Wow. You don't realize how dysfunctional your own family is until you see a healthy parent modeled for you. I started adding up all the "nice" things the healthy father says - I'm sorry, acknowledges a miss step, clear answer, clears up the financial worry, says he wants to spend time with him, empowers the relationship between brothers and compliments the son for being a good brother and even offers to babysit. I started crying when he said what a good big brother he is.
Empowering. This series with the clinical analyses should be taught to young adults all over. Wish I had seen this when I was a teen. Thank you for what you do and for sharing your knowledge and passion with the world.
I would like my 13 year old son to watch this. His father is the same victim. Yesterday he had to come back to the car and get $20 because his father was flipping out about spending it on him. He had to be the adult and just came back to me to diffuse the situation. "I spent $20 yesterday I'm not spending another $20!" He tells my son I get life so easyvand he works so hard never gets anything bla bla bla. My son just turned 13. His father is 61!
The comment the dad makes about the world demanding more and more from him really resonates with me. My mom has always had a habit of listing everything she's ever done, and needing constant praise. If the conversation is not about her and all her "sacrifices," she gets bored. She blames my brothers and I for not going to medical school. She never stops talking about everything she "gave up" to raise us. She also takes lots of jabs at my father while praising her husband. Its constant. I only just realized how powerful ones skewed perception of themselves really is. And yes, a single phone call with her is as draining as you'd imagine.
Really helpful. I got exhausted right along with the “son” because this type of conversation is the norm with most of my family of origin, but I thought it was my “crazy” and “selfishness.” The analysis is life-giving in its clarity and gives me plenty to work with. Side note: I am impressed with your production quality and I really love these staged dialogues. Thank you for your compassion and generosity
I appreciate the gossip part. I did not realise that this is not normal family conversation. I wish I had an example of a normal family conversation style (Movies aren't helping much, they need drama)
Sounds just like my father. Always talking about his wife and her plans. Always not being present in our lives and making excuses that revolve around his wife and her adult children. Love the role play! Especially showing the healthy father. It is helpful for me because I need to hear what it's like to have a healthy response from a father.
This was so incredibly helpful. I grew up in the foster system and found my father earlier this year after 30 years. At first it was all roses and flower gardens, but he became increasingly volatile. I went through a relationship with a diagnosed covert narcissist in my 20s and when my father started talking in the same patterns, I knew something was up. I didn't grow up in healthy family systems and have no idea what would be reasonable to expect. Seeing my father's antics through the lens of him wanting his victimhood story confirmed makes so much sense. This series has been a great aid and comfort.
"It's often helpful to think about how the covert narcissist wants us to respond to them to see through the drama and victimization." It was a revelation when I realized that my mom's hyperidealization of my parenting style was actually an attempt to get me to parrot it all back to her about HER parenting. I realized when she said "You're such an amazing mother!" that she wanted me to say "Aw, no mom, YOU'RE an amazing mother!" But I never did. Because it wasn't true. And I hated how perfect she thought I was. She was always talking to the me in her head instead of the real me. I kept trying to impress my humanity upon her and that I'm good enough but certainly not without fault, but she kept rejecting it because she wanted me to mirror her sentiment back to her so she could feel appreciated and validated. I couldn't do it. It was so frustrating.
That helps me a lot. I’ve been confused by my mom’s treatment as a servant-child and I could never do anything right but at the same time was idolized and bragged about all.the.time. Like how are both possible at once? But this makes sense. To me, I couldn’t do it right, but to everyone, everything right I did was credit to her.
I have a very similar dynamic with my mom. I think I was about 30 before I realized that my mom had a relationship with the projection she had of me, not myself. Whenever my behavior deviated from her idea of me, she would get angry. And the hyperbolic, inaccurate compliments were always cringey. She has never known who I am and I realize now that it’s not because I’ve been with-holding, but because she shames me when I am authentic. Anyway, what you shared really resonates and I don’t often meet other people with this type of dynamic.
@@schias6 that’s a good way to explain it and I would agree that’s exactly what my mom is like. I couldn’t talk to her about anything and she always idealized how she wanted me to behave. Even to last Saturday, they came over to yell at me for not talking to them (I didn’t let them in) including “no, what we want is the way things were before.” Well as they were before was inauthentic and unhealthy, so... no thanks. I like your expression “projection of me, not myself.” Explains a lot.
@@ruthvansandt9713 you sound like you are much better at setting boundaries than I am. I’m like the first role-play, making half-assed attempts to stand up for myself and then caving when she deflects or attacks. I’m glad you’re keeping yourself safe.
@The Dark Overlord I’m extremely distrustful when I receive really over the top or inaccurate praise. My guard immediately goes up and I feel like I’m being “handled.” I’m usually slow to judge or distrust people, but this is the exception. When my mom would compliment me, it was often about what she wanted me to be, not who I actually was. Then I would feel ashamed as though I had tricked her. Needless to say, Imposter Syndrome is an issue for me too. 😅
Wow I just realized my dad is a full covert narc with that ending. He will burden me with his victim mentality then go "Well I don't want to burden you with my problems." Like you already did but thanks.
😂 I am saying I totally lol b/c my narcissist would dump their self inflicted woes on me and then say I have my own life and can’t be burdened or whatever- like that too.
Great analysis and very helpful to see especially after watching the video you posted to go with this analysis commentary playing 2nd… Very eye opening and I can say I was intrigued with the first form (the same conversation but minus the analysis between dialogue) - Great… Then these (written) facts are really really cool to pause- think about- and I could even take note for myself the differences (when applicable) between my thoughts watching video I compared with what I learned from reading the analysis comments in video II
Had a convo similar to this with my dad the other day. Everything was an attack on him and I was insensitive for not asking about his girlfriend drama (when he insists on dating people he knows are bad for him). I said that unless he gets therapy, I cannot discuss his relationships. It was liberating.
@@maureenseel118 good for you💛 Sometimes the parent child relationship is reversed. They expect us to solve their problems. No more doing that for me. It's like waking up finally💛
Oh yes, that is how it is going..... There is no compromise possible. That is the problem. Either you play your " role" or you are out. Confrontating is always ending in a catastrophe . Once you realize there is no way out, you have to decide. Go on like this or free yourselve once and for all. In case you stay in it decades later you realize nothing changed, you will regret. If you free yourselve by setting boundaries and pass the truh you will feel so much better. Fight for your right to be respected and preciated, you can not deal with family members who put you down and talk badly behind your back. This is not what family is about. Thank you Patrick for making it so clear again, by this horrible confusing and hurting "conversation".
This was SO HELPFUL. I feel like I shouldn’t be getting this level of production quality for free. Thank you for all of the hard work you put into your videos!!
Watching this I realise I was co dependent with my father by always trying to “educate” him when he rang and talked negatively about my brothers and sisters. For months now I’ve chosen to have no contact with him . No more putting energy into his narcissism. Now I’m learning to keep myself safe and well and put my energy into healthy relationships. At first it was very hard to do as I had layers of guilt and shame for putting myself first. My anxiety is reducing and I feel more freedom. These role play videos and clinical analysis are so helpful.
I found an old video of my mom on UA-cam from when I was 11 (from an old game show,) and it was so weird suddenly seeing things in her I never saw as a kid. It was there all along but I was blind to it. I had to be for survival. Everyone I showed it to agreed she was creepy. But to me, that was my normal. Thanks for uploading these roleplays, it really helps gain perspective!
Great video! You explaining what is normal for an adult child to expect from their parent helps me to mourn what I did not get from my parent. Thank you for generously sharing your knowledge!
I think the second mention of the gift card is also to shame the son... "Look what I do for other people (probably not family, surely not you) and they are grateful and appreciate me" Shame Bazooka. Great Word :) That is exactly what it feels like
Could you do a video addressing codependency as not addressing unfairness? This is a big challenge for me, and I would love some understanding around it and strategies for better dealing with unfairness in a direct way. Thank you SO much for these videos, they are incredibly helpful for people who grew up thinking this was normal :)
I've always known that my mother was a narcissist, but I always went back and forth as to whether my father is, too. This really makes me feel that he is most likely a covert narcissist. This feels like every conversation I have with him. Thank you for your videos. They are really helping me wrap my head around my family.
