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Tales Of The Spark Plug. Engine Tuning By Reading Plugs
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- Опубліковано 26 вер 2021
- A plug reading run with our Plan Z Slant Six revealed an unexpected and unusual problem with our Holley carb.
Here's what we found and the deductive reasoning we used to find it.
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“You know, it felt good so you just stay in it a little bit” that’s how kids are born Tony.
New Tee shirt slogan... mmm nah.... :)
Don't drink and park, accidents cause people.
@@ianide2480 Yeah, and usually not good people. Usually the Charles Mansons and the Unabombers of the world.
He was pushing instead of pulling 🤣😂
Alabama the band...🎶Mmmm mmm Mmmm feels so right 🎶😂🤣
All the old hot rodders told me, read your plugs, Read Your Plugs, READ YOUR PLUGS! they showed me the basics but Tony has expounded greatly on this! Thanks UT!
he talks to much
Awesome episode! When the rubber meets the road! You are not afraid to show the good the bad or the ugly. True hot rod gold in the 21st century. I have learned so much from your shows. Thanks for going the extra mile to make top tier UA-cam content.
Now that’s troubleshooting. I love the way you explain the thought process. As a career electrician, troubleshooting is part of what I do. Cars are a love but not a daily play for me. I love to see a fellow troubleshooter sharing knowledge. Awesome content Sir.
Back in '72 I put a turbo assembly off a 315 cu in Olds Rocket on the slant 6 in my'65 Belvedere I. I used the single barrel side draft carb from the Olds along with all the associated parts ( methanol injection, waste gate, etc.). That thing ran like a raped ape, but my fuel economy went down the toilet. I re-jetted the carb myself, no jets or metering rods were available so I made my own. Got my fuel economy back and it still ran like a raped ape. I was pretty good with jetting carbs from racing motorcycles, but THAT was a challenge AND a wonderful learning experience.
This👆 children of the internet, is someone who's forgotten more about the ICE yesterday we'll ever know.(no offense Uncle)
We are not allowed to say "Raped Ape" any more. I believe the politically correct name they are forcing us to use is "Sexually Molested Primate". I agree that it does not illicit the same sense of just how fast your car was running but, remember the same people that regulate our speech want to eliminate all cars as well.
Most Deres had big blocks and the olds rocket never had side drafts. The deres started the Fury frenzy 318 to 440 and those were lead sleds. The 904s were crap and the tq flights only worked as stem slammers so trans were garbage if you had an auto. I blew out lots of 904s shredded bolts on flex plates warpage and burnt tq converters. 58 this year back in 72 was flood agnes my dad lost 2 mopars in that flood one a Dodge custom 318 pushbutton trans other was a 440 police intercepter Fury III.
ua-cam.com/video/UzsNMERC35I/v-deo.html this ones awesome
@@johngebhartiii7088 Wow, that is a beautiful car. 5 years older than mine but I really like that 2-door body style. Mine were 4 door. Sounded nice too when he started it up. I wonder what they were asking for it?
The lesson I learned is always go to waffle house after a night of runs.
Now I want waffles
Burts Chili here….😂
you got that backwards
There are too many shootings at Waffle Houses.
the W in Waffle House is silent
Your story is exactly why I love to have an air/fuel ratio gauge mounted in my car.
This is why I watch UTG every.. single.. day.. Uncle Tony, I've learned more from UT's channel than most others *combined*. I picked up a UTG T-shirt earlier this summer and will continue to support the channel in every way possible; please take a moment to do the same for UT. Like, subscribe, send up smoke signals... whatever you can to help UT to continue making the best content on the interwebs. I'm in the throws of rebuilding a largely neglected 68 Mustang coupe and UTG has helped me with more aspects of my build than he'll ever know. I may not have stolen a bus (yet), but I'm learning the way of the gearhead monk.
There are those who are smart and skilled, those who are wise, those who are passionate, and those who are entertaining. But rarely do you find all of that in a gearhead.
