.50 a pound I don't call that expensive. I am also a black powder shooter and I will absolutely use nothing but black powder you can have all your substitutes. Also I've been shooting 22 250 and they only thing I will load it with 260 Winchester I have never had point of impact problem with weather change. I do absolutely love H 4831 long cut the cartridge that I use it in I like to have it as full as possible.
Love Triple Seven!
My 6.5X257 loved the surplus 4831!
Bought back in the late 60's
We really need a Blue Dot and STEEL equivalent, Hodgdon. Us magnum shot-shell reloaders NEED it!
Hi Ron, a quick question about logistic .I do believe some hodgdon powders are made in Australia ie ADI 2209 is H4350 ADI 2208 is Vargent . Is this powder shipped to the USA and then shipped back to Australia in the form of canister powders and factory loads
Yes, ADI makes a fair number of Hodgdon's powders (others come from St. Marks Powder in the US and from General Dynamics in Canada). Good question, I wonder if all the Hodgdon packaging is done in the US? Are the same powders labeled ADI less expensive in Australia? That would probably give a good idea if a lot of shipping is involved.
Great video 🎯
They dumped more than just surplus smokeless powders into the ocean. Heck, they just plain sank some ships. They dumped radar equipment, drill presses, milling machines and other surplus manufacturing equipment. Britain foolishly dumped mortar rounds into the Irish Sea only to have wash up on shore.
I believe they dumped all that equipment so it wouldn't slow down the post war economy . It will always come down to protecting corporate profits.
@@garrybrischke53 Fer sher. It would have created a depression that made FDR's run of terror on the economy look like cub scout camp.
Thanks for all the information
Great content and conversation!!!
My fighter squadron would send planes up, drop thousands of pounds of fuel and then land and do this repeatedly so they would be allocated more fuel for deployment work-ups.
Good, thx
They pushed a lot of plains off aircraft carriers at the end of WWII also.
They want us to recycle aluminum cans. I wonder how many cans it takes to make a helicopter that was dumped in the ocean. ( that we are told to keep clean)
Good show
Haven't heard if they returned to making black powder in Louisiana...??? 😲😞
I have been preaching for years, "what makes everything go boom, primers, right"?
It doesn't matter how much or many components are available, (or not available) without primers we are dead in the water. You can acquire as much brass, bullets, reloading equipment, guns, etc as you want, but without primers all you have is expensive components you cant use!
This is why I stockpiled primers, enough to last me the rest of my life
I bought when they were relatively cheap, and they are now in some cases quadruple the price others are paying now.
I dont 'know it all', but i knew that!
The real crime here is the gunshow 'pimps' and others who have created these prices and claim to support the 'shooting sports' are the ones to blame for our current situation.
Oh ya I’ve used pyrodex, lit the front porch on fire as a kid playing with a tub of it lol put it out quickly so no real damage, mom was still very displeased
It is so so heartening to see any great company selling their products on honest information . No freakass mentally disturbed guy in a bikini in a tub of suds claiming he's a girl . Thank God we still have some sanity left .Thank you Hodgdon and thank you Ron Spomer .
Your brain would break if you knew about the number of trans-femmes I know who hand-load.
@@Pyreleaf * You can break my brain, how many?
@@charlessmith4242 three.
@@Pyreleaftheres a pink pistols club or something. Cant remember who what whatever. Sociology minor. No matter how you break a group down, amazing how people can be subdivided into groups no one would EVER expect. Never judge a book by its cover is still appropriate even these days😊
You gotta love ball powder, 748 & 296
Thanks Hodgdon for discontinuing the IMR Enduron powder line 😡
If I only had a choice of 2 powders be clays and stable
Thanks for sharing! Kinda makes me feel older though.
Black Hills? That makes my Mk 262 clone project even more interesting. 🤔
So this is why I am paying double/triple the price for powder now?
1:52 I’ll take 10# at $6.75. Thanks! lol.
So this guy is responsible for the larcenous price increases? The companies selling primers for three times the price it was three years ago smacks of greed as well. The bigger a company gets, the greedier it gets. There are several of the powders shown that have exactly the same load data listed but labeled a different brand. I know of a couple, I'd like for them to list all that are merely re-branded. In this manufactured shortage, it would be nice to have a cross reference for the same powders with different brand labels.
Do they actually make the powders or are they just wholesalers
What happened to Goex, I haven't seen any in a long time ?
4895 loads a 308 AND the 375 Ruger just fine. Better stuff out there now but old timers don’t like to change.
What did this video have to do with the dumping?
Tells how Hodgen got started...duh!
@@johnrebman5718 okay, I get it now. Thanks, 👍.
That does not explain why Ramshot powder is always out of stock.
