Initial review. Canon TC-20 M printer 24" roll paper printer. Pigment ink Sheet feed and scanner
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- Опубліковано 28 вер 2024
- Initial review of the Canon TC-20 M roll paper printer. 24" width with sheet feed [A3 max] and built in A4 scanner. CMYK pigment ink tank printer. AMA. Questions welcome for full testing and detailed review.
It's an office printer, but how well can it print? Are just four inks enough for photo printing.
Canon TC-20 M printer specifications are at:
www.canon.co.u...
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I look forward to your more detailed thoughts. First, this appears to be suitable for certain small businesses, restaurants, libraries, and other entities like schools. Here in the US, Amazon cites it as a poster printer. I see that it uses an MC-32 maintenance cartridge, selling for $50 (ouch!). I could not find data on how many ml of ink it holds. In line with that, perhaps you could take a stab at how much ink goes to paper vs. the MC-32 cartridge. Moreover, it would be nice to know the ml of ink used on paper per sq. inch. 😊
Thanks - I'll try and get some info - however I didn't set the printer up and I print a very wide range of stuff, which makes reliable usage data tricky.
Great to see them innovating in completely new printers! *How about a larger than the Pro-200, 13" dye ink printer, Canon, please?!* Incredibly small, but 2 inch rolls are a big disadvantage, like you say for paper choices and also increased curl. But the fact that it's this small and accepts roll paper is a breakthrough!
Since the cartridges seem small enough, do the ink cartridges ride on the print heads? I read this is an advantage with the Pro-200, so lines aren't needed. Could reduce clogging problems, perhaps?
Since Epson's sublimation dye ink printer (for printing metal) also has only four inks, perhaps the color gamut is similar, and will not produce vivid greens and oranges, and maybe purples too (for flowers)?
A 12 or more ink version that could use 3 inch roll paper could be perfect for those who don't print a lot, but would like to print 24 inch fine art prints, and maybe have less clogging problems with these smaller cartridges on the print head, if that's the case and true?
I'd like to get a 44 inch someday. Could they do this in 44 inch with 12 or more inks?
Ink cartridges this small wouldn't be practical for printing in volume, but could be perfect for those who only print big occasionally.
The ink in big ink cartridges can go bad over time if not used too, and they're so expensive as a set.
Smaller ink cartridges could be more practical for the hobby printer.
Nice to see Canon pushing the envelope.
It's an ink tank printer - those are bottles in the the boxes [70ml]
Canon do some papers with 2" cores as do others. You'll need to look it up though, they vary by region.
I just picked up the Lustre 250 I used in my recent P8500 testing, to have a try with.
What you want isn't coming anytime soon - hits the big printer market too much
What you describe would be like the PRO-2100...
with some measurements i could easily 3d print you some adapters for any core size
Thanks - I've suggested this in the [written] review I've just finished writing - however, it's not my printer, so it is off back to Canon soon...
@@KeithCooper I'm thinking about getting this printer to use as a dye sublimation printer. The model without the scan bed is quite a bit cheaper. Do you overall like the printer? I need a printer that can take roll media and uses an ink tank system. It seemed like a good fit.
Sounds like it might - with the important proviso that I've never used dye-sub inks!
Hi! Can you review HP DesignJet T210 if you can please?? Thank you!
Not unless someone can get HP to lend me one... I'm not on their Christmas card list I'm afraid.
I cannot afford to buy stuff just to test :-(
Is it possible to insert a 280-gram canvas into this printer and print on the canvas?
It is not specifically supported. It should print if you can get it onto a 2″ core and it’s not too thick. I didn’t have any available to test this though. I’d suspect the cutter is not up to regular cutting of canvas though. I’ve seen several printers with paper cutters warn against cutting canvas, since it dulls the blade and the additional cutting force can damage the blade transport mechanism.
As mentioned in the main review...
www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-tc-20m-printer-review/
I had the same problem of 3in core tube as I use to print Hanemuhle and Canson paper. So I asked a vendor to produce a 3D print support that enlarge from 2in to 3in. I have the project here, if you like I can sent it by email to you and you can ask some vendor in your city that prints in 3D for you.
