Check out the Guild Starfire 1-12. Mahogony body, so a bit fuller sound than a maple body, and the HB2 pickups allow coil spitting. For a bit north of a grand, you can get a Starfire IV 12 string, which is a very nice guitar. Still far less than a Ric, or a 6000 series Gretsch, but more versatility than the 5400 series Gretsch can manage. I do like my Gretsch 5422-12 for the exceptional clean sounds. But my Guild Starfire 1-12 has more versatility on the sound, and can take on a bit of grit, without mudding up.
I own the Gretsch, and I really like the sound of it. I'd say you're getting 90+ percent of the Ric sound... but you're paying 45 percent of the Ric money. You can buy a pretty nice amp (and a Jangle Box) with the 55 percent you're got left. The Gretsch is a great value; but nothing sounds like a Rickenbacker..
There is a reason why the Rick defines the sound of the electric 12-string. The only guitar I've played that comes close the sound was a Vox Teardrop XII. which had weak pickups,, but it did have pretty decent approximation to "that" sound. I've not played the Danelectro, but I've heard demos where it sounds a lot better than it does here. A piercing tone that is part of what you want from a 12. The Gretsch sounds pretty good for the price, but I wouldn't be seen dead with a guitar that looks like that. PS 1 The reason for the Rick headstock design is to stop it hitting the floor when you take your hand off the neck. A common problem with bighead twelves that are based on a six-string design. PS 2 The small knob on the Rick is a blend control when both pickups are selected. It enables you to produce a very wide range of sounds with a single knob. Try it with the neck pickup treble turned right down: Roger McGuinn to Joe Pass, with one twist. PS 3 Rickosound (aka stereo) is fantastic for rhythm playing. Put the neck pickup through a clean channel, and the bridge through your FX channel. Your lead guitarist will hate you!
Not even close. The Dano was brittle and tinny. The Gretsch - though better - was unfocused and muddy. The Rick is the clear winner in every way. And let's face it, the main reason people play electric 12-strings is for that classic 60s/80s sound. You might as well be playing the same guitar that most of those bands were - they used Ricks for a reason! FWIW: I own a Jetglo 360v64 12-string that is my pride and joy.
I go for the Dano!!!!....I love the bite and the brightness!!!...(And I own the 59x12)...🤩..The Gretsch and the Ric sound quite similar. But no guitar sounds like a Danelectro!!!
My dream guitar has long been the Ric 360 12-string. But I am a basement player, who jams with buddies on occasion. While I am in the fortunate position to be able to afford the insane indulgence of the Ric (around $3700 Cdn for a new one), I couldn’t rationalize the cost even to myself, let alone my wife. I’ve considered the Danelectro in the past (primarily because of the price….around $750 Cdn new), but found it “tinny” sounding, and not pleasing to my ear. However September is “Fender month” at my favourite music chain, so I was there on the last day of September, after purposely avoiding the place all month. I went with my buddy who I jam with regularly, as we were each considering picking up a Bassbreaker amp. I came across this gorgeous gold top Gretsch 12-string, and after playing it for a bit, fell deeply in like. I jokingly said to my buddy, “Too bad Fender didn’t own Gretsch. I’d grab this in a minute”. He said “They are”. We confirmed it with one of the sales staff, and after somewhat begrudging getting “clearance from Clarence” (the wife), it was part of my aresenal. The look on my wife’s face when I got home made it clear she wasn’t very impressed with me. But once she saw, and more importantly, heard it, she understood. And I scratched the electric 12-string itch for about 1/3rd the price of the Ric. And your comparison test confirmed for me that I made the right decision, consider I’m not even in a bar band. Thanks for putting this together.
I think the Ricky is the best, but Gretsch sounded great. The Danelecto was to shrill. I could see using it for some special effects, but not as your main 12. Great demo!
Agreed. The Danelectro was a non-starter. Maybe if you bought some RB pickups and then hollowed out room for them in the Danelectro, you would have a guitar that would sound good, but stock... the Danelectro is just unbearable.
Great video. I'm lucky enough to stand by the motto, if you're shopping for something special like a guitar and there are cheaper alternatives described as 'being almost as good as X', just get the X. It might hurt in the moment, but then there's a lifetime of maximum enjoyment as opposed to feeling good with a low price but never really loving what you got. Obviously there are many exceptions, but guitars get their reputations for a reason, and I usually want the best, within reason. Thank you for the video, you just facilitated another Ricky purchase, though I'll go used to cut the price-pain down a bit.
Sound is a key part. But so is playing feel. And looks and overall inspiring vibe and what turns you on. I have a Ric 330/12 but I did try the Dano and Gretsch both of which were fine guitars. But I WANTED the Ric so badly I raided the bank for it.
My Danelectro sounds nothing like that. It’s partly the bridge which believe or not makes a big difference with its wooden rosewood. I have owned three Ric.,12’s. Go listen to the Dano’s on here.,l would not buy that Dano one if I had to base it on this video. I play the Dano out and people including musician who say I am going to get one of those. The original Rosewood bridge helps with the sustain, but also sounds so much more full and fat. That thing sounded like shit so all I can say is anyone listening to this go to UA-cam put in danelectro Trail String and you’ll hear what they really sound like with the Rosewood bridge might I add?. Also try changing the strings on the Ric if you got a half a day to put into it, believe me, I broke a string at a gig my 20 minute break was not enough time to change one string. That’s why I sold them all.
The Rick is still the best sounding electric 12-string guitar of all of them. The Danelectro sounds shrill. The Gretsch is a good sounding 12-string though. At the end of the day the Rickenbacker remains the king.
Very nice job. It does sound like the Gretsch could be a replacement for the Rick for those who may not be able to afford one. But there is a recognizable difference in "definition of sound" between the Gretsch and Rick. Again, nice job.
The little black knob on the Rick is a balance control for the center toggle position. This way you can accentuate one of the two pups in the blend. It’s essential because the neck pickup kind of obscures the 12 string sound, while the bridge pickup is so brittle it’s hard to use. I owned all 3 of these at one time, I gave up the Danelectro because it buzzed like crazy and was super thin as you hear in this demo. Both this Gretsch and Rick are giant guitars. The Rick 620/12 is far better if you want something smaller and solid. Also, the MIJ Gretsch has better electronics . Don’t fool around with budget Gretsch if you can avoid it.
Like the Gretsch, but I prefer the Ric. I love the sound and would use it often. If I wanted a 12 string to play occasionally I might choose differently. I think the hi gain pickups are highly underrated and to my ears sound similar but more full than toasters. Thanks for the video
What a great video, man! Super useful for someone shopping for a 12 string. And showing the graphic EQ was also very helpful. I'm not in the market for a Rickenbacker because it's not cost effective for my use, and also -- I actually preferred the Gretsch sound. What you hear as muddiness, I hear as body. I've heard the Danelectro in other videos and they made it sound much better than the one you played -- but they set up the amp, etc., which you pointed out that you did not. But even in those other videos, it still doesn't sound as good as the other two, and it is certainly not as versatile. You helped me to decide on the Gretsch, and I'm ordering it now. Seriously, I wish other guitar reviewers followed your style of video making! You go right to the heart of the matter and the way you edit it makes it easier for the viewer to compare!!! Keep it up!
Hi great shootout, I've own several brand 12 strings, i now have a ric 360 mapleglo 12 and its definitely the best sounding 12 I've had, the Gretsch did sound fantastic though, wasn't impressed with the Daneolectro
I'm pretty sure this Danelectro has a wiring issue... I own one (and an AC15) and it's nowhere NEAR as thin as illustrated here. Mine IS bright, but also full and rich in the mids and lows.
Super video thank you! Rickenbacker is the clear winner here. When you compare the price you should mention also diffences in looks: when you hold a Rickenbacker in your hands it feels very well made (and expensive). I tried a couple of Gretsch made in Asia: you can feel the diffence
Rickenbackers have incredible build quality and sound. A real Gretsch (MIJ) 12 rather than an Electromatic might offer a better comparison with the Ric..but there goes the mid price point.
The Gretsch sounds the mellowest of the three on my puny mobile phone speaker, but it's not just about how they sound, it's about how they feel to play. I just picked up an acoustic Grand Auditorium Sigma acoustic 12 string over a D'Angelico principally because it gives me bags of confidence with its solid feel and resonant tone.
I have had all three of these Guitars. I have two big issues with the Rick 360. Which I still own . Jet Black like ( Lennons which he never used on stage ) . The narrow neck ( even Harrison said it was tough to one play cleanly) and the insane location of the tuning pegs. The Gretsch to me is the best of this group unless your a Pro RECORDING Artist . You play a 12 string live with all the noise in the band and you could play any decent 12 and you would sound great. Been there done that. I own 6 12 strings and I love the sound of the instrument. Great video .We all have different opinions on Guitars
Like I said , I have 4- 12 strings and the best sounding for the money is my Gretsch G5022-12 White Falcon acoustic. I have the low E strings switched around so the low E is on Top. Made all the differece in the world on sound.
@@dennyhess2296 Hey Denny thats the Guitar I am playing on my profile picture. Yes its a great sounding Guitar. Wow the idea of switching the Low E string around sounds great. I will give that a try. Thanks for the idea
The sound of the Rick is undeniable! However the neck is too narrow! It’s a 12string with a 6 string neck. I have long thick fingers and it’s a chore to play. The nut is only 41mm whereas others are around 48mm which is more comfortable
The video is very illustrative. I had wondered how each of these guitars stand against each other. Very well played, too! Thanks a lot. You gave me a good idea. From what you present, I am now considering a Rick. Thanks!
