Events since I shot this video (updating as applicable): - Miller has deleted their Instagram which they'd been using to post what appeared to be attempts to mock the authorities trying to find and serve them with court documents. - Reporting is that Miller will not be retained for future projects, though Warner Bros. has yet to make an official statement. - Miller’s Vermont farm is currently housing a mother and her three children, and has been for several months. There are concerns from some sources that the farm is not safe for children (due to the presence of guns and marijuana on the premises), while the mother in question claims to have fled the abuse of her children’s father. - Miller has been changed for burglary based on investigations of an incident in Stamford, VT back in May and given a citation to appear in court on Sept. 26... we'll see if that happens.
I have been away, I missed your excellent breakdowns Vera. You are very even handed. Loved your tmnt vid, and I have been playing tons of SOR 4 too. Excellent game, will grad TMNT when I can afford it
One thing that occurs to me (acknowledging first my deep reluctance to speculate on currently unknown facts/motivations) is that it’s not at all mutually exclusive for someone from a toxic family background to end up with/be manipulated by an abusive partner or mentor. In fact, it’s tragically common. So even if (emphasis on IF) the allegations by the young adult re their family are true, it’s entirely possible that the allegations against Miller are also true. Survivors of abuse are sadly at pretty high risk of additional abusive situations… and yeah, I speak from both personal experience and experience working with other survivors. Mess is definitely the right word…
This is absolutely a possibility, but I didn't want to spend any more time in the quagmire trying to figure out how much of each might or might not be accurate. But yes, these are not entirely mutually exclusive concepts.
It seems that some psychologists find that a fair percentage of child abusers will attempt to gain a “special” closeness with their victims by cultivating the idea that the child’s parents are “abusive” and “toxic”. Pretty easy scam. Most children go through periods where they believe that if only their parents would shape up, they would have the freedom to do as they please.
@@theaureliasys6362 Exactly. In terms of the topic of the video - what happens with the Flash movie - both parties being guilty doesn't change the problems for WB. It just complicates the situation Iron Eyes is in, making their situation much worse.
I was going to express a similar sentiment. One of my best friends had this exact thing happen to him. Parents were queerphobic, he got duped by a fellow queer person with the promise of acceptance, but that person wound up being abusive as all heck. To echo your disclaimers, I want to note that I'm not speculating that this is what has happened with the Miller situation. I just wanted to concur that I've seen situations where vulnerable people can end up in cycles of abuse.
Honestly, I feel like we are wrong if we focus on the fact that Tokata is now a legal adult - as obviously shown, this started while they were a minor, so talking about the entire story, using teenager seems accurate. Furthermore, using grooming absolutely applies here. As a queer person, I understand how this word is being used against our community, yet the term is completely appropriate here, and I honestly think that it is more harmful to try not to use the word to save face. What message does this serve other than to show people that we won't recognize grooming in our own community?
Just checked. While Tokata is now a legal adult, they met Ezra Miller at the age of 12. So, this relationship PRIMARILY occurred while the individual was a minor.
The use of the term grooming only applies if Miller tried to coerce them into a sexual relationship. Since we don't know that for certain, it's not apparent whether that is accurate or not.
@@cryofpaine it actually doesn’t - look it up. More importantly, I was responding to vera’s point that she wouldn’t use the term, though she felt it fit, solely due to the connotation the term has in the modern climate
@@elgranespejo not "solely". It was because the only people using it were sensationalist news agencies trying to push an agenda. No one has officially accused him of such, at least with regard to Tokata. (I don't know if the other person has or not.) And unless you're talking about haircare, yes, "grooming" is explicitly sexual. "the action by a pedophile of preparing a child for a meeting, especially via an internet chat room, with the intention of committing a sexual offense."
Totally agree. And the relationship beginning in childhood and continuing into adulthood is the literal DEFINITION of grooming, so I have no idea why she focuses so much on Iron Eyes being currently 18.
"Remember when you assaulted some people, met a 12 year old, and are now on the run from the law? That wasn't me, Barry. That was all you. Seriously, you need help."
I have some (potential) insight into that confusion regarding "nonbinary" vs. "nonbinary transgender." My former roommate was Lakota and Two-Spirit. The way she explained it to me, Two-Spirit is a gender identity which, if you were categorizing it from a perspective other than Lakota, would be considered nonbinary. However, because it's such an entrenched part of their culture, nobody is really surprised when a Lakota person identifies as Two-Spirit, so it's not considered "transgender" in the same way we think of the term; it's more like, "Well you already thought of me as [fill in the blank gender], I'm just *also* [other gender]." As I hope is obvious from my caveats, I am not remotely Lakota myself, so please don't take my word for it. I just recognized a kinda confusing categorization matter that I had some degree of context for and thought I'd offer what I knew.
I was thinking similarly. Not familiar with the tribe nor their specific practices/beliefs nor even less so the adherence of the people involved here; but I do know that a number of native peoples have practices and beliefs that have things like two spirits/souls in one body, genders in-between or outside of male/female, and genders simultaneously male and female. So, through this particular cultural lens, I can see a more logical reasoning for the wording.
I have several Cherokee friends who identify as both Two Spirit and transgender interchangeably. Some sources say that Native Americans, Pacific Islanders, Indian Diaspora, some African peoples, etc. have traditional Two Spirit-like genders in their cultures. Western cultures have a gender binary because of Christian dualism. Transgenders were formerly thought of as gays and lesbians until distinguished by sexologists in the '60s.😎🧐
@@darlalathan6143 trans people were recognized as such as early as the 20s but the loss of Magnus Hirschfeld’s work really set back grsm studies and even activism by decades.
Really appreciate you posting this op, as I too was vaguely aware of this, but not nearly enough to feel comfortable commenting on it, despite the fact that it didn't sit right with me how Vera considered/discussed non-binary and transgender identities only in the typical western way
THANK YOU! I mentioned this above, my guess is that Miller is being an ignorant white barging into a native space not understanding what is going on and then going further and trying to 'educate' Tokata and save them from the 'abusive' family
A lot of native American cultures had non-binary identities prior to the coming of the colonialist, so the family being accepting of non-binary is consistent with their heritage
If Ezra has been pursuing the victim that long, it is perfectly correct to refer to them as a teenager, since the age is very relevant and a 29 year old pursuing an 18 year old is abusive, even though the 18 year old is (only just) considered legally adult. Grooming is also appropriate, since Ezra wanted to sleep with the teenager as a child. Trying to get a child to sleep with you through non-violent means is called grooming. Corrupting a minor and grooming are synonyms. If you think grooming is a stronger word than abuse ... well, that just makes no sense. I know you are in no way defending Ezra, but by quibbling over the use of such terms (which are accurate) you do give the impression that there should be different rules for abusers who are non-binary. Prince Andrew had sex with a 17 year old. In the UK, 17 is above the age of consent. In the US, where it happened, it is not. In the UK, we consider him an abuser and paedophile. The girl could not legally consent to sex, therefore it was non-consensual. The rules should not be different if he changes his pronouns. We should all be glad that Ezra has been exposed. The problem is if people use Ezra to pretend that all non-binary people are paedophiles and abusers. The danger here is that if you say we should treat queer people differently in these situations, you are going to look as if you are saying that queer abusers should not be held to account. The bigots will then leap on that and say, "You see? They all protect each other, because they are all abusers!" Which is, of course, nonsense. Ezra Miller is not an abuser because they are queer, but neither are they less of an abuser because they are queer. Their gender identity and sexuality are irrelevant. They groomed and abused at least one child and it seems there are more. You are worried that the term grooming is aimed only or mainly at the queer and trans community, but it is not. It is used mostly in reference to straight male abusers going after children. It is a term describing a behaviour that Ezra Miller definitely and obviously engaged in. If Ezra raped someone, would you object to the term rape being used? Must any allegation against a queer or trans person be reduced to something milder to avoid feeding transphobia? Because trust me, that is the worst possible way to "help" transfolk. We all agree that abusers are bad people. They do bad things. They hurt the young and the vulnerable, causing damage that can last a lifetime. Abusers should not be protected to protect the community they come from (but in no way represent) and that community should not say, "Because this is one of ours, the rules must be different and never mind that the victim is also one of ours." Agree completely that "kidnapping" should not be used unless there is evidence that the person with Ezra has been taken away without their consent. In the second case, though, the behaviour described is classic grooming, making it even more appropriate to use that term. Clearly, Iron Eyes is the victim here. Obviously, the victim of grooming by an abuser, possibly also the victim of bigoted parents, however, they clearly respect their child's pronouns and non-binary identity, so I find that unlikely. I have to say that if my child, binary, non-binary or hexadecimal, were being preyed upon by someone 11 years older with an unhealthy interest in pubescent children, I would do anything it took to save that child and we should not judge their attitude to the person who is abusing their child as being their opinion of anyone who is non-binary or trans. The only negative connotation I see is that Chase believes Ezra is trying to manipulate how his child sees their own gender identity. However, as you say, without seeing the full petition, that is very hard to judge. It should go without saying that nobody, not parents, not a creepy abuser, not the authorities, should be trying to control anybody's gender identity. That is for the individual to decide. As someone who wanted to be a boy between the ages of 9 and 12, but ended up very happy being female, I am very glad nobody decided for me that I was trans when I was really just going through a phase. I was left to figure things out and I did, as do kids trans or factory-settings, if allowed to do so. There is nothing to suggest the parents see transgender as negative. Their issue seems to be with the coercion. Bear in mind that parents whose child comes out as non-binary may not see non-binary as a transgender identity, simply because they may not have a full understanding of the nature of either term and that the terms are constantly evolving, which can be hard for the general public to keep up with. Don't mistake confusion or ignorance for bigotry. The victim's family are indigenous. Therefore, their criticism of a white paedophile can be called racist in order to discredit it. Abusers will accuse people of all kinds of bigotries to discredit their allegations. The fact that Ezra has drug convictions surely makes the allegation more, not less believable, Your motives are good, but there comes a time when you just have to say, "This person is a bad person who has done bad things." In the long run, that helps the community, because it shows that you are not protecting or making excuses for members of the community who abuse children. Look at the current situation in the Catholic church to see what happens when a community tries to hide or water down (such as avoiding terms like "grooming") allegations against their own. An awful lot of non-Catholics think all Catholics are paedophiles. Same thing is happening to the trans community when anyone with a trans identity who commits abuse is treated differently by the community than a non-trans person would be. If WB have any sense, they will just abandon the film, but of course, they will go after as much money as they can. Ethics are not important to them.
Great response. You've said much of what I wanted to say. I'll add I think where Vera's frustration with the world "grooming" comes from is the fact that it's overused to defame queer people (alleging they "groom" minors to become one of them, etc) Alleged "grooming" is appropriate terminology for the specific case of Miller, however, based on the testimony of the parents who've come forward. Yes it does stink that Miller has (allegedly) reinforced harmful tropes against the trans community, but it doesn't mean we get to be be pedantic about the language use so the trans community at large looks better. The details of the allegations are what they are.
This pretty much, Grooming is Grooming. Even if Miller is (Seemuingly) reinforcing harmful tropes agianst the trans community, it doesn't change that Miller is/was grooming that girl, and the sooner we accept that the sooner we can properly try Miller for what they are doing.
I wish the article writers would figure out they can respect gender pronouns without making stories hard to follow. When there are multiple separate "they"s or "them"s in a sentence it can get confusing. For example, "They said they came closer." would be more understandable if written as "the family said they came closer." or "they said Ezra came closer."
It's also hard to find articles that respect people's preferred terms in other languages even if there ARE pronouns they can use. I've only found one news site in Spanish that uses "elle" and the " -e" ending for adjectives instead of mas/fem "él / ella" and "-o/a" endings. Made me so happy when I did, despite the upsetting content of the articles themselves. Hope Miller gets help 😬
Its the same thing as if you have multiple people of the same gender. People just like to make excuses for not using they/them pronouns. Like the ridiculous plural argument. When they themselves have probably used it in the singular without really knowing it.