Wow, this is so helpful for me! Thank you so much, i even realised as a very small child that in my realationship to my parents is something wrong. But i donˋt know what it was. I thought that i was adopted. I have so much pain in me so that i go to the therapie. I am diagnosed with BPD and depression, thats the result of living a live with two narcisstic parents. This must be teached in school. Now i am 46 years old and i am going NO CONTACT with my father, my mother died four years ago. My mother also had a histrionic personality disorder. I come from Germany and here you donˋt find a lot about that! Thank you so much, that shows me that I was always right 👍🏻❤️
The written analysis was crucially educational. I watched this video five times to get all the nuances of the emotional abuse. I would have only picked up on about 1/10th of the complicated layers of dysfunction without the written comments. Also, I appreciated learning where the son was slipping into codependency and other learned adaptive responses. I hope you do this same written analysis for the narcissistic mother role play (maybe you already did). I can't thank you enough for putting the written analysis in to the video.
This is absolutely amazing. Change the names and add in a few subtle backhanded shots to my self esteem and its pretty much word for word my experience. It took me until I was 40 to realize what he was and finally go no contact for good.
I’m only halfway through and WOW, this is one of the most eye opening things I’ve ever seen. I have similar interactions (I’m the codependent) at home, work, and just about everywhere… Some changes need to take place, damn.
I ve been educating myself about narc/codependancy for a couple of years now; so I am quite knowledgable about them, but these role plays give me a push forward to better understanding and interpetation to each move; sight and feeling thats been going on in my life. Very intellegent.. Guess now why my supervisors love doing role play in our work as teachers.. Thank you❤
Thanks for the videos and the analysis. Yesterday I had a tough conversation with my covert narcissistic mother on the phone. Two weeks ago she gave me harsh judgements on my life choices, and after the phone call I was so depressed by her words I was not able to go to work. Yesterday I chose to tell her how much she and my father had been hurting me since I was a child, instead of swallowing all of it like I used to do. Of course this was met by denial, like I just made up all the childhood traumas myself. But I feel this is my first step of getting empowered. I would like to cut the codependency but still do not know how.
Really relatable, I appreciate the breakdown. I see so much of myself and my attempts to get my point across in the just the right words while avoiding my mom's landmines. I'm still trying to figure out how to be myself without fear, but your videos are so helpful.
Great analysis. I know this type of manipulation and emotional abuse all too well. That's why I've been distancing myself and setting firm boundaries in place, to protect me from any toxic people or situations. Keep up the great work. ☺
This is so empowering and helpful, thank you Patrick!. I have always known my dad was "special", but for my mom, it took me a very long time to understand how her victim systematic stance had something to do with narcissism. She could look like the nice codependent to my narcissistic dad. Yet she was often emotionally neglectful. Incapable of handling healthy criticism and self-reflecting. I didn't know there was a word for gaslighting. Now the silent treatment she has been giving me for five months, makes me understand she has been abusing me, making me the persecutor. A decent "normal" parent would not hold grudge for ever nor cut off their adult child. Victimization is a way to avoid responsibility, but how does it affect their image? Is it in the sense "My pain is above anyone else's, therefore I am special"?
Thank you, this is helpful and right on time. My mom ended her silent treatment to text me happy birthday, yet she added that she's not ready for calls and she's just started to feel better.. Not asking how I have been in many months and putting the focus on her health again. I understand she set the rules and I have to walk on eggshells if I want a relationship with her.
@@MissSarahGM sounds like you have to be the parent for her. I feel you. Stay strong and look after yourself. Your mother is an adult and can handle her afairs on her own
@@fuzzyecheveriaharmsii Thank you for the kind words of support. I was moved when I saw her text message after 5 months. She wrote she cut contact with the whole family for health reasons. I don't believe she ignored my brother as well. Then it felt like she wants to avoid the whole subject, she already added she get stressed on the phone and she needs calm.. So I understand it's a way to keep me compliant and submitted. I'm an adult but no support system and it's tough all on my own. I realize I was letting myself being abused and put in the persecutor role just to have a little connection and love from them.
@@MissSarahGM You didn't let her abuse you. She abused you. The responsibility was and is with her. Not yours. You were a child who was only trying to survive. On this channel you have a small community to start with. I hope you will find help and a support system close to you.
@@fuzzyecheveriaharmsii Thank you, I am really glad I found this channel and the community, it is so helpful to have other people understand what it is, behind the appearances. And even as an adult, it isn't easy to cut contact. The hardest is the acceptance of their limitations and grieving that. At least I know clearly what I don't want in my life, inconsistent, invalidating people.
Triggers. Triggers everywhere. The text in between is like what's going on in my mind when talking to my parent, but he describes it so much more clearly!
THANK YOU!!!! I knew my dad was not right, but I always interpreted him as another victim of my mom's aggressive narcissism. My sister and I learned to don't ever depend on our parents but I didn't quite understand why, I felt like I was being a bad son, like "I'm not giving them the attention they need, I'm being selfish, meybe they're hurt inside and I have to understand them and help them be happy" (I still feel like that from time to time). It took a LOT of help from friends and therapy, and even so, is just this last couple of years that I'm truly starting to understand just what they are and what can we do about it. This content is so professionally made, thank you so much for sharing it!!!
Thank you for this. My father is possibly a narcissist because our talk goes usually like in the video, but in my case, he "wins" the discussion by saying things out loud and agressively. He blames my mother and his money struggle for his unhapinness and I started to stabilish some boundaries like "I don't wanna hear your complains about my mother." (I got a "You don't like me anymore" after this...). Me and my brother we both told him he should go to see a therapist, but unfortunately he truly believes he doesn't need help and that all his problems will go away as soon as he pays his debts. I'm already noticing how hard will it be to stabilish the boundaries and stop the codependency between us, but I need to do it. The empowered son gave me inspiration to how I am going to stabilish my own boundaries. So, thank you.
Mine is also like all that you described, except for debts. Mine simply has his mediocre job with mediocre pay, the same old one, he got right after finishing school, and yet he has the audacity to berate me by saying that I never gonna get well-paid job (previous was toxic and underpaid) or my mom (who already passed) in front of me for one short period of time when she had to change her job for less paid one, because I was a toddler then and there was literally no one else to care about me (she generally always had a higher pay than him, which he used to absolve any responsibility, in that disgusting manner "you have the money, so you make decision, and if it doesn't work out I blame you for the rest of life"). He even makes me buy him food, and when I ask for money on that (I'm not his parent, I'm not obliged, he is nor disabled, and I'm not rich) he finds excuses to not to give any or screams that I'm wasting too much money (of course I'm wasting money, his food often is more expensive than mine) till I gave up... Sorry, my comment seems turned into rant. Just realised he is narc. I knew about other relatives, but couldn't recognise narcissism behind all that pitifulness and pretended helplessness, he wears as masking veil.(
Excellent video! Wow this could have been a conversation with my mother. This last Thanksgiving it took weeks to get an answer if she was coming or not. I've realized I'm a codependent and creating strong boundaries. Wish me luck on my journey!
This is how the narcs win they wear you down so much you just wanna side with them even if what they're saying is you're a bad person you find yourself saying yes yes I'm horrible you're so right
Wow. I’m shocked. This is my life textbook & I stumbled on this by accident as I NEVER would’ve guessed this as the root of it because I’ve been brainwashed my whole life they’re the martyr, they’ve sacrificed so much for me, woe is them, etc etc no boundaries! NOW WHAT DO I DO? Can you confront someone with their covert narcissism? I don’t anticipate that going well as they think they know everything & I’m ungrateful. Please make a video on what to do now. I’m tried the empowered approach unknowingly on my own and it gets NO WHERE. Ends dramatic and ugly and they run to rest of my family to complain about how horrible I am. Then I start questioning my own sanity.
Yep. If you try the "empowered" route, that choose-your-own-adventure path doesn't lead to anything good either. The only successful thing I've done is go no-contact. Life is easier. Less drama. I choose friends who have accountability, and all is well. I also choose friends whose parenting is better role-modeling for me than my parents. Imperative to break the cycle. :(
I was able to understand the use of guilt and shame as weapons to prevent real emotional connection and accountability in a relationship. I better understand my own psychological need to have strong boundaries with my narcissistic mother, brother, and two sisters. I understand the idea of "codependency" in pretending the family member is caring about me.