Hey Ron , felt a little bit weird on this one as you two was a little too much close to each other and it made me think it was too intimid 😅 cheers from aussie land -ADI 😊
Why not, the govt dumped nuclear waste in the ocean 100 miles off the east and west coasts.
What about primers?
Never answered who and where their powder was made.
4227 H or imr what's the deference?
Hey not, hear me out, why not sell the inside ammo to the public, foreign militaries or the private sector? It’d make a pretty good profit and would cut a good chunk of gov money out of the budget.
My truck is 2005 has 180k original owner. 4x4 but doesn't even have power windows. I love it. I wish we could just get a basic truck with no tech garbage for a reasonable price. I'll drive my truck for eternity at this rate.
That is all well and good, but what does your old truck have to do with gunpowder and reloading?
@@bigk4755 oh lol must have been commenting in the previous video.
hmmmmm, i love all these products
Ya can we get some retumbo please
It's a pride of doing things ourselves it's fun
That and dumping guns makes me sick.
our gov. is our worst enemy
We need to start making are own gunpowder
Make some Clays powder! Can’t find it anywhere!
The gov/military has been doing this for years. On my way home from the Mediterranean we had to throw ammo overboard so that the next group got the same amount for their deployment. It’s stupid but it was military. That was in 91.
Yeah, we dumped huge amounts of materiel in the Pacific after WWII and Vietnam. All the stuff we had in Europe we just left there to rearm friendly nations, otherwise I'm sure all of it would have been dumped as well.
The military and the Federal government are entirely separate. Don't conflate the two. The Army existed before there was a Declaration of Independence and before there was any Constitution. Separate systems of laws, codes, and ceremony.
@@exothermal.sprocketYeah but in a lot of cases they have the same sorts of corruption
And now the government claims shortages. Talk about lousy forsightedness.
Yeah, that’s about as stupid as stupid can get.
this is just a tiny fraction of the crap our government does illegally lmao
No wonder Hodgdon raised their prices on us. They were not complaining when the supply was down and prices rose. Thanks Hodgdon!!! Thanks brandon!!!!
Exactly.
If government is doing things like this. There should be some sort of punishment for this. It’s criminal
If it was ww1 that propellant was most likely cordite or similar. Very unstable as it ages .
@@paulsouth4794yes, a lot of powders had (and some still have) a shelf life, and could literally expire due to moisture or chemical decomposition over time.
Making them either dud or worse.
@@paulsouth4794doesn't matter.
@@skydivingcomrade1648
Do you understand that WW I was a long time ago?
Public sentiment and mores were vastly different then than now, and I don’t take it to be my proper place to criticize them. It was their world and their time.
Unless, of course, we presume ourselves to be perfect, which I do not.
@johncox2865 Our Government has a LONG history of wasting American peoples money. Biden's abandonment of Afghanistan 🇦🇫 is just one recent example of criminal waste. My government gets ZERO room for grace, (they don't give it to others). I don't care what excuse or mental illness they used to waste American citizens money.
What part of this isn't the monopoly part ?
Great interview, Thank you. Looks like Hodgdon has a monopoly buying up everybody. You didn't ask the hard questions: Why are so many powders not available ? Are they being controlled by the Government? Who is buying all the powder? And the list goes on and on.
Yes, it's all controlled. This may not seem related, but it is:
ua-cam.com/video/gbUK4cFCTPg/v-deo.html
3:17:30
It is never good when one company buys out all the other companies. Then their is no competition and they can charge what they want. Like we are seeing now. Man....there are a lot of questions iI wish you would of asked him. The upfront truth from this guy would of been nice.
This video was very interesting. I understand a lot more about the powders I use now. Unfortunately, regardless of all of the powders and other components I have on my bench, nothing goes boom without primers. Currently I can only load for about half of the cartridges I use due to the severe shortage of large rifle primers. It would be great if you could do a show about that.
I have been holding out to jump into reloading because of these scarcities, but I think I have been making a huge mistake. I should started ages ago.
Lacking any one component, a cartridge cannot be loaded. The Sniffy- Cackles communist regime known this and no doubt are causing the component shortage on purpose. These tyrant, czar, despot, dictator oppressors will do whatever they can to restrict availability of these products.
