ANDRETTI GETS DENIED! Opinions on Formula One's Refusal to Admit Andretti
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- Опубліковано 1 лют 2024
- If Formula One thinks that this is buried because of the Lewis Hamilton news... Think again.
The Andretti saga has been going on for a while now and it's official that they won't be allowed in for 2025 or 2026. But, F1 is open to them re-applying and coming in for 2028 instead, when they'll have to pay more money. Convenient.
But the reasoning just seems like a list of excuses. And that doesn't sit well with me somehow. The 'excuses' seem more annoying than the fact they were denied...
Speaking of- Read the reasons here: www.autosport.com/f1/news/ful...
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Apparently Andretti didn’t turn up for that meeting because the zoom invite went into a junk folder.
What a fucking meme. 🤣
Jesus Christ this is a farce all around.
What a fucking joke. I've been watching Andretti get shit on by F1 since 1993
is this true? hard to tell if this is a satire comment.
It sounds funny, but if you think about it logically it just shows how petty FOM is. FOM is owned by Liberty Media, a multibillion telecommunication corporation. If they are incapable of relaying a message about an important business meeting aside from sending a single staffer's email, then it says a lot about their intention.
To be fair it's their own interpertation of "We've not received any invitation whatsoever" in a polite way. And honestly, I doubt that FOM was even going to invite them to a meeting, because that would've been seen as "softening the tone" by Andretti (which would've been false hope anyway)
F1: You won't be competitive
Also F1: We aren't even going to give you a chance to prove if you're competitive.
Life had more of a chance to prove they could be competitive.
@@patmanbnlI feel like if Ecclestone was still in charge he would've already let Andretti in after receiving a big bag of money 💰
Also also F1: We're happy to have Haas fighting to be 11th in a 10 team championship.
@@jimscarlett Also F1: We're happy to have Visa Cashapp Mastercard Credit One Bank Amazon F1 Team as well as Cooked Stake F1 Team compete.
@@kuromori6200 As well as Audi who will be bad for the prestige of the sport.
It's absolutely ridiculous - two thirds of the grid barely meet these unreasonable high standards…
Then the solution cant be to bring in another team that doesnt meet these requirements. When it comes to the commercial side of F1, the F1 teams are actually working together to grow the pool of money, they are like a team working together to make sure there is more money for everyone. Every group like that is going to have a few weak links, people who are just leaching off the system. So, if you are going to add new team members the last thing you want to do is add more people who are likely to rank on the weaker side on your team because that will just make everyone poorer.
Formula One is now operating under a franchise model. Obviously the existing franchises don't want to split the profits pie and give a share to an extra team. I wish they'd just come out and say it. Even American fans can understand that because we see it in our own native sports. There are obviously more competent people, for instance, who want a Major League Baseball franchise than the people who run the Oakland As, which are already in, but the existing franchise holders have no obligation to let anyone else in until they want to. I think Andretti are just wasting their time and money with this effort. They should just wait until a team comes up for sale and buy in, or when the F1 organization puts out an RFP for new teams, if that ever happens. You can't force your way in.
9.5 of the 10 teams don't meet the standard of 'competing for the championship'...
None of them do. Ferrari and Red Bull gained notoriety through F1 and the rest aren't competitive on top of that.
@@jessez8503 I don’t really follow logic on why they can’t bring another team. Poor performing teams should be dropped by that logic instead
The extremely bogus part of their denial is that they expect an 11th team to be immediately competitive for podium places and maybe wins. That means a new team has to immediately enter F1 and be in the top-3 in the constructor's rankings, bypassing seven other teams that have years/decades of F1 experience. No new team will ever meet that bar.
I didn't expect FOM to accept the Andretti's. But I also didn't expect them to be so deeply condescending, and insulting to the intelligence of the F1 fanbase. How do they seriously expect to have successful expansion in the US while basically sticking a middle finger to one of Americas biggest motorsports organisations and one of its biggest motor manufacturers.
They want US fan money but don't give a shit other than that.
Andretti would be another Assembly team and NOT a Constructor! Maybe if they had a bid that was less like HAAS and more like a true racing constructor we would now be looking at a possible 11th team! Its a shame because as a racing organisation Andretti is a global brand. :(
@@shadow7037932 They probably won't be getting US money for much longer. F1's supposed massive popularity boost in the US in recent years is at best a mirage and at worst a myth. It will disappear quickly enough. Most likely the Miami & Vegas GP's will be gone after 3 or 4 years. Maybe Texas will hang around because of TV money, the TV rights holders wanting at least one race in the US. Andretti will never have an F1 team. Colton Herta will never drive an F1 car. And the F1 TV ratings in the US likely have peaked and in a couple of years will be half what they were when they were at their peak. I'm old, so I've seen this all before. It seems to happen once every generation.