One of the most thorough and helpful discussions and comparisons of these 3 12-string electrics. I've been watching reviews of the Gretsch Electromatic 12-string because it's in my price range, and this review offered me much more information about Gretsch buiild and tone, along with the reviewer's helpful opinions comparing the 3 guitars. Thanks much for this terrific review of these 12-string electrics!.
@@tuguybear930 The Gretsch and Guild guitars built in Korea and Indonesia are some very nice guitars, especially when you factor in the price paid for them. The quality far outstrips the price point.
I have a couple of vintage Danelectro-made Silvertones, and I love lipstick tube pickups, but that Danelectro sounds like garbage. I never could have imagined it sounding so bad. Thin, no mids, no bass. I just picked up a Gretsch G5422G-12, and it is gorgeous.
How often are you really going to play an electric 12 string? I have a Cozart on which I had to finish the neck (Tung Oil) and replace the tuners (found some on sale at StewMac). It's now very playable and cost less than the Dano. The Dano sounded thin and tinny compared to the Gretsch and Ric. To me, those 2 sounded quite similar. Rics are beautiful guitars (I used to own a 620) but rather pricey. For the money, I'd go with the Gretsch, knowing that it was only going to get occasional playing time...
Absolutely excellent review, I’m looking to buy a 12 string and so pleased to come across this review. Clear, concise and very well put together. Thank you. Personally I’ve had Rickenbacker in the past and wasn’t really impressed with it, I ended up changing it. Based on this review I thing the Gretsch is really good value for money. The cheap guitar sounded really poor in comparison as you would expect for the price but I thought the Gretsch sounded better than the Rick which sounded too thin although that’s s what they are known for. Thanks for the very helpful review
Hm, that is intersting what you defined about the Gretsch, I heard a playing session of the Gretsch for the first time yesterday and it surprised me bigtime that it came out forward so prominently compared to what I was used to from the Rick. Another point on which I think the Gretsch is slowly winning on me over the Rickenbacker.
You know that old adage, "You get what you pay for?" This is a great example. I hate to say it, but that Dano was terrible - far too shrill. The Rick edges out the Gretsch, but it's close!
First I wanna thank you for saying Rickenbacker and not Rickenbocker. At some point you should try a Burns Double Six, because despite being a spectacularly ugly guitar, it sounds gorgeous, and for my money, it's the only one that comes close to pushing the Rickenbacker off its perch.
The Danelectro sounded horrible, I've got one and I've never been able to make it sound that bad. But I use the middle pickup selection with a compressor. Having said that it doesn't sound like a Ricki or a Gretsch. So no surprise really. Thanks.
Great job on the video. I think it's the only way to compare them. The Gretsch and Ric sounded incredibly similar until you were playing single notes, and I think that may be due to the placement of the fundamental and octave strings.
Thanks for the great video. In Australia for new prices, Danelectro is around $750 to 850 AUD, the Gretsch is $1,600 to $2,000 AUD, the Rickenbacker anywhere from $3,500 to $5,000 AUD. The way I see it, if having the RIC is going to encourage you to play a 12 string three or four times as often as you would with the Danelectro, then the value equation is a no brainer. And it's further enhanced if you decide to sell the guitar later on. If you just want a knockabout 12 string that you are going to play every now and then, or you prefer the Danelectro sound, then that will work too. In Australia, you aren't going to lose much re-selling a Danelectro 12. The Gretsch is the middle ground. I imagine most players who buy a Gretsch are probably likely to keep it forever. But then, if you are going to keep the guitar forever, probably worth considering spending the extra money and buying a RIC. The difference in price will be ammortized over the years and the resale value would be better decades on from now. And the RIC is a RIC.
People buying a Mercedes or BMW don't try to justify it because they'll drive one three or four times as often as a Hyundai. Musicians however, tend to complain about the price of just about anything. Personally, I like the Ric. They're rare, the headstock design is the same size as a six string, not a foot long like the others, they have a distinctive sound and they're well made. I bought my 330/12 in Australia a long time ago, and when I look at how much they're selling for now, I smile. Their narrow neck width can be an issue for some, but you can get another nut made that closes up the spacings between the doubled strings and moves them all slightly outwards. The models without neck binding have slightly more room to play with. You could also reverse the stringing to the conventional arrangement as renowned Ric player Marty Willson-Piper does apparently, if that's an issue for you.
@@deaddoll1361 Alternatively, the Rickenbacker 1993Plus 12 and 660/12 both ship with wider necks. Indeed Marty Wilson-Piper has strung his Ric 12s with the conventional arrangement as per the original Rickenbacker 12 String OS electric prototype that was gifted to Suzi Arden by F.C. Hall way back in 1963. To this day, that RIC is the ONLY 12 string electric guitar Rickenbacker ever manufactured with conventional stringing.
Not sure how you eq'd the Dano, but I've heard other demos where it sounded great. Good enough for me to look into getting one. I play Rics, Teles and Strats into an AC15 with a Jangle Box compressor.
@@RecordingFreaks Pretty sure there's something wrong with yours... I have the same DC59-12 and an AC15, AND I have a 5420 6-string. If they sounded as far apart, eq-wise, as the two in your video, I'd never be able to swap between the two during a gig without some MAJOR EQ changes.... but I do, without any changes at all. Go look at other videos of this guitar (even comparing it to Ric's) and you'll see. You should have someone look at yours.
Given the price difference between the Gretsch and the Rick I would be on the Gretsch, for the simple fact that I don’t play that many songs that require an electric 12 string. The DE on the other hand was awful sounding on its own and would probably have a use being double tracked with the Gretsch!
I've owned a couple Danelectros, they were were always interesting in a good way, .. but that one sounds nasty - like they should have cut the neck down at the 12 fret and sold it as a 12 string mandolin. But the Gretsch? wow, punches way above its price point and in some sections sounded better in the mix to the Ric . I've got friends I jam with who have 12 string Rickies so I'll probably get the Gretsch to add a little sonic variation.
Good video and sound comparison. I have the same gretsch 5422tg in white. I made a new nut and switched the saddles around and strung it up like a Rickenbacker. Playing it through a vox ac10. It has it's own sound and different than any other 12 string I've ever heard.
The Danelectro sounded very bright and thin, but I think the Gretsch tone wise was equal to the Rickenbacker, and for the difference in price, the Gretsch wins
The Danelectro sounds thin and tinny. The Rick sounds great, but the Gretsch is a real surprise! Almost as good as the Rick for a fraction of the cost.
Well. If ever you wanted a video that explored every detail needed as to buy a specific guitar then this is it. Bloody brilliant job. I'm for the Ricky lol
Would like to see you match up the Guild Starfire 1-12 and Starfire IV-12 against the Ric. The SF 1-12 is less than the Gretsch, the SF IV-12 a bit more. Both well under the cost of the Ric, but also very good values for what you get. Nice demo for what you had available.
Same suggestion I wanted to make. I'm familiar with an older Guild Starfire 12 with the lovely LB-1 pickups that are exceptionally articulate and brilliant in sound. Guild continues to be largely ignored and I can't for the life of me understand why!
The new version of the Danelectro is $549. Came back from the guitar shop all excited because, well, you know, I'm going to catch hell from the wife for buying the $1,000 Gretsch. Rickenbacker is out of the question because as you said, I only want a 12-string for a few songs (though I could change my mind on that). Listening to you play those, all the exact same licks and chords against band tracks (great job on that as well, btw), I came up EXACTLY with the same conclusions you made. And then blending in those audio graphs told the same story you were playing. What an awesome job of comparing these guitars! Completely unbiased, perfectly organized. I guess I'll just have to go through one of those rocky periods with the wife. I mean , really...I don't have a 12-string (and that's just unfair).
Great video. For me, the 5422-12 string gets me close enough to be happy. My Country "Gentleman" Classic (62 model 6122) and a VOX amp get me close enough to those Early Beatle Sounds that I love. I am not a professional and I make compromises in my life that seem to work. BTW after playing the Gretsch 6122, I couldn't live with how small the Rickenbacker is; just my personal preference I guess. I paid $999.00 + tax for my 5422-12 with new guitar, case (not Gretsch), strap and tuner. All this made the covid lockdowns tollerable !
1. The Gretsch sounds like a Gretsch, its tonal qualities are similar to my six string model. I would extrapolate from there how an Ibanez AS73-12 would sound in comparison since I have a 6 string model for that too. 2. The sounds of the Ric and the Gretsch are super close from this vantage point. 3. I can see why the Beatles could mix Gretsch and Rickenbacker tones. They match up well. 4. For studio, the Danelectro could be EQ'd, but for live performance I'd pick the $900 Gretsch. I'd worry about gigging a $2000-$3000 guitar. Excellent comparison.
Hello. I own a Ric 381-12V69. I must say that using the Ric-O-Sound box that splits the stereo sound into two separate outputs, makes all the difference in the world. It made the guitar sound like it was in a cathedral. The 330-12 differs from the 360-12 and the 381-12, in that it is mono output only. Great job on the video! If you want a good mix with an electric 12 string, I recommend a trebly bass. That’s how The Byrds were recorded.
Good to know, though I doubt I'll own a Rick $$$$ anytime soon. Using lots of compression (on the recording) could get you to that Byrds sound, but I kinda prefer this guitar (I have the Gretsch 12 in Walnut Satin finish) without a compression pedal in a band setting so that the dynamics can really shine through.
