GAME OF TOMES 📚 we read The Count of Monte Cristo
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- Опубліковано 9 бер 2024
- @CarolynMarieReads and I are here to tell you (with tons of spoilers) all our thoughts on The Count - our first true tome for Game of Tomes! You can join us here: 📚 links.fable.co/game-of-tomes
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The Count of Monte Cristo--because sometimes Karma needs a hand.
Hahahahaha
Story of my life.
After 14 years in prison I don’t think a life with Mercedes would have been posible. He suffered so much. 14 years. Like he practically came back from the d3ad. Hayde seems like a new beginning, and I did feel we were given hints about her love and admiration for the Count, but more development would had been appreciated. It’s a nivel a re read often. Probably mi favorite book ever.
Mercedes does not wait ten years. She marries Fernand more or less after one year and a half (it is said at some point in the book). Otherwise how could Albert be 19-20 years old when he meets the count in Rome?
Edmond remains 14 years in prison and then, after he escapes, comes back after 6 years (more or less).
Of course, she still loves Edmond and at some point believes he is dead, but she does not remain ten years alone before marrying Fernand.
Yeah, I think that's why Emma feels more forgiving towards Mercedes than some of us hahaha. 18 months seems like no time at all to me
What 10 years??? Emma, read the book again!!!! 😂😂😂
She married Fernand after 18 months!
I just wanna say that I would have been so distraught if Edmond would have killed himself. He deserves happiness more than anyone. I was so happy with the ending and am glad that Edmond finally got his happily ever after.
Agreed! Even if it was weird that he got it with Haydee
I think Villefort was the most culpable because he abused his position of power. He destroyed evidence, thus allowing an innocent man to be punished all to protect his own ambition.
His punishment did go awry, but he had no way of anticipating the murder/suicide.
Haidee (sp?) loved Dantes and respected him, but every time he called himself a father-figure she corrected him and said she had a father and it wasn't Dantes. He was trying to keep her at arms length, but he didn't see her as a daughter either. She symbolizes a fresh start, new beginning. His time with Mercedes had passed. They had changed and been through too much.
I'm surprised to hear you say that the book was too harsh on Mercedes. The fact that the Count not only allowed Albert to live, but was willing to allow himself to be shot in the duel was easily the most compassion shown in the book.
As an aside, I think it's unfair to act as if she is some innocent bystander. She was married to an awful person that was doing awful things to rise in power and wealth and she claims ignorance. I find it hard to believe that she could be so easily deceived into believing her husband was in any way a good man. Mercedes is essentially a mafia wife.
Agree 100%
I think you guys were a little too hard on Valentine. It’s so easy to read a book and watch a movie and be like “just do this, it will solve all your problems, it’s so easy, you’re creating your own issues” but don’t we all do that?? That’s where emotion and internal conflict plays a role in defying logic. That internal conflict is what made her a complex character. She was a genuinely good person and why is that automatically boring?? Like when it comes to loving your family but not agreeing with them and being stuck in a prison of their design, it’s not easy to deal with at all. Maybe it’s cause I can relate to her that I am able to see it from a more understanding point of view
I thought her hesitancy was very realistic, and I loved her character because of it. Her love for her grandfather also seemed very real, the connection they had also made her a great character ❤
I agree! Her 'goodness' is what makes her a complicated character--she's a woman torn between her desires and her duties, obedience and happiness. Love her character.
omg true! i was kinda disappointed they didn't like her as much because she was too "good." i feel like it's so hard to be a good person, and more importantly, to be good in times of struggle, which valentine often faced. it's so easy to fall into the trap of seeing the "bad" or "complicated" character as interesting just because they do more wild things than a character trying to uphold their values, when in fact so much goes on in their internal conflict (as you point out) than these other characters. Especially also as you want to please your family, but also do your own thing. It's such a hard thing to do and shouldn't be discounted so easily.
I was looking for a comment like this. I feel the same way, it is a little bit harsh. Also considering that Maximilien was being super manipulative and unjust with her.
She was so real. I absolutely felt her inner turmoil
I'm so confused cause I thought Mercedes and Fernand got married around 18 months after Edmond's imprisonment? I think Albert was around 20 years old when he met the Count in 1838. If this is true then Mercedes could not have waited 10 years for Edmond, right? Either way, he shouldn't have expected her to just be there after 14 years.