I'm so happy to find this channel. Being parentified as a young child and now an adult, I've struggled with emotional problems which stemmed from covert narcissistic parent. So I've watched a great deal of UA-cam videos about psychological/emotional disorders. Anyway, I appreciate the role playing on this video and commend the creator/producer/writer -- Patrick for such informative, instructional and enlightening channel. I had to watch some of the videos a few times because of familiarity within the convos! Thank you Patrick for your remarkable job of imparting knowledge & healthy boundaries to otherwise boundary-challenged individuals like me. I just subscribed to your channel. :)
In my case I would have been avoiding accountability with the father not to "keep a connection fantasy going" but to avoid a beating. Or, later as an adult, to avoid being insulted and yelled at.
[for me] all of your Videos have sooo much impact [for me], and it helpts me too understand myself, my past and my present. Thank you for helping me to empower myself, so heal and feel more safe in my little world. Lovely greetings from Germany.
I feel toxically shamed in such an unavoidable manner that it's hard for me to internalize and recognize that my parents do these things. Thank you for making it easier for me to recognize these tactics my parents use. Update: I think maybe one day I would know what a healthy parent looks like: Reading Homecoming by John Bradshaw.
This was exactly what was happening in my marriage. Thank you so much for putting into words why it happened. After so many years of counseling with different therapists, none could see that my ex was this person. In fact the counseling perpetuated the abuse we went through, as they placed me on equal grounds of blame as my ex. This is helping me so much. I can’t thank you enough
When my first child was born, I was living in South Korea at the time with my wife. My dad made no effort to come and visit, and whenever I asked about him coming to see his granddaughter, he would play the victim and talk about how he’s poor and has no money (Even though he had taken vacations to Egypt, Argentina and the US with his wife). It had been three years when I finally got him to come visit, but not without all the guilt tripping and victimhood every time I asked about him coming. It got so toxic I felt bad that I was asking him to come see his first grandchild.
Even tho this is a staged convo... its almost as draining as the real thing. Cannot believe I've had to endure this for over 20+ years of my life. I hope these SHELLS can one day burn in hell for the abuse they have put us through.
Great video. Reminds me of a lot of conversations with my mother 😢. Especially the parts where he was on the verge of challenging the Dad but backed off. I've done that lots of times and always come away depressed and drained. Thanks Patrick. This really helps me to see things as they are. ❤
I think the problem, for me at least, with being empowered is that it's exhausting to do it all the time, so things don't seem they'll change on a more permanent basis, unless you cut that person out. For me, it's my mother. My father was probably a narcissist (he passed away 5 years ago), but I have no doubt this is my mother. When I was a kid I used to describe her as not selfish, but self centered, and a martyr. I understand so much more now. I'm still trying to cope. I can't live with the guilt of shutting her out of my life, but she's so draining most of the time. I work long, stressful hours, but still check in with her every night to make sure she's okay. Some nights I know my behavior and control needs to improve, but I can't muster it. I can't complain to her, or it'll set her off about something bad that happened to her 40 years ago that was so much worse than what I'm dealing with. She's so helpless too, at 72 years old. She's been swindled out of money and property. I do find these videos helpful. Again, it's just being so tired sometimes when I talk to her. I can be empowered if my faculties are all present, but it's also hard to be empowered without being emotional.
This was so helpful thank you ❤ I'm past midlife, have a narcisisitic mother (who I keep at a distance), and now I'm realising my father is the same. He was verbally & physically abusive when I was a child, spoke with his fists (just as my mother did), threatened suicide when the spotlight was on him, and generally the perpetual show man with his victim-aggressor cycles. He left when i was 10 yrs old, calmed down when he remarried, I thought he'd changed. Little was known about NPD back then. He was still impatient and lost his temper occasionally, but mostly he seemed kind and very generous with his money and practical help - especially friends and neighbours of course. I'd always noted that like my mother, mentally he grew with his chronological years, but emotionally he was still an infant (in his omnipotent stage, where everything is an extension of themselves, including the😂 children). My step mum died suddenly a year ago, I supported my dad to the point of exhaustion. Then the narcisisism re-surfaced because I refused to entertain the petty issues he had caused with his new woman. I was still grieving, and his issues were infantile and toxic. This video was like a god send for me. I've just had my dad leave after a verbally abusive visit. I felt ill, drained and strangely traumatised (for a woman who considers herself self-aware). The effects were psychological and pysiological, like I had regressed back into my confused and violated child state. I actually stood up to him. In fact I blew up at him a couple of times. I told him I will not have his aggression in my house and if it happens again he can leave and go home. The shame part of the clinical analysis was interesting to me - where we feel shame for accommodating their manipulation. On the flip side, I felt a lot of shame becasue I blew up at him. After he'd left I kept trying to justify my reaction in my mind, I was feeling sadness for him and punitive towards myself, despite the fact that he had been aggressive all weekend. I know I had attacked him with my past trauma, I was probably triggered, it just wasn't in my nature. I even questioned if I was a narcissist myself. I'm here now stunned at how I'm feeling inside - disproportionate to what any outside observer was perceive as an aggressive, emotionally immature man getting angry because his daughter refused to pander to his needs. An ugly but not uncommon family flare up if you will. Apologies for the long comment, I've subscribed with thanks and look forward to listening to more of your videos.
The role play and added notes brought me to tears - and I'm not a cryer (not allowed as a child) - I'm taking notes so that I am now empowered to deal with the toxic person! Keep the teachings coming!
Thank you so much for creating these role plays along with the analysis, it’s so helpful on so many levels and a brilliant way of showcasing the behaviours. 👍🏽🥇
This makes sense with my parents. The “I’m too busy with ___ to care about your thing.” And then they denounce the thing that I wanted to do. Or my dad would miss something, and I would be upset and then my mom would be like, “well, why would he care about it.” ... but then talk to him later and say that he should’ve gone. So, like, my mom trying to deflect that she’s upset/upset that I’m upset and not knowing what to do about it, but then making me feel worse lol Not quite the same, but the deflecting and lack of accountability are familiar to me.
Just wanted to let you know that I just found your channel, and you seem to do a great job explaining all this, and I love the roleplays! However, I find that this video is inaccessible for me because I'm blind, and it seems like maybe you are putting up the clinical analysis on the screen but not saying anything out loud. So, if possible, could you please make a version of this video, or in future videos at least, make sure you say out loud whatever the analysis is? Also, another thing that makes this extra-important for me is that I am getting my Masters in Clinical Mental Health Counseling, so I feel like this analysis would definitely help.
I agree! I hope he does start reading the text analyses in between. I love the roleplay, but I usually listen while doing other things and don't always have my phone at hand to read the text. Best of luck with your studies!
@@shibolinemress8913 Thank you so much! So far, it has gone well. However, at this time, I am taking some time off to go to my own therapy and work on myself (much of this work is trauma work) before starting to see clients. I just have my clinical courses to go, though, pretty much. :)
Your clinical breakdowns are so helpful.. As with the rest of your content. I am grateful you spend the time and resources to get quality materials out to the rest of us! Many Thanks!
My parent's divorced ~3 years ago for this very reason. My dad recently caused quite a problem between the kids (has been since the divorce but this one took the cake). I finally sent him a fair length e-mail because he blocked us. I said everything I ever wanted to say. I told him exactly why everything was his fault and why I don't feel a bit of remorse or shame in telling him this. Maybe it wasn't the best way to respond, but it made me feel better. Even if he didn't register a single word of it haha.
So many lines in this video I’ve heard my father say verbatim. (like “nothing comes easy for me” and “just another person lined up to giving me problems,” along with prioritizing a new relationship more than his longstanding ones - his girlfriend over his 3 kids). And realizing more how my younger brother and I are engaging in a codependent relationship with him. My siblings and I all agree he’s a narcissist but it’s good to be able to recognize what behaviors are narcissistic & shouldn’t be tolerated and what aren’t and where to draw the line (even if that line means estrangement).
Thank you for this role play and analysis! It resonates with me regarding some family dynamics. It also helps me realize how maybe some of my behaviors are not the healthiest too.
omg even the opening text about why he's making it about Betty explains so much about how my dad communicates/just waits for his turn to speak so he can talk about what he wants to talk about. (If he even waits.) I'll come to him with something important and he'll want to talk about his newest friend obsession and everything this person's doing with their life. Like, that's nice but I'm trying to discuss something relevant to me/our household? At least pretend to listen to me while I talk about this. All that's missing is he will interrupt me to tell me about his obsession so that I have to keep restarting whatever I'm trying to say if I don't forget what I was trying to discuss entirely. Not just sidetracking like in the video, but legitimately just waiting for me to take a breath so he can start. i never really understood why he was doing that. I knew it must be the NPD somehow, but didn't know what purpose it served or how I'm supposed to respond to it that won't either encourage the behavior or get my head bitten off.
🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌I appreciate your Efforts of bringing Self Awareness on such Sensitive Topics related to Keeping our Mental Health in Check... Thanks and God Bless....
Thank you for this informative and enlightening content format! These analysis are highly insightful and I find them being helpful "diconstructors" of narcissistic mind...
Wow, amazing video Patrick. I can definitely relate to this and its really helpful. I'm about to go back to my family home for a bit after living away from them for about a year and having less contact, and my mental health has improved being away from that toxic family system. I'm not sure yet if I'll have the strength to stand up and enforce boundaries, but hopefully I won't be back there for too long and I'll have better tools to take care of myself whilst I'm back there. Keep up the good work
Just watched this again and can't believe it has so few views compared to the video with just the role play. Your clinical analyses are GOLD! Perhaps they need a more flashy title to get people to understand the riches within? "Secret Messages of Covert Narcissist Father Revealed! - Role Play Part II" ; - D Regardless, *THANK YOU!*
Thank you for taking the time to create content for those of us trying to improve the relationships and experiences we share with others. Is this a clinical analysis, or a reenactment of a situation given as an example, where a clinician offers explanations of behaviors and the correct terminology so the viewer can become a more mindful and well informed individual?
All your role-play videos that contrast toxic/healthy/empowered relationships are so insightful; thank you for these fascinating resources. Would it be possible to do similar role-play videos for parents with borderline personality disorder and for colleagues with narcissistic PD in the workplace? Thanks in advance, Patrick.
Oh man, this hits home a little too much. I’m kind of mind-blown right now. I will have to watch this one again and really study it. Thank you for these resources.
I don't have the energy nor the willingness anymore to try to confront or change the relationship with my family of origin, I'm done with wasting energy on that, but I did learn A LOT about myself and I catch my codependency very quickly now and don't act on it with other people (I still play the game in my family, it's just "easier", painful, but not worth putting myself through the accusations), so much so that now I sometimes attract codependent people and I am 'asked' to be their narc. It's weird and interesting, but I obviously won't and I don't try to safe then either 💪 It's a complicated and challenging balance and learning process, but I'm feeling I'm doing pretty good right now. Hopefully the healthy relationships will be for me too one day soon 😉🤞🤗
Thank you so much for these videos. I wonder if it would be possible to make a video educating about the dynamics but without saying the word "narcissism" so this video could be shown to teenagers/children who have a narcissistic parent? Or maybe someone can point me to such material?
I find that I boast about myself a lot... partially fishing for compliments, but partially just to get someone to tell me the truth about who I am. I guess I’m used to be insulted or not being allowed to be myself so it is more of a test than a ... way to brag? Idk, I feel like I do need that reassurance... but then when I don’t get it ... Idk, I’m learning how to not get stuck in those “fishing for compliments” circles, and be more aware about how I feel about myself.
I relate to this one the most. I had to cut ties with dad. He would talk to me on the phone every week for a minimum of two hours! And then we would have breakfast a few days later and he would say the same stuff that we just talked about for two hours the other day. Breakfasts were more like three hours. If I tried to get up he would say something like ‘oh I know you’ve got more important things to do’ or some thing like that. I couldn’t take the stress of seeing his name on caller ID. I’d be trying to cook dinner for my daughter because by now it’s 7 o’clock. He would hear the pans and pots knocking together as I tried to cook and he would say ‘what’s all that noise? ‘I said I’m trying to cook dinner for my daughter. ‘OK well I’ll let you go finish’ that as he continues to talk and I’m still stuck
Oh, I love this with the analysis !!! Looking at it now without emotions, it seems like this covert narcissist is still a little boy whose ego is very vulnerable a from whom the world expects behavior that he is unable to manage. Isnt narcissism just another form of post-traumatic personality? Somehow he managed to survive his childhood, but was never able to become a really functional adult; and his internal settings make therapy almost impossible. - My narc father does this alot - when trying to plan important get togethers (eg. birthdays, ...) he does something like in this example.... shifts the topic and nothing ends up getting planned (I am so busy with .....etc. he says), (What does he get out of it? the attention from the repeated phone calls?? does created chaos make him feel good??) - but interestingly when it was my graduation from medical school and when it was my wedding (the dates were firmly set some months in advance) he was capable of planning, being there on time and taking part appropriately (? because of the narcissistic supply?). So after seeing this pattern repeat over and over, I have changed my approach completely. My narc father uses both covert and overt strategies... his primary strategy seems to be covert (hidden) strategies and when that does not work, then he goes into overtly aggressive strategies.... Oh, and at other times during the year he will complain about being lonely and needing help. A covert narc with property in 2 countries on 2 continents complains about needing help, becuase of something something. What manipulation. His main narc life focuses have always been money and property and looking good. I also had a similar experience regarding a "plan" mine had to do with email adress. When I first completed college and moved back home for a few months he offered for me to have an email adress through his internet provider, because it would be more secure (my own personal password), bla, bla, seemed a good idea at the time (even logical, and that email adress became my primary most important email adress), but some years later he decided to cancel that internet provider and did not tell me. So all of a sudden one day I found out, that I lost a lot of important info and contacts. WTF.
I wish there was a support group locally or even online and a zoom call so we could all compare notes about the narcissist in our life and then I went and married an hour assist and now my son is turned out to be a narcissist. My daughter is 16 and has lived with her dad for the past year after living with me previously the whole time. I was so happy that I got to raise her and she wasn’t going to be a narcissist. However she moved in with her dad last summer and they immediately told her lies and I don’t even know what But now she’s not only more narcissistic she refuses to speak to me anymore. After we were so close a little bit of parental alienation and she’s gone
This is really helpful. I am really bad at wording things, but I can easily see the stuff that is going on. I am going to try and talk to my teacher about my situation to, indeed, reality check a bit. I want to be fully sure I have the right to stop the contact with my mother since it is so enery draining to be there so often. I was able to make it less, but over time I realized it wasn't enough. Yet idk if I have any right to do so, since a narcistic someone has feelings after all, and I don't want to do invalidate someone's feelings, bc I know as well how hard it is to be ignored when you have something that is important to you that is bothering. I'm in a fight and I am thankful for some of the words you gave, bc that makes it easier to explain without saying something that may not be true and stuff. I hope you all have a nice day ^^
This reminds me of something my mother did. I had gotten a loan to help her pay out my father when they separated so my name was on the title of the home. I split up with my partner and had to be a single mother. The Pension people needed to value the family home because I didn't live there. They had to make sure I wasn't getting rent of her etc. I called her and told her this (at an extremely difficult time for me) and her response was...'great, now I have to clean up the house'... 🙄
That’s such great content. It’s really helping me opening my eyes to certain things in my family. I’m wondering if the dynamic between a Covert Narcissistic Father and his child would be different if it was a daughter ?
This is so real and validating. It really feels like the answer is no contact after a certain point.
Wow. You don't realize how dysfunctional your own family is until you see a healthy parent modeled for you. I started adding up all the "nice" things the healthy father says - I'm sorry, acknowledges a miss step, clear answer, clears up the financial worry, says he wants to spend time with him, empowers the relationship between brothers and compliments the son for being a good brother and even offers to babysit. I started crying when he said what a good big brother he is.
Empowering. This series with the clinical analyses should be taught to young adults all over. Wish I had seen this when I was a teen. Thank you for what you do and for sharing your knowledge and passion with the world.
I would like my 13 year old son to watch this. His father is the same victim. Yesterday he had to come back to the car and get $20 because his father was flipping out about spending it on him. He had to be the adult and just came back to me to diffuse the situation. "I spent $20 yesterday I'm not spending another $20!" He tells my son I get life so easyvand he works so hard never gets anything bla bla bla. My son just turned 13. His father is 61!
I second this!
The comment the dad makes about the world demanding more and more from him really resonates with me. My mom has always had a habit of listing everything she's ever done, and needing constant praise. If the conversation is not about her and all her "sacrifices," she gets bored. She blames my brothers and I for not going to medical school. She never stops talking about everything she "gave up" to raise us. She also takes lots of jabs at my father while praising her husband. Its constant. I only just realized how powerful ones skewed perception of themselves really is. And yes, a single phone call with her is as draining as you'd imagine.