Yeah that's just bad writing in the basic sense like theres tons of situation where you're writting about multiple people that all use the same pronouns, like a group of men, and you would insert names as needed to make it clear which person is doing what
just wanna use this opportunity to tangentially point out that disappearances of indigenous women in america is an ongoing crisis that needs more attention (not implying anyone specifically mentioned in the video is a woman, just this news reminded me of this issue)
As sympathetic as I am for the complexity here, and the current bullshit accusations being leveled against the trans community, I'm pretty sure that the quoted "sexual corruption of a minor" accusation is a pretty clear match to "grooming".
I’m shocked someone as problematic and chaotic as them has the privilege of starring in more than one of the biggest and highest grossing franchises with Harry Potter and the DC Extended Universe. I’m so disappointed in Ezra Miller as they seemed like a funny down to earth person you’d hang out with based on their interviews, and I think they’re a pretty talented actor in the things they’ve done past playing Flash in the DCEU, but they’re a truly chaotic and evil human being that is in dire need of help ASAMFP.
I don’t think Miller ever seemed down to earth tbh or they seemed like the type of person who would automatically go off the rails. When your image is possibly high wild part animal who gets a lot of praise for being themselves how many times has that image ever ended well?
I thought they were pretty good in Perks of Being a Wallflower and was happy to see when it seemed like their career was picking up with being in Fantastic Beasts and the DCEU. Boy has everything, (actor, franchises, etc.) just gone to crap in this situation. At least I can still enjoy Wallflower.
@@PaceFilmsProductions I wonder how much of this was caused by Millers own fan base much like Charlie Sheen’s they cheered on Miller and Miller got lost in trying to appeal to them
As someone with a degree in Anthropology, I can see where perfectly non-transphobic individuals would take exception with calling all non-binary people "transgender" because a lot of non-Western cultures fully acknowledge and embrace more than 2 genders (and, heck, the Talmud talks about 4 or 5 genders and their roles various religious and legal roles and responsibilities). I really don't have the expertise or education or cultural background to state with authority whether or not it's accurate to call them transgender, but if someone belongs to an *acknowledged* 3rd gender, I can see where transgender might not be the most applicable term, which has me wondering if that "Miller has decided they're transgender" thing is less about Takota's gender identity and more about Western conceptions of gender being pushed on them by someone without an appropriate cultural context. Because there is a very big difference between being transgender in a culture with a sharp and widely accepted gender binary and being a 3rd gender individual in a society that's always had that concept. Like I don't know anything about this family other than the Dakota Pipeline activism, so I really can't speak directly to whether they're good and supportive parents or not (obviously i hope they are since all kids deserve that), but I can definitely see where Indigenous parents might have a problem with Miller using Western terms/ideas to describe a very not-Western social gender role.
The entire situation is just so tragic for everyone involved. Relationships are breaking, people are suffering, money is being lost ..not just by big executives but by the people who worked on this movie, people who own theater's . In general people lives are being torn apart...it is very sad.
Don’t feel bad for the people who worked on the live. They got paid. Don’t doubt that. If they didn’t then iatse would have something to say. The people loosing money would be any actors who are paid a portion of revenue and the studio itself. Theatres aren’t loosing money either because the movie isn’t even out. They will just show something else.
It's entirely possible that Takato is accurate about their parents and wanting to escape that environment. But, it's *also* possible that most, if not all, of the accusations against Ezra are true. There is some pretty damning evidence to suggest the latter, at least. I just hope that Takato and any other people affiliated with Ezra are safe or will be able to find safety soon.
Or BOTH could be true to some degree. Someone who is in a not-very-supportive home environment would be more susceptible to manipulation by an older person who seems to offer that support. And, if one is young, one might not immediately spot the issues with the latter, or might not want to admit them if they do, because when you're 17 or 18 you want to feel like an adult who can make your own decisions.
I understand your point, and I agree with your reluctance to use that word right now. But I'm really hesitant to throw away the term grooming, particularly with how often it happens to queer kids after their parents reject them. It feels like conservatives are taking away our ability to describe our own experiences. 😕
I would also say that, ignoring the current political climate around that word and assuming the facts as you present them are true, this is a pretty clear-cut case of grooming.
In a way, I feel like the stuff with Ezra Miller is almost in the background. Yes, what they're doing is obviously bad and they need help or something right now. That goes without saying. However, it now feels more like the focus should be on WB themselves and what they should DO about Ezra and the Flash film. I mean, all throughout the drama, WB has remained silent and done NOTHING about this! That's how I see it at least. Hope I made sense here.
I feel like what else could WB do at this point besides put out a statement along the lines of "We don't condemn the actions allegedly made by Miller,"? And as others and Vera stated, they already made the movie. Should they shelve it (not release it)? I feel what has been stated from another commenter is the best case scenario; just putting it in hbo max and wipe their hands with Miller. 🤷🏾♀️
The legal handling of events after this person turned 18 might be more difficult, but everything before...? If Miller did the things they're being accused _to a minor_ , yeah, they're screwed. A victim turning 18 doesn't absolve the accused.
We don't know the whole story, but even based on their most recent activity prior to this, I would say WB might consider the Flash film to be a busted flush at this point. With these recent allegations, they now find themselves in a more precarious position as you indicated. Such allegations, when they involve children, tend to leave a stain even if they are not true ultimately. Ezra may not realise it, but they are literally driving their career into the ground with their behaviour. Personally, I can honestly see this film being canned, or sold off to HBO Max and not given a cinema release or released directly to DVD/Blu-Ray. I can't see them piling so much money into premieres and press junkets given that even if they don;t have Ezra, their actions and antics will be what all the reporters will want to ask about. So either WB will not release the film, or they will dump it into home video and streaming services. I very much doubt that it will get a cinema release. it might, who knows, but I dont see it. As for Ezra,'s career, this I think will kill it. No studio will hire them given all the baggage. Even if the WB hide them from doing press for the Flash, whoever hired them next will end up having to deal with that flak. No, their career is pretty much done I reckon.
The year is 2222. After centuries of speculation and serching, a single mostly complete copy of the unreleased, and presumed lost, Flash movie is found in an Argentine salt mine, still clutched in the desiccated hands of one Ezra Miller. The day before the planned premier of the lost work, Ezra Miller returns as a salt-lich, exiting the cave with one thousand salt-zombies marching behind him. T H I S W I L L N E V E R E N D, the horde calls out, in one voice. The release is postponed yet again.
So, I’ve been friends with the parents and a lot of people in the Standing Rock community since around the same time. Most, if not all, are supportive of the trans community. Especially their Aunt, who would definitely not allow any homophobia or transphobia to be inflicted within the household. It really does look like Ezra could be renaming Tokata and aggressively pushing a previously unrevealed identity onto them. I believe that trying to use they them pronouns is out of respect, but not properly distinguishing non binary from transgender is due to all of these things being a surprise. All of Tokatas family and friends were unaware up until this point that they were non binary. And, of all of the communications it has been almost entirely Ezra communicating this, as well as using the name Gibson. Which was previously a name Tokata used for family, friends, and their self. It’s plausible that Ezra latched onto that and convinced them that it was their real name. It does sound like there is some serious emotional manipulation, pressure to use massive amounts of Ketamine, violence and continued threats of violence. With how things have played out it’s hard to know whether or not sexual violence has occurred. A far more reliable article is by a publication produced by the family and community: lastrealindians.com/news/2022/6/10/chief-bear-testifies-ezra-miller-groomed-my-niece?fbclid=IwAR1DGdlay6Jnv9Fmimth2705KwjhpkGcKhZu16bMOjie22imQ81Qhi6tvp4&fs=e&s=cl
Thanks for the article. I have been reading a lot of the mainstream and tabloid like articles, so it is great to actually read full accounts from her uncle and family members and photos provided by the family. If any of this info are proven true legally, it is very concerning that Tokata is with Ezra and I can see why her parents, family and friends are very worried. I also think it doesnt help honestly that with all these accusations, Ezra doesnt come forward with Tokata.
@@nett6051 for sure. If Ezra were healthy and stable there would be other conversations to be had. As it stands that isn’t a safe place for an isolated young adult to be, no matter what their dynamic is.
What Ezra did WAS grooming. Iron Eyes was a teenager when they met. Ezra tried to sleep with them when they were still a child. I understand that the word groomer is being weaponized against the LGBT community, but we can't deny that was Ezra did was grooming. Just because they are part of the LGBT community doesn't mean they are above criticism.
17:21 both things could be true. Tokata could currently be in danger being with Ezra Miller and could also have been in a toxic household with their parents.
I don't for one minute think it was easy trying to pick your way through all the sensationalism to give a balanced view on what is basically a shit show no matter how you look at it, you've presented it in as fair a way as possible to support your conclusions around what's happening with the film. At this stage that's all anyone can do until the full facts come out, wild speculation doesn't help anyone so I'm glad you didn't go down that route. I still get the feeling that this is not going to end well and the fallout is going to be rumbling around for a long time.
Well...bloody, buggering hell, what a shitty situation all around! Thank you for putting together such a balanced, nuanced take, it is a refreshing contrast to the sensationalist/propagandist screaming heard elsewhere! I just hope the whole clusterfuck will come to the quickest, least awful end possible, for the sake of all involved. As horrid as this thing is, "The Secretions of Dumblybum" made me laugh. I'm gonna go watch some videos of puppies and cats now, I've had my fill of humans for today...
Another big part of the issue is that the Flash movie apparently contains some plot points that are extremely important for the next several films the DCEU has lined up, so if they end up scrapping it, all those other movies will have to go in for major retools as well.
@@kellswitch That would mean shooting the whole movie over again, maybe even more expensively than the first time as all the returning cast and crew members would be in a prime position to demand raises.
One suggestion when you don't know if someone has changed their first name is to refer to them by last name as much as possible to avoid deadnaming them.
That seems really counterintuitive when you're discussing an issue where two of the key persons share a last name. It would have made this video a logistical nightmare to get across clear and concise. The preface up front is a much simpler, but still delecate way to deal with this imho
@@Smouv In a case like this, where the genders are distinct and there is a known relationship, defaulting to pronouns is a good first step. Yes, periodically you need to reinforce/restate which person you're talking about, but that's where the relationship comes into play.
@@Smouv I picked my words pretty carefully. Using their father or mother’s full name when needing to refer to them and to “their parents” when talking about those two collectively. Hopefully folks follows it alright.
maybe the differentiation between nonbinary and enby transgender has to do with nonbinarity (is that a word) being a whole thing of its own in some indigenous cultures? and as such different from the more western term transgender. but like, idk shit, honestly. this is just a wild speculation.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, Ezra could literally kill someone on video and I wouldn’t miss Michael Keaton returning as Batman. That being said, it seems that they are incredibly volatile and absolutely mentally ill, and some of these situations could be managed fairly easily if Miller checked themself into a mental health or substance abuse facility. The involvement of children is incredibly startling and the fact that more than one child has been approached by Miller makes me sincerely doubt their intentions, even if the one child in question is now of legal age. I also feel like this sucks for the enby community, that this individual is one of very few public representatives and that public opinion of Miller will now consequently affect public opinion of non-binary individuals on the whole. With that in mind, I’m going to just close out this statement by highlighting that Emma D’Arcy, another non-binary actor, looks absolutely flawless and amazing as Rhaenyra in the forthcoming House of the Dragon and maybe they can be the hero spokesperson the non-binary community needs right now?
from the pov of someone who was a hardcore ezra miller stan, as disgusted as i am with their behaviour, i’m more concerned. they clearly need help but it seems everyone around them only enables their erratic and dangerous behaviour. it’s heartbreaking, disappointing, and concerning. i really hope they can get help before things take a turn for the unthinkable, if they haven’t already.
I'm interested in this topic in part because I can't begin to grasp what is going thru Miller's head. What is their intent? Why is having such an awesome position in life (a winning lottery ticket to having little worry about struggles affecting most of us) such a burden? They could do so much, no? Looking forward to your perspective (haven't finished yet).
