Why GM Cancelled Its First Mid-Engine Sports Car - 1984-1988 Pontiac Fiero
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- Опубліковано 13 жов 2024
- The 1984-1988 Pontiac Fiero was not only GM's first mid-engined sports car but it was also America's first mid-engine car. When the Fiero was first released for the 1984 model year, it was praised by the automotive press and its sales far exceeded GM's expectations. Watch the video to find out why GM cancelled the Fiero.
As a former technician working for Pontiac during these times, I can attest to the popularity of the Fiero and the unique driving feel of GM’s first mid-engined car. I really liked the direct feel of the steering as it was a manual rack & pinion unit. The car inherently had a rear weight bias as the power train was all behind the front seats. It was about as close as you could reasonably get to a roadworthy go-cart experience. You sat low and all of the mass of the car was centered between the four wheels. I agree that the 1988 version was finally blessed with the proper suspension and chassis that it deserved from day one, rather than the front end of the Chevette out front, and the front power train and suspension from the Citation out back. As a Pontiac fan from way back, I could never learn to admire GM and the Chevrolet favoritisms within. The Fiero certainly had its fair share of quirks too, but overall a very innovative creation within some very tight constraints. Pontiac has a long history of that. It feels emptier in the automotive without them around. Another GM better idea...SARCASM!
The most fun car I've ever owned was an '86 Fiero with the V6. You could reach out and touch the ground from behind the wheel, it could smoke the tires with ease and it took 90 degree corners like it was on rails. If I had the money I'd find another one and keep it just for kicks. Great car.
Had one. We were doing good financially and my wife just had to have one. Never disliked that car.
Remember the 79' Trans Am? The T/A 6.6? They advertised it as 220 hp. When Hot Rod magazine tested it, it had 260+
They had to lie to protect the Corvette. So instead of making the Corvette better, they chose to make everything worse. What kind of thinking is that?
The way I heard it is that GM was told to eliminate some of it's brands by the Obama Administration or they wouldn't get any money to bail them out. Olds was already shut down, Pontiac had to go, Hummer was sold to the Chinese for pennues on the dollar, and Saturn had to shut down because they were made in the South (as a favor to the UAW, since the factory was non Union). I hear ya, tho.....my 68 Firebird & 95 Cutlass Convertibles will always have a place in my heart ❤
we have 3 ,,an we have corvairs too an a 95 transport ,,ok i worked at delco so i know cars lol
My Father designed it. It was credited to his boss, but I remember coming home from college for Christmas break and walking into the the family drafting/art room and seeing plans that looked like the finished product long before his boss saw them. GM screwed it up telling him it should be "a secretary commuter car" and made him use a Chevette front suspension and the old heavy Iron duke 4 cylinder. I went to CA with him for the wind tunnel testing. He was near heartbroken. Ironically, he left GM and went to Entech that GM hired to improve to Fiero. I remember spending time with him there and the smell of clay and oil. The 6 cylinder GT was born. Better suspension, engine etc. Even did a prototype Convertible. They took it out to AZ and ran it on mountian roads with rented Porches and Ferraris. I believe GM saw it as a Corvette killer and dumped it.
Your dad designed a sick car
The entire rear suspension , including steering, "unibody/strut" , subframd/engine cradle was all taken from the X/A car platform. It even used the tie rods design from the X/A cars. And it was supposed to be a Commuter Car. Not a sports car. The sales sound high but were nothing compared the other A car sales numbers. In those years GM sold almost 500,000 Buick Century each model year . !
That's awesome. Thanks for sharing that bit of history. You should be very proud of him.
Wow, your daddy designed the whole car?
Thats nothing, my daddy designed Cape Canaveral and the entire Apollo moon rocket, and I designed the internet.
@@TwoLotus2 Trolls
I have two 84 Fiero’s. People don’t realize how well they handle. You have the best of both worlds. Awesome handling and a smooth comfortable ride. Fiero seats are the most comfortable seats 💺 i’ve been in.
Yes they did i had a 84 also
richard slack Awesome!
Miss my '87. Unfortunately it was too expensive to maintain. I LOVED the way it cornered! It was manual so I wouldn't need an alarm today!
I have a 86 4 cylinder. It was my daily driver for years. It got over 30+ mpg and it is pretty reliable. It is fun to drive and I don't see how you would need power steering. Being GM the parts are common and not very expensive. I am tall but there is plenty of legroom and good headroom. Getting in is not too bad being so low. I just open the door and sit into the seat backward and swing the legs in.
@@pctrashtalk2069 exactly ! Tall people need not to worry being in a Fiero. Plenty of leg room and also shoulder room.
Pontiac was always the crazy GM kid.