You are correct, she waits 18 months for Edmond
I can see the karma thing here more than the revenge . He didn't directly took revenge on them like Coming out of jail and ruined their life instantly. He found out all their bad deeds and brought out all their faults to the public ( that they were doing repeatedly in their life without realising it ). It would have been difficult for him to take revenge if they didn't do bad deeds anymore. So that's how karma worked. It was philosophical too. I loved it sooo much. Thank you for adding this book.❤️
I feel like the people who are mad of Mercedes’ and Edmond not ending up together are kind of missing the whole point of the book
The authors mentioned in Faria's list were:
Thucydides, Greek, b. 640 BC, who wrote "History of the Peloponnesian War."
Xenophon, Greek, b. 431 BC, who continued on Thucydides history with "Hellenica."
Plutarch, Greek, b. 46 AD, who wrote "Parallel Lives," and "Moralia." (Dumas mentions Plutarch’s "life of Scipio
Africanus" which is actually a lost work.)
Titus Livius (Livy,) Roman, b. 59 BC, who wrote "Ab Urbe Condita" or "From the Founding of the City."
Tacitus, Roman, b. 56 AD, who wrote "Annals" and "Histories."
Strada, Roman, b. 1572 AD, who wrote war histories of Belgium and Netherlands.
Jornandes, Goth, b. 6th century, who wrote about Rome and the Goths.
Dante, b. 1265, obviously "The Divine Comedy" among other things. (No mention of Boccaccio.)
Montaigne, French, b. 1533, who wrote "Essais."
Shakespeare, English, b. 1564, who wrote some plays and whatnot. (Dumas mentions characters from at least "Macbeth," "Hamlet," and alludes to "A Winter's Tale.)
Spinoza, Dutch, b. 1632, who wrote "Tractatus Theologico-Politicus," "Ethics," and "Tractatus Politicus."
Machiavelli, Italian, b. 1469, who wrote "The Prince," and "Discourses on Livy," and "The Art of War."
and Bossuet, French, b.1627, who wrote "Politics Drawn from the Very Words of Holy Scripture."
32:10 "It ages with you and it's not so hard anymore"
-Emma, 2024
erection emma!
It was so funny for no reason lmaoo
Eugene is so cool! Also I agree with the comments saying Villefort is most culpable because he was in a position of power and used that not only to further his own gains but also terrorize another, despite his professional responsibilities.
Also, Edmund getting with Haydee gave me the heebie geebies. Starts with a g and ends with rooming.
Same
I just want to thank you ladies for making me read this tome! The Count and Mercedes have really great chemistry so yah that ending didn't sit well with me too, but god this was so entertaining. My favorite quote is "I like ghosts. I have heard it said that the dead have never done, in six thousand years, as much evil as the living do in a single day." This was just an epic story overall!
Absolutely loved this book!!! Mercedes and the Count's first meeting had me audibly gasping and clutching my chest cuz I wanted her to confess she recognized him so badly. Also, I really need a Eugenie and her friend spin off.
Also another thing about Valentine. “You’re doing this to yourself” it’s not so easy to defy your entire family when you have no rights as an individual during that time and your family decide the outcome of a lot of what you do. Idk let’s analyze for a sec
I just wanted to thank you guys.....without you guys picking it up and recommending it i never would have read it. This really is one of the best classics I've ever read💜
Same💯
i feel like my cheekbones were lifted an inch higher from laughing so much to emma describing her experience with the penguin clothbound 😭😭 HAHAHAHA
I thought Villefort’s wrong was the worst one because his wasn’t jealousy, he didn’t even know Edmund. He simply acted in his own best interest at the expense of someone he knew was innocent, so I thought he got what he deserved. Because he loses everything he gained because of acting selfishly, where if he had helped Edmund, he might’ve had gained the same if not more with no risk of loss. Anyway I loved! the book, thanks to both of you for recommending it ❤❤❤
I wanna watch this video so badly but simultaneously want to catch up by reading without spoilers first 😢😂
I wanted to like this book as much as you both, and many commenters, did. I got lost in the characters and subplots a lot. I knew what was going on within the chapter, but once we switched to someone else, I’d forget who was who and what they did. I should have made myself a character map. I did end up googling one after awhile.