Really helpful. I got exhausted right along with the “son” because this type of conversation is the norm with most of my family of origin, but I thought it was my “crazy” and “selfishness.” The analysis is life-giving in its clarity and gives me plenty to work with. Side note: I am impressed with your production quality and I really love these staged dialogues. Thank you for your compassion and generosity
I appreciate the gossip part. I did not realise that this is not normal family conversation. I wish I had an example of a normal family conversation style (Movies aren't helping much, they need drama)
Sounds just like my father. Always talking about his wife and her plans. Always not being present in our lives and making excuses that revolve around his wife and her adult children. Love the role play! Especially showing the healthy father. It is helpful for me because I need to hear what it's like to have a healthy response from a father.
This was so incredibly helpful. I grew up in the foster system and found my father earlier this year after 30 years. At first it was all roses and flower gardens, but he became increasingly volatile. I went through a relationship with a diagnosed covert narcissist in my 20s and when my father started talking in the same patterns, I knew something was up. I didn't grow up in healthy family systems and have no idea what would be reasonable to expect. Seeing my father's antics through the lens of him wanting his victimhood story confirmed makes so much sense. This series has been a great aid and comfort.
"It's often helpful to think about how the covert narcissist wants us to respond to them to see through the drama and victimization." It was a revelation when I realized that my mom's hyperidealization of my parenting style was actually an attempt to get me to parrot it all back to her about HER parenting. I realized when she said "You're such an amazing mother!" that she wanted me to say "Aw, no mom, YOU'RE an amazing mother!" But I never did. Because it wasn't true. And I hated how perfect she thought I was. She was always talking to the me in her head instead of the real me. I kept trying to impress my humanity upon her and that I'm good enough but certainly not without fault, but she kept rejecting it because she wanted me to mirror her sentiment back to her so she could feel appreciated and validated. I couldn't do it. It was so frustrating.
That helps me a lot. I’ve been confused by my mom’s treatment as a servant-child and I could never do anything right but at the same time was idolized and bragged about all.the.time. Like how are both possible at once? But this makes sense. To me, I couldn’t do it right, but to everyone, everything right I did was credit to her.
I have a very similar dynamic with my mom. I think I was about 30 before I realized that my mom had a relationship with the projection she had of me, not myself. Whenever my behavior deviated from her idea of me, she would get angry. And the hyperbolic, inaccurate compliments were always cringey. She has never known who I am and I realize now that it’s not because I’ve been with-holding, but because she shames me when I am authentic. Anyway, what you shared really resonates and I don’t often meet other people with this type of dynamic.
@@schias6 that’s a good way to explain it and I would agree that’s exactly what my mom is like. I couldn’t talk to her about anything and she always idealized how she wanted me to behave. Even to last Saturday, they came over to yell at me for not talking to them (I didn’t let them in) including “no, what we want is the way things were before.” Well as they were before was inauthentic and unhealthy, so... no thanks. I like your expression “projection of me, not myself.” Explains a lot.
@@ruthvansandt9713 you sound like you are much better at setting boundaries than I am. I’m like the first role-play, making half-assed attempts to stand up for myself and then caving when she deflects or attacks. I’m glad you’re keeping yourself safe.
@The Dark Overlord I’m extremely distrustful when I receive really over the top or inaccurate praise. My guard immediately goes up and I feel like I’m being “handled.” I’m usually slow to judge or distrust people, but this is the exception. When my mom would compliment me, it was often about what she wanted me to be, not who I actually was. Then I would feel ashamed as though I had tricked her. Needless to say, Imposter Syndrome is an issue for me too. 😅
Wow I just realized my dad is a full covert narc with that ending. He will burden me with his victim mentality then go "Well I don't want to burden you with my problems." Like you already did but thanks.
Same here
😂 I am saying I totally lol b/c my narcissist would dump their self inflicted woes on me and then say I have my own life and can’t be burdened or whatever- like that too.
Great analysis and very helpful to see especially after watching the video you posted to go with this analysis commentary playing 2nd… Very eye opening and I can say I was intrigued with the first form (the same conversation but minus the analysis between dialogue) - Great… Then these (written) facts are really really cool to pause- think about- and I could even take note for myself the differences (when applicable) between my thoughts watching video I compared with what I learned from reading the analysis comments in video II
That "I know you're tired of hearing about the old man's problems" is what did it for me. He hit the nail right on the head with that one
This reminds me of the relationship I had with my mother.. everything is about THEM. The entire conversation is focused back to them.
Had a convo similar to this with my dad the other day. Everything was an attack on him and I was insensitive for not asking about his girlfriend drama (when he insists on dating people he knows are bad for him). I said that unless he gets therapy, I cannot discuss his relationships. It was liberating.
@@maureenseel118 good for you💛 Sometimes the parent child relationship is reversed. They expect us to solve their problems. No more doing that for me. It's like waking up finally💛
Oh yes, that is how it is going..... There is no compromise possible. That is the problem. Either you play your " role" or you are out. Confrontating is always ending in a catastrophe . Once you realize there is no way out, you have to decide. Go on like this or free yourselve once and for all. In case you stay in it decades later you realize nothing changed, you will regret. If you free yourselve by setting boundaries and pass the truh you will feel so much better. Fight for your right to be respected and preciated, you can not deal with family members who put you down and talk badly behind your back. This is not what family is about. Thank you Patrick for making it so clear again, by this horrible confusing and hurting "conversation".
This was SO HELPFUL. I feel like I shouldn’t be getting this level of production quality for free. Thank you for all of the hard work you put into your videos!!
Watching this I realise I was co dependent with my father by always trying to “educate” him when he rang and talked negatively about my brothers and sisters.
For months now I’ve chosen to have no contact with him . No more putting energy into his narcissism. Now I’m learning to keep myself safe and well and put my energy into healthy relationships. At first it was very hard to do as I had layers of guilt and shame for putting myself first. My anxiety is reducing and I feel more freedom. These role play videos and clinical analysis are so helpful.
I found an old video of my mom on UA-cam from when I was 11 (from an old game show,) and it was so weird suddenly seeing things in her I never saw as a kid. It was there all along but I was blind to it. I had to be for survival. Everyone I showed it to agreed she was creepy. But to me, that was my normal. Thanks for uploading these roleplays, it really helps gain perspective!
I think all survivors go thrue this phase of discovery. It is crucial for processing Trauma. It hurts so much but it get's better
Well said and so accurate, both of you! I can relate 100%
Creepy is definitely the word. When I realized how abnormal my mother was..... "Creepy" was definitely the word.
Great video! You explaining what is normal for an adult child to expect from their parent helps me to mourn what I did not get from my parent. Thank you for generously sharing your knowledge!
I watched the original, but your descriptions made it much more clear! I’ll have to watch this again.
I think the second mention of the gift card is also to shame the son... "Look what I do for other people (probably not family, surely not you) and they are grateful and appreciate me"
Shame Bazooka. Great Word :)
That is exactly what it feels like
Could you do a video addressing codependency as not addressing unfairness? This is a big challenge for me, and I would love some understanding around it and strategies for better dealing with unfairness in a direct way. Thank you SO much for these videos, they are incredibly helpful for people who grew up thinking this was normal :)
I've always known that my mother was a narcissist, but I always went back and forth as to whether my father is, too. This really makes me feel that he is most likely a covert narcissist. This feels like every conversation I have with him. Thank you for your videos. They are really helping me wrap my head around my family.
100%
Wow, this is so helpful for me! Thank you so much, i even realised as a very small child that in my realationship to my parents is something wrong. But i donˋt know what it was. I thought that i was adopted. I have so much pain in me so that i go to the therapie. I am diagnosed with BPD and depression, thats the result of living a live with two narcisstic parents. This must be teached in school. Now i am 46 years old and i am going NO CONTACT with my father, my mother died four years ago. My mother also had a histrionic personality disorder. I come from Germany and here you donˋt find a lot about that! Thank you so much, that shows me that I was always right 👍🏻❤️
The written analysis was crucially educational. I watched this video five times to get all the nuances of the emotional abuse. I would have only picked up on about 1/10th of the complicated layers of dysfunction without the written comments. Also, I appreciated learning where the son was slipping into codependency and other learned adaptive responses. I hope you do this same written analysis for the narcissistic mother role play (maybe you already did). I can't thank you enough for putting the written analysis in to the video.
This is absolutely amazing. Change the names and add in a few subtle backhanded shots to my self esteem and its pretty much word for word my experience. It took me until I was 40 to realize what he was and finally go no contact for good.