We Build Excitement! 😉
Oldsmobile has traditionally been the division that received new technology - the first fully automatic transmission, OHV "Rocket" V8 in 1949, front wheel drive Toronado 1966, even the Quad4 was once considered state of the art - by GM at least.
@@timothykeith1367 and yet Chevy was always the best seller.
@@kiprandom7208 Probably because Chevy was better at selling "youth" over innovation.
@@V8AmericanMuscleCar YAY!!
"8.1g on the skid test". Wow. That's unbelievable! ;)
no 0.81 g !
Yes! Surprised I had to scroll so far to find someone else that caught that handling 'misstatement'! Can you imagine the number of lawsuits? 🏎️ 🚑 🤔 😁
At the same time, the 1984 Corvette recorded the best skidpad numbers of any production car in history, .90g. But you had to gather all your teeth fillings after a spirited drive. We're talking stiff.
Came here with the same comment.. this guy's credibility just went out the window.
Well GM is very good at making STUPID decisions. And it just keeps getting WORSE.
Amen. Just look at the EV1.
The Fiero was not a mid engined vehicle it was a rear engine vehicle. It was simply a front engine trans axle setup put in the rear of the car, engine was not in front of the rear axle
Troll much?! Not a GM fan but they’ve got several great cars. Volt / Bolt / C8 are all great and excellent engineering.
I still get a laugh out of their stupid Optispark. They make beautiful junk.
My thoughts exactly
Awesome cars. I wish they had considered the turbo charged 3.8 for the GT.
not too late to do it yourself! wow, what a screamer that would be!
I just got done driving my 3800 supercharged fiero, its a common swap and for good reason, that blown buick 3.8 is very torquey and PULLS
That would have made an even more legendary car than the GNX itself. And I don't say that lightly. GNX 4 lyfe.
Well, I guess that when they missed their chance at putting it in the Fiero, they made sure not to miss the chance to put it into the 1989 Turbo Trans-Am...that was a fun car! All the fearsome power of the GNX in a WS6 performance package pony car that could turn and stop too. I used to PDI (pre-delivery inspection) those new cars as a dealership technician. What a great time. Those GMC Syclone & Typhoon twins too. The GM turbo hot-rods were just spooling up! Chevrolet hated those days during GM.
Wait....I thought you were dead? 🤔😆
I drove an '88 GT with an Olds Quad 4 HO engine swap. A magical combination.
Great engines that were under the radar. My sister has one in an '87 Calais.
Back then turbo 4's got no respect. If I ever get a Fiero I will Mazda swap it with a KLZE v6. 2.5l 200hp 170tq NA, 7k rpm+, 4.333 gear with the Mazda trans. 0-60 in the 5's, 1/4 mile mid 13's Na with the appropriate Ferrari noises. I'd do the same to an MR2.
I actually heard a rumor that the Quad 4 would've been a factory option if the Fiero stayed in production.
Didn't those engines have all kinds of issues though (head gaskets I think)?
The Quad 4 was slated to go into the 1989 Fiero. Keep in mind tho, that the Quad 4 also had issues
I remember back in the 1980’s a Pittsburgh Porsche dealership was giving customers a brand new Pontiac Fiero for free when you bought a new Porsche.
But.... I thought it was buy a FIERO we give you a Free Porsche🤔🤔🤔
Do a video on the 914
Imagine this car with the Grand National engine. It would be incredible. 245 horsepower in that little car. You would have had the fastest car of the 80s.
Should have been. But GM had their royal pecking order and the Fiero was near the bottom. What a waste.
@@muznick Thanks for agreeing. I just might have someone build me one with that engine. I think it would be absolutely insane
GN engine hp/ torque were ridiculously under rated!
@@justanotherdrunk imagine that engine in a little Fiero
There are Fieros out there presently that have been fitted with a supercharged 3800 engine which is a decendent of the GN Turbo 3.8
Pontiac was always the coolest GM division, and GM never seemed to like that.
Cars Simplified: Always innovative for performance... GTO started the muscle car era in the 60’s.
"Why GM Cancelled Its First Mid-Engine Sports Car - 1984-1988 Pontiac Fiero"
**Ronald Finger entered the chat*
You rang?
@@RonaldFinger Love your restoration work. Incredible, really.
Without even needing to watch this, the real reason is because GM didn't like pontiac making unique cars.
The mid 80s is when GM started losing it, now they aren't worth the right time of day.
This guy is about as exciting as Ben Stein taking role call
Buller, Buller.
@@wildbill5670 Fry....Fry...Fry...
Anyone? Anyone?
Fiero....Fiero.. .Fiero....