Good stuff big guy.
When a mechanic buddy told me to fix my first motorcycle in the 70's, and he told me about plug heat ranges and what a plug should look like (the same color as the filter on my cigarettes) the light switched on and I've never looked back. I even use that on my modern EFI/OBD2 systems as a primary method of determining fuel metering for my favourite RPM to back up code information. Makes perfect sense....
Anybody else notice this video is 1320 long? BRAVO TONY !!!!!!!
If the track isn't a quarter mile, it ain't drag racing.
@@bradlawson8678 So you would rather have no tracks to run on than a 1/8 mile?
I see 13:21?? 🙄🙄
@@DavidStirm now thats weird. 1320 on my laptop.
@@ClaremontClassicGarage I was wondering. He said 1320 mine definitely display 1321. I was thinking why would he just make that up lol 😆
Some things i remewber about running a big carb. on a small engine ; 1 drill the idle air bleeds, 2drill outwhere the idle mixture screws to almost diament of these screws ,3 also incrase the taper i use wet/dry sandpaper 4 this , 4 i heard of lowering the float level - Maybe prevent rain ? don,t know ? On a friends 302 sbf power valves Never worked but straight jeting was o.k. best wishes U.T.G.
soon UTG will show us how to build a budget dry sump oiling system.
I posted how to do this in the previous vid. Use a belt driven hydraulic pump for a single stage scavenge and the stock oil pump for pressure.
@@bobroberts2371 Yeah, old skool.
At least he show us something.
Are these builds really budget builds when all you do is work on them cause every part fails?
@UCmZp5lsovHkt6ywHDd90suw totally agree..my time is worth much more..being a slave to these builds is not fun.I enjoy uncle Tony's channel greatly but all this time and effort to go 14 or 15 seconds in 1/4 mile is absurd
Perfect explanation of how to do this. Sparking plugs do speak in tongues or is it Pig latin? Over the past few years on Webers & Edelbrocks in my stable I've just gone to air/fuel meters. Yes it's kinda expensive and drilling holes in the exhaust ain't fun but at least welding is not such a thing on the bungs anymore. I've found this to be the tool to shine the light on range of mixture reading... cold, hot, idle, load up and down hills... etc. The mystery is now on a gauge right there and so easy to deal with. I think this is like welding. Learn with a stick welder then get the fancy wire welder. Learn from the start. Learn to read plugs then get an air/fuel meter - earn your stripes! Good bare bones tech you offer - as always. Good luck on the oil pan issue and I'll be following. Bobby
Wow...gold such knowledge will be lost soon thank God someone is putting it in a video for future generations great deductive work may the Lord bless you and your channel
Re: sump oil pressure issues. In the 70s when the Ford boys in Australia were circuit racing clevo 51s, even the factory teams were blowing engines like roman candles. To keep within homologation rules, Ford Australia engineers developed a sump with "ears" on each side of the stock sump to increase volume taking cap out from 6 odd quarts to over 8. They put them into production at the factory and kerbed the 351c grenades. Picked up many Bathurst and points round wins in these super competitive times. Im thinkin increase volume by 2 to 3 quarts and the usual baffle windage/ magic. At bathurst and other tracks the clevos used to near suck the sump dry with the small sumps at 7k plus leading to engine failure. and yeah- boom. Just showing you some ocha history.
Your knoledge and expirence is invaluable but to have the knowledge and experience best of both worlds.
Awesome lesson on spark plug reading. That kind of wisdom comes from experience and it's usually bad experience where the lesson is learned. Keep it up Tony.
Solid reasoning. Sounds like it needs a smaller carb, or different boosters.
Best explanation and breakdown of events ive ever seen awsome!
Great video Uncle Tony! I learn more in five minutes from you than from anywhere else! Thanks!
When I tune my drag mini bike I pop in a new plug and do a pull but I shut it off during the pull ( at what ever rpm and throttle position I want to check). Helps get a tru read of what's going on at part and full throttle I was having a rich idle/part throttle and lean full throttle. So I jetted down the idle circuit and jetted up the main circuit
Exactly the sort of sorcery I come to learn from Uncle Tony!
