Thank you! It's a great show, and very strong on vintage, and even though it isn't big it's a good size, especially if it's your first pen show. I had my own small pop up pen show last year with a lot of the same sellers and all few others, and I'm planning on doing it again next year in western Massachusetts.
@@davelindomusic2207 here's hoping you'll be able to come! You got a Waterman's #7 Red at the show? Nice find! Is it the first generation ripple hard rubber or the second generation black celluloid one? I got one a couple of years ago at the same show, and it's a first year in perfect condition. I made a video about it, too. It's here on UA-cam.
@@singlesideman it's a first generation ripple with the white bands. It needed some cleaning but I got it going pretty well. The nib is a little wrinkled but I'm gonna send it to Greg minuskin to straighten it out. I'm gonna check your vid now!
@@davelindomusic2207 that's a great pen. Nice. Mine is the first year without the white bands. It has a really flexible and elastic nib. You just got yours at the Commonwealth Pen Show? How's the nib? Red nibs can be as soft and flexible as a Pink, and others not as much, although still quite soft and flexible.
ive got a new york nib almost exactly like that one on the first pen, maybe a tad bit narrower. just simply lovely to write with all bouncy-like. i also really like those early sheaffer's. everyone knows sheaffer for their stiff nibs but their early pens were just as capable as any. i'd like to know when and why exactly they switched to almost exclusively nails, only very rarely doing flexible nibs.
New York Waterman's nibs, and their nibs generally from the 1940s a earlier, but especially from the 1920s and earlier, are really wonderful and all over the place in terms of the kinds of lines they make. They're extraordinary, and each has its own character. Their earlier ones are even more incredible, like the one in my circa 1908 Waterman's 412 Filigree. It's just amazing.
Sheaffer had made tough manifold nibs since the beginning of the company in 1913. Manifold nibs were made for using carbon paper which would make many fold copies, meaning multiple copies. In order to make copies with carbon paper a good deal of pressure needs to be used when writing, so using a fountain pen to make carbon copies would require using a nib that is very stiff and tough. These nibs were considered premium nibs and were costlier than thinner flexible nibs, not least because they were made of considerably thicker gold. Sheaffer made and offered in their catalogs many different types of nibs at that time, just like pretty much every other fountain pen company of the day. In 1923 Sheaffer was only ten years old, one of the newest fountain pen companies in an enormous and hugely competitive market, and in order to distinguish themselves and be more competitive they decided to create a new pen with a lifetime warranty called the Lifetime pen. They charged a lot of money for it, $7 (which was like $132 in 2024 dollars, but because the fountain pen market is so small today the same pen would probably sell for at least twice as much), and in order to justify that high price and to make sure that the company wouldn't go broke replacing damaged nibs under warranty they made the pens out of celluloid instead of black hard rubber, which is more brittle than celluloid (they were the first major company to do so - LeBoeuf had done it earlier, but they were a small, though very innovative company) and they used extremely tough manifold nibs. These new Lifetime pens, while expensive, were hugely successful, outselling their competitors. Customers loved these exciting new bright jade green plastic pens that weren't the "old, boring black hard rubber". They were a big hit, so other companies, notably Parker, would follow suit the following year with their new celluloid pen, the Black Tipped Jade, which was essentially their flagship Duofold pen, but without the Duofold name because they weren't sure if the new material would be durable enough, and they didn't want to give their flagship pen a bad name, so they waited a year before calling it a Duofold. This new celluloid pen proved to be hugely successful as well, so all the pen companies jumped on the celluloid bandwagon and made more expensive pens with warranties and tough manifold nibs so that the companies wouldn't lose money by having to replace thick gold nibs for free, and then Parker made different colors, and other companies followed suit, and the rest is history. Customers wanted fun, bright new colors and patterns in pens that were tough and durable, and pen companies were all too happy to accommodate them, but Waterman's was still doing well with sales of their mottled hard rubber pens, and they introduced their ripple pattern in late 1924 to keep up with the competition, but customers ultimately preferred the bright, deep and varied colors of the new celluloid pens, so Waterman's ultimately came out with the big, expensive Patrician in 1929, but then the stock market crashed, and Waterman's began to slip in popularity, and the other companies gained the market share that Waterman's lost, leading to their becoming troubled financially, and their French subsidiary, Waterman JIF, which had been doing well, ultimately bought them out some time in the 1940s, I believe.
This type of Waterman was available in India during British rule. Now a days, we get Waterman from France. Modern Waterman don't write like old Waterman.
Waterman was a US company founded in 1883. They had manufacturing facilities in the US, Canada, England and France, and they made pens in the US for the Canadian, English and French markets. The pen in the video is an American Waterman's 52 from the late 1920s. Beginning in the late 1920s Waterman's market share declined with the popularity of the bright new colors of celluloid pens from Sheaffer and Parker, and smaller companies, and Waterman didn't make celluloid pens until they introduced the Patrician in 1929, but by then Sheaffer had been making celluloid pens for five years, and Parker for three years, and the companies that had already been making celluloid pens had captured the majority of market share, and Waterman was losing their market dominance. They kept losing market share and never caught up, and by the 1940s were doing so badly that their French subsidiary, Waterman JIF, who were doing quite well as a company, bought out the parent company.
Thanks, Todd!
@@howardcunix8677 thank you so much! It was a great show, and I was really happy with the pens I found.
Beautiful pens, Todd!!!
Thank you so much! I was very, very happy to have found them.