I had a friend who traded in a 78 TRANS AM on a new 84 FIERO back in 85. It was a nice little sporty car and she loved it. I still wouldn't have traded the 78 TRANS AM for it.
Yeah it’s cool but not legendary
Weird. I was a GM salesman at the time and had a lady customer that traded a black Trans Am for a first year red Fiero with sunroof. Factory order, as I recall. Could it be?
They should have used the Buick V6 from the get go . Could you imagine one with a Buck Grand National GNX V6 !
Those Iron Dookies were dismal as a performance engine.
Would the GN's V6 have fit into the Fiero's engine bay?
@@msbae a small block chevy fits, so I reckon a 3.8 buick v6 w/turbo would fit.
@@msbae I think V8archie built a fiero with the GN's LC2 block
If you are thinking of swapping tho the transverse buick 3800s are wayy easier to swap in.
Mine is a 3800 supercharged 88 formula and I couldnt be happier!
What killed the Fiero was the insurance companies. If you got the 6 cylinder GT, you couldn't get insurance.
@@albundy8052 - You're gonna pay Corvette Insurance for a 6 cylinder Fiero? When the Fiero came out, it had the highest collision rating since it had the most accidents. Like the Mustang 5.0, insurance companies would only insure the auto. 4 or 5 speed were no bueno unless you wanted to foot a higher insurance bill. 20th Century wouldn't even insure a 4 or 5 speed.
3 Things I remember, they said it caught fire, it was later fixed, 2 fiero copied the 308 with some kit cars, lawsuit, lastly the newest prototype was setting fast lap times, faster than the vette of that era. I had the 84 and the 87 gt fastback, no fires, no land speed records, but extremely fun!!!
The deeper info that. Is left out here is this. The Fiero was built in a plant that could build 250K cars a year. Pontiac had banked on the GM 80 F body replacement to fill in the productions but it was canceled. It was FWD/AWD and when the Ford FWD Mustang was changed to the Probe they killed the car. This opened the door to the Corvette people to kill the Fiero as they were in danger of not approving the C5. It later was canceled but it was ignored, So the truth is there is not one single reason for the Fiero death but a seres of things that all contributed to the failure.
There is much more to this yet too The main issue was the over selling at the start to justify the plant and then the Corvette people using the GM 80 were the prime reasons.
There was a Fiero Musium Sanford MI the owner was going to have an auction this Spring .. Retirement age.. Covid-19 post phoned his auction .. Then there was a Big Flood and damaged most of his cars and parts.. He still has for sale what ever he can sell..
The Pontiac Fiero was just an experimental car for GM. They used this platform for the Saturn. Pay attention to body design!
Not just an experiment, but to take full advantage of what Pontiac spent into that program. The 1990 Fiero prototype design was used for Firebird/Camaro's new design.
No, it wasn't experimental. It was a 100% Pontiac production car, but it was so much ahead of it's time that many of it's technological advances ended up being used even years after GM killed the Fiero. You have to remember how corporations structured work: Pontiac can develop and invent new things and concepts, but since there under the GM unbrella, GM takes credit for it even if they themselves had nothing to do with it. That's how the first production Saturn's used a similar design chassis and body panels, and those enduraflex panels made their way to the Camaro and Firebird of the 90s. It was Fiero technology borrowed for other GM cars.
The Fiero museum in Detroit was recently destroyed in flooding after a dam failure. Unlike after the Corvette museum collapse, GM is not rushing to help.
So yet another example of how stupid GM are, sad really.
The Fiero museum that flooded was in Sanford Michigan over 100 miles north of Detroit.
Why would they dig into their retirement yacht fund to help out. After all the Horn of Mexico and the Panama Canal are not there for nothing ... It costs money, a gross, disgusting, obscene amount of money to get there in a yacht you know.
@@dmyers2178 Correct it's funny how a city in Michigan can be 200 miles away and people want to call it Detroit.
Aside from the in depth analysis, I mainly tune in to listen to the dulcet tones of a man who sounds as though his entire family has just passed away.
I remember when the Pontiac Fiero was on the market. I found it more attractive than Toyota's MR2. I was more than disappointed when it was discontinued. How typical of corporate decision makers. While a V6 engine would've made for a much more spirited performance, I would've personally been happy driving the 4 cyl. powered Fiero. I would've probably been more comfortable driving it over the Toyota MR2.
@Lou Sainis I could be wrong, since I was never able to compare the two cars, but I would think that was because the MR2 was smaller and lighter weight than the Fiero.
Because the MR2 had a proven engine. The fiero was just an experiment for GM, the MR2 on the other hand was built to be special.
@@Bozar069 The Iron Duke had been around forever -- they just didn't put enough oil in it.