Andretti was not "insulting/condescending" showing up with a piece of paper and expecting them all to sign during a race weekend?
@@ronbelanger4113 That was a hilarious stunt all the team bosses basically said no and he was laughed out the paddock. What a ridiculously fucking stupid move that was.
F1 supposedly wants to appeal to the American market yet rejects one of the most recognizable names in American Motorsports who was backed by one of the biggest American automotive companies
So apart from Cadillac, GM the entire American Market what value do they bring lol.. It's ridiculous.
Whatcdo haas bring, what do red bull bring, what do williams bring, what are all the non car companys bring, its just stupid, andretti was just pushed out by teams that are just scared, i dont normally get salty avout f1 but this just feels all wrong for me@@Fiasco3
In the honor of Haas, Netflix is renaming their series. "Drive to Die."
I have a theory that F1 wants the American audience obviously because of the money, but doesn’t want a competitive American team because of the possible embarrassment of them succeeding. Not even saying they would succeed, just the possibility of it would be embarrassing for the teams on top of the “financial” implications.
The FIA wants to appeal to the US... F1...it's fairly happy.
Les races, more teams would mean losing some European races and getting another proper US track.
Lose-lose.
I'm still puzzled by how the teams just flat out ignore the parts of the Concorde Agreement that states up to 12 teams, with a 13th only if the teams want it, that the tracks must have enough space for 12 teams with the capability for a 13th, is what's been thrown around by reputable sources who have gone through the agreement the teams signed
They also have to agree a deal with FOM, which, surprise, they haven't.
Going to be some fall out. Legal battles. It's a total farce and a clear personal vendeta from F1 towards the FIA and also I strongly suspect a vendeta towards Andretti aswell.
@@LemonyTangAndretti was pretty rude going in but that's just how burgers are. The big problem is FOM doesn't want the FIA to exist. And Andretti is caught in the middle
@@LemonyTang Legal battles will be a mistake. The F1 people are fantastically rich and are used to having their own way, and you can't force your way into their club. We saw this play out a few years ago in the NHL when Blackberry owner (in the days when Blackberry was a big thing) Jim Ballsillie tried to force his way into ownership of a team and was quickly shown the door. F1 is a club. You can't force your way in. All this noise around the Andretti effort is not going to help them. They should have played it quiet & coy. I'll venture to say that unless they buy a team, there will never be an Andretti team in Formula One.
@@0Synergy
Meanwhile, the people who are going to keep the FIA around:
I’m the IOC, I’m the IOC, I’m the reason nothing works
I would love to see Andretti show up at COTA with a working car and be able to take laps during the F1 weekend in front of the fans.
Agreed - to a point. Only if they've had "behind closed doors" trials elsewhere. They don't want to go there and be slow after all.
I would like to see it too. It's the only F1 racing Andretti will ever do!!!!!
Technically, the FIA has approved the entry. The FIA governs the races. Andretti can rightfully show up and compete. They just can’t be shown on TV or have their team/sponsors on any of the buildings at the track.
It would be funny if they hired the track for the weekend after the race and did some demo runs setting competitive times.
@@barnigranero5882 Yeah but you're assuming they would set a competitive time right out the box. More likely he'll show up and by maybe on Williams/Haas’s pace. That'll be a bit embarrassing when he'll have been talking it up and in reality he won't even be near the backmarkers. Whilst the big boys like Red Bull Ferrari Mercedes and McLaren will just leave them for dead.
I live in Australia, the next train station down from me I can see a big Andretti Motorsport logo on one of their factories for the supercars team. I remember Mario doing Valvoline ads on the TV as a kid. They are known more than F1 is giving them credit for worldwide.
Point 17 isn't even FOM's remit, the FIA sets the standards for track accommodations. That means there HAS to be garage and paddock space for a full 24 car grid or you don't get the rubber stamp. FOM is so used to being able to use those extra garages for their own ends they think denying the space to AN ACTUAL RACE TEAM is their call, it's not.
This would never happen in miniature golf.....
"What is your source for the research fom?"
"The source is that we made it the f up."
I suspect that GMs limited initial commitment to the project has actually been a liability to the application.
@@jessez8503 I wouldn't say limited. GM wants to F1 with Andretti at first, while FOM wants Cadillac without Andretti.
Guess Andretti didn’t ‘invest’ their money with the right people.
… and by invest i mean bribe.