I’m only halfway through and WOW, this is one of the most eye opening things I’ve ever seen. I have similar interactions (I’m the codependent) at home, work, and just about everywhere… Some changes need to take place, damn.
My life just flashed before my eyes😏
I ve been educating myself about narc/codependancy for a couple of years now; so I am quite knowledgable about them, but these role plays give me a push forward to better understanding and interpetation to each move; sight and feeling thats been going on in my life. Very intellegent.. Guess now why my supervisors love doing role play in our work as teachers.. Thank you❤
Thanks for the videos and the analysis. Yesterday I had a tough conversation with my covert narcissistic mother on the phone. Two weeks ago she gave me harsh judgements on my life choices, and after the phone call I was so depressed by her words I was not able to go to work. Yesterday I chose to tell her how much she and my father had been hurting me since I was a child, instead of swallowing all of it like I used to do. Of course this was met by denial, like I just made up all the childhood traumas myself. But I feel this is my first step of getting empowered. I would like to cut the codependency but still do not know how.
Really relatable, I appreciate the breakdown. I see so much of myself and my attempts to get my point across in the just the right words while avoiding my mom's landmines. I'm still trying to figure out how to be myself without fear, but your videos are so helpful.
This videos are gold.Thank you SO MUCH.
Great analysis.
I know this type of manipulation and emotional abuse all too well. That's why I've been distancing myself and setting firm boundaries in place, to protect me from any toxic people or situations.
Keep up the great work. ☺
This video is a soft version of what I experience in my own relationship. These conversations can get so nasty.
This is so empowering and helpful, thank you Patrick!. I have always known my dad was "special", but for my mom, it took me a very long time to understand how her victim systematic stance had something to do with narcissism. She could look like the nice codependent to my narcissistic dad. Yet she was often emotionally neglectful. Incapable of handling healthy criticism and self-reflecting. I didn't know there was a word for gaslighting. Now the silent treatment she has been giving me for five months, makes me understand she has been abusing me, making me the persecutor. A decent "normal" parent would not hold grudge for ever nor cut off their adult child.
Victimization is a way to avoid responsibility, but how does it affect their image? Is it in the sense "My pain is above anyone else's, therefore I am special"?
Thank you, this is helpful and right on time. My mom ended her silent treatment to text me happy birthday, yet she added that she's not ready for calls and she's just started to feel better.. Not asking how I have been in many months and putting the focus on her health again. I understand she set the rules and I have to walk on eggshells if I want a relationship with her.
@@MissSarahGM sounds like you have to be the parent for her.
I feel you. Stay strong and look after yourself. Your mother is an adult and can handle her afairs on her own
@@fuzzyecheveriaharmsii Thank you for the kind words of support. I was moved when I saw her text message after 5 months. She wrote she cut contact with the whole family for health reasons. I don't believe she ignored my brother as well. Then it felt like she wants to avoid the whole subject, she already added she get stressed on the phone and she needs calm.. So I understand it's a way to keep me compliant and submitted. I'm an adult but no support system and it's tough all on my own. I realize I was letting myself being abused and put in the persecutor role just to have a little connection and love from them.
@@MissSarahGM You didn't let her abuse you. She abused you. The responsibility was and is with her. Not yours. You were a child who was only trying to survive. On this channel you have a small community to start with. I hope you will find help and a support system close to you.
@@fuzzyecheveriaharmsii Thank you, I am really glad I found this channel and the community, it is so helpful to have other people understand what it is, behind the appearances. And even as an adult, it isn't easy to cut contact. The hardest is the acceptance of their limitations and grieving that. At least I know clearly what I don't want in my life, inconsistent, invalidating people.
Triggers. Triggers everywhere. The text in between is like what's going on in my mind when talking to my parent, but he describes it so much more clearly!
Excellent and scary at once.
THANK YOU!!!! I knew my dad was not right, but I always interpreted him as another victim of my mom's aggressive narcissism. My sister and I learned to don't ever depend on our parents but I didn't quite understand why, I felt like I was being a bad son, like "I'm not giving them the attention they need, I'm being selfish, meybe they're hurt inside and I have to understand them and help them be happy" (I still feel like that from time to time). It took a LOT of help from friends and therapy, and even so, is just this last couple of years that I'm truly starting to understand just what they are and what can we do about it.
This content is so professionally made, thank you so much for sharing it!!!
Thank you for this. My father is possibly a narcissist because our talk goes usually like in the video, but in my case, he "wins" the discussion by saying things out loud and agressively. He blames my mother and his money struggle for his unhapinness and I started to stabilish some boundaries like "I don't wanna hear your complains about my mother." (I got a "You don't like me anymore" after this...). Me and my brother we both told him he should go to see a therapist, but unfortunately he truly believes he doesn't need help and that all his problems will go away as soon as he pays his debts. I'm already noticing how hard will it be to stabilish the boundaries and stop the codependency between us, but I need to do it. The empowered son gave me inspiration to how I am going to stabilish my own boundaries. So, thank you.
Mine is also like all that you described, except for debts. Mine simply has his mediocre job with mediocre pay, the same old one, he got right after finishing school, and yet he has the audacity to berate me by saying that I never gonna get well-paid job (previous was toxic and underpaid) or my mom (who already passed) in front of me for one short period of time when she had to change her job for less paid one, because I was a toddler then and there was literally no one else to care about me (she generally always had a higher pay than him, which he used to absolve any responsibility, in that disgusting manner "you have the money, so you make decision, and if it doesn't work out I blame you for the rest of life"). He even makes me buy him food, and when I ask for money on that (I'm not his parent, I'm not obliged, he is nor disabled, and I'm not rich) he finds excuses to not to give any or screams that I'm wasting too much money (of course I'm wasting money, his food often is more expensive than mine) till I gave up... Sorry, my comment seems turned into rant. Just realised he is narc. I knew about other relatives, but couldn't recognise narcissism behind all that pitifulness and pretended helplessness, he wears as masking veil.(
Excellent video! Wow this could have been a conversation with my mother. This last Thanksgiving it took weeks to get an answer if she was coming or not. I've realized I'm a codependent and creating strong boundaries. Wish me luck on my journey!
This is how the narcs win they wear you down so much you just wanna side with them even if what they're saying is you're a bad person you find yourself saying yes yes I'm horrible you're so right
Hello, thank you for all your content it is amazing and so helpful! Could you do a video with covert narcissist mother and daughter role play?
I had to take this in stages because WHOOO this is my dad and stepdad. Excellent at playing the poor pitiful me game, completely devoid of empathy
Wow. I’m shocked. This is my life textbook & I stumbled on this by accident as I NEVER would’ve guessed this as the root of it because I’ve been brainwashed my whole life they’re the martyr, they’ve sacrificed so much for me, woe is them, etc etc no boundaries! NOW WHAT DO I DO? Can you confront someone with their covert narcissism? I don’t anticipate that going well as they think they know everything & I’m ungrateful. Please make a video on what to do now. I’m tried the empowered approach unknowingly on my own and it gets NO WHERE. Ends dramatic and ugly and they run to rest of my family to complain about how horrible I am. Then I start questioning my own sanity.
Yep. If you try the "empowered" route, that choose-your-own-adventure path doesn't lead to anything good either. The only successful thing I've done is go no-contact. Life is easier. Less drama. I choose friends who have accountability, and all is well. I also choose friends whose parenting is better role-modeling for me than my parents. Imperative to break the cycle. :(
I was able to understand the use of guilt and shame as weapons to prevent real emotional connection and accountability in a relationship. I better understand my own psychological need to have strong boundaries with my narcissistic mother, brother, and two sisters. I understand the idea of "codependency" in pretending the family member is caring about me.
I'm so happy to find this channel. Being parentified as a young child and now an adult, I've struggled with emotional problems which stemmed from covert narcissistic parent. So I've watched a great deal of UA-cam videos about psychological/emotional disorders. Anyway, I appreciate the role playing on this video and commend the creator/producer/writer -- Patrick for such informative, instructional and enlightening channel. I had to watch some of the videos a few times because of familiarity within the convos! Thank you Patrick for your remarkable job of imparting knowledge & healthy boundaries to otherwise boundary-challenged individuals like me. I just subscribed to your channel. :)
In my case I would have been avoiding accountability with the father not to "keep a connection fantasy going" but to avoid a beating. Or, later as an adult, to avoid being insulted and yelled at.