They were nice & fun even with the ball-less 92 horse power 4 banger 5 speed manual. The staggered 205 215 Goodyear Eagle ST's made all the difference on mine.
@@LG123ABC I had a Fiero and it was fun but the 2.5 was junk for cheap economy compacts. The MR2 had a 16 valve engine built for performance and actually used in motorsports.
200 hp a real transmission those cars would have beat the transam
the 5spd is a very good trans
That's why they toned them down. It'd be faster than the Trans-Am and of course chevy's baby, the corvette.
GM already made that mistake with the turbo Grand National which was faster than their flagship the Corvette at that time. Clearly GM brought the Fiero back and call it Corvette now. Since GM killed Pontiac the Fiero name is now moot but not it's legend lol.
@@animalcorvair
Pontiac TransAm ... Look it up. Just another great car GM killed ... no ... murdered.
@@Wildstar40 they killed my corvirs.. my 95 transport well all pontiac ,,now they have nothing to sell
i have a red 84 my one boy has an 84 indy ,,an my youngest he has a 87 gt 2,8 5 spd ,,very fun cars
An all-time classic and another gem of the 80s. I had an 86 GT and did the supercharged 3800 swap. That was good enough to beat stock to very lightly modified Grand Nationals in the mid 90s.
I drive a 3800sc 88 formula with an NiC cam and 3.4 pulley. was your 3800sc in your fiero bone stock? The Buick Grand National is my dream car but its badass my current setup was putting the hurt on some GNs back in the day! Buick 3.8 power!
I've driven one back in the day and it was exciting to say the least,I just don't think GM tested it like they should have.If better quality had been there I feel it would have lasted much longer.
I had one. No mechanics would work on it.
Apparently they were notorious for chronic mechanical problems and were impossible to diagnose.
It was fund to drive but I had it for months and months and was only able to drive it for a few weeks.
It stopped running and I had to donate it to one of those charities.
Thanks for the content.
Keep up the good work.
בס״ד
Can't be that bad....I've owned 11 of the 1988 model. Lot o poor mechanics out there
They were just feared by those uninformed “mechanics”. If they actually knew anything about any prior GM vehicles, it was just one more model from the GM bucket. Same engines and computer systems as most of the GM front wheel drive fleet cars. The body structure was the only real unique stuff, very innovative too. Too bad they didn’t integrate that concept into more of their other vehicles other than the Corvette. Trusty GM, cannibalizes from within to always protect Corvette and Chevrolet.
I've kept my 86 se v6 on the road for 3 years so far as my daily.
Only major things I've had to do is upgrade the radiator (because these things tend to run warm) and replace the water pump. (Twice because I broke the first one putting it on and didn't notice until everything was back together)
I had an 1988 GT , red, kept it for 14 years, it was one of the most reliable vehicles I’ve ever owned. Brakes, oil changes and shocks and trunk struts were all I replaced, sold it for almost what I paid for it.
I believe mechanics (and owners) were frustrated by exhaust manifold that were prone to breaking.
Like most American companies GM looked at short term gains with ignoring long term costs.
How sad a car is done in by having successful sales in its first year. This is still a cool car today. I'd love to get my hands on one of these that has a 350 Chevy engine in it. Those cars are monsters on the street. There was a guy that specialized in doing the V-8 conversions, I wonder if he's still around?
Good story, I've learned something new!
There was actually an even bigger reason they canceled it. Behind the cabin there were two trays that did not open with the trunk. They were made of magnesium. In the early generation 84/85 they were solid and caught fire in a very dangerous way. Metal fires are very very hot, and these panels were inches from your head. Add to that the regular overheating (not the oil part), issues with Fieros and you are something scary. This was fixed within a year or two, and most of the road have the updated version that is slotted.
There were also some fairly annoying problems with the 2.5 "Iron Duke," that got worse on the Fiero. The OHV SFI (1 overhead injector that sprays into a bowl like a carborator in a way) was atomizing gasoline outside the engine. If you removed your air cleaner and you ran rich with a hot engine.....well Fireo. The ECM sat on the cabin firewall (so much irony there....), and had a tendancy to have the main Prom go bad because it was socketed and the heat loosed the contact points. (any easy fix, but diagnosing it was hard and made the engine do all manor of wierd things randomly, as random as bumps in the road). The Pickup on the electronic timing had a tendancy to get water and gunk in it and confuse the ECM. The most annoying thing I dealt with was the alternator being way down in the engine and also being the belt tensioner. The headlights had a tendancy to have the gears break, but that is not a specific Fiero problem.
I bought a Fiero with that engine and brought it back to life. I bought one for 500 bucks, put about 700 in it, and sold it for 500 dollars. It taught me a lot about cars, and I do not regret it. The fact is, the Fiero's features and unique style (things like speakers in the headrests), and look way outway the cons.
