I saw some information and theoryes that Utumno was build in the central north of middle earth, maybe a little bit to east. Illuin was build in the north of the central-estic regions, and Utumno was probably very close behind some mountains, where the light of Iluin was weak. So, according to this theory, Utumno’s remnants are drowwned in Utumno's bay which was probably formed after the destruction of utumno, the war of wrath and maybe the downfall of Numenor. Utumno’s bay is a little bit in northeast compared to Lonely Mountain and Eren Engrin where the dwarves had their mine (MERP map). Compared to the south regions, you can watch where sea Rhun is and go straight in the north-north-east until you reach forodwaith and where Utumno’s bay is now. Down i will show what i found. I have searched for a definite answer to this question for a long time. There seems to be a lot of contradictory information on its location. I could not find any reasonably detailed answer at all. Therefore, I decided to have a look at the master’s works myself. A closer look at the source material revealed that some of the contradictions are misinterpretations. Hence there could very well be a consensus regarding the location of Utumno. The master definitively had a final word on the location of a Utumno. To understand where Utumno was, we will determine the vertical and horizontal location of it separately. Was Utumno inside or behind the Iron Mountains? (Vertical position on Arda) The literature and the drawn maps seem to contradict each other on that question. We have two maps from Tolkien which clearly show Utumno behind the Iron Mountains. Firstly, there is the “earliest map” which shows Utumno (here still written Utumna) in the northernmost part behind the Iron Mountains. Secondly, the Map IV of the “Ambarkanta maps” also shows Utumno to the north of the Iron Mountains. However, the following quote from the Silmarillion might implicate a different location of Utumno: “Now Melkor began the delving and building of a vast fortress, deep under Earth, beneath dark mountains where the beams of Illuin were cold and dim. That stronghold was named Utumno.” - J.R.R. Tolkien, edited by C. Tolkien: The Silmarillion This part created the believe that Utumno was built below (and not behind) the Iron Mountains. The very popular Atlas of Middle Earth from Karen Wynn Fonstad also displays the Ruins of Utumno inside of the Iron Mountains, most probably based on this text segment. But there are two indications inside this quote which make an Utumno below the Iron Mountains highly doubtful. Firstly, the light of the Illiun were “cold and dim” at its location. Below the Iron Mountains would not be any light at all. However, behind the Iron Mountains the light would indeed be dim because that part of Arda would only see indirect light of the Lamps. I created a sketch to visualize the issue with indirect light from Illuin and the two possible locations of Utumno. Secondly, the quote does not even mention the Iron Mountains as mountain range. It says that Utumno was build beneath “dark mountains”. Therefore, we can conclude that the theory of Utumno below the Iron Mountains is a conclusion (although an understandable one), but it is not based on the written text itself. We have further proof that Utumno was behind the Iron Mountains from the Silmarillion itself: “In the north of the world Melkor had in the ages past reared Ered Engrin, the Iron Mountains, as a fence to his citadel of Utumno; and they stood upon the borders of the regions of everlasting cold, in a great curve from east to west.” - J.R.R. Tolkien, edited by C. Tolkien: The Silmarillion Melkor back then was so powerful, he did not build a wall as defense line for his citadel, he reared a gigantic mountain range. A “fence” usually encircles something. Utumno’s (first) wall was this mountain range and placing Utumno inside its own fence makes little sense. Additionally, Utumno being located behind the Iron Mountains is directly confirmed by another text piece from HoME 11: “At this time the Valar came hither from Aman for their assault upon Melkor, whose stronghold was in the North beyond Eryd Engrin (the Iron Mountains).” - J.R.R. Tolkien, edited by C. Tolkien: The History of Middle Earth - the War of the Jewels, Volume 11 In summary, Utumno’s gates were behind the Iron Mountains. However, its pits and tunnels probably reached the Iron Mountains or even spots in the Misty Mountains which allowed the Balrog to get there without being noticed. After determining its horizontal position, we will have a look at its even more mysterious vertical position on Arda. Why did the awoken Elves at Cuiviénen see smoke in the north? (Horizontal position on Arda) The following quote created the assumption that Utumno had to be in the northeast of middle earth. It tells the story of the Elves which awoke at Cuiviénen. After the destruction of Utumno, they were on their journey to Valinor: “ […] passing northward about the Sea of Helcar they turned