That’s one aspect I won’t delve into. I’m neither qualified not comfortable with attempting to parse the thought processes of people I don’t know outside of very specific circumstances (such as trying to figure out why a company executive made a certain business decision).
@@CouncilofGeeks I understand. To me it's beyond understanding so I'm content to hear anyone with even a speculative idea. I like learning about all sorts of things whether I personally relate well to them or not. Learning for learning's sake, I guess. Enjoying your precision here in this strange context in this odd situation. You do offer potential insight as to a common ground if Iron Eyes felt constrained by family, which can't yet be determined if that's credible or spin. Thank you for your thoughtfullness.
Success has its own darkside. Money solves some of life's most basic troubles but it doesn't buy happiness. Plenty of rich powerful folk have lived sad, messed up lives. Power corrupts and fame can break your grip on reality. Sometimes money just allows people to get away with more bad stuff for longer.
@@lisakaz35 The thing with having more money is that you end up very quickly needing even more money. Unless you're very frugal and careful. Let's say you start with an average house and car. You become successful and what do you do? You buy a bigger house and car that costs more money to maintain. Then you become even more successful and it's rinse and repeat.
Just leaving something for the algorithm. I'm not a fan of DC and so a lot of this goes right over my head, but I appreciate the info on a culture level. That's the level at which I'm concerned.
Recast, dead easy, Robert Sheehan from Umbella Academy, he look similar and is dead dead good and I think he could pull of a impersonation of what Ezra did
Robert Sheehan is a really good call. While watching this video and the last one, I've been wondering how much would really need to be reshot, given that a decent portion would be Miller in the suit (so almost fully covered) or it's already CGI. Given that tech also exists to implant an actor who wasn't even there into a film, it does open up the realistic possibility of a recast while still using the same film. It would be expensive and take a lot of work but surely even that is better than the film being scrapped. Assuming this all doesn't get sorted out or whatever but I don't see that happening taking everything into account. Even if it does WB would be stupid to keep Miller involved at this point.
@@c17sam90 For close ups and talky scenes etc I would agree but not for all the action scenes with lots of fx and CGI and while they're in the suit. Then you might not be able to actually tell it's Miller and it would be easier to CGI someone's face on top as all you'd see at most is the mouth area and the eyes. Everything else would covered by the suit. The main issue is for the scenes where they aren't suited and you can see his full, unmasked head. It may still be too much, we have no way of knowing right now and it all depends how far they are willing to go with it. We'll have to wait and see what they do, for us it's all speculation. 🙂
@@Elwaves2925 but again if it can be proven Ezra put on the mo cap suit and did the movements then yes they still have to credit him. You then have all the finished merchandise that has to be changed and gotten rid of. It’s not as simple as people think you then have to do all the chemistry tests and get everyone back to film. I studied acting contracts at university and the only way to do what you were asking is basically throw every single frame of Miller/something built for his likeness and build in the bin and start from scratch. It worked for all the money in the world because they had a minor character and that’s it.
Thank you Vera. I don't want to listen to other channels because yours is more balanced. It's like a trainwreck it's almost impossible to look away Ezra Miller's life. I don't think Warner Bros is going to hire Ezra Miller's future projects.
I don't know the situation at all, and what's in the video is all new to me. But being not straight means that many things about our surrounding culture, as well as the family and home background, neighborhood community, faith / worship community, and school system, all may be very different and sometimes (or often) at odds with being not-so-straight, and navigating that as we grow up. As much good as we may get from those, some may be very toxic and negative, or at least conflicting and anxiety-producing for our non-straight selves. I will never truly know just how at odds each of those factors were with my own internal perceptions of them and my own inner struggle while growing up and even into young adulthood. But I grew up feeling very unsupported and at odds with those (family, friends, school, church, where and when I grew up) and conflicted and anxious about it. My gay feelings were something I didn't know what to make of, how to deal with. I knew how I felt, emotionally, physically, sexually, but that developed from very early and immature as a pre-teen through to more mature adult feelings. I will always wonder what it would've been like to have support and feel safe and get to embrace that part of myself in growing up, even at college age. I know many non-straight folks feel that way and have gone through much the same things, both my generation and now. What a huge difference it might have made to be able to be open and talk about it or explore those feelings more, and what a big difference it would have made to have more positive experiences and less of the negative experiences I grew up with. I was lucky that the homophobia at home was not violent or overt, but the subtle, quiet kind of homophobia is still very damaging. It is important for non-straight youth to have friends and role models and allies who are supportive, and safe spaces to be in. When home, school, church, neighborhood community, mass media, all are stacked against you, it's tough to get through adolescence. As anathema as it may sound to parents or authority figures, very honestly, sometimes when we are growing up, we genuinely need others who support us as individual people, including and especially the not-straight or not-cisgender sides of us. I'm still dealing with undoing that damage as a gay adult. who had a pretty good home and family, yet rampant homophobia in every aspect of my life growing up. It wasn't always in-your-face or violent, but it was there, even in my home life, spiritual life, and certainly always in my school life with other kids/teens. If there had been acceptance and role models for me as a boy growing up discovering my gay feelings, I would have had a much better time from childhood to adolescence and into adulthood. This is something that many straight adults don't understand about growing up for non-straight youth. Even parents do not always know what's best for their children and do not always do what's best, even with the best intentions, most well-meaning. When parents are homophobic or transphobic and their child is not straight or not cisgender, the parents are mistaken in treating their own child with homophobia or transphobia, consciously and unconsciously. My own parents surely thuoght they were doing right in how they raised me. In most ways, they did great. But growing up discovering I was gay, with parents who were homophobic if quiet about it, was still very damaging, maybe to the point of abuse being an accurate term. Understand that I loved them and they loved me. I didn't come out until after they were gone. I never felt I could talk to them about me being gay, or about any friends at school, bullying, etc., and my parents never gave me any reason to think otherwise, even into adulthood. Understand how toxic that is to a young person growing up. Understand that is where many non-straight peel come from, an entire youth of that until they can maybe escape it as independent adults, or unless they have those allies and safe spaces growing up, elsewhere and with other people than home, school, church, and other people and places we usually think of as safe havens., as nurturing good environments and role models. This is the damage behind homophobia and transphobia. It damages many kinds of personal relationships for years to come, and certainly while growing up. This is why acceptance and openness are important, so that people can keep from that damage or heal from it. -- And it's why I am so opinionated or outspoken when I reply to things like this.
Relevant Side Topic: How the Lakota Sioux (and Standing Rock Sioux, presumably a subgroup) view nonbinary, queer, gay, or transgender may be relevant. Some Native American nations / tribes have their own traditional cultural beliefs regarding their own flavors of non-straight people. Two-spirit and third-gender are just two types of these views. Some nations / tribes believe in a binary male-female straight cisgender model. Others have varying beliefs, traditions, within their culture and language. I don't know the Lakota Sioux take on this. Even within those traditions, not everyone believes the "traditional" way; people still live in the modern world. For someone whose parents or who themselves lives within a Native American tribal, cultural identity, this can have crucial meaning, and it notably, importantly, may not be the prevailing white American (straight cisgender) view; their culture may have a different take on it.
Gibson has said that they go by Gibson. They have it as their name on Instagram but haven't changed their username. Most relatives of theirs commenting on social media have misgendered them and recently they posted another thing about their father
The public seemed to be willing to give Ezra a chance if they would only explain the circumstances from their point of view for a while now. Ezra's radio silence is probably the most damaging because most people are now assuming the reports are true. I just hope things get sorted out for Takota. Thanks for making the details a little more clear for us. It's all so confusing and disappointing.
Amazing analysis, especially since there are so many "on the other hands" that Topo would have trouble keeping up. Obviously, the most important thing is that everyone comes out of this healthy and whole, but I cannot help thinking about the technical people who have spent years of their lives trying to make a decent piece of art and could now end up with nothing to show for it--through zero fault of their own.
Honestly it seems literally harmful to not refer to actual allegations of grooming accurately as such when conservatives are trying to muddy the water by trying to call things that are not remotely close to grooming "grooming". I think it's much better to explain that conservatives are using "grooming" to refer to any instance of kids seeing or learning about LGBT people specifically to maliciously conflate all LGBT people with child molesters. Refusing to say groomer just because the allegations refer to an LGBT person just muddies the waters just as the transphobes are trying to achieve
I have thoughts in so many conflicting directions about this. First, I'm a parent and one of my kids is 11, so I immediately feel horrified on behalf of the complaint from a 12 year old child. Second, I have several trans loved ones, some of whom are also minors, and I've seen what it can be like to have unsupportive family, and I generally encourage some of my adult trans friends to act as older siblings/mentors to my younger trans relatives, because even in a fully supportive family, there is still a lot that as a cis person, I simply will not have those experiences and may not fully grok them. So I can see how that could be a source of comfort for the 18 year old, if that is the situation. But then, also, there are abusers and predators who specifcally prey on the vulnerable, and you mentioned that this person has had a past trauma. But even assuming everything is fine and Ezra is fully cleared of any wrongdoing here, they still have shown a very frequent tendency toward violence, and that's only what we've seen in public. So I'm still deeply uncomfortable. And regarding career and movie stuff... Mel Gibson has come back after a few years of laying low after some of his public incidents. I'm not sure Marky Mark ever suffered any consequences from his hate crimes. I fully expect that Ezra can bounce back, whether they should or not.
Mel Gibson was a giant a-list stat with a fan base of middle anger and older men and women many of whom are probably just as anti-Semitic as him. Miller is not so big and their you fan base is a lot more unforgiving of serious offenses such as grooming or extreme violence towards people.
I’m sad that they have caused such controversy as Ezra is really good I actually started to like them as Barry Allen. That said, I understand where the executives are coming from and I think they should drop it on streaming asap to just get past it while also releasing the film
same with me. i fell in love with their version of barry in zack snyder's justice league but what they've been doing is just inexcusable and the flash should just be dropped on streaming
Yeah this whole thing is such a mess. I hope Miller is found and gets some help. Idk what type of help they need, I'm no professional, but they're clearly not well. I'm going to hope Iron Eyes is okay and being honest with the statements about not wanting to be home etc.
Even if their parents are transphobic and just a toxic environment in general, Ezra Miller is not in my opinion not the best suited person to take care of this person. I really hope for Ezra’s sake that these allegations turn out to be false. Mostly because if it turns out to be true it means they did horrible things to a person. More horrible than they’ve already done in the past.
I legitimately had a friend at university who was scared of Miller because of that film and after seeing Miller saying they own the crossbow Kevin used in the film and it’s in their office wall.
I say don’t replace the actor, replace the character kill of Barry Allen and give us wallet west he was my first introduction to the flash and I love him.
The reporting of this whole story has also demonstrated that there's still a lot of ignorance in the mainstream media in regards to non-binary people. I think most of it isn't deliberately malicious, I just think a lot of mainstream society just doesn't understand that area of the LGBTQ community that well even compared to trans women and trans men.
I'd say that if a news outlet (entertainment or otherwise) is ignorant in some way then it is deliberate, even if it's not intended maliciously. There's nothing stopping them hiring (even if it's freelance) someone who isn't ignorant and does understand the landscape, especially for the bigger outlets. Not doing so is absolutely deliberate by those outlets and I feel if they don't understand the subject then they shouldn't be talking about it. 🙂
@@Elwaves2925 I mean something as basic as the pronouns. Most places I've seen do use they/them but still outn keep slipping into he/him. Even with online creators who are respectful of such issues make the mistake.