If Bernie was still in charge then Andretti would have (probably) already joined after Bernie received a big bag of money from Andretti 💰
Bernie had some of the best lawyers, and yet he surrendered to Liberty. How good do you imagine Michael's lawyers will be?@@CyanRooper
@@MrCyphermonkey It's an American team, the correct term would be "lobbied"
And by right people, you mean involve the Saudis.
Two Passages from the Statement that keep stuck in my Head:
"While the Andretti name carries some recognition for F1 fans, our research indicates that F1 would bring value to the Andretti brand rather than the other way around."
and
"the need for any new team to take a compulsory power-unit supply, potentially over a period of several seasons, would be damaging to the prestige and standing of the championship"
After I read this my first responce was: We need to talk about Haas! 🤡
F1 shade for, we are too good for Andretti. They be assholes.
On the power unit point, you could include, McLaren, Williams, Aston Martin, Stake, Red Bull, and Red Bull Jr.
Haas joined at a different time though. I'm not sure Haas would get an entry these days.
I do feel personally that Andretti doesn't bring much to the table for F1 itself right now. They aren't bringing a new engine supplier in for atleast the first two years which would benefit other teams by increasing competition which should drive power unit prices down. And on the sponsor front most of Andrettis existing relationships with sponsors are regional sponsors. They are happy to sponsor Indycar where the races are in North America and most of the viewers are but are they going to spend more to sponsor an F1 car when most races and most viewers can not use their product or services. The reality is they are likely to have to go after companies that already sponsor other teams thus not growing the pue but diluting it. What they should have been doing is approaching big multinational firms who dont currently sponsor F1 teams, for example Apple, Netflix or Disney and get commitments and then gone we have x,y and z lined up and they don't sponsor any existing team. That would show they are being something to the table and would have out the teams more at ease
Absolutely absurd!
A complete slap in the face to Andretti, GM, and US fans. Americans need to boycott, and The US Government needs to make it very clear that no Andretti, no US races.
My big issue with this isn't that they were denied for 2026, but the wording in the letter they could "try" again in 2028. Had they said we'll let you in when GM has an engine built is one thing, but this is like the beginning of Happy Gilmore and "try again next year."
Someone on another forum asked what they did at Daytona last weekend, as if one race result mattered. After (almost) 24 hours and 791 laps they were 14 seconds off the winner in third. That's closer than most teams were to RBR last year in F1 after only 1.5 hours of racing.
Meanwhile, at least half of the F1 grid is irrelevant.
They are not using F1 power plants.
@@ronbelanger4113 who? The half of the F1 grid that's irrelevant?
Imagine speaking on being competitive when they have one driver and team win majority of the races.
And basically admitted that half the grid bring nothing to F1
And hey have, Williams, Haas, Sauber and Alpha Tauri and the bottom of the championship, with little or none progress
@@MrSniperfox29 They bring more than Andretti ever will that's for sure.
@@kicapanmanis1060 lol. No.
@@kicapanmanis1060 Haas? Nope
Sauber - Have brought nothing for years
RB 2.0 - Nope
Alpine - Completely uncompetitive
Williams - Living on a legacy
Nobody would notice if they weren't racing because they bring nothing to the table anymore
The CRH did not consult the 10 teams on Andretti's entry into F1 - in my best Dr. Evil impersonation - " RRRIGHT"
Exactly. Nobody believes they didn't consult the teams. At minimum they'd have talked to Merc, Ferrari etc. FOM must think the F1 fanbase are naive blithering idiots who have no concept of anything.
Whether or not FOM, in their words "consulted the other teams", a majority of the other teams publicly made their opinions known.
The argument "We're concerned Andretti won't be competitive and we also have new rules being introduced which could effect said competitiveness" when HAAS was literally in that exact same situation when they joined in 2016 with the rules changes in 2017 doesn't add up. If Formula 1 is serious about wanting to grow the sport in the US then having Andretti as an entry is a no brainer. I feel F1 has shot them selves in the foot and i'm concerned that by 2028 the anti-dilution fee will be increased (because current teams want it) and Andretti will just give up due to the cost.
Haas was under different Concorde Agreement.
@@kicapanmanis1060 this. Also under Bernie’s rule.
Considering the expansion fees for the two new expansion teams in the NHL for example (since Aidan is wearing a Bruins cap, I can make this reference) - the Vegas Golden Knights and Seattle Kraken, had went over the half billion mark, wouldn't shock me if Liberty and the teams saw this and wanted the anti-dilution fee to be like the expansion fees in the major pro-leagues in North America (NFL, NBA and NHL) since a new team in F1 is more or less an expansion team anyway.