towards the west. Before them great clouds hung still black in the North above the ruins of war [against Utumno], and the stars in that region were hidden.” - J.R.R. Tolkien, edited by C. Tolkien: The Silmarillion After the Battle of Powers (war on Utumno), the Sea of Helcar was clearly in the east of Middle Earth (Ambarkanta Map V). Therefore, the region north of it (Utumno) should be the northeast of middle earth. This is obviously contradictory with the earlier map of Tolkien which I cited earlier (Map IV). Map IV portrayed Utumno in the northwest. So, what is the right horizontal position behind the Iron Mountains? Was Tolkien aware of this issue and gave an answer to this question? Actually, yes, there is a note note in HoME 11: “'(Utumno)... at the western end' > 'at the midmost'. This shift of Utumno eastwards is implied in the hasty note pencilled on the LQ 2 text of Chapter 2, Of Valinor and the Two Trees, in which the story entered that Angband also was built in the ancient days, 'not far from the northwestern shores of the Sea'” - J.R.R. Tolkien, edited by C. Tolkien: The History of Middle Earth - the War of the Jewels, Volume 11 According to this source, this note is from 1958 and therefore much younger than the earlier mentioned maps. Notice that it says “western end”, clearly indicating a change to the horizontal position of Utumno on the map. The note represents the final documented thought of Tolkien on the Location of Utumno. Therefore, Utumno finally returned to its original central location behind the northern mountain range just as displayed in the earliest map. Nonetheless, the quote above from the even younger Silmarillion about the journey of the Elves might still create the image of an Utumno even further to the east. At least on a world like ours. Right here is a rather complex misinterpretation issue according to my analysis. Arda back then was in no way like our world is nowadays. It was flat. This basically means that the cardinal points need to be interpreted differently. On a round world, the northern most part can always be reached simply by going northwards. This is not true for a flat world. A flat world has one single northern most point. To reach it, you always must go to the midmost part of the world and then upwards. Only there is the most northern point of a flat world. The graphic is based on the Atlas of Middle Earth. As we concluded above, Tolkien placed Utumno at the midmost part behind the Iron Mountains. Therefore, Utumno in the north of the flat Arda was always at the “midmost” horizontal position, no matter from which point you were facing north. This part might be not all that easy to understand so please do not hesitate to ask any questions. Melkor’s first and mightiest citadel was probably the most hellish place ever to exits on Middle Earth. The malice and darkness of this place were just unimaginable. I hope this thread brings some light to it! There is just a one real criticism about this statement: The Sea of Helcar was in the east of middle earth. Therefore, the region north of it (Utumno) should be the northeast of middle earth If you look at map IV, from which you draw your conclusion, the inland Sea of Helk(c)ar is not to the east of M-E. It is central and Cuiveinen is to the east of the Sea but still not to the far east of M-E. But this is the mistake of Karen Wynn Fonstad in her "The Atlas of Middle-earth", despite it being an amazing work of cartography. The problem is that while the Ambarkanta Map IV (which is more a diagramatic map than a topographic), the Sea of Helcar and the Sea of Ringil are shown to be in the middle of Endor, in Ambarkanta Map V the West-lands are depicted as larger, because JRRT wanted to show the details of Beleriand. Not to mention how at that phase of the Legendarium the Professor had not yet thought of Eriador, Rhovanion and Gondor (the territory, not the realm), hence when Karen Wynn Fonstad decided to make her Atlas, she simply added these lands between Beleriand and the Sea of Helcar (while having the South Blue Mountains end in the White Mountains), thus greatly enlarging the West-lands. However, she did not consider that based on Ambarkanta Map IV the lands east of the Sea of Helcar were as large as the lands west of it, hence she kept it as it was, and thus the East-lands in her Atlas is many times smaller than the West-lands.
According to the third theme of the Music of the Ainur, the inclusion and processing of Melkor's melody into the texture of the music is the counterpart of Melkor's spiritual power incarnating into it after the Arda vision is embodied. In my opinion, this incarnation is not homogeneously distributed over Arda, and locations such as Utumno and Angband are special places where Melkor's spiritual power spread over Arda is concentrated and focused in a certain region. Even the proto-Mordor designed by Melkor for Sauron is one of these regions. I believe that there may be a connection between the making of the One Ring and this Morgoth element.
