Rivian SUB-ZERO Drive! How does EXTREME COLD affect range? | Rivian Dad
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- Опубліковано 28 лип 2024
- I take Rocky the Rivian R1T out for a 2 hour drive on frozen Colorado highways to see how the cold weather impacts range in a real-world test. I start with a bone-cold battery at minus 13 degrees Fahrenheit and drive for two hours on flat roads to get the battery to warm up.
CONTENTS:
00:00:00 Intro
00:00:42 10 minutes in
00:01:32 20 Minutes in
00:02:28 30 minutes in
00:04:03 52 minutes in
00:05:04 Snow Mode?
00:05:48 1 hour in
00:10:08 1 hr 40 minutes in
00:10:43 Efficiency touches 2mi/kWh
00:11:28 Rivian Denver Service Center
00:12:46 What is the Rivian's Grade?
00:18:25 Final Thoughts
#R1T #R1S #RangeTest - Наука та технологія
Extra points for anyone who can spot the typo!
I live in Castle Rock, just south of Denver, and left my house at 7:45am yesterday, in -17F weather. I had the advantage of having my R1T in my garage, and the temperature was about 40F. So my battery was more than 50 degrees warmer, plus it had charged overnight, and I pre-heated the truck cabin before pulling out of the garage, while it was on the charger. I wasn't watching the efficiency graphs, but I went about 70 miles that day, and didn't notice much of a range drop. I think having a warmer battery made all the difference. I think the first hour of your trip the truck was putting a lot of energy into heating your battery up to a more reasonable temperature. I also didn't have any issue going into snow mode or with the adaptive cruise control. The HVAC also worked like a champ, I love the heated steering wheel as well!
VERY INTERESTING! Thanks for sharing. This was exactly my suspicion. In fact, from our road trip, we found that cold weather didn't impact the range at all - once the battery was warm from driving. I have also gained a new appreciation for steering wheel heaters. :) Thanks!
@@RivianDad , First, Scott, thanks for making the video and sharing your experience with your Rivian in very cold temps.
I took about a 1300 mi road trip in my R1S a few weeks ago in similar conditions. You both confirmed my experience as well, though I will say I found my avg mi/kW remained well below 2 even hours into the ride. I believe the vehicle struggled to keep the battery warm in the extreme cold. The avg got better when it warmed up into the 20s f.
One thing I will point out is the in-cabin heat struggled. I had to crank the thermostat up into the mid to upper 70s to feel any heat, otherwise it was cool air coming out of the vents.
Scott, thanks for another great video. I have driven about 150 miles here in Iowa with temps around -5 to -10F and have been averaging around 1.0 to 1.25 m/kWh. All of my driving has been on short trips, 20 miles or less, so nice to know that the efficiency will go up some as the battery warms up. My trips start from an unheated garage. I have also notice some range increase if I begin the trips after having the vehicle plugged in to my home charger for a couple hours to warm the battery before departing. So far, so good, but like you, a little disappointed in the cold weather range. Overall, still love the vehicle over the first 6,000 miles!
Very interesting and relevant perspective. I think it’s a bit less daunting that I may have initially thought. Turns out if you take a few steps, like you’re suggesting, that the range will do pretty well once you’re on the road. Thanks for your feedback!
Great video! Would really like to see the same with preconditioning to see how good it could be.
Good video. Seems to have been a good learning experience. What you experienced is likely applicable to all EV’s. The battery needs to be warm before starting on a trip. Unfortunately, there are lots of people living in dense population areas that have to park on the street at night and likely may not be able to keep the car plugged-in overnight or even throughout the day for longer stop periods.
Really interesting to see the impact of the cold quantified. I've had our Model S for 7 years now, and knew there was a big drop in the snow but it just doesn't have data to et you see the full impact.
I'll bet it's pretty similar. Thanks!
Great video Scott. I feel like electric is like diesel trucks and plug them in 110v to keep them warm. The cold only really worries for road trips, but still good to know.
If you combine this experience with our experience on the road trip ( ua-cam.com/video/kyTkKoiWy_E/v-deo.html ), I think it's clear that when the battery is warmed, the efficiency is "normal." It's the getting TO warm that hurts the efficiency. So, the road trips are less impacted by cold. Thx for watching!
Just a note about the mechanical issues: There were no issues the day before, which was much warmer (and before the software update). Also, you'll notice there were sensor issues as well. I chalked that up to the snow around the vehicle, and the cold. I'll let you know if it resets itself.