Been moulding my own bullets because of ridiculous projectiles cost. Anti lead laws? Started testing pure bismuth and pure zinc in 45 cal including double patched in my 50 FLINTlock. No primers? Percussion caps are primers. No black powder? Substitutes suck in flintlocks but work. Eventually. Pure bismuth isnt bad in handgun. I waterquench straight from the mould. Pure zinc great for rifle. Bismuth expands when it cools. Have to run it through a few sizers starting at 457. Do that with zinc too. Blazer makes 10mm in small pistol primers. 308 match uses small primers. Shortened 454 casull for 45 colt small primer brass. Blazer 45 acp small primers. Hornady ak small primers. Good luck with finding those. All this bull💩left me with trying to figure out work arounds. Saeco 945 is a gas check mould and 45acp still get 850fps plus velocity😊. Slight gun mods. Barrel and spring
If I could only have 2 powders they would be H4895 & unique. Great video.
That and 3031.
@@hoffmiermp yes 3031 would be 3rd choice.
IMR 3031 & unique are my two.
Know where I can buy some H4895?
Ron, there must’ve been some questions you wanted to ask, but you didn’t want to put Mr. Hodgdon on the spot; for instance, the supply chain status, how the delivery venders were knee-capped by the Brandon regime to elevate powders and primers to expensive Hazmat level, increasing the cost of business (all by design,) leading to this shortage through production capacity reductions because merchants don’t want to pay the hazmat fees. The manufacturers could say they were at capacity, but like the hospitals removing 50% or more of their beds, they removed production machinery positions, thus reducing to a lesser capacity. If you think the shortages are C_V_D driven, I have a bridge to sell you in Tucson.
There’s no question that the Sniffy- Cackles communist regime is the cause of the ammunition and reloading components shortage.
Finally someone telling it like it is,hodgdon. Is just a greedy corporation,like all government suppliers.. Fiixing prices,buying up their competitors,and screwing their customers.
2 replies plus mine now and I see none. What a load of 💩. Love to know what they say
Great video Ron and very informative. I will say that I no longer hunt anything anymore, ah but I do have glorious memories. And I will say that I have been reloading for fifty years now and all the critters I have bagged in the past were all shot with one of my loads. And yes I agree with you that it is a special feeling to bag a critter with a load that you made yourself. Now a days I just like to plink, and I plink often as there is a nice gravel pit that I ride my quad the 4.5 miles to do just that. One real nice thing about reloading is you can load and shoot a lot of the calibers that are too hard to get or are way, way too expensive to acquire such as .357 and .44 mag, two of my favorite calibers. Though I have some .243 Win, 30-06, 30-30 Win and .300 Win Mag loaded up that I do enjoy plinking with. Anyway, a BIG thanks to the Hodgdon family and to you Ron !!!
Benchmark is going for $49.99 per lb.! Yikes. Not helpful for this handloader
The price of Primers is just outright criminal level of greed.
And lack of🤬
US Government: "We need to protect the environment"
Also US Government:
we start algae blooms. we are green.
Well back in 1919 environmental protection wasn't something many people were concerned with. Especially the oceans, people thought they were just too big for anything humans did to have any impact.
@@nerd1000ify Which frankly is true. Dumping in oceans is a big bad today, but it actually doesn't harm it as many microbes actually metabolize these chemicals. People forget these chemicals come from the ground to begin with, so a lot of these chemicals are being emitted from the ocean floor regularly. I remember when tons of "marine biologists" were going crazy about oil spills and then while they were trying to figure out the next money making "solution", deep sea algae swam up ate all the oil and sunk back down taking away their payday opportunity.
@DaveSmith-cp5kj there are numerous materials that are environmentally damaging even at infinitesimal concentrations. One example that immediately comes to mind is tributyltin, which caused local population collapses in marine invertebrates simply by leaching out of the anti-fouling paint on ship hulls. Another emerging example is PFOA which is causing many concerns for human health due to tiny amounts contaminating groundwater.
@@nerd1000ify That is what was claimed, but it never was scientifically established. It has been decades later and that decline has continued in other parts of the world as well. We now know it had nothing to do with the chemical, but had to do with the basicity of the water itself.
And this is a huge problem with environmental "sciences". Lots of claims are thrown out and repeated, but there is little (or often none) evidence to isolate something as the cause, only broad conclusions based on correlation.
Is this just to keep it out of the hands of reloaders?
No matter what anyone tells you , yes. It is.
And also put manufacturers at a short
Not really. In the video they dumped the powder back in WW2 and not the recent years.
Back then they'd just about dump anything they couldn't keep or sell. Guns, u-boats, jeeps, aircraft...you name it. Sent it all to the bottom.
No crazy opinions, no BS. This is your best yet Ron. Thank you Hodgdon.
so you don't make gun powder you sell gun powder!
Ron without his hat!!!
Ron you forgot to ask the most important question, what are they doing to fix the world wide powder shortage
Shortage means higher profits for less products.😢
Ammo shortage huh?!?
Are you going to pick up and make TRAILNOSS?!?! Cowboy shooters REALLY NEED TRAIL BOSS!!!!!!!!!