I feel Angband is the worst place of the 3. Utumno might be the birth place of evil, but Angband is where all that evil was advanced and all issued forth from that place. The Valar had to sink the whole of Beleriand beneath the seas to wash away the destruction Angband wrought upon the world. Mordor is basically just a 3 sided mountain range wall with a tower and a volcano, how puny!
Barad-dur was more Sauron's hiding place that he refused to leave during the War of the Ring because he didn't want to lose another body. But Mordor was also designed for practicality, as Sauron needed to feed his troops and enslaved Men worked the fertile volcanic soil in southern Mordor to produce food. It was also encircled by mountains except to the east, where Sauron already controlled the realms of Men anyway.
The Broken Sword: Can you do other videos deep dive lore about; Maedhros(my favorite elf of all times,) the three houses of the Edain;(Beor,Haleth, and Hador,) HURIN Life story(don’t forget to mention his sister’s tragic ending,) the original Beren and Luthien(of the Book of Lost Tales,) Beruthiel(Dark Queen of Gondor,) The Line of the House of the Stewards of Gondor, and HUGE video about Aragorn’s “The Grey Company Travels, and Elf and Dwarves friendships(Eol and the dwarves of the Blue Mountains, Narvi and Celebrimbor, Legolas and Gimli, The Dwarves of Belegost and the break off war of Doriath, The five maiar mission that where send to protect the elf of cuivienen passing to Valinor, the different Middle Earth Plants, stars, Jewels, et.
I would love a video about that! While Finrod is beloved for many reasons, one of my favorite aspects about him is one that is often left unmentioned, yet is the reason Finrod is one of my favorite Elves. He had a love interest is Valinor, Amarië, whom he was separated from because she couldn’t follow him in his exile. This was briefly mentioned in the Silmarillion and I thought it was heartbreaking and gave so much more depth to Finrod’s character. I would’ve loved to learn more about the two of them from Tolkien.
Please do “what if Shelob got the Ring?” Remember her mother Ungoliant killed the Trees and chased Morgoth and the Silmarils to Middle Earth. A spider with the Ring would have been something!
Feel like the Utummo could possibly still exist but whoever would explore it would take forever to find its hidden rooms but if discovered could potentially Unlesh epic amounts of chaos
I always liked to think that one reason for Mordor's location was proximity; nothing in Middle Earth seemed to reference things the more east they were, and despite the fact that the world was made round, it basically seems that nothing ever sailed around that way, and attacked the east from the extreme east. We know practically nothing about the far east, or far south, and it seems that this is a thing even within the world. Since most of the important places were more western, and they still treated Valinor as if it was west, instead of separate, most threats to Sauron would have come from that direction, and even then had to practically March across all of Middle Earth, possibly up over mountain chains, just to reach his border, and then fight through the Black Gate, or over those jagged peaks, with resources already likely thinned. Utumno was hidden, but Angband was positioned in a way that siege could be laid to it for centuries, even if the good guys couldn't win, but Mordor was so far east, and wirh so many hidden, or unknown, resources that attacking it seemed foolish, even if you knew where it was. Numenor needed to sail land forces over an ocean, and then March across the land, so he just made it so inconvenient to attack no one did.
His fortresses are long gone ? Have you forgotten the bit in the lost appendix where Morgoth got a sneaky Day Pass from the uttermost void and built Ibrox ?
@@darkjudge8786 One is called 'Paradise' and the other is called 'Castle Greyskull' for a reason. My addiction is only to good football ... I note you don't state where you stay, embarrassed are we ?
Not likely, when Morgoth was around, it is most likely his dark powers and presence alone is more than enough to provide and supply all of his armies without the need of any kind of food or any sustenances (this is Fantasy stuff so try not to take it seriously), also let’s not forget Morgoth was an Ainur and a Valar/Godlike being (even when he was at his weakest) and even Valars doesn’t need any kinds of practical sustenances to survive so makes sense that Morgoth would share his non-existent, no practicality appetite on his armies when he was still around Of course by the time Morgoth was expelled and banished from Arda, the once Morgoth’s armies alone began to experience and suffer hunger (except for the Balrogs since they are Ainur as well) hence why by the time Sauron became Dark Lord in the 2nd and 3rd ages, he needed to rely on practicality this time around to provide and sustain his Orc armies, luckily for him at the back of his land Mordor called Rhun which is sustainable farming land needed for him to supply his troops
I’m more interested as to how they managed a sustainable agriculture to the point of being able to shelter and feed hundreds of thousands of orcs, trolls, beasts, and dragons You say it’s the worst place in middle earth. Seems like it may have been the most advanced place in middle earth.