When the count first made his appearance and no one knew he was Edmond I was confused. Like did no one know who he was? What kind of disguise is this that he fools all these people? Am I supposed to be fooled also?
In the beginning of Haidee, I thought she was more of a concubine type slave. The author made it sound like she just lived in one room all the time.
The actor's name was Richard Harris, he was wonderful actor and I loved him as Dumbledore. (I haven't read the book yet but I have seen several adaptions, so I thought it was pretty safe to watch you chat.)
I died with the book innuendos 😂😂😂😂😂
First of all thank you for choosing this tome for your bookclub and motivating me to read it! I probably wouldn’t have picked it up otherwise but it ended up being one of my favourite classics! 🧡
With the ending I also assumed for a while that Edmond would kill himself and that would have been so impactful. But it would also have a lot of readers frustrated including me. So to me it seems like Dumas wanted a reason for Edmond to stay alive and love is one of the best arguments for that. I feel with Mercedes everything that happened between them had them both estranged in a way that they couldn’t end up together anymore. The only other woman available was Haydee so here we are 😅 It feels very forced to me and not at all satisfying.
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR QUESTIONING THAT ENDING -- I MEAN what the hell was that pairing? Haidée has been like a daughter to Edmond for half the book and then Dumas seems to think it'd be ok for them to be lovers? but this book has been amazing and i'm so so so thankful you guys picked it for Game of Tomes
Loved your comments about how "the sins of the father" is applied in the book! So insightful!! I need you two to have a podcast! :)
I’ve been waiting for this! Thanks for finally getting me to read this wonderful book
Will have to watch this later, but THANK YOU SO MUCH for choosing this book for Game of Tomes! It’s definitely a new favourite of mine and one to reread many times. It was such a ride! ❤
I was patiently waiting for this video!!!!! I had the best time with this book, I am so happy you guys influenced me to join this journey!!!
So excited for what’s to come ❤❤
I was enjoying your discussion so much that it took eight and a half minutes to dawn on me that there are a ton of spoilers in this video. Sadly, I'm going to cut this video short, but I will come back to it when I finish The Count.
Thank you so much for inspiring me to read this book! I really enjoyed it but I did have some issues with the ending 😅
One, I did hope the Count and Mercedes would end up together and the Haydee thing came totally out of nowhere to me. The whole slave / father figure thing did not play well.
Two, the Count being so cruel to Max with not letting him know Valentine was alive until the very last minute. I thought that was a bit much. I get why he did that but still… and Max and Valentine don’t even seen to be mad 😀
And finally, the idea that if a woman loses her lover she’s supposed to either kill herself or move to a convent or she’s basically a ho. Oh no no no.
Anyway, still loved the book!
While I do have issues with Haydee and the count, him ending up with Mercedes would’ve gone against the message of the ending. Their time had passed and they needed to let each other go and say goodbye amicably
😂😂😂😂 I love how Emma just👏kept👏going👏with her explanation😂😂
She probably could have KEPT IT UP for 1300+ pages.
Thanks so much for inspiring me to read this absolute classic! Loved every second of it, especially all the nods to greek mythology. Great video and round-up as well!
At the beginning when Emma was asked how is Monte Cristo compared to War and peace, I heard „compared to one piece“😅😅😅😅😅 i was like, how can you compare two different worlds😅😂😂😂😂
Same😂😂
Ever since I finished this book I've been thinking of the Bread and Salt chapter NON STOP. Edmond and Mercedes had so much tension and chemistry! I can see them ending up very differently if they were not in the hands of Dumas, but I still loved them!!
Fun fact, the author actually worked with a ghost writer but because the authors name was more popular, the ghost writer didn’t get any credit and the ghost writer tried to sue he lost, this was the same ghost writer the author worked on with the three musketeers. I don’t know if this is true I heard this was mentioned about the Count of Monte Cristo
I did discover this as well when I was poking around on Wikipedia, definitely don't have anywhere near enough knowledge to be able to decipher how justified the decision in the lawsuit was/how much credit Maquet deserves, but whoever wrote the thing it's a masterpiece 😆
some authors from that time would actually write as a job and get paid per page, they would also employ other writers to write for them under their name..Idk if Dumas was in those exact circumstances but it's possible, also another possible reason for why it's as long as it is lol
that was an epic journey, i loved reading it through every day of february ❤
Love you guys ❤
Thanks for making me read this, I LOVED IT
At last I've been waiting for so on your thoughts ❤❤ I was the one who asked about Eugenie and the Villeforts (don't know if the questions made it tho,I just started the video)
Just watched this as I finally finished the book! Yay! You two are hilarious!