It sounds like the issue with the parents is the suggestion Miller is putting ideas in their kid’s head, and as a result they are fearful they are being brainwashed. Among those ideas from what I can gather is the notion their child is trans. Which they don’t trust that their kid actually is. Now if miller has been pressurising 12 year old non-binary kids into adult situations and influencing them to identify as trans when they don’t, then I personally feel the parents in this case have a point. They (miller) are a threat. Certainly the court appearances and charges of violent behaviour would tend to imply as much. Now let me be clear here. I’m not siding with the heteronormative parents because Miller identifies as anything whatsoever. I am siding with them, because the information publicly available confirms Miller has a history of violence and inappropriate behaviour. As lgbtq myself, I am sensitive to the misuse of the term “groomer”, but on this occasion, I’m not entirely sure I wouldn’t use it to describe miller myself. Their behaviour has been bizarre, and does not give their critics much to go on in terms of “the benefit of the doubt”. But again, to be clear. I believe they are a risk to children, because they are a drugged up violent individual who appears to project their own gender identity on others. (Allegedly) And not because that gender identity is in itself dangerous.
Lmao I feel you about not wanting to be a celebrity drama channel. It's one thing for a few here and there, but it's exhausting when someone's channel just completely changes.
My personal thoughts I am glad I am not Warner Bros executive for the DCEU movies. It's a trainwreck on both Iron Eyes and Ezra Miller's lives. I don't like commenting on private lives of people in general. Like Johnny Depp and Amber Heard I actually avoid most channels on UA-cam in regards to the situation. Personally I don't think that News Commentators should reporting on the court filings and they can serve the people in charge. Unfortunately this situation mirrors an actor named River Phoenix and his early death in front of the bar owned by Johnny Depp. Warner Bros may and most likely bite the bullet by dumping the Flash on HBO Max. I don't think any marketing will save this movie from a loss nor the bad news will not end when the movie releases. Ezra Miller's bad press is going to continue because we haven't reached it's peak yet. The right wing media will continue to put oxygen in to it because it's fits their narrative.
Ezra Miller has crashed and burned pretty spectacularly. For Warner Bros, imo they should either trash the project all around, or dump it on DC Universe with a statement saying they will donate all the proceeds to mental health for youths or something.
I completely agree with your aside on definitions of non-binary and transgender. I'm afab non-binary. I'm trans because I am not cis. That doesn't mean I'm FTM and being FTM or MTF is not a requirement to be trans.
appreciate you doing all the work and sifting through this mess. I tend to just go 'yikes!' and move on. random thought: while I like the streak in your hair, I miss the cap.
It's clear that Ezra Miller has exhibited blatant and repetitive signs of being a danger to others. Even just the fit of rage upon hearing the word "tribe" should have told society that the situation would eventually end with victims. Besides Ezra Miller's own, the fault also lies with Hollywood and the mainstream media. This behavior has to stop being celebrated. It's not cute, nor just. Just the Iceland incident alone should have put Ezra's career and freedom on an indefinite hold. Again, public safety took a back seat to the propaganda machine that's to afraid to act appropriately. Now, the damage is done, especially with the latest victim. It's traumatic to feel powerless under the weight of a system rigged to excuse predatory behavior because of the aggressor's assumed victimhood status. Imagine the scorn if the parent had to physically defend the minor. What if police had to be involved, but weren't because we were told to hate all police that week? We need to stop excusing individuals based solely on identity. We need not be bullied out of appropriate solutions. We need to hold actions accountable and relearn what progress was supposed to be. Ezra Miller's behavior fell through the cracks for a reason; because we demanded it so. The cycle has to stop.
I’m not a DC fan and I don’t know the flash’s story, but I do know and hate the industry’s favorite saying, “we’ll fix it in post”. 😩 They may put the squeeze on their editing team to see what shots and scenes with Ezra in it can be cut, both saving face by having less of his in it and saving money on SFX by eliminating scenes. It would seriously be like pulling teeth and honestly they probably wouldn’t have much to chop, but they (upper management) would see it as a “hey at least we tried” aka we forced the lower people to burn themselves out trying to do our bidding under threat of loss of job and then we can blame them if it doesn’t work even though it wasn’t possible in the first place. TL;DR upper management likes to think we’re low paid miracle workers and then blame us when it can’t be done because obviously someone can do it.
i've enjoyed quite a few of your videos Vera, and then you just bust out some adorable rattos at the end?!?! You're so fantastic and I'm glad to know you're a fellow rat lover 🐀😍🐀 I subscribed for sure, keep being your awesome self, I love your outros you have such a wonderful warm and kind energy 💖
The new head of WB is a well known conservative penny pincher with an almost pathological hatred of adverse publicity. It’s a toss up between his two basic instincts which will hold sway. That said, I never liked the casting of Ezra Miller as Barry Allen in the first place. A recast will not be a big loss.
MovieBob: "I can't make a video about Ezra Miller and how it could potentially affect THE FLASH and the DCEU! Stuff in this story keeps happening that keeps me from commenting on it!" Vera Wylde: "Hold my beer." Good job, Vera. You did what MovieBob couldn't. 🙂
Oh boy, that case is a mess from any angle, the now-18 young adult involved, or their parents, or Ezra Miller. Were the parents helping their child through college (money, other support) before they (now-adult offspring) dropped out? Since E.M. was said to have been giving financial support for college. How long has the relationship been going on? It sounds like the two have only been together since the young person entered college or after leaving college, but admittance was when, at 17? We don't seem to have anything to say whether the parents and their now-adult child were on amicable terms or if there was transphobia or homophobia going on, or other disagreement / distance or toxicity. The young adult hasn't distanced themselves from E.M. to show independence of thoughts and actions, which might be helpful to their own side of the case. So all in all, there are at least three sides not agreeing. -- Clearly, I have no way to know what's really going on or what to think about this. But all three sides appear to be in dispute over the young adult's situation, and over E.M.'s involvement or responsibility in the situation.Better for the young person to become disentangled from both E.M. and the parents, be independent, and make better choices in future about friends/lovers, and either patch things up with the parents or move on with their own life. But there's no winner in that until the young person gains their independence from what sounds like a mess. I can't know what's going on between the three sides, or if E.M. and th young person are fine together. So it's u[ to that young adult and up to the courts, sounds like, to resolve the mess. Fine for parents to care about their child's well-being. But also, there's a point at which one's child becomes adult and independent in their life, even if it's not what the parents like or think is right. It is possible to have phobic or overly-controlling parents who won't let their own adult child live their own life, make their own decisions, earn and keep their own money or living space, relationships, and many other factors of being independent. Sometimes the parents are right, sometimes not. Sometimes the adult child has to live through their own life and learn from mistakes, be independent. It sounds like both the parents and Ezra Miller are confused about letting the young adult decide and live for themselves, on their own, not under either side's influence or control. Be supportive instead of overly-controlling, whether parents, friend, or lover.
from the info given, it really looks like both sides are right: ezra isn't providing a healthy relationship and the parents aren't providing a good home. which really sucks that we kinda have to pick a side to agree with and that the media is hyping up one of the few big openly nonbinary people as not a pure/innocent/admirable person as if that proves the conservatives right. it also sucks cuz now the whole flash universe story angles will be tainted to some degree
This whole situation has become messier than chocolate ice cream on white bed sheets. I believe there was an article in THR or somewhere else saying that WB won’t have Miller be involved in the future of DC Films going forward (meaning that The Flash will be the last thing Miller will be in). And in regards to the FB franchise, I’ve not seen any updates about Miller’s involvement, but it’s safe to say the studio will recast or maybe the whole franchise will end without any theatrical instalments and maybe just do a TV miniseries or a TV movie or a comic book miniseries (these are just my theories, who knows what might end up happening).
OMG your rats are adorable, Vera! 🥰 🐀 Anyway, my first instinct is to say that the only decent way to proceed would be to just shelve the movie altogether, and eat the loss. I know that's not something any business would dream of doing, but I'm talking about from a moral standpoint, not economics. The idea of trying to recoup funds spent on a film where your star is currently, as you so evocatively put it, radioactive, to the point that any press at all will only incite the right wing to greater heights of panic and maybe more violence against us out in the open... it seems there is no _winning_ move, but the move that will cause the least harm (except to some exec's pockets) is to bin it. But then when I think on it further, and I think about all the rotten things that straight, binary, cis male actors have done in the past, and I start to get this disgusting feeling of resentment at the thought that a studio probably won't cover for Miller quite the way they would for a Franco (for example), and in addition to feeling like I need to shower, it makes me almost want to wait it out, too; see how Ezra's legal and behavioral issues may change before release time.
From an PR point of view the only thing that can salvage this mess is for the Miller kid to get help and for the Spin Docters to build a solid "sinner to saint" plot. Other than that I don't see Miller getting a job in at least the next decade. Sadly this seems to be turning into an other Lucian Piane story.
Thank you for tackling this, I know it is a super heavy thing to handle and you did it amazingly well. what ever happens I hope everyone is going to be safe and get whatever help and support they need. As far as the flash, they need to suck it up and reshoot. because it is going to be IMPOSSIBLE to do anything with this movie. Do you think any of the other actors want to be involved with WB again if they are stuck with this movie. No. So just get the WB flash, reshoot with them and move on and hope for the best.
That’s what I thought. I also wonder if Warner Brothers was already treading carefully, what with Ezra’s minor scandals, on top of the other non-related controversies. Ezra’s character is crucial to the plot of Fantastic Beasts, but doesn’t get much to do, so I wonder if that played into the rationale there. It’s odd to me that, after having been in every interview for the previous one, often with other cast members, Ezra would just be allowed to camp out in Hawaii.
I'm just sticking to speculating on The Flash movie. It is possible that Warner may be insured against damage caused by imputed immoral conduct of performers in their film. If so, they could scrap the entire movie and write it off against insurance. Or they could shelve it and use some of the material elsewhere eg on TV
Events since I shot this video (updating as applicable):
- Miller has deleted their Instagram which they'd been using to post what appeared to be attempts to mock the authorities trying to find and serve them with court documents.
- Reporting is that Miller will not be retained for future projects, though Warner Bros. has yet to make an official statement.
- Miller’s Vermont farm is currently housing a mother and her three children, and has been for several months. There are concerns from some sources that the farm is not safe for children (due to the presence of guns and marijuana on the premises), while the mother in question claims to have fled the abuse of her children’s father.
- Miller has been changed for burglary based on investigations of an incident in Stamford, VT back in May and given a citation to appear in court on Sept. 26... we'll see if that happens.
Ezra Miller has also now been fired from DC
I have been away, I missed your excellent breakdowns Vera. You are very even handed. Loved your tmnt vid, and I have been playing tons of SOR 4 too. Excellent game, will grad TMNT when I can afford it
One thing that occurs to me (acknowledging first my deep reluctance to speculate on currently unknown facts/motivations) is that it’s not at all mutually exclusive for someone from a toxic family background to end up with/be manipulated by an abusive partner or mentor. In fact, it’s tragically common. So even if (emphasis on IF) the allegations by the young adult re their family are true, it’s entirely possible that the allegations against Miller are also true. Survivors of abuse are sadly at pretty high risk of additional abusive situations… and yeah, I speak from both personal experience and experience working with other survivors. Mess is definitely the right word…
This is absolutely a possibility, but I didn't want to spend any more time in the quagmire trying to figure out how much of each might or might not be accurate. But yes, these are not entirely mutually exclusive concepts.
It seems that some psychologists find that a fair percentage of child abusers will attempt to gain a “special” closeness with their victims by cultivating the idea that the child’s parents are “abusive” and “toxic”. Pretty easy scam. Most children go through periods where they believe that if only their parents would shape up, they would have the freedom to do as they please.
Same conclusion.
@@theaureliasys6362 Exactly. In terms of the topic of the video - what happens with the Flash movie - both parties being guilty doesn't change the problems for WB. It just complicates the situation Iron Eyes is in, making their situation much worse.
I was going to express a similar sentiment. One of my best friends had this exact thing happen to him. Parents were queerphobic, he got duped by a fellow queer person with the promise of acceptance, but that person wound up being abusive as all heck. To echo your disclaimers, I want to note that I'm not speculating that this is what has happened with the Miller situation. I just wanted to concur that I've seen situations where vulnerable people can end up in cycles of abuse.