Excellent - Thanks
It's not my printer though, so it goes back to Canon at some point
I'd be happy to include the info in the main review when it's done, if you like? [email me at Northlight Images?]
Sounds great.@@KeithCooper
Keith, Does Canon make various roll papers to fit the 2” inch roll adapter? John H.
Yes, but you'll need to check their site for what's available where.
Im completely new. How on earth do I print my wrapping paper? What software do I use?
I took a repeating pattern and tiled it in photoshop to create a 24" x 36" image - then I printed it normally as with any other document
Hey Keith, I find photoshops print setting are very limited. It’s not even giving me an option to print A1. Is it different for you?
A custom paper size for the document and when printing
See the actual review
www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-tc-20m-printer-review/
Thanks. Some things help there thanks. But I’m still getting limited options in print settings for PS.
I world like to make fine art print of illustrazioni it will ne ok with this?
Sorry? Of what?
@@KeithCooper I’m so sorry my italian t9 changes my words. I would like to know if you think that this print is fine to make fine Art print of illustrations, because the ink is pigmented. Thank you
Yes, within the limits of just four inks
See the written review for more about what papers I tested the printer with...
www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-tc-20m-printer-review/
@@KeithCooper thank you so much, you are the best 🌸
Can it handle a 20" paper roll?
It's not clear...
The specs say: Roll paper : A3, A2, A2+, A1, B2, B3, 18'', 24'', 17''
So, no 13" [A3+] , but B2 is 19.7 inch and B3 is 13.9"
The lack of a solid adjustable spindle is a downside with this printer, as is the forced use of 2" cores
I just got this printer, and I’ve probably tried for 4 hours just to get plain paper roll to take in the feeder and keep getting code 1300 for paper jam I make sure the paper is cut straight and I feed it slowly and still won’t take
I WILL NEVER SUGGEST THIS PRINTER TO ANYONE THIS IS RIDICULOUS
If anyone can help me please, THANKS!
Have you read my actual review?
www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-tc-20m-printer-review/
Yes!
I noticed that some roll papers needed distinct de-curling before they would feed.
Is sheet paper working OK
If it helps anyone: I have a roll feed laminator that only has attachments for 1inch or 3inch rolls of laminate. However the laminate I needed to use with it, comes on a 2inch core. I found a local person with a 3D printer, and paid him to analyse the pieces and design and then 3D print an attachment piece and it solved the problem. I wonder if the same could be done for this printer.
Yes - a good idea - I've looked at what's needed and that would likely work.
You just need to make sure the rolls are not too wide once mounted.
i just got this printer...and yes...having a really hard time finding a 2 inch roll paper to print my art ....
i would like to see more detailed revew as to printing on Canson aquarelle paper sheets as it is the paper i use most...that would be wonderful...as i print watercolor prints not photography.
Thank you so much...i love all your revews!👍🙏
Thanks
I don't have any such paper, and the only stuff I have, an HP 'aquarelle', is a3+
Just make sure it's an inkjet paper - it prints a 310gsm cotton rag just fine [with custom profile]
How many 24x36" prints of full coverage photographs could be made with 70ml ink bottles?
I couldn't say - my testing is far too varied to get any meaningful information about this. Quite a few...
How many pages can you print with one set of ink? Can you write the size and quantity of paper you used?
No idea I'm afraid - the printer was lent to me by Canon, already initialised, so I've no way of knowing this
I am waiting for this printer with your full review, thank you 😊🙏👍
Thanks - just making some icc profiles today...
Hi, do you have an idea of how many prints you can typically get in A3 format (approximately) with the initial set of cartridges?
Sorry - no. The printer was lent to me already iniitialised
I feel bad for people that purchase this printer, 2" core is so limiting to the number of products that can be used. Always do your research, I sell media for a living, and customers do not take into consideration what printer they decide on, to the types of printing they want to do.
Yes, I'm just finishing the main written review for the TC-20M and I have a very important 'check this first' section.
That and the lack of borderless will thwart some.