Edit: the mechanical issues resolved themselves once the temp warmed up for a day or so.
If you leave the vehicle connected and warm it up before starting, does the battery warm up faster?
Also, today at 40 degrees, snow mode activated!!!
@@robinlunt2535 Ah, so it goes into snow mode when it couldn't possibly be snowing. Not good. I hope Rivian addresses the issue.
Please keep us posted on what Rivian advises about the suspension.
I have assumed that having the truck plugged in keeps the battery warm(er), but on cold days I still get the cold icon in the lower right and occasional pop up notices that Regen is reduced while the battery is cold.
Also, Snow Mode simply reduces regenerative braking. Low Standard and High are options in Snow Mode, it’s 4WD so basically All Purpose with less regenerative breaking to avoid skids / slides that I’ve seen mentioned in forums.
Finally, with the recent software update the App allows heating the cabin, I assume this wakes up the battery and prepares it for travel, but “preconditioning” is not mentioned.
Happy holiday, interesting issues regarding the suspension, but considering electronics have a lower working limit normally around where the temp was in this video, I'm not surprised.
With the news report I've just read regarding the artic storms that have hit the US, stay safe.
Thanks! Yeah, I'm wondering if it will clear up by itself when the weather warms. Yes it's very cold here, but supposed to be balmy on Christmas Day! Go figure. Thx for watching.
It's not the electronics. I drove my Grand Cherokee three hours to the Poconos last night at -4 F and the air suspension worked perfectly the entire time. As I mentioned in another comment, almost all air suspension issues in cold weather are due to moisture getting into the system. Then the compressor freezes and the air suspension stops working. At the factory, the system is filled with high purity nitrogen. If atmospheric air gets into the system, it brings moisture along with it and this can cause all kinds of problems, but most notably compressor freeze in cold weather, rendering the air suspension inoperable. The solution is to get the suspension evacuated and refilled with nitrogen. And of course leak test it to see why the air got in there in the first place. Air suspension systems are designed to take in atmospheric air when the system experiences a leak in order to keep everything working. So if you have a healthy air suspension system with no leaks and a full charge of nitrogen, there shouldn't be any issues even at -13F.
Air suspension means somewhere is a compressor. Most likely have a bit of water in a line somewhere in the lines which is frozen.
It will go up once the battery warms up. This is something you need to mention more appropriately and explain to people. Once the battery is full warmth, especially on road trips it will be about a 25 percent or less hit.
Edit: Nevermind, you kinda did go over it all. Nice video
Thanks! I do try and cover the basics as best as I can. Sometimes stuff slips through the cracks. Thx for watching.
Hey Scott! Bummed you didn’t get to test out Snow Mode! It’s solid. My R1T is parked outside, I had to get around in -10, so I pre-conditioned the battery by having it plugged in (it charged overnight to 70%), and 30 min before I had to leave I biked charging limit to 85% and I turned on some HVAC. Besides being comfy when I hopped in, I was at about 1.4 efficiency right out of the gate. That may be my trick going forward on super cold days when I’ve got a good amount of miles ahead of me. Fwiw and hi from the fam!
I agree. This is the way.
Note to self, turn off kneel mode if temps are going down by that much and leave height in standard.
Yeah. Note that the R1S handled the weather without any mechanical issues so my R1T issues might be an outlier. We'll see if it resets itself when the weather warms up. Thanks for watching!
B-, tough grader!!
Applied to electricity- those atmospheric issues impact everything like a natural gas power plant produces less electricity at higher altitude (less oxygen).
Ha, well B- is not a bad grade. Any other day it gets an A at least.
@3:54 nice drifting!! :P
Ha, Thanks!! I did a lot more today once I got snow mode actually going. :)
I am watching many different EV videos to see if they get them to where they are practical. When they do, I will purchase one. By practical I mean the following. Range of 400 miles minimum in all weather. Charge times at a commercial charging station empty to full in under 10 minutes. Price in the range the same as a comparable sized gas model before any government incentives. Thanks for exposing the faults of an EV.
most gas cars don't even have 400miles range?
@@throwawaypt2throwawaypt2-xp8nx your claim is totally false. Even if it was true, it only takes about 5 minutes to refuel.