Honestly, I feel like we are wrong if we focus on the fact that Tokata is now a legal adult - as obviously shown, this started while they were a minor, so talking about the entire story, using teenager seems accurate.
Furthermore, using grooming absolutely applies here. As a queer person, I understand how this word is being used against our community, yet the term is completely appropriate here, and I honestly think that it is more harmful to try not to use the word to save face. What message does this serve other than to show people that we won't recognize grooming in our own community?
Just checked. While Tokata is now a legal adult, they met Ezra Miller at the age of 12. So, this relationship PRIMARILY occurred while the individual was a minor.
The use of the term grooming only applies if Miller tried to coerce them into a sexual relationship. Since we don't know that for certain, it's not apparent whether that is accurate or not.
@@cryofpaine it actually doesn’t - look it up. More importantly, I was responding to vera’s point that she wouldn’t use the term, though she felt it fit, solely due to the connotation the term has in the modern climate
@@elgranespejo not "solely". It was because the only people using it were sensationalist news agencies trying to push an agenda. No one has officially accused him of such, at least with regard to Tokata. (I don't know if the other person has or not.)
And unless you're talking about haircare, yes, "grooming" is explicitly sexual.
"the action by a pedophile of preparing a child for a meeting, especially via an internet chat room, with the intention of committing a sexual offense."
Totally agree. And the relationship beginning in childhood and continuing into adulthood is the literal DEFINITION of grooming, so I have no idea why she focuses so much on Iron Eyes being currently 18.
"Remember when you assaulted some people, met a 12 year old, and are now on the run from the law?
That wasn't me, Barry. That was all you. Seriously, you need help."
Eobard Thawne knows
I admire how you always go out of your way to remain unbiased and not spread misinformation. Love this vid Vera, very informative!
Regardless of the outcome wb would be wise to part ways with miller
I have some (potential) insight into that confusion regarding "nonbinary" vs. "nonbinary transgender." My former roommate was Lakota and Two-Spirit. The way she explained it to me, Two-Spirit is a gender identity which, if you were categorizing it from a perspective other than Lakota, would be considered nonbinary. However, because it's such an entrenched part of their culture, nobody is really surprised when a Lakota person identifies as Two-Spirit, so it's not considered "transgender" in the same way we think of the term; it's more like, "Well you already thought of me as [fill in the blank gender], I'm just *also* [other gender]."
As I hope is obvious from my caveats, I am not remotely Lakota myself, so please don't take my word for it. I just recognized a kinda confusing categorization matter that I had some degree of context for and thought I'd offer what I knew.
I was thinking similarly. Not familiar with the tribe nor their specific practices/beliefs nor even less so the adherence of the people involved here; but I do know that a number of native peoples have practices and beliefs that have things like two spirits/souls in one body, genders in-between or outside of male/female, and genders simultaneously male and female. So, through this particular cultural lens, I can see a more logical reasoning for the wording.
I have several Cherokee friends who identify as both Two Spirit and transgender interchangeably. Some sources say that Native Americans, Pacific Islanders, Indian Diaspora, some African peoples, etc. have traditional Two Spirit-like genders in their cultures. Western cultures have a gender binary because of Christian dualism. Transgenders were formerly thought of as gays and lesbians until distinguished by sexologists in the '60s.😎🧐
@@darlalathan6143 trans people were recognized as such as early as the 20s but the loss of Magnus Hirschfeld’s work really set back grsm studies and even activism by decades.
Really appreciate you posting this op, as I too was vaguely aware of this, but not nearly enough to feel comfortable commenting on it, despite the fact that it didn't sit right with me how Vera considered/discussed non-binary and transgender identities only in the typical western way
THANK YOU! I mentioned this above, my guess is that Miller is being an ignorant white barging into a native space not understanding what is going on and then going further and trying to 'educate' Tokata and save them from the 'abusive' family
A lot of native American cultures had non-binary identities prior to the coming of the colonialist, so the family being accepting of non-binary is consistent with their heritage
If Ezra has been pursuing the victim that long, it is perfectly correct to refer to them as a teenager, since the age is very relevant and a 29 year old pursuing an 18 year old is abusive, even though the 18 year old is (only just) considered legally adult. Grooming is also appropriate, since Ezra wanted to sleep with the teenager as a child. Trying to get a child to sleep with you through non-violent means is called grooming. Corrupting a minor and grooming are synonyms. If you think grooming is a stronger word than abuse ... well, that just makes no sense.
I know you are in no way defending Ezra, but by quibbling over the use of such terms (which are accurate) you do give the impression that there should be different rules for abusers who are non-binary.
Prince Andrew had sex with a 17 year old. In the UK, 17 is above the age of consent. In the US, where it happened, it is not. In the UK, we consider him an abuser and paedophile. The girl could not legally consent to sex, therefore it was non-consensual. The rules should not be different if he changes his pronouns.
We should all be glad that Ezra has been exposed. The problem is if people use Ezra to pretend that all non-binary people are paedophiles and abusers. The danger here is that if you say we should treat queer people differently in these situations, you are going to look as if you are saying that queer abusers should not be held to account. The bigots will then leap on that and say, "You see? They all protect each other, because they are all abusers!" Which is, of course, nonsense.
Ezra Miller is not an abuser because they are queer, but neither are they less of an abuser because they are queer. Their gender identity and sexuality are irrelevant. They groomed and abused at least one child and it seems there are more.
You are worried that the term grooming is aimed only or mainly at the queer and trans community, but it is not. It is used mostly in reference to straight male abusers going after children. It is a term describing a behaviour that Ezra Miller definitely and obviously engaged in. If Ezra raped someone, would you object to the term rape being used? Must any allegation against a queer or trans person be reduced to something milder to avoid feeding transphobia? Because trust me, that is the worst possible way to "help" transfolk.
We all agree that abusers are bad people. They do bad things. They hurt the young and the vulnerable, causing damage that can last a lifetime. Abusers should not be protected to protect the community they come from (but in no way represent) and that community should not say, "Because this is one of ours, the rules must be different and never mind that the victim is also one of ours."
Agree completely that "kidnapping" should not be used unless there is evidence that the person with Ezra has been taken away without their consent. In the second case, though, the behaviour described is classic grooming, making it even more appropriate to use that term.
Clearly, Iron Eyes is the victim here. Obviously, the victim of grooming by an abuser, possibly also the victim of bigoted parents, however, they clearly respect their child's pronouns and non-binary identity, so I find that unlikely. I have to say that if my child, binary, non-binary or hexadecimal, were being preyed upon by someone 11 years older with an unhealthy interest in pubescent children, I would do anything it took to save that child and we should not judge their attitude to the person who is abusing their child as being their opinion of anyone who is non-binary or trans.
The only negative connotation I see is that Chase believes Ezra is trying to manipulate how his child sees their own gender identity. However, as you say, without seeing the full petition, that is very hard to judge. It should go without saying that nobody, not parents, not a creepy abuser, not the authorities, should be trying to control anybody's gender identity. That is for the individual to decide. As someone who wanted to be a boy between the ages of 9 and 12, but ended up very happy being female, I am very glad nobody decided for me that I was trans when I was really just going through a phase. I was left to figure things out and I did, as do kids trans or factory-settings, if allowed to do so.
There is nothing to suggest the parents see transgender as negative. Their issue seems to be with the coercion. Bear in mind that parents whose child comes out as non-binary may not see non-binary as a transgender identity, simply because they may not have a full understanding of the nature of either term and that the terms are constantly evolving, which can be hard for the general public to keep up with. Don't mistake confusion or ignorance for bigotry.
The victim's family are indigenous. Therefore, their criticism of a white paedophile can be called racist in order to discredit it. Abusers will accuse people of all kinds of bigotries to discredit their allegations. The fact that Ezra has drug convictions surely makes the allegation more, not less believable,
Your motives are good, but there comes a time when you just have to say, "This person is a bad person who has done bad things." In the long run, that helps the community, because it shows that you are not protecting or making excuses for members of the community who abuse children. Look at the current situation in the Catholic church to see what happens when a community tries to hide or water down (such as avoiding terms like "grooming") allegations against their own. An awful lot of non-Catholics think all Catholics are paedophiles. Same thing is happening to the trans community when anyone with a trans identity who commits abuse is treated differently by the community than a non-trans person would be.
If WB have any sense, they will just abandon the film, but of course, they will go after as much money as they can. Ethics are not important to them.
Wonder what's on this one's hard drive ey?
fantastic response.
Great response. You've said much of what I wanted to say. I'll add I think where Vera's frustration with the world "grooming" comes from is the fact that it's overused to defame queer people (alleging they "groom" minors to become one of them, etc) Alleged "grooming" is appropriate terminology for the specific case of Miller, however, based on the testimony of the parents who've come forward.
Yes it does stink that Miller has (allegedly) reinforced harmful tropes against the trans community, but it doesn't mean we get to be be pedantic about the language use so the trans community at large looks better. The details of the allegations are what they are.
Someone put in my thoughts after finishing the video
This pretty much, Grooming is Grooming. Even if Miller is (Seemuingly) reinforcing harmful tropes agianst the trans community, it doesn't change that Miller is/was grooming that girl, and the sooner we accept that the sooner we can properly try Miller for what they are doing.
I wish the article writers would figure out they can respect gender pronouns without making stories hard to follow. When there are multiple separate "they"s or "them"s in a sentence it can get confusing. For example, "They said they came closer." would be more understandable if written as "the family said they came closer." or "they said Ezra came closer."
The only way to do if you want to be respectful is just say surnames repeatedly.
It's also hard to find articles that respect people's preferred terms in other languages even if there ARE pronouns they can use. I've only found one news site in Spanish that uses "elle" and the " -e" ending for adjectives instead of mas/fem "él / ella" and "-o/a" endings. Made me so happy when I did, despite the upsetting content of the articles themselves. Hope Miller gets help 😬
Its the same thing as if you have multiple people of the same gender. People just like to make excuses for not using they/them pronouns. Like the ridiculous plural argument. When they themselves have probably used it in the singular without really knowing it.
Yeah that's just bad writing in the basic sense like theres tons of situation where you're writting about multiple people that all use the same pronouns, like a group of men, and you would insert names as needed to make it clear which person is doing what
This whole visiting a 12-year-old at their house just to hang out situation is starting to feel a little like Leaving Neverland 🙄
Yeah, super-inappropriate and kinda entitled...
just wanna use this opportunity to tangentially point out that disappearances of indigenous women in america is an ongoing crisis that needs more attention (not implying anyone specifically mentioned in the video is a woman, just this news reminded me of this issue)
As sympathetic as I am for the complexity here, and the current bullshit accusations being leveled against the trans community, I'm pretty sure that the quoted "sexual corruption of a minor" accusation is a pretty clear match to "grooming".
I’m shocked someone as problematic and chaotic as them has the privilege of starring in more than one of the biggest and highest grossing franchises with Harry Potter and the DC Extended Universe. I’m so disappointed in Ezra Miller as they seemed like a funny down to earth person you’d hang out with based on their interviews, and I think they’re a pretty talented actor in the things they’ve done past playing Flash in the DCEU, but they’re a truly chaotic and evil human being that is in dire need of help ASAMFP.
I don’t think Miller ever seemed down to earth tbh or they seemed like the type of person who would automatically go off the rails. When your image is possibly high wild part animal who gets a lot of praise for being themselves how many times has that image ever ended well?
I thought they were pretty good in Perks of Being a Wallflower and was happy to see when it seemed like their career was picking up with being in Fantastic Beasts and the DCEU.
Boy has everything, (actor, franchises, etc.) just gone to crap in this situation.
At least I can still enjoy Wallflower.