I would have liked to have also seen in comparison, the Eastwood 12-string and the re-issued Fender 12-string as well. The Fender "Electric XII" is also quite familiar in late-'60's pop records- "I'm Not Like Everybody Else" by the Kinks, The "Pinball Wizard" strum in "Tommy," the 12-string on "Stairway to Heaven", and the 12-string work by Lou Reed on Velvet Underground albums, for instance.
Nice review but I don't think the comparison was totally fair. I have a Dano 12 and I've had some other 12s (not a Ricky though) and one thing I've found is that EQ on the amp is critically important to dialing in the best sound for each guitar. With a little more EQ that Dano could have sounded way better. I know mine does. Although the Ricky does a better job of sounding like a Harrison or McGuinn recording, I think if you gave McGuinn a Dano or Gretsch, and EQed it properly, you would be hard pressed to tell the difference, especially in a band mix. Recording is another story altogether, but live the Dano is the best choice in my opinion. No offense to you, because I think you did a great job with this video, but I have a bone to pick with all these guitar comparisons on UA-cam which think they're doing the most "scientific" comparison by keeping the amp on the same settings for all the guitars. The reason we have EQ, and different amps, and pedals is that every guitar has unique needs to make them sound their best. I give you credit for at least trying to use EQ to shape each guitar. But I know from my own experience that the Dano has a very good sound if you pair it with the right amp and at the right settings.
Great job on clearly showing the differnces between these three - very well thought out and presented. Like the way you cut between each - gives an obvious comparison (to someone like me with a poor working memory!). The Rick sounded like one expects (lovely), the Gretsch was nice too but the Dano was horrible - way too thin and trebly. It might be useful and have it's place somewhere but not for me. I had toyed with the idea of giving a DC59-12 a go but not now. Thanks!
I might has missed something, but did you use any compressor? This is seen as essential in getting "the sound". For instance, when McGuinn had his signature Rickenbacker made, a compressor wa built into it.
I think part of the difference in the sound between the Gretsch and the Ric can be attributed to the string placements and that the Gretsch is a hollowbody guitar and the Ric is semi-hallowbody. You could swap the string placement in the Gretsch to be like the Ric as long as you replace the Nut. The hollowbody is certainly going to give a slightly rounder-fuller bottom and low mids than the Ric. The Gretsch comes close to the Ric, and probably closer with a string/nut change and some EQ.
What a great video! Splicing the video to compare each song part side by side with each guitar is very helpful. I also appreciate your notes at the end, both your objective and subjective takes.
The video provided a decent comparison of each guitar's output (level...as in loudness) relative to the others. The comparison did a good job of showing what to expect from each guitar *_at the given amp settings,_* useful for playing live,, but not very informative for studio recording purposes. The irony ot this comparison is that the one guitar with a 12-saddle bridge (allowing for individually-intonated strings) was out of tune. It's not clear why the neck pickups (alone) weren't included in the comparison. Showing the EQ settings was a good idea, but frankly the comparison lost its usefulness as soon as *_any_* EQ was applied, and that includes the decision to use the bridge+neck p'ups on the Dano. That alone made everything that followed an apples-to-oranges comparison. To be sure, the Dano *_needs_* some fattening up (EQ and compression) to hold its own against the Gretsch and Rick. The video clearly demonstrated that. But considering the fact that digital signal processing was available (via ProTools), the Dano could have been made to sound great by itself or in a mix. And even in a live application, the AC15 has enough tonal range to fatten up the Dano's tone. The point is that, once you make any adjustments away from the baseline condition that aren't applied equally to all the guitars, you might as well go all the way into doing whatever it takes to get the guitar to sound good at any given pickup configuration. It takes a lot more tweaking to achieve that on the Dano, and the video does demonstrate that. But it doesn't really show that the Dano can be made to sound great. Heck...just the fact that it has individual string intonation gives it a huge advantage over the other two guitars. I've owned and played many 12-strings, and none of them-ZERO-had octave pairs that played in tune all the way up the neck if the root and octave strings couldn't be individually intonated. So, if your budget is Dano-sized, you shouldn't let this comparison throw you off. It takes more work to dial in the Dano, but it CAN be done. With enough care in setting it up and tweaking it, it's a great sound machine.
You can't go by this video to judge the Danelectro... I have a DC59-12 AND a Gretsch (and an AC15) and they sound MUCH more similar than they do here.... I think the one in this video has some kind of wiring issue that's bleeding off all the low end... my Dan is bright, but has just as much low end as my Gretsch! Also, my Dan plays perfectly in tune... as long as you don't squash the strings down like you're playing a Sears Acoustic. You need a lighter touch with your left hand for the Dan. It doesn't bother me as I've always used 8s or 9s on my electrics. As BB King said to Billy Gibbons, "Why you workin' so hard?"
@@garystackhouse5787 You might be right about something whacked in the Dano's wiring, or just generally in the components in the signal path. I have a Dano 6-string, and it's not as anemic-sounding as the 12 in this demo. In fact, with the right amp settings, it's plenty ballsy, and has a great sound all its own. Anyhow, I'm glad someone else agrees that this video should not be considered anything like absolute or definitive of the Dano's sound. I happen to have a great 12-string (Vox Phantom XII) that I modded with a 12-saddle tunable bridge. But if I needed a 12-string that I *_know_* can sound great, I wouldn't hesitate to buy a Dano 12.
Wonderful shootout! It was incredibly informative and useful! I can imagine all the work you had to do to produce the alternating brands chordal comparison segment, and all while continuously playing one song! It was so effective, in presenting the attributes of each model & brand! It powerfully demonstrated that special highly identifiable chime that is unique to the Rickenbacker. Also, those High-Output Rickenbacker pickups sounded really good! They still have the distinctive desirable Rickenbacker sound, but also sound a little fuller and stronger!
The Rickenbacker has that “Rickenbacker jangle” that the Gretsch doesn’t quite reach, but the Gretsch still sounds really great. What takes the Gretsch over the top for me is the 45mm nut width, which is much more comfortable for me than the Rickenbacker’s 41.4. I never have been able to fathom why Rickenbacker makes their necks so narrow.
With a skinny neck you can play complex chords more easily up to the higher part of the neck, you don't need to stretch you fingers too much. Having closer pairs of strings make quick arpeggios more agile with the right hand (less space to cover). All of this require more precision and practice
The Royer was overkill for the Dano. The Ric sounded the best in your shoot out. But IMO you were not playing an electric 12 string right. You were heavy handed like playing an acoustic guitar. Playing a 12 is a very light delicate attack on the strings so the guitar can ring out. I have a Dano 12 and it doesn't sound like the way you demoed it. I also have an Epi 12 string jumbo blonde acoustic. An electric 12 needs more finesse to play it properly. The picking space is more finite. Also you had the same settings for each. The different guitars have different tones and ball parking an amp setting does not give each guitar space to shine. A better but more complex demo would've been to dial in the best sound for each guitar. And as others have commented there was no compression in your signal. McGuinn's tone was discovered by accident at the studio he recorded with when out of fear for blowing up their gear they strapped a compressor on the 12. A very important effect for a 12 it turns out. Altogether glad you made the demo.
I'm with you! I have a DC59-12 AND a Gretsch (and an AC15) and they sound MUCH more similar than they do here.... I think the one in this video has a wiring issue that's bleeding off all the low end.
@@garystackhouse5787 Yes. Not that a shoot-out of 12 strings is an easy endeavor. A little more attention to detail is needed IMO to get a better idea for a comparison.
The Dano sounds paper-thin while the other two sound pretty darn close to each other, with the Rick sounding slightly better than the Gretsch, but they both have depth and warmth. I've had a Gretsch 12'er for a few years and really like it. It cost $700 used in like-new condition (Still had the factory strings on it). I'm mostly a Tele guy, but I love that Byrds and West Coast Pop Art Experimental Band '60s psych stuff with 12-string jangle. The Gretsch sounds good for overdubs if it needs that spacey fairy-dust sound. I've found that the 12-String sounds really good through a Twin Reverb, which gives it the clarity it needs to really shine. With a smaller lower wattage amp (10-40 watts) it almost distorts too much and you hear more amp than guitar. I'd probably like a Rick, but for the small percentage of time I play 12-string guitar I'll stick with the Gretsch. I also love the feel of a hollow-body archtop. It's kind of neck-heavy, so I used an adapter from Martin to put the strap around the headstock Johnny Cash style and problem solved. I'd also be interested in hearing the Fender XII, and more recently they came out with a Squire Jazzmaster 12. The Beach Boys and The Smiths also used a lot of 12-string guitars on their recordings but maybe not so much on stage. But remember Rickenbacker gave the first two 12-string electrics ever made to The Beatles, who started it all.
What a dilemma. Spend a lot more to get The Sound or spend a lot less to get real close to The Sound. If I were a pro no doubt the Rickenbacker. But being 73 with arthritic hands I may have to settle for the Gretsch. You did a great job with your demo. Thank you.