Wow... That was a master class on deductive reasoning there UT.
Maybe you need to don a deerstalker hat and curved pipe.
Reminds me of a guy back in high school in the 70's who was running a tunnel ram with dual Holey 650 double pumpers on a stock Chevy 283, with stock single exhaust, in his Impala. Sure it looked cool but it barley ran and when it did, it ran like crap. I was only running a single Holley 650 on my worked over 440 with a Purple shaft cam and medium high rise intake, headers and dual glass pack exhaust and it took me a little time to get that tuned in so it ran perfectly.
I ran a 427 chevy with a nice cam mid-size port heads and small headers, 650 DP Holley. I worked it up a bit. Milled off the choke horn and set up the rest of it. It pulled strong and had a sharp throttle, sure it wasn't a high rpm screamer but drove great and had strong mid-range. You dont always need a giant carburetor...
Had a 72 Satellite LA built in canada balanced blueprinted with factory 3/4 cam. Put a 2p180 intake on it a carter afb with 2 one inch alum spacers and hedman headers with dual thrush birdies to attempt to silence it. 2 and1/4 inch exhaust think specs called for 52 and a half inches per side to get max hp from long header to exit. Other than advancing timing to 13 degree btdc and plugging the vacuum distributer it ran perfect.
@@johngebhartiii7088 The 440 I built was a 1970 Police interceptor. I actually owned 2 of them but only built one, I used the other as a daily driver. It had 10.5:1 compression, was bored .030 over, and had a Mallory dual point ignition with a 50k volt coil. I kept the original cop rear end gears and had the A727 Trans rebuilt complete with a shift kit. That thing would fly. I was once clocked by a Kentucky State trooper doing 152 in a 55 back in the 1970's. He was cool and wrote me up for 74 as anything over that he said would mean I would be arrested. He made me get out and open the hood. Then he had me start the engine so he could hear it. He told me the Crown Vics they drove would not go over 135. My Fury got a little over 20 mpg which was pretty good for that big a car in 1977. At 70, it was only turning 1900 rpm and , if you were wide open, it would hit 100 before it shifted out of 2nd! Redline was at 6,000 but it was set up to shift at 5,700. I miss those cars.
My 1st car was a 351 Cleveland powered Australian Ford Falcon
I thought my dad was the greatest when he put a tunnel ram and twin point Mallory dizzy on it
6 months later when he new i wouldn't kill myself he swapped back to single 4 barrel and re curved the distributor, holy sheet did it go then
That's when i realized my father actually cared for me 😂
@@huski300 Had a 65 two door guy I got it from put a 302 boss in it. Gave him fits fitting that motor in. Can imagine the 351 was a shoehorn fit as well. Check out SRC he runs a 61 but I think its a chevy LT in that.
We used to do this all the time also can look at the exhaust tips for similar results.
Sorry to be a naysayer on the downdraft concept but there is a reason triple/double webers are the gold standard for high performance in line applications. I have done SU, Weber and downdraft on 4 and 6 cyl and what a good set of tuned webers does is amazing.
I simply use a Dremel with a wire brush to clean the fouling off in order to get a read on my plugs. Been working great for decades! Doing multi RPM throttle chops is critical when trying to tune....
See the "cleaning plugs with fire" video .
What about adding a two step? The throttle blades will be open and you’ll not be relying on the accelerator pump. My friend used a two step with a c4 footbrake trans and it worked pretty well.
I'm not ruling that out as a possibility, but I'd rather fix it right than resort to a crutch
Uncle Tony's Garage I understand what you’re saying, but a two step on a strip only car isn’t really a crutch.
I'm glad to hear staggered jets. That is hard for bought not built people to understand.
