Should You Buy a Kitesurfing Trainer Kite?
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- Опубліковано 26 лип 2024
- If you are wondering Should You Buy a Kitesurfing Trainer Kite?, in this video we discus. What is a kitesurfing trainer kite good for? What is a kitesurfing trainer kite not good for? when should you buy a kitesurfing trainer kite? and when should you not buy a kitesurfing trainer kite?. Checkout the full course here: flukeskitesurfing.funnelbundl...
Whether you need a trainer kite really depends on what you will use it for. Of course, a trainer kite is great for learning some base skills, however when it comes to actually developing the correct muscle memory for kiting, in most cases its best to simply fly a full size kite in your lessons. The reason is, the differences between a trainer kite and a full kitesurfing kite make learning on a trainer kite run the risk of creating bad habits... so for most people, they only use the trainer kite for the first half -1 hour and then they quickly progress to the full size kiteboarding kite and never use the trainer kite again.
Why should you buy a trainer kite? What I like about trainer kites is that they are fun to fly. This means if you have friends or family that might use your trainer kite on the beach to play with, then its a good idea to get one. This way you can use the trainer kite for a few days before your first kiteboarding lessons, and then once you progress to the full kites, your friends can still play with the trainer while down the beach while you're out there kitting. I would say thats the main reason i think someone should get a kitesurfing trainer kite... if they plan to get more use out of it in the future. On top of that, if you don't plan to take lessons for a while (as in weeks away), then its a good idea to get a trainer kite and use that time to master flying the trainer. This will help you develop skills that cross over into the big kites, particularly if you get very good at it. But as above, really I've found the main use for a trainer kite is in the first hour or so that gives you the base feeling and concept, after that you are simply learning to to fly the trainer kite, which is quite different to how to fly a full kiteboarding kite. Hope this helps. - Спорт
Thanks Luke for another great video. I personally found owning a trainer kite important. Here are a couple of thoughts in case they benefit smn else. My experience has been that through it:
1) I got rid of the fear of what it is to fly a kite. It helped me understand the basics and gave me the confidence I needed prior to handling the 12 m beast.
2) In my eternal venture to recruit friends to join me kite surfing, the trainer is instrumental. Friends can have a taste of what kite surfing is, in a safe manner.
3) On some days when the strong wind doesn't pop up, the trainer will fly high and I can try more aggressive maneuvers in the hope that one day I can transfer them to the inflatable kites.
I was so amazed that kiters will master their kites in crowed area, making such incredible colored show, that I purchased my 1rst trainer kite (HQ 3m). I was immediately astonished how easy it was to fly and get fun. Indeed it is different than a 4lines inflatable kite, but far less complex and dangerous without any instructor! It gave me the taste of kite flying, and I moved quickly to lessons, 1rst real kite purshase (14m2) and many other steps...But I must admit that I still own it after many years and as I leave in country side, quite far from ocean, but with a large field behind my home, I often open it and fly it for 1/2h just for fun, sometimes with a harness and some elastic ropes connected to the bar...The flying experience is quite different, more tricky I would say but I could fly on light, strong, gusty days, without any helper and very low risk! It is by sure a very good demonstration step to show to newbies before they start
Another point for using one, with reference to the Downloop/underloop video, is that it is really much easier to train loops, so that one gets confident to commit more when performing loops with bigger kites. Even though I haven't tried with big kite myself, yet :) great video as always!
Yeah for sure! learning loops is a great thing to do on trainer kites! :)
Yes, absolutely. Here's what I did:
a.) Bought a good quality "small" kite(Peter Lynn 2.4) with two line control bar. So, I learned all about the wind window, power eye, looping, self-launch, self-landing. Made mistakes and also mastered the coordination and control. At high winds, you get a taste of the potential power. This kite was around $100.
b.) Next moved up to a larger trainer kite(Peter Lynn, Hornet 4.0) for $250. Expensive, but now I had more appreciation for quality and cost. Also, this can be used as a power/traction kite for land boarding and even kite jumping. So, at this size and decent wind(8+ knots) it can really knock you down. You cannot simply cross the power eye, or loop the kite without consequences. So, you learn absolute respect and control of the kite. Also, with 4 lines you "will" learn about line management, because it can take you 15 minutes or 60 minutes to finish/wind the lines. The larger kite also stays up in low winds(5knots) when my small trainer couldn't. At this point, I can also put on my windsurf harness/hook and connect to the steering bar. It won't exactly mimic a real kite surfing kite at 10m or larger size, but you will definitely learn to maneuver the kite safely, efficiently and precisely.
Now, I don't live near water, but I know I will eventually have my chance one day. In the meantime, I wanted to just get a feel for it and have full mastery of kite control. I found it addicting and when wind is right I enjoy kite jumping and will be gearing up for land boarding.