Morgoth and his armies don’t required any practical sustenances when he was still around, his dark powers and presence alone was more than enough for them to survive in his fortresses, he IS their God after all and let’s not forget Morgoth is a Valar and Valars don’t need any kind of practical sustenances for they are godlike beings after all and basically live forever without need of any kinds of practicality
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Perfect places to visit during winter months
I appreciate your deep dive videos, they are timeless.
I appreciate that! 😁
I saw some information and theoryes that Utumno was build in the central north of middle earth, maybe a little bit to east. Illuin was build in the north of the central-estic regions, and Utumno was probably very close behind some mountains, where the light of Iluin was weak. So, according to this theory, Utumno’s remnants are drowwned in Utumno's bay which was probably formed after the destruction of utumno, the war of wrath and maybe the downfall of Numenor. Utumno’s bay is a little bit in northeast compared to Lonely Mountain and Eren Engrin where the dwarves had their mine (MERP map). Compared to the south regions, you can watch where sea Rhun is and go straight in the north-north-east until you reach forodwaith and where Utumno’s bay is now. Down i will show what i found.
I have searched for a definite answer to this question for a long time. There seems to be a lot of contradictory information on its location. I could not find any reasonably detailed answer at all. Therefore, I decided to have a look at the master’s works myself. A closer look at the source material revealed that some of the contradictions are misinterpretations. Hence there could very well be a consensus regarding the location of Utumno. The master definitively had a final word on the location of a Utumno. To understand where Utumno was, we will determine the vertical and horizontal location of it separately.
Was Utumno inside or behind the Iron Mountains? (Vertical position on Arda)
The literature and the drawn maps seem to contradict each other on that question. We have two maps from Tolkien which clearly show Utumno behind the Iron Mountains. Firstly, there is the “earliest map” which shows Utumno (here still written Utumna) in the northernmost part behind the Iron Mountains. Secondly, the Map IV of the “Ambarkanta maps” also shows Utumno to the north of the Iron Mountains. However, the following quote from the Silmarillion might implicate a different location of Utumno:
“Now Melkor began the delving and building of a vast fortress, deep under Earth, beneath dark mountains where the beams of Illuin were cold and dim. That stronghold was named Utumno.”
- J.R.R. Tolkien, edited by C. Tolkien: The Silmarillion
This part created the believe that Utumno was built below (and not behind) the Iron Mountains. The very popular Atlas of Middle Earth from Karen Wynn Fonstad also displays the Ruins of Utumno inside of the Iron Mountains, most probably based on this text segment. But there are two indications inside this quote which make an Utumno below the Iron Mountains highly doubtful. Firstly, the light of the Illiun were “cold and dim” at its location. Below the Iron Mountains would not be any light at all. However, behind the Iron Mountains the light would indeed be dim because that part of Arda would only see indirect light of the Lamps. I created a sketch to visualize the issue with indirect light from Illuin and the two possible locations of Utumno.
Secondly, the quote does not even mention the Iron Mountains as mountain range. It says that Utumno was build beneath “dark mountains”. Therefore, we can conclude that the theory of Utumno below the Iron Mountains is a conclusion (although an understandable one), but it is not based on the written text itself. We have further proof that Utumno was behind the Iron Mountains from the Silmarillion itself:
“In the north of the world Melkor had in the ages past reared Ered Engrin, the Iron Mountains, as a fence to his citadel of Utumno; and they stood upon the borders of the regions of everlasting cold, in a great curve from east to west.”
- J.R.R. Tolkien, edited by C. Tolkien: The Silmarillion
Melkor back then was so powerful, he did not build a wall as defense line for his citadel, he reared a gigantic mountain range. A “fence” usually encircles something. Utumno’s (first) wall was this mountain range and placing Utumno inside its own fence makes little sense. Additionally, Utumno being located behind the Iron Mountains is directly confirmed by another text piece from HoME 11:
“At this time the Valar came hither from Aman for their assault upon Melkor, whose stronghold was in the North beyond Eryd Engrin (the Iron Mountains).”