I love these videos. You have a great teaching ability. Thanks
Excellent video Tony
thank you sir Uncle Tony
Thank you for your insights and video 🙂❤👍PS: Great video came at perfect timing for me when I was looking at my plugs.
I lost all concentration when you said Waffle House!! All I could think about was a double plate of hash browns, scattered, smothered and topped, sweet tea too.🤤😋
Mmmm yummy 🤤
"scattered, smothered and topped," a man of culture I see
I forgot to say covered!😲🙄
If it's a Holley get yourself adjustable metering block that controls the idle air bleeds circuit, with a small cube engine you need to change the air bleed to give it more responsiveness or to rid of the bog, I did this to a 465 changed the metering plate with air bleed and now it spins the wheels on take off no bog or hesitation.
Tony, I learned a bit about how to read plugs on 2 strokes. Same procedure, warm bike up on regular plugs, swap to new and give her hell through all the gears, just cut the ignition at top end and remove the plugs. Why? Because the partial throttle rips will ruin the plug read. I don't like taking a hacksaw to expensive plugs, but it is the best way to read the burned on ring of the plugs.
I'm sure its different for a 4 stroke, but it's so similar at the same time it hurts.
Thanks UTG
Awsum !!! Learned a little bit more !!!! Thanks.
Uncle tony never disappoints
I leaned towards to big a accl pump nozzle size or move the accl pump cam to another position
But boosters ...I missed that, but I'm not looking at it, hearing it, much less also driving it. You da man! This channel is killin me. I want another beater to thrash on so badly...alas
Very good video Tony
looking forward to the results.on a big tire truck,i replaced the horns feeding to carb two sizes smaller to help with just off idle throttle stumble.
Gotta love the easy rider helmet i have the same one since about 1980 keep the videos coming uncle Tony
Thank goodness for my algorithm feed ;) ✊🏼
I'm new thanks to DD Speedshop. I enjoyed the video and I look forward to more!
Dominic at Thumper carbs really knows his stuff too!!
I remember way back in the day, it was a really big deal for the more prominent NASCAR teams to have an expert plug reader who worked for the spark plug manufacturers, right there at the track, inspecting plugs under heavy magnification. But nowadays, I think their engine builders are so advanced, that they can read the plugs themselves.
Looking through Facebook dim UA-cam videos and bam, you’ve got a thumbnail of my home town track, buffalo valley!
I have a haunted cylinder 5 in my 318 … about once a year or so, it cracks the porcelain on the plug. Normal wear but crack - all other cylinders fine … I might have to install the new ones with a drop of holy water!
It cracks on the combustion side of the plug or the wire side?
@@bobroberts2371 wire side
@@DScaglione. Does the plug fall apart?
If it does, there is an install problem or maybe something hitting the plug.
If not, you are likely seeing a carbon track from a failed plug boot. It goes like this, plug gap gets big causing firing voltage to rise. Spark flashes over from the terminal to shell causing a carbon track on the plug insulator and boot. Plug is changed, miss fire goes away however carbon track is still on boot. Plugs wear a little, firing voltage goes up however carbon track on boot makes an easy path causing a miss fire / carbon tracking on plug.
Great stuff Tone
Great vid!
Uncle Tony has that Penske sheet metal I see. Love the videos. 😃
I wish I had someone to show me how to do this plug tuning. I just built my first small block Chevy and I kind of understand what you’re saying but it’s so different when I’m standing there in front of the car and I just don’t know what to do lol
1987 thunder road in barre vermont went to 6 cylinders,of course it ws a tube chassis on a 61 lancer body,real light but i made the oil pan,7 quarts,deep sump with crank baffles,it was a modified on asphalt circle track,and mad my own intake for 3 side draft 1 1/ SUs,lol, i won a lot of races,the next year they went back to v8s
Great video unk👍👍
Interesting situation! Inclined to believe it is simply to much carburetor. Sticking w/ Holley, the Street Avenger 390 cfm(from memory model 8007) seems like it might offer a more consistent result. Assuming the goal in vacuum is around 7.5; using the 390 w/slightly detuned transfer-slots(base-plate adjust) and a lower octane fuel, like say 93 pump-gas as well as a nice 1.25-1.50" anodized spacer seem to me like a good place to experiment. In my view proper atomization is going to be a chore w/ that intake in general, and quite possibly less is more. Glad you got to run at the track!