Very cool! I was there too. My first pen show!
Thank you! It's a great show, and very strong on vintage, and even though it isn't big it's a good size, especially if it's your first pen show. I had my own small pop up pen show last year with a lot of the same sellers and all few others, and I'm planning on doing it again next year in western Massachusetts.
Nice! Well hopefully I can go! I picked up a #7 with a Red nib. Very satisfied with it!
@@davelindomusic2207 here's hoping you'll be able to come! You got a Waterman's #7 Red at the show? Nice find! Is it the first generation ripple hard rubber or the second generation black celluloid one? I got one a couple of years ago at the same show, and it's a first year in perfect condition. I made a video about it, too. It's here on UA-cam.
@@singlesideman it's a first generation ripple with the white bands. It needed some cleaning but I got it going pretty well. The nib is a little wrinkled but I'm gonna send it to Greg minuskin to straighten it out. I'm gonna check your vid now!
@@davelindomusic2207 that's a great pen. Nice. Mine is the first year without the white bands. It has a really flexible and elastic nib. You just got yours at the Commonwealth Pen Show? How's the nib? Red nibs can be as soft and flexible as a Pink, and others not as much, although still quite soft and flexible.
ive got a new york nib almost exactly like that one on the first pen, maybe a tad bit narrower. just simply lovely to write with all bouncy-like.
i also really like those early sheaffer's. everyone knows sheaffer for their stiff nibs but their early pens were just as capable as any. i'd like to know when and why exactly they switched to almost exclusively nails, only very rarely doing flexible nibs.
New York Waterman's nibs, and their nibs generally from the 1940s a earlier, but especially from the 1920s and earlier, are really wonderful and all over the place in terms of the kinds of lines they make. They're extraordinary, and each has its own character. Their earlier ones are even more incredible, like the one in my circa 1908 Waterman's 412 Filigree. It's just amazing.
Sheaffer had made tough manifold nibs since the beginning of the company in 1913. Manifold nibs were made for using carbon paper which would make many fold copies, meaning multiple copies. In order to make copies with carbon paper a good deal of pressure needs to be used when writing, so using a fountain pen to make carbon copies would require using a nib that is very stiff and tough. These nibs were considered premium nibs and were costlier than thinner flexible nibs, not least because they were made of considerably thicker gold. Sheaffer made and offered in their catalogs many different types of nibs at that time, just like pretty much every other fountain pen company of the day. In 1923 Sheaffer was only ten years old, one of the newest fountain pen companies in an enormous and hugely competitive market, and in order to distinguish themselves and be more competitive they decided to create a new pen with a lifetime warranty called the Lifetime pen. They charged a lot of money for it, $7 (which was like $132 in 2024 dollars, but because the fountain pen market is so small today the same pen would probably sell for at least twice as much), and in order to justify that high price and to make sure that the company wouldn't go broke replacing damaged nibs under warranty they made the pens out of celluloid instead of black hard rubber, which is more brittle than celluloid (they were the first major company to do so - LeBoeuf had done it earlier, but they were a small, though very innovative company) and they used extremely tough manifold nibs. These new Lifetime pens, while expensive, were hugely successful, outselling their competitors. Customers loved these exciting new bright jade green plastic pens that weren't the "old, boring black hard rubber". They were a big hit, so other companies, notably Parker, would follow suit the following year with their new celluloid pen, the Black Tipped Jade, which was essentially their flagship Duofold pen, but without the Duofold name because they weren't sure if the new material would be durable enough, and they didn't want to give their flagship pen a bad name, so they waited a year before calling it a Duofold. This new celluloid pen proved to be hugely successful as well, so all the pen companies jumped on the celluloid bandwagon and made more expensive pens with warranties and tough manifold nibs so that the companies wouldn't lose money by having to replace thick gold nibs for free, and then Parker made different colors, and other companies followed suit, and the rest is history. Customers wanted fun, bright new colors and patterns in pens that were tough and durable, and pen companies were all too happy to accommodate them, but Waterman's was still doing well with sales of their mottled hard rubber pens, and they introduced their ripple pattern in late 1924 to keep up with the competition, but customers ultimately preferred the bright, deep and varied colors of the new celluloid pens, so Waterman's ultimately came out with the big, expensive Patrician in 1929, but then the stock market crashed, and Waterman's began to slip in popularity, and the other companies gained the market share that Waterman's lost, leading to their becoming troubled financially, and their French subsidiary, Waterman JIF, which had been doing well, ultimately bought them out some time in the 1940s, I believe.
This type of Waterman was available in India during British rule. Now a days, we get Waterman from France. Modern Waterman don't write like old Waterman.
Waterman was a US company founded in 1883. They had manufacturing facilities in the US, Canada, England and France, and they made pens in the US for the Canadian, English and French markets. The pen in the video is an American Waterman's 52 from the late 1920s. Beginning in the late 1920s Waterman's market share declined with the popularity of the bright new colors of celluloid pens from Sheaffer and Parker, and smaller companies, and Waterman didn't make celluloid pens until they introduced the Patrician in 1929, but by then Sheaffer had been making celluloid pens for five years, and Parker for three years, and the companies that had already been making celluloid pens had captured the majority of market share, and Waterman was losing their market dominance. They kept losing market share and never caught up, and by the 1940s were doing so badly that their French subsidiary, Waterman JIF, who were doing quite well as a company, bought out the parent company.
As for modern Waterman not writing like vintage American Waterman's, that's true of pretty much all fountain pen companies.