@@JohnSmith-ug5ci I'm interested to hear how often you drive 800mi, with one stop. 🤣
@@fifthcircle1 never. I have never made such a claim. However I have driven 714 mile without a stop. On long trips I usually drive around 600 mile before stopping and fueling up. Lastly I can fuel up in around 10 minutes which includes bladder relief. In an EV it would take over an hour empty to full charge stopping two or three times, but manufacturers do not recommend fully charging. EVERY EV on the market is a scam.
I would be interested in if the Rivian offers a preconditioning of the battery and cabin temperature before driving - for best already being connected to a wallmount charger and a timer used for both. 🤔
What was up with that bus flap haha? I experience about the same in mine. Unfortunately I have to keep my R1T outside but try to warm it up while it's still plugged in. The efficiency is right around 1 for the first 20-30 minutes of driving then levels out around 1.5 in temps below freezing. This is with the HVAC on BTW. Thanks for the video Scott!
Thanks! Yeah, it's an important bit of info for me: warm up the vehicle at home while still sucking juice from the grid.
Great video! even 1mile per kwh is pretty good considering the heavy temps. Yeah figure the air compressors dont want to turn on since its so cold outside. maybe compressing air that cold would break the compressors so it stops itself.
but you would think that youd get a more details error msg lol. maybe its a case of "keep it simple stupid" to not confuse the typical consumer.
also please dont hang out of the left lane if youre not passing someone. no point especially when youre driving slower due to snow. stick to the right and chill since youre going slow.
thx. Yeah and in the end, the efficiency was pretty decent even for a cold day. It was just the start that hurt.
And, don’t fret, I can drive just fine. When it’s snowy/icy road, I choose the safest lane first - even if people behind me have to slow down, which is good for everyone. If I’m going too slow, I’ll scoot over. But I stay in the lane with the best driving conditions.
Would love to see a rehash of this video this weekend, but using the preconditioning feature that was just released.
Seeing if you can reach the better range numbers earlier in the drive
Good idea, but unfortunately don’t think I can pull it off this weekend. I’ll keep it on the list. Thanks!!
Actually… decided it was a must-do video. Thanks! I credited you in the vid. (Link soon)
Air suspension thats not working in cold weather is often due to the compressor freezing up. And that only can happen if atmospheric air gets into the system and displaces the moisture-free nitrogen that it's filled with from the factory. If the system starts working normally again when the weather warms up, it's almost definitely going to be moisture from atmospheric air in the system.
I’m happy to report that the system is working fine now after warming up again. Interesting info. Thanks!
@@RivianDad so it fixed itself when warmer, good to know.
@@GA-wq8xq yes. probably some water in the line somewhere which mucked up the system
How did the hvac work at those temps? We were in Denver today as well, flying out this evening. Happy Holidays! Keep the content coming! We pickup our R1S tomorrow!!!
I was out in -17F temperatures, and the HVAC worked great, along with the heated seats and steering wheel. It wasn't snowing though, which could have made things a lot more challenging.
Congrats on the R1S. Hope you love it!!
HVAC worked well enough that I took off my coat and hat after a bit since I was too warm. And, that's without blasting it (since I was trying to be at least a little nice to the truck). And, it should also be noted that I haven't experienced the mechanical issues with the R1S at the same temp. Thx
@@RivianDad your windshield looked frosty the whole drive… how are the defroster and windshield washers?
Thanks, Scott! Excellent video. Performance of ICE cars improves if you warm them up (let them idle) in cold weather. Why isn’t the same principle applicable to BEVs, I wonder?
Note that the driving performance was amazing right out of the gate, it's efficiency that takes a hit. So, range. If the vehicle was warmer to start, I feel like it would have done much better. This is one reason why people in cold climates have block heaters. But, you're right. Lesson learned.
@@RivianDad Yes! Block heaters! I had one when I lived in Syracuse, New York!
How does the heater work? Does it stay warm in the truck?
Probably battery temperatures if it wasn't preconditioned or plugged in before setting off. Warming the battery and cabin beforehand (while plugged in) will minimize battery demand once on the road. Better said than done for many who cant plug in or garage it overnight.
For those without a garage, but can plug it in, remote or scheduled preconditioning (remote start) is usually available for these vehicles. Scheduling charging to end just before a commute or trip will also warm the battery, the simple act of charging generates heat within the pack.