I LOVED this book!!
This was such a phenomenal read to start the year 😊 there were so many moments that genuinely had me cheering or gasping out loud, and all Edmond's agonizing over questions of fate and providence were so incredibly thought-provoking - I was slightly expecting Dumas to be boiler-plate entertaining adventure fiction, maybe even a bit shallow, but my God he's an absolute master of theme! There's so much substance to this book I feel like I could live on it for a year without having to eat anything 😂
Also, personally I think the symbolic/thematic interpretation of the Haydee ending (that Edmond realizes that he can still have a life/a future that isn't wholly dependent on his traumatic past) justifies most of the weirdness around the more literal reality of their situation, but I can be a bit of a thematic absolutist so those who don't care for that perspective can ignore me 🙂
Such a great book! I did have some problems but they don’t take away the power of the book. Also this video is great (the last part is so hilarious!)
Great review girls, from a great book. Thanks for sharing with US.
thx - so happy you found a genuine 5 star read. All of your points seemed rational and well thought out. Especially I liked how you thought about Franz being wrote out of the story bc it's something I too thought about. I suppose Dumas was uncomfortable with having a character in Paris who could talk independently about the Count, particularly when all those rich and powerful people became very interested in who he was and where he came from.
Fantastic that you’re doing the Big Classics, so am I!!! Have just bought “ the Count omc, Middlemarch, the Woman in white, Moby Dick and Anna Karenenina. Have read;”Les Miserables, War and Peace,Shogan, 1Q84,The Goldfinch, The Cornish Trilogy, The Divine Comedy,and Homers the ILIAD/ODESSY. WILL FOLLOW INTENTLY, many thanks again
I’m going to read Count of Monty Cristo next.Thanks Emma and Carolyn.You guys are so entertaining love all the light hearted stuff a jokes etc,serious and light really good balance. I’m only relatively new to UA-cam lit reviews,only a few months, was following Jennifer Brooks,just before she passed,poor girl She was phenomenal,will really miss her. Love the English Guys too,Tristan and the other guy that’s done a phd. in English lit.
Still hasn't convinced me to have another go at reading this. However, the last five minutes are a joy😂😂
It was my first time joining the Game of Tomes and I don't really read classics (just not my vibe, usually boring for me, etc.) but I loved this book so much! I started on Janurary 1st, prepared to read it for the next 2 months, but ended up reading it in 20 days. I was so invested in the story, even though there were some slow parts like you mentioned in the video. I couldn't stop thinking about this book and will definitely re-read and annotate it one day. In the meantime, I'm recommending this book to everyone ahah
Will not join for the next book but will be back for the Lord of the Rings trilogy, which I'm very intimidated by...
Please recommend more classics that grip you like this!!
For me, Edmond was like the personification of karma. Also, everything that led to the ruin of his enemies was brought on by themselves, Edmond just sped up the process ahah
COMC & LOTR are my two favorite books ever. Don’t be intimidated by LOTR but be aware that he tends to do a lot of description about landscapes. 😂
Well, our erudite and beautiful hosts have convinced me to add another tome to my TBR...
Omg! The ending was too funny 😂
So sad we missed this live. Was it live? We will try to figure out this app that you talked about. I think Marie knows about it...and we can discuss our reading progress with you all...instead of just listen to this recounting.
Like you both, we just wished that Edmond would forget the revenge tour, and spend the rest of his days doing good and being the example, like Abbe was to him. Though, we're glad that he didn't take his own life...which in a way (to us) would've given power back to ALL that hurt him and took the fourteen years...and then to have him take his life...would've tainted the story. At least, a bit.
Yes, it did seem weird who he ended up with. The power dynamic that had been infused into that relationship...felt like grooming (in a way), and they could really never be together, but if it worked out (between them), live life to the fullest...I guess.