The Ironduke was a bit of a mistake, or was worsened by the automatic 3 speed transmission. Car guys everywhere have given the Fiero a redux for the IronDuke problems: The 3800 swap. Basically a FWD 3800 (Grand AM, Grand Prix, many others) is a $500 dollar swap for a $500 dollar car to make it not only worth way more, but just be a fantastic thing to drive. If you already have the V6 Fiero, it is fine just as is, but there are lots of 2m4 (1984/1985 Automatic 4cyl)s out there that deserve a second chance and some love.
If you really want to blow people away (Speedwise and Impressionwise) a Cobalt SS swap. Fiero owners and enthusists are very friendly, and if I had the ability I would have one in the drive myself.
Your GM motorhome video is still my favorite OldCarVideo, but this is a close second. I was 20 and 10 years put respectively to have been there at the time, but there is something alluring about cars of that era.
Had GM brought the Fiero out correct in 84 i would have bought one, it really seemed like GM wanted to kill this car from day one. The car could have been a gold mine for GM.
I am a proud owner of several Fiero's. I drove a 1988 Formula all through my high school years in the 90's and I still have it today. I have all 4 years and most of the trim levels. 4 cyl or 6 they are fun cars to drive swiftly. They are a bit of a parts bin car, but that just makes the more common stuff that much cheaper to replace when needed.
Let’s keep Buick but ditch Pontiac was the stupidest thought ever.
When will there be new Trans Ams again?
never sadly
The first car in that company, around which GM was built, was the Buick. I was surprised that a model or two of Pontiac was not retained in the bankruptcy and creation of the company now using the GM trademarks. However, Pontiac was not a big factor in sales at the old, liquidated, bankrupt GM which preceded the company created by the bankruptcy court.
@blackandgold51 why? Buick has it's own legacy. They don't need to co-opt Pontiac's. That's silly. There was talk of a new Wildcat around 2008. Buick could easily resurrect the GN and GNX. But since both of those cars are really just spiritual successors to their top of the heap GS455 Stage 1 and GSX Stage 1....why go with the second team? GNX was just a touch slower than a GS455 Stage 1, but the Stage 1 had 1970 tires. A New Gran Sport with a highest performance option GSX getting a Stage 2 package would be the right thing to do. But don't worry, none of that will ever happen. GM says: This division does this, this division does that...Buick will never have a real performance option ever again. Buick's money comes from foreign sales on mid-tier luxury cars. A sad destination for a marquee that made cars the Chevrolet brothers used to race.
Because buicks are extremely popular in the Chinese market
Everyone wants to bring back Pontiac, but they forget that Pontiac would be nothing more than the same ugly, disposable, identityless trash gm puts out nowadays for everything except for their camaro and corvette.
After the many, MANY times gm has held Pontiac down, and finally sacrificed them, along with all their other mistakes, how are they still in business? Oh wait...
I worked at the ad agency, (DMB&B) that handled the Pontiac account in 1989. I asked a lady ad executive, why Pontiac canceled the Fiero, and she replied, because the Insurance companies hiked the Insurance rates on the car, because of the early engine fires, so that's what really killed the sales.
I loved my 86. V6 auto, and T-tops. Handled great, except in snow. Too light in the front. But I learned how to drive it. Hit the intersection at about 45° slowly, tap the gas and the rear would swing right in. Delivered pizzas for 2 winters in OK, and never got stuck. Summers were when that car shined. 😉
I worked for a Pontiac dealership when the Fiero came out in 84, the thing I remember the most about them was the problem they had with the Iron Duke block cracking at the point where the cooling water entered the motor. Pontiac came up with a fix for it by thickening the block at that point, but I can still remember having over a half dozen block that we had to hold until GM rep would have to check the block so we could be paid for the warranty repair. I also remember that on the ones that had the V-6 motor, you had to almost pull the motor out of the car to get access to the three forward spark plugs.
I worked Heavy Line for Pontiac from 84 until 89. I lost count of the many broken V6 exhaust bolts, 2.5 cylinder heads and clutches I did then. I could drop the rear sub-frame with the engine and trans in 26 minutes (We did a lot of them)!
Yes, I had an 85 GT and the V6 header bolts sheared off 2 or 3 times and once they had to replace the inboard head because of this. Later it spun a main bearing, so I had to rebuild the motor myself (warranty expired!) cuz GM wouldn't acknowledge the poor quality control on the 2.8 V6, which engine shop mechanics had eluded to having high failure rates. Owned mine for 13 years!
Thank you for being honest and giving this car some well deserved respect. It wasn’t perfect, but it was amazing for its time.