Very nice comparison. I thought my Dano sounded better than yours by comparison to my 5422 and my Ric. Maybe it was how we both EQ'd the amp. I also put some compression and chorus on it usually. I found the 5422 rather hard to play with it's wide 1.875" nut width and fatter neck. It sounded a little better than the Dano but I hated playing it so it had to go. My Ric was a 620/12 but the narrow nut drove me nuts too. 1.63" is too narrow...1.875" is too wide...1.75" is just right! And that's what my Gibson neck-thru body SG 12-string is! That plays like a dream but good luck finding one. I stumbled onto a deal on a mint used one at the right time. I really like that guitar. Dano has raised their price to $549 new. Still a value but if I was shopping that range, I might go for a Guild starfire 12-string instead, not sure. I haven't played that one but it looks interesting. Dano did bring out some humbuckery/dual lipstick models (59X-12) so those may have a bit more beef than the single lipsticks. The harley bentons are the best value out there now on 12 strings. I've got a double-neck harley benton but the 12-string has a wider nut on that, I think it's 1.875". I'm just getting to know that one but it sounds pretty good. Maybe do a shootout on the Dano 59-X12 (humbucker lipsticks) and the Harley Benton RB-612-CS next and maybe the guild starfire 12 string.
I have both a Dano and a Ric 12 string., albeit a Chinese Dano and a 330 Ric. I liked the Dano a good deal for the price (less than $200). It has a different but not terribly inferior sound. However I found that it had 4 issues. As noted here the lipsticks are fearsome in the treble area, which with the 12 string overloads and needs backing off the tone a to get any balance. However using flatwounds helped a huge amount. Secondly it was a bit of a neck-diver, but a fairly wide strap mitigated the worst of it. I found it has tuning stability issues. I think the bolt on neck and the plywood and MFD construction are a little unstable with all that tension coming from 12 strings, because I found a light gauge (9-42) actually improved tuning stability which is not my usual experience with guitars. Replacing the pot metal bridge and the tuners (which aren't great though are probably better on the newer Korean Danos) might help, but then I'm spending nearly as much as the guitar cost in the first place! Finally, mine came with jumbo frets, and I feel this causes serious issues with intonation, especially on the octaved strings. The Ric has tiny mandolin style frets and while shredders and bluesy-benders might hate them (aiding Rics' reputations as rhythm guitars) I think they're vital for a 12 string. The Ric certainly stands head and shoulders above it really, as it should for the price, the build quality is fantastic and it gets that sound right out of the box, even with the modern "hi gain" pickups. It takes flats or rounds pretty well and holds tuning pretty good. Other than the price (though I paid well below 2 grand for mine) the main drawback is the super thin neck, it does take some getting used to, but if you're into arpeggios and cross-picking, the relatively close spacing at the bridge makes that sort of style a little easier. The swapping of the string positions on the Rick doesn't really make that much difference as far as I can tell - a lot of debate is had over the difference, but going back and forth between the Ric and the Dano (which is strung traditionally) it seems a minor thing - pickups, playing style, and control settings and amp make a much bigger difference in terms of sound. The other disadvantage for the Ric is the 6 saddle bridge as opposed to the 12 saddle on the Dano, which is a big deal for some but I've found careful matching of the gauges between the bass and octave can smooth this out pretty well anyway, and as I noted, in my experience the frets on the Dano cause more intonation issues than the bridge on the Ric anyhow.
In this order, Rickenbacker wins! 2nd place is the Gretsch and the Dan Electro. On the Electro, the pickups were too low output! A liitle disappointed since I was going to buy it. I'll save up my pennies and get the Rickenbacker 360-12. I guess it's that old adage, you get what you pay for! Thank you for posting this. Good insight and detail.
Nice comparison, but I will say they aren’t going to sell many Danelectros after hearing your video. I thought the Gretsch was pretty close to the Ric at less than half the cost. I am partial to the Ric as I own a 620-12 and have small hands so the neck on the Ric is a joy to play for me. PS: I like the Focusrite VU meter in your intro.
Thanks for the demo, I will be sticking with my Gretch 12 string, we are getting married soon (me and Greta Gretch), I might invite you to the wedding...lol ❤😂🎉😮😅❤
I also bought the Gretch, and very pleased indeed I am with it, it comes very close to the Rikenbacker sound, and that is good enough for me, also the guy didn't try them without being amped up,, and I have to tell you that the Grerch is fantastic, on its own, without being amped up, enjoy, if you do decide on the Grerch...peace out ❤❤😂🎉😮
I am very sorry to say, but the Danelectro sounds budget all over: not my choice. The Gretsch comes very close to the Rick in the beautiful shimmering tone, but is, as said, much more affordable. Update: too bad that three other affordable players were not included: the Hagström DLX 12, the Guild Starfire I-12 and the Squier Paranormal Jazzmaster XII. The first can pass as a serious rival concerning quality to the Gretsch and the Guild and the Squier are way more affordable candidates with the same jangle quality. As for the Hagström, I can by now vouch for it concerning playability because I bought it recently, but I understand that I was lucky to have bought it with discount for the same present price as the Guild.
The Dano has sharp attack, but, like all of its brothers and sisters, it really only has one tone and lacks sustain ... which is why producers used to use them to give sharp needle point attack to a track. Famously, the Dano Longhorn was played in unison along with a Fender Precision or standup bass using gates to separate the strains down the track. The Dano gave the attack and the P-Bass or String Bass (or both) gave richness and sustain to the sound. Given his penchant for huge fat mixes, this technique may have been invented by Phil Spector, but could just as easily been invented by Chet Atkins trying to establish sonic control over a slap bass sound. The Dano 12 plus Gretsch 12 played together in unison might actually get close to the sound of the Rick with giant treble boost. In the end, though, you get what you pay for... Which is why you should really search for a vintage Fender 12 ... for that Stairway to [getting blocked] Heavenly sound. Great to hear the guitars mixed into a full band recording. You can really judge how each one transforms the texture of the overall sound.
Nice comparisons here with and without backing tracks. The Danelectro almost sounded like an unplugged electric. Very tinny, not much character. The Gretsch was cool, bit seemed too muddy. The Ric is definitely the ticket here. All you needed was that slight high-end boost and the magic was there. Thanks for posting this.
If I was allowed just one word to describe the sound of the Danelectro, I have to go with "annoying". And that's coming from someone who adores 12 strings. I own 4, with an Eastwood "Classic 12" (Gretsch "Country Gentleman" knockoff), very shortly to be mine. "The guitar is in the mail", so to speak..
Had a similar experience when trying 12 strings-- the danelectro is a great feeling instrument but is very glassy sounding. In hindsight, that might be tamed by using flatwounds
If you can afford, the Ric easily! One under communicated bonus with Ric 12s is that due to the 6+6 tuner layout, you can use it as a 6 without looking too weird. I actually use mine as a 6 for the moment. Great vid by the way, thanks!
man, there’s something wrong with your dano! maybe miswired? i have one and it is actually quite close to the rick, but yours is missing all the lower freqs. but dont take my word for it ; see other UA-cam comparisions. (also, you can have a nut made for any 12 with whichever per-course string order you prefer. i hated the aluminum nut on the Dano, so had a new one made and chose the Rick order, low first.)
Surprised at how weedy the Dano sounded. My 6-string is much fuller (and of course louder) with both pickups on. My fat chubby hands cannot get on with the Rick's narrow nut width. That and the ridiculous price rule one out for me. The closest I can get is my Variax or my 12-string (non-Fender) strat with a whopping great neck.
I think you're somehow letting down the Danelectro. I've seen another YT video comparing it with a Rickie albeit through a Fender amp, and there they sounded much more alike. In fact, I probably preferred the Danelectro a little though I should be biased in the other direction, being the owner of a Rickie 330.
Man, that Gretsch has a great sound with just a bit more low tones added and for $900, I'd be seriously going for it!!!!!!!!!
Check out the Guild Starfire 1-12. Mahogony body, so a bit fuller sound than a maple body, and the HB2 pickups allow coil spitting. For a bit north of a grand, you can get a Starfire IV 12 string, which is a very nice guitar. Still far less than a Ric, or a 6000 series Gretsch, but more versatility than the 5400 series Gretsch can manage. I do like my Gretsch 5422-12 for the exceptional clean sounds. But my Guild Starfire 1-12 has more versatility on the sound, and can take on a bit of grit, without mudding up.
I own the Gretsch, and I really like the sound of it. I'd say you're getting 90+ percent of the Ric sound... but you're paying 45 percent of the Ric money. You can buy a pretty nice amp (and a Jangle Box) with the 55 percent you're got left. The Gretsch is a great value; but nothing sounds like a Rickenbacker..
Maybe try what I did to see how you like it.
There is a reason why the Rick defines the sound of the electric 12-string. The only guitar I've played that comes close the sound was a Vox Teardrop XII. which had weak pickups,, but it did have pretty decent approximation to "that" sound. I've not played the Danelectro, but I've heard demos where it sounds a lot better than it does here. A piercing tone that is part of what you want from a 12. The Gretsch sounds pretty good for the price, but I wouldn't be seen dead with a guitar that looks like that.
PS 1 The reason for the Rick headstock design is to stop it hitting the floor when you take your hand off the neck. A common problem with bighead twelves that are based on a six-string design.
PS 2 The small knob on the Rick is a blend control when both pickups are selected. It enables you to produce a very wide range of sounds with a single knob. Try it with the neck pickup treble turned right down: Roger McGuinn to Joe Pass, with one twist.
PS 3 Rickosound (aka stereo) is fantastic for rhythm playing. Put the neck pickup through a clean channel, and the bridge through your FX channel. Your lead guitarist will hate you!