@@PaceFilmsProductions I wonder how much of this was caused by Millers own fan base much like Charlie Sheen’s they cheered on Miller and Miller got lost in trying to appeal to them
As someone with a degree in Anthropology, I can see where perfectly non-transphobic individuals would take exception with calling all non-binary people "transgender" because a lot of non-Western cultures fully acknowledge and embrace more than 2 genders (and, heck, the Talmud talks about 4 or 5 genders and their roles various religious and legal roles and responsibilities). I really don't have the expertise or education or cultural background to state with authority whether or not it's accurate to call them transgender, but if someone belongs to an *acknowledged* 3rd gender, I can see where transgender might not be the most applicable term, which has me wondering if that "Miller has decided they're transgender" thing is less about Takota's gender identity and more about Western conceptions of gender being pushed on them by someone without an appropriate cultural context. Because there is a very big difference between being transgender in a culture with a sharp and widely accepted gender binary and being a 3rd gender individual in a society that's always had that concept.
Like I don't know anything about this family other than the Dakota Pipeline activism, so I really can't speak directly to whether they're good and supportive parents or not (obviously i hope they are since all kids deserve that), but I can definitely see where Indigenous parents might have a problem with Miller using Western terms/ideas to describe a very not-Western social gender role.
I know this situation isn't funny in the Slightest, but I just can't stop myself from saying this....
"DAMMIT BARRY!!!!!"
The entire situation is just so tragic for everyone involved. Relationships are breaking, people are suffering, money is being lost ..not just by big executives but by the people who worked on this movie, people who own theater's . In general people lives are being torn apart...it is very sad.
Don’t feel bad for the people who worked on the live. They got paid. Don’t doubt that. If they didn’t then iatse would have something to say. The people loosing money would be any actors who are paid a portion of revenue and the studio itself. Theatres aren’t loosing money either because the movie isn’t even out. They will just show something else.
It's entirely possible that Takato is accurate about their parents and wanting to escape that environment. But, it's *also* possible that most, if not all, of the accusations against Ezra are true. There is some pretty damning evidence to suggest the latter, at least. I just hope that Takato and any other people affiliated with Ezra are safe or will be able to find safety soon.
Or BOTH could be true to some degree. Someone who is in a not-very-supportive home environment would be more susceptible to manipulation by an older person who seems to offer that support. And, if one is young, one might not immediately spot the issues with the latter, or might not want to admit them if they do, because when you're 17 or 18 you want to feel like an adult who can make your own decisions.
I understand your point, and I agree with your reluctance to use that word right now. But I'm really hesitant to throw away the term grooming, particularly with how often it happens to queer kids after their parents reject them.
It feels like conservatives are taking away our ability to describe our own experiences. 😕
I would also say that, ignoring the current political climate around that word and assuming the facts as you present them are true, this is a pretty clear-cut case of grooming.
In a way, I feel like the stuff with Ezra Miller is almost in the background. Yes, what they're doing is obviously bad and they need help or something right now. That goes without saying. However, it now feels more like the focus should be on WB themselves and what they should DO about Ezra and the Flash film. I mean, all throughout the drama, WB has remained silent and done NOTHING about this! That's how I see it at least.
Hope I made sense here.
I feel like what else could WB do at this point besides put out a statement along the lines of "We don't condemn the actions allegedly made by Miller,"? And as others and Vera stated, they already made the movie. Should they shelve it (not release it)? I feel what has been stated from another commenter is the best case scenario; just putting it in hbo max and wipe their hands with Miller. 🤷🏾♀️
@@nancykerrigan, Agreed. Hell, Batgirl, which has Keaton in it, is already going on HBO Max, so putting The Flash there too makes a kind of sense.
The legal handling of events after this person turned 18 might be more difficult, but everything before...? If Miller did the things they're being accused _to a minor_ , yeah, they're screwed. A victim turning 18 doesn't absolve the accused.
I really hope Iron Eye comes out of this safely what ever this is that is actually going.
We don't know the whole story, but even based on their most recent activity prior to this, I would say WB might consider the Flash film to be a busted flush at this point. With these recent allegations, they now find themselves in a more precarious position as you indicated. Such allegations, when they involve children, tend to leave a stain even if they are not true ultimately. Ezra may not realise it, but they are literally driving their career into the ground with their behaviour.
Personally, I can honestly see this film being canned, or sold off to HBO Max and not given a cinema release or released directly to DVD/Blu-Ray. I can't see them piling so much money into premieres and press junkets given that even if they don;t have Ezra, their actions and antics will be what all the reporters will want to ask about. So either WB will not release the film, or they will dump it into home video and streaming services. I very much doubt that it will get a cinema release. it might, who knows, but I dont see it.
As for Ezra,'s career, this I think will kill it. No studio will hire them given all the baggage. Even if the WB hide them from doing press for the Flash, whoever hired them next will end up having to deal with that flak. No, their career is pretty much done I reckon.
I've only heard some things in passing and what I've heard is so incredibly bizarre. Like, what the hell happened to them to become like this?
Drugs and ego
The year is 2222. After centuries of speculation and serching, a single mostly complete copy of the unreleased, and presumed lost, Flash movie is found in an Argentine salt mine, still clutched in the desiccated hands of one Ezra Miller.
The day before the planned premier of the lost work, Ezra Miller returns as a salt-lich, exiting the cave with one thousand salt-zombies marching behind him.
T H I S W I L L N E V E R E N D, the horde calls out, in one voice.
The release is postponed yet again.
Lmao
*Them not him, for Ezra Miller, but otherwise quite amusing.
So, I’ve been friends with the parents and a lot of people in the Standing Rock community since around the same time. Most, if not all, are supportive of the trans community. Especially their Aunt, who would definitely not allow any homophobia or transphobia to be inflicted within the household. It really does look like Ezra could be renaming Tokata and aggressively pushing a previously unrevealed identity onto them.
I believe that trying to use they them pronouns is out of respect, but not properly distinguishing non binary from transgender is due to all of these things being a surprise. All of Tokatas family and friends were unaware up until this point that they were non binary. And, of all of the communications it has been almost entirely Ezra communicating this, as well as using the name Gibson. Which was previously a name Tokata used for family, friends, and their self. It’s plausible that Ezra latched onto that and convinced them that it was their real name.
It does sound like there is some serious emotional manipulation, pressure to use massive amounts of Ketamine, violence and continued threats of violence. With how things have played out it’s hard to know whether or not sexual violence has occurred.
A far more reliable article is by a publication produced by the family and community:
lastrealindians.com/news/2022/6/10/chief-bear-testifies-ezra-miller-groomed-my-niece?fbclid=IwAR1DGdlay6Jnv9Fmimth2705KwjhpkGcKhZu16bMOjie22imQ81Qhi6tvp4&fs=e&s=cl
Thanks for the article. I have been reading a lot of the mainstream and tabloid like articles, so it is great to actually read full accounts from her uncle and family members and photos provided by the family. If any of this info are proven true legally, it is very concerning that Tokata is with Ezra and I can see why her parents, family and friends are very worried. I also think it doesnt help honestly that with all these accusations, Ezra doesnt come forward with Tokata.
@@nett6051 for sure. If Ezra were healthy and stable there would be other conversations to be had. As it stands that isn’t a safe place for an isolated young adult to be, no matter what their dynamic is.
This is a whole mess indeed. I just hope the victims in question are okay and hope the situation just doesn't get worse.
A moment of recognition for "The Fantastic Beasts: The Secretions of Dumbleybum". Brava, Vera, brava.
RIP to Miller’s PR person
What Ezra did WAS grooming. Iron Eyes was a teenager when they met. Ezra tried to sleep with them when they were still a child. I understand that the word groomer is being weaponized against the LGBT community, but we can't deny that was Ezra did was grooming. Just because they are part of the LGBT community doesn't mean they are above criticism.
17:21 both things could be true. Tokata could currently be in danger being with Ezra Miller and could also have been in a toxic household with their parents.
Which makes things even sadder for Tokata....
I don't for one minute think it was easy trying to pick your way through all the sensationalism to give a balanced view on what is basically a shit show no matter how you look at it, you've presented it in as fair a way as possible to support your conclusions around what's happening with the film. At this stage that's all anyone can do until the full facts come out, wild speculation doesn't help anyone so I'm glad you didn't go down that route. I still get the feeling that this is not going to end well and the fallout is going to be rumbling around for a long time.
Well...bloody, buggering hell, what a shitty situation all around! Thank you for putting together such a balanced, nuanced take, it is a refreshing contrast to the sensationalist/propagandist screaming heard elsewhere! I just hope the whole clusterfuck will come to the quickest, least awful end possible, for the sake of all involved.
As horrid as this thing is, "The Secretions of Dumblybum" made me laugh. I'm gonna go watch some videos of puppies and cats now, I've had my fill of humans for today...
Another big part of the issue is that the Flash movie apparently contains some plot points that are extremely important for the next several films the DCEU has lined up, so if they end up scrapping it, all those other movies will have to go in for major retools as well.
I do not know enough about script writing, how much of a retool would it be if they just recast?
@@kellswitch That would mean shooting the whole movie over again, maybe even more expensively than the first time as all the returning cast and crew members would be in a prime position to demand raises.
@@Rmlohner Oh, I'm sorry, I thought you were referring to future movies. Thank you for clarifying! :)
One suggestion when you don't know if someone has changed their first name is to refer to them by last name as much as possible to avoid deadnaming them.
Which is what I opted to do after discussing the issue.
That seems really counterintuitive when you're discussing an issue where two of the key persons share a last name. It would have made this video a logistical nightmare to get across clear and concise. The preface up front is a much simpler, but still delecate way to deal with this imho
@@Smouv In a case like this, where the genders are distinct and there is a known relationship, defaulting to pronouns is a good first step. Yes, periodically you need to reinforce/restate which person you're talking about, but that's where the relationship comes into play.
@@Smouv I picked my words pretty carefully. Using their father or mother’s full name when needing to refer to them and to “their parents” when talking about those two collectively. Hopefully folks follows it alright.
maybe the differentiation between nonbinary and enby transgender has to do with nonbinarity (is that a word) being a whole thing of its own in some indigenous cultures? and as such different from the more western term transgender. but like, idk shit, honestly. this is just a wild speculation.
Non-binariness? Idk, either
I appreciate your thoroughness and clarity given such an unclear situation.
I don’t think I’ll ever see the Flash film. I might just watch the scenes with Keaton as Batman on UA-cam or somethin’ and have it be that.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, Ezra could literally kill someone on video and I wouldn’t miss Michael Keaton returning as Batman. That being said, it seems that they are incredibly volatile and absolutely mentally ill, and some of these situations could be managed fairly easily if Miller checked themself into a mental health or substance abuse facility. The involvement of children is incredibly startling and the fact that more than one child has been approached by Miller makes me sincerely doubt their intentions, even if the one child in question is now of legal age. I also feel like this sucks for the enby community, that this individual is one of very few public representatives and that public opinion of Miller will now consequently affect public opinion of non-binary individuals on the whole. With that in mind, I’m going to just close out this statement by highlighting that Emma D’Arcy, another non-binary actor, looks absolutely flawless and amazing as Rhaenyra in the forthcoming House of the Dragon and maybe they can be the hero spokesperson the non-binary community needs right now?
There's also Emma Corrin (the one who became Lady Di in The Crown), they are enby too btw (and just became a cover star of British Vogue!)
@@darthbee18 I’ve never watched The Crown, but I’m a huge geek for ASOIF so I’m really excited for HOTD.
from the pov of someone who was a hardcore ezra miller stan, as disgusted as i am with their behaviour, i’m more concerned. they clearly need help but it seems everyone around them only enables their erratic and dangerous behaviour. it’s heartbreaking, disappointing, and concerning. i really hope they can get help before things take a turn for the unthinkable, if they haven’t already.
casual reminder that indigenous concepts of gender identity do not necessarily align with white/european ones
I'm interested in this topic in part because I can't begin to grasp what is going thru Miller's head. What is their intent? Why is having such an awesome position in life (a winning lottery ticket to having little worry about struggles affecting most of us) such a burden? They could do so much, no? Looking forward to your perspective (haven't finished yet).