Nice one Trex, perfect for that and those bigger kites like a 4M can be a lot of fun.. as you say, in high winds they can really pull you :) let us know how it translates when you do get the change to hit the water :)
@@FlukesKitesurfing Thanks Flukes. My dream is one day sign up for a nice weeklong kitesurfing camp, maybe in vietnam...I've seen their video. However, lately I've been seeing a lot of new video's on kite wings. Wow...now talk about compact/safe/fool proof equipment. Do you guys have any experience with kite wings?
@@trexinvert Nice :) We actually haven't tried the wing yet.. but Ocean Rodeo are launching one soon so we will get it going then :)
Agree with all of this. Since I knew it would take awhile for me to save up for lessons and gear (~$2500-3000), I bought a 3.5m 2-line to mess around with for several moths. I developed muscle memory and even practiced body dragging in shallow water. I have also heard a lot that if you can afford it and get right into lessons, it isn't worth it.
Hey Mcr, yeah actually i did a similar thing when i was learning. We flew a 3.5M buggy kite for weeks as we didn't have any kite gear or lessons planned. It can be helpful particularly if you have a wait before lessons.
Awesome videos as usual. This is exactly the question I had when I started. Ended up returning the trainer.
Thanks Jean-Francois
Great video, thanks for posting
I have a trainer, but use it for fun when bored and keep it in the car
Yeah us too :) Great for bit of the fun on the beach
yup agree with this.. curious if you guys have tried the aluula kites from ocean rodeo? could be a good video
There are also super cheap power kites on aliexpress that do the job.
I bought a 2.5m for 18usd.
Happy I got one and it did help with learning the wind window and loops.
Would not recommend spending more than that if the goal is kitesurfing, even though the major brands trainer kites are way better in every way.
Nice, yeah i haven't sen them that cheap, but that might be a great option if you can get it. Not much to lose then and still a bit of fun :)
Thanks for your important tips 👍
Glad it helped!
Luke: I am rank beginner and bought a Ozone 4 meter trainer. Winds are generally light in my area. On Sunday I took a drive to the ocean, as the projection was for 15-20 mph wind. I was alone and set up my lines upwind as you mention in another video to try and self launch. The wind was blowing probably 20-25 mph. I oriented the kite as you mentioned in your video (was launching in stubble grass about 5 inches high) and the kite just sat there no matter what I did with the lines. A good hearted bloke that was watching sauntered over and asked if I would like some help. I asked if he had ever assisted launching a kite to which he answered: "No". I took him to the kite and explained (as in your video) how to hold and orient the kite's leading edge into the wind, and to just step back and not toss the kite when I gave the the thumb's up sign. I got back to my bar, hooked in getting ready for my first real time with the kite and then the excitement began...lol. At the thumbs up, my assistant tossed the kite into the air! The kite immediately headed downwind (fast!) and began to death loop in the power zone. This resulted in a quick trip ending in a perfect downwind one point face plant. It was pretty exciting. I got my bell rung pretty good and there was blood everywhere! It all happened so fast I could not use the safety release (you can bet from now on my launches will feature one hand on the bar and one hand on the safety release!). My assistant ran to secure the kite while I tried to gather my wits! My previous outing with the kite was in too little wind, and the kite (once I got it aloft with a straight downwind assisted launch!) almost took me out with a front stall. All was not for naught though, I now have valuable experience in two wind conditions, and am the proud owner of two black eyes! :-)
So, to my questions: What is a good wind condition (mph) to look for in my next outing? How should the kite be trimmed prior to launch (all the way out on a front trimmed kite??) Do you have any ideas why when I was at a right angle to the wind direction with the furthest kite tip oriented upwind a bit (such that the kite looked like it wanted to fly) that I could not get the kite to roll up on to its tip (or even act like it would get airborn)?? And finally, is this why you don't the want the launch assistant to throw the kite into the air? :-)
Cheers Luke.....Terry
Hey Terry sounds a little tooo "exciting" lol glad you're all good :) To answer your questions, firstly is this a leading edge inflatable kite? If so it should be treated the same as any kite because by the sounds of it your connected via your harness. many people in my local area fly 4M kites actually kitesurfing, so they can really be powerful if the wind it too strong as perhaps you experienced. (a 4M is a big trainer kite and should be respected unlike a 1.5M ram air kite with no harness like i have in this video which even in high winds wont really hurt you and you can just let go.) that said, this 4M will teach you a lot about kiting, just need to get it sorted safely. If it is a ram air kite, then you need to hot launch it from directly downwind like seen in the video.
1. I never have a non kiter launch my kite. I would always rather self launch rather have a helper that doesn't know what they are doing.