Awesome U.T.
I mention, or show someone how to read spark plugs and they look at me like I'm magician or an idiot...
I tell them you can nail a tuneup dead on by reading plugs and using a pyrometer and they're completely lost.
Keep teaching the "black art" of tuning "Uncle Merlin"!!!!
You blanked off the power valve, supplying too much fuel off idle for a small engine, reinstalling one with a low number valve so it gradually enriches as the vacuum drops off at higher rpm, might help??
In order to read the main jet mixture properly you must cut the plug shank off and inspect the mixture ring at the base of the insulator. The top part of the insulator should be no other color than white when performing a plug chop. Indeed the top section of the insulator will have color if the mixture is pig rich because cylinder temperatures are not high enough to keep that part of the plug clean i.e. rich. Just my 2 cents....love your vids!
I enjoy these videos.
A little extra gas at 8:20? 🤣
lol no, I stepped on something crunchy when I was moving my foot while filming. No idea what it was. I forgot to try and take it out in editing.- Kathy
Nah! Leave it! Its funny!!!👍🏻😄
Now gotta go back n look what carb youre using, I cant remember!! But off the top of my head, maybe a "hole" spacer for better air velocity(and atomization), and/or use a softer pump shot by changing linkage?
Love this project... needs less carb. The engine only going to pull 325 to 375 cfm at 5000. Going to be difficult to tune off idle thru WOT with that holley. Do you have a 450 or something you can try?
I've been getting better at plug reading. 2 stroke dirt bikes in winter, and then when I put a bigger carb and exhaust on my 3 wheeler. I also had plugs that were black around the edge, and white lean in the center. Pilot jet too rich? I knew my main jet was lean. I fixed that now so it at least has good throttle response but I thought it was weird how you can have the two extremes in one run. I think if you had smaller booster it would atomize better. Wether you want to punch it off idle or foot-brake launch at 2k rpm. Can you lighten up the accelerator pump squirt with the linkage adjustment?
Maybe you could hunt down a second hand oil accumulator, or try and fab one yourself, they are a pretty simple bit of kit. Tube, floating piston, air on one side and oil on the other much like a shock absorber.
I'm thinking the power valve needs to be added back (instead of none/plugged), but size it tall (instead of 1/2 idle vacuum) go for 3/4 vacuum?
for numbers sake if idling at -15 inHg vacuum get a -10 inHg power valve. Makes the boosters kick in earlier, but with slight the delay needed for the transition so the cylinders can gulp the initial accelerator pump charge. Or am I completely off base here?
No, the issues is not the amount of fuel, but how the fuel is being atomized. It's dripping at small throttle openings and this feeding pure liquid to a few cylinders.
I am not sure , when ever i used a carb or carbs too big for an engine the carbs then required very large jets to compensate for low draw through the venturi , and if i remember correctly you have removed the PV's which is neg 10 sizes approx aswell. Good Luck with it
This reminded me when I played with my 125 cc bike's carburettor to set all its systems to work together nice and smooth. This is such an enjoyable topic and a real puzzle for gearheads.
Does it count as cheating to stick a standalone wideband O2 sensor in that tailpipe to see what is exactly happening?
Click bait thought you was at the track shoulda known 🙄
Plug Chops are essential. I had the same problem with an oversized carb.
Thanks UTG! Been waiting for you to do this video for a long time!!
Annular boosters might be the answer. The best carburetor I ever had was a 9380 Holley .
I was thinking the same.
Just a thought on pan wonder if a oversized pan with a custom deeeep pocket where u can make a longer pickup tube
With such a small motor with poor atomization you could probably use a small Street Demon or small Edelbrock AVS2. The triple stacked boosters or annular discharge boosters of the AVS2 would probably help.
