Thanks for taking the time to post these, gave me the confidence to order a YY! after a negative experience with a Neoden TM240A years ago! We should have ours in the coming week. Would highly appreciate a "tips & tricks" style video to help other users to gain from your experience with yours. Keep up the good work!
That fiducial system looks pretty terrible - can you manually do the fiducial setting, i.e. line it up manually from the camera view so you don't have to rely on thieir vision working?
you think using this for small proto runs for customers is worth it? Like 3 boards at a time using just cut-tape parts from digikey? Trying to decide if this + setup time actually saves any time at all for super small batches
I think that depends on how many components per board you're talking about. If a board has like 30 components and you're only making 3 of them then it's not worth it as you'd be able to hand assemble them In the time it took you to set up the PnP If a board has like 300+ components on it then ya, it would probably be worth it just from the time savings alone over hand assembling. The yy1 can do about 1200 components per hour in real world use. Hope that helps.
Awesome review. Thanks! Whats the process if I have say 80 unique parts? Can you re-reel the machine. Would that be more painful than it’s worth? Also how do you do dual sided boards.
80 unique parts would be a challenge. Are there 80 unique parts all on one side of the board? If let's say there are 40 unique parts on both sides of the board that would be possible. Just place one side of the board (I'd do your whole production run on one side, then flip and do the other side all at once) To do a double sided board you'd use a high temp paste for the 1st side, reflow it, try and make sure everything soldered Correctly as reworking it with the 2nd side placed would be difficult. Then use a low temp paste for the 2nd side. When you reflow the 2nd side it won't get hot enough for the 1st side to melt again. Now if you have 80 uniques on 1 side, that would be tricky or maybe even impossible. I'd try and standardize components as much as possible to get that unique number down. The problem with re-reeling in the middle of a run is your solder paste would dry up before you could finish, on top of it being just a major pain in the ass to have to do that every single time.
I also have problems with the coordinates. I set all feeder positions, then after big moves there is a slight difference. I think the number of steps is not correct in the software for step motor.
I don't have issues with it missing steps after bit moves. Only time I've seen the component pick up spots being off is after a reboot and that wasn't consistently off every time. I saw someone else mention missed steps and they noticed that the gantry wasn't square to the side rails. Like if one of the side belts skipped a tooth and therefore it could cause issues. You might take a look at that and see if your gantry is square.
@@paulprice There is a problem with the end limit switches (optical sensors). When there is so much light on them, they dont work. I had some sunshine on them, basically the machine hit the end and it got crazy. I realized it is the light affects them!
Hi, what are the maximum pcb dimensions and maximum placing area? I have a 390mmX200mm board, placing area is 348X170mm. Can i place with this machine? Detailed answer is important for me, thanks..
I don't really get the setup, Ideally you don't want to set this using the first component. The board bed should be set 0,0 in the bottom left corner where the silver screw is on the mounting bars. Then first component should be first line in BOM for FD-1 with component coordinates then select fiducial and teach to another fiducial. Do you know where 0,0 is on your machine and also if you can change the 0,0 as in settings the password provided in the manual did not work. Ive contacted Neoden but no reply. My head is literally going over the top of bottom left feeders when trying to find a component at 60 x 23 on the coordinates which is daft so I am definitely either missing something or somethings gone a miss on this little machine of mine. Any advice helpful.
I don't have any of those to try. But as long as the component isnt bigger than 18x18mm the camera alignment should work. Anything bigger you can place without vision but the accuracy will be less. Especially with small pins on the LQFP-112 it may be difficult to place accurately without vision if it's bigger than 18x18
It will place ESP32 modules, but it can't use the vision system to place them, it just uses the coordinates to place them as they're too big for the camera. It works well enough, tho usually I have to look at them and occasionally tweak the position of the module if it didn't get placed exactly right.
What aspect the pitch settings isn't working? You should be able to set the pitch in that 44 feeder setting page. But note if you try and do a test pick it will only use 4mm spacing, but when you run the program it will use the pitch you entered.
Hello Sir I just got my YY1 machine arrived last night, I'd like to ask if there's a way to setup the pick up behaviour..? Mine enables the vacuum valve a little late and it misses sucking the component.. much appreciated sir..
I'm not familiar with that issue. Have you checked to make sure all the vacuum hoses are securely attached. I had one tube on the head that was loose from shipping when I received mine. If it continues to be an issue I'd contact neoden support
@@paulprice alright sir thank you, must be my fault I'm ttying out 1206 smd's on Bulk feeder trays, just figuring out how it handles loose parts that small
I think it depends on how much volume you're doing and how quickly you need your boards built. For instance I have a few products that I keep the parts on hand and when I need a new batch made I can make them in a day and have them back up for sale in 24-48hrs. But if you're fine with waiting a few weeks for a PCBA to make them and you're doing low volume then it's probably not worth it.
No, by default there are spots for 8, 12 and 16. It also supports 24 but that is an add on purchase. Which I did get. I've used all 4 sizes on this machine
@@_adamalfath correct. If you only used 8mm feeders you could fit 52. With a few 12 and 16 thrown in (default configuration) I think it's 45 feeders if memory serves me right
Thanks for taking the time to post these, gave me the confidence to order a YY! after a negative experience with a Neoden TM240A years ago! We should have ours in the coming week. Would highly appreciate a "tips & tricks" style video to help other users to gain from your experience with yours. Keep up the good work!
If you are going to do a next video you could show how good (or not) the bulk picking is.