However, there are media available if you search for them [I'm in Leicester in the UK - no idea about overseas]
The 2" core limit can be dealt with if you are of a practical bent... irksome but not insurmountable.
Black and white quality
An admirable hope... ;-)
I'm not expecting too much, given the four inks, butI'm running some tests on this with my profiling today
Hi Keith is the canon TC-20 the same as the TC-20m but with out the scanner ?
I don't know for sure - I've only the Canon specs to compare.
ok thanks, there is one local to me chip as chips as the printer was bought for a project which never happened. @@KeithCooper
yes
By "A3" sheets you mean not even "A3+" (13x19"?). Thank you in advance
Precisely...
I wanted to make sure people didn't think they were getting more than the printer offers.
Hey Keith, can this printer take single sheets of A1 / A2 paper?
No - A3 maximum. 24" is roll only
Hi Keith, been following your channel for a long time now. Great videos. I want to point out, it appears that Canon is marketing this printer (plotter) to architects/engineers/designers, and it also appears to be a direct competitor to the HP DesignJet line of desktop plotters. The 4-color system is perfectly adequate for line drawings and presentation-type prints. Maybe you could mention this in the long-form review. Just my two cents. Thanks for all you do!
Also, HP has a long list of specialty papers on 2" cores for printing posters, banners, etc. Coated bonds, vellums, films, etc. that look great for graphics work.
One more edit, I'm not promoting HP, I'm just noting for the community that there are paper options on 2" cores from HP. Based on my experience with HP plotters over the years. I do not know what Canon is offering in that regard.
Thanks
Yes I will mention what markets it's aimed at.
I'll also be giving the Canon Poster software a go.
My main testing though is to see how far I can push photo printing - I've no testing experience with CAD applications and the like, so have nothing to compare it with for speed etc.
Canon does have quite a few papers - I'll see what they send me ;-)
[I cannot afford to buy stuff for testing like this]
Thank you for taking your time to review! I just bought this printer and I’m having a hard time finding information about printing capability(card stock and what not)
Glad it was helpful! Email me at Northlight Images if you've any specific questions? I've got it here for about a month
Is it possible to use single sheets of large sizes such as A1?
No - sheet feeding is physically limited to A3
It's possible you might be able to fool it, but what happens with the trailing edge border would be unpredictable.
Hi Keith, thanks for the video. 2 questions, are you able to do double sided prints? And are you able to print on heat transfer DTF paper? Thanks
DS - only by reversing the sheet paper. No idea how this will succeed though.
I'm afraid I've never seen or used DTF paper, so I don't know at all...
@@KeithCooper Thanks for your response, DTF paper is a heat transfer paper for transferring images to material.
Thanks - no-one has ever sent me any to try ;-)
I can't afford to buy most of the stuff I test - paper stocks have built up over many years of testing, but no-one I deal with uses or supplies DTF@@doombxny
I assume you've amassed quite the collection of large format printers by now, do you keep them all running on a schedule to avoid ink dry-out?
Ah...
You make erroneous assumptions about the size of my house, my wealth and the patience of my wife [the other half of Northlight Images] ;-)
Almost all just loans - no way could I afford otherwise. They are allowed if they come with a return by date...
I have a weekly reminder pop up in the diary to turn any big printers on
@@KeithCooper Thanks, I don't doubt that you could manage it all though! With the number of videos you put out, I struggle to keep up lol.
Thanks - the videos are partly because I've managed to make the production process quite rapid. That and I get a steady stream of emails asking me questions. If the reply runs to a second paragraph I note it down as an outline for a short video ;-)
Can you print vinyl with it?
Probably not - not unless you can find one where the ink will dry properly.
Very interested to hear all about this printer.
I'll be reporting my testing...
Thanks for the info, would love more details on where you think the gamut is.
Thanks - Not quite sure however what you mean by 'where' in this instance?