2. Wind range for the 4M as a trainer will depend on a few factors, but it should fly nicely in 15 knots to practice
3. Checkout the self launch downwind line method. Its the preferred method for self launching a LEI ua-cam.com/video/mP5XLYSqKQU/v-deo.html
4. without seeing what happened, often a death loop immediately after launch is due to a line setup error. Typically a line is caught on a bridle, or the pilot is holding the wrong side of the bar, or the lines are connect to the wrong side of the kite. so best to be sure to triple check that you have the setup correct. use the downwind setup and be sure to preflight check.
5. the reason the helper doesn't throw the kites is less about it creating an issue specifically, and more about that if the helper "needs" to throw the kite in any way, it means the pilot is not positioned correctly. when you are correctly positioned across the wind and ready to launch you should feel you have the perfect control to slowly steer the kite up with minimum force and under control to hover the kite 2m off the ground if that makes sense. if it doesn't feel like that, then the pilot needs to reposition. Hope that helps mate :) Give it another go in lighter wind and let us know how it goes :)
Hey, g'day Mate!
Thanks so much for responding Luke, I really appreciate that you did!
RE: You're questions
The Kite - Yes it's a LEI kite (4 m Ozone Uno V2, 4 line, manufactured in 2019). It was previously owned by a kite boarding school but I was told it was only flown twice (by a little old lady....just joking). From it's pristine condition and crunchyness, I think the seller was square with me on this. I wanted a used 2.5 m Uno but could not find one at the time. I had concerns when buying the 4m about the potential power of the kite (I had previously logged about 2 hours on a 2.5 m Uno (owned by a friend) but when the opportunity came along I thought that if I were careful, I could get the flying fundamentals down on the beach and then be able to begin body dragging with it, reasoning that the 2.5m probably would not be powerful enough for body dragging. I bought a used 50 cm Liquid Force bar to use with it and have verified all four lines are the same exact length.....twice.
Pre Flight- I laid out the lines downwind as described in your excellent video. Verified three times that the lines were not crossed and properly attached and the bridles were not tangled. Before you responded back to me, i went back to your video for a post mortem review. I was positioned properly to the wind direction but I hosed up on the kite placement to the wind for the self launch! Had the position reversed! Rather than the kite presenting the trailing edge to me when I stepped back tensioning the lines , I was rotating the leading edge around to face me when stepping back. Duh! I believe this is why the kite would not roll up onto its end and fly. I did however pick up the bar properly prior to my express trip downwind. :-)
Post mortem analysis - I think the kite might have flown as situated, but the wind was shifting and gusting a bit when it got tossed in the air. I'm concerned the trim of the kite was not set up properly as the front lines were taut and the back lines were very loose such that the kite may not have been controllable. It's hard to say because everything happened very quickly. Also I believe I had the bar fully in, to try to get the rear lines to tension up a bit. The death loop may have been my own doing as I cranked on the bar in panic trying to gain control of the kite. I knew I was in trouble when the kite rocketed down wind at launch! The whole flight lasted maybe 2 - 3 seconds!
Your explanation makes perfect sense to me Luke. Thank you. I was expecting the kite to be stable when released, but it was not, so I must not have been positioned properly. Would you please respond back to me regarding the proper trim for the kite prior to launch? This is very concerning to me and I have not seen this addressed anywhere. (In your course you do address trim, but it's with the kite already in the air.) With the bar fully out (depowered) should the front and rear lines have approximately the same tension at launch, or should the front lines be taut and the rear lines be more loose? Or?? I will study some of yours and others launch videos to see if this can be deduced.
I will shoot for a bit less exciting wind conditions on my next try. Also I will try to find a location where I can tether the bar and walk the kite into the sweet spot myself! This should help immensely on several levels.
Thanks again....Cheers Mate! :-) Terry
@@tlv7257 just in case ir takes time for gis response: bar should be out, Kite depowered and 4 lines similar tension (lets check what Flukes says as im a newbie) :)
@@davidamigos.davidamigosnwa4522 Thanks for responding David!.....That's what I have been thinking also. Although all my control lines are equal length, it seems the front lines are tensioned, while the rear lines are slack when my bar trim adjustment is all the way out and my bar out also. Think I will need to sheet in a bit to correct this trim. I may get a chance to go out tomorrow in 12 to 15 mph winds (projected) for practice. Thanks again!......Terry
@@tlv7257 Hey Terry, happy to help mate. Yeah with small kites like that the back lines often do seem a little slack. Thats how they look but you should still be able to control the kite ok in any trim settings if its setup as per the manufacturers settings and in moderate wind conditions for the kite size. One more thing to check then (if you have the setup correctly) is that the trailing edge should not be flapping before launch when someone is holding it. As in "the perfect position to launch your kite" video, if the training edge is flapping, the kite will drift back and that can sometime cause issues including loss of control, Anyway, let me know how it goes next time!
Thanks for sharing
for sure! Thanks for watching
I hace a north lizard 1.8 and It is actually a 4 line kite, with a bar wich is even longer than a 11m kite bar. Also when you let go de bar de leash pulls a safety line which depowers de kite completely.
