Hahahahahha best comment ever. Thank you. How do you know its jiggly? In fact, at the time it was BIG , but not jiggly, it was hard and bloated. I will pin your comment for everyone to see.
Nice review. Leon would have been pleased. Over here we've come to know them as Leonidas speakers. Sadly he passed away last june. He kept building speakers till the end, he left us a real nice legacy.
Did you try the 2 voice coils of the woofers in series as well as in parallel configuration? When two 8-ohm coils are in series, the amp sees 16 ohms (211 amp should’ve loved this) and in parallel the amp sees 4 ohms (solid state amps would like this).
FINALLY!!! Lol! No, seriously… FINALLY!!! I’ve been waiting for your review and take on the LEOBs. Great review my man! I think I’ll try them with the Fast 10 first. Thanks LOIC!!!
This Video is aging amazingly well! Getting my carpenter brother to chop me out some Big Mass Wooden Open Baffles. This info is exactly what I was seeking.
I really enjoyed this video Loic. I used to run the FAST-10S + W15 in a shallow open back cabinet with forward facing Aurum Cantus G3Si ribbons and ceiling facing Skar Audio VX1-ST bullet tweeters. Fantastic results with a single 2.2uf Duelund CAST Cu-Sn cap on the tweeters (wire in series with each other though in parallel with the fullrange) and a Crown XLS1502 to drive the woofer. I used primarily tube amps for the fullrange and tweeters. IT was an unforgettable sound. The cabinets were constructed using Karri hardwood and I used Dynamat Extreme on the top, bottom and side panels and a strip on the front baffle. Made an incredible improvement to solidity of sound. Now running Lii Song Fieke S6 until speakers based around the Platinum-10 displace it ;)
This was a fantastic review 👏. You summed up my feelings on the W15's perfectly. I'm running mine with the F15's though. If you can run it with an active crossover I highly recommend it. I'm using a minidsp shd for my setup, and it made dialing things in a breeze. Can't wait to see what you come up with for your build.
@@hificave lol, I was considering running a super tweeter on my setup as well. The downside of DIY is the same as the upside. You can do anything you want... that also means you want to do everything lol.
I’m sure the sound is better than most $50k boxed low efficiency designs. That said I wouldn’t use that woofer. When I did a comparison between good pro audio woofers with the accordion surround and more contemporary woofer designs with the half roll surround the results were clear. Pro audio all the way.
I built some open baffles years ago based around the Lampizator P17, even with what were essentially radiogram drive units plus a big Altec bass was impressed but they didn’t have the headroom for loud rock ( occasionally). Obviously these are a different kettle of fish. I don’t doubt they will have an ‘in the room’ sound - my question is do they play loud with no compression or distortion? There is a pair available in UK at a good price and I’m tempted…. I have a VTL amp which has very good control and enough power I feel.
Open baffle bass? So wild. Exteme opposite of my sealed and sealed/radiator bass. Awesome the beauty is displayed all around. Excited to get my hands on my first Lii speakers soon. Just some of their budget 6.5 full range with wood (i think) resonator wizer thing. Anyway, the Lii speakers will be compared to: Cerwin Vega full range claiming "103db spl 1w/1m" You just Mentioned the high sensitivity and ability to go without passive or active crossovers... Should i atleast add a cap inline to stop Sub-bass freq?
Hi, I do like your videos. But I really miss some music run to these. I currently use mid 60s Goodman audiom 12inch full range in a DIY enclosure (I built PA stuff for 10 years and had been in the pro PA rental biz for some 5 years as well (up to 50kW and also with large horn systems 2x4 mtr mouth for big open air shows) So I know a little on what to expect and what not. Also I built a 330ltr. Scoop with different plates for 12 up to 18 inch speakers. Which currently has a 15inch Rola PA Bass mounted. Since it's vintage and I mostly listen to my system at loud levels, that 15inch is the first one which is at it limits. I also tried b&c, 18-sound and RCF 15inch speakers, which can do very high SPL easily but also don't deliver the low end with I want. And I also don't want to build a 500+ ltr. Enclosure for a 21inch PA driver. I don't have that space without ditching some more interior 😉 So I think may be one of these 15/18 inch drivers may, handle that. While the usual PA drivers have a roll of around 50 down to 40 hertz, these W-type will fit nicer in my scoop which is tuned to 30hz. Thanks for your words... And don't listen go haters. They gonna hate anyway. Your channel, your decisions. Cheers.
I`m really curious about the fast 10 vs the silver 10 in the Liionidas. Let us know if you get feedback. I`m hesitating between the 2 . When I can get some feedback, I might make my mind up and place an order for the Liionidas. Merci Loic.