For those who cannot plug in so easily, preconditioning (remote start) is usually available, and may warm the battery depending on the vehicle. Unfortunately, this will use a good chunk of energy in the process. Not a necessary step, but a comfortable one for a warm cabin. Otherwise, bumping up tire pressures in these temperatures will help, they no doubt dropped significantly from the warmer days. Reducing cabin heat is a big one, keep those settings below 70F and prioritize seat and steering wheel heat, if equipped. Slowing down helps, that cold air is thick while most likely battling increased rolling resistance from snow and slush on the roads.
From experience in Minnesota with a Chev Volt, we usually saw a 35% drop in range (below EPA figures) with temperatures below 15F. Most of that energy went into cabin heating, though we preconditioned while plugged in when possible. The worst was a 45% drop while the vehicle sat (unplugged) in -25F temperatures for two days.... that only happened once. Otherwise, between 15F to about 30F we were living with a 20%-25% drop. And continually improving above 30F.
Thanks William, excellent information. And thank you so much for taking the time to write this out. Great community, and it’s great to learn from each other. It seems like your information lines up well with my experience. I’ve also tried on the channel to consider EV adoption for those who are in unique circumstances, like, as you point out, people who don’t have a garage to park in, or a place to charge at home. I want to see better solutions for everyone, so the EV adoption is accelerated.
@@RivianDad
I figured my comment isn't much news to you, but figured it useful to other viewers new with EV adoption. What you're doing is much more informative in documenting real world experience.
Great video! This is the first one I have seen in the well below 0 temp area. It performs how I would expect; large range hit when unconditioned and cold but still good for an EV. From what I read and see elsewhere, a warm garage and preconditioned battery makes a significant difference. Great info.
How much heat did you have on? Seat warmers? Heated steering wheel? High heat? Low heat? Auto heat at 70? I have a feeling all the heat features would suck a lot of power. I anticipate myself only using the bare minimum on a longer trip for that reason.
I didn’t turn on the seat heater or the heated steering wheel, I had the air conditioning on at 73° I think. But I didn’t blast it. People online have said that it’s better to use the heat seater and the steering wheel since it draws less energy than the standard heater. Part of my objective was to simulate a cold start and a “normal“ drive as if I were commuting so the heater was on. Honestly, I don’t think it affected efficiency it all that much compared to warming the battery. But certainly some. Mostly, I think it was just the fact that the battery was so cold. It took a while to warm up.
It’s pretty easy to conserve EV range in the cold (at least initially) by preconditioning the battery while still connected to power (regardless of whether the vehicle is parked outside or in a garage. Obviously in the garage the vehicle and battery start out a bit warmer. Simulating the cold start is useful for a return commute etc…but I wonder what the ratio is between preconditioning (not connected to power) to range conservation….
@@awashkowitz7156 thanks. Yes, it’s a very good question, and I don’t have a complete answer. Still trying to figure it out. I’m trying to get some measurements of the battery efficiency between the two different states either plugged in or not plugged in, but it’s a little tricky.
Doesn’t the heat affect the efficiency on colder days?hows the heat works in cold days like this?
my model y lost about 15% in the 30s-40s degrees
I wonder if it would have fared better if it were kept warmer than that in a garage. Probably so. Thx for your comment.
What if truck was outside , but was on charger and pre- warmed before leaving ?
Hey what's your cabin temps... Live in ks.. debating on r1s
Scott - we got the Hakka R5 tires on the R1S. Let me know if you want to take it for a spin to see the difference. 👍
Yes!! We’re waiting for ours.
@@robinlunt2535 just drove to Steamboat. It was impressive. Like glue on the snowpack/ice roads. Snow mode + Hakka = amazing.
Very cool! Yeah, I want to see them.
it was a good test. I hope you can do another test in similar conditions, but instead have the truck plugged in before the journey starts.
Yes, I'd like to do that, although it will be up to Mother Nature if she wants to give us -13 degree weather again.
I want one but we do get -40 below up here lol
Does it do better if it is plugged in for charging or conditioning when parked outside?
From what I've heard, it DOES do better if it is plugged in before driving. Assuming that the battery was recently charging so it has not had a chance to cool all the way off. I will have to verify that, though. Thanks!
You seems like using the Pirelli Scorpion OEM tires, not some snow tires. How did you feel about using those in such condition?