Oh, and while the Americans cry foul on the rejection of Andretti's bid (and rightfully so), can't help myself to mention that they do the exact same thing to their neighbours north of the 49th parallel. For years Quebec City has been trying to bring NHL hockey back to town after the Nordiques were taken away from them in 1995 (and won the Stanley Cup in 1996 as the Colorado Avalanche). They have a NHL-ready area, a fanbase that will fill the entire arena and have the support of the local govenment. But no, the league is too stubborn on their efforts of keeping the Coyotes in Arizona - a team that has been kicked out of multiple arenas, a proposal for a new arena in Tempe, AZ was soundly rejected by locals in favour of a waste dump of all things and are playing in a 5000-seat (even less than 5000) arena where they are second fiddle to the local COLLEGE team. The Videotron Centre, which is in Quebec City, has 3-4 times more seats. But nope - the Canadian market brings zero value to the NHL brand (kinda ironic as the NHL is Canadian invention). A similar rhetoric used by FOM for their rejection on the Andretti bid. Well, at least the NBA is considering bringing the league back to Seattle (the Supersonics were unjustly moved to Oklahoma City all the way back in 2008)
You either die a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become Ferrari 🤡
I’m starting to think there’s someone within F1 who’s been holding some sort of grudge against Michael Andretti since the 90s and is finally getting their chance to take it out on him. The Dawi would be proud.
I've been thinking the same thing. Somebody's got some weird grudge against him for...reasons?
I've thought that too. Holding it against him because he was expected to be an F1 champion like Mario and failed.
Yeah, lol. Someone needs to get over 31 years ago if that's the case....but that would be appropriately F1 levels of petty.
It's no secret that Andretti has rubbed them up the wrong way… but it does seem incredibly personal… seems nothing would be good enough for FOM at the standards they're setting
Not really. Andretti wants to get in with a cheap $200mil fee and dilute the earnings of the other teams and the teams reasonably doesn't want it. If Andretti wanted in, he should have tried during the last Concorde when F1 was desperate and risky not now when things are on the up.
I'm glad I turned down the offer to go to the British GP. The only thing FOM is interested in is money, not fans interest.
Totally agree with your assessment here. They bring up a couple of (minor) valid points which support their rejection but the majority of it is just nitpicking, pointless, or outright wrong. It reeks of both desperation to keep an 11th team off the grid and a personal grudge against Andretti themselves. Parts of the statement seem specifically crafted in such a way as to do little more than belittle them. It seems to have gotten bizarrely personal.
Thank you for covering this! I feel like the Hamilton news was conveniently timed to bury this important fact/news!
I remember my dad saying that F1 had a problem with the Andretti's. I try to keep an open mind, so whenever he said it, I would roll my eyes. I remember he had so many conspiracies about Micheal having issues back when he was with McLaren. Though I believe there are some valid arguments against Andretti joining now, but some part of me is starting to believe my dad may of had a point. I am not sure GM would be willing to develop an F1 PU, along with any investors, without Andretti having a guarantee they will be in F1. So I get why Andretti would want to get a foot in the door.
Michael had nothing but bad things to say about F1. He was too good to not live there and with his lack or personality didn’t help now and must have some issues still. F1 has such a big ego they’ll surely cut off their nose to spite their face. As Andretti being in F1 would be a win win as an American owner. Hass is just a test bed for Ferrari and myself as a usa 🇺🇸 citizen doesn’t equate Hass as a 🇺🇸 representative. F1 races in the USA is more about a show, entertainment and not all that a real race fan would miss if all the races went away 🤷♂️
How can haas even try to call themselves a USA rep after driving around with a massive Russian flag and a trapstamp of Putin’s face in the back
Theyre not worried about being competitive, theyre worried theyll walk in and beat ferrari. And thats unacceptable
That sounds right
Tbf I could beat Ferrari. Just stay behind them until they bottle a strategy or Leclerc puts it in a wall lel.
@@davidvasquez08senor lewis…?
....about reason #16. Andretti needs F1 more than F1 needs Andretti. As a life long American Race fan, I know I knew who Mario Andretti (and Michael) were before I knew anything about Formula 1. F1 wants the American market, but wants to shut out one of the biggest names in US auto sports. Seems like the reasoning is shaky and incomplete, if not intended to be insulting. It's greed.
The logistical argument is mental as well. Look at us we're...F1 we can do anything. We have the logistical ability to ship race teams across the world in a few days time...what 2 more cars?! another team?! you want the impossible!
Phil Hill (1961)and Mario Andretti (1978) are the only Americans to win a F1 Championship. And the Italians still recognized that fact. The FOM are assholes.