That’s one aspect I won’t delve into. I’m neither qualified not comfortable with attempting to parse the thought processes of people I don’t know outside of very specific circumstances (such as trying to figure out why a company executive made a certain business decision).
@@CouncilofGeeks I understand. To me it's beyond understanding so I'm content to hear anyone with even a speculative idea. I like learning about all sorts of things whether I personally relate well to them or not. Learning for learning's sake, I guess. Enjoying your precision here in this strange context in this odd situation. You do offer potential insight as to a common ground if Iron Eyes felt constrained by family, which can't yet be determined if that's credible or spin. Thank you for your thoughtfullness.
Success has its own darkside. Money solves some of life's most basic troubles but it doesn't buy happiness. Plenty of rich powerful folk have lived sad, messed up lives. Power corrupts and fame can break your grip on reality. Sometimes money just allows people to get away with more bad stuff for longer.
@@nicka3697 I hear that. Some problems can be solved by money. Not sure if that's me or not, but at times I'd think so. Thanks for your input.
@@lisakaz35 The thing with having more money is that you end up very quickly needing even more money. Unless you're very frugal and careful. Let's say you start with an average house and car. You become successful and what do you do? You buy a bigger house and car that costs more money to maintain. Then you become even more successful and it's rinse and repeat.
Just leaving something for the algorithm. I'm not a fan of DC and so a lot of this goes right over my head, but I appreciate the info on a culture level. That's the level at which I'm concerned.
Recast, dead easy, Robert Sheehan from Umbella Academy, he look similar and is dead dead good and I think he could pull of a impersonation of what Ezra did
Ooooh YES
Robert Sheehan is a really good call.
While watching this video and the last one, I've been wondering how much would really need to be reshot, given that a decent portion would be Miller in the suit (so almost fully covered) or it's already CGI. Given that tech also exists to implant an actor who wasn't even there into a film, it does open up the realistic possibility of a recast while still using the same film. It would be expensive and take a lot of work but surely even that is better than the film being scrapped. Assuming this all doesn't get sorted out or whatever but I don't see that happening taking everything into account. Even if it does WB would be stupid to keep Miller involved at this point.
@@Elwaves2925 you would basically be remaking the film. If one frame of the performance Miller gave is onscreen they have to pay Miller.
@@c17sam90 For close ups and talky scenes etc I would agree but not for all the action scenes with lots of fx and CGI and while they're in the suit. Then you might not be able to actually tell it's Miller and it would be easier to CGI someone's face on top as all you'd see at most is the mouth area and the eyes. Everything else would covered by the suit.
The main issue is for the scenes where they aren't suited and you can see his full, unmasked head. It may still be too much, we have no way of knowing right now and it all depends how far they are willing to go with it. We'll have to wait and see what they do, for us it's all speculation. 🙂
@@Elwaves2925 but again if it can be proven Ezra put on the mo cap suit and did the movements then yes they still have to credit him. You then have all the finished merchandise that has to be changed and gotten rid of. It’s not as simple as people think you then have to do all the chemistry tests and get everyone back to film. I studied acting contracts at university and the only way to do what you were asking is basically throw every single frame of Miller/something built for his likeness and build in the bin and start from scratch. It worked for all the money in the world because they had a minor character and that’s it.
Thank you Vera. I don't want to listen to other channels because yours is more balanced. It's like a trainwreck it's almost impossible to look away Ezra Miller's life.
I don't think Warner Bros is going to hire Ezra Miller's future projects.
I love your willingness to share your point of view with us
I don't know the situation at all, and what's in the video is all new to me. But being not straight means that many things about our surrounding culture, as well as the family and home background, neighborhood community, faith / worship community, and school system, all may be very different and sometimes (or often) at odds with being not-so-straight, and navigating that as we grow up. As much good as we may get from those, some may be very toxic and negative, or at least conflicting and anxiety-producing for our non-straight selves. I will never truly know just how at odds each of those factors were with my own internal perceptions of them and my own inner struggle while growing up and even into young adulthood. But I grew up feeling very unsupported and at odds with those (family, friends, school, church, where and when I grew up) and conflicted and anxious about it. My gay feelings were something I didn't know what to make of, how to deal with. I knew how I felt, emotionally, physically, sexually, but that developed from very early and immature as a pre-teen through to more mature adult feelings. I will always wonder what it would've been like to have support and feel safe and get to embrace that part of myself in growing up, even at college age. I know many non-straight folks feel that way and have gone through much the same things, both my generation and now. What a huge difference it might have made to be able to be open and talk about it or explore those feelings more, and what a big difference it would have made to have more positive experiences and less of the negative experiences I grew up with. I was lucky that the homophobia at home was not violent or overt, but the subtle, quiet kind of homophobia is still very damaging. It is important for non-straight youth to have friends and role models and allies who are supportive, and safe spaces to be in. When home, school, church, neighborhood community, mass media, all are stacked against you, it's tough to get through adolescence. As anathema as it may sound to parents or authority figures, very honestly, sometimes when we are growing up, we genuinely need others who support us as individual people, including and especially the not-straight or not-cisgender sides of us. I'm still dealing with undoing that damage as a gay adult. who had a pretty good home and family, yet rampant homophobia in every aspect of my life growing up. It wasn't always in-your-face or violent, but it was there, even in my home life, spiritual life, and certainly always in my school life with other kids/teens. If there had been acceptance and role models for me as a boy growing up discovering my gay feelings, I would have had a much better time from childhood to adolescence and into adulthood. This is something that many straight adults don't understand about growing up for non-straight youth. Even parents do not always know what's best for their children and do not always do what's best, even with the best intentions, most well-meaning. When parents are homophobic or transphobic and their child is not straight or not cisgender, the parents are mistaken in treating their own child with homophobia or transphobia, consciously and unconsciously. My own parents surely thuoght they were doing right in how they raised me. In most ways, they did great. But growing up discovering I was gay, with parents who were homophobic if quiet about it, was still very damaging, maybe to the point of abuse being an accurate term. Understand that I loved them and they loved me. I didn't come out until after they were gone. I never felt I could talk to them about me being gay, or about any friends at school, bullying, etc., and my parents never gave me any reason to think otherwise, even into adulthood. Understand how toxic that is to a young person growing up. Understand that is where many non-straight peel come from, an entire youth of that until they can maybe escape it as independent adults, or unless they have those allies and safe spaces growing up, elsewhere and with other people than home, school, church, and other people and places we usually think of as safe havens., as nurturing good environments and role models. This is the damage behind homophobia and transphobia. It damages many kinds of personal relationships for years to come, and certainly while growing up. This is why acceptance and openness are important, so that people can keep from that damage or heal from it. -- And it's why I am so opinionated or outspoken when I reply to things like this.
I usually agree with you, but in my opinion brainwashing is basically the same as grooming
Relevant Side Topic: How the Lakota Sioux (and Standing Rock Sioux, presumably a subgroup) view nonbinary, queer, gay, or transgender may be relevant. Some Native American nations / tribes have their own traditional cultural beliefs regarding their own flavors of non-straight people. Two-spirit and third-gender are just two types of these views. Some nations / tribes believe in a binary male-female straight cisgender model. Others have varying beliefs, traditions, within their culture and language. I don't know the Lakota Sioux take on this. Even within those traditions, not everyone believes the "traditional" way; people still live in the modern world. For someone whose parents or who themselves lives within a Native American tribal, cultural identity, this can have crucial meaning, and it notably, importantly, may not be the prevailing white American (straight cisgender) view; their culture may have a different take on it.
I had no idea what was going on but I can trust you to give a balanced take. This whole situation is bizarre and sad. Thanks for the video.
I hope Keaton got all the money upfront instead of profit on the backend.
Gibson has said that they go by Gibson. They have it as their name on Instagram but haven't changed their username. Most relatives of theirs commenting on social media have misgendered them and recently they posted another thing about their father
The public seemed to be willing to give Ezra a chance if they would only explain the circumstances from their point of view for a while now. Ezra's radio silence is probably the most damaging because most people are now assuming the reports are true. I just hope things get sorted out for Takota. Thanks for making the details a little more clear for us. It's all so confusing and disappointing.
He’s on the run so he can’t be served the protective order
I love it when you get all nuanced. I think lack of nuance is half the problem we have nowadays.
Amazing analysis, especially since there are so many "on the other hands" that Topo would have trouble keeping up. Obviously, the most important thing is that everyone comes out of this healthy and whole, but I cannot help thinking about the technical people who have spent years of their lives trying to make a decent piece of art and could now end up with nothing to show for it--through zero fault of their own.
Honestly it seems literally harmful to not refer to actual allegations of grooming accurately as such when conservatives are trying to muddy the water by trying to call things that are not remotely close to grooming "grooming". I think it's much better to explain that conservatives are using "grooming" to refer to any instance of kids seeing or learning about LGBT people specifically to maliciously conflate all LGBT people with child molesters. Refusing to say groomer just because the allegations refer to an LGBT person just muddies the waters just as the transphobes are trying to achieve
I have thoughts in so many conflicting directions about this. First, I'm a parent and one of my kids is 11, so I immediately feel horrified on behalf of the complaint from a 12 year old child. Second, I have several trans loved ones, some of whom are also minors, and I've seen what it can be like to have unsupportive family, and I generally encourage some of my adult trans friends to act as older siblings/mentors to my younger trans relatives, because even in a fully supportive family, there is still a lot that as a cis person, I simply will not have those experiences and may not fully grok them. So I can see how that could be a source of comfort for the 18 year old, if that is the situation. But then, also, there are abusers and predators who specifcally prey on the vulnerable, and you mentioned that this person has had a past trauma.
But even assuming everything is fine and Ezra is fully cleared of any wrongdoing here, they still have shown a very frequent tendency toward violence, and that's only what we've seen in public. So I'm still deeply uncomfortable.
And regarding career and movie stuff... Mel Gibson has come back after a few years of laying low after some of his public incidents. I'm not sure Marky Mark ever suffered any consequences from his hate crimes. I fully expect that Ezra can bounce back, whether they should or not.
Mel Gibson was a giant a-list stat with a fan base of middle anger and older men and women many of whom are probably just as anti-Semitic as him. Miller is not so big and their you fan base is a lot more unforgiving of serious offenses such as grooming or extreme violence towards people.
18 year old person*
@@SavageMinnow Yes, thank you. I will fix that.
Mark Wahlberg realized what he was doing was wrong, and changed for the better.
If I'll be honest about the situation, I hope they get a straightjacket during rehab.
1:38 But Vera...We LOVE your deep dives! :)
I’m sad that they have caused such controversy as Ezra is really good I actually started to like them as Barry Allen. That said, I understand where the executives are coming from and I think they should drop it on streaming asap to just get past it while also releasing the film
same with me. i fell in love with their version of barry in zack snyder's justice league but what they've been doing is just inexcusable and the flash should just be dropped on streaming
Yeah this whole thing is such a mess. I hope Miller is found and gets some help. Idk what type of help they need, I'm no professional, but they're clearly not well. I'm going to hope Iron Eyes is okay and being honest with the statements about not wanting to be home etc.
Even if their parents are transphobic and just a toxic environment in general, Ezra Miller is not in my opinion not the best suited person to take care of this person. I really hope for Ezra’s sake that these allegations turn out to be false. Mostly because if it turns out to be true it means they did horrible things to a person. More horrible than they’ve already done in the past.
Regardless of what the truth is, this whole thing is a tragedy and I hope everyone involved is safe and works out their issues over time.
Jesus Kevin got worse
insert Captain America "I understood that reference!" GIF
I legitimately had a friend at university who was scared of Miller because of that film and after seeing Miller saying they own the crossbow Kevin used in the film and it’s in their office wall.
I say don’t replace the actor, replace the character kill of Barry Allen and give us wallet west he was my first introduction to the flash and I love him.
Idk why DC loves Barry Allen so much, but thrown Wally away? Maybe it’s because of Iris West?
Is she really that popular of a character though?