You mentioned you highly recommend upgrading the crossover. Having tested it, do you have any crossover suggestions in terms of values and perhaps brands? If I heard you right, 5,000 hz seems awfully high even with the issues of a low qts in the 10" driver. Lastly, how does it compare overall to your original non-separated butcher blocks and to the Macara's? I know the Leonidas is using both coils so as you mentioned, it has more bass, but overall? Thank you. I've been enjoying your channel.
the stock crossover is very basic and uses parts that are well... not transparent. when I bi-amped, and used a digital crossover for the bass driver to dovetail the full range driver, as the full driver ran full but rolls off around 200hz naturally considering the baffle setup. Anyway, when biamped, it showed the true potential which was way. more resolving and dynamic. so if you build your own crossover with high quality parts.. or bi amp. the dfference is significant.
Can you purchase the Liionidas extreme open baffle speakers from Lii Audio in the USA? I’m asking because I sent a few questions to Lii Audio, via, the contact feature on their website. I never got a response and it’s been over (3) weeks. Decware or Caintuck Audio does not sell these speakers although they were listed on Lii Audio’s website as dealers for the USA. I’m curious how they compare to Spatial Audio open baffle speakers which I had? It would be concerning if I did buy them directly from Lii Audio and could not get any support if I had an issue.
Great review. Congrats. I have a pair of s10 using cabinets that I love, and recently bought all the components to set that liionidas conf with the W15s. Looking forward to receiving them soon to run all the tests. Have you considered adding another w15 on top to each baffle? like pure audio project does.. What do you think about that?
I have a setup with W15's on the bottom and F15's on the top. My room is 23x13.5x8. I have the 100w plate amps driving the 2 W15's at half gain. The last thing I think I need is more bass. I have mine crossed at 150hz and they blend seamlessly with the F15's. The only thing I'm considering adding is a super tweeter for a bit more sparkle up top. You're in for a treat though. Drums and horns sound especially lifelike on some recording. The space they give in the soundstage is breathtaking. Do you plan on building your own crossovers, using plate amps with high level inputs and outputs, or an active crossover?
@@JC-lk3oy thks for your commens. Honestly I need to receive them and do some testing before having a deeper opinion. My room is bigger but anyhow let's see how it sounds once I can test them. I will be using the passive crossover that comes with the Lii Audio structure, ... by the way, I don't know where it crosses, yet. As far as I know W15 goes till 4Khz, it sounds a bit strange for me that you cut them at 150 Hz, did you consider that ? On the other hand, adding an extra W15 to each baffle could maybe add some extra soundstage to the whole system. I have not used plate amps so far, why are you using them ?. They say S10s are more sparkled than F15s so I'm not thinking in a super tweeter. I will start at that point but maybe in the future I go ahead bulding my own crossovers. The electronics are quite simpe but I feel a bit lazy at that point. The good thing is that Liionidas work as a platform so I could even use some DSP processing to improve and understand the system before changing anything. Thks again
@@LuisFlores-gc5zm yes, I could have gone higher on the crossover, but part of what I was going for is that incredible coherence you get when you run a single driver full range. Also the F15 is quite a bit faster than the W15 so I'd prefer to cross it over earlier. I'm using Dirac up to 200hz to help with dialing in the low end as well. I don't like DSP too high in the frequency range as it tends to make things sound dull. I did use the 10 band EQ in the miniDSP SHD to tame things down a bit in the 6k-8k range as well though. I'm interested to hear how you like them when you get them. They are very well built drivers.
Hi Loic, you did a very nice informative video!!! I am in the process of buying a open baffle or box speakers like the Børresen X2 or X3 and Alta Audio Alyssa & Alec Speakers. My goal is to buy some speakers that punch well above their price or get some giant killers! I am looking for very detailed speakers that has great mids, will give me a long, huge holographic wide sound stage, has a nice ceiling to floor sound and can play all types of music! I am looking for speakers that sound great even in a UNTREATED room. It would be great if you can tell me which set of speakers will best meet most of my desires. In a nice dedicated large room with no windows, do you think that the Liionidas Extreme Open Baffles can equal the performance or sound better than the Børresen and Alta Speakers? Also what is most expensive box speakers that you have heard can the Liionidas Extreme Open Baffles equal in sound? 👍👏
What about the depth of the stereo image with that kind of speakers ? High efficiency speakers often offer a flat and forward image. Yes impact is there ! Yes the sound is wide but what about the placement, the separation, the layers ?
I have been thinking or dreaming of building a pair of Omni Directional speakers with a 12" Sono Tube. I would have to do some measuring to see if a 10" or 12" speaker would fit. I have yet to figure out the diffuser and how I would port the Tube. If I wanted to weight the base I could use concrete. This would be part of my Frankensteen collection.
Sounds like an interesting project. Not sure I've ever seen a large driver omni speaker before. Is there a similar design you've seen someone do before? If so and if they wrote opinions or anything about it I'd love to get a link. Have you taken a look at the LX-mini yet? It's not full omni, but it's a heck of a speaker that can be made from supplies from Home Depot.
Wish I could get these in Brazil where I moved recently for our new home. Brasilia is an audio desert so I’m considering humping a kit when back in NYC. Have you compared LiiSong at all with GS Research or CSS open baffle kits?