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[for me] all of your Videos have sooo much impact [for me], and it helpts me too understand myself, my past and my present. Thank you for helping me to empower myself, so heal and feel more safe in my little world. Lovely greetings from Germany.
I feel toxically shamed in such an unavoidable manner that it's hard for me to internalize and recognize that my parents do these things. Thank you for making it easier for me to recognize these tactics my parents use.
Update: I think maybe one day I would know what a healthy parent looks like:
Reading Homecoming by John Bradshaw.
This was exactly what was happening in my marriage. Thank you so much for putting into words why it happened. After so many years of counseling with different therapists, none could see that my ex was this person. In fact the counseling perpetuated the abuse we went through, as they placed me on equal grounds of blame as my ex. This is helping me so much. I can’t thank you enough
Your text were very helpful. I learned so much 😌
When my first child was born, I was living in South Korea at the time with my wife. My dad made no effort to come and visit, and whenever I asked about him coming to see his granddaughter, he would play the victim and talk about how he’s poor and has no money (Even though he had taken vacations to Egypt, Argentina and the US with his wife). It had been three years when I finally got him to come visit, but not without all the guilt tripping and victimhood every time I asked about him coming. It got so toxic I felt bad that I was asking him to come see his first grandchild.
They make you feel bad/guilty for asking them to show up and play their role. Isn’t that wild?
Great video! The explanations are very helpful! You are a great actor as well as teacher.
I just experienced all scenes with my mom, thank you for your analysis . I feel better prepared for the next conversation!
Even tho this is a staged convo... its almost as draining as the real thing. Cannot believe I've had to endure this for over 20+ years of my life. I hope these SHELLS can one day burn in hell for the abuse they have put us through.
Great video. Reminds me of a lot of conversations with my mother 😢. Especially the parts where he was on the verge of challenging the Dad but backed off. I've done that lots of times and always come away depressed and drained. Thanks Patrick. This really helps me to see things as they are. ❤
I think the problem, for me at least, with being empowered is that it's exhausting to do it all the time, so things don't seem they'll change on a more permanent basis, unless you cut that person out. For me, it's my mother. My father was probably a narcissist (he passed away 5 years ago), but I have no doubt this is my mother. When I was a kid I used to describe her as not selfish, but self centered, and a martyr. I understand so much more now. I'm still trying to cope. I can't live with the guilt of shutting her out of my life, but she's so draining most of the time. I work long, stressful hours, but still check in with her every night to make sure she's okay. Some nights I know my behavior and control needs to improve, but I can't muster it. I can't complain to her, or it'll set her off about something bad that happened to her 40 years ago that was so much worse than what I'm dealing with. She's so helpless too, at 72 years old. She's been swindled out of money and property. I do find these videos helpful. Again, it's just being so tired sometimes when I talk to her. I can be empowered if my faculties are all present, but it's also hard to be empowered without being emotional.
Awesome work
This was so helpful thank you ❤
I'm past midlife, have a narcisisitic mother (who I keep at a distance), and now I'm realising my father is the same. He was verbally & physically abusive when I was a child, spoke with his fists (just as my mother did), threatened suicide when the spotlight was on him, and generally the perpetual show man with his victim-aggressor cycles.
He left when i was 10 yrs old, calmed down when he remarried, I thought he'd changed. Little was known about NPD back then. He was still impatient and lost his temper occasionally, but mostly he seemed kind and very generous with his money and practical help - especially friends and neighbours of course.
I'd always noted that like my mother, mentally he grew with his chronological years, but emotionally he was still an infant (in his omnipotent stage, where everything is an extension of themselves, including the😂 children).
My step mum died suddenly a year ago, I supported my dad to the point of exhaustion. Then the narcisisism re-surfaced because I refused to entertain the petty issues he had caused with his new woman. I was still grieving, and his issues were infantile and toxic.
This video was like a god send for me. I've just had my dad leave after a verbally abusive visit. I felt ill, drained and strangely traumatised (for a woman who considers herself self-aware). The effects were psychological and pysiological, like I had regressed back into my confused and violated child state.
I actually stood up to him. In fact I blew up at him a couple of times. I told him I will not have his aggression in my house and if it happens again he can leave and go home.
The shame part of the clinical analysis was interesting to me - where we feel shame for accommodating their manipulation. On the flip side, I felt a lot of shame becasue I blew up at him. After he'd left I kept trying to justify my reaction in my mind, I was feeling sadness for him and punitive towards myself, despite the fact that he had been aggressive all weekend.
I know I had attacked him with my past trauma, I was probably triggered, it just wasn't in my nature.
I even questioned if I was a narcissist myself.
I'm here now stunned at how I'm feeling inside - disproportionate to what any outside observer was perceive as an aggressive, emotionally immature man getting angry because his daughter refused to pander to his needs. An ugly but not uncommon family flare up if you will.
Apologies for the long comment, I've subscribed with thanks and look forward to listening to more of your videos.
The role play and added notes brought me to tears - and I'm not a cryer (not allowed as a child) - I'm taking notes so that I am now empowered to deal with the toxic person! Keep the teachings coming!
Thank you so much for creating these role plays along with the analysis, it’s so helpful on so many levels and a brilliant way of showcasing the behaviours. 👍🏽🥇
This makes sense with my parents. The “I’m too busy with ___ to care about your thing.” And then they denounce the thing that I wanted to do.
Or my dad would miss something, and I would be upset and then my mom would be like, “well, why would he care about it.” ... but then talk to him later and say that he should’ve gone. So, like, my mom trying to deflect that she’s upset/upset that I’m upset and not knowing what to do about it, but then making me feel worse lol
Not quite the same, but the deflecting and lack of accountability are familiar to me.
Just wanted to let you know that I just found your channel, and you seem to do a great job explaining all this, and I love the roleplays! However, I find that this video is inaccessible for me because I'm blind, and it seems like maybe you are putting up the clinical analysis on the screen but not saying anything out loud. So, if possible, could you please make a version of this video, or in future videos at least, make sure you say out loud whatever the analysis is? Also, another thing that makes this extra-important for me is that I am getting my Masters in Clinical Mental Health Counseling, so I feel like this analysis would definitely help.
I agree! I hope he does start reading the text analyses in between. I love the roleplay, but I usually listen while doing other things and don't always have my phone at hand to read the text. Best of luck with your studies!
@@shibolinemress8913 Thank you so much! So far, it has gone well. However, at this time, I am taking some time off to go to my own therapy and work on myself (much of this work is trauma work) before starting to see clients. I just have my clinical courses to go, though, pretty much. :)
@@anniepark6694 I hope all goes well for you in that! You'll probably become a great therapist, since you've been through trauma too. Go, you! 🤗🤗
@@shibolinemress8913 Thank you so much! Actually, working with trauma is one of my biggest interests, so this is perfect!
Your clinical breakdowns are so helpful.. As with the rest of your content. I am grateful you spend the time and resources to get quality materials out to the rest of us! Many Thanks!
My parent's divorced ~3 years ago for this very reason. My dad recently caused quite a problem between the kids (has been since the divorce but this one took the cake). I finally sent him a fair length e-mail because he blocked us. I said everything I ever wanted to say. I told him exactly why everything was his fault and why I don't feel a bit of remorse or shame in telling him this. Maybe it wasn't the best way to respond, but it made me feel better. Even if he didn't register a single word of it haha.
5:19 ROFLMAO - my dad used to talk about his "ship coming in" ALL THE TIME. Very often in conjunction with the victim narrative du jour.
Wow so accurate,just put my mother in here instead. Thank you.
NC was the only answer in the end
So many lines in this video I’ve heard my father say verbatim. (like “nothing comes easy for me” and “just another person lined up to giving me problems,” along with prioritizing a new relationship more than his longstanding ones - his girlfriend over his 3 kids). And realizing more how my younger brother and I are engaging in a codependent relationship with him. My siblings and I all agree he’s a narcissist but it’s good to be able to recognize what behaviors are narcissistic & shouldn’t be tolerated and what aren’t and where to draw the line (even if that line means estrangement).
The breakdown helps a ton! Hopefully I'll be able to see and respond properly when my dad uses these patterns of behavior
Thank you for this role play and analysis! It resonates with me regarding some family dynamics. It also helps me realize how maybe some of my behaviors are not the healthiest too.