I'll have some photo printing ICC profiles available for people to test when I've done the review. So far I've a 250gsm Lustre, a 310gsm rag art paper and have just done a 115gsm polyprop 'water resistant' synthetic paper. Tomorrow I'm washing some prints... ;-)
@@KeithCooperSorry, I should have been more clear. I meant where the gamut falls short compared to printers with more inks. Thanks!
ah - it's not really like that, the gamut is often reduced with fewer inks, but print quality includes all of what's inside the gamut of a paper/ink/printer combination, not just its boundary.
Evaluating print quality by gamut is akin to evaluating a car just by maximum speed.
This is one reason I absolutely never give 'gamut volumes' or any similar data in printer/paper reviews. It's the distinction between data and information which is often missed.
I'll see if I can put together some more info as to the differences I look for and which ones make for pretty diagrams, but precious little else ;-)
Thanks@@KeithCooper , forgive me, I'm a very technical person who tends to think in numbers. I think for someone like me who is new to printing, understanding the implications of a smaller gamut (or whatever else I'm missing in a printer with less inks) would be helpful. There's not a ton of resources out there that describe the trade-offs with any precision. I'm curious what the real world implications are, I tend to print fairly saturated landscape scenes. Thanks!
You won't get any precision in much of this - I too have a scientific/engineering background, but find that getting, yet alone presenting *meaningful* numbers is not easy.
It's also off-putting to many photographers - there are sound reasons [book sales!] any mention of maths is left to an appendix in my book about using tilt/shift lenses.
My suggestion is to get a copy of the book I recommend ['Real World Color Management' by Fraser et al.]
You don't need to even read all of it, but this is my way of explaining things to more technically minded people. Understanding things like rendering intents and colour spaces is vital if you really want to appreciate the subtleties of gamut. It's also vital to be able to know what really matters...
To expand my gamut and car testing analogy - several hypothetical cars with a a maximum speed of 120mph
One with 3 gears, one with 4 gears and one with a six speed auto box.
Add in an electric with effectively 1 gear to the mix if you like.
All have the same top speed, but rather different performance characteristics in getting there.
Hope that helps?
OK, did you manage to make a profile, is it good enough for a photo print? Of course it only has 4 colors, but still... ? Txs
Yes - see the main [written] review and linked videos about the printer and its use.
www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-tc-20m-printer-review/
Surprisingly good for 4 colour...
Mr Keith, do you think an Epson P900 has much better image quality? I know the Epson is made for photography but it costs twice a Canon TC20 or an Epson T3170 here in my country.
Ah... define 'much better image quality'??
Maybe yes, if used well, with good media and profiles - but that's because I'm a photographer and what I print.
Read the actual review to see what the TC-20M is capable of - surprisingly good for some uses...
www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-tc-20m-printer-review/
@@KeithCooper Thanks I'll check it. I'll use the printer to print "art and posters". But I'm just starting the business so it won't have much volume at first.
Will it print with the roll cover door open? This could allow for a 3” core to be mounted above and feed down.
Yes, if you defeat the interlock mechanism, but the roll is driven, not friction fed...
Where can I find the color profiles for this printer?
for which paper?
i created some - listed in the main written review
www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-tc-20m-printer-review/
@@KeithCooper TC-20M
No - what paper?
Profiles are specific to the combination of paper and printer.
There is info on the ones I created in the main [i.e. written] review
I heard that Canon printers - plotters - use about 10% of ink when cleaning the head? In addition, I could not find information on how much ink this printer uses, e.g. A4, A1? How long does printer downtime require head cleaning?
Yes all printers use ink for cleaning - it's an integral part of how inkjet printers work.
I don't have a percentage - it will vary with usage patterns [types/sizes of prints]
Every printer will do some cleaning every so often, whether left powered up or not. Switching off or leaving on usually makes little difference.
My testing is too varied to get any ink usage information, especially since it was used a bit at Canon after setup. That said, the maintenance cart is low and when I replace it I'll weigh things and check the printer's usage list since setup.
I _may_ be able to get some usage info for the review...
Hi Keith, I have the same request as I had for the Epson p8500: could you print an image on this printer, print the same image, on the same paper with your P5000 and talk about the differences? Please do that for both color and b&w. Thanks
I'll do this for the P8500 [or P6500] and P9500 if I get to go back, but I'll never compare two such dissimilar printers as the P5000 and TC20 from different makers.