@@hificave Have u heard the PureAudio Project Duets? I want open baffles and they might b the only ones I can reasonably fly with me to Brazil, unless I get components and DIY the cabinets myself.
@@marclambert8596 Fly to Spain and pick up the baffles for 1600 euro's, maybe they'll ship them. I'm having a pair sent to my place in Greece and flying back to the US with them. They'll fit in the oversize and over weight rules.
I bought the basic liionidas baffles, a couple w15, and fast8. What’s the major difference between extreme baffles vs the basic ones? Is it the extra bracing and side panels?
Hi! Love to see more content on the Liionidas. First off, I've never seen a W15 move as much as in your video. Jeeeesh what music are you playing? I don't even see mine moving. Almost gets me thinking the changed the xmax on the never W15's. The Liionidas isn't designed by Lii-Audio themselves, Leon Huijgen (aka Leonidas) made them and searched the design for free go the diy community. If anyone wants the drawings and schematics for the Liionidas to build them, hit me up. And if they still use the original crossovers, the crossover point would be around 350~400hz. And hifi cave, try a class D for once (preferably Purifi), just a small tip which could be a surprise😉 Keep up the good work!
@@hificave i found the song, cranked the volume, not even close the amount of movement I see in your video. Let me check with Lii-Audio if they changed the newer W15 to have more xmax then the old one. That would could also be the reason why you don't need the wings😉
@@MrHardbats what amp is driving your w15? The video makes it look like its moving a lot but when I look at it in person it doesnt seem to move that much.
@@hificave nice. Looking forward to your review on the Platinum driver. Can you please indicate if it was in a box or Open Baffle, or should I just wait for your review.
I was listening to the Decware SEWE300B at my friends house the other night. However, he’s using it to drive his W-15’s. Listening to your video, you indicated the Leonidis is power hungry. Do you think the SEWE300B will be able to drive the Leonidis without a problem? Here is some of the Jazz user on Decware site to describe the amp. World Voltage compatibility 50/60Hz DRIVER TUBE Compatibility: 6N6P, 6922, 6N1P INPUT TUBE Compatibility: 12AU7 OUTPUT TUBE Compatibility: WE300B VOLTAGE REGULATOR TUBE Compatibility: OC2, OA2 OB2 RECTIFICATION: 274B or 5U4 or 5AR4 INPUTS: Two pair isolated 24K Gold RCA INPUTS with switching. OUTPUTS: LO & HI , for 2~6 & 8~16 OHM SPEAKERS IDLE CURRENT: 65~75 MILS PER OUTPUT TUBE HIGH VOLTAGE: 390 VDC AT TRANSFORMERS INPUT IMPEDANCE: 100 K OHMS INPUT SENSITIVITY: FULL POWER @ 2.0 VOLTS POWER INTO 8 OHMS: 4 to 7 WATTS PER CHANNEL @ 3%THD PENDING VR TUBE USED. Thank you in advance.
yeah, they are power hungry. But its more then just wattage. Damping factor, plate voltage and transformers come into play in the execution. I have never used the SEWE300B, I really cant say. BUT, Steve knows what he is doing. in my tests so far, my favourite amp to drive the w15 (30hz up to 400hz) is a class D crown of all things... I find single ended amps struggle a bit to control the w15, push pull works better, but like I just mentioned, the budget friendly crown is shocking me... working on a video for this.. but, of all tube amps I tried to control the w15, Decware and Galion were the best ones.
The pt10 is the most transparent of all lii-song drivers. But it rolls off quick in open baffle. But it would work with w15 and w12. The crossover point and baffle shape size and material is where things will be magic or tragic. :-)
Dear Sir, Good day, Will this pair of Lii Audio Liionidas Open Baffle Speaker cause his bass to be bass humming? Please give me your opinion as my room is small (10ft x 15ft). thanks
Hard to say as dimensions are not the only factor to consider, but with its flexibility in how you chose to configure the bass driver (1 coil for medium bass, 2 coils in parallel for heavy bass, 2 coils in series for light bass) you can adjust the amount of bass you need.