I actually felt the tires did quite well. I’m sure there are better tires for snow, but these are good. Thx
@@RivianDad Thanks for sharing your experience! I was on the fence whether to get Blizzak and Costco had a deal until yesterday. Decided to see this winter and then decide. Storage is more of a problem than buying an extra set!
@@ayeameen thx. Let me know if you get/like the Blizzaks
@@RivianDad I am passing using blizzak this year. I'll see how it goes. I have season's pass for skiing for last 3 years and go their quite often. My previous car also had 3 peak rated CrossClimate2 tires. So far it wasn't a problem with that.
Did you pre-condition the battery before starting?
No. I did not. I did that on purpose, since I wanted to get the coldest possible start to see how long it took the battery to warm up.
Wondering if you tried other drive modes to see if the suspension would change heights. Probably the cold.
Yes. It would go into Conserve mode. Probably because it’s the same ride height. Note that the problem cleared up by itself a day later when it warmed up.
@@RivianDad what about sport mode that is also low?
@@GA-wq8xq I didn't try any other modes. Note that it worked again when the temp warmed up two days later.
@@RivianDad glad it worked again without a service call.
When it's that cold outside, will the charge door open?
I’ve never had problems with the charge door opening.
I would've tried a hard reset but unlikely it would've helped.
I'll try that later when it's warmer. Good idea. Thx!
Was the heater on? That draws a bunch.
Yes. I tried to simulate a normal drive. It wasn’t blasting though.
Can you test if your spare tire latch is frozen?
Sorry, I didn’t do that. it’s warm now so it wouldn’t matter, but I will say that the doors worked just fine - and the gear tunnel door.
At the 52 minute point it says you travelled 31.8 miles and used 12.9KW - that would equal 2.47 miles per KW not 1.28 so what am I missing?
not sure how that is calculated. I'll have to look into it. thx
Were you ever able to figure out why Snow Mode didn't work? Was it the extreme cold or was it another malfunction?
It started working when it warmed up. We think it wouldn’t work because the truck wouldn’t change height. That was certainly connected to the cold (water in air suspension perhaps).
Is your R1S limestone color?
Yes
Interesting video. Yeah, these things are gonna be much happier when parked in a garage overnight and made toasty before heading out…otherwise efficiency and general range will not be stellar.
Yeah. I'm generally pleased compared to our other EV which takes a much bigger hit during cold weather.
We seen that u had ice on the windshield, y was that
Cuz it was freakin’ 13 below zero. I scraped but there was plenty that was pretty hard to get off. It came off eventually.
Shouldn't it get a much worst rating since it was build as an off roading adventure truck? This is the second video I've watched the cold weather made a Rivian fail. Seems they need to test cold weather better.
Do you precondition?
Not normally. And for this drive I intentionally did not since I wanted to drive from bone cold. I know that preconditioning would have helped things.
@@RivianDad just wondering life gets busy I’m sure you don’t think about precondition 24/7!
@@enriquereboyras4381 Tell me about it. I barely have enough time to put it into Drive. :) Thx for asking though.
What kind of scarf was that?
Washington Nationals (used to live there)
-13c is not that cold. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
-13 f is 🥶🥶🥶
Oh. May want to use the temperature measurement next time to avoid confusion.
Or use celsius as it is the better measurement to use.
@@Digikidthevoiceofreasonhard to argue with that, but it's the system we have! thx
@@RivianDadI’m pretty sure, or at least hope, he’s messing with you. You stated you were in Colorado, were using miles, and it looks like -13f vs -13c. It is pretty obvious which system you were using.
Toys for the rich. Not ready for prime time. Extreme heat. Extreme cold. Towing heavy loads. All greatly reduce range. Not practical to wait an hour or more to charge to only get 120 miles. And imagine getting stuck in a pile up on a highway in extreme cold for hours? Literally life and death! Nope! 10 years from now maybe! Enjoy all your early adopters with endless cash and credit to pay 2-3x the cost for 1/3 to 1/2 the range in extreme conditions! And NOT helping the environment as the materials for the batteries are mined with borderline slave labor and wrecking the earth more than drilling and carbon monoxide in the air right now! Wake up!
Snow mode should not be dependent of air suspension setting. That's a stupid move, Rivian. Make Snow Mode available at any air suspension setting.
I’m going to agree with you on that one. It is working again and I did get snow mode going. And, I noticed that snow mode defaults to the middle ride height, which is above where I was on this drive. But yeah, that’s a fix that Rivian should add. Thanks.