They are totally different printers - it would be like me comparing the image quality from my GFX100S to my EOS 100D. I have a near 20 year review policy of avoiding comparative reviews in anything but specific and finely characterised areas. This is the sort of stuff I'd only ever cover [if at all] in written articles.
Also, differences simply won't show accurately or reliably on video - it is a dreadful medium for anything colour critical - especially with people watching on phones...
@@KeithCooper Hi Keith, the reason such a comparison would be interesting is because it would establish a base line comparison. For instance, when you use the gfx100s to eos 100d comparison, I know what you're talking about because someone has already established the base line parameters such as resolution, dr, noise, etc. AFAIK, nobody has ever established baseline printer comparison parameters. So, when you say "I can get good quality images out of this printer", I don't know what that means and when you say "...don't expect the same quality as what you get with p5000,", I don't know what that means either. I think it would be helpful to show what to look for and to quantify the differences in image quality that you're referring to. Thanks
I do appreciate that and why...
The problem is such comparisons, without a rigorous and meaningful methodology are at best unreliable and at worst meaningless ;-)
To develop such a framework for this sort of print would be a mammoth task.
The 100D/GFX comparison is a relevant one here since I generally avoid discussions of camera DR/Noise/resolution and pay very little attention to them in my camera use. The arguments I see about this [informed and otherwise ;-) ] convince me that such an endeavour for printing would not be one I'd enjoy [ and that is partly why I do this stuff]
I guess that I don't actually believe that some numerical description of print quality would be useful or helpful. Sure, I can show differences of gamut between printers [as in the recent post comparing P5000/P8500 on the lustre paper] but the differences there are far more subtle than a simple animated plot can show.
I rail against paper reviews which pack in a mass of spurious charts and tables in the mistaken belief that "data equals information". Note that I differentiate the sort of print work I look at, from commercial press and print - that can be [and is] a whole lot more complex and analytical - print quality control for example can be very technical.
Print is about content and meaning for me. When I do talks [or my 1-2-1 teaching] about prints I take along examples, but I never tell people in advance what paper or printer or settings I've used.
Sorry if that leaves the issues too open for you, but I'm probably not the person to nail numbers to these things... I'll try a few more examples though ;-)
Thanks for asking BTW - this may return as a video ;-)
@@KeithCooper In that case, could you at least clarify in detail what you mean when you say that one will not get the same quality with printer A vs printer B and clarify what you mean when you say that you can still get a good print. Thanks
'A good print' is the easiest - does it pass the 'on my office wall test' are there any aspect of it I see I'm concerned about - so, any colour casts on a B&W, banding or uneven colour transitions
One problem is that these are for a colour image a combination of printer, software, profile and paper. That means, could I have go t a better print by choosing a different paper. editing differently [colour range and gamut for example] - or am i seeing some fundamental flaw of the the printer?
For the P8500 vs P9500 for example, my experience tells me that the sheer number of inks in the P9500 will let me print some images in a more striking way.
However put two identical prints at opposite ends of the room and few will be able to tell the difference.
This I why I say that I can make a good print with any modern 'good' printer. Print 'quality' is largely limited by the skills of the person using the printer [myself included]
That's as detailed as I'll go without having physical prints on a table in front of me and the person I'm discussing it with.
I will try and address what you ask, but explaining print quality without a print to hold and touch, to someone without much experience in printing is challenging.
What it actually means is that if you are new to printing, the only reason to buy a top end printer is because you have the spare cash ;-) Almost any 13" printer currently available is good enough to start with...
Hi Keith, I’m curious to know if it’s possible to use different kind of palate like 180g or 160g?
I’m a tattooer and I would love to buy a printer machine for print my paints but the problem is that i would like to have a paper that is similar to the one that I use for paint watercolour
What's a 'palate' ? Not a term I'm familiar with
Can I put in canvas paper to print in this printer?
What do you actually mean by 'canvas paper'?