Felt truly sad for Mercedes. She really got the worst of it, of them that survived (at least).
It felt to us that (in a way), the Count...gave each of them an out (by owning their part, and doing good), but each of them deflected and doubled down. The revenge was warranted (in a sense), but hollow by the end.
This was a lot of fun. My wife was losing it at the end. Thank you for that. I understood what was happening, but wasn't sure how my wife was going to react...and she then exploded in laughter. Thank you. That was hilarious to witness.
Thank you for this wonderful discussion.
Haven't started Middlemarch, yet...but will...soon. Talk to you both, later (probably on that app).😊
Thank You Sooo Much for This Podcast😊📚I As Well Loved the Abbe Faria And Edmond Scenes As Well. I also Had Hoped Edmond and Mercedes would get back Together and Was Sad That They Didn't😥I Also Agree with Both About The Ending🤔Overall LOVED the Book Much😊📚
Thanks for telling us all about your soft book. Sounds like the Count was really shafted.
i love yall together
I love "Count" and hearing you guys discussing it makes me want to reread it. I wanted Edmund and Mercedes to get back together, but I think I missed an opportunity to discuss it with someone commenting on video about adapting the book in a show.
Sorry for the long comment 😅:
In my opinion the one that did the worst was absolutely Villefort because he represented JUSTICE, and he should have been the one to protect people and instead he let his personal life interfere with his job.
Edmond being too much makes him really human. Humans are not perfect, it’s very easy to say I would do this, I would have done this, but if something so terrible happens to you don’t know how you will actually behave. For example: Edmond initial rage towards Mercedes is understandable, we know as readers that it’s unjustified, but girls… put yourself in his shoes. He is mad with rage towards the world but in the end he never intended to revenge on her. He understands and respects her very much. It was just too much for him. As I have already written under another video of Emma, at the end of the novel Mercedes and Edmond are not the same people they were when they were nineteen, too many things have happened. The ending between them it’s not random, they ending up together would have been a cliché.
Edmond understands he has gone too far when the child, Edward, dies. An innocent life should not have suffered. That is the turning point, the epiphany.
Love between Haydee and Edmond is not so random actually. In a chapter, way before the ending, Haydee say something (I don’t remember the exact words) to the count and he starts to think about her differently but pushes away the idea because he thinks he is not worthy.
I reread this book so many times and the more you reread the more you understand why certain things happens. ❤
Yes! I agree with all of this. Haydee told him she had a dad and it wasn't Dantes. She is his chance at a fresh start.
I think I need to read this. I've seen movie, but the book would be a completely different experience. Added to the TBR 😊
Eu gostaria muuuito de participar dos clubes do livro que vocês promovem mas por conta da barreira linguística não consigo. Assisto os vídeos através da tradução automática do UA-cam. Você duas são maravilhosas separadamente mas juntas ficam ainda mais incríveis, beijos❤
I love the count of monte cristo and war and peace. Both books are the best books that I ever read
Same I thought I'd never finish a big book especially after I dnf'd war and peace and this restored all my faith and resolve in my ability to read
Oh my god I cried at the end I can't 😂
0:44 I knew Carolyn is gonna ask the question about ranking War and Peace. Haha .. Agreed with Carolyn, no book can be better than War and Peace, imo.
The only part I really didn't like was the ending. I was annoyed with Dantes for waiting so long to tell Max that Valentine was alive. Why make him suffer like that?
I loved The Count of Monte Cristo. I couldn't put it down. I love a good revenge story.
As much as I hated how Edmond basically grrr roomed Haydée, I realized when I finished the book that the reason why he ends up with her is because she is 19. Edmond feels like he can pick his life back up from where he left it off at 19.
Hi Emma! I wonder if you have any non-fiction favourites?
I dont know about Edmond killing himself. if Edmond killed himself, his hole letter to Maximilien means nothing. It's more impactfull for him to chose to live after everything that happened to him ❤ amazing book!
Way to close ladies!!! Love the innuendo. It was very Hard not to burst out laughing. Thank you for the video. Solid performance.
Emma you should get a clothbound copy of Hard Times by Dickens
War and Peace and The Count are on my reading stack, I keep getting distracted by old Stephen King novels.