Not even close. The Dano was brittle and tinny. The Gretsch - though better - was unfocused and muddy. The Rick is the clear winner in every way. And let's face it, the main reason people play electric 12-strings is for that classic 60s/80s sound. You might as well be playing the same guitar that most of those bands were - they used Ricks for a reason!
FWIW: I own a Jetglo 360v64 12-string that is my pride and joy.
I go for the Dano!!!!....I love the bite and the brightness!!!...(And I own the 59x12)...🤩..The Gretsch and the Ric sound quite similar. But no guitar sounds like a Danelectro!!!
My dream guitar has long been the Ric 360 12-string. But I am a basement player, who jams with buddies on occasion. While I am in the fortunate position to be able to afford the insane indulgence of the Ric (around $3700 Cdn for a new one), I couldn’t rationalize the cost even to myself, let alone my wife. I’ve considered the Danelectro in the past (primarily because of the price….around $750 Cdn new), but found it “tinny” sounding, and not pleasing to my ear. However September is “Fender month” at my favourite music chain, so I was there on the last day of September, after purposely avoiding the place all month. I went with my buddy who I jam with regularly, as we were each considering picking up a Bassbreaker amp. I came across this gorgeous gold top Gretsch 12-string, and after playing it for a bit, fell deeply in like. I jokingly said to my buddy, “Too bad Fender didn’t own Gretsch. I’d grab this in a minute”. He said “They are”. We confirmed it with one of the sales staff, and after somewhat begrudging getting “clearance from Clarence” (the wife), it was part of my aresenal. The look on my wife’s face when I got home made it clear she wasn’t very impressed with me. But once she saw, and more importantly, heard it, she understood. And I scratched the electric 12-string itch for about 1/3rd the price of the Ric. And your comparison test confirmed for me that I made the right decision, consider I’m not even in a bar band. Thanks for putting this together.
The Gretsch holds up very well against the Ric at a fraction of the cost.
I think the Ricky is the best, but Gretsch sounded great. The Danelecto was to shrill. I could see using it for some special effects, but not as your main 12. Great demo!
Agreed. The Danelectro was a non-starter. Maybe if you bought some RB pickups and then hollowed out room for them in the Danelectro, you would have a guitar that would sound good, but stock... the Danelectro is just unbearable.
Great video. I'm lucky enough to stand by the motto, if you're shopping for something special like a guitar and there are cheaper alternatives described as 'being almost as good as X', just get the X. It might hurt in the moment, but then there's a lifetime of maximum enjoyment as opposed to feeling good with a low price but never really loving what you got. Obviously there are many exceptions, but guitars get their reputations for a reason, and I usually want the best, within reason. Thank you for the video, you just facilitated another Ricky purchase, though I'll go used to cut the price-pain down a bit.
Sound is a key part. But so is playing feel. And looks and overall inspiring vibe and what turns you on. I have a Ric 330/12 but I did try the Dano and Gretsch both of which were fine guitars. But I WANTED the Ric so badly I raided the bank for it.
My Danelectro sounds nothing like that. It’s partly the bridge which believe or not makes a big difference with its wooden rosewood. I have owned three Ric.,12’s. Go listen to the Dano’s on here.,l would not buy that Dano one if I had to base it on this video. I play the Dano out and people including musician who say I am going to get one of those. The original Rosewood bridge helps with the sustain, but also sounds so much more full and fat. That thing sounded like shit so all I can say is anyone listening to this go to UA-cam put in danelectro Trail String and you’ll hear what they really sound like with the Rosewood bridge might I add?. Also try changing the strings on the Ric if you got a half a day to put into it, believe me, I broke a string at a gig my 20 minute break was not enough time to change one string. That’s why I sold them all.
The Rick is still the best sounding electric 12-string guitar of all of them. The Danelectro sounds shrill. The Gretsch is a good sounding 12-string though. At the end of the day the Rickenbacker remains the king.
Very nice job. It does sound like the Gretsch could be a replacement for the Rick for those who may not be able to afford one. But there is a recognizable difference in "definition of sound" between the Gretsch and Rick. Again, nice job.
This guy does a great job at guitar comparisons. Keep up that great work, thanks!
The little black knob on the Rick is a balance control for the center toggle position. This way you can accentuate one of the two pups in the blend. It’s essential because the neck pickup kind of obscures the 12 string sound, while the bridge pickup is so brittle it’s hard to use. I owned all 3 of these at one time, I gave up the Danelectro because it buzzed like crazy and was super thin as you hear in this demo. Both this Gretsch and Rick are giant guitars. The Rick 620/12 is far better if you want something smaller and solid. Also, the MIJ Gretsch has better electronics . Don’t fool around with budget Gretsch if you can avoid it.
Like the Gretsch, but I prefer the Ric. I love the sound and would use it often. If I wanted a 12 string to play occasionally I might choose differently. I think the hi gain pickups are highly underrated and to my ears sound similar but more full than toasters. Thanks for the video
What a great video, man! Super useful for someone shopping for a 12 string. And showing the graphic EQ was also very helpful. I'm not in the market for a Rickenbacker because it's not cost effective for my use, and also -- I actually preferred the Gretsch sound. What you hear as muddiness, I hear as body.
I've heard the Danelectro in other videos and they made it sound much better than the one you played -- but they set up the amp, etc., which you pointed out that you did not. But even in those other videos, it still doesn't sound as good as the other two, and it is certainly not as versatile.
You helped me to decide on the Gretsch, and I'm ordering it now.
Seriously, I wish other guitar reviewers followed your style of video making! You go right to the heart of the matter and the way you edit it makes it easier for the viewer to compare!!! Keep it up!
Love that Gretsch.
Hi great shootout, I've own several brand 12 strings, i now have a ric 360 mapleglo 12 and its definitely the best sounding 12 I've had, the Gretsch did sound fantastic though, wasn't impressed with the Daneolectro
I agree Steve
I'm pretty sure this Danelectro has a wiring issue... I own one (and an AC15) and it's nowhere NEAR as thin as illustrated here. Mine IS bright, but also full and rich in the mids and lows.
Super video thank you! Rickenbacker is the clear winner here. When you compare the price you should mention also diffences in looks: when you hold a Rickenbacker in your hands it feels very well made (and expensive). I tried a couple of Gretsch made in Asia: you can feel the diffence
Rickenbackers have incredible build quality and sound. A real Gretsch (MIJ) 12 rather than an Electromatic might offer a better comparison with the Ric..but there goes the mid price point.
The Gretsch sounds the mellowest of the three on my puny mobile phone speaker, but it's not just about how they sound, it's about how they feel to play. I just picked up an acoustic Grand Auditorium Sigma acoustic 12 string over a D'Angelico principally because it gives me bags of confidence with its solid feel and resonant tone.
I have had all three of these Guitars. I have two big issues with the Rick 360. Which I still own . Jet Black like ( Lennons which he never used on stage ) . The narrow neck ( even Harrison said it was tough to one play cleanly) and the insane location of the tuning pegs. The Gretsch to me is the best of this group unless your a Pro RECORDING Artist . You play a 12 string live with all the noise in the band and you could play any decent 12 and you would sound great. Been there done that. I own 6 12 strings and I love the sound of the instrument. Great video .We all have different opinions on Guitars
Like I said , I have 4- 12 strings and the best sounding for the money is my Gretsch G5022-12 White Falcon acoustic. I have the low E strings switched around so the low E is on Top. Made all the differece in the world on sound.
@@dennyhess2296 Hey Denny thats the Guitar I am playing on my profile picture. Yes its a great sounding Guitar. Wow the idea of switching the Low E string around sounds great. I will give that a try. Thanks for the idea
The sound of the Rick is undeniable! However the neck is too narrow! It’s a 12string with a 6 string neck. I have long thick fingers and it’s a chore to play. The nut is only 41mm whereas others are around 48mm which is more comfortable
I would go for the Gretch
The video is very illustrative. I had wondered how each of these guitars stand against each other. Very well played, too! Thanks a lot. You gave me a good idea. From what you present, I am now considering a Rick. Thanks!
One of the most thorough and helpful discussions and comparisons of these 3 12-string electrics. I've been watching reviews of the Gretsch Electromatic 12-string because it's in my price range, and this review offered me much more information about Gretsch buiild and tone, along with the reviewer's helpful opinions comparing the 3 guitars. Thanks much for this terrific review of these 12-string electrics!.
I had a Gretsch 12 Electromatic. Awesome sounding guitar and played great. Don't be put off by made in Korea. The build quality is outstanding.
@@tuguybear930 The Gretsch and Guild guitars built in Korea and Indonesia are some very nice guitars, especially when you factor in the price paid for them. The quality far outstrips the price point.
Great review, truthful and clearly stated. Agree or not, this is simply honest which is a wonderful thing. Nice job Brian.
I wish you'd included Guild, & perhaps a Chinese knockoff...
...great review though. Love the way you spliced the demo's directly together rocks! 👏🏼👏🏼
That Ricky sits so well in the mix, I wouldn't buy the others
I have a couple of vintage Danelectro-made Silvertones, and I love lipstick tube pickups, but that Danelectro sounds like garbage. I never could have imagined it sounding so bad. Thin, no mids, no bass. I just picked up a Gretsch G5422G-12, and it is gorgeous.