Hi Keith! Thank you for ypur video! Quite helpful! I print canvas - just like the canvas used to paint artworks by hand and brush... but made for digital printing... i'd be very thakfull if you could tell us if this printer will accept such media. Thanks a lot! Best.
That is actual canvas... I test it on many printers, but not this one
From the review
www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-tc-20m-printer-review/
"Canon TC-20M canvas printing?
Not specifically supported. It should print if you can get it onto a 2″ core and it’s not too thick. I didn’t have any available to test this though.
I’d suspect the cutter is not up to regular cutting of canvas though. I’ve seen several printers with paper cutters warn against cutting canvas, since it dulls the blade and the additional cutting force can damage the blade transport mechanism."
we found Paul McCartney's long lost brother.
I am not from Liverpool! :-)
Do you know if it's possible to use 3 inch core rolls with adapter?
Yes, but none are supplied [I don't have any -thought I did somewhere, but could only find one...]
There is a physical paper roll diameter limit of 4" though - so some rolls I've got wouldn't fit in anyway
Hi Keith, thanks for the reviews, they are really helpful. I'm struggling to find info on what is the thickest media this printer will accept. I need to be able to print from A4 to A1 at 250gsm. Will this printer handle this weight? Thanks in advance.
The photo paper I've got in it at the moment is a 24" roll of 250gsm lustre photo paper... works just fine. I've printed sheets on 310gsm cotton rag as well...
That's great and really helpful. Thanks for your swift reply.
Hi Keith, if during the tests on this printer you could try a transparency like the one you used on the ET-8550, I'd be very grateful. It's for my digital negatives for contact printing. Thanks. Cheers.
Sorry - I don't have any media...
@@KeithCooper ;-(
Can this print straight a2 sheets of art paper not necessarily rolls?
No, I'm afraid not - the sheet feed is limited to A3 width (not even A3+)
@@KeithCooper thanks for the enlightenment.
Can you advice on the best color printer to use for a2 paper printing business? That will relatively be low cost per print
Thought I could use Tc 20
Low cost - this one - use roll paper, there is a cutter
Hello, can u know how to turn OF autocut ?and how to manage density ink (saturation)
I'm printing via the normal driver, so you just deselect cutting
As to ink density - I'm printing with icc profiles, so it's not relevant
There are settings in the driver if you want to go that route
@@KeithCooper i cant find whe are deselect cut, i find only speed cut (normal or slow)
@@KeithCooper y print from default driver settings or some soft?( sory , my eng bad....)
Whoops - looked at the wrong printer driver. I can't see any control over cutting
Otherwise I'm just printing using the normal Mac driver from Photoshop
I'll be covering all the details when I write the main review - thanks for asking - I'd not spotted the variable cut speed.
OK. I would be grateful if you could review all print quality settings in the driver, but for now I will figure it out myself.@@KeithCooper
Hello I really like your information tank you so much for your time, I have a quick question, it this ploter could print on couche paper or glossy paper?
Glossy photo - yes
"couche paper " - sorry never heard of it?
@@KeithCooper I think is the same but here we call it couche not glossy paper, I'm strongly considering to get this ploter because your information thank you so much!
Ok - the same as in it is most definitely not a 'plotter' from my POV - it is an inkjet printer.
Plotters, for me, were made by Calcomp and HP and used individual ink pens ;-)
@@KeithCooper well that's true, Im looking for a plotter or printer wich alow me to print A3 on glossy paper with good quality and this is a good option now just because the price talking about value for money because is cheap and in my country there are not many options to consider, do you think it is good option? or maybe you know another better:)
I only know UK markets I'm afraid.
For A3 glossy, the ET-18100 is good. The TC-20M main attraction is roll paper
It looks more a blueprint and design style printer than a photo or photographic one. Glad it's ink fed and has a replaceable maintenance cartridge.
Yes, that's where it's more likely marketed.
However, one of the reasons I got it here to test was show that it was capable of more than that ;-)
We are looking at this for quick blueprints. Would you recommend this one?
it's what it's aimed at, so should be fine - however I'm just testing posters and photo with it - which it also does fine.
There may be other printers better suiting your application, but I've not tested any.