Cheers, from the Pacific West Coast of Canada.
FOM pretty much expects Andretti and GM to spend the time and money to develop a full car and engine before finding out if they'll be able to race. And ideally have that car out running at an F1 track to see if the lap times would be competitive. They'd probably then deny them based on testing restrictions.
Nah
They deny the based from marketing standpoint.
The funny thing is that Haas has now said they won't be competitive in 2024 already.
They don't expect to be competitive in 2024. In all fairness it could be 2034 and they would still be a mobile chicane.
your caption at 8:05 “(oh, it’s the Bible I only just noticed)” got a real chuckle out of me 😂
So they must be competitive from the start, can someone pass that message on to Haas then.
Half the grid isn't competitive except for the last couple of points each weekend.
Good to see how we have the real focus in F1 still discussed. Guess I can skip the whole season until someone showing Andretti logo on grandstand-no, FOM can forbid but it shall not be stopped.
First off: love the Bruins hat.
Second: the general vibe I have is the same as I do with the USA being a noise in FIFA: they love our money, they don't love our company.
I would like more teams regardless of how competitive they are initially.
F1: we want to appeal to the American market, so we’re going to have four races in America.
Also F1: rejects an American racing team from entering the sport, despite them being given the green light by the FIA, already have a car built, has a massive car company backing them and is associated with one of America’s most famous racing names.
F1, what is wrong with you?
F1 teams are basically an old world European old men's club.
@@shadow7037932 Oh yeah because not like Haas exists or the Americans too embarrassed over that one....
“Hurr durr they might need help with chassis and buy an engine in the early years hurr durr it hurt credibility!”
Every team in the 60s and 70s using a March chassis and Cosworth DFV: 😬
And they were sponsored by, funded by, and badged as *Ford.* Ironic.
Its a shame even with them having a sort of link with McLaren with Zac Brown being the CEO of them and also owning United Autosports with there tie up in Supercars
I go off F1 more and more each year.. I used to go to Silverstone every year... I can't be arsed to even watch it on TV now.. maybe highlights at most.. it's disappearing up it's own backside..
Appreciate the Futurama reference 👏🏻
The Shane McMahon reference was amazing. Also I feel like Liberty Media just doesn't wanna have to risk giving more money to the teams or something like that.
Andretti will be allowed in when they vote another half a billion in for the anti-dilution fee in the next Concorde Agreement.
It won't be a surprise if that is the case...
They'll only be allowed in if one of the 10 teams folds. The teams don't want to share their TV money, if Andretti came along with a billion dollars the teams would demand 2 billion.
It kinda reminds me of what Vettel said regarding driver salaries:
"Isn’t it a funny coincidence that it’s the first time that teams can actually make money with racing in F1, and something like the salary cap for drivers pops up. Just thinking, isn’t that funny?”
There was a time when F1 was more than happy to let new teams into the sport so long as they weren't so crap that they had to kick them out. Now that the cost cap exists and the teams are actually making money instead of losing money they are suddenly more picky about letting new teams in.
Conspiracy. Hamilton news is to cover Andretti snub. 😢
Let's see, what's important to Liberty Media (BTW, a media company). 1. Implementing street races in high profile cities and resorts that the teams, drivers, and spectators don't like just for the show. Adds no value to the racing product. 2. Promoting, highlighting and allowing unlimited access to mega Hollywood (media) and sports stars during the pre and post race broadcast. The ticket buying fans get nothing, also adds no value to the racing product. 3. Deny access to new teams, technology, drivers, and ideas which maintains the status-quo which adds no value to the racing. Pretty simple, showbiz and money is all Liberty Media wants. Left F1 two years ago and am not coming back.
People talk about the WRC being in trouble but they had a sensational Monte Carlo event recently...im more concerned about F1 tbh.
Well commercially speaking F1 is in rare health but racing is a different story
Don't forget Brawn GP also used the fallback engine supplier rule when they joined...
They went to Ron Dennis and Ron hooked them up.
How long ago was that again? 😂 Times have changed
I have a feeling F1 is going to experience the same sort of collapse Nascar has had in the near future. It feels like a very precarious house of cards already, and manglement decisions like this won't help.
And with 2024 looking like another season of absolute Verstappen domination, ratings will take a brutal hit.