The Fiero was one of the cars during the life of Pontiac that GM decided to cancel due to growing concerns about it hurting sales of Chevrolets that GM felt were more important.
The 1980s was the beginning of trouble for GM. Even though GM had plenty of money, the company was spending a lot for expanding lineups by introducing new engines, vehicles, and brands. Engineering was also an issue GM began running into in the 1980s. It seemed like GM was being run by a group of mobsters with millions of dollars before things became worse by the late 1990s.
To be more specific, Corvette was whining like a baby.
I got my drivers lic right in the middle of the production run of the Fiero. I almost bought a used one in 89. My buddy had an 88 GT and it was a really fun car to drive w that V6
Wow 8.1 g’s how did the driver stay awake, LOL! I remember this car and I thought it was a great looking vehicle for its time especially the GT model. Great video keep them coming.
G-suit standard equipment 😂 We build excitement! PON-TI-AAAC!!
86mustanggt: When he said 8.1 g's I immediately burst out in laughter!!! I thought...only if it is strapped to the fuselage of an F-16 in full afterburner!
I have an 88 with a 2.5 iron duke that I want to replace with a HO 2.3 quad 4 and overdrive trans. I assume they didn't build them that way was that then it would smoke a vette.
I own a 88´Fiero GT 5 speed and it is one of the best handling cars I ever drove! It is sad that Pontiac has stopped production after 1988.
1988 was a great year for me. I bought a new 1988 red Fiero formula with the 5 speed and also owned a 1987 1/2 20th anniversary Red IROC-Z convertible with the 5.0 TPI 5 speed. They were both awesome cars that are very collectible today. Wish I still had them.
Honestly, the way they made this car was absolutely ingenious.
You’d think a (relatively) low-production mid-engine two-seat sports car would have cost an arm and a leg for tooling and R&D, but this is actually one part of typical GM parts-bin manufacturing that impressed me.
The original front suspension was straight off the Chevette. Hey, it was meant as a small commuter car, so why not?
The engine, transmission, drivetrain, and rear suspension was straight from the front wheel drive Chevy Citation (or Pontiac Phoenix). Both the 2.5 Iron Duke and 2.8 V6 were used on those X-body cars, and it used the same transaxles. Oddly for a RWD car, it also had the same MacPherson struts and lower control arms and the tie rods were fixed in place to keep the wheels aligned (which would have made it relatively easy to modify it to four wheel steering like contemporary Honda Preludes had).
But unfortunately GM has always been its own worst enemy. Either it was creating a plethora of divisions with tons of duplicated vehicle types, parts, infrastructure, and labour force that simply cannibalized sales from their other divisions rather than increase total market share....... or for fear of all that (and to keep the mighty Corvette at the top) they killed amazing and innovative cars that people actually wanted to buy.
I bought a gold Fiero back in 95'. I loved it. I drove it over 100 regularly. I had the 4 cylinder. I once got it up over 135mph. It was my first car. I paid 2K for it. I'd love the chance to own one again. Thanks.
My buddy had one of these in high school and I use to call it the Fire-Arrow.
The oil-related engine fire issue was due to lack of airflow through the engine compartment, and a rocker cover gasket that allowed the extremely hot oil to push past it. GM basically replaced the gasket with a better one, and called it a day. As for the cooling... a simple 1"-tall slit the width of the hood bulge, along it's trailing slope, negates that issue.
GM also developed mounting for the DOHC 3.4L V-6 to be installed.
I remember in the 90’s seeing one of these on fire and thought , ‘ how appropriate of a name’
This was the car that made me start liking sport cars when I was a kid. I remember seeing one driving down the street and thinking to myself, this is the sickest looking car on the road. This car was extremely ahead of its time back then
Yes. Also in the way it was build.
Pontiac was testing a Fiero with the Oldmobile Quad 4 engine when the Fiero program was cancelled. Had the Fiero been allowed to continue, the Fiero would have gotten the 180 bhp version of that engine, and it would have made the Fiero a surprisingly desirable sports car.
I had an 85 GT and she was sweet. Never a mechanical issue. Solidly awesome car!!!
I LOVED the GT model with the V6 and manual transmission. I saw a Consumer Report on that set-up and they rated it VERY GOOD AND RELIABLE. I WISH I HAD ONE 😉😮😓
The Fiero had a 5 star safety rating. The only car that beat it was a Volvo.
I remember back in the day companies selling body kits that you could turn the Fiero into a "Ferrari"....anyone remember those? 😆
I remember those Fiero-Ferrari kits...A neighbor did his up and it looked like the retarded sibling of a 308 GTS..