Hey Carlos, nice one! :)
great video , thanks. this chestermans beach tofino?
Maybe ;)
Trainer kites are always fun i kite voor 12 years en i stil use my trainer kite Some times
Nice!
Could I use something like this using a simple SUP just to get around the lake at a 5mph speed?
Hey Adrian, yeah maybe for some fun... but would be hard, as the kite will likely hit the water at some point and the fun would be over. The best thing to get if you want to use a sup is a Wing. Often people learn to wing foil, by first using the wing with a sup.
Can you use one of these on the water? I'd like to get into this but I'd just like to glide along the water, I don't care about the "extreme" tricks or anything like that. It seems like a smaller kite like this would be all the power I need.
Hey Garret, no not really. In fact in most cases when learning beginners prefer to be more powered (bigger kites).. as the power of the kite can help make up for poor technique. This kite would not pull you in the water at all... unless it was blowing 40+ knots maybe :)
@@FlukesKitesurfing from what size can you use it in water with a wind of 15 km h? 3m kite its enough just to slide, or not?
If you are light on your feet and only weigh 140lbs... can you use this kite with a foil board or twin tip?
No, it's a different kite
You are referring to a 2-line trainer. What about a 3-line trainer?
Hey Philipp, yeah this vid is just referring to the 2 lines when talking about the "Muscle memory" With a 3 or 4 line, you might get a better feel for sheeting in and out which will help you transition a little closer to what is needed for a big kite. The rest remains the same. As soon as you progress to a big kite, the only real time you might use the trainer again is with friends etc :)
The only advantage of a 3 liner is that you can self-launch if you crash nose down. It's handy if you are in the water and the kite is waterproof. So, the steering control is the same between two and three lines. You can quickly master the kite and will rarely crash, so the 3rd line is not used. Stick with the 2 line. Then if you want more challenge and progress, get a 4 liner where you can learn to de-power, fly reverse and steer in reverse.
Any recommendations for a trainer?
They all mainly do a similar thing.. for fun, I like 2m+ ones so i can feel the wind a bit more (more power), the 3 line ones can be better as sometimes they allow you to sheet in and out as well... but even a small one like we have there is fun to fly :)
Depends on your price range. I agree with Flukes Kitesurfing for a cheaper less commitment type of option. If money isn't an object then the HQ Hydra is probably still the only closed cell trainer. Because it's closed cell it can be water re-launchable. This would be great for practicing up-wind & then fun down-wind body-dragging/surfing on on-shore days with plenty of beach. (no obstructions, i.e. people, trees, building, inclines)
im just gonna Vite the bullet and buy the normal kites as soon as I get better at water starts. Thanks for the input, y’all. 🪁
@@JohnsonJLB Can I use the hydra hq in water with a wind of 15km h on average? 3m size
Trainer Kite messed me up with bad habits when I got to the real thing. I do not recommend. Rather get a smaller kite you can harness into.
Thanks for the insight Jazz! Certainly i have heard similar things from some other people too.
Is this a 4.5m trainer kite?
This is 1.5m
Nice Vid, but for me it doesn‘t really cover the question of the usefulness of trainers unless you cover the true depowerable trainer kites that have four-lines and a harness, like the Ocean Rodeo React, whose carry bag conveniently doubles as a harness. Training with a true four-line+harness trainer can save you real money on lessons, since you really will have the kite flying skills you need before your start your lessons and which can‘t be trained with a two-liner like you show here (especially because of the tendency of beginners to pull on the bar when overpowered instead of letting out the bar, which habit is only exacerbated by flying two-liner kites, since you then „hold on tighter“. Only a four liner with bar& harness can teach you to let out the bar to depower.) . Also, they‘re great for adolescents who are interested in kiting, and if it‘s a water launchable front-tube trainer like the ocean rodeo, they can even do body drags with it, which is great fun by itself. I‘d say a trainer like that gives you the skills equivalent to the first 4 hours of lessons at least and would be good for anybody, since you learn the skills without getting launched onto your face whenever you make a mistake, relaunch goes much faster, and you don‘t need to pay somebody $50/Hour to watch you crash the kite into the water 100 times. Of course, a four line depowerable trainer costs about as much as 8 lessons (unless you get it used), but then you have the kite, which also is just a lot of fun at the beach, like you say.
Hey Josh, yeah this video is mainly about the low cost 2 line kites. But as you say, if you get something like the Ocean Rodeo React, you can get a lot more out of it and develop a lot of skills prior to lessons. The React is effectively a tiny LEI kite... similar to buying a 3 meter Kitesurfing kite and using that as a trainer kite. You will undoubtedly get a lot of skills with it. A little more expensive, but if price isn't a concern, its a great option :)