Actually, more cave man torso, please ... Or really, whatever makes you happy. In all seriousness, though, just thanks for getting the ball rolling on some actual coverage of Lii Audio products. I'm running a pair of Fast-8s hanging baffle-less on my desktop, reinforced by a cheap pair of DIY sealed subs on the floor behind. I also use a Schiit Loki in my electronics stack. I can dial the Fast-8s to where they're almost satisfying all by themselves (proper little baffles might help this experiment, who knows?), but when I have them set up to taste with the subs, I still dial in a bit more bass because it feels a bit more full and accurate for the upper bass to be coming from the mains. I also have the top band on the Loki turned to the 1:30-2:00 position and I find that's all the sparkle up top I can handle. The Fast-8s, if Lii's published data is to be believed, is the most well behaved, flattest responding and neutral behaving of all the Lii drivers (except for maybe the W-15 through their pass band, which seems to go up through 5kHz; how about those full range with a nice dipole planar tweet like a B&G Neo3 or equivalent, just capped off up top with a nice, high end capacitor to minimize its effect on the sound?). Certainly, if I were building a W-15 based open baffle (the living room might be able to support such a thing after a remodel; fingers crossed), I would definitely pair them with Fast-8s. Only $800 USD for drivers for a pair. I would drive them with a pair of Dayton DTA-100LF subwoofer amps and a Sparkos modified Aiyima A07 (I know, I know, I'm not properly audiophile, but I feel I'm fairly expert at getting 95+% of the way there without spending enough money or taking up enough space to piss off my wife; anyone who wants to argue that is probably complaining about waistline issues that they likely argue away by saying that they don't film themselves to put useful content onto UA-cam, so its fine, right?), that way I can manage crossover, levels and some EQ for less than $500 USD on amplification. So, anyone reading this far, yeah, a pair of Fast-8s are great starter open baffle fullrangers, and they're probably endgame units for some of us. I had been guessing from information gleaned from all over the net that the W-15s were going to be some of the best open baffle bass units, especially given the price (some other similarly specced units such as the Dipole series from Acoustic Elegance might be as good or better, but they'd darned well better be for 50% more money; they certainly don't outperform W-15s on the high end, rolling off more around 2kHz), but you and Thomas have confirmed beyond question that they will be out performing my conservative estimations once I'm able to get one into my CAVE to play with. Thanks for all of this.
Would love to hear these. I have to ask, all this talk about them being an amazing value, these are ~$6100 before tax and whatnot, are they on that level of fit and finish? They look gorgeous on the website, naturally. But that’s a price range with some very serious competition. Curious on how they hold up in person! Love the content and your open baffle journey, btw!
Well first, tekton perfect set runs with any amplifier. From 6 to 100 watts tube or solid state. Over 100 watts be careful they wont sound their best. Liionidas open baffle, require at least 40 watts in my experience to work, and a strongly recommend a quality solidstate or exceptional tube amp to make the big w15 bass driver play. If both are driver correctly Tekton= party, lively, fun to listen. Liionidas open baffle: very open sound stage, airy, refined, spacious, with gut pushing power.
Thanks a bunch! My Tektons already sound extremely open/airy in my space! Will the Liionidas play rock’n roll without decapitating the listener? (My Tektons are close to, due to a bright listening/un-treated listening room…)
Ahh bro don't pay any attention to the hate , the hate is derived from them being Jealous , Love your videos and I Appricate all your input . I get called a Kentucky Redneck all the time and their right and I have very thick skin 😆
Off-putting? Loic tu m'as tellement fait rire que j'ai craché ce que j'avais dans la bouche sur le tapis! Maudit! Tes Trolls sont crissement spécialement con! Sois moins intelligent et donne moins de détails, you know, dumb it down a little bit. Hahaha ! Mais j'adore ta façon d'y répondre. Keep up the good work my friend !
You got a big jiggly belly and your home made speakers sound distorted and out of tune.
Hahahahahha best comment ever. Thank you. How do you know its jiggly?
In fact, at the time it was BIG , but not jiggly, it was hard and bloated. I will pin your comment for everyone to see.
@@hificave Thanks!!
@@STEPMOMMEE make sure to subscribe.
Nice review. Leon would have been pleased. Over here we've come to know them as Leonidas speakers.
Sadly he passed away last june. He kept building speakers till the end, he left us a real nice legacy.
Super great review Loïc. Love your review style as always! Keep up the excellent work!
Did you try the 2 voice coils of the woofers in series as well as in parallel configuration? When two 8-ohm coils are in series, the amp sees 16 ohms (211 amp should’ve loved this) and in parallel the amp sees 4 ohms (solid state amps would like this).
I thought about it. I will try it.
FINALLY!!!
Lol! No, seriously…
FINALLY!!!
I’ve been waiting for your review and take on the LEOBs.
Great review my man!
I think I’ll try them with the Fast 10 first.
Thanks LOIC!!!
This Video is aging amazingly well! Getting my carpenter brother to chop me out some Big Mass Wooden Open Baffles. This info is exactly what I was seeking.
Hahhaha holy shit people are mean. Glad you covered this speaker, looks amazing
I really enjoyed this video Loic. I used to run the FAST-10S + W15 in a shallow open back cabinet with forward facing Aurum Cantus G3Si ribbons and ceiling facing Skar Audio VX1-ST bullet tweeters. Fantastic results with a single 2.2uf Duelund CAST Cu-Sn cap on the tweeters (wire in series with each other though in parallel with the fullrange) and a Crown XLS1502 to drive the woofer. I used primarily tube amps for the fullrange and tweeters. IT was an unforgettable sound. The cabinets were constructed using Karri hardwood and I used Dynamat Extreme on the top, bottom and side panels and a strip on the front baffle. Made an incredible improvement to solidity of sound. Now running Lii Song Fieke S6 until speakers based around the Platinum-10 displace it ;)
This was a fantastic review 👏. You summed up my feelings on the W15's perfectly. I'm running mine with the F15's though. If you can run it with an active crossover I highly recommend it. I'm using a minidsp shd for my setup, and it made dialing things in a breeze. Can't wait to see what you come up with for your build.
thanks J C!! I am thinking of running my w15 with a set of F15 in open baffle with a horned super tweeter now.. I am all over the place. :-)
@@hificave lol, I was considering running a super tweeter on my setup as well. The downside of DIY is the same as the upside. You can do anything you want... that also means you want to do everything lol.
@@JC-lk3oy hahaha yup
@@hificave the guy who designed the crossover used an upfiring tweeter firing against a wooden ping pong ball
I’m sure the sound is better than most $50k boxed low efficiency designs.
That said I wouldn’t use that woofer. When I did a comparison between good pro audio woofers with the accordion surround and more contemporary woofer designs with the half roll surround the results were clear. Pro audio all the way.
I built some open baffles years ago based around the Lampizator P17, even with what were essentially radiogram drive units plus a big Altec bass was impressed but they didn’t have the headroom for loud rock ( occasionally).
Obviously these are a different kettle of fish. I don’t doubt they will have an ‘in the room’ sound - my question is do they play loud with no compression or distortion? There is a pair available in UK at a good price and I’m tempted….
I have a VTL amp which has very good control and enough power I feel.
Open baffle bass? So wild. Exteme opposite of my sealed and sealed/radiator bass. Awesome the beauty is displayed all around.
Excited to get my hands on my first Lii speakers soon. Just some of their budget 6.5 full range with wood (i think) resonator wizer thing.
Anyway, the Lii speakers will be compared to:
Cerwin Vega full range claiming "103db spl 1w/1m"
You just Mentioned the high sensitivity and ability to go without passive or active crossovers...
Should i atleast add a cap inline to stop Sub-bass freq?
Loic, man your style rocks ! On all chapters, your content is "da schiit" :) , hands down.
PS: would love 2 have an audio bud like you .
Damn! Thanks sir! Just now, like that. We became audio buds. Haha
@@hificave :) glad 2 hear ! ( Jupiter caps 4 every audio nut out there ! )
Hi,
I do like your videos. But I really miss some music run to these.
I currently use mid 60s Goodman audiom 12inch full range in a DIY enclosure (I built PA stuff for 10 years and had been in the pro PA rental biz for some 5 years as well (up to 50kW and also with large horn systems 2x4 mtr mouth for big open air shows)
So I know a little on what to expect and what not.
Also I built a 330ltr. Scoop with different plates for 12 up to 18 inch speakers. Which currently has a 15inch Rola PA Bass mounted. Since it's vintage and I mostly listen to my system at loud levels, that 15inch is the first one which is at it limits.
I also tried b&c, 18-sound and RCF 15inch speakers, which can do very high SPL easily but also don't deliver the low end with I want. And I also don't want to build a 500+ ltr. Enclosure for a 21inch PA driver. I don't have that space without ditching some more interior 😉
So I think may be one of these 15/18 inch drivers may, handle that. While the usual PA drivers have a roll of around 50 down to 40 hertz, these W-type will fit nicer in my scoop which is tuned to 30hz.
Thanks for your words...
And don't listen go haters. They gonna hate anyway.
Your channel, your decisions.
Cheers.
I`m really curious about the fast 10 vs the silver 10 in the Liionidas. Let us know if you get feedback. I`m hesitating between the 2 . When I can get some feedback, I might make my mind up and place an order for the Liionidas. Merci Loic.
Are you planning on making your own crossover or use the stock one?
You mentioned you highly recommend upgrading the crossover. Having tested it, do you have any crossover suggestions in terms of values and perhaps brands? If I heard you right, 5,000 hz seems awfully high even with the issues of a low qts in the 10" driver.
Lastly, how does it compare overall to your original non-separated butcher blocks and to the Macara's? I know the Leonidas is using both coils so as you mentioned, it has more bass, but overall? Thank you. I've been enjoying your channel.
the stock crossover is very basic and uses parts that are well... not transparent. when I bi-amped, and used a digital crossover for the bass driver to dovetail the full range driver, as the full driver ran full but rolls off around 200hz naturally considering the baffle setup. Anyway, when biamped, it showed the true potential which was way. more resolving and dynamic. so if you build your own crossover with high quality parts.. or bi amp. the dfference is significant.
Can you purchase the Liionidas extreme open baffle speakers from Lii Audio in the USA? I’m asking because I sent a few questions to Lii Audio, via, the contact feature on their website. I never got a response and it’s been over (3) weeks. Decware or Caintuck Audio does not sell these speakers although they were listed on Lii Audio’s website as dealers for the USA. I’m curious how they compare to Spatial Audio open baffle speakers which I had? It would be concerning if I did buy them directly from Lii Audio and could not get any support if I had an issue.
Low QTS drivers can be used very successfully on open baffles if the baffles are large enough and the driver happy with some equalization.
Yes, with the right execution anything can work. Agree with you.
Has anyone tried the Platinum-10 in the Liionidas?
Great review. Congrats. I have a pair of s10 using cabinets that I love, and recently bought all the components to set that liionidas conf with the W15s. Looking forward to receiving them soon to run all the tests. Have you considered adding another w15 on top to each baffle? like pure audio project does.. What do you think about that?
I have a setup with W15's on the bottom and F15's on the top. My room is 23x13.5x8. I have the 100w plate amps driving the 2 W15's at half gain. The last thing I think I need is more bass. I have mine crossed at 150hz and they blend seamlessly with the F15's. The only thing I'm considering adding is a super tweeter for a bit more sparkle up top. You're in for a treat though. Drums and horns sound especially lifelike on some recording. The space they give in the soundstage is breathtaking. Do you plan on building your own crossovers, using plate amps with high level inputs and outputs, or an active crossover?
@@JC-lk3oy thks for your commens. Honestly I need to receive them and do some testing before having a deeper opinion. My room is bigger but anyhow let's see how it sounds once I can test them. I will be using the passive crossover that comes with the Lii Audio structure, ... by the way, I don't know where it crosses, yet. As far as I know W15 goes till 4Khz, it sounds a bit strange for me that you cut them at 150 Hz, did you consider that ? On the other hand, adding an extra W15 to each baffle could maybe add some extra soundstage to the whole system. I have not used plate amps so far, why are you using them ?. They say S10s are more sparkled than F15s so I'm not thinking in a super tweeter. I will start at that point but maybe in the future I go ahead bulding my own crossovers. The electronics are quite simpe but I feel a bit lazy at that point. The good thing is that Liionidas work as a platform so I could even use some DSP processing to improve and understand the system before changing anything. Thks again
@@LuisFlores-gc5zm yes, I could have gone higher on the crossover, but part of what I was going for is that incredible coherence you get when you run a single driver full range. Also the F15 is quite a bit faster than the W15 so I'd prefer to cross it over earlier. I'm using Dirac up to 200hz to help with dialing in the low end as well. I don't like DSP too high in the frequency range as it tends to make things sound dull. I did use the 10 band EQ in the miniDSP SHD to tame things down a bit in the 6k-8k range as well though. I'm interested to hear how you like them when you get them. They are very well built drivers.
Hi Loic, you did a very nice informative video!!! I am in the process of buying a open baffle or box speakers like the Børresen X2 or X3 and Alta Audio Alyssa & Alec Speakers. My goal is to buy some speakers that punch well above their price or get some giant killers! I am looking for very detailed speakers that has great mids, will give me a long, huge holographic wide sound stage, has a nice ceiling to floor sound and can play all types of music! I am looking for speakers that sound great even in a UNTREATED room. It would be great if you can tell me which set of speakers will best meet most of my desires.
In a nice dedicated large room with no windows, do you think that the Liionidas Extreme Open Baffles
can equal the performance or sound better than the Børresen and Alta Speakers?
Also what is most expensive box speakers that you have heard can the Liionidas Extreme Open Baffles equal in sound? 👍👏
What about the depth of the stereo image with that kind of speakers ? High efficiency speakers often offer a flat and forward image. Yes impact is there ! Yes the sound is wide but what about the placement, the separation, the layers ?
I have been thinking or dreaming of building a pair of Omni Directional speakers with a 12" Sono Tube. I would have to do some measuring to see if a 10" or 12" speaker would fit. I have yet to figure out the diffuser and how I would port the Tube. If I wanted to weight the base I could use concrete. This would be part of my Frankensteen collection.
Sounds like an interesting project. Not sure I've ever seen a large driver omni speaker before. Is there a similar design you've seen someone do before? If so and if they wrote opinions or anything about it I'd love to get a link.
Have you taken a look at the LX-mini yet? It's not full omni, but it's a heck of a speaker that can be made from supplies from Home Depot.
Wish I could get these in Brazil where I moved recently for our new home. Brasilia is an audio desert so I’m considering humping a kit when back in NYC. Have you compared LiiSong at all with GS Research or CSS open baffle kits?
Not yet
@@hificave Have u heard the PureAudio Project Duets? I want open baffles and they might b the only ones I can reasonably fly with me to Brazil, unless I get components and DIY the cabinets myself.
@@marclambert8596 Fly to Spain and pick up the baffles for 1600 euro's, maybe they'll ship them. I'm having a pair sent to my place in Greece and flying back to the US with them. They'll fit in the oversize and over weight rules.
I bought the basic liionidas baffles, a couple w15, and fast8. What’s the major difference between extreme baffles vs the basic ones? Is it the extra bracing and side panels?
Yep. Pretty much.
Hi!
Love to see more content on the Liionidas. First off, I've never seen a W15 move as much as in your video. Jeeeesh what music are you playing? I don't even see mine moving. Almost gets me thinking the changed the xmax on the never W15's.
The Liionidas isn't designed by Lii-Audio themselves, Leon Huijgen (aka Leonidas) made them and searched the design for free go the diy community.
If anyone wants the drawings and schematics for the Liionidas to build them, hit me up.
And if they still use the original crossovers, the crossover point would be around 350~400hz.
And hifi cave, try a class D for once (preferably Purifi), just a small tip which could be a surprise😉
Keep up the good work!
The track that made the woofers crank like that is Make us stronger by Ghost Rider.
@@hificave i found the song, cranked the volume, not even close the amount of movement I see in your video. Let me check with Lii-Audio if they changed the newer W15 to have more xmax then the old one. That would could also be the reason why you don't need the wings😉
@@MrHardbats what amp is driving your w15? The video makes it look like its moving a lot but when I look at it in person it doesnt seem to move that much.
@@hificave I use a Purifi class D amp. Best sounding amp I tried which has a lot of control on the W15.
Maybe the video just exaggerates it.
Great post. Have you tried the Crystal 10? Its better than the fast 10 but supposedly not as great as the silver 10.
No i have not. I was privileged however in hearing a sneak peak at the Platinum 10 however.. more on that coming up.
@@hificave nice. Looking forward to your review on the Platinum driver. Can you please indicate if it was in a box or Open Baffle, or should I just wait for your review.
I was listening to the Decware SEWE300B at my friends house the other night. However, he’s using it to drive his W-15’s.
Listening to your video, you indicated the Leonidis is power hungry. Do you think the SEWE300B will be able to drive the Leonidis without a problem? Here is some of the Jazz user on Decware site to describe the amp.
World Voltage compatibility 50/60Hz
DRIVER TUBE Compatibility: 6N6P, 6922, 6N1P
INPUT TUBE Compatibility: 12AU7
OUTPUT TUBE Compatibility: WE300B
VOLTAGE REGULATOR TUBE Compatibility: OC2, OA2 OB2
RECTIFICATION: 274B or 5U4 or 5AR4
INPUTS: Two pair isolated 24K Gold RCA INPUTS with switching.
OUTPUTS: LO & HI , for 2~6 & 8~16 OHM SPEAKERS
IDLE CURRENT: 65~75 MILS PER OUTPUT TUBE
HIGH VOLTAGE: 390 VDC AT TRANSFORMERS
INPUT IMPEDANCE: 100 K OHMS
INPUT SENSITIVITY: FULL POWER @ 2.0 VOLTS
POWER INTO 8 OHMS: 4 to 7 WATTS PER CHANNEL @ 3%THD PENDING VR TUBE USED.
Thank you in advance.
yeah, they are power hungry. But its more then just wattage. Damping factor, plate voltage and transformers come into play in the execution. I have never used the SEWE300B, I really cant say. BUT, Steve knows what he is doing. in my tests so far, my favourite amp to drive the w15 (30hz up to 400hz) is a class D crown of all things... I find single ended amps struggle a bit to control the w15, push pull works better, but like I just mentioned, the budget friendly crown is shocking me... working on a video for this.. but, of all tube amps I tried to control the w15, Decware and Galion were the best ones.
So far what are your thoughts on the PT-10? I’m debating building a Leonids type baffle with either the PT-10 with the W-12, or the F-10 with the W12.
The pt10 is the most transparent of all lii-song drivers. But it rolls off quick in open baffle. But it would work with w15 and w12. The crossover point and baffle shape size and material is where things will be magic or tragic. :-)
@@hificave thank you for answering.
@@hificave thank you for your response.
Dear Sir, Good day, Will this pair of Lii Audio Liionidas Open Baffle Speaker cause his bass to be bass humming? Please give me your opinion as my room is small (10ft x 15ft). thanks
Hard to say as dimensions are not the only factor to consider, but with its flexibility in how you chose to configure the bass driver (1 coil for medium bass, 2 coils in parallel for heavy bass, 2 coils in series for light bass) you can adjust the amount of bass you need.
@@hificave Thanks ur info.
...
Nice review Loic 👍.. with qts below .3 do you think silver10 ob can dive to 100hz range? planning to have 2.1 setup with single w15 and 2 silver10
I dont think so. Unless you compensate with some kind of EQ when I tried the s10 on their own in the baffle it doesnt go down that low.
And even with an EQ it would come with side effects..
@@hificave thanks for the respond.. not really going with EQ route.. how about wings?
@@mohdpazli that is worth a try for sure and would be my suggestion.
Actually, more cave man torso, please ...
Or really, whatever makes you happy.
In all seriousness, though, just thanks for getting the ball rolling on some actual coverage of Lii Audio products. I'm running a pair of Fast-8s hanging baffle-less on my desktop, reinforced by a cheap pair of DIY sealed subs on the floor behind. I also use a Schiit Loki in my electronics stack. I can dial the Fast-8s to where they're almost satisfying all by themselves (proper little baffles might help this experiment, who knows?), but when I have them set up to taste with the subs, I still dial in a bit more bass because it feels a bit more full and accurate for the upper bass to be coming from the mains. I also have the top band on the Loki turned to the 1:30-2:00 position and I find that's all the sparkle up top I can handle.
The Fast-8s, if Lii's published data is to be believed, is the most well behaved, flattest responding and neutral behaving of all the Lii drivers (except for maybe the W-15 through their pass band, which seems to go up through 5kHz; how about those full range with a nice dipole planar tweet like a B&G Neo3 or equivalent, just capped off up top with a nice, high end capacitor to minimize its effect on the sound?). Certainly, if I were building a W-15 based open baffle (the living room might be able to support such a thing after a remodel; fingers crossed), I would definitely pair them with Fast-8s. Only $800 USD for drivers for a pair. I would drive them with a pair of Dayton DTA-100LF subwoofer amps and a Sparkos modified Aiyima A07 (I know, I know, I'm not properly audiophile, but I feel I'm fairly expert at getting 95+% of the way there without spending enough money or taking up enough space to piss off my wife; anyone who wants to argue that is probably complaining about waistline issues that they likely argue away by saying that they don't film themselves to put useful content onto UA-cam, so its fine, right?), that way I can manage crossover, levels and some EQ for less than $500 USD on amplification.
So, anyone reading this far, yeah, a pair of Fast-8s are great starter open baffle fullrangers, and they're probably endgame units for some of us. I had been guessing from information gleaned from all over the net that the W-15s were going to be some of the best open baffle bass units, especially given the price (some other similarly specced units such as the Dipole series from Acoustic Elegance might be as good or better, but they'd darned well better be for 50% more money; they certainly don't outperform W-15s on the high end, rolling off more around 2kHz), but you and Thomas have confirmed beyond question that they will be out performing my conservative estimations once I'm able to get one into my CAVE to play with.
Thanks for all of this.
So what about the coils connected in serial? 16 ohms? Something that a tube amp prefers
Havent tried yet. But its on my todo list.
Would love to hear these. I have to ask, all this talk about them being an amazing value, these are ~$6100 before tax and whatnot, are they on that level of fit and finish? They look gorgeous on the website, naturally. But that’s a price range with some very serious competition. Curious on how they hold up in person! Love the content and your open baffle journey, btw!
It is big competition in this price range, its the versatility that separates this one for me.
still hesitating if I should build or save the time and buy
😃😎
Very arty video w the red tint. Don’t let people fat shame you, dude.
Hahahahha nobody is. I find it funny.
"Eddy has no followers" LOL
Dude Carl got some issues lol
🤗👍LIKE NOW .., watch, later LOIC 😁💚💚💚
Compared with Tekton Perfect SET? I am considering a change… Some kind of impression…. Yes, different price bracket I know…. But something?!? 🤞🏻😛
Well first, tekton perfect set runs with any amplifier. From 6 to 100 watts tube or solid state. Over 100 watts be careful they wont sound their best.
Liionidas open baffle, require at least 40 watts in my experience to work, and a strongly recommend a quality solidstate or exceptional tube amp to make the big w15 bass driver play.
If both are driver correctly
Tekton= party, lively, fun to listen.
Liionidas open baffle: very open sound stage, airy, refined, spacious, with gut pushing power.
Thanks a bunch! My Tektons already sound extremely open/airy in my space! Will the Liionidas play rock’n roll without decapitating the listener? (My Tektons are close to, due to a bright listening/un-treated listening room…)
Forget the haters! The belly view is nothing compared to your incredibly informative content and that devil view is too creepy!
Haters make me laugh. And give me ideas. :-)
These speakers vs spatial audio x4.
If I ever get my hands on spatial x4, will let you know.
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆
I heard them at the Toronto audio fest. They sounded fabulous. Do you think of selling yours at some point?
They weren’t mine, I was privileged to have em on loan from lii-song canada. Give them a shout if your interested in a pair.
@@hificave Thank you for your answer!
Ahh bro don't pay any attention to the hate , the hate is derived from them being Jealous , Love your videos and I Appricate all your input .
I get called a Kentucky Redneck all the time and their right and I have very thick skin 😆
Off-putting? Loic tu m'as tellement fait rire que j'ai craché ce que j'avais dans la bouche sur le tapis! Maudit! Tes Trolls sont crissement spécialement con! Sois moins intelligent et donne moins de détails, you know, dumb it down a little bit. Hahaha ! Mais j'adore ta façon d'y répondre. Keep up the good work my friend !
Ta tout compris!! :-)
I never knew amplifiers have torque.
Its an expression. High current, good damping factor, consistant bandwidth. Torque :-)
😂😂😂
Nice review, but the price is absurd.
Thanks. Hifi prices are all absurd.
Piano black. :(
How annoying!🤦♂️
I know. 🤦♂️