The Race made a great point on all this. Analyzing a team's competitiveness is not even supposed to be in FOM's purview. They intentionally try to tie it to commercial viability to make their points, and in doing so, inadvertently imply they will never be interested in allowing in a customer team ever again.
re: entering 2025 then needing to rebuild a new car.
i think this is deliberate, if you enter for an adjustment year where you're not really expecting anything, you're able to completely focus on stuff like making the team run efficiently and similar stuff. then for 2026 you turn up with an experienced team and a car that's gonna be fully focused on without having to be behind on anything
4:25 *by Paragraph 9. You got me!*
*_Absolute and TOTAL BS._*
How can ANYBOY expect a NEW F1 team to be competitive form the get go.
As far as I remember only one teams have done so, in the 70 years of F1: Brawn GP (and we know why) and Williams (just took them 3 years...)
100% with you on the unconstructiveness of Indycar superiority squabbling- there's no fighting the comparison of the two, but despite the similarities they do have radically different vibes, and there's no reason they can't co-exist.
I really hope the uproar of the Andretti snub catalyzes Penske Corp. to look at booking an Indycar mini tour in the UK. Seems like Brands Hatch and one or two other courses under the same owners could host IC races, and the vibe of Indycar being grittier, cheaper, and more unpredictable than F1 could resonate quite well with jaded F1 fans.
Penske can't even run Indycar competently in the US if recent hybrid debacle is any indication. He's skating off due to the pandemic but that is slowly changing. The teams won't be for it either due to the large costs involved.
At least I know what channel the f1 will be on and what day. Indycar can’t get that right. 🤣
8:52 Paragraph 16 is the biggest lump of bulls*** ever recorded in human history
It feels like excuses because they are. The garage and track accommodation argument is particularly lame, in that all F-1 sanctioned tracks are required to support at least 24 cars (Las Vegas can handle 12 teams plus an extra garage). That one's not just a lame excuse, but a bald faced lie. As to getting ready in time, if the expectation is to have a team that can win podiums and races in the first year, then yes, Andretti won't be ready. But that's an absurd requirement that's never been put on any new team in history. On the new car for 2026, well, no team is allowed to work on their 2026 cars until the start of 2025 anyway, so that doesn't really make a difference. What FOM wants is GM and for any new team that comes in to have to pay an anti-dilution fee closer to the currently lowest valued team (which is Williams at $725M). And that fee can't increase from the current $200M until 2026. To let a new team in for $200M could have a negative impact on current teams valuations. It's very short sighted, but that's the driving motivation.
Haas, Williams and Alpha have not been competitive for years. The claim that FOM cares about a team not being competitive is ridiculous. They couldn't care less if a team can't compete. In fact, they love that because it makes life easier for the top teams who actually matter.
Imma just call this as Indygate but built different.
If Indygate was how F1 died in America, this is overkill.
Everyone keeps pointing to buying an existing team and getting on with it.
Andretti does have some very wealthy and powerful partners, but instead of spending a billion dollars on an existing team they could just buy a billion dollars worth of Liberty stock and basically force them to approve them.
The problem is you have to have someone who wants to sell at a non insane price. Paying 200m was a far cheaper option.
They already tried buying out Sauber. The deal fell through when the Sauber CEO realized Andretti planned to can the whole Hinwil factory and relocate everything to the US, aka a lot of people would be fired.
The only possible buys are Haas or Alfa Tauri (whatever, the Minardi one). No one else is selling to them.
This is ridiculous from FOM, Andretti should be taking them to court.
They're also pulling a delaying tactic, until the Concord Agreement is renewed with a much larger new-team entry fee requirement. That would make it financially impossible for any new team to join. So they stay at 10 teams for the foreseeable future.
It's a good business model they created withe the cost cap in term of spending less and still rake in the profit. Though it stale the competition when you isolate yourself, but it's alright for them as long as they control the gate and penalize the new competitor, just keep changing the labels for the existing teams. To keep the viewership up, it is required to continue to make it social media relevant with shows and generated drama. Once it is looking like it is no longer profitable, sell it at an inflated price before the on paper value reflected it.
Aiden and Rocketpoweredmohawk provide me with all the F1 analysis I need. 👍
I was waiting for this
F1 basically found a way to come up with dozens of lots of weak arguments on why they consider Andretti not fit to compete in F1, instead a single convincing argument. Quite an invitation to be taken to court, as far as I am concerned.
That will also ensure he will never ever join F1.
@@kicapanmanis1060 I wouldn't be surprised if that was the intention: Make them sue, so that they cam be blamed with having dug their own grave.
unlikely. It will DELAY him entering F1 and deter anyone else from trying. I don't think any of FOM's arguments are likely to hold up in court as they are easily dismissed by thinking about them for a minute.
Another excellent and entertaining read on F1 current affairs. KUTGW.
If HAAS is considered “competitive” I don’t see any way as Andretti could be any worse than them.