O yea got a lot out this 👍 nice info ! 👌
different boosters? A Holley 390? delay the opening of the rear barrels? Reduce the accelerator pumps?
Lower the float, this will delay the start of the main circuit.
hey my first comment on your videos. but here goes, slant six is my go to engine in everything :P and it suffers from Pore distrebution and aussispeed has some modernised intake manifolds that have alot better fuel distrebution then the old offenhouser. just a suggestion to check them out. cilynder 6-1 are lean, 5-2 are just right and 4-3 are to fat is what i learned for the doug dutra book maby that is somthing to look in to :) hei from norway and good luck in all your /6 endeavors.
I aspire to be a wizard like you one day ❤
Just a random thought what if your float level is a tick too high and the-vibration at the carburetor at that RPM is causing the boosters to dribble fuel out
id try lowering the float level as a quick test some times thatll help with the boosters dripping worked on my 850 brawler anyways
I understand what you're saying, but this is a different kind of booster drip. This one does not happen at idle...only when the throttle is slightly open
@@UncleTonysGarage thats what mine was doing too part throttle cruze it would dump black smoke, idle was fine. Kinda same situation too the 850 is bigger than my 454 needs its a stock 454 with a junk efi cam. Their was just enough air flow to make the boosters drible at aroud 1500 rpm almost a syphon effect probably not your problem but may help some one
Thanks for the reply love the channel coming from a gm fanatic
Hey Uncle Tony, would an oil accumulator be beneficial for the slant six?
Tony maybe add a deeper sump to the oil pan also extend oil pump pickup.
How does one tell apart the stumble of too much gas from the stumble of too little? And if the engine is so lean that it pings during a run, should one back off the throttle?
Can it be converted to a dry sump oil system?
do you go to a very dark place at night and lift the hood and watch for spark arc from the plug wires?
The wires are fine...zero ignition issue
Could the air emulsion tubes be gunked up? Also preventing atomisation?
Not just carburetor friends, but also wizards!
I was wondering if having a link added to the engine build video (assuming there is one) to this video might help some folks who duplicate your oil pan but never see this one.
Tony
Would an annular booster help with the atomization of fuel in the phase you are fighting? I have not yet used a carb with annular boosters so I can't say it will help....
Sounds like your main air bleeds weren’t emulsifying the fuel in the mail-well properly. And that was causing the boosters to drip. Any update on this yet?
those plugs showing "lean" with carbon on one side are fuel washed bet if you clocked the plug it would face right at the intake valve. I would look into a drop the discharge size and accelerator pump cam I think pink is the slowest lift curve
Uncle Tony, I have 2 454 BBCs in my boat and want to check some plugs! On one motor I can get to odds easily and safely while hot on the water, on the other motor I can do the same with my evens. But it is extremely difficult to get to all 16, could I still get decent information from 4 plugs/ motor? Thanks!
Can you lean out that intermediate circuit? Or lean the Excellorator pump?
Many years ago I was reading the plugs from a slant six and they said I should upgrade the power plant to a 340
So what did the thing run in the 1/8th??
Pretty damn slow!
65 years young ) had a helmet just like that. As a pup. When I got my Rupp. Minibike )) was 7 years old ) Ride on ))
62 years old and have the same helmet for the last 50 + years and still ride with it on my little old 66 FLH, and if anybody asks those DOT approved stickers came on it.
Whats the vacuum like on that slant? Put a bigger spacer to allow fuel longer time to atomize, and possibly lower rated power valves.
I was thinking wrong power valves as well. Bring a vacuum gauge into the dash.
Fuel is dripping directly from the boosters. A mile high spacer can't fix that
do you plan to slow the accelerator pumps down any?
"if it feels good, stay in it" words to live and die by....
A whole lot of us are here only because of that philosophy.
I’m waiting for that t-shirt to come out!
😂