@@tedmalley7636 Exactly! 😆 I've only seen one that looked decent, and it was built by some guys in a garage that built Custom Cars.
Yeah, I remember PISA in Arizona. They make the "Finale" and the "Jalapeño". Ugly then, uglier now.
There was a dealer in Westminster, CA. DeLongpre, that offered them off the floor that were really well done. A cease and desist order from Ferrari put in to those.
They still do... and a few custom originals as well.
My friends mom bought one. He begged his mom to drive it. She finally relented and we took it out for a spin. Not even a mile from the house we were banging through the gears and the shifter cable broke. We drifted into a garage begging them to fix it. All they could do is put it in first gear. We drove it home in first gear parked it and I went home. The next morning, well, let’s say she figured it out. It was a year until she let him drive it again. I love how it handled. What I loved more is that when a nice young girl wanted to ride in it she had to sit on the passengers lap. 😀
_Have to clarify something here, the 1984 Chevy Corvette was not double the price of an '84 Pontiac Fiero, it was three times as expensive. Lots of well researched facts here though. Great channel content always!_
The engines fires numbered below 300 incidents, reported to the NHTSA, mostly involving 1984 models. Of course the media made sure the problem was overblown.
The flying buttresses on the GT, those really completed its shape. So beautiful...
I saw a white one in the Target parking lot about three ago. Shopping went secondary after seeing it.
Ronald Finger does a really good fiero restoration series on his channel. Nothing too crazy just well produced with a lot of necessary detail.
I had an 84 with the 4cyl and at 100 mph the front tires would just about come off the ground. Scary fun.. lol I miss that little car.
We bought a new 87 Fiero and loved it. The eighties was not a banner decade for GM with the exception of the Fiero. Their product line up was about as boring as you could get with cars like the Chevette Citation and Celebrity. Pontiac was the only division to try to build something half way exciting with the introduction of the Fiero. GM always protects Corvette at all costs and the Fiero was a affordable alternative that threatened the highly profitable Corvette.
A cousin of mine; dropped in 327 small block in this chassis;it was a hoot to drive!!
Back in the late 1990s , there was a shop in Houston that put a 350 chevy engine in Fieros .
Plenty of power in that package .
They had working mules of the 89 fiero. It had the 3.4 dohc chevy v6. The fiero mule was smoking the corvette in every test and GM had no plans of changing the corvette anytime soon. I'm shocked you made no mention of this.
Very nice article but it misses the biggest point of cancellation, the Fiero was built in a dedicated plant with no other models being produced along side it. The plant had to produce 50,000 units annual to stay profitable. As he mentioned the 88 model fell well short of that goal and was actually extended a month or so. This was also the second year in a row with less than 50,000 units, the 87 model was close. (46,581 units)
I own a red 1986 Fiero 2M6 notchback, its the second Fiero I’ve owned and I absolutely love it. It’s absolutely mint and I parked it next to a Lamborghini Gallardo yesterday and in no way is comparable to the Italian bull, but you know what it looks really good even sitting next to an Italian super car. Imagine if Pontiac continued to improve the Fiero over the years.... I think it would have taken over corvette production line, or at least create some in house competition that would have raised production quality and look of both corvette and Fiero!
Fiero was a timeless design 👍
That's right. With some nice rims today and a little lowered, it would look like a new car.
I really wish they would come out with a new Fiero. That 2.0 turbo would make it a rocketship.
It took me about 15 minutes to locate the fuel filler release the one time I drove a GT. It was on the B pillar behind/left of the driver's head. 😁
I worked at the Fiero plant from beginning to end it was probably one of the best places I worked in at General Motors.
I always liked these but never knew much about them
Did happen to walk to a deli by where I worked in the mid '80s and pulling into the parking lot was a silver GT 'fastback' type. First time i'd seen one.
The Iron Duke was a great motor. Family had a S-10 and put like 220k on the clock. Even had it repainted, it was so reliable.
Owned an 84, have owned an 86 since 95. Love to hear people try and pronounce Fiero, which means "proud" in Italian. Great little car for cruising
One of my friend's dad bought a V-6 version and it was beautiful and sounded great. The memories!
Note: If I heard correct you said it did 8.1 G on the skid pad which is considerably more grip than modern F1 car :).
I am the original owner of a 1985 Fiero Sport Coupe. The car just turned 108,000 miles. It has been the most reliable car I have ever owned. I plan on keeping it until I can no longer get in and out of the car. I completed a 619 mile tour of with my Fiero and it not only performed flawlessly, but it returned an average 43 m.p.g. What car can you purchase today that is not a hybrid, that can match that m.p.g.?