How often are you really going to play an electric 12 string? I have a Cozart on which I had to finish the neck (Tung Oil) and replace the tuners (found some on sale at StewMac). It's now very playable and cost less than the Dano. The Dano sounded thin and tinny compared to the Gretsch and Ric. To me, those 2 sounded quite similar. Rics are beautiful guitars (I used to own a 620) but rather pricey. For the money, I'd go with the Gretsch, knowing that it was only going to get occasional playing time...
Absolutely excellent review, I’m looking to buy a 12 string and so pleased to come across this review. Clear, concise and very well put together. Thank you. Personally I’ve had Rickenbacker in the past and wasn’t really impressed with it, I ended up changing it. Based on this review I thing the Gretsch is really good value for money. The cheap guitar sounded really poor in comparison as you would expect for the price but I thought the Gretsch sounded better than the Rick which sounded too thin although that’s s what they are known for. Thanks for the very helpful review
Hm, that is intersting what you defined about the Gretsch, I heard a playing session of the Gretsch for the first time yesterday and it surprised me bigtime that it came out forward so prominently compared to what I was used to from the Rick. Another point on which I think the Gretsch is slowly winning on me over the Rickenbacker.
You know that old adage, "You get what you pay for?" This is a great example. I hate to say it, but that Dano was terrible - far too shrill. The Rick edges out the Gretsch, but it's close!
First I wanna thank you for saying Rickenbacker and not Rickenbocker.
At some point you should try a Burns Double Six, because despite being a spectacularly ugly guitar, it sounds gorgeous, and for my money, it's the only one that comes close to pushing the Rickenbacker off its perch.
Would love to see an update with a Paranormal Squier Jazzmaster 12
Great idea!
The Rick definitely sounds the best (by far), the Dano is way too shrill. For the money, I'd go with the Gretsch.
I wholeheartedly agree!
The Danelectro sounded horrible, I've got one and I've never been able to make it sound that bad. But I use the middle pickup selection with a compressor. Having said that it doesn't sound like a Ricki or a Gretsch. So no surprise really. Thanks.
Great job on the video. I think it's the only way to compare them. The Gretsch and Ric sounded incredibly similar until you were playing single notes, and I think that may be due to the placement of the fundamental and octave strings.
Thanks for the great video. In Australia for new prices, Danelectro is around $750 to 850 AUD, the Gretsch is $1,600 to $2,000 AUD, the Rickenbacker anywhere from $3,500 to $5,000 AUD. The way I see it, if having the RIC is going to encourage you to play a 12 string three or four times as often as you would with the Danelectro, then the value equation is a no brainer. And it's further enhanced if you decide to sell the guitar later on. If you just want a knockabout 12 string that you are going to play every now and then, or you prefer the Danelectro sound, then that will work too. In Australia, you aren't going to lose much re-selling a Danelectro 12. The Gretsch is the middle ground. I imagine most players who buy a Gretsch are probably likely to keep it forever. But then, if you are going to keep the guitar forever, probably worth considering spending the extra money and buying a RIC. The difference in price will be ammortized over the years and the resale value would be better decades on from now. And the RIC is a RIC.
People buying a Mercedes or BMW don't try to justify it because they'll drive one three or four times as often as a Hyundai. Musicians however, tend to complain about the price of just about anything. Personally, I like the Ric. They're rare, the headstock design is the same size as a six string, not a foot long like the others, they have a distinctive sound and they're well made. I bought my 330/12 in Australia a long time ago, and when I look at how much they're selling for now, I smile.
Their narrow neck width can be an issue for some, but you can get another nut made that closes up the spacings between the doubled strings and moves them all slightly outwards. The models without neck binding have slightly more room to play with. You could also reverse the stringing to the conventional arrangement as renowned Ric player Marty Willson-Piper does apparently, if that's an issue for you.
@@deaddoll1361 Alternatively, the Rickenbacker 1993Plus 12 and 660/12 both ship with wider necks. Indeed Marty Wilson-Piper has strung his Ric 12s with the conventional arrangement as per the original Rickenbacker 12 String OS electric prototype that was gifted to Suzi Arden by F.C. Hall way back in 1963. To this day, that RIC is the ONLY 12 string electric guitar Rickenbacker ever manufactured with conventional stringing.
Not sure how you eq'd the Dano, but I've heard other demos where it sounded great. Good enough for me to look into getting one. I play Rics, Teles and Strats into an AC15 with a Jangle Box compressor.
The Dano has no EQ, unless shown in video. Amp EQ is the same for all guitars and is also shown.
@@RecordingFreaks Pretty sure there's something wrong with yours... I have the same DC59-12 and an AC15, AND I have a 5420 6-string. If they sounded as far apart, eq-wise, as the two in your video, I'd never be able to swap between the two during a gig without some MAJOR EQ changes.... but I do, without any changes at all. Go look at other videos of this guitar (even comparing it to Ric's) and you'll see. You should have someone look at yours.
There is absolutely something wrong with that Dano. Every other demo I have seen, the Dano did not sound as egregious as this one does here.
That particular Dano has a real electronics issue...as many have said, they usually sound much better.
Given the price difference between the Gretsch and the Rick I would be on the Gretsch, for the simple fact that I don’t play that many songs that require an electric 12 string. The DE on the other hand was awful sounding on its own and would probably have a use being double tracked with the Gretsch!
I've owned a couple Danelectros, they were were always interesting in a good way, .. but that one sounds nasty - like they should have cut the neck down at the 12 fret and sold it as a 12 string mandolin.
But the Gretsch? wow, punches way above its price point and in some sections sounded better in the mix to the Ric . I've got friends I jam with who have 12 string Rickies so I'll probably get the Gretsch to add a little sonic variation.
Wasnt impressed with the DanElectro- even if its cheap. Gretsch is the way to go- best bang for the buck. Sounds so close to the Rickenbacker.
Good video and sound comparison. I have the same gretsch 5422tg in white. I made a new nut and switched the saddles around and strung it up like a Rickenbacker.
Playing it through a vox ac10. It has it's own sound and different than any other 12 string I've ever heard.
I bet that gretsch with a Janglebox compressor would sound phenomenal!
The Danelectro sounded very bright and thin, but I think the Gretsch tone wise was equal to the Rickenbacker, and for the difference in price, the Gretsch wins
The Danelectro sounds thin and tinny. The Rick sounds great, but the Gretsch is a real surprise! Almost as good as the Rick for a fraction of the cost.
Well. If ever you wanted a video that explored every detail needed as to buy a specific guitar then this is it. Bloody brilliant job. I'm for the Ricky lol
I agree! Well done video...now send me that Ric now!
Would like to see you match up the Guild Starfire 1-12 and Starfire IV-12 against the Ric. The SF 1-12 is less than the Gretsch, the SF IV-12 a bit more. Both well under the cost of the Ric, but also very good values for what you get. Nice demo for what you had available.
I wish I had one to try that.
Same suggestion I wanted to make. I'm familiar with an older Guild Starfire 12 with the lovely LB-1 pickups that are exceptionally articulate and brilliant in sound. Guild continues to be largely ignored and I can't for the life of me understand why!
The new version of the Danelectro is $549. Came back from the guitar shop all excited because, well, you know, I'm going to catch hell from the wife for buying the $1,000 Gretsch. Rickenbacker is out of the question because as you said, I only want a 12-string for a few songs (though I could change my mind on that). Listening to you play those, all the exact same licks and chords against band tracks (great job on that as well, btw), I came up EXACTLY with the same conclusions you made. And then blending in those audio graphs told the same story you were playing. What an awesome job of comparing these guitars! Completely unbiased, perfectly organized. I guess I'll just have to go through one of those rocky periods with the wife. I mean , really...I don't have a 12-string (and that's just unfair).
12-string electrics are so awesome. Love the opening chords, especially in the mix. Great playing and demo!
I have the Gretsch. It is a Korean model built in 2018. Very nice.
The small fifth knob is a blend knob, not a master volume. Nice comparison between the three!
Alone , the gretsch wins.
In the mix , that Rick is the queen.
Danelectro is pure ear pain
The Rickenbacker has a Radiused Fretboard.
Great video. For me, the 5422-12 string gets me close enough to be happy. My Country "Gentleman" Classic (62 model 6122) and a VOX amp get me close enough to those Early Beatle Sounds that I love. I am not a professional and I make compromises in my life that seem to work. BTW after playing the Gretsch 6122, I couldn't live with how small the Rickenbacker is; just my personal preference I guess. I paid $999.00 + tax for my 5422-12 with new guitar, case (not Gretsch), strap and tuner. All this made the covid lockdowns tollerable !
1. The Gretsch sounds like a Gretsch, its tonal qualities are similar to my six string model. I would extrapolate from there how an Ibanez AS73-12 would sound in comparison since I have a 6 string model for that too.
2. The sounds of the Ric and the Gretsch are super close from this vantage point.
3. I can see why the Beatles could mix Gretsch and Rickenbacker tones. They match up well.
4. For studio, the Danelectro could be EQ'd, but for live performance I'd pick the $900 Gretsch. I'd worry about gigging a $2000-$3000 guitar.
Excellent comparison.
Hello. I own a Ric 381-12V69. I must say that using the Ric-O-Sound box that splits the stereo sound into two separate outputs, makes all the difference in the world. It made the guitar sound like it was in a cathedral. The 330-12 differs from the 360-12 and the 381-12, in that it is mono output only. Great job on the video! If you want a good mix with an electric 12 string, I recommend a trebly bass. That’s how The Byrds were recorded.
