Mud After Rapture, Jamie Wheal in dialogue with Tim Adalin

Jamie Wheal is a writer and cofounder of the Flow Genome Project. He’s the author of 'Recapture the Rapture: Rethinking God, Sex, and Death in a World That's Lost Its Mind', and a guide to leaders across many domains of high service and performance.
This dialogue sought in part to relate with the questions and tensions at the forefront of Jamie’s thinking, three years post the publishing of Recapture The Rapture. It found some footing in the mud of uncertainty between the desire to democratise transcendence, and the reality of life-death process as epitomised by narratives of exodus.
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[@O.G.Rose.Michelle.and.Daniel]

This was a fascinating discussion, and I'll have to read Mr. Wheal's books. I appreciate the emphasize on the problem of scale, the generational differences, the tensions between trying to do something and being a realist, and more. I felt all of that was really well spoken to and not evaded. This is what really needs to be focused on and discussed. It's the "Hard Problem," we might say. Thank you both!

[@Voicecraft]

Thanks for your reflections O.G.!

[@MiraMyo]

He’s amazing. One of the leading thinkers of our time lifting to a higher octave, a sweeter tone…along with Dr. Joe Dispenza and many others.
Thank you!!!

[@aspasiakarageorge7820]

Excited to listen to this one, Tim! Love the 8:30 mark: "you have to do a fuck ton of setup to get to a remotely interesting point". Amen.

[@andrearobinson7526]

Thank you both. An interesting roller-coaster of sorts, both sobering realism, and Tim asking the 'yeah, and how do we...?' is like another part of the ride. Asking high-level 'what' and 'how' questions are often just a mirror for inquiry on the ground floor @ the local level. This talk brought me into the earth, then out into objectivity, then back. Afterwards, I sat in a sauna and a thought I had was that the 'intelligence' we yearn for comes from some other areas. For example, if Jamie was the 'mind' and Tim was 'the heart' maybe a 3rd person, like an older woman would be the deep belly. The 3rd realm of intelligence. Then also is the non-verbal elements which also have something to 'say' (as in a redwood tree or a creek). At the heart, are 2 beautiful men having this hard yet honest dialog, and the opportunity for humility or the great unknown to be acknowledged along with all the data points. We're going to have to stretch and straddle both taoist-like humility & participatory leadership, even while stumbling our way back 'home'. I love the term 'back to basics' and yet the world has flipped, so maybe now it's 'forward to basics'. Biomimesis brings guidance, if we can agree to get 'out of the way'. Finding a common language will ultimately be beyond 'words' and beyond neuro-typical a+b=c linear limitations imo.

[@Voicecraft]

Thank you for your reflections Andrea. I have been appreciating your comments and the perception they've shown me.

[@r.shanejenkins4399]

The instinct to survive and protect our children is good and it is also good to sacrifice of ourselves and our future for each other as one. The temporal tensions/conflicts between the two remains impossible to resolve without submission/trust/faith in a mutually acknowledged authority. No man is worthy or able to carry the weight of that authority. Where oh where might we find the way to the perfect Love, Truth, and Beauty on which all creation has always depended. ✝️

[@Voicecraft]

A deep tension present in this for sure. Thank you for laying it out.

[@markkuykendall5475]

I've been paying attention to Jamie Wheal for a few years now. Him, along with several other of the more well known "Liminal Web" people. I've seen several of them become less positive over time. Listening to homie, here, talk about his broken heart and his feeling that we're basically fucked is murderous for me.
I WANT and NEED a bright future. My heart beats for expanding cirlces of tolerance, cosmopolitanism, and compassion for people. I want all the "weirdos," no matter how "weird" or "gross" or frightening they might be, to be able to live with dignity and freedom and opportunity, real opportunity for happiness and community.
I hunger and dream of either "Fully Automated Luxury Space Communism" or "Fully Automated Luxury Space Reformed and Gelded Capitalism," I'll take either one provided even the smallest and weakest of us all have enough and don't have to live in fear.
We are made of star stuff; we belong among the stars, goddamnit!
Listening to this was horrible. It was so very depressing.

[@TennesseeJed]

I really like Jamie! Trippin' dead fan too!

[@shawnewaltonify]

Personally, I do not stop listening and reading even when i can detect a belief by the author in the exodus of a small few. If you did that, then you would not be able to build a vision of the world that includes people who identify as Muslim, because their prophet Muhammad once said that all people in the world would one day become Muslim. Any historian worth their salt can reinterpret scripture in order to remove contradictions between prophets and events. If you can help people who are Muslim by seeing how it is possible that one day everyone on earth will believe in the same thing that Muslims and the members of all other religions believe in, then you can help Jamie with this too. Basically, everyone is forced into either having a belief in a small few who form the future, or having to suspend judgement on this topic because there is no true story of human evolution yet. Until now, the story of human evolution has been a story about "Exodus." We made a major step recently by discovering DNA and selfish gene theory and we are still adjusting to the impact of it on our narrative we have for ourselves in the future, but it is time that we look to scientists for a multi-level theory of evolution that gives us a narrative about desirable traits and how everyone can select them in a way that is not limited to the exodus of a small few. The answer is genetics and evolutionary biology and we are waiting patiently for the true story of life that we so desperately need to get out of this division into groups.

[@chipsellarole267]

This interviewer is so hard to comprehend. The rambling cliche’s and pop words make it hard to see his point clearly.