That fiducial system looks pretty terrible - can you manually do the fiducial setting, i.e. line it up manually from the camera view so you don't have to rely on thieir vision working?
you think using this for small proto runs for customers is worth it? Like 3 boards at a time using just cut-tape parts from digikey? Trying to decide if this + setup time actually saves any time at all for super small batches
I think that depends on how many components per board you're talking about. If a board has like 30 components and you're only making 3 of them then it's not worth it as you'd be able to hand assemble them In the time it took you to set up the PnP
If a board has like 300+ components on it then ya, it would probably be worth it just from the time savings alone over hand assembling.
The yy1 can do about 1200 components per hour in real world use.
Hope that helps.
@@paulprice cool thanks Paul!
Awesome review. Thanks! Whats the process if I have say 80 unique parts? Can you re-reel the machine. Would that be more painful than it’s worth? Also how do you do dual sided boards.
80 unique parts would be a challenge. Are there 80 unique parts all on one side of the board?
If let's say there are 40 unique parts on both sides of the board that would be possible. Just place one side of the board (I'd do your whole production run on one side, then flip and do the other side all at once)
To do a double sided board you'd use a high temp paste for the 1st side, reflow it, try and make sure everything soldered Correctly as reworking it with the 2nd side placed would be difficult.
Then use a low temp paste for the 2nd side. When you reflow the 2nd side it won't get hot enough for the 1st side to melt again.
Now if you have 80 uniques on 1 side, that would be tricky or maybe even impossible. I'd try and standardize components as much as possible to get that unique number down. The problem with re-reeling in the middle of a run is your solder paste would dry up before you could finish, on top of it being just a major pain in the ass to have to do that every single time.
thank you ❤
I also have problems with the coordinates. I set all feeder positions, then after big moves there is a slight difference. I think the number of steps is not correct in the software for step motor.
I don't have issues with it missing steps after bit moves. Only time I've seen the component pick up spots being off is after a reboot and that wasn't consistently off every time.
I saw someone else mention missed steps and they noticed that the gantry wasn't square to the side rails. Like if one of the side belts skipped a tooth and therefore it could cause issues. You might take a look at that and see if your gantry is square.
@@paulprice There is a problem with the end limit switches (optical sensors). When there is so much light on them, they dont work. I had some sunshine on them, basically the machine hit the end and it got crazy. I realized it is the light affects them!
Hello Paul. Have you compared this machine with SMT330-X? Why this one was chosen?
Hello, good video 🙂. is it possible to solder micro leds? where can we order component spools? Thanks
Hi, what are the maximum pcb dimensions and maximum placing area? I have a 390mmX200mm board, placing area is 348X170mm. Can i place with this machine? Detailed answer is important for me, thanks..
I don't really get the setup, Ideally you don't want to set this using the first component. The board bed should be set 0,0 in the bottom left corner where the silver screw is on the mounting bars. Then first component should be first line in BOM for FD-1 with component coordinates then select fiducial and teach to another fiducial.
Do you know where 0,0 is on your machine and also if you can change the 0,0 as in settings the password provided in the manual did not work. Ive contacted Neoden but no reply.
My head is literally going over the top of bottom left feeders when trying to find a component at 60 x 23 on the coordinates which is daft so I am definitely either missing something or somethings gone a miss on this little machine of mine. Any advice helpful.
Hello Paul.. hmm is there any chance we can test LQFP-112 using with or without vision assist..? Thanks bro..
I don't have any of those to try. But as long as the component isnt bigger than 18x18mm the camera alignment should work.
Anything bigger you can place without vision but the accuracy will be less. Especially with small pins on the LQFP-112 it may be difficult to place accurately without vision if it's bigger than 18x18
How does it go placing esp32 modules?
It will place ESP32 modules, but it can't use the vision system to place them, it just uses the coordinates to place them as they're too big for the camera.
It works well enough, tho usually I have to look at them and occasionally tweak the position of the module if it didn't get placed exactly right.
So In between Neoden YY1 and QiHe -- is Neoden better?
Hello sir it's me again.. I tried using the tape feeder #44 for TO-252 or Dpak, But i can't seem to make the pitch settings work
What aspect the pitch settings isn't working? You should be able to set the pitch in that 44 feeder setting page. But note if you try and do a test pick it will only use 4mm spacing, but when you run the program it will use the pitch you entered.
@@paulprice alright thanks Sir
Hello Sir I just got my YY1 machine arrived last night, I'd like to ask if there's a way to setup the pick up behaviour..? Mine enables the vacuum valve a little late and it misses sucking the component.. much appreciated sir..
I'm not familiar with that issue. Have you checked to make sure all the vacuum hoses are securely attached. I had one tube on the head that was loose from shipping when I received mine.
If it continues to be an issue I'd contact neoden support
@@paulprice alright sir thank you, must be my fault I'm ttying out 1206 smd's on Bulk feeder trays, just figuring out how it handles loose parts that small
Is this cost effective over getting jlcpcb or similar to do turnkey?
I think it depends on how much volume you're doing and how quickly you need your boards built.
For instance I have a few products that I keep the parts on hand and when I need a new batch made I can make them in a day and have them back up for sale in 24-48hrs.
But if you're fine with waiting a few weeks for a PCBA to make them and you're doing low volume then it's probably not worth it.
Is it correct all the feeder bank only support 8mm tape?
No, by default there are spots for 8, 12 and 16.
It also supports 24 but that is an add on purchase. Which I did get. I've used all 4 sizes on this machine
@@paulprice Ah I see. It's a little bit confusing that the webpage says "all 8mm", must be max. 52 tape "at" 8mm. Thanks for the info.
@@_adamalfath correct. If you only used 8mm feeders you could fit 52. With a few 12 and 16 thrown in (default configuration) I think it's 45 feeders if memory serves me right