Great show
WWF1 is absolute gold
funny, last time I watched IndyCar it was a messed race start, not too much happened mid race and of the cars owned by Chip Ganassi winning on fuel strategy
The statement saying "To add value to the championship, they would need to be immediately competing for race wins and podiums" while also saying "If Andretti debued with engines from GM day 1 would add credibility to the team" are so polaraly opposite it warrents scrutiny from all F1 fans. FOM can't just say "we need you to win day 1, oh, and it needs to be with brand new, non-race-tested engines." The contradiction basicslly just communicates FOM doesnt want anyone new in F1, and they are insulted they even have to have a meeting about this. I can certainly say as an F1 fan I feel insulted on behalf of Andretti. Not a great look to just throw a huge grab bag of contradicting nonsense reasons to deny one of the biggest names in motorsport from entering your championship.
Excellent analysis!
None of the teams can start any design work on the '26 cars until 1st Jan 2025 anyway so it's not like Andretti would be disadvantaged in that respect.
That could be the case, but FOM is suggesting that they reapply for 2028, not 2026. By then, the teams would have two years' worth of development on their established direction, which would put them behind the curve.
Somehow I forgot about you for the past couple months. The new studio looks great
The best comparison I can think of with this is Great Leighs Racecourse in Essex. The authorities went, 'No, try again next year' then 'No, try again next year', then 'Oh, go on then' and it was absolutely fine. Big fields, good prize money, future development plans. You just wonder why the powers that be faffed around so much.
I think the idea behind joining the year before the new ruleset starts is to have a low pressure year where the team can gather track experience and operational data on what works and what doesn’t so the team is in a rhythm when they start with the new car on even footing with the rest of the teams.
No thoughts to share on this issue but I just want to say your camera and set has come a long way. Great work!
This room is a million times better.
Half a billion dollar entree fee is ridiculous
Haas built an F1 car in their first season that was competitive and then binned it as the regulations changed as they expected. Not a peep from anyone. Recently they’ve not really bothered, also not a peep from anyone in FOM. Everyone thinks that Haas is hanging on at the back for a new concord agreement to flip its team for $500m, not a peep from FOM …
Haas entered when Bernie was in charge. Things have changed since then.
Bernie’s rules were a lot different and he’d probably have said yes.
Lol. And people hated Bernie and Max Mosley.
Grass isn't always greener....
Makes you wonder how in the 80s & 90s F1 had 22-26 teams, 2 & 3 T cars plus race cars each weekend, smaller & less modern facilities at circuits, in some cases more staff per team..
Doesn't bother me tbh about Andretti, the grid has been this size for a while now, and the raft of scandal and change ive seen in 30 years of following F1 this is just another thing that will come and go and probably come again.
I bet many long term established F1 fans would agree and im sure more Non-Americans dont really care.
This seems like the Netflix generation of F1 fans getting triggered.
I feel its more so the teams especially the lower half who didn't want Andretti, I also think that f1 and them are closer than ever and if were honest or realistic rather Andretii probably beats at least 3 or 4 teams just by being competent.
I can't help feeling that Liberty are trying to force Andretti to buy an existing team. People will point to Gene Haas as someone they might want out of the sport but the Racing Bulls/Red Bulls connection & Alpha Tauri's refusal to race Red Bull cars is another issue. Andretti taking over one of these teams would solve a lot of problems for Liberty. Then, there's always the question of how long until Renault get bored again & unexpectedly thrown Alpine on the market?
TLDR: we like money and we don't want anyone taking our money
90% of the stuff that has been said by the F1 CRH is just excuses to avoid sharing the money
With repeatedly being reminded Haas is not a rich team, I wouldn't be amazed if Andretti buys the team out instead of going the 11th team route
Haas won’t sell to Andretti.
Tha is for talking about this while everyone is on the Hamilton news it’s a huge deal
I'm not a nascar fan but I have to tip my hat too them for always welcoming any f1 drivers who want to
try out some nascar racing. Look at how they treated Kimi Raikkonen. They all showed nothing but the upmost respect too him.Seems like everyone in nascar were very honored to have him there.
Absolutely agree. Now we have Shane Van Gisbergen (Aussie V8 Supercars Champ) trying out for the feeder NASCAR Series.
So Liberty want them to be instantly competitive and getting podiums, but they also want them to come in with a new engine supplier with no F1 engine building experience and they're not happy with them using customer engines like Williams, McLaren, Red Bull and Haas do, and they want to extend their reach in the USA but are happy to discourage an American manufacturer, and they want more manufacturers but not like this.
Man, Bernie would have been on this like a rat on a potato.