Thank you very much for your videos! I am learning a lot.
omg even the opening text about why he's making it about Betty explains so much about how my dad communicates/just waits for his turn to speak so he can talk about what he wants to talk about. (If he even waits.) I'll come to him with something important and he'll want to talk about his newest friend obsession and everything this person's doing with their life. Like, that's nice but I'm trying to discuss something relevant to me/our household? At least pretend to listen to me while I talk about this. All that's missing is he will interrupt me to tell me about his obsession so that I have to keep restarting whatever I'm trying to say if I don't forget what I was trying to discuss entirely. Not just sidetracking like in the video, but legitimately just waiting for me to take a breath so he can start.
i never really understood why he was doing that. I knew it must be the NPD somehow, but didn't know what purpose it served or how I'm supposed to respond to it that won't either encourage the behavior or get my head bitten off.
🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌I appreciate your Efforts of bringing Self Awareness on such Sensitive Topics related to Keeping our Mental Health in Check...
Thanks and God Bless....
Thats my mother...
Very enlightening, thank you very much for sharing this video !
Thanks for another therapy session!! I like the explanatory text.
This was amazing! Please do a covert narcissist romantic partner!
My mind is blown. Thank you 🙏
Thank you for this informative and enlightening content format! These analysis are highly insightful and I find them being helpful "diconstructors" of narcissistic mind...
Wow, amazing video Patrick. I can definitely relate to this and its really helpful. I'm about to go back to my family home for a bit after living away from them for about a year and having less contact, and my mental health has improved being away from that toxic family system. I'm not sure yet if I'll have the strength to stand up and enforce boundaries, but hopefully I won't be back there for too long and I'll have better tools to take care of myself whilst I'm back there. Keep up the good work
Just watched this again and can't believe it has so few views compared to the video with just the role play. Your clinical analyses are GOLD! Perhaps they need a more flashy title to get people to understand the riches within? "Secret Messages of Covert Narcissist Father Revealed! - Role Play Part II" ; - D Regardless, *THANK YOU!*
Thank you for taking the time to create content for those of us trying to improve the relationships and experiences we share with others.
Is this a clinical analysis, or a reenactment of a situation given as an example, where a clinician offers explanations of behaviors and the correct terminology so the viewer can become a more mindful and well informed individual?
I love the attempt at empathy at the end like it just makes everything better. 😂
All your role-play videos that contrast toxic/healthy/empowered relationships are so insightful; thank you for these fascinating resources. Would it be possible to do similar role-play videos for parents with borderline personality disorder and for colleagues with narcissistic PD in the workplace? Thanks in advance, Patrick.
This was extremely helpful. Thank you so much!
Oh man, this hits home a little too much. I’m kind of mind-blown right now. I will have to watch this one again and really study it. Thank you for these resources.
I don't have the energy nor the willingness anymore to try to confront or change the relationship with my family of origin, I'm done with wasting energy on that, but I did learn A LOT about myself and I catch my codependency very quickly now and don't act on it with other people (I still play the game in my family, it's just "easier", painful, but not worth putting myself through the accusations), so much so that now I sometimes attract codependent people and I am 'asked' to be their narc. It's weird and interesting, but I obviously won't and I don't try to safe then either 💪
It's a complicated and challenging balance and learning process, but I'm feeling I'm doing pretty good right now.
Hopefully the healthy relationships will be for me too one day soon 😉🤞🤗
When CN dad says he's overwhelmed by getting people gift cards, it cracks me up.
Thank you so much for these videos. I wonder if it would be possible to make a video educating about the dynamics but without saying the word "narcissism" so this video could be shown to teenagers/children who have a narcissistic parent? Or maybe someone can point me to such material?
Very good ! Thank you for the notes
I find that I boast about myself a lot... partially fishing for compliments, but partially just to get someone to tell me the truth about who I am. I guess I’m used to be insulted or not being allowed to be myself so it is more of a test than a ... way to brag? Idk, I feel like I do need that reassurance... but then when I don’t get it ... Idk, I’m learning how to not get stuck in those “fishing for compliments” circles, and be more aware about how I feel about myself.
I relate to this one the most. I had to cut ties with dad. He would talk to me on the phone every week for a minimum of two hours! And then we would have breakfast a few days later and he would say the same stuff that we just talked about for two hours the other day. Breakfasts were more like three hours. If I tried to get up he would say something like ‘oh I know you’ve got more important things to do’ or some thing like that. I couldn’t take the stress of seeing his name on caller ID. I’d be trying to cook dinner for my daughter because by now it’s 7 o’clock. He would hear the pans and pots knocking together as I tried to cook and he would say ‘what’s all that noise? ‘I said I’m trying to cook dinner for my daughter. ‘OK well I’ll let you go finish’ that as he continues to talk and I’m still stuck
Great video and very true!
Very interesting approach to the topic. I’m pretty sure my husband is covert.
Nailed it! Thank you so much ❤
My narc father uses catastrophic thinking/victimisation to induce fear into our relationship. With fear I can be controlled and remain docile.
Oh, I love this with the analysis !!! Looking at it now without emotions, it seems like this covert narcissist is still a little boy whose ego is very vulnerable a from whom the world expects behavior that he is unable to manage. Isnt narcissism just another form of post-traumatic personality? Somehow he managed to survive his childhood, but was never able to become a really functional adult; and his internal settings make therapy almost impossible. - My narc father does this alot - when trying to plan important get togethers (eg. birthdays, ...) he does something like in this example.... shifts the topic and nothing ends up getting planned (I am so busy with .....etc. he says), (What does he get out of it? the attention from the repeated phone calls?? does created chaos make him feel good??) - but interestingly when it was my graduation from medical school and when it was my wedding (the dates were firmly set some months in advance) he was capable of planning, being there on time and taking part appropriately (? because of the narcissistic supply?). So after seeing this pattern repeat over and over, I have changed my approach completely. My narc father uses both covert and overt strategies... his primary strategy seems to be covert (hidden) strategies and when that does not work, then he goes into overtly aggressive strategies.... Oh, and at other times during the year he will complain about being lonely and needing help. A covert narc with property in 2 countries on 2 continents complains about needing help, becuase of something something. What manipulation. His main narc life focuses have always been money and property and looking good. I also had a similar experience regarding a "plan" mine had to do with email adress. When I first completed college and moved back home for a few months he offered for me to have an email adress through his internet provider, because it would be more secure (my own personal password), bla, bla, seemed a good idea at the time (even logical, and that email adress became my primary most important email adress), but some years later he decided to cancel that internet provider and did not tell me. So all of a sudden one day I found out, that I lost a lot of important info and contacts. WTF.
I wish there was a support group locally or even online and a zoom call so we could all compare notes about the narcissist in our life and then I went and married an hour assist and now my son is turned out to be a narcissist. My daughter is 16 and has lived with her dad for the past year after living with me previously the whole time. I was so happy that I got to raise her and she wasn’t going to be a narcissist. However she moved in with her dad last summer and they immediately told her lies and I don’t even know what But now she’s not only more narcissistic she refuses to speak to me anymore. After we were so close a little bit of parental alienation and she’s gone
Brilliant. Thank you
Yes, very true! Except sadly this father was actually a lot nicer than mine.
This is really helpful. I am really bad at wording things, but I can easily see the stuff that is going on. I am going to try and talk to my teacher about my situation to, indeed, reality check a bit. I want to be fully sure I have the right to stop the contact with my mother since it is so enery draining to be there so often. I was able to make it less, but over time I realized it wasn't enough.
Yet idk if I have any right to do so, since a narcistic someone has feelings after all, and I don't want to do invalidate someone's feelings, bc I know as well how hard it is to be ignored when you have something that is important to you that is bothering.
I'm in a fight and I am thankful for some of the words you gave, bc that makes it easier to explain without saying something that may not be true and stuff.
I hope you all have a nice day ^^
This is like my dad
This reminds me of something my mother did. I had gotten a loan to help her pay out my father when they separated so my name was on the title of the home.
I split up with my partner and had to be a single mother. The Pension people needed to value the family home because I didn't live there. They had to make sure I wasn't getting rent of her etc.
I called her and told her this (at an extremely difficult time for me) and her response was...'great, now I have to clean up the house'... 🙄
Thank you, for helping me understand crazy making in conversations with a narch.😔 Please do more videos!!!
That’s such great content. It’s really helping me opening my eyes to certain things in my family. I’m wondering if the dynamic between a Covert Narcissistic Father and his child would be different if it was a daughter ?