I’m reading deleuze and guattari 😜
I don’t understand why you guys think that Edmond killing himself would be the perfect ending… book clubs are cute in concept but I genuinely get frustrated when I hear things that just don’t make sense
This is absolutely in my top 5 favorite classics now! It encapulates every emotion. I love that there are so many extra side stories. I wouldnt have read it without the encouragement of this readalong 🖤
His friendship with Abbe Faria was one of my favorite parts. I despise Madame de Villefort. I did get a little annoyed with Dante some further into the book. I felt like at a certaon point he should have just let it go but he does eventually get there.
I'm with Caroline on the reveals. Epic lol
I watched the movie adaptation after and it was awful. I wanted to bust the tv 😅
The revenge on Villefort did feel slightly out of proportion to me (compared to everyone else's), but I just realised Villefort could've stopped his punishment earlier by not favouring his family name over secrets kept (mirroring what he did with Dantes in prison). As his family were dying one by one he chose to keep it hush-hush, and so in the end he paid a bigger price because he still hadn't learned.
I read 400 pages in this, then started getting confused and it's STILL in my cr (it's been like 6 months)
i am SEATED!
WHY WOULD EDMOND KILL HIMSELF??? What would that solve?? So weird. The whole concept of the book is to hope.. maybe I am not meant to be in a book club Lolol
Yayyy yayyy yayy ✨😭🥺
10:00 WHAT WAS THAT 😭😭😂😂
Monte Cristo WAS the karma✨
Perhaps a hot take, but Fernand and Caderousse deserved to get it the worst IMO
A good 'tome' is Gone with the Wind. (hint, hint).
This book is by far the best I've ever read, but man, am I struggling with Middlemarch. Is anybody else???? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Dude imagine you’re about to marry your husband/wife/whatever and then you get into prison and find out your loved one only waited 10 years for you and then moved onto someone else. Would you personally fight for someone who had an expiration date for waiting for you?? Like bro the entire concept of the book is wait and hope. I think people are acting like Edmond and Mercedes’ should’ve had a Disney ending but that’s simply not realistic, nor fair to Edmond. What, he’s supposed to live a happy life with a woman who slept and had a child with his enemy as if nothing happened??? like bro 😐
And she didn’t wait 10 years, she married Fernand after 18 months… I get it, kind of, she was probably devastated and didn’t think she had a different choice after loosing Edmond. But Fernand being the person sending the letter… I get how Edmond feels…
I don’t believe in Karma as I’ve studied violence against women enough to know men never get bad karma from destroying lives
So would have definitely went on a vengeance journey
31:53 😂😂😂 💀
Can y'all breath 🤣 32:02
Villefore got slammed. There was also whole side issue with his second wife with poisoning everyone
💖👍👌💖💐🍀💖
2:26 my first thought was "who's gonna arrest her for being a Napoleon supporter nowadays", lmao
18:51 ehm… she actually waited like 1 and half year? Albert is around 20ish when he meets Edmond in Rome.
20:08 I wouldn’t have liked to see Mercedes and Edmond back together, they changed too much grew apart for 20 years.
I didn’t like Edmond with Haydee though. She’s too young and and I really felt like Edmond sees her more as the daughter he never had and not as a lover… but also they had so much affection for each other.
Also I saw the Jim Caviezel’s (I hope that’s how it’s written) movie and, like, it was awful, but in a very funny way. Also in the movie Mercedes and Edmond get back together. Spoiler 😅
I think Carolyn misunderstands Karma. It is not Instant Karma, as John Lennon sings about. It is through the cycles of reincarnation. You may spend your entire lifetime putting good into the world with no changes in your lifetime, maybe even quite the opposite, depending upon your past lifetimes.
But if you do not believe in reincarnation. which a true Christian shouldn't, karma is heresy and nothing to be supported (being good, yes, but not karma). For a true Christian, this lifetime is all you have: one and done.
Christian - be good in this lifetime, or else you go to Hell after you die. No do-over.
Hindu - be good in this lifetime, or else your next lifetime will be Hell (maybe even as a lesser animal) after you reincarnate.
Both are veiled threats, relying on fear, to be good. In Hinduism, however, you have the ability to eventually 'repent' in a future lifetime and recover to go to heaven/enlightenment.
Emmie is so hot