Good to know, though I doubt I'll own a Rick $$$$ anytime soon. Using lots of compression (on the recording) could get you to that Byrds sound, but I kinda prefer this guitar (I have the Gretsch 12 in Walnut Satin finish) without a compression pedal in a band setting so that the dynamics can really shine through.
I would have liked to have also seen in comparison, the Eastwood 12-string and the re-issued Fender 12-string as well. The Fender "Electric XII" is also quite familiar in late-'60's pop records- "I'm Not Like Everybody Else" by the Kinks, The "Pinball Wizard" strum in "Tommy," the 12-string on "Stairway to Heaven", and the 12-string work by Lou Reed on Velvet Underground albums, for instance.
Ric for the win! But Gretsch sounds great too
Nice review but I don't think the comparison was totally fair. I have a Dano 12 and I've had some other 12s (not a Ricky though) and one thing I've found is that EQ on the amp is critically important to dialing in the best sound for each guitar. With a little more EQ that Dano could have sounded way better. I know mine does. Although the Ricky does a better job of sounding like a Harrison or McGuinn recording, I think if you gave McGuinn a Dano or Gretsch, and EQed it properly, you would be hard pressed to tell the difference, especially in a band mix. Recording is another story altogether, but live the Dano is the best choice in my opinion.
No offense to you, because I think you did a great job with this video, but I have a bone to pick with all these guitar comparisons on UA-cam which think they're doing the most "scientific" comparison by keeping the amp on the same settings for all the guitars. The reason we have EQ, and different amps, and pedals is that every guitar has unique needs to make them sound their best. I give you credit for at least trying to use EQ to shape each guitar. But I know from my own experience that the Dano has a very good sound if you pair it with the right amp and at the right settings.
A little compression does wonders on a 12-string.
Great job on clearly showing the differnces between these three - very well thought out and presented. Like the way you cut between each - gives an obvious comparison (to someone like me with a poor working memory!). The Rick sounded like one expects (lovely), the Gretsch was nice too but the Dano was horrible - way too thin and trebly. It might be useful and have it's place somewhere but not for me. I had toyed with the idea of giving a DC59-12 a go but not now. Thanks!
I was unimpressed with the Dano.
I might has missed something, but did you use any compressor? This is seen as essential in getting "the sound". For instance, when McGuinn had his signature Rickenbacker made, a compressor wa built into it.
I didn’t. Maybe I should have!! Lol
Thanks for the comparison. It reinforced my appreciation for the Gretsch.
They all sounded good. Got to admit, twelve strings are certainly inspiring 👍🏻
I think part of the difference in the sound between the Gretsch and the Ric can be attributed to the string placements and that the Gretsch is a hollowbody guitar and the Ric is semi-hallowbody. You could swap the string placement in the Gretsch to be like the Ric as long as you replace the Nut. The hollowbody is certainly going to give a slightly rounder-fuller bottom and low mids than the Ric. The Gretsch comes close to the Ric, and probably closer with a string/nut change and some EQ.
at least switch the low E around , makes a world of difference.
Excellent review and comparison. Thanks!
I haven't bought a new guitar for many years now.I just ordered a Gretsch today thanks to you. So thanks, you made my mind up.
The Rick sounded best to me
The Rick lives in the mix the best.
What a great video! Splicing the video to compare each song part side by side with each guitar is very helpful. I also appreciate your notes at the end, both your objective and subjective takes.
The video provided a decent comparison of each guitar's output (level...as in loudness) relative to the others. The comparison did a good job of showing what to expect from each guitar *_at the given amp settings,_* useful for playing live,, but not very informative for studio recording purposes. The irony ot this comparison is that the one guitar with a 12-saddle bridge (allowing for individually-intonated strings) was out of tune.
It's not clear why the neck pickups (alone) weren't included in the comparison.
Showing the EQ settings was a good idea, but frankly the comparison lost its usefulness as soon as *_any_* EQ was applied, and that includes the decision to use the bridge+neck p'ups on the Dano. That alone made everything that followed an apples-to-oranges comparison.
To be sure, the Dano *_needs_* some fattening up (EQ and compression) to hold its own against the Gretsch and Rick. The video clearly demonstrated that. But considering the fact that digital signal processing was available (via ProTools), the Dano could have been made to sound great by itself or in a mix. And even in a live application, the AC15 has enough tonal range to fatten up the Dano's tone.
The point is that, once you make any adjustments away from the baseline condition that aren't applied equally to all the guitars, you might as well go all the way into doing whatever it takes to get the guitar to sound good at any given pickup configuration.
It takes a lot more tweaking to achieve that on the Dano, and the video does demonstrate that. But it doesn't really show that the Dano can be made to sound great. Heck...just the fact that it has individual string intonation gives it a huge advantage over the other two guitars. I've owned and played many 12-strings, and none of them-ZERO-had octave pairs that played in tune all the way up the neck if the root and octave strings couldn't be individually intonated.
So, if your budget is Dano-sized, you shouldn't let this comparison throw you off. It takes more work to dial in the Dano, but it CAN be done. With enough care in setting it up and tweaking it, it's a great sound machine.
You can't go by this video to judge the Danelectro... I have a DC59-12 AND a Gretsch (and an AC15) and they sound MUCH more similar than they do here.... I think the one in this video has some kind of wiring issue that's bleeding off all the low end... my Dan is bright, but has just as much low end as my Gretsch! Also, my Dan plays perfectly in tune... as long as you don't squash the strings down like you're playing a Sears Acoustic. You need a lighter touch with your left hand for the Dan. It doesn't bother me as I've always used 8s or 9s on my electrics. As BB King said to Billy Gibbons, "Why you workin' so hard?"
@@garystackhouse5787 You might be right about something whacked in the Dano's wiring, or just generally in the components in the signal path. I have a Dano 6-string, and it's not as anemic-sounding as the 12 in this demo. In fact, with the right amp settings, it's plenty ballsy, and has a great sound all its own.
Anyhow, I'm glad someone else agrees that this video should not be considered anything like absolute or definitive of the Dano's sound. I happen to have a great 12-string (Vox Phantom XII) that I modded with a 12-saddle tunable bridge. But if I needed a 12-string that I *_know_* can sound great, I wouldn't hesitate to buy a Dano 12.
Wonderful shootout! It was incredibly informative and useful! I can imagine all the work you had to do to produce the alternating brands chordal comparison segment, and all while continuously playing one song! It was so effective, in presenting the attributes of each model & brand! It powerfully demonstrated that special highly identifiable chime that is unique to the Rickenbacker. Also, those High-Output Rickenbacker pickups sounded really good! They still have the distinctive desirable Rickenbacker sound, but also sound a little fuller and stronger!
The Rickenbacker has that “Rickenbacker jangle” that the Gretsch doesn’t quite reach, but the Gretsch still sounds really great. What takes the Gretsch over the top for me is the 45mm nut width, which is much more comfortable for me than the Rickenbacker’s 41.4. I never have been able to fathom why Rickenbacker makes their necks so narrow.
That's why I have the Rickenbacker 660/12. Even though it's a solid body, it has a 44.5mm nut and still has that Ric sound.
With a skinny neck you can play complex chords more easily up to the higher part of the neck, you don't need to stretch you fingers too much. Having closer pairs of strings make quick arpeggios more agile with the right hand (less space to cover). All of this require more precision and practice
The Royer was overkill for the Dano. The Ric sounded the best in your shoot out. But IMO you were not playing an electric 12 string right. You were heavy handed like playing an acoustic guitar. Playing a 12 is a very light delicate attack on the strings so the guitar can ring out. I have a Dano 12 and it doesn't sound like the way you demoed it. I also have an Epi 12 string jumbo blonde acoustic. An electric 12 needs more finesse to play it properly. The picking space is more finite. Also you had the same settings for each. The different guitars have different tones and ball parking an amp setting does not give each guitar space to shine. A better but more complex demo would've been to dial in the best sound for each guitar. And as others have commented there was no compression in your signal. McGuinn's tone was discovered by accident at the studio he recorded with when out of fear for blowing up their gear they strapped a compressor on the 12. A very important effect for a 12 it turns out. Altogether glad you made the demo.
I'm with you! I have a DC59-12 AND a Gretsch (and an AC15) and they sound MUCH more similar than they do here.... I think the one in this video has a wiring issue that's bleeding off all the low end.
@@garystackhouse5787 Yes. Not that a shoot-out of 12 strings is an easy endeavor. A little more attention to detail is needed IMO to get a better idea for a comparison.
Just ordered one of the Gretsch G5422g-12's cant wait to get my hands on it.
One nice feature is the master volume, as it allows you to get the pup balance where you want it, then separately control the overall volume.
The Dano sounds paper-thin while the other two sound pretty darn close to each other, with the Rick sounding slightly better than the Gretsch, but they both have depth and warmth. I've had a Gretsch 12'er for a few years and really like it. It cost $700 used in like-new condition (Still had the factory strings on it). I'm mostly a Tele guy, but I love that Byrds and West Coast Pop Art Experimental Band '60s psych stuff with 12-string jangle. The Gretsch sounds good for overdubs if it needs that spacey fairy-dust sound. I've found that the 12-String sounds really good through a Twin Reverb, which gives it the clarity it needs to really shine. With a smaller lower wattage amp (10-40 watts) it almost distorts too much and you hear more amp than guitar. I'd probably like a Rick, but for the small percentage of time I play 12-string guitar I'll stick with the Gretsch. I also love the feel of a hollow-body archtop. It's kind of neck-heavy, so I used an adapter from Martin to put the strap around the headstock Johnny Cash style and problem solved. I'd also be interested in hearing the Fender XII, and more recently they came out with a Squire Jazzmaster 12. The Beach Boys and The Smiths also used a lot of 12-string guitars on their recordings but maybe not so much on stage. But remember Rickenbacker gave the first two 12-string electrics ever made to The Beatles, who started it all.