Us european fans want to see Andretti compete! How can you say Andretti Cadillac won't be competitive? Have you seen Cadillac chasing Porsche across the line in Daytona last weekend? Pinnacle of Motorsport? Or just club racing?
All the big teams fret over what they're going to do with their academy drivers. There's the opportunity for two seats. "Oh no! We can't have that!"
Liberty/FOM is rolling in it. They're paying for Miami and Las Vegas, two cities who don't need the money (particularly the latter). They should make up the "shortfall" in winnings - they'll barely notice it.
Ferrari didn't veto it???!!!?? 😮
I blame Roberto Moreno.
Maybe Andretti says OK, to a 2028 start. By end of 2025, Gene might be ready to sell Haas.
Most of the reasonings behind rejection are largely gatekeeping, plain and simple
It is. And there's nothing wrong with that.
Only about 3.5k to go…
3.5k til I pull off the greatest troll in history.
@@AidanMillwardcome on…you’ll probably loose all your subs if that happens
@@AidanMillwarda vid on Roberto…Alomar
@@mrterp04that would be awesome
@AidenMillward the way you rounded out this video was more or less my thoughts on the matter when I heard about it two days back.
But does make me wonder if there is a bigger picture that we are not seeing? Just a bit of food for thought?
Apparently, Alpine with their major mal-misorganisation and absolute piece of s*** car this season brings more value to the sport
“Contactless payment F1” 😂
they denied them now that way in the future they will be more popular and have more hype surrounding them. imagine what 2 years of media build up will do for both parties.
You can’t say stake in a f1 video
$500 mill? Taking the piss.
F1 found a way to get IndyCar, NASCAR, IMSA, and NHRA fans all on the same side with this one...
F1 have absolutely no interest in letting anybody in. They were literally inventing criteria to throw the bid out. F1 is a closed shop, they should just be upfront about it, i.e. refuse to take any bids. Andretti have clearly spent a lot of money on the bid when in reality they had absolutely no possibility of it working out favourably regardless of what it did.
Its completely disingenuous as a process.
The shame of it is that there are 3 teams in f1 who have no interest in being in f1 and are phoning it in.
Well they'll definitely be fighting this out in court
FOM and FIA are like my boss...if its not their idea...its not any good
26 cars is allowed, we should have 26 car grids. Easy as
Its like a circular email went around Domenicali’s staff office asking for reasons to deny Andretti on every category, instead of 2 or 3 legally water-tight arguments. Their bid is well over what would has always been expected of a new team in the past and the “offer” of come back in 2028 (when we can charge you double) is a just a sugar covered stick to ward off any legal action. This document looks like it was drawn up by interns though, so I expect it would likely burn in court. And when you look at Domenincali’s multi-decade association with John Elkann, the Chief of brands like Chrysler, Dodge and Jeep who also happens to have inherited Ferrari and has been personally credited by Sky with signing Hamilton, its no surprise that the Andretti document has being waiting around for a convenient slot to dump it into the media, say 18hrs before Hamilton’s move to Ferrari is announced? Liberty better hope no-one in FOM did any share trading this month, because that red hot commercially sensitive news has been all over that office network for at least this week. Karthikeyan tried to tell a joke about that on Sky’s Hamilton livestream and got shut down in an instant. Their coverage on Andretti is bad. Someone has had words via the managerial structures, about protecting their exclusive rights by being supportive to the sport. It really shows when you do a lot of live coverage.
I think F1 could have a serious anti trust problem over this. The problem is they keep changing the rules. Andretti meets every standard they have set. In response, they just pretend he doesn't or change the standards. That is called a cartel. If I were Andretti, I would sue. If nothing else, the discovery would be lit. F1 is so arrogant and out of touch, I bet there are some wonderfully appalling and embarrassing things to be found in discovery.
As someone who has worked in live sports broadcasting, it is not a walk in the park, you don't just get to sit and watch the sport you enjoy. You're literally just travelling between different TV compounds throughout the world, putting in long day-long shifts for an entire week, just to travel somewhere else the next week to do the exact same thing again.
If you enjoy a sport, don't work in it, you won't enjoy it anymore.
Leaves the same bad taste as the "big" (football) clubs trying to form an protected European super league
How about 12 teams, 24 races, with each time only competing in 20 of the races - i.e. each team randomly assigned which 4 races they miss each year
This was an excellent thing on a very interesting thing.
Its too bad that the FIA cant put pressure or even force F1 to do anything. It feels like the FIA should have more power than they do.
The FIA should've never allowed F1 to become a separate entity.
It's reasonable to include a commercial assessment but that should probably be a part of the FIA approval process.