Bingo! That’s probably the easiest fix to that situation
The reporting of this whole story has also demonstrated that there's still a lot of ignorance in the mainstream media in regards to non-binary people. I think most of it isn't deliberately malicious, I just think a lot of mainstream society just doesn't understand that area of the LGBTQ community that well even compared to trans women and trans men.
I'd say that if a news outlet (entertainment or otherwise) is ignorant in some way then it is deliberate, even if it's not intended maliciously. There's nothing stopping them hiring (even if it's freelance) someone who isn't ignorant and does understand the landscape, especially for the bigger outlets. Not doing so is absolutely deliberate by those outlets and I feel if they don't understand the subject then they shouldn't be talking about it. 🙂
@@Elwaves2925 I mean something as basic as the pronouns. Most places I've seen do use they/them but still outn keep slipping into he/him. Even with online creators who are respectful of such issues make the mistake.
@@theshadowdirector Ah okay, I took it you meant ignorant regarding the whole thing not just the pronouns in use.
Thank you for going into the importance of using and NOT using words carelessly, it's important
It sounds like the issue with the parents is the suggestion Miller is putting ideas in their kid’s head, and as a result they are fearful they are being brainwashed. Among those ideas from what I can gather is the notion their child is trans. Which they don’t trust that their kid actually is. Now if miller has been pressurising 12 year old non-binary kids into adult situations and influencing them to identify as trans when they don’t, then I personally feel the parents in this case have a point. They (miller) are a threat. Certainly the court appearances and charges of violent behaviour would tend to imply as much.
Now let me be clear here. I’m not siding with the heteronormative parents because Miller identifies as anything whatsoever. I am siding with them, because the information publicly available confirms Miller has a history of violence and inappropriate behaviour. As lgbtq myself, I am sensitive to the misuse of the term “groomer”, but on this occasion, I’m not entirely sure I wouldn’t use it to describe miller myself. Their behaviour has been bizarre, and does not give their critics much to go on in terms of “the benefit of the doubt”.
But again, to be clear. I believe they are a risk to children, because they are a drugged up violent individual who appears to project their own gender identity on others. (Allegedly) And not because that gender identity is in itself dangerous.
Lmao I feel you about not wanting to be a celebrity drama channel. It's one thing for a few here and there, but it's exhausting when someone's channel just completely changes.
Well said about the groomer topic
but look at Batgirl being scrapped so we might need to wait till later today to see what would happen
My personal thoughts I am glad I am not Warner Bros executive for the DCEU movies. It's a trainwreck on both Iron Eyes and Ezra Miller's lives. I don't like commenting on private lives of people in general. Like Johnny Depp and Amber Heard I actually avoid most channels on UA-cam in regards to the situation. Personally I don't think that News Commentators should reporting on the court filings and they can serve the people in charge. Unfortunately this situation mirrors an actor named River Phoenix and his early death in front of the bar owned by Johnny Depp. Warner Bros may and most likely bite the bullet by dumping the Flash on HBO Max. I don't think any marketing will save this movie from a loss nor the bad news will not end when the movie releases. Ezra Miller's bad press is going to continue because we haven't reached it's peak yet. The right wing media will continue to put oxygen in to it because it's fits their narrative.
Ezra Miller has crashed and burned pretty spectacularly. For Warner Bros, imo they should either trash the project all around, or dump it on DC Universe with a statement saying they will donate all the proceeds to mental health for youths or something.
Mental health snd victims of SA
@@Dave102693 Yeah, good idea
I completely agree with your aside on definitions of non-binary and transgender. I'm afab non-binary. I'm trans because I am not cis. That doesn't mean I'm FTM and being FTM or MTF is not a requirement to be trans.
appreciate you doing all the work and sifting through this mess.
I tend to just go 'yikes!' and move on.
random thought: while I like the streak in your hair, I miss the cap.
It's clear that Ezra Miller has exhibited blatant and repetitive signs of being a danger to others. Even just the fit of rage upon hearing the word "tribe" should have told society that the situation would eventually end with victims. Besides Ezra Miller's own, the fault also lies with Hollywood and the mainstream media. This behavior has to stop being celebrated. It's not cute, nor just. Just the Iceland incident alone should have put Ezra's career and freedom on an indefinite hold. Again, public safety took a back seat to the propaganda machine that's to afraid to act appropriately. Now, the damage is done, especially with the latest victim. It's traumatic to feel powerless under the weight of a system rigged to excuse predatory behavior because of the aggressor's assumed victimhood status. Imagine the scorn if the parent had to physically defend the minor. What if police had to be involved, but weren't because we were told to hate all police that week? We need to stop excusing individuals based solely on identity. We need not be bullied out of appropriate solutions. We need to hold actions accountable and relearn what progress was supposed to be. Ezra Miller's behavior fell through the cracks for a reason; because we demanded it so. The cycle has to stop.
Thanks for covering this, cause all the news was kinda confusing me. Like I thought both people speaking put about Ezra were the same, for example.
finally i can learn about the situation without having to sit thru the constant misgendering in the other videos
Thank you for cutting through the BS on this issue.👍
I’m not a DC fan and I don’t know the flash’s story, but I do know and hate the industry’s favorite saying, “we’ll fix it in post”. 😩
They may put the squeeze on their editing team to see what shots and scenes with Ezra in it can be cut, both saving face by having less of his in it and saving money on SFX by eliminating scenes. It would seriously be like pulling teeth and honestly they probably wouldn’t have much to chop, but they (upper management) would see it as a “hey at least we tried” aka we forced the lower people to burn themselves out trying to do our bidding under threat of loss of job and then we can blame them if it doesn’t work even though it wasn’t possible in the first place.
TL;DR upper management likes to think we’re low paid miracle workers and then blame us when it can’t be done because obviously someone can do it.
i've enjoyed quite a few of your videos Vera, and then you just bust out some adorable rattos at the end?!?! You're so fantastic and I'm glad to know you're a fellow rat lover 🐀😍🐀 I subscribed for sure, keep being your awesome self, I love your outros you have such a wonderful warm and kind energy 💖
The new head of WB is a well known conservative penny pincher with an almost pathological hatred of adverse publicity. It’s a toss up between his two basic instincts which will hold sway.
That said, I never liked the casting of Ezra Miller as Barry Allen in the first place. A recast will not be a big loss.
MovieBob: "I can't make a video about Ezra Miller and how it could potentially affect THE FLASH and the DCEU! Stuff in this story keeps happening that keeps me from commenting on it!"
Vera Wylde: "Hold my beer."
Good job, Vera. You did what MovieBob couldn't. 🙂
I apreciate and admire your thouroughness on these topics.
Oh boy, that case is a mess from any angle, the now-18 young adult involved, or their parents, or Ezra Miller. Were the parents helping their child through college (money, other support) before they (now-adult offspring) dropped out? Since E.M. was said to have been giving financial support for college. How long has the relationship been going on? It sounds like the two have only been together since the young person entered college or after leaving college, but admittance was when, at 17? We don't seem to have anything to say whether the parents and their now-adult child were on amicable terms or if there was transphobia or homophobia going on, or other disagreement / distance or toxicity. The young adult hasn't distanced themselves from E.M. to show independence of thoughts and actions, which might be helpful to their own side of the case. So all in all, there are at least three sides not agreeing. -- Clearly, I have no way to know what's really going on or what to think about this. But all three sides appear to be in dispute over the young adult's situation, and over E.M.'s involvement or responsibility in the situation.Better for the young person to become disentangled from both E.M. and the parents, be independent, and make better choices in future about friends/lovers, and either patch things up with the parents or move on with their own life. But there's no winner in that until the young person gains their independence from what sounds like a mess. I can't know what's going on between the three sides, or if E.M. and th young person are fine together. So it's u[ to that young adult and up to the courts, sounds like, to resolve the mess. Fine for parents to care about their child's well-being. But also, there's a point at which one's child becomes adult and independent in their life, even if it's not what the parents like or think is right. It is possible to have phobic or overly-controlling parents who won't let their own adult child live their own life, make their own decisions, earn and keep their own money or living space, relationships, and many other factors of being independent. Sometimes the parents are right, sometimes not. Sometimes the adult child has to live through their own life and learn from mistakes, be independent. It sounds like both the parents and Ezra Miller are confused about letting the young adult decide and live for themselves, on their own, not under either side's influence or control. Be supportive instead of overly-controlling, whether parents, friend, or lover.
Barry’s become the Reverse Flash
Thanks for this even handed explanation of what's going on
I watch celebrity drama almost exclusively on this channel. Just for your analysis, not even for the drama itself.
That sigh at the beginning was a complete vibe
from the info given, it really looks like both sides are right: ezra isn't providing a healthy relationship and the parents aren't providing a good home. which really sucks that we kinda have to pick a side to agree with and that the media is hyping up one of the few big openly nonbinary people as not a pure/innocent/admirable person as if that proves the conservatives right. it also sucks cuz now the whole flash universe story angles will be tainted to some degree
This whole situation has become messier than chocolate ice cream on white bed sheets. I believe there was an article in THR or somewhere else saying that WB won’t have Miller be involved in the future of DC Films going forward (meaning that The Flash will be the last thing Miller will be in). And in regards to the FB franchise, I’ve not seen any updates about Miller’s involvement, but it’s safe to say the studio will recast or maybe the whole franchise will end without any theatrical instalments and maybe just do a TV miniseries or a TV movie or a comic book miniseries (these are just my theories, who knows what might end up happening).
On the reservation she’s from she’s still considered a kid not an adult
Excellently even handed and comprehensive, thank you for this!!
The thumbnail is such a banger
I congratulate you on your focus on accurate facts
OMG your rats are adorable, Vera! 🥰 🐀
Anyway, my first instinct is to say that the only decent way to proceed would be to just shelve the movie altogether, and eat the loss. I know that's not something any business would dream of doing, but I'm talking about from a moral standpoint, not economics.
The idea of trying to recoup funds spent on a film where your star is currently, as you so evocatively put it, radioactive, to the point that any press at all will only incite the right wing to greater heights of panic and maybe more violence against us out in the open... it seems there is no _winning_ move, but the move that will cause the least harm (except to some exec's pockets) is to bin it.
But then when I think on it further, and I think about all the rotten things that straight, binary, cis male actors have done in the past, and I start to get this disgusting feeling of resentment at the thought that a studio probably won't cover for Miller quite the way they would for a Franco (for example), and in addition to feeling like I need to shower, it makes me almost want to wait it out, too; see how Ezra's legal and behavioral issues may change before release time.
From an PR point of view the only thing that can salvage this mess is for the Miller kid to get help and for the Spin Docters to build a solid "sinner to saint" plot. Other than that I don't see Miller getting a job in at least the next decade.
Sadly this seems to be turning into an other Lucian Piane story.
Thank you for tackling this, I know it is a super heavy thing to handle and you did it amazingly well. what ever happens I hope everyone is going to be safe and get whatever help and support they need. As far as the flash, they need to suck it up and reshoot. because it is going to be IMPOSSIBLE to do anything with this movie. Do you think any of the other actors want to be involved with WB again if they are stuck with this movie. No. So just get the WB flash, reshoot with them and move on and hope for the best.
The grooming accusation has become so bad I saw a thing on twitter accusing asexuals of 'grooming' children. Grooming for what? Eating pizza?
The good news for Warner is if they do another Fantastic Beasts movie they can EASILY write out Miller due to how their character ended in Secrets
That’s what I thought. I also wonder if Warner Brothers was already treading carefully, what with Ezra’s minor scandals, on top of the other non-related controversies. Ezra’s character is crucial to the plot of Fantastic Beasts, but doesn’t get much to do, so I wonder if that played into the rationale there. It’s odd to me that, after having been in every interview for the previous one, often with other cast members, Ezra would just be allowed to camp out in Hawaii.
I'm just sticking to speculating on The Flash movie. It is possible that Warner may be insured against damage caused by imputed immoral conduct of performers in their film. If so, they could scrap the entire movie and write it off against insurance. Or they could shelve it and use some of the material elsewhere eg on TV