What a dilemma. Spend a lot more to get The Sound or spend a lot less to get real close to The Sound. If I were a pro no doubt the Rickenbacker. But being 73 with arthritic hands I may have to settle for the Gretsch. You did a great job with your demo. Thank you.
Very nice comparison. I thought my Dano sounded better than yours by comparison to my 5422 and my Ric. Maybe it was how we both EQ'd the amp. I also put some compression and chorus on it usually. I found the 5422 rather hard to play with it's wide 1.875" nut width and fatter neck. It sounded a little better than the Dano but I hated playing it so it had to go. My Ric was a 620/12 but the narrow nut drove me nuts too. 1.63" is too narrow...1.875" is too wide...1.75" is just right! And that's what my Gibson neck-thru body SG 12-string is! That plays like a dream but good luck finding one. I stumbled onto a deal on a mint used one at the right time. I really like that guitar. Dano has raised their price to $549 new. Still a value but if I was shopping that range, I might go for a Guild starfire 12-string instead, not sure. I haven't played that one but it looks interesting. Dano did bring out some humbuckery/dual lipstick models (59X-12) so those may have a bit more beef than the single lipsticks. The harley bentons are the best value out there now on 12 strings. I've got a double-neck harley benton but the 12-string has a wider nut on that, I think it's 1.875". I'm just getting to know that one but it sounds pretty good. Maybe do a shootout on the Dano 59-X12 (humbucker lipsticks) and the Harley Benton RB-612-CS next and maybe the guild starfire 12 string.
I have both a Dano and a Ric 12 string., albeit a Chinese Dano and a 330 Ric. I liked the Dano a good deal for the price (less than $200). It has a different but not terribly inferior sound. However I found that it had 4 issues.
As noted here the lipsticks are fearsome in the treble area, which with the 12 string overloads and needs backing off the tone a to get any balance. However using flatwounds helped a huge amount.
Secondly it was a bit of a neck-diver, but a fairly wide strap mitigated the worst of it.
I found it has tuning stability issues. I think the bolt on neck and the plywood and MFD construction are a little unstable with all that tension coming from 12 strings, because I found a light gauge (9-42) actually improved tuning stability which is not my usual experience with guitars. Replacing the pot metal bridge and the tuners (which aren't great though are probably better on the newer Korean Danos) might help, but then I'm spending nearly as much as the guitar cost in the first place!
Finally, mine came with jumbo frets, and I feel this causes serious issues with intonation, especially on the octaved strings. The Ric has tiny mandolin style frets and while shredders and bluesy-benders might hate them (aiding Rics' reputations as rhythm guitars) I think they're vital for a 12 string.
The Ric certainly stands head and shoulders above it really, as it should for the price, the build quality is fantastic and it gets that sound right out of the box, even with the modern "hi gain" pickups. It takes flats or rounds pretty well and holds tuning pretty good.
Other than the price (though I paid well below 2 grand for mine) the main drawback is the super thin neck, it does take some getting used to, but if you're into arpeggios and cross-picking, the relatively close spacing at the bridge makes that sort of style a little easier. The swapping of the string positions on the Rick doesn't really make that much difference as far as I can tell - a lot of debate is had over the difference, but going back and forth between the Ric and the Dano (which is strung traditionally) it seems a minor thing - pickups, playing style, and control settings and amp make a much bigger difference in terms of sound. The other disadvantage for the Ric is the 6 saddle bridge as opposed to the 12 saddle on the Dano, which is a big deal for some but I've found careful matching of the gauges between the bass and octave can smooth this out pretty well anyway, and as I noted, in my experience the frets on the Dano cause more intonation issues than the bridge on the Ric anyhow.
In this order, Rickenbacker wins! 2nd place is the Gretsch and the Dan Electro. On the Electro, the pickups were too low output! A liitle disappointed since I was going to buy it. I'll save up my pennies and get the Rickenbacker 360-12. I guess it's that old adage, you get what you pay for! Thank you for posting this. Good insight and detail.
compressor pedals helps cheaper 12 string electric guitars. Don't know if you had one in the signal.
No. I didn’t use a compressor. I wanted all the guitars to be treated the same. Sounds like a good idea though!
The compressor on the Ric is magical. That's the McGuinn secret.
Nice comparison, but I will say they aren’t going to sell many Danelectros after hearing your video. I thought the Gretsch was pretty close to the Ric at less than half the cost. I am partial to the Ric as I own a 620-12 and have small hands so the neck on the Ric is a joy to play for me.
PS: I like the Focusrite VU meter in your intro.
Gretsch
Tom Parker, the Rickenbacker patriarch, decided to change the pronunciation because he was worried about anti-German sentiment after World War II.
Thanks for sharin’
God Bless you n’ your family.
SOLI DEO GLORIA
(To The Glory of God Alone)
Father, Son & Holy Spirit
-Ronnie
Thanks for the demo, I will be sticking with my Gretch 12 string, we are getting married soon (me and Greta Gretch), I might invite you to the wedding...lol ❤😂🎉😮😅❤
Closed my eyes during the playing part and knew immediately which guitar was what. The Ricky blows everything else away. Unmistakable sound!!
Your the first person I know to play in the mix ( band) I’ve wondered why other people don’t do this? Good review.
I also bought the Gretch, and very pleased indeed I am with it, it comes very close to the Rikenbacker sound, and that is good enough for me, also the guy didn't try them without being amped up,, and I have to tell you that the Grerch is fantastic, on its own, without being amped up, enjoy, if you do decide on the Grerch...peace out ❤❤😂🎉😮
I am very sorry to say, but the Danelectro sounds budget all over: not my choice. The Gretsch comes very close to the Rick in the beautiful shimmering tone, but is, as said, much more affordable.
Update: too bad that three other affordable players were not included: the Hagström DLX 12, the Guild Starfire I-12 and the Squier Paranormal Jazzmaster XII. The first can pass as a serious rival concerning quality to the Gretsch and the Guild and the Squier are way more affordable candidates with the same jangle quality. As for the Hagström, I can by now vouch for it concerning playability because I bought it recently, but I understand that I was lucky to have bought it with discount for the same present price as the Guild.
The Dano has sharp attack, but, like all of its brothers and sisters, it really only has one tone and lacks sustain ... which is why producers used to use them to give sharp needle point attack to a track. Famously, the Dano Longhorn was played in unison along with a Fender Precision or standup bass using gates to separate the strains down the track. The Dano gave the attack and the P-Bass or String Bass (or both) gave richness and sustain to the sound. Given his penchant for huge fat mixes, this technique may have been invented by Phil Spector, but could just as easily been invented by Chet Atkins trying to establish sonic control over a slap bass sound.
The Dano 12 plus Gretsch 12 played together in unison might actually get close to the sound of the Rick with giant treble boost. In the end, though, you get what you pay for...
Which is why you should really search for a vintage Fender 12 ... for that Stairway to [getting blocked] Heavenly sound.
Great to hear the guitars mixed into a full band recording. You can really judge how each one transforms the texture of the overall sound.
Nice comparisons here with and without backing tracks. The Danelectro almost sounded like an unplugged electric. Very tinny, not much character. The Gretsch was cool, bit seemed too muddy. The Ric is definitely the ticket here. All you needed was that slight high-end boost and the magic was there.
Thanks for posting this.
If I was allowed just one word to describe the sound of the Danelectro, I have to go with "annoying". And that's coming from someone who adores 12 strings. I own 4, with an Eastwood "Classic 12" (Gretsch "Country Gentleman" knockoff), very shortly to be mine. "The guitar is in the mail", so to speak..
Had a similar experience when trying 12 strings-- the danelectro is a great feeling instrument but is very glassy sounding. In hindsight, that might be tamed by using flatwounds
If you can afford, the Ric easily! One under communicated bonus with Ric 12s is that due to the 6+6 tuner layout, you can use it as a 6 without looking too weird. I actually use mine as a 6 for the moment. Great vid by the way, thanks!
man, there’s something wrong with your dano! maybe miswired? i have one and it is actually quite close to the rick, but yours is missing all the lower freqs. but dont take my word for it ; see other UA-cam comparisions. (also, you can have a nut made for any 12 with whichever per-course string order you prefer. i hated the aluminum nut on the Dano, so had a new one made and chose the Rick order, low first.)
Surprised at how weedy the Dano sounded. My 6-string is much fuller (and of course louder) with both pickups on. My fat chubby hands cannot get on with the Rick's narrow nut width. That and the ridiculous price rule one out for me. The closest I can get is my Variax or my 12-string (non-Fender) strat with a whopping great neck.
You CAN intonate all 12 strings separately on the Rickenbacker IF you purchase the 12-saddle bridge.
I think you're somehow letting down the Danelectro. I've seen another YT video comparing it with a Rickie albeit through a Fender amp, and there they sounded much more alike. In fact, I probably preferred the Danelectro a little though I should be biased in the other direction, being the owner of a Rickie 330.
Rickenbacker Hi-Gains do NOT produce the definitive Rick sound. And this particular model does NOT feature a 12-saddle bridge Some other models do.