An insane genius welder in Maine grafted the rear end of a Fiero (front end wreck) to the front end of a Honda Gold Wing and created a trike with a 2 person backseat.
I've had a 1986 SE 4 cylinder automatic, this what a cool commuter (no power) it was an ok car. But I still have and drive my 1987 GT 5 speed every summer and I would not sale it, at 218000 km it still a pleasure to drive a real sports car without all that electronic junk, abs, power brake and steering, air bags...... It never been a muscle car it was a drivers car, finesse driving and I love it !
I'm retired management from a major midwest corporation and having had to play the corporate politics game to try and get something done I know how you have to make tradeoffs and water down really good ideas to get them approved. GM bean counters in trying to save a few dollars per unit sabotaged the Fiero introduction with the less than ideal Chevette front suspension and three speed automatic along with the four speed manual when clearly the market they were going for was the same as the Porsche 411 and the Fiat X19 but just a little bigger, more comfortable and more powerful.
I had a 1988 Fiero GT 5 speed for over 10 years. It ran great. just a bad cooling fan switch went out. I miss it.
Always loved that car. Might see if I can pick one up.
I bought my daughter one when she was in high school. Great car, never had any issues with it. Wish I had it now.
I have one of the 2000 made indy replicas. Still easy to work on and a joy to drive on a car that is nearly 40 years old.
Recently been lusting after a late model Corvair. Although, the more I see these, the more I want one. Worked on a few back in the day, but never appreciated them, for what they were.
This car was a really big deal for GM when they started making them. They had converted the old Fisher Body plant in Pontiac, MI to mostly robotic assembly "workers" and even held a open house of sorts of the plant to show it all off. It was primarily for friends and family of GM factory workers in the Pontiac area and had LOTS of fan fare to go with it. They gave away stuff like t-shirts, hats, stckers, key chains, etc. to commemorate the event. The one thing I remember vividly was the demonstration they had set up to show off the dent proof body panels and the robots. They had one of robots simply hoding a rope that had a bowling ball that was drilled through and the rope tied off to keep the ball at the end of the rope. A second robot would grab the ball and pull it back and up, in the arc that the rope would allow, then let it go, letting the ball bounce off of the door panel showing the resistance to denting. The ball would eventually come to rest against the Fiero's door after bouncing a few times then the process would just repeat itself. It also showed the robot's abilities to perform repetitive tasks without errors. It truly was something to see in the early, almost mid, 80s.
The Fiero design was compromised too much, for the reasons you state..to lower cost. Especially woeful was that 2.5l push rod 4 cyl. eng. as the base power plant It was obsolete, even for the mid 80's. If the Fiero had survived a little longer it would likely have received the Olds. designed "Quad 4" engine as the base power plant.
Loved my 86 2M6. Fun to drive, and as a single guy it was all I needed.
I remember reading in one of the Kit Car magazines that after the Fiero was cancelled one of the kit car companies tried to buy the Fiero design and/or tooling from GM and GM said no.
The P-Car... I imagine that this was the mid-engine Corvette study, with the 60 degree V6, that GM deemed "unworthy" of being a Corvette in 1978. It was in Car and Driver magazine (March 1983). It looks a lot like the Fiero... This same design showed up as a "commuter" car in 1981 as the Pontiac P-Car or Pegasus (glad it didn't take that name). Basically an X Car from the engine compartment and drive wheels and axles and a Chevette up front, I always thought the choice of using the 2.5 Iron Duke was crazy, but it was GM's best 4 cylinder. And the car had no temp gauge in 1984...smh. The 2.8 V6 from the Citation X-11, made it a fun sports car... Wish i could find one!
GM had a well-earned repute for launching cars with bad-to-blah specs; getting the fit, finish, power right at last; then cancelling JUST with success in reach. Same 3 (Fiero, Allanté, Cimarron) are top examples.
I have some reservation with one quote: 8.1 G skidpad. No one can maintain consciousness at that level ;-) Hahaha! Surely you meant .81G
I had one in high school. It handled well but it had a tendency to slide or push the front end through curves on hard cornering because of the light weight in the front.
The original Fieros reminded me of the Triumph TR7 but by 88 they looked awesome.
Great job! You hit all the high points without any of the fluff.
You could have specified that from 1984 to 1987, the front suspension was lifted from the Chevrolet Chevette and then came with an original design of the front suspension for model year 1988 ;-)
Remember,when it first came out it wasn't supposed to be a sports car. But is was supposed to be commuter car!
...and that was the dumbest idea in the first place.
Would definitely buy a new revision and modern Fiero if GM brought it back. Absolutely loved the V6 GTs.
I love that idea. The Fiero was a poor man's Ferrari. Unfortunately if they would build it today, I doubt it would be affordable.