- J.R.R. Tolkien, edited by C. Tolkien: The History of Middle Earth - the War of the Jewels, Volume 11
In summary, Utumno’s gates were behind the Iron Mountains. However, its pits and tunnels probably reached the Iron Mountains or even spots in the Misty Mountains which allowed the Balrog to get there without being noticed. After determining its horizontal position, we will have a look at its even more mysterious vertical position on Arda.
Why did the awoken Elves at Cuiviénen see smoke in the north? (Horizontal position on Arda)
The following quote created the assumption that Utumno had to be in the northeast of middle earth. It tells the story of the Elves which awoke at Cuiviénen. After the destruction of Utumno, they were on their journey to Valinor:
“ […] passing northward about the Sea of Helcar they turned towards the west. Before them great clouds hung still black in the North above the ruins of war [against Utumno], and the stars in that region were hidden.”
- J.R.R. Tolkien, edited by C. Tolkien: The Silmarillion
After the Battle of Powers (war on Utumno), the Sea of Helcar was clearly in the east of Middle Earth (Ambarkanta Map V). Therefore, the region north of it (Utumno) should be the northeast of middle earth. This is obviously contradictory with the earlier map of Tolkien which I cited earlier (Map IV). Map IV portrayed Utumno in the northwest. So, what is the right horizontal position behind the Iron Mountains? Was Tolkien aware of this issue and gave an answer to this question?
Actually, yes, there is a note note in HoME 11:
“'(Utumno)... at the western end' > 'at the midmost'. This shift of Utumno eastwards is implied in the hasty note pencilled on the LQ 2 text of Chapter 2, Of Valinor and the Two Trees, in which the story entered that Angband also was built in the ancient days, 'not far from the northwestern shores of the Sea'”
- J.R.R. Tolkien, edited by C. Tolkien: The History of Middle Earth - the War of the Jewels, Volume 11
According to this source, this note is from 1958 and therefore much younger than the earlier mentioned maps. Notice that it says “western end”, clearly indicating a change to the horizontal position of Utumno on the map. The note represents the final documented thought of Tolkien on the Location of Utumno. Therefore, Utumno finally returned to its original central location behind the northern mountain range just as displayed in the earliest map.
Nonetheless, the quote above from the even younger Silmarillion about the journey of the Elves might still create the image of an Utumno even further to the east. At least on a world like ours. Right here is a rather complex misinterpretation issue according to my analysis. Arda back then was in no way like our world is nowadays. It was flat. This basically means that the cardinal points need to be interpreted differently. On a round world, the northern most part can always be reached simply by going northwards.
This is not true for a flat world. A flat world has one single northern most point. To reach it, you always must go to the midmost part of the world and then upwards. Only there is the most northern point of a flat world. The graphic is based on the Atlas of Middle Earth.
As we concluded above, Tolkien placed Utumno at the midmost part behind the Iron Mountains. Therefore, Utumno in the north of the flat Arda was always at the “midmost” horizontal position, no matter from which point you were facing north. This part might be not all that easy to understand so please do not hesitate to ask any questions.
Melkor’s first and mightiest citadel was probably the most hellish place ever to exits on Middle Earth. The malice and darkness of this place were just unimaginable. I hope this thread brings some light to it!
There is just a one real criticism about this statement:
The Sea of Helcar was in the east of middle earth. Therefore, the region north of it (Utumno) should be the northeast of middle earth
If you look at map IV, from which you draw your conclusion, the inland Sea of Helk(c)ar is not to the east of M-E. It is central and Cuiveinen is to the east of the Sea but still not to the far east of M-E.
But this is the mistake of Karen Wynn Fonstad in her "The Atlas of Middle-earth", despite it being an amazing work of cartography. The problem is that while the Ambarkanta Map IV (which is more a diagramatic map than a topographic), the Sea of Helcar and the Sea of Ringil are shown to be in the middle of Endor, in Ambarkanta Map V the West-lands are depicted as larger, because JRRT wanted to show the details of Beleriand. Not to mention how at that phase of the Legendarium the Professor had not yet thought of Eriador, Rhovanion and Gondor (the territory, not the realm), hence when Karen Wynn Fonstad decided to make her Atlas, she simply added these lands between Beleriand and the Sea of Helcar (while having the South Blue Mountains end in the White Mountains), thus greatly enlarging the West-lands. However, she did not consider that based on Ambarkanta Map IV the lands east of the Sea of Helcar were as large as the lands west of it, hence she kept it as it was, and thus the East-lands in her Atlas is many times smaller than the West-lands.
Bro... Just make a video already. I ain't reading all that and it sounds like you have the content to fill a video....
Very good Analysis, thank you 👌
@@Sandnan_der_gruene_Pilger It's not my own analysis, i just discover it, but thank you.
Thanks for the content! Does more for the fans than you know!
Thank you so much 😁
Utumno is Quenya word for "Underworld". Angband is a Sindarin word that literally meant "Iron Prison" or "Hell of Iron".
I wanted a video on Utumno pretty close to this being released. It's so rarely mentioned despite being such an important place.
According to the third theme of the Music of the Ainur, the inclusion and processing of Melkor's melody into the texture of the music is the counterpart of Melkor's spiritual power incarnating into it after the Arda vision is embodied. In my opinion, this incarnation is not homogeneously distributed over Arda, and locations such as Utumno and Angband are special places where Melkor's spiritual power spread over Arda is concentrated and focused in a certain region. Even the proto-Mordor designed by Melkor for Sauron is one of these regions. I believe that there may be a connection between the making of the One Ring and this Morgoth element.
Utumno without a doubt is the most evil, Angband next and Mordor last. But that doesn't mean I would want to spend time in any of them.
I feel Angband is the worst place of the 3. Utumno might be the birth place of evil, but Angband is where all that evil was advanced and all issued forth from that place. The Valar had to sink the whole of Beleriand beneath the seas to wash away the destruction Angband wrought upon the world. Mordor is basically just a 3 sided mountain range wall with a tower and a volcano, how puny!
Man, i wish there was more info and lore available about these two iconic places.
It would be really awesome to see Angband and Utumno in a live action film or in animation
Or as Lego models.
Juat dont let amazon do it
It would be cool to see most of the events of the Silmarillion in live action but i just wouldn’t trust them to do it justice.
@@primal1233 Ancalagon the Black as well
Okay, Valar, NOW do you see why reprieves for recidivists don't work?
The Broken Sword: our defense against Amazon. I appreciate your content more, now than ever! You help clense the palette of Tolkien abusers!
Utumno and Angband?
I just imagine Bezos' and Musk's mansions.
Does Utumno (or the ruins of) still exist above the waves in the Third Age?
Could you do a deep dive into Forodwaith?
Barad-dur was more Sauron's hiding place that he refused to leave during the War of the Ring because he didn't want to lose another body. But Mordor was also designed for practicality, as Sauron needed to feed his troops and enslaved Men worked the fertile volcanic soil in southern Mordor to produce food. It was also encircled by mountains except to the east, where Sauron already controlled the realms of Men anyway.
I thought mordor was created by jabbing a sword Into the ground? 🤫😑
The most evil fortress of Melkor? His dark heart. No one could ever penetrate its walls and conquer it.
The Broken Sword: Can you do other videos deep dive lore about; Maedhros(my favorite elf of all times,) the three houses of the Edain;(Beor,Haleth, and Hador,) HURIN Life story(don’t forget to mention his sister’s tragic ending,) the original Beren and Luthien(of the Book of Lost Tales,) Beruthiel(Dark Queen of Gondor,) The Line of the House of the Stewards of Gondor, and HUGE video about Aragorn’s “The Grey Company Travels, and Elf and Dwarves friendships(Eol and the dwarves of the Blue Mountains, Narvi and Celebrimbor, Legolas and Gimli, The Dwarves of Belegost and the break off war of Doriath, The five maiar mission that where send to protect the elf of cuivienen passing to Valinor, the different Middle Earth Plants, stars, Jewels, et.
Uh i thought the Balrogs were just fallen fire miya not that they were created?
They were fallen Maia, though I assume Morgoth had some involvement in the form they took as basically fire demons.
@Destroyer94100 hmmm i dont believe it states anywhere that he had anything to do with their forms or anything like that explicitly
The Broken Sword: Can you please do a video deep dive of; Athrabeth Finrod ah Andreth, where a mortal women and an elf prince fall in love.
I would love a video about that! While Finrod is beloved for many reasons, one of my favorite aspects about him is one that is often left unmentioned, yet is the reason Finrod is one of my favorite Elves. He had a love interest is Valinor, Amarië, whom he was separated from because she couldn’t follow him in his exile. This was briefly mentioned in the Silmarillion and I thought it was heartbreaking and gave so much more depth to Finrod’s character. I would’ve loved to learn more about the two of them from Tolkien.
So THAT’S what Gandalf meant with “Flame of Udûn!”
Exactly. Such a great line!
Hey babe..
Broken Sword dropped a new video...
*she casts it to the tv thus shocking me*
I knew i married this woman for a good reason.
Subbed
Please do “what if Shelob got the Ring?” Remember her mother Ungoliant killed the Trees and chased Morgoth and the Silmarils to Middle Earth. A spider with the Ring would have been something!
If done right, Id love to see these places come to life in a movie
I was good with Utumno until the flies. Not dealing with the damn flies.
Feel like the Utummo could possibly still exist but whoever would explore it would take forever to find its hidden rooms but if discovered could potentially Unlesh epic amounts of chaos
I always liked to think that one reason for Mordor's location was proximity; nothing in Middle Earth seemed to reference things the more east they were, and despite the fact that the world was made round, it basically seems that nothing ever sailed around that way, and attacked the east from the extreme east. We know practically nothing about the far east, or far south, and it seems that this is a thing even within the world. Since most of the important places were more western, and they still treated Valinor as if it was west, instead of separate, most threats to Sauron would have come from that direction, and even then had to practically March across all of Middle Earth, possibly up over mountain chains, just to reach his border, and then fight through the Black Gate, or over those jagged peaks, with resources already likely thinned. Utumno was hidden, but Angband was positioned in a way that siege could be laid to it for centuries, even if the good guys couldn't win, but Mordor was so far east, and wirh so many hidden, or unknown, resources that attacking it seemed foolish, even if you knew where it was. Numenor needed to sail land forces over an ocean, and then March across the land, so he just made it so inconvenient to attack no one did.
How about a list of the most powerful elvish kingdom's in middle earth in the first age 😊
His fortresses are long gone ? Have you forgotten the bit in the lost appendix where Morgoth got a sneaky Day Pass from the uttermost void and built Ibrox ?
Think you are talking about Celtic Park chief. Although all of Glasgow fits the description . Got your daily methadone mate or still in the gear?
@@darkjudge8786 One is called 'Paradise' and the other is called 'Castle Greyskull' for a reason. My addiction is only to good football ... I note you don't state where you stay, embarrassed are we ?
These are too short.
If the Noldor surrounded Angband for nearly half a millennium one would think those inside would have long died of starvation.
They ate mushrooms.
They were never able to cover the north side because of the mountains, so Morgoth's servants and troops could move freely up there.
Not likely, when Morgoth was around, it is most likely his dark powers and presence alone is more than enough to provide and supply all of his armies without the need of any kind of food or any sustenances (this is Fantasy stuff so try not to take it seriously), also let’s not forget Morgoth was an Ainur and a Valar/Godlike being (even when he was at his weakest) and even Valars doesn’t need any kinds of practical sustenances to survive so makes sense that Morgoth would share his non-existent, no practicality appetite on his armies when he was still around
Of course by the time Morgoth was expelled and banished from Arda, the once Morgoth’s armies alone began to experience and suffer hunger (except for the Balrogs since they are Ainur as well) hence why by the time Sauron became Dark Lord in the 2nd and 3rd ages, he needed to rely on practicality this time around to provide and sustain his Orc armies, luckily for him at the back of his land Mordor called Rhun which is sustainable farming land needed for him to supply his troops
3rd, huzzah!!!
I’m more interested as to how they managed a sustainable agriculture to the point of being able to shelter and feed hundreds of thousands of orcs, trolls, beasts, and dragons
You say it’s the worst place in middle earth. Seems like it may have been the most advanced place in middle earth.
Morgoth and his armies don’t required any practical sustenances when he was still around, his dark powers and presence alone was more than enough for them to survive in his fortresses, he IS their God after all and let’s not forget Morgoth is a Valar and Valars don’t need any kind of practical sustenances for they are godlike beings after all and basically live forever without need of any kinds of practicality
Video 328
First
And the opening is still